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BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II

Keith A of Hertford 03 Feb 17 - 06:24 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Feb 17 - 06:38 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Feb 17 - 06:45 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Feb 17 - 07:17 AM
Big Al Whittle 03 Feb 17 - 07:52 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Feb 17 - 08:19 AM
Big Al Whittle 03 Feb 17 - 08:57 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Feb 17 - 09:00 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Feb 17 - 09:16 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Feb 17 - 09:25 AM
Raggytash 03 Feb 17 - 09:47 AM
Big Al Whittle 03 Feb 17 - 09:48 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Feb 17 - 10:31 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Feb 17 - 11:05 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Feb 17 - 11:24 AM
punkfolkrocker 03 Feb 17 - 11:37 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Feb 17 - 12:13 PM
Jim Carroll 03 Feb 17 - 12:24 PM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Feb 17 - 12:40 PM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Feb 17 - 12:44 PM
Dave the Gnome 03 Feb 17 - 12:54 PM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Feb 17 - 12:56 PM
Steve Shaw 03 Feb 17 - 01:02 PM
Teribus 03 Feb 17 - 01:27 PM
Jim Carroll 03 Feb 17 - 01:28 PM
Steve Shaw 03 Feb 17 - 01:50 PM
Jim Carroll 03 Feb 17 - 02:33 PM
bobad 03 Feb 17 - 03:50 PM
Steve Shaw 03 Feb 17 - 05:26 PM
bobad 03 Feb 17 - 06:48 PM
Teribus 04 Feb 17 - 02:54 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Feb 17 - 03:32 AM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Feb 17 - 05:08 AM
Steve Shaw 04 Feb 17 - 05:23 AM
Steve Shaw 04 Feb 17 - 05:26 AM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Feb 17 - 05:32 AM
Teribus 04 Feb 17 - 06:02 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Feb 17 - 06:58 AM
Steve Shaw 04 Feb 17 - 07:20 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Feb 17 - 08:05 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Feb 17 - 08:14 AM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Feb 17 - 09:12 AM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Feb 17 - 09:31 AM
Steve Shaw 04 Feb 17 - 10:54 AM
Backwoodsman 04 Feb 17 - 11:29 AM
bobad 04 Feb 17 - 11:47 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Feb 17 - 12:18 PM
Jim Carroll 04 Feb 17 - 12:28 PM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Feb 17 - 12:41 PM
Steve Shaw 04 Feb 17 - 01:02 PM
Jim Carroll 04 Feb 17 - 01:07 PM
Jim Carroll 04 Feb 17 - 01:42 PM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Feb 17 - 02:38 PM
Jim Carroll 04 Feb 17 - 03:25 PM
Keith A of Hertford 05 Feb 17 - 05:38 AM
Jim Carroll 05 Feb 17 - 05:48 AM
Backwoodsman 05 Feb 17 - 05:52 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Feb 17 - 06:28 AM
bobad 05 Feb 17 - 08:02 AM
Keith A of Hertford 05 Feb 17 - 09:19 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Feb 17 - 09:29 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Feb 17 - 09:46 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Feb 17 - 09:58 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Feb 17 - 10:04 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Feb 17 - 10:10 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Feb 17 - 10:14 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Feb 17 - 10:16 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Feb 17 - 10:21 AM
bobad 05 Feb 17 - 10:23 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Feb 17 - 11:04 AM
bobad 05 Feb 17 - 11:14 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Feb 17 - 11:35 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Feb 17 - 11:36 AM
Raggytash 05 Feb 17 - 11:38 AM
Backwoodsman 05 Feb 17 - 01:06 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Feb 17 - 01:09 PM
Keith A of Hertford 05 Feb 17 - 01:10 PM
Keith A of Hertford 05 Feb 17 - 01:16 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Feb 17 - 01:16 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Feb 17 - 02:24 PM
Dave the Gnome 05 Feb 17 - 04:02 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Feb 17 - 04:21 PM
Dave the Gnome 05 Feb 17 - 04:42 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Feb 17 - 05:43 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 03:12 AM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Feb 17 - 04:15 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 04:28 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 04:36 AM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Feb 17 - 04:39 AM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Feb 17 - 04:42 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 04:51 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 04:56 AM
Raggytash 06 Feb 17 - 06:18 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 06:57 AM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 07:03 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 07:12 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 07:32 AM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 07:35 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 07:40 AM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 07:55 AM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 08:00 AM
Backwoodsman 06 Feb 17 - 10:58 AM
akenaton 06 Feb 17 - 11:40 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 11:56 AM
bobad 06 Feb 17 - 12:01 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 12:02 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 12:06 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 12:15 PM
akenaton 06 Feb 17 - 12:16 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 12:40 PM
Raggytash 06 Feb 17 - 12:51 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 12:59 PM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Feb 17 - 01:08 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 01:16 PM
Raggytash 06 Feb 17 - 01:31 PM
Jim Carroll 06 Feb 17 - 01:36 PM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Feb 17 - 01:38 PM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Feb 17 - 01:41 PM
