Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)

Subject: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Jul 14 - 02:46 PM

In Six Months, Microsoft Will Pull The Plug On Windows 7 Support
Business Insider By Julie Bort July 8 2014

Microsoft is warning customers that the end is soon coming for Windows 7 in much the same way it came for Windows XP earlier this year. Microsoft will end free mainstream support for Windows 7 on January 13, 2015.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates
From: GUEST,Ed
Date: 08 Jul 14 - 02:49 PM

Can you give any good reason why they should continue to support it?

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 08 Jul 14 - 02:49 PM

well, I'll go over to Apple before I put up WIN 8...

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 08 Jul 14 - 02:54 PM

"Can you give any good reason why they should continue to support it?"

How about the fact that we have spent good money on the d*mn thing and do not see the need to switch over to something else - which will not be cheap... or did you think they would offer free upgrades?!?

If I take care of my older car, I see no good reason to be forced to buy a newer model because I can't get parts any longer. How about customer satisfaction?!

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 08 Jul 14 - 03:00 PM

Each new Windows version is more or less a new system. Upgrading is very tedious and risky. Apple will harvest part of the crop. So would Linux, if its propagandists and protagonists were more on the ball.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates
From: michaelr
Date: 08 Jul 14 - 06:36 PM

Fuck, I've bought 7 but haven't installed it yet (still using XP which works just fine). Should I even bother?

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Jul 14 - 06:52 PM

Will that also be the cut off date for further monthly security 'fixes' via windows update ?

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Brian May
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 02:37 AM

I went to Apple with the advent of Vista. Never regretted it.

My experience of Windows 7 is that it was the most stable variant I'd ever used. Microsoft and other major companies need to re-invent themselves every time period in order to keep themselves viable as a business,

Hence they wish to 'force' consumers to use their latest gig - and in fairness, combatting security threats is getting more complex, although much of the threat appears to come via the browser these days.

MS have had to delay all the previous out of support days - can't see this being any different.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 03:22 AM

I think maybe our unnamed Guest based his/her post on this article: In Six Months, Microsoft Will Pull The Plug On Some Parts Of Windows 7 Support. The original post left out the pertinent phrase, "some parts of." It appears the article has been updated to state that Microsoft will issue security updates to Windows 7 until 2020. Maybe the original poster didn't have access to the update.

So, I think the predicted disaster may not be as serious as our Guest expects.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Mr Red
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 12:38 PM

I'm waiting for the post that claims Apple products don't get viruses.
If you were a virus writer wouldn't you go for the soft underbelly where there are ignoramuses who believe they are impregnable?
Viruses per se do not earn the criminals money. Trojans and Zombies are where the money is. And without a "Defender" (Macs don't have AV products - hmmm) how would you know?

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 12:53 PM

Win7 is the last best stable version. I use Windows 7 Ultimate and will keep it going until (if ever) they create another desktop version. Win 8.1 is intended for mobile devices and touch screen devices. If I went to that I'd then have to find a large touch-screen monitor. I use Win 8.1 on my touchscreen laptop and would find a non-touch system using it to be frustrating. I expect we'll be hearing these reports of less support of Win7 for some time to come. Microsoft wants to move customers along to new versions, but they do always drag us kicking and screaming.

Win 8.1 isn't bad, and you can use the "old desktop" easily enough. It comes up any time you open a tile for a program that is older.


SRS

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 01:37 PM

Win 8 is dogshit. I did try to install 8.1 but it demanded access to my social media platforms! No fucking way. I have however put Classic Shell onto 8 and it is less worse.

I have also found out how to save things where I want to, not where the fraggling OS wants to, in 7 (on the extra hard drive, duh, so that "format C" does not wipe out my data) and maybe, just maybe, I can do the same with Win 8 and put all my data onto a thumb drive.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 01:39 PM

PS - I am getting three old single core machines back into running. What would be the simplest, easiest, Linux to try on one or more of them? I do want to try it but there are so many stories about problems getting stuff to work.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 01:44 PM

Richard, I'm tempted to try AV Linux - a light weight install package designed specifically for musicians & videograhers.

http://www.bandshed.net/AVLinux.html

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 02:10 PM

I am pleased to have found a "not genuine" pre-activated version of win7 for my old PC.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Stanron
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 07:55 PM

I use Linux Mint 16. The Cinnamon desk top is similar to XP, or maybe I've got used to it. There is now a version 17. You download the file and burn it to a disk as an ISO, set your computer to boot from the CD/DVD drive and try it out. If you like it you can make a bootable flash drive, buy a new hard drive and install it on that or, more risky, dual boot on your C drive.

Linux has a free office suite with database, spreadsheet, word processor and drawing program fully compatible with Windows formats.

There is a program called Wine which allows me to run Sibelius 3 and a Sudoku program I bought when running XP.

Ther is another program that allows you to install Windows afresh inside Linux although I've not tried that.

Linux is great. A free operating system, loads of free software and a very supportive online community. I've used it for at least a year now, guess how many virus programs I've had to buy.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: michaelr
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 08:07 PM

What's an ISO?

