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Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 Nov 2010

Nicholas Waller 09 Nov 10 - 06:32 AM
mattkeen 09 Nov 10 - 08:13 AM
GUEST,punkfolkrocker 09 Nov 10 - 10:27 AM
John MacKenzie 09 Nov 10 - 10:43 AM
John MacKenzie 09 Nov 10 - 10:46 AM
GUEST,Chris Brady 09 Nov 10 - 10:50 AM
GUEST,punkfolkrocker 09 Nov 10 - 10:56 AM
GUEST,Chris Brady 09 Nov 10 - 11:19 AM
TopcatBanjo 09 Nov 10 - 11:41 AM
GUEST 09 Nov 10 - 03:06 PM
GUEST,folkwaller 10 Nov 10 - 05:48 AM
GUEST 10 Nov 10 - 07:47 AM
GUEST 10 Nov 10 - 08:28 AM
Phil Edwards 10 Nov 10 - 01:11 PM
GUEST,S Byers 10 Nov 10 - 03:24 PM
oldstrings 10 Nov 10 - 05:05 PM
Nicholas Waller 10 Nov 10 - 06:22 PM
mattkeen 11 Nov 10 - 04:54 AM
Willa 11 Nov 10 - 09:18 AM
John MacKenzie 13 Nov 10 - 08:04 AM
GUEST,Ed 13 Nov 10 - 06:18 PM
GUEST,Ralphie 14 Nov 10 - 02:17 AM
John MacKenzie 14 Nov 10 - 05:17 AM
GUEST,Ralphie 14 Nov 10 - 05:58 AM
BTNG 14 Nov 10 - 03:30 PM
GUEST,Ralphie 14 Nov 10 - 03:54 PM
GUEST,Chris B. 15 Nov 10 - 09:08 AM
GUEST,Chris B. 15 Nov 10 - 09:09 AM
GUEST,Paul 16 Nov 10 - 09:49 AM
GUEST,punkfolkrocker 16 Nov 10 - 10:29 AM
GUEST,Chris B. 16 Nov 10 - 01:01 PM
GUEST,Paul 16 Nov 10 - 01:08 PM
Phil Edwards 16 Nov 10 - 05:58 PM
GUEST 17 Nov 10 - 05:49 AM
GUEST,Ed 17 Nov 10 - 05:57 AM
GUEST 17 Nov 10 - 06:34 AM
GUEST,Chris B re: "Bright Phoebus" 17 Nov 10 - 08:28 AM
jacko@nz 17 Nov 10 - 07:52 PM
GUEST,Chris B - Bright Phoebus 19 Nov 10 - 04:55 PM
Spleen Cringe 30 Nov 10 - 10:02 AM
GUEST 30 Nov 10 - 10:44 AM
GUEST,Spleen Cringe 30 Nov 10 - 12:02 PM
GUEST,Chris B. 30 Nov 10 - 05:12 PM
GUEST,Chris B. 01 Dec 10 - 09:51 AM
Rain Dog 11 Mar 16 - 06:14 AM
GUEST 11 Mar 16 - 08:42 AM
GUEST 02 Apr 16 - 06:02 AM
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Subject: Lal Waterson Radio4 13.30 Tues 9th
From: Nicholas Waller
Date: 09 Nov 10 - 06:32 AM

Apologies if someone else mentioned this before (though I saw no evidence from the last 7 days) but at half past one on BBC Radio 4 this afternoon (Tues 9th November 2010) there's a programme about Lal Waterson.

I assume after the broadcast it will become available on Listen Again - check out http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00vrvqh

Once in a Blue Moon: The Songs of Lal Waterson

The story of one of the great folk singers and writers of our time, Lal Waterson.

Lal Waterson's voice was stark but captivating and it's been said that the songs she wrote were close to German cabaret or chanson. They were lyrically ambitious and melodically powerful. Since her death in 1998, her reputation has grown and now she is placed alongside the great singer song-writers like Nick Drake and Richard Thompson. She was a member of the famous Waterson family and numbered among other relatives the folk singer Martin Carthy and his daughter Eliza.

In this feature, Robin Denselow explores the life and legacy of Lal Waterson and assesses her impact on song-writers today.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: mattkeen
Date: 09 Nov 10 - 08:13 AM

Thank you for posting that


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Nov 10 - 10:27 AM

thanks, but sadly too late

"Availability:
Sorry, this programme is not available to listen again"


any repeats likely ??

or helpful hints to rapidshare/megaupload etc downloads.. ???


