Sting goes folk!

Subject: Sting goes folk!
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 31 Oct 09 - 07:39 AM

Check out the track listing for his new Christmas album, If On A Winter's Night, which contains The Cherry Tree Carol, The Snow it Melts the Soonest, a Soul Cake song, and others.

Bizarrely, the Soul Cake Song is credited to (Music & Lyrics by Paul Stookey, Tracey Batteast and Elene Mezzetti), whereas the others are listed as Trad.

http://www.sting.com/discog/?v=so&a=1&id=571

Ah - they've inserted the word "Christmas" - that will explain why it's not traditional. ;)

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 31 Oct 09 - 07:51 AM

Just check out his Black Seam

L in C

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 31 Oct 09 - 08:02 AM

I know that song. But these are yer actual traditional songs! Well, except for Soul Cake, which was clearly written by a few of his mates.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 31 Oct 09 - 08:12 AM

Poohie! Now every time we do The Souling Song some twep is going to think it's a Sting song. What utter drivel. Hallowe'en, eh? You'd be better off listening to this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bfj0oOv240M

The lanes are very dirty, my shoes are very thin,
I've got a little pocket to put a penny in...

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 31 Oct 09 - 08:23 AM

No end to his talents, another Sting song: Dowland who?

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 31 Oct 09 - 08:29 AM

Sean, just wIt till they patiently explain that you've got the words wrong, as it's supposed to be about Christmas... ;)

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: GUEST,Bryony
Date: 31 Oct 09 - 08:29 AM

Surely he can't honestly do that can he? Does it say the same on the album?

We're puttin it on the next Demon Barbers album, can I change a few words (which I've probably done already) and claim all the prs and mcps for it?!

Oh and can I do that with all the trad songs I perform? Ace, I'm gonna be minted!

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: GUEST,JM
Date: 31 Oct 09 - 09:31 AM

Bry, it's not Sting doing it - the Paul Stookey credited is Paul of Peter, Paul and Mary, so I guess that they attempted to copyright it 40 years ago, and the label is playing it safe by crediting them as the writers.

Unfortunately, this was quite common. There are loads of songs where Alan Lomax registered himself as the writer, and a fair few where Peter Kennedy did the same.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: GUEST,Bryony
Date: 31 Oct 09 - 09:38 AM

Well that's pants!! I ain't creditin them!

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 31 Oct 09 - 10:27 AM

His real name is Noel Stookey, he stopped using Paul a long time ago.

Dave H

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 31 Oct 09 - 10:33 AM

Any quick Google search for traditional song lyrics, will throw up such inspired lyricists as Loreena McKennit, Sinead O Connor, Celtic Woman etceteras.
I must confess, as I was never a folk enthusiast, it was only recently it dawned on me that Pentangle hadn't actually written all their own songs.. :)

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Rasener
Date: 31 Oct 09 - 11:01 AM

I have always thought that PP&M's version was brilliant and still is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zO4u-N_VGJY&feature=related

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Hollowfox
Date: 31 Oct 09 - 01:17 PM

Whatever the fine print on the back of the album says about who did what to who, I heard this cd the other day and liked it enough to buy it.

Subject: Review: Sting - Snow it Melts the Soonest
From: Vin2
Date: 05 Nov 09 - 08:42 AM

Just saw Sting singing The Snow It Melts the Soonest on Jooles Holland's programme. Fair play to him for bringing a great trad song (from around Newcastle??) onto the box. I still love the version Anne Briggs did on her (i think) first album on Topic. Copy link below into address bar to listen. Luvlee natural voice she had.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mv_hasUk74Q

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Hawker
Date: 05 Nov 09 - 09:00 AM

And he even grew a folkie beard to present it properly!
Actually, I quite like it, though the anglo-american accent on a geordie sort of annoys me.........
But Im sure he could be quite picky about my singing too :0)
Cheers, Lucy

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Folknacious
Date: 05 Nov 09 - 09:22 AM

We're puttin it on the next Demon Barbers album, can I change a few words (which I've probably done already) and claim all the prs and mcps for it?!