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Stanron
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 09:09 PM

ISO is a file extension used in burning DVDs. Like

Filename.iso

More info here.

ISO Definition

Linux operating systems are distributed as free downloads of files with this kind of extension and your DVD burner has to be able to burn this kind of file.

There are programs that do this out there for free.

Alternatively your local Tesco or Asda sells magazines such as 'Linux User'. Issue 141 has a DVD containing a bootable DVD of Linux Mint 17 which, if you like it, can be used to install the system on your machine. This cost me £5.99 in my local Asda. A good bit cheaper than Windows.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: michaelr
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 09:18 PM

Thank you, Stanron. I'm in USA, so no local Tesco or Asda.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Stanron
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 09:34 PM

OK try this site

Mint 17

The very first link, Cinnamon .32bit would be a good start.

Download the file and burn it to a DVD. Ith the DVD in your drive reboot and see if it runs.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Stanron
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 09:36 PM

That should be 'With the DVD in your drive reboot etc'.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 09 Jul 14 - 11:59 PM

Win 8 is written for machines and devices that save their data to the cloud, but you can set it up so it doesn't do that. Just install it like your other computers with a discrete password for the computer alone, not using your email to connect the computer to the Microsoft cloud. You can later set up any accounts you want to transfer data to the cloud, if you wish.

SRS

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Nick
Date: 10 Jul 14 - 07:48 AM

Look on Microsoft's Support Life Cycle page gives you a fuller picture.

I use Office 2000 on a machine at home which is still merrily working 5 years after all support ended (and have a friend using Office 97 which went out of support 12 years ago) and it still works fine.

I'd reckon that it is more likely that something mechanical on your machine will fail before the extended support for Windows 7 (which is mostly about security rather than needed functionality)

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: treewind
Date: 10 Jul 14 - 06:21 PM

"Richard, I'm tempted to try AV Linux - a light weight install package designed specifically for musicians & videograhers."

It's very easy to try. Like Mint 16 mentioned above, you download a DVD image, burn it to a blank DVD which you can boot and find out if it supports all your hardware properly. The live DVD has and almost-one-click installer. I use AVLinux on my studio computer, with Ardour as the main audio recording, editing and mixing tool - done several whole albums on it now, it's a lovely setup.

I have two old laptops running Linux too. One, an IBM Thinkpad R50, is Lubuntu, which is Ubuntu with the LXDE dektop - ultra-lightweight and fast. The other is an HP/Compaq with plain Debian (my favourite Linux distribution).

If in doubt about hardware support, Ubuntu is a safe bet - it works on almost anything and has good hardware detection.

As for Windows 7 - yes, the primary level of support expires soon but that's the same level that was dropped many years ago on XP, while security updates will continue for a long time. They may be emphasising end of Win7 support because nobody wants to buy Windows 8. Almost all Windows 8 sales are pre-installed where buyers hardly have a choice. Win 7 is quite usable if you must use Windows: fast with a solid state drive and 8MB of memory(!), and very stable.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Brian May
Date: 10 Jul 14 - 07:14 PM

8 Gig of RAM?

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: bob schwarer
Date: 10 Jul 14 - 07:28 PM

Windows 9 will be out this fall or next spring according to rumors. Whether or not it will have a "start" menu was not mentioned.

You can always add a "Start" menu to Windows 8 to get it to look like old W7. Microsoft is finally getting the message that Windows 8 is not a desktop system.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Jul 14 - 07:49 AM

"8 Gig of RAM?"
Er, yes [blush] You know what I meant.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 11 Jul 14 - 02:00 PM

I couldn't find any announcement of termination date for Windows 7 on the Microsoft site.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: GUEST,Ed
Date: 11 Jul 14 - 02:43 PM

Bob,

Both 'Bob' and 'Schwarer' should be started with a capital letter. I suppose that I should let you off, being American.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Jul 14 - 02:52 PM

Hi treewind, ok - took your advice and downloaded & burnt iso onto DVD.

Clicking the disc in Win 7 doesn't autoplay. only opens up file structure.
Do you mean the PC needs to reboot with the disc inserted in DVD drive ?

I just want to try it, not install it.

Btw, the MD5 downloadex with the iso didn't confirm iso was ok when tested in MD5 checker ?

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Stanron
Date: 11 Jul 14 - 03:15 PM

Yes you need to reboot. On my PC I have to press F8 to get to the boot option menu which allows me to choose to boot from the DVD drive. Perhaps you should check your BIOS to see if CD/DVD booting is enabled.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Stanron
Date: 11 Jul 14 - 08:06 PM

Oh yes, you can just try it. There is a button to press if you want to install it, but you can check if it recognises your modem and other hardware.

It's worth keeping in mind that running the system from a CD or DVD is a lot slower than it will be when it is installed on a hard drive.

These days installation is pretty straightforward and hassle free, and there's no validation code or registration. Installation should take less than an hour and if your hard drive is big enough you could have a dual boot. Windows and Linux.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: GUEST,SqueezeMe
Date: 11 Jul 14 - 11:06 PM

This thread has inspired me to try Linux. Thanks to all concerned.

I have been using XP since the April withdrawal of Micro$oft support with no adverse effects....so far! However, I suppose it is only a matter of time until something goes pear shaped.