Jim Carroll 06 Feb 17 - 01:42 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 01:49 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 01:52 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 01:54 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 01:58 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 02:01 PM
Jim Carroll 06 Feb 17 - 02:03 PM
akenaton 06 Feb 17 - 03:23 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 03:43 PM
Backwoodsman 06 Feb 17 - 04:02 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 04:12 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 04:18 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 04:20 PM
Backwoodsman 06 Feb 17 - 05:02 PM
bobad 06 Feb 17 - 05:27 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Feb 17 - 05:40 PM
Greg F. 06 Feb 17 - 05:56 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 06:14 PM
The Sandman 06 Feb 17 - 06:29 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 06:31 PM
bobad 06 Feb 17 - 06:46 PM
Greg F. 06 Feb 17 - 06:53 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 07:03 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 07:16 PM
bobad 06 Feb 17 - 08:00 PM
Jim Carroll 06 Feb 17 - 08:06 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 08:13 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 09:22 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Feb 17 - 09:24 PM
bobad 06 Feb 17 - 10:14 PM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 03:18 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 03:53 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 04:33 AM
Raggytash 07 Feb 17 - 04:37 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 04:41 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 04:54 AM
Stu 07 Feb 17 - 04:59 AM
Raggytash 07 Feb 17 - 05:01 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 05:01 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 05:07 AM
Raggytash 07 Feb 17 - 05:29 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 05:33 AM
Stu 07 Feb 17 - 05:34 AM
Raggytash 07 Feb 17 - 05:37 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Feb 17 - 05:47 AM
akenaton 07 Feb 17 - 05:52 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Feb 17 - 05:53 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 05:55 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 05:57 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 05:58 AM
Raggytash 07 Feb 17 - 06:00 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 06:03 AM
Raggytash 07 Feb 17 - 06:05 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 06:05 AM
Raggytash 07 Feb 17 - 06:09 AM
akenaton 07 Feb 17 - 06:11 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 06:15 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 06:15 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 06:22 AM
Raggytash 07 Feb 17 - 06:31 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 06:33 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 06:36 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 06:40 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 07:00 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 07:13 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 07:16 AM
Backwoodsman 07 Feb 17 - 07:38 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 07:40 AM
bobad 07 Feb 17 - 07:45 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 07:57 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 08:02 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 08:31 AM
bobad 07 Feb 17 - 08:33 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 08:36 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 08:45 AM
Teribus 07 Feb 17 - 09:05 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 09:20 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Feb 17 - 09:46 AM
David Carter (UK) 07 Feb 17 - 09:47 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 10:13 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 10:17 AM
Teribus 07 Feb 17 - 10:18 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Feb 17 - 10:20 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 10:29 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 10:31 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Feb 17 - 10:37 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Feb 17 - 10:38 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 10:44 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 10:46 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 10:46 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 10:53 AM
Raggytash 07 Feb 17 - 11:05 AM
Raggytash 07 Feb 17 - 11:07 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 11:12 AM
bobad 07 Feb 17 - 11:17 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 11:25 AM
Teribus 07 Feb 17 - 11:27 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 11:31 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 11:37 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Feb 17 - 12:07 PM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 12:10 PM
Teribus 07 Feb 17 - 12:13 PM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 12:16 PM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 12:19 PM
Raggytash 07 Feb 17 - 12:25 PM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 12:36 PM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 01:02 PM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 01:26 PM
Raggytash 07 Feb 17 - 01:40 PM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 02:39 PM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Feb 17 - 02:49 PM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 02:56 PM
Steve Shaw 07 Feb 17 - 03:15 PM
Dave the Gnome 07 Feb 17 - 03:55 PM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 04:05 PM
akenaton 07 Feb 17 - 05:00 PM
Steve Shaw 07 Feb 17 - 05:18 PM
Greg F. 07 Feb 17 - 06:14 PM
bobad 07 Feb 17 - 06:57 PM
Jim Carroll 07 Feb 17 - 07:28 PM
Raggytash 07 Feb 17 - 07:33 PM
Steve Shaw 07 Feb 17 - 07:41 PM
Steve Shaw 07 Feb 17 - 07:52 PM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Feb 17 - 04:13 AM