As long as you put it down correctly as "Trad. Arr." by you, yes. In fact there's every good reason to: if you don't, somebody else who doesn't deserve it will get it from another copyrighted arrangement, or it will just go into the big pot that feeds the like of Paul McCartney & Elton John from the "unassigned" stuff. Best idea is change the title too.

As I understood the famous fallout of singing men between M. Carthy & P. Simon over Scarborough Fair when the latter nicked the former's arrangement and it appeared on record as by Simon, MC would have let it go if PS had credited it as "Trad. Arr. P. Simon". That's the modern-fangled folk process. We may tut-tut at it, but since Mr. Anon isn't around to get his royalty cheques, better a struggling folkie working to forward the music than fatcat pop songwriters who had nothing to do with it at all.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: GUEST,Barnacle Babe
Date: 05 Nov 09 - 02:18 PM

Does anyone know if the rumor is true that he consulted with Louis Killen on this album? I've been anticipating this album for a long time. Can't wait to hear it. :)

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Stower
Date: 05 Nov 09 - 02:25 PM

I've never been a particular fan of Sting until recently. I have never disliked his work, it's just never grabbed me. Then I was so impressed that he went out on a limb, tried to learn the lute and did the Dowland album. Now he's doing trad material. This is a man who follows his musical curiosity and takes the music seriously. As with Dowland, he has done his research. He has certainly won my respect. Buy his winter album. It's beautiful.

If Sting can get an album with a lot of trad material into the charts, then maybe, just maybe ...

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Folkiedave
Date: 05 Nov 09 - 03:07 PM

There was a long thread on Mudcat about the origins of the song.

thread.cfm?threadid=16979#161608

The definitive answer is dated 21-01-00 and is by Malcolm Douglas - who else?

Briefly it dates back to Blackwoods Magazine (Edinburgh) and 1821.

The version most people sing now is probably based on Anne Brigg's version.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: GUEST,Ian Gill
Date: 05 Nov 09 - 03:59 PM

I saw Sting on TV too, wasn't overly impressed, but it motivated me to dig out the Dick Gaughan and Anne Briggs CDs to play again. I loved 'Message In a Bottle', 'Can't Stand Losing You' etc. at the time - whilst going to see Nic Jones, Carthy, June Tabor et al. How many viewers will track down 'The Snow It Melts the Soonest' and discover other treasures - as most of us folkies did at some time?

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Maryrrf
Date: 05 Nov 09 - 04:11 PM

I dug out my Old Blind Dogs "Legacy" album and listened to Ian F. Benzie's version of "The Snows" - superb. As a matter of fact that whole album is a jewel, and I'm glad it's back in my car CD player again.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: GUEST,larkin
Date: 06 Nov 09 - 04:10 AM

I saw him perform Soulin with his 'Troupe' on the Andrew Marr show - he was far too earnest, as though he'd discovered folk music ! With his folkie beard   and hand jiving girl singers- The whole thing got right up my nose. Maybe that's just me. . I wasn't impressed by the arrangement either. I won't be able to sing Snows without some eejit saying it's a Sting song . I might just go back to bed and get out the right side!!

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Black belt caterpillar wrestler
Date: 06 Nov 09 - 07:42 AM

I have been told that when the Police split up Sting did investigate the idea of setting up a Folk band and went as far as contacting a few lesser known "regular folkies".

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: GUEST,keith ferret
Date: 06 Nov 09 - 07:53 AM

i've listened to the album and am distinctly unimpressed....whatever it is it's not folk...by the way I loved dream of the blue turtle, summoners tale and the album with englishman in New York on....not so keen on the lute album. On the snow it melts the soonest he sings the Stokoe lyrics apart from woodcock crows.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 06 Nov 09 - 07:55 AM

I could just imagine a 'supergroup' in the style of a folkie 'Traveling Wilburies' consisting of Sting, Midge Ure, Bono and so-on releasing rocked-up trad music which simultaneously conveys some earnest 'message' essential to world salvation, at key commercial times of the year..