I have burned the .iso and played around with the program a bit and it makes some sense, so next step is to (nervously) hit the install button to attempt a dual boot set up. (Yes, I've backed up everything on an external HD, just in case....)

Wish me luck!

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: GUEST,SqueezeMe
Date: 11 Jul 14 - 11:09 PM

Just one point.
If I decide at a later stage to permanently pull the plug on WinXP, will I have to reformat and re-install Linux?

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 12 Jul 14 - 12:43 AM

If you create a dual-boot system with partitions on the hard drive, should you decide to use just Linux then you can format just the drive that had XP on it and leave Linux alone. You can later move that partition of the drive back into usable space for Linux.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: SqueezeMe
Date: 12 Jul 14 - 08:12 AM

OK. Thanks.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Stanron
Date: 12 Jul 14 - 09:03 AM

If you don't already have a second hard drive you could get one and install linux on that. It would help if you know if it is IDE or SATA but it's easy enough to tell if you look inside. IDE drives have wide ribbons maybe 2" wide and SATA drive connectors are about 1/2" wide.

Hard drives are pretty cheap these days and if your existing drive is old you may not find out until it dies completely.

Linux installation routines are usually trouble free but I have, once, accidentally reformatted a Windows 7 drive without meaning to. Removing the Windows hard drive and installing linux on a fresh drive will guarentee you loose nothing. You can replace the Windows drive later and use F8 on boot up to choose which system to use.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: GUEST,SqueezeMe
Date: 13 Jul 14 - 09:30 AM

Your comments, Stanron, are appreciated, but I went ahead prior to reading your post. Installed dual boot set up sucessfully, without loss. However, this is not my main computer, so any disaster will be a minor one.

The learning curve begins/continues....

So far, so good. Managed to get Audacity happenning, along with various audio/visual applications, plus basic internet and word processing.

Still lacking Tag&Rename type software. Any suggestions?

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 13 Jul 14 - 10:35 AM

I used a dual system back when commercial computers were coming with Windows ME (that was a piece of junk but it had the drivers for a lot of my computer's peripherals) and Win2000Pro. I work at a university and was able to get that for a few dollars and I set up the Win2000 for work and used the ME for other stuff. It took HP and others a while to finally release the drivers for the peripheral equipment so they could be installed on the 2000 side. When that happened, I got rid of the ME crap and shifted my partitions so the ME side simply went away. Those were the old days when some of this stuff was a little harder to do and drivers weren't everywhere for download.

SRS

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Stanron
Date: 13 Jul 14 - 11:25 AM

I'm not sure what you mean by Tag&Rename type software. Have you discovered the Software Manager yet? You can use it to search for and install compatible programs. Which version have you installed?

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Jul 14 - 11:36 AM

I've inherited some laptops and a PC from a close relative who passed 2 years ago, dating from win 95 to vista.
Prime candidates for AV linux as soon as I have time to get them running again.

But I will need to try and crack passwords beforehand,
to see if anything on the hard drives is of vital importance
to keep for posterity ?

I googled a while back, that there may be 'hack' software to burn to a boot disc
that circumvents passwords for those versions of windows.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: GUEST,SqueezeMe
Date: 13 Jul 14 - 09:20 PM

Stanron, Tag&Rename is a program for Windows used for applying/editing metadata tags in recorded music files. Like many folk here, I'm slowly transcribing my large LP record and cassette collection to digital format, and whilst tags are not absolutely essential, those of us who are a wee bit OCD quite like the idea....

Of course, I can always boot to Windows and use my existing Tag& Rename program there, but it would be nice to try to use something in Linux as my immediate aim is just to see how I get along with the OS, with the long term aim of dispensing with Windows.

I have installed Linux Mint 17 and indeed discovered the Software Manager, which does contains an Audio Tag Tool, which I've tried (albeit briefly) but I don't find it too intuative and it seems the help file is missing from the download, hence my request for recommendations of similar programs that others may be using. Lots in a Google search results of course: far too many to try them all!

In the meantime, the fun continues....

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Jul 14 - 07:25 PM

I just downloaded Mint 17 and installed it on my number 2 machine. Nice. Similar to the Mint 16 I normally use.

There is a program you can download through the Software Manager called Wine. This lets you install and run Windows programs in Linux.

You need the installation files and you install it, funnily enough, using the

Uninstall Wine Software

Link. It doesn't work for all software but it's worth a try.

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: GUEST,SqueezeMe
Date: 14 Jul 14 - 08:02 PM

Thanks for the advice, Guest above.
I have tried that, with some success, but not all features of T&R seem to work, though probably enough for what I need. Still playing with it....

Subject: RE: Tech: Thank you, Bill Gates (Win7)
From: Stanron
Date: 14 Jul 14 - 09:47 PM

Guest above was me on the new machine without cookie. I have a couple of Windows programs that run under Wine. Both have their problems but I can generally work round them. The only thing that I haven't sorted out is my printer. It's an OKI and they don't do Linux drivers.It is possible to run Windows in Linux but I haven;t tried that as I have no Windows installation stuff.