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 09 Nov 10 - 10:43 AM

I heard it today, and it was a very enjoyable programme. I hope it will become available again soon.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 09 Nov 10 - 10:46 AM

Sorry, but I just double checked and it says here that you have 7 days left to listen.
I assume it will only be available within the UK as it's a BBC production.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Chris Brady
Date: 09 Nov 10 - 10:50 AM

Only 'watch it agains' are restricted to the UK - due to bandwidth restrictions; 'listen agains' - aka audios - should be OK from overseas. Can be captured using Audacity (use 'Stereo Mix' setting and Options / Software Playthrough) or Orbit or Flashget.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Nov 10 - 10:56 AM

brilliant...

thanks John..




maybe some one sensible at the BBC read this thread in the last half hour
and sorted it out for us...


Now just need a repeat [or download] of the 'lost' "Bright Phoebus" radio documentary
from a couple of years ago..


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Chris Brady
Date: 09 Nov 10 - 11:19 AM

Lots of info. here:

http://search.bbc.co.uk/search?go=toolbar&uri=/&q=waterson

but no watch or listen agains.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: TopcatBanjo
Date: 09 Nov 10 - 11:41 AM

Not sure why there is confusion as I have just listened to this on iPlayer, but here's the direct link:

Lal Waterson prog on R4 Listen Again

Very interesting and enjoyable programme.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Nov 10 - 03:06 PM

Thanks for the link - it worked for me.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,folkwaller
Date: 10 Nov 10 - 05:48 AM

I was lucky enough to hear the programme. It is well worth tracking down to listen to.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Nov 10 - 07:47 AM

Anyone able to identify the song that plays out the programme?

Thanks


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Nov 10 - 08:28 AM

Anyone able to identify the song that plays out the programme?

It's called 'Stumbling On'. Lal's version is on her Once In A Blue Moon album. You can hear it on youtube: here

Eliza Carthy also does a fine version on her Red Rice release, but I can't immediatly find an online version. Buy the CD!


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: Phil Edwards
Date: 10 Nov 10 - 01:11 PM

Thanks for the tip - that was good stuff. I must admit, I hadn't realised how dark some(?) of Lal's lyrics were - while I was listening to the programme I googled "sitting in a shower of rain" and was stopped in my tracks by "Never the same". (I mean, I thought the Scarecrow was a bit grim...)

My only grimpe* is that I do get tired of hearing about people who revolutionised the folk scene, turned it upside down, gave it a much-needed kick in the pants, etc, etc. It seems to be obligatory to say that about anyone who's any good - as if "folkie" was synonymous with "conservative mediocrity", so simply saying someone was a folkie and a good one would be like saying they were particularly good at mowing lawns. At least Robin Denselow didn't mention *r*n sw**t*rs...

*Typo, but I think I'll keep it. I grimpe, you grimpe, they're forever grimpering...


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,S Byers
Date: 10 Nov 10 - 03:24 PM

"Now just need a repeat [or download] of the 'lost' "Bright Phoebus" radio documentary from a couple of years ago..

Sadly this is not available anywhere - but you might put out an appeal at http://www.radioarchive.cc


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: oldstrings
Date: 10 Nov 10 - 05:05 PM

Thanks to Nicholas for posting this, and Topcat Banjo for removing the mysteries of accessing it!
I remember Lal as a shy, awkward, thin and pale young woman; the opposite of Norma, circa original Watersons. I hadn't heard much about her since, and this programme was of great interest.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: Nicholas Waller
Date: 10 Nov 10 - 06:22 PM

My pleasure! (ie posting this). I hadn't heard any trailers, I just happened to glance at the Radio 4 schedule a couple of hours beforehand and noticed the name and thought it worth mentioning in these parts.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: mattkeen
Date: 11 Nov 10 - 04:54 AM

A great songwriter I think - as is her brother Mike


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: Willa
Date: 11 Nov 10 - 09:18 AM

Thanks to those who raised this and made it accessible. I loved it; I do sing a few of Lal's songs, but never had the pleasure of hearing her live.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 13 Nov 10 - 08:04 AM

On the strength of this programme, I bought Bright Phoebus, and Once in a Blue Moon. I had been meaning to buy the former for ages, but always forgot.
Bright Phoebus is sensational, and I love almost all of the songs on it. However, was it just me, or did anyone else hear echoes of Rocky Raccoon and Eleanor Rigby in there. Not a criticism, just a passing thought.
Once in a Blue Moon, is much deeper, and having listened to it twice so far, I'm still making up my mind about it.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Ed
Date: 13 Nov 10 - 06:18 PM

'Bright Phoebus' is indeed a fine album. I'm curious as to your "echoes of Rocky Raccoon and Eleanor Rigby"?