Jim Carroll 08 Feb 17 - 05:10 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Feb 17 - 09:57 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Feb 17 - 10:05 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Feb 17 - 10:07 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Feb 17 - 10:13 AM
Steve Shaw 08 Feb 17 - 10:14 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Feb 17 - 10:17 AM
Raggytash 08 Feb 17 - 10:21 AM
Raggytash 08 Feb 17 - 10:25 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Feb 17 - 10:42 AM
Raggytash 08 Feb 17 - 10:49 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Feb 17 - 10:50 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Feb 17 - 10:55 AM
Raggytash 08 Feb 17 - 11:05 AM
Jim Carroll 08 Feb 17 - 11:24 AM
Jim Carroll 08 Feb 17 - 11:28 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Feb 17 - 01:43 PM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Feb 17 - 01:47 PM
Dave the Gnome 08 Feb 17 - 03:09 PM
Jim Carroll 08 Feb 17 - 03:27 PM
Jim Carroll 08 Feb 17 - 03:31 PM
bobad 08 Feb 17 - 03:40 PM
Greg F. 08 Feb 17 - 03:42 PM
Jim Carroll 08 Feb 17 - 03:44 PM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Feb 17 - 03:59 PM
Raggytash 08 Feb 17 - 04:11 PM
Raggytash 08 Feb 17 - 04:16 PM
Dave the Gnome 08 Feb 17 - 04:51 PM
Dave the Gnome 08 Feb 17 - 04:54 PM
Teribus 08 Feb 17 - 05:55 PM
Raggytash 08 Feb 17 - 06:24 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Feb 17 - 06:30 PM
bobad 08 Feb 17 - 06:39 PM
Teribus 08 Feb 17 - 07:46 PM
Jim Carroll 08 Feb 17 - 07:56 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Feb 17 - 08:56 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Feb 17 - 09:23 PM
Dave the Gnome 09 Feb 17 - 02:40 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Feb 17 - 03:01 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Feb 17 - 03:30 AM
Teribus 09 Feb 17 - 03:33 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Feb 17 - 03:44 AM
akenaton 09 Feb 17 - 03:53 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Feb 17 - 04:20 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Feb 17 - 04:25 AM
akenaton 09 Feb 17 - 04:31 AM
akenaton 09 Feb 17 - 04:36 AM
Raggytash 09 Feb 17 - 04:46 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Feb 17 - 05:15 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Feb 17 - 05:17 AM
Teribus 09 Feb 17 - 06:12 AM
Raggytash 09 Feb 17 - 06:17 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Feb 17 - 07:01 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Feb 17 - 07:11 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Feb 17 - 07:37 AM
Teribus 09 Feb 17 - 07:39 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Feb 17 - 07:42 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Feb 17 - 08:27 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Feb 17 - 08:29 AM
Raggytash 09 Feb 17 - 08:32 AM
akenaton 09 Feb 17 - 08:40 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Feb 17 - 08:47 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Feb 17 - 09:10 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Feb 17 - 09:22 AM
Teribus 09 Feb 17 - 03:06 PM
Jim Carroll 09 Feb 17 - 03:15 PM
Jim Carroll 09 Feb 17 - 03:34 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Feb 17 - 03:43 PM
bobad 09 Feb 17 - 03:43 PM
Raggytash 09 Feb 17 - 04:40 PM
Teribus 09 Feb 17 - 05:31 PM
Dave the Gnome 09 Feb 17 - 05:36 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Feb 17 - 07:21 PM
Teribus 10 Feb 17 - 04:01 AM
Jim Carroll 10 Feb 17 - 04:11 AM
Jim Carroll 10 Feb 17 - 04:18 AM
Teribus 10 Feb 17 - 05:14 AM
Jim Carroll 10 Feb 17 - 05:22 AM
Jim Carroll 10 Feb 17 - 05:24 AM
Raggytash 10 Feb 17 - 05:29 AM
Dave the Gnome 10 Feb 17 - 05:42 AM
Steve Shaw 10 Feb 17 - 05:53 AM
Steve Shaw 10 Feb 17 - 05:57 AM
Raggytash 10 Feb 17 - 06:02 AM
Dave the Gnome 10 Feb 17 - 06:05 AM
Teribus 10 Feb 17 - 06:06 AM
Jim Carroll 10 Feb 17 - 06:35 AM
Dave the Gnome 10 Feb 17 - 06:41 AM
Steve Shaw 10 Feb 17 - 07:01 AM
Raggytash 10 Feb 17 - 07:14 AM
Dave the Gnome 10 Feb 17 - 08:30 AM
Iains 10 Feb 17 - 08:37 AM
Raggytash 10 Feb 17 - 08:46 AM
Jim Carroll 10 Feb 17 - 08:51 AM
Dave the Gnome 10 Feb 17 - 08:56 AM
Jim Carroll 10 Feb 17 - 09:05 AM
Raggytash 10 Feb 17 - 09:10 AM
Dave the Gnome 10 Feb 17 - 09:21 AM
Jim Carroll 10 Feb 17 - 09:57 AM
Dave the Gnome 10 Feb 17 - 09:59 AM
Jim Carroll 10 Feb 17 - 10:04 AM
Raggytash 10 Feb 17 - 10:05 AM
Jim Carroll 10 Feb 17 - 10:07 AM
Dave the Gnome 10 Feb 17 - 10:09 AM
Raggytash 10 Feb 17 - 10:11 AM
Dave the Gnome 10 Feb 17 - 10:19 AM
Jim Carroll 10 Feb 17 - 11:08 AM
Steve Shaw 10 Feb 17 - 11:29 AM
Steve Shaw 10 Feb 17 - 08:38 PM
Teribus 11 Feb 17 - 06:28 AM
Jim Carroll 11 Feb 17 - 06:43 AM
Raggytash 11 Feb 17 - 06:53 AM
The Sandman 11 Feb 17 - 07:18 AM
Jim Carroll 11 Feb 17 - 07:24 AM
akenaton 11 Feb 17 - 07:53 AM
Dave the Gnome 11 Feb 17 - 01:03 PM
Dave the Gnome 11 Feb 17 - 01:35 PM
Steve Shaw 11 Feb 17 - 02:15 PM
Dave the Gnome 12 Feb 17 - 04:30 AM
Steve Shaw 12 Feb 17 - 06:43 AM
Raggytash 12 Feb 17 - 06:57 AM
Steve Shaw 12 Feb 17 - 07:25 AM
Steve Shaw 12 Feb 17 - 07:39 AM
Dave the Gnome 12 Feb 17 - 08:39 AM
Steve Shaw 12 Feb 17 - 12:57 PM
Steve Shaw 12 Feb 17 - 01:58 PM
Raggytash 12 Feb 17 - 02:42 PM
Steve Shaw 13 Feb 17 - 06:24 PM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Feb 17 - 04:35 AM
Jim Carroll 15 Feb 17 - 04:57 AM
Steve Shaw 15 Feb 17 - 05:33 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Feb 17 - 06:39 AM
Raggytash 15 Feb 17 - 06:51 AM
Jim Carroll 15 Feb 17 - 06:57 AM
Steve Shaw 15 Feb 17 - 07:06 AM
Raggytash 15 Feb 17 - 07:06 AM
Steve Shaw 15 Feb 17 - 07:11 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Feb 17 - 09:01 AM
Steve Shaw 15 Feb 17 - 09:09 AM
Raggytash 15 Feb 17 - 09:14 AM
Steve Shaw 15 Feb 17 - 09:20 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Feb 17 - 09:22 AM
Jim Carroll 15 Feb 17 - 09:24 AM
Raggytash 15 Feb 17 - 09:26 AM
bobad 15 Feb 17 - 09:40 AM
Raggytash 15 Feb 17 - 09:49 AM
Jim Carroll 15 Feb 17 - 09:59 AM
Greg F. 15 Feb 17 - 10:04 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Feb 17 - 10:27 AM
Steve Shaw 15 Feb 17 - 11:49 AM
Jim Carroll 15 Feb 17 - 11:59 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Feb 17 - 12:44 PM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Feb 17 - 12:53 PM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Feb 17 - 01:04 PM