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Mr Happy
Date: 06 Nov 09 - 08:53 AM

He's had a frog named after him too!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dendropsophus_stingi

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Dave Sutherland
Date: 06 Nov 09 - 09:43 AM

According to one of the biographies of Sting it stated that in the early seventies he sang under his own name, Gordon Sumner, singer/songwriter material in the folk clubs on the North side of the Tyne. Can't recall ever catching one of his performances however I did apparently see him as part of Last Exit at Newcastle City Hall around 1975 although I decamped to the bar 2/3rds of the way through their session.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Mr Happy
Date: 06 Nov 09 - 09:45 AM

I wonder how the frog's title is pronounced - a hard or soft 'g'?

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: GUEST,larkin
Date: 06 Nov 09 - 12:52 PM

Loved your comment Crow sister !

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: melodeonboy
Date: 06 Nov 09 - 08:01 PM

So did I!

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Lox
Date: 06 Nov 09 - 08:24 PM

Just seen sting perform on "later with Jools Holland" on BBC2.

I instinctively feel like resisting Stings forays into various genres, but I think he has found his niche in a credible deep and authentic way with this.

He was asked why he chose to include one of his songs on an album conatining songs going back as far as the 15th century and his response was that people have been making up songs for thousands of years and he wishes to include himself in that process and see hmself as part of a bigger picture - in other words reminding his fans that songwriting was not a late twentieth century phenomenonowned exclusively by the young and hip.

He seemed to love the song that he was singing and with good reason, besides which he was being supported by some awesome players, including a woman who played the harp and sang in what sounded like gaelic and who had a glorious and soulful singing voice.

He was very focussed on his music and on his band and seemed genuinely unconcerned about the hype and the chatter.

I enjoyed the whole show a lot but his song about christmas at sea set the scene and added a certai magic to the proceedings that I haven't seen or heard in a performance for a while - much less on TV.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 06 Nov 09 - 10:35 PM

While reading this thread, and hitting the links, I clicked onto 'A Soulin', by Peter Paul and Mary..and just wanted to take a moment to remember Mary Travers, who died this past September. God Blessed us all with her!!

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 06 Nov 09 - 11:03 PM

Speaking of musicians who did crossover styles, check this one out from another one, recently passed on, close friend of our family's.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o7YjCdNT27c&feature=related

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Zen
Date: 07 Nov 09 - 07:48 AM

The harp player accompanying and singing with Sting on Jools Holland was Mary MacMaster (previously with Sileas and The Poozies).

Zen

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Desert Dancer
Date: 07 Nov 09 - 11:57 AM

Interview (and sound clips) with National Public Radio here.

~ Becky in Tucson

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Reinhard
Date: 07 Nov 09 - 12:08 PM

Previously, Zen? The Poozies have just released a brilliant new CD, Yellow Like Sunshine, after six years of recording silence (though they seem to have been busy gigging), and Mary Macmaster is still with them.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Maryrrf
Date: 07 Nov 09 - 12:39 PM

At first I listened to some sound clips off the album and didn't like them at all, but I've listened again and also to some of the full songs available at the NPR link someone posted. I've changed my opinion. I think Sting does treat the songs with respect, and while he doesn't sing them like a dyed in wool folkie, my thinking is now "Good for him!" for trying something different.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: akenaton
Date: 07 Nov 09 - 04:10 PM

I've always considered Sting a "folkie".

He is an excellent writer and his songs contain all the elements of good contemporary folk music.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: GUEST,Karl
Date: 03 Dec 09 - 07:16 AM

For once...just for once, can't you just accept this collection as a terrific compilation of songs reflecting the more meaningful side of the winter season without sniping, whinging and bleating on about "trad" this and "folkie" that!
Unless this "holierm than thou" attitude of so many folk enthusiasts is dropped the folk music scene will continue to annoy and alienate until it disappears up its smug derriere!

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: manitas_at_work
Date: 03 Dec 09 - 07:20 AM

Did you actually read the thread Karl? It's really very positive about the album and Sting's musical interests.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: GUEST,Karl
Date: 03 Dec 09 - 07:33 AM

Marvellous...yes, some find the album acceptable..the point I'm trying to make is that Sting does NOT do folk..Sting does music!