Which songs are you thinking of? At a push I can hear something of 'Rocky Racoon' in 'Rubber Band' but that's about it.

Keep at 'Once in a Blue Moon' It's not the easiest record, and it's quite dark sometimes, but it repays repeated listening.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 14 Nov 10 - 02:17 AM

Mr McKenzie said "I bought Bright Phoebus".
Jolly good, except that the family will not receive a penny, as the Celtic Music situation rumbles on.
I'm not in anyway blaming you, but just thought you'd like to know that your money is in the hands of someone other than Lals family.
And, I have a recording of the R4 doc "Lost Albums, Bright Phoebus" from a few years ago.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 14 Nov 10 - 05:17 AM

Amazon never mentioned Dave Bulmer, Ralphie.
How else do I get a copy anyway?
It's either that or copy someone else's disc, either way the people who should be paid, aren't.
Not condoning Mr Bulmer's greed, just stating facts.
I spoke to a well known singer songwriter last night, and we happened to mention copying CD's. His response was, as a songwriter he was happy that his songs got out there, but as a singer he would miss the income.
So it's a sort of no win situation, I'm afraid.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 14 Nov 10 - 05:58 AM

Amazon wouldn't even know about Bulmer. Why should they?
And as I said above, I certainly am not blaming anyone for buying badly produced CD-Rs. If that is all that is available. The money for Bulmer is peanuts anyway.
Which is why I can't understand what prevents him from doing a deal with all the artists on the old Leader/Trailer labels that he legitemately owns the rights to?
Everyone would make a lot more than they are now. (Apart from the ones who are now dead of course,)
Even in these financially straightened times. A complete box set of all of Nic Jones output, complete with sumptuous booklet (a la Sandy Denny, Fairport, and many others) could be a money spinner for him, and the artists as well. After all Neil Wayne did the same with the Free Reed recordings over the past few years, and jolly good they are too.
Well, I'm not holding my breath on this one.
It's just so sad. I hope Mr Bulmer sleeps soundly at night.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: BTNG
Date: 14 Nov 10 - 03:30 PM

Bulmer has slept soundly for years as I'm sure you have Ralphie...

anyway back to what this thread is really about...the programme is available outside of Britain, I'm listening to it right at this moment (14th November 2010)

BTNG


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 14 Nov 10 - 03:54 PM

Good to know that it is available to listen again outside of the UK.
(Although I think it will disappear from the BBC Listen Again facility in a day or so)
Not so good to know that you have posted with no real name BTNG, So, I'll treat your other remark the way I treat all anonymous postings, by ignoring it.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Chris B.
Date: 15 Nov 10 - 09:08 AM

Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 14 Nov 10 - 02:17 AM

Mr McKenzie said "I bought Bright Phoebus".
Jolly good, except that the family will not receive a penny, as the Celtic Music situation rumbles on.
I'm not in anyway blaming you, but just thought you'd like to know that your money is in the hands of someone other than Lals family.
And, I have a recording of the R4 doc "Lost Albums, Bright Phoebus" from a few years ago.

======

That R4 doc. "Lost Albums, Bright Phoebus" could do with uploading to TheBox.bz or RapidShare.com - so that others may also listen to it. I can do this if you wish.

======


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Chris B.
Date: 15 Nov 10 - 09:09 AM

I have the latest BBC doc. on MP3 (see OP) if anyone wants it.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Paul
Date: 16 Nov 10 - 09:49 AM

Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Chris B.
Date: 15 Nov 10 - 09:09 AM

I have the latest BBC doc. on MP3 (see OP) if anyone wants it.

---------------------

I would be very grateful indeed if you could upload it to sendspace or something. Been having a nightmare here struggling with iPlayer to try and listen to it before the time ran out.

Does anyone have the Bright Phoebus doc for upload as well?

Thanks!


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 16 Nov 10 - 10:29 AM

please, I would also be grateful for a link to an upload of

"Lost Albums, Bright Phoebus"

I only managed to listen to the first half of the Saturday afternoon broadcast
before the mrs dragged me out to the shops..

and for whatever reason was unable to listen again on BBC i player.

cheers...