Dave the Gnome 15 Feb 17 - 01:07 PM
Steve Shaw 15 Feb 17 - 01:19 PM
Dave the Gnome 15 Feb 17 - 01:30 PM
Dave the Gnome 15 Feb 17 - 02:08 PM
Raggytash 15 Feb 17 - 04:01 PM
Steve Shaw 15 Feb 17 - 05:21 PM
Greg F. 15 Feb 17 - 05:45 PM
Steve Shaw 15 Feb 17 - 05:53 PM
Jim Carroll 15 Feb 17 - 07:48 PM
Steve Shaw 15 Feb 17 - 08:21 PM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Feb 17 - 04:12 AM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Feb 17 - 04:25 AM
Dave the Gnome 16 Feb 17 - 05:36 AM
Steve Shaw 16 Feb 17 - 05:45 AM
Raggytash 16 Feb 17 - 05:58 AM
Steve Shaw 16 Feb 17 - 09:08 AM
Dave the Gnome 16 Feb 17 - 09:16 AM
bobad 16 Feb 17 - 09:55 AM
Jim Carroll 16 Feb 17 - 10:01 AM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Feb 17 - 10:14 AM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Feb 17 - 10:19 AM
bobad 16 Feb 17 - 11:16 AM
Jim Carroll 16 Feb 17 - 11:48 AM
Steve Shaw 16 Feb 17 - 12:12 PM
Jim Carroll 16 Feb 17 - 12:48 PM
Dave the Gnome 16 Feb 17 - 01:08 PM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Feb 17 - 02:52 PM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Feb 17 - 03:03 PM
Dave the Gnome 16 Feb 17 - 03:08 PM
Dave the Gnome 16 Feb 17 - 03:13 PM
Raggytash 16 Feb 17 - 03:18 PM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Feb 17 - 03:19 PM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Feb 17 - 03:36 PM
Steve Shaw 16 Feb 17 - 03:40 PM
Raggytash 16 Feb 17 - 04:17 PM
Dave the Gnome 16 Feb 17 - 05:38 PM
Dave the Gnome 16 Feb 17 - 06:01 PM
Steve Shaw 16 Feb 17 - 06:07 PM
Dave the Gnome 16 Feb 17 - 06:11 PM
Steve Shaw 16 Feb 17 - 06:21 PM
Jim Carroll 16 Feb 17 - 07:28 PM
Steve Shaw 16 Feb 17 - 07:50 PM
Jim Carroll 17 Feb 17 - 04:34 AM
Dave the Gnome 17 Feb 17 - 04:35 AM
Raggytash 17 Feb 17 - 04:42 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Feb 17 - 06:22 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Feb 17 - 06:32 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Feb 17 - 06:36 AM
Raggytash 17 Feb 17 - 06:36 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Feb 17 - 06:41 AM
Raggytash 17 Feb 17 - 06:59 AM
Teribus 17 Feb 17 - 07:07 AM
Raggytash 17 Feb 17 - 07:10 AM
Jim Carroll 17 Feb 17 - 07:10 AM
Dave the Gnome 17 Feb 17 - 08:14 AM
bobad 17 Feb 17 - 08:16 AM
Dave the Gnome 17 Feb 17 - 08:44 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Feb 17 - 08:51 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Feb 17 - 08:54 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Feb 17 - 09:02 AM
Raggytash 17 Feb 17 - 09:04 AM
Jim Carroll 17 Feb 17 - 09:59 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Feb 17 - 11:06 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Feb 17 - 01:19 PM
Raggytash 17 Feb 17 - 01:22 PM
Steve Shaw 17 Feb 17 - 01:22 PM
Steve Shaw 17 Feb 17 - 01:55 PM
Raggytash 17 Feb 17 - 02:19 PM
Raggytash 17 Feb 17 - 02:28 PM
Teribus 17 Feb 17 - 02:59 PM
Raggytash 17 Feb 17 - 03:10 PM
Teribus 17 Feb 17 - 03:41 PM
Raggytash 17 Feb 17 - 04:06 PM
Raggytash 17 Feb 17 - 04:29 PM
Teribus 17 Feb 17 - 04:49 PM
Raggytash 17 Feb 17 - 05:46 PM
Steve Shaw 17 Feb 17 - 05:54 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Feb 17 - 03:53 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Feb 17 - 04:02 AM
Raggytash 18 Feb 17 - 04:13 AM
Teribus 18 Feb 17 - 04:16 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Feb 17 - 04:21 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Feb 17 - 04:30 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Feb 17 - 04:43 AM
Steve Shaw 18 Feb 17 - 04:56 AM
Raggytash 18 Feb 17 - 04:56 AM
Steve Shaw 18 Feb 17 - 04:59 AM
Teribus 18 Feb 17 - 12:36 PM
Steve Shaw 18 Feb 17 - 02:33 PM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Feb 17 - 03:19 PM
Steve Shaw 18 Feb 17 - 05:24 PM
Teribus 18 Feb 17 - 09:46 PM
Joe Offer 19 Feb 17 - 02:43 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Feb 17 - 03:17 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Feb 17 - 04:05 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Feb 17 - 04:14 AM
Teribus 19 Feb 17 - 08:27 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Feb 17 - 08:36 AM
Teribus 19 Feb 17 - 09:36 AM
Dave the Gnome 19 Feb 17 - 02:32 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Feb 17 - 03:04 PM
Jim Carroll 19 Feb 17 - 03:06 PM
akenaton 19 Feb 17 - 03:54 PM
akenaton 19 Feb 17 - 03:56 PM
Jim Carroll 19 Feb 17 - 07:45 PM
Big Al Whittle 19 Feb 17 - 09:12 PM
akenaton 20 Feb 17 - 03:41 AM
Dave the Gnome 20 Feb 17 - 03:42 AM
Teribus 20 Feb 17 - 04:03 AM
Jim Carroll 20 Feb 17 - 04:20 AM
Big Al Whittle 20 Feb 17 - 04:21 AM
Raggytash 20 Feb 17 - 04:30 AM
Big Al Whittle 20 Feb 17 - 05:37 AM
Raggytash 20 Feb 17 - 05:52 AM
Dave the Gnome 20 Feb 17 - 06:12 AM
Keith A of Hertford 20 Feb 17 - 07:19 AM
Raggytash 20 Feb 17 - 07:33 AM
Big Al Whittle 20 Feb 17 - 07:38 AM
Keith A of Hertford 20 Feb 17 - 07:41 AM
Raggytash 20 Feb 17 - 07:50 AM
Jim Carroll 20 Feb 17 - 08:03 AM
bobad 20 Feb 17 - 08:41 AM
Keith A of Hertford 20 Feb 17 - 09:17 AM
Raggytash 20 Feb 17 - 09:48 AM
Jim Carroll 20 Feb 17 - 10:52 AM
Greg F. 20 Feb 17 - 11:08 AM
Teribus 20 Feb 17 - 12:06 PM
Raggytash 20 Feb 17 - 12:23 PM
Keith A of Hertford 20 Feb 17 - 12:51 PM
Jim Carroll 20 Feb 17 - 01:10 PM
Teribus 20 Feb 17 - 02:18 PM
Raggytash 20 Feb 17 - 02:20 PM
Jim Carroll 20 Feb 17 - 02:48 PM
Teribus 20 Feb 17 - 02:48 PM
Jim Carroll 20 Feb 17 - 03:03 PM
Raggytash 20 Feb 17 - 03:14 PM
Teribus 20 Feb 17 - 03:18 PM
Jim Carroll 20 Feb 17 - 03:40 PM
Jim Carroll 20 Feb 17 - 03:42 PM
akenaton 20 Feb 17 - 03:45 PM
Steve Shaw 20 Feb 17 - 03:55 PM
akenaton 20 Feb 17 - 04:12 PM
Teribus 20 Feb 17 - 04:36 PM
Raggytash 20 Feb 17 - 05:28 PM
Dave the Gnome 20 Feb 17 - 06:27 PM
Jim Carroll 21 Feb 17 - 03:23 AM
Teribus 21 Feb 17 - 04:26 AM
Keith A of Hertford 21 Feb 17 - 04:33 AM
Keith A of Hertford 21 Feb 17 - 04:36 AM
Jim Carroll 21 Feb 17 - 04:58 AM
Keith A of Hertford 21 Feb 17 - 07:33 AM
Jim Carroll 21 Feb 17 - 07:47 AM
Keith A of Hertford 21 Feb 17 - 10:48 AM
Keith A of Hertford 21 Feb 17 - 10:53 AM
Keith A of Hertford 21 Feb 17 - 11:22 AM
Raggytash 21 Feb 17 - 11:25 AM
Jim Carroll 21 Feb 17 - 11:35 AM
Keith A of Hertford 21 Feb 17 - 11:35 AM
Jim Carroll 21 Feb 17 - 01:53 PM
Teribus 21 Feb 17 - 02:22 PM
