Manners at festival sessions.

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: GUEST,padgett
Date: 07 May 14 - 11:45 AM

Wakefield sessions have tunes and songs ~ first and third Sundays in the month @ Fernandes Tap and Bull and Fairhouse from 1.30pm that is a mixed session open pub and audience and musicians without direction and works well

second Sunday is instrumentalists' session in Barnsley @ Old No 7 bar, Irish and no singing starts 1.30pm! see Alan Jones Celtic session

Ray

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: Mr Happy
Date: 07 May 14 - 10:47 AM

Meself & Gloom Band enjoyed the fringe [un/dis/organised ]seshes at Upton, glorious sunshine at sesh in beer garden of White Lion - no bad manners, hog it alls or showoffs - just good music, singing & company!

We'd stayed home each evening, only venturing out during the day & had a super time, watched the morrisers et al & the procession - encountering goodd neighbourliness & friendliness in all day sessions.

Perh probs refered to above involved excess alcohol, all day & all evening supping?

Anyway, we all had fab time - off to Chester FF next over next bank hol - anyone else?

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 May 14 - 07:22 PM

"Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: Steve Shaw - PM
Date: 05 May 14 - 05:09 PM

Avoid festival sessions. Avoid festivals. Enjoy life instead."
so all festival sessions are the same and all festivals are the same, what a ridiculous statement.

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: GUEST
Date: 06 May 14 - 01:13 PM

One thing about organised festival instrumental sessions in bars is that a space gets set aside for the musicians and about a quarter of it gets taken up by non playing spouses and partners, plus the inevitable character who uses an extra chair for storing the instrument case. Late comers then spill over into the main bar area blocking access with all the annoyance that causes for other customers.

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 06 May 14 - 12:45 PM

Yes, Nigel, instrumentalists, but I doubt if anyone misunderstood what I wrote.

And of course I was giving 2 extremes. There are many mixed sessions, and perhaps it would be better to differentiate between solo/small group performances and the pieces that everyone is endeavouring to join in with.

Where there is obviously a performance going on people should respect that, but we are talking here about playing/singing in a public place and there are examples above where we also need to respect the space of locals, non-performers etc. It's a two-way thing!

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 06 May 14 - 07:31 AM

Maybe in some cases oblivious to the tune, too.

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 06 May 14 - 07:20 AM

From: Steve Gardham - PM
Musicians' session.
usually equals almost everybody in the room thrashing away on an instrument oblivious to anything else but the tune.

Singers' session.
Individual singers performing, everybody else listening.

A big difference I'd say.

Discussing 'manners', this is one that annoys me.
Can we stop discussing musicians/singers? The term 'musicians' encompasses both.
I think (hope) that the distinction you intended to make was instrumentalists(or players)/singers.

Cheers
Nigel

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 06 May 14 - 05:50 AM

My worst experience of bad manners was at The Middle Earth in Whitby a few years ago, we were there early and sat at the front, it filled up very quickly, the late arrivals came armed with chairs and seated themselves in front of those of us who were already there, so close as to make playing uncomfortable, when asked to move they all said no, comments about their bad manners got a response which confirmed their bad manners, we and a few more people just walked out.

Dave H

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: Johnny J
Date: 06 May 14 - 05:26 AM

Festival sessions when they work can be brilliant affairs and, in my humble opinion, a much more enjoyable experience than the regular pub session both in terms of musical potential and spontaneity.

Conversely, they can often be a disaster, sometimes very patchy and, at other times a complete rabble.

Usually, there is also an increased number of punters around including non performing and often wannabe musicians and singers who want to get get in on the act plus many local people on whose territory these festival sessions are encroaching. Usually, there are even more of the latter too who don't necessarily enjoy the music but like the sense of occasion and opportunity to get "p-ss-d".

Generally, festival sessions tend to be more welcoming and less cliquish than the regular affairs but the downside of this is that many people regard them as a free for all.
While I am more likely to join a session with musicians I don't know at a festival, I still don't force myself upon them or try to take over. Not everyone is quite as good mannered or as reticent as me though.