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Chris B.
Date: 16 Nov 10 - 01:01 PM

Good apps. for recording BBC audio is either Audacity (set to Options / 'Software Playthrough' and using 'Stereo Mix') or the various sound recording apps. of NCH at htto://www.nchsoftware.com/index.html

The said prog. is temporarily uploaded to:

http://www.mediafire.com/?xm0gg8jn72m7oy2

It will disappear after 10 downloads or 60 days - which ever is soonest.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Paul
Date: 16 Nov 10 - 01:08 PM

amazing, thanks!


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: Phil Edwards
Date: 16 Nov 10 - 05:58 PM

"The said prog" = the one in the Subject line, right? Not the Bright Phoebus doc.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Nov 10 - 05:49 AM

Sadly the Bright Phoebus doc. is not in the public domain right now.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Ed
Date: 17 Nov 10 - 05:57 AM

Thank you Chris, for uploading it.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Nov 10 - 06:34 AM

Aha - I see the issue. I've now renamed the file "once_in_a_blue_moon-documentary.2010-11-09.mp3" - it is NOT the music CD of the same name.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Chris B re: "Bright Phoebus"
Date: 17 Nov 10 - 08:28 AM

BBC Documentary - "Lost Albums: Bright Phoebus"

Tuesday 8 May 2007 13:30-14:00 (Radio 4 FM)
Repeated: Saturday 12 May 2007 15:30-16:00 (Radio 4 FM)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/lostalbums/pip/ux1hf/

Music journalist Pete Paphides reveals the stories and music behind some of the great albums which have been lost in the mists of time.

Folk legends Mike Waterson, Martin Carthy and Ashley Hutchings talk about the writing and recording of the 1972 album now considered one of the definitive recordings of the genre. When it was released, it was shunned by both critics and audiences.

Appeals have gone out for a copy of this programmes to: www.TheBox.bz # www.radioarchive.cc # news:uk.music.folk # news:rec.music.folk


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: jacko@nz
Date: 17 Nov 10 - 07:52 PM

Thanks for that link Chris

Jack

ps Hope things are well with you


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Chris B - Bright Phoebus
Date: 19 Nov 10 - 04:55 PM

BBC Documentary - "Lost Albums: Bright Phoebus"

I have contacted someone on another forum who has a copy. But its on his hard-drive on his computer in store in Israel. However due to the interest on that forum and this one he's going to try and retrieve it for me. We'll get a copy for folks here eventually.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: Spleen Cringe
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 10:02 AM

Great stuff.

Now I just wish there was way of seeing the Lal Waterson tribute at the BBC Electric Proms... missed it at the time.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 10:44 AM

There's a few things on Youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=laIlYccDc2k

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZDENoSQ4uA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuDpGbXuBlc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t5ejyrs2FSg


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Spleen Cringe
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 12:02 PM

Thanks!


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Chris B.
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 05:12 PM

Sadly the "Lal Waterson tribute at the BBC Electric Proms" is not on TheBox.bz nor is there a torrent file out there.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 13.30 Tues
From: GUEST,Chris B.
Date: 01 Dec 10 - 09:51 AM

See: http://www.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=133942


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 Nov 2010
From: Rain Dog
Date: 11 Mar 16 - 06:14 AM

Once in a Blue Moon: The Songs of Lal Waterson

This was on BBC Radio 4 Extra this morning. It is available on the BBC iplayer for a further 29 days

Once in a Blue Moon


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 Nov 2010
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Mar 16 - 08:42 AM

Does anyone know the number of the house in Park Avenue, Hull where she lived? There is, at present, no blue plaque on it like there is on the houses of Amy Johnson and Anthony Minghella. But there should be.


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Subject: RE: Lal Waterson BBC Radio4 Nov 2010
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Apr 16 - 06:02 AM

Dave Bulmer of Celtic Music died a few years ago - isn't Mike Waterson now dead? Whether this has led to a resolution of the disputes between DB and the artists formerly with Leader Music (if I ahve got the facts right) I do not know. There is I think a whole thread about this; my impression is that it was not just a simple case of greed on DB's part - if so he would have released a lot of the music and not paid the artists what they were legally entitled to. I suspect once people began to criticise him this got his back up and he became fairly intransigent (I emphasise that on the whole my sympathies would have been with the artists). Anyway a sad situation all round.

I bought a vinyl version of "Bright Phoebus" in the early 1970s (I still have it though don't have a normal working turntable to play it on. although I do have one of those ones which enable you to convert to digital format). I think the vinyl version is worth around £50.

I also remember hearing (at least some of) the radio program about Bright Phoebus while travelling in the car some years ago.


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