Raggytash 21 Feb 17 - 02:40 PM
Teribus 21 Feb 17 - 03:11 PM
Dave the Gnome 21 Feb 17 - 03:25 PM
Raggytash 21 Feb 17 - 05:50 PM
Teribus 21 Feb 17 - 05:52 PM
Steve Shaw 21 Feb 17 - 06:27 PM
Big Al Whittle 21 Feb 17 - 06:52 PM
Steve Shaw 21 Feb 17 - 06:55 PM
Raggytash 21 Feb 17 - 07:15 PM
Steve Shaw 21 Feb 17 - 07:36 PM
Big Al Whittle 21 Feb 17 - 08:55 PM
Teribus 22 Feb 17 - 01:55 AM
Jim Carroll 22 Feb 17 - 03:50 AM
Steve Shaw 22 Feb 17 - 04:30 AM
Dave the Gnome 22 Feb 17 - 04:54 AM
Keith A of Hertford 22 Feb 17 - 04:57 AM
Teribus 22 Feb 17 - 05:08 AM
Jim Carroll 22 Feb 17 - 07:47 AM
Jim Carroll 22 Feb 17 - 07:53 AM
Jim Carroll 22 Feb 17 - 07:58 AM
Teribus 22 Feb 17 - 09:12 AM
Raggytash 22 Feb 17 - 09:37 AM
Jim Carroll 22 Feb 17 - 10:57 AM
Keith A of Hertford 22 Feb 17 - 11:51 AM
Jim Carroll 22 Feb 17 - 12:31 PM
Raggytash 22 Feb 17 - 01:49 PM
Dave the Gnome 22 Feb 17 - 04:09 PM
Teribus 22 Feb 17 - 05:22 PM
Raggytash 22 Feb 17 - 05:55 PM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Feb 17 - 05:15 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Feb 17 - 05:29 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Feb 17 - 05:32 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Feb 17 - 05:40 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Feb 17 - 05:45 AM
Raggytash 23 Feb 17 - 05:55 AM
Steve Shaw 23 Feb 17 - 05:58 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Feb 17 - 06:04 AM
Raggytash 23 Feb 17 - 06:07 AM
Jim Carroll 23 Feb 17 - 06:21 AM
Steve Shaw 23 Feb 17 - 06:42 AM
Jim Carroll 23 Feb 17 - 06:44 AM
Jim Carroll 23 Feb 17 - 07:03 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Feb 17 - 07:29 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Feb 17 - 07:32 AM
Raggytash 23 Feb 17 - 08:10 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Feb 17 - 08:41 AM
Raggytash 23 Feb 17 - 09:01 AM
Jim Carroll 23 Feb 17 - 09:02 AM
Raggytash 23 Feb 17 - 09:11 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Feb 17 - 12:14 PM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Feb 17 - 12:22 PM
Jim Carroll 23 Feb 17 - 12:45 PM
Jim Carroll 23 Feb 17 - 12:53 PM
Jim Carroll 23 Feb 17 - 01:08 PM
Dave the Gnome 23 Feb 17 - 01:42 PM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Feb 17 - 01:50 PM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Feb 17 - 01:57 PM
Jim Carroll 23 Feb 17 - 02:11 PM
Jim Carroll 23 Feb 17 - 03:09 PM
Raggytash 23 Feb 17 - 03:21 PM
Dave the Gnome 23 Feb 17 - 04:05 PM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Feb 17 - 03:57 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Feb 17 - 04:17 AM
Jim Carroll 24 Feb 17 - 04:38 AM
Teribus 24 Feb 17 - 04:51 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Feb 17 - 04:54 AM
Big Al Whittle 24 Feb 17 - 05:07 AM
Raggytash 24 Feb 17 - 05:29 AM
Steve Shaw 24 Feb 17 - 05:42 AM
Steve Shaw 24 Feb 17 - 05:46 AM
akenaton 24 Feb 17 - 06:03 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Feb 17 - 06:06 AM
Iains 24 Feb 17 - 06:39 AM
Raggytash 24 Feb 17 - 06:48 AM
Raggytash 24 Feb 17 - 06:52 AM
Raggytash 24 Feb 17 - 06:54 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Feb 17 - 06:54 AM
Jim Carroll 24 Feb 17 - 07:03 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Feb 17 - 07:26 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Feb 17 - 07:31 AM
Jim Carroll 24 Feb 17 - 07:47 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Feb 17 - 08:29 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Feb 17 - 08:38 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Feb 17 - 08:40 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Feb 17 - 08:44 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Feb 17 - 08:57 AM
Jim Carroll 24 Feb 17 - 09:02 AM
Teribus 24 Feb 17 - 09:03 AM
Raggytash 24 Feb 17 - 09:21 AM
bobad 24 Feb 17 - 09:24 AM
Teribus 24 Feb 17 - 09:33 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Feb 17 - 09:33 AM
Raggytash 24 Feb 17 - 09:46 AM
bobad 24 Feb 17 - 09:49 AM
Iains 24 Feb 17 - 09:51 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Feb 17 - 10:07 AM
Steve Shaw 24 Feb 17 - 10:08 AM
Jim Carroll 24 Feb 17 - 10:08 AM
Teribus 24 Feb 17 - 10:11 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Feb 17 - 10:15 AM
Raggytash 24 Feb 17 - 10:26 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Feb 17 - 10:42 AM
Steve Shaw 24 Feb 17 - 10:45 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Feb 17 - 10:48 AM
Teribus 24 Feb 17 - 11:11 AM
Jim Carroll 24 Feb 17 - 11:23 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Feb 17 - 11:52 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Feb 17 - 11:59 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Feb 17 - 12:12 PM
Jim Carroll 24 Feb 17 - 12:25 PM
Steve Shaw 24 Feb 17 - 01:26 PM
Teribus 24 Feb 17 - 02:29 PM
Teribus 24 Feb 17 - 02:33 PM
Steve Shaw 24 Feb 17 - 02:54 PM
Teribus 24 Feb 17 - 04:33 PM
Dave the Gnome 24 Feb 17 - 05:50 PM
Steve Shaw 24 Feb 17 - 05:52 PM
Jim Carroll 24 Feb 17 - 08:06 PM
Donuel 24 Feb 17 - 08:19 PM
Steve Shaw 24 Feb 17 - 08:36 PM
Teribus 25 Feb 17 - 02:28 AM
Teribus 25 Feb 17 - 02:57 AM
Jim Carroll 25 Feb 17 - 03:46 AM
akenaton 25 Feb 17 - 03:48 AM
Keith A of Hertford 25 Feb 17 - 04:03 AM
Keith A of Hertford 25 Feb 17 - 04:09 AM
Keith A of Hertford 25 Feb 17 - 04:17 AM
Keith A of Hertford 25 Feb 17 - 04:22 AM
Raggytash 25 Feb 17 - 04:33 AM
Jim Carroll 25 Feb 17 - 04:35 AM
Dave the Gnome 25 Feb 17 - 04:58 AM
Keith A of Hertford 25 Feb 17 - 05:29 AM
Dave the Gnome 25 Feb 17 - 05:37 AM
Raggytash 25 Feb 17 - 05:45 AM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 06:05 AM
Dave the Gnome 25 Feb 17 - 06:11 AM
Jim Carroll 25 Feb 17 - 07:05 AM
Teribus 25 Feb 17 - 07:19 AM
Jim Carroll 25 Feb 17 - 07:29 AM
Big Al Whittle 25 Feb 17 - 07:29 AM
Raggytash 25 Feb 17 - 07:37 AM
Jim Carroll 25 Feb 17 - 08:21 AM
Teribus 25 Feb 17 - 08:38 AM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 08:38 AM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 08:40 AM
Teribus 25 Feb 17 - 08:51 AM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 08:53 AM
Teribus 25 Feb 17 - 08:53 AM
Raggytash 25 Feb 17 - 08:55 AM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 09:01 AM
Jim Carroll 25 Feb 17 - 09:17 AM
Jim Carroll 25 Feb 17 - 09:38 AM