Another example of bad manners is when a group of musicians and or singers enter a bar and set up their own session while there is another already in progress just a few feet away. As far as I'm concerned, the people who were there first should be allowed to have priority no matter how bad or good they might be. If the new people wish to play or sing, they should either respectfully request to join the existing session or wait until it is over. Sounds sensible, I'd have thought?

As regards sessions organised by the folk festival itself, I would tend to disagree that these are necessarily always a good thing and I think their efforts should be better spent on planning concerts and more official events rather than running pub sessions. Also, I am not keen on the idea of musicians being "planted" in bars although the idea, I'm sure, is to make sure something happens. However, if this is the case, they should be prepared to take a back seat and allow others a chance but some of them just seem to treat it like another gig.

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: selby
Date: 06 May 14 - 03:18 AM

Fringe or Festival herein lies the problem in my opinion, at a festival a couple of years ago a group of us all musicians where in a pub enjoying a drink with our instruments not on view. The room had tables around the walls leaving a horseshoe in the middle. A group of people came in to hold a session in the middle of the room at this point they had no respect for anyone in the room,organising furniture shoving boxes in peoples faces etc, we where sat facing the wall at a table and a 2 of this group placed there chairs so that it was resting on the backs of our chairs they where so arrogant that they would not move,one of them also fussed around as if they was god. When the session started we took our instruments out and played the tunes being played badly in there ear till they moved. This was at a large festival and was unorganized, the view they gave of the organized festival was not very well received by non folkies in the room we left after finishing our beer.

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: GUEST,#
Date: 05 May 14 - 09:03 PM

I think maybe the OP meant fringe, not festival.

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 May 14 - 08:51 PM

If you think my post amounted to "aggression", oh anonymous guest, you must be bonkers! It represented an opinion that I happen to know is shared by many!

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: GUEST
Date: 05 May 14 - 08:17 PM

Too many drunk...and even more stoned.

Why do you even go? (to hook up)

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: GUEST,SussexCarole
Date: 05 May 14 - 08:09 PM

Andrew & I ran one of the music/song sessions at Upton in the Muggery (Saturday night)and what a pleasure that was. A wonderful mixed session of all genres of song and music. Everyone happy to take their turn and share everything. Best session ever - thanks to all who came.

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: GUEST
Date: 05 May 14 - 05:25 PM

Why the aggression Steve? And again I refer back to the original question .

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 05 May 14 - 05:12 PM

Musicians' session.
usually equals almost everybody in the room thrashing away on an instrument oblivious to anything else but the tune.

Singers' session.
Individual singers performing, everybody else listening.

A big difference I'd say.

Before you ask, I take part in and enjoy both.

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 May 14 - 05:09 PM

Avoid festival sessions. Avoid festivals. Enjoy life instead.

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: GUEST
Date: 05 May 14 - 04:16 PM

Barging past a musician playing
Presumably not the ones who insist on blocking the doorways.

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: GUEST
Date: 05 May 14 - 01:12 PM

Thought that was how they always dressed!

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 05 May 14 - 01:08 PM

Dress code? Is dressing like extras at the filming of the Hobbit classed as bad manners?

Sorry bored of Chorlton

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: GUEST
Date: 05 May 14 - 01:03 PM

I'm talking about a musicians session though I struggle to see that it really makes any difference. However, the actual question is why does a different set of rules seem to apply at a festival session as opposed to regular "home" sessions.

Subject: RE: Manners at festival sessions.
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 05 May 14 - 12:51 PM

It makes a big difference here to know whether you're talking about a music session or a song session. If you're talking about a typical musicians session I doubt if anyone would notice if you shouted across the room.

Barging past a musician playing or even any 'barging' is just plain rude; it's got nothing to do with being in a session.

Subject: Manners at festival sessions.
From: GUEST
Date: 05 May 14 - 11:19 AM

Having spent a couple of days playing in sessions at another wonderful Upton festival I have again been reminded how people's manners tend to go out of the window when at festival sessions. Just as an exampl; the all too common scenario of a fellow musician barging past, interrupting concentration, enjoyment and, sometimes.even the space needed to play. Thankfully people tend to be well mannered and considerate at their friendly "home" session but plonk them in a festival environment and it can all too easily turn into a wrestling match. Why? We're all here to enjoy some good music . And just because yo're not joining in it doesn't give anyone the right to shout across the room to your mate.