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Folkiedave
Date: 03 Dec 09 - 08:54 AM

Manitas - Guest Karl is clearly Lizzie Cornish. You don't expect her to have read anything people have written do you?

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Folkiedave
Date: 03 Dec 09 - 09:06 AM

Unless this "holierm than thou" attitude of so many folk enthusiasts is dropped the folk music scene will continue to annoy and alienate until it disappears up its smug derriere!

The folk scene - as I pointed out to you Lizzie on another thread - is doing extremely well. Shame you can't recognise that.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 03 Dec 09 - 09:22 AM

My folk scene amounts to handful of great singers & musicians and a few dirty back rooms in pubs in Preston, Chorlton, Newcastle & Fleetwood. The rest of it I don't bother with at all.

As for Stings latest album - it is pure folk, pure shite & will probably win awards.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Vin2
Date: 03 Dec 09 - 12:12 PM

Guest Karl is Lizzie - i do get confused with all this at times - dohh!!

As for Sting well i'll repeat what i said further up....'Fair play to him for bringing a great trad song (from around Newcastle??) onto the box'.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Folkiedave
Date: 03 Dec 09 - 04:51 PM

I haven't heard this record so would not comment myself. But there is a string of reviews here.

I recognise the name of Debbie Koritsas - who used to do a lot of writing for "Living Tradition" magazine, amongst the reviewers.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Suegorgeous
Date: 03 Dec 09 - 09:10 PM

I've been listening to this album a lot in the last week, and to my surprise, it's really grown on me.

Some things about Sting's singing and interpretation do grate/irritate, and he's clearly far more at ease singing his own compositions (one of which I found stunning, in good part due to Kathryn Tickell's fiddle-playing on it).

But mostly I'm really enjoying the songs, and the variety and thought he's put into it. And that "Newcastle" trad song is indeed lovely, started to learn it myself.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Vin2
Date: 04 Dec 09 - 06:13 AM

Tis a grand song indeed Suegorgeous. Have you heard Anne Brigg's version ?

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: GUEST,Karl
Date: 04 Dec 09 - 07:13 AM

And Lizzie is not entitled to hold an opinion?

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 04 Dec 09 - 09:06 AM

We are a funny lot, aren't we? Sniping and grouching, theorising and IMHO-ing, incesting and excluding. If folk was a baby and we its guardians, it would have three eyes and 4 arms - and no legs or ears whatsoever because it wouldn't need to go anywhere or listen to anything else.

And then we blame songwriters for navelgazing. Me, I can't see the sense in this thread for dingleberries.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Folkiedave
Date: 04 Dec 09 - 09:20 AM

Karl/Lizzie can hold whatever opinions she wants Lizzie/Karl. It is writing his/her opinions on message boards that seems to get her/him into trouble it seems.

And as far as I am aware manitas at work is entitled to say to Karl/Lizzie:

Did you actually read the thread Karl? It's really very positive about the album and Sting's musical interests.

Shame that Karl/Lizzie or even Lizzie/Karl hasn't bothered to reply. Sheesh!!

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Suegorgeous
Date: 04 Dec 09 - 12:16 PM

Vin - yes, found it on youtube the other day. Lovely song.

Sue

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 04 Dec 09 - 12:22 PM

This important thread was mistakenly put into BS!

Stig Goes Folk

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 04 Dec 09 - 01:36 PM

Some nice tunes on the Sting album. His approach is not exactly my cup of tea, but if you want to curl up by the fire on a winter's night, I think any of these cuts will lull you into a pleasant nap.
Sting is commercializing Folk music? Good for him. Or is a lack of commercial sales the proof of integrity when it comes to traditional music?

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 05 Dec 09 - 02:42 AM

I should also caution that the same sleep-inducing quality that would make Sting's album a pleasant accompaniment for a winter's nap could make it absolutely deadly in your car's sound system on a long drive. After two bars of The Snow it Melts the Soonest I became so relaxed that I still have the imprint of the computer keyboard on my forehead.

Subject: RE: Sting goes folk!
From: Suegorgeous
Date: 05 Dec 09 - 06:49 AM

Extraordinary. The album has completely the opposite effect on me. I've been driving around with it on all week. :)