Teribus 25 Feb 17 - 10:36 AM
Dave the Gnome 25 Feb 17 - 10:41 AM
Keith A of Hertford 25 Feb 17 - 10:59 AM
Keith A of Hertford 25 Feb 17 - 11:03 AM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 11:05 AM
bobad 25 Feb 17 - 11:10 AM
Keith A of Hertford 25 Feb 17 - 11:10 AM
Teribus 25 Feb 17 - 11:24 AM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 11:29 AM
Teribus 25 Feb 17 - 11:35 AM
bobad 25 Feb 17 - 11:55 AM
Jim Carroll 25 Feb 17 - 12:14 PM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 12:26 PM
Teribus 25 Feb 17 - 12:33 PM
Teribus 25 Feb 17 - 12:41 PM
Raggytash 25 Feb 17 - 12:44 PM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 12:45 PM
Jim Carroll 25 Feb 17 - 01:41 PM
Big Al Whittle 25 Feb 17 - 02:00 PM
Big Al Whittle 25 Feb 17 - 02:35 PM
Dave the Gnome 25 Feb 17 - 02:39 PM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 02:49 PM
Iains 25 Feb 17 - 03:01 PM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 03:24 PM
bobad 25 Feb 17 - 03:40 PM
Dave the Gnome 25 Feb 17 - 03:47 PM
bobad 25 Feb 17 - 03:52 PM
Big Al Whittle 25 Feb 17 - 04:29 PM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 04:30 PM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 04:38 PM
akenaton 25 Feb 17 - 04:59 PM
Big Al Whittle 25 Feb 17 - 05:02 PM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 05:03 PM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 05:06 PM
bobad 25 Feb 17 - 05:39 PM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 05:49 PM
Dave the Gnome 25 Feb 17 - 06:03 PM
Steve Shaw 25 Feb 17 - 06:13 PM
bobad 25 Feb 17 - 06:23 PM
bobad 25 Feb 17 - 06:34 PM
Dave the Gnome 26 Feb 17 - 03:46 AM
Iains 26 Feb 17 - 03:47 AM
Jim Carroll 26 Feb 17 - 04:44 AM
Steve Shaw 26 Feb 17 - 05:45 AM
bobad 26 Feb 17 - 07:05 AM
Teribus 26 Feb 17 - 07:07 AM
Keith A of Hertford 26 Feb 17 - 07:13 AM
Steve Shaw 26 Feb 17 - 07:30 AM
Jim Carroll 26 Feb 17 - 07:32 AM
akenaton 26 Feb 17 - 07:33 AM
Raggytash 26 Feb 17 - 07:33 AM
Big Al Whittle 26 Feb 17 - 07:34 AM
Keith A of Hertford 26 Feb 17 - 07:34 AM
Keith A of Hertford 26 Feb 17 - 07:47 AM
bobad 26 Feb 17 - 08:07 AM
Raggytash 26 Feb 17 - 08:09 AM
Jim Carroll 26 Feb 17 - 08:42 AM
bobad 26 Feb 17 - 08:49 AM
Jim Carroll 26 Feb 17 - 09:01 AM
Keith A of Hertford 26 Feb 17 - 09:36 AM
Steve Shaw 26 Feb 17 - 10:11 AM
Jim Carroll 26 Feb 17 - 10:23 AM
Raggytash 26 Feb 17 - 10:42 AM
Teribus 26 Feb 17 - 11:05 AM
Teribus 26 Feb 17 - 11:25 AM
Raggytash 26 Feb 17 - 11:55 AM
Keith A of Hertford 26 Feb 17 - 12:03 PM
Teribus 26 Feb 17 - 12:05 PM
Jim Carroll 26 Feb 17 - 12:20 PM
Jim Carroll 26 Feb 17 - 12:30 PM
Raggytash 26 Feb 17 - 12:53 PM
akenaton 26 Feb 17 - 01:03 PM
Big Al Whittle 26 Feb 17 - 01:12 PM
Steve Shaw 26 Feb 17 - 01:13 PM
Dave the Gnome 26 Feb 17 - 01:16 PM
Jim Carroll 26 Feb 17 - 01:47 PM
Teribus 26 Feb 17 - 02:10 PM
Raggytash 26 Feb 17 - 02:48 PM
Jim Carroll 26 Feb 17 - 02:57 PM
Iains 26 Feb 17 - 03:19 PM
Iains 26 Feb 17 - 03:24 PM
Big Al Whittle 26 Feb 17 - 04:29 PM
Dave the Gnome 26 Feb 17 - 05:09 PM
Steve Shaw 26 Feb 17 - 05:29 PM
bobad 26 Feb 17 - 05:57 PM
Big Al Whittle 26 Feb 17 - 06:35 PM
Jim Carroll 26 Feb 17 - 06:56 PM
Steve Shaw 26 Feb 17 - 07:51 PM
Steve Shaw 26 Feb 17 - 08:39 PM
bobad 26 Feb 17 - 09:40 PM
Teribus 27 Feb 17 - 01:38 AM
Teribus 27 Feb 17 - 01:42 AM
Dave the Gnome 27 Feb 17 - 03:05 AM
Jim Carroll 27 Feb 17 - 03:33 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Feb 17 - 03:42 AM
Dave the Gnome 27 Feb 17 - 03:54 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Feb 17 - 03:56 AM
Teribus 27 Feb 17 - 03:59 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Feb 17 - 04:02 AM
Raggytash 27 Feb 17 - 04:08 AM
Jim Carroll 27 Feb 17 - 04:09 AM
Raggytash 27 Feb 17 - 04:11 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Feb 17 - 04:14 AM
Jim Carroll 27 Feb 17 - 04:29 AM
Dave the Gnome 27 Feb 17 - 04:30 AM
Raggytash 27 Feb 17 - 05:02 AM
Jim Carroll 27 Feb 17 - 05:37 AM
Teribus 27 Feb 17 - 06:19 AM
Steve Shaw 27 Feb 17 - 06:20 AM
Steve Shaw 27 Feb 17 - 06:23 AM
Iains 27 Feb 17 - 06:32 AM
Teribus 27 Feb 17 - 06:46 AM
Steve Shaw 27 Feb 17 - 07:11 AM
Jim Carroll 27 Feb 17 - 07:17 AM
Iains 27 Feb 17 - 07:31 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Feb 17 - 07:41 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Feb 17 - 07:48 AM
Jim Carroll 27 Feb 17 - 07:58 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Feb 17 - 08:01 AM
Raggytash 27 Feb 17 - 08:02 AM
bobad 27 Feb 17 - 08:21 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Feb 17 - 08:26 AM
Raggytash 27 Feb 17 - 08:32 AM
Dave the Gnome 27 Feb 17 - 08:44 AM
Jim Carroll 27 Feb 17 - 08:59 AM
bobad 27 Feb 17 - 09:07 AM
Teribus 27 Feb 17 - 09:24 AM
Raggytash 27 Feb 17 - 09:53 AM
Teribus 27 Feb 17 - 10:32 AM
Raggytash 27 Feb 17 - 10:37 AM
Dave the Gnome 27 Feb 17 - 11:01 AM
Jim Carroll 27 Feb 17 - 11:20 AM
Steve Shaw 27 Feb 17 - 12:11 PM
bobad 27 Feb 17 - 12:28 PM
Steve Shaw 27 Feb 17 - 12:51 PM
Jim Carroll 27 Feb 17 - 01:01 PM
Greg F. 27 Feb 17 - 01:15 PM
Teribus 27 Feb 17 - 01:18 PM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Feb 17 - 01:36 PM
Raggytash 27 Feb 17 - 01:44 PM
Teribus 27 Feb 17 - 01:53 PM
bobad 27 Feb 17 - 01:59 PM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Feb 17 - 02:11 PM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Feb 17 - 02:16 PM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Feb 17 - 02:27 PM
Dave the Gnome 27 Feb 17 - 02:40 PM
Steve Shaw 27 Feb 17 - 05:19 PM
Teribus 27 Feb 17 - 07:07 PM
Steve Shaw 27 Feb 17 - 09:17 PM
Iains 28 Feb 17 - 03:14 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Feb 17 - 04:17 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 05:00 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 05:08 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 05:14 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 05:15 AM
Teribus 28 Feb 17 - 05:20 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 05:22 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Feb 17 - 05:32 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 05:35 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 05:37 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Feb 17 - 05:57 AM
