Thought for the Day (Oct 14)

Subject: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: Tony Burns
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 08:30 AM

"There is no human reason why a child should not admire and emulate his teacher's ability to do sums, rather than the village bum's ability to whittle sticks and smoke cigarettes. The reason why the child does not is plain enough--the bum has put himself on an equality with him, and the teacher has not." - Floyd Dell

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: Peter T.
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 09:13 AM

Not true -- chidren are enticed by superior authority and the expectation of magical powers to learn all sorts of stupid things. They admire and emulate all over the place: that is the glory and curse of the thing.
yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: Patrish(inactive)
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 09:30 AM

Looking through the eyes of a child (I was one once) Whittlins sticks is magical, smoking face may look magical. But sums??!! The teacher has to get to child level -speak the same language, understand the child. The bum may not care.....

kindest regards Patrish

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: MMario
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 09:34 AM

"the glory and the curse" - sometimes that just seems to describe CHILDREN, period, doesn't it?

MMario

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: katlaughing
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 11:07 AM

I don't know...I'm glad my teachers didn't come down to our childish levels when teaching us sums and all other subjects. My children, 21, 26, & 29, who did not grow up with calculators attached, are still nonetheless amazed at how well I do sums in my head; sometimes it downright frustrates them!

I am grateful that my teachers had high expectations of us and gave us the tools and training to accomplish them.

I am not sure some of this holds true, today. Teachers are expected to be and do so much more now. They don't have time or energy left, quite often, to really focus on actual teaching. That and children, today, seem to be pretty passive and lazy, in general, about learning. I think there are many reasons for this, mostly societal. And, after all, children will only strive to live up to our expectations, so if those are low, well....there ya go.

MHO, kat

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: Mían
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 11:22 AM

The saying speaks to me of the virtue of remaining child-like in all one's endeavours - infusing wonder into the smallest act.

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: Peter T.
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 11:33 AM

There you have it Mian -- think of the wonder of doing sums: of being able to add something to something else and get something different, to be able to add 634520334 to 5435493045 within a few seconds and get some humungous new number. Multiplying, subtracting, dividing!!! all fabulous, and we let our machines do it for us, as the ironist said about our servants and dancing. Is there anything more important to the future of the earth than exponential functions (cf., yesterday on the rate of population increase, or any ecosystem's thriving).
And how do they teach it? As if it were death with a cold (as my mother used to say). Drives you crazy. All this wonderful stuff, locked away by dullness.
yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: Penny S.
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 12:25 PM

Having just had a week when the teaching went like magic, (well, almost), but knowing that what lay behind it was weeks of late night and weekend grind, I know why we don't do the magic all the time. Two weeks off and one week on would just about work.

But you do have to respect the child.

Penny

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: Magpie
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 12:31 PM

Yes, Penny, you're right. But sometimes it's darn near impossible! But then again I teach 13-15 year-olds. They can be pretty difficult at times. Especially when they don't even have any respect for themselves.

Magpie (who isn't all that magic most of the time)

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: Bert
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 12:39 PM

You're right Peter T, it's amazing how they can take something that should be such fun and make it boring.
When I was at school no one ever told me that math was a game. Let's pretend that we can have number without quantity. So kids got really frustrated trying to understand some hidden meaning that wasn't there and never did get the hang of it.

Hey guys this is fun! let's see what happens if we take two of these 'things that are not there' and then grab another two of them. Now how many of them do we have? which we don't really HAVE at all 'cos this is just let's pretend!!!

But of course this takes time. When I was teaching I found EXACTLY the same ratio as Penny S. For every hour in class I had to spend at least two hours preparing the lesson, to do it properly.

Bert.

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: Peter T.
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 02:27 PM

You also need to be treated as if teaching is a worthy occupation, so you have the morale and incentive to keep up your energy. University professors get that more or less automatically (often for no good reason at all) but the ones on the front lines -- kindergarten through high school (hell, by the time they are in university it is all about over for good or ill) -- get practically none anymore.
yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: annamill
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 02:56 PM

I don't know. Seems to me it's not about coming DOWN to a childs level as much as it is understanding what motivates a child and using that. What the bum does puts no pressure on a child to learn, shows him the pleasure in doing the things he does (or supposed pleasure, we know better). He doesn't care if the child learns or not, therefore, allowing the child to pick up the knowledge the natural way. Observing its uses. Somewhere along the line, we have taken the natural joy out of learning and made it very unpleasant. Too bad. We get an "F".

Love, annap

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: Mían
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 03:25 PM

A child is just us in smaller bodies, eh?

And I remember almost all of my teachers, kindergarten thru' high school. They are the most important people in my life besides my immediate family members. Perhaps I am odd that way.

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: Little Neophyte
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 09:18 PM

You made good point annap & mian. I totally agree with you about loss of joy in learning. There was no joy in my learning process as a child until grade eight when a particular teacher brought back vital signs into my academic life. I am also currently experiencing the gift of a great teacher. It is a rare opportunity, one I feel deep gratitude for. Little Neo

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (Oct 14)
From: katlaughing
Date: 14 Oct 99 - 09:31 PM

Gee, I feel really fortunate. I loved most of my teachers and the ones I didn't that I thought were the hard-arses (and they were) are the ones I now feel the most gratitude for, as they really made me learn. And, since their forcefulness was a challenge that I enjoyed, well, I believe I received the equivalent or better of a nowadays college education in high school. I enjoyed school very much.

kat