Teribus 28 Feb 17 - 06:29 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 06:36 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 06:41 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 06:43 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 06:48 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 06:50 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 06:51 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 06:55 AM
Big Al Whittle 28 Feb 17 - 06:57 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 07:01 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Feb 17 - 07:06 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 07:12 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 07:20 AM
Teribus 28 Feb 17 - 07:24 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 07:44 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 07:44 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Feb 17 - 07:48 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 07:49 AM
bobad 28 Feb 17 - 07:58 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 08:08 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 08:19 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 08:19 AM
Teribus 28 Feb 17 - 08:23 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Feb 17 - 08:27 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 08:31 AM
Teribus 28 Feb 17 - 08:34 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 09:07 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 09:12 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 09:15 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Feb 17 - 09:30 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 09:34 AM
Iains 28 Feb 17 - 09:42 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 09:46 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 10:29 AM
Raggytash 28 Feb 17 - 10:39 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 10:39 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 10:46 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 10:47 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 10:50 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 10:56 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 10:58 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 11:03 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 11:09 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Feb 17 - 11:25 AM
Iains 28 Feb 17 - 11:44 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Feb 17 - 12:35 PM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 12:39 PM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 12:44 PM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 12:49 PM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 12:51 PM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 12:52 PM
Iains 28 Feb 17 - 12:52 PM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 12:53 PM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 17 - 12:57 PM
Teribus 28 Feb 17 - 01:13 PM
Jim Carroll 28 Feb 17 - 01:25 PM
Iains 28 Feb 17 - 01:33 PM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 01:39 PM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 01:43 PM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 02:06 PM
Teribus 28 Feb 17 - 02:19 PM
Iains 28 Feb 17 - 03:00 PM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 04:24 PM
Dave the Gnome 28 Feb 17 - 05:11 PM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 05:17 PM
Steve Shaw 28 Feb 17 - 05:21 PM
Teribus 01 Mar 17 - 01:44 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Mar 17 - 03:24 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Mar 17 - 03:25 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Mar 17 - 04:31 AM
Keith A of Hertford 01 Mar 17 - 04:33 AM
Keith A of Hertford 01 Mar 17 - 04:34 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Mar 17 - 04:41 AM
Teribus 01 Mar 17 - 05:13 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Mar 17 - 05:21 AM
Big Al Whittle 01 Mar 17 - 06:32 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Mar 17 - 06:36 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Mar 17 - 06:40 AM
Steve Shaw 01 Mar 17 - 06:53 AM
Teribus 01 Mar 17 - 07:31 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Mar 17 - 07:42 AM
bobad 01 Mar 17 - 08:17 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Mar 17 - 09:45 AM
Big Al Whittle 01 Mar 17 - 10:36 AM
Iains 01 Mar 17 - 04:38 PM
Raggytash 01 Mar 17 - 04:51 PM
bobad 01 Mar 17 - 05:09 PM
Jim Carroll 01 Mar 17 - 05:58 PM
Steve Shaw 01 Mar 17 - 08:24 PM
Teribus 02 Mar 17 - 02:09 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 04:26 AM
Steve Shaw 02 Mar 17 - 04:44 AM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Mar 17 - 06:12 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 06:35 AM
Iains 02 Mar 17 - 06:41 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 06:49 AM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Mar 17 - 06:53 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 07:01 AM
Teribus 02 Mar 17 - 07:03 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 07:07 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 07:09 AM
Raggytash 02 Mar 17 - 07:12 AM
Steve Shaw 02 Mar 17 - 07:29 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 07:29 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 07:32 AM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Mar 17 - 07:42 AM
bobad 02 Mar 17 - 08:08 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 08:18 AM
Raggytash 02 Mar 17 - 08:31 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 08:51 AM
Raggytash 02 Mar 17 - 09:26 AM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Mar 17 - 10:16 AM
Raggytash 02 Mar 17 - 10:28 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 10:32 AM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Mar 17 - 10:50 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 11:18 AM
Raggytash 02 Mar 17 - 11:19 AM
Jim Carroll 02 Mar 17 - 11:59 AM
Steve Shaw 02 Mar 17 - 12:09 PM
Jim Carroll 02 Mar 17 - 12:18 PM
Steve Shaw 02 Mar 17 - 12:52 PM
Teribus 02 Mar 17 - 01:22 PM
Teribus 02 Mar 17 - 01:54 PM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Mar 17 - 02:07 PM
Iains 02 Mar 17 - 02:17 PM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 02:20 PM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Mar 17 - 02:27 PM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Mar 17 - 02:29 PM
Jim Carroll 02 Mar 17 - 02:29 PM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 02:29 PM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 02:30 PM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Mar 17 - 02:32 PM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 03:04 PM
Raggytash 02 Mar 17 - 03:17 PM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Mar 17 - 03:37 PM
Raggytash 02 Mar 17 - 03:52 PM
Teribus 02 Mar 17 - 04:13 PM
Raggytash 02 Mar 17 - 04:40 PM
Steve Shaw 02 Mar 17 - 04:41 PM
Dave the Gnome 02 Mar 17 - 05:48 PM
Teribus 02 Mar 17 - 07:44 PM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Mar 17 - 04:01 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Mar 17 - 04:11 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Mar 17 - 04:44 AM
Raggytash 03 Mar 17 - 05:19 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Mar 17 - 05:27 AM
Teribus 03 Mar 17 - 05:43 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Mar 17 - 06:23 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Mar 17 - 06:38 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Mar 17 - 06:47 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Mar 17 - 06:52 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Mar 17 - 07:03 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Mar 17 - 07:30 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Mar 17 - 08:01 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Mar 17 - 08:53 AM
Raggytash 03 Mar 17 - 08:58 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Mar 17 - 09:15 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Mar 17 - 10:32 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Mar 17 - 10:56 AM
Raggytash 03 Mar 17 - 10:58 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Mar 17 - 11:06 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Mar 17 - 11:23 AM
Raggytash 03 Mar 17 - 11:34 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Mar 17 - 11:36 AM
Raggytash 03 Mar 17 - 11:54 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Mar 17 - 12:40 PM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Mar 17 - 02:03 PM
Dave the Gnome 03 Mar 17 - 02:08 PM
Steve Shaw 03 Mar 17 - 02:34 PM
Jim Carroll 03 Mar 17 - 03:04 PM
Teribus 03 Mar 17 - 03:52 PM
Steve Shaw 03 Mar 17 - 04:00 PM
Teribus 03 Mar 17 - 04:48 PM
Steve Shaw 03 Mar 17 - 05:04 PM
Dave the Gnome 03 Mar 17 - 07:25 PM
bobad 03 Mar 17 - 07:31 PM
Steve Shaw 03 Mar 17 - 07:44 PM
bobad 03 Mar 17 - 08:03 PM
Steve Shaw 03 Mar 17 - 08:18 PM
Steve Shaw 03 Mar 17 - 08:23 PM
bobad 03 Mar 17 - 09:15 PM
Steve Shaw 03 Mar 17 - 09:26 PM
bobad 03 Mar 17 - 09:39 PM
Teribus 04 Mar 17 - 01:06 AM
akenaton 04 Mar 17 - 03:30 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Mar 17 - 03:53 AM
Dave the Gnome 04 Mar 17 - 04:03 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Mar 17 - 04:22 AM
Dave the Gnome 04 Mar 17 - 05:08 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Mar 17 - 05:30 AM
Backwoodsman 04 Mar 17 - 09:45 AM
Dave the Gnome 04 Mar 17 - 01:11 PM
Jim Carroll 04 Mar 17 - 02:48 PM
Backwoodsman 04 Mar 17 - 04:13 PM
Steve Shaw 04 Mar 17 - 04:21 PM
Steve Shaw 04 Mar 17 - 06:13 PM
Raggytash 04 Mar 17 - 07:02 PM
Steve Shaw 04 Mar 17 - 07:49 PM
Jim Carroll 05 Mar 17 - 04:18 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Mar 17 - 01:28 PM
Dave the Gnome 05 Mar 17 - 01:37 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Mar 17 - 03:42 PM
Dave the Gnome 05 Mar 17 - 04:13 PM
Raggytash 05 Mar 17 - 04:22 PM
Dave the Gnome 05 Mar 17 - 04:27 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Mar 17 - 04:52 PM
Raggytash 06 Mar 17 - 06:01 PM
Teribus 07 Mar 17 - 02:27 AM
Raggytash 07 Mar 17 - 03:38 AM
Teribus 07 Mar 17 - 04:49 AM
Raggytash 07 Mar 17 - 04:57 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Mar 17 - 05:12 AM
Teribus 07 Mar 17 - 05:13 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Mar 17 - 05:31 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Mar 17 - 05:32 AM
Raggytash 07 Mar 17 - 05:42 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Mar 17 - 06:16 AM
Teribus 07 Mar 17 - 07:24 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Mar 17 - 07:33 AM
Raggytash 07 Mar 17 - 07:58 AM
Raggytash 07 Mar 17 - 08:14 AM
Teribus 07 Mar 17 - 09:54 AM
Raggytash 07 Mar 17 - 10:01 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Mar 17 - 10:06 AM
Raggytash 07 Mar 17 - 10:11 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Mar 17 - 10:17 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Mar 17 - 01:42 PM
Teribus 07 Mar 17 - 05:25 PM
Steve Shaw 07 Mar 17 - 05:44 PM
Steve Shaw 07 Mar 17 - 07:12 PM
Teribus 08 Mar 17 - 02:14 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Mar 17 - 02:43 AM
Jim Carroll 08 Mar 17 - 03:16 AM
Steve Shaw 08 Mar 17 - 03:24 AM
akenaton 08 Mar 17 - 03:31 AM
akenaton 08 Mar 17 - 03:40 AM
Jim Carroll 08 Mar 17 - 03:42 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Mar 17 - 03:52 AM
Teribus 08 Mar 17 - 04:21 AM
Jim Carroll 08 Mar 17 - 05:03 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Mar 17 - 05:10 AM
Teribus 08 Mar 17 - 05:19 AM
Raggytash 08 Mar 17 - 06:09 AM
akenaton 08 Mar 17 - 06:11 AM
akenaton 08 Mar 17 - 06:13 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Mar 17 - 06:22 AM
bobad 08 Mar 17 - 06:41 AM
Raggytash 08 Mar 17 - 07:09 AM
Steve Shaw 08 Mar 17 - 07:17 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Mar 17 - 07:31 AM
Steve Shaw 08 Mar 17 - 07:42 AM
Raggytash 08 Mar 17 - 08:15 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Mar 17 - 08:19 AM
bobad 08 Mar 17 - 08:23 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Mar 17 - 08:40 AM
Raggytash 08 Mar 17 - 08:59 AM
akenaton 08 Mar 17 - 09:25 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Mar 17 - 09:45 AM
Teribus 08 Mar 17 - 09:49 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Mar 17 - 09:59 AM
Raggytash 08 Mar 17 - 10:00 AM
Raggytash 08 Mar 17 - 10:03 AM
Teribus 08 Mar 17 - 10:10 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Mar 17 - 10:10 AM
Raggytash 08 Mar 17 - 11:30 AM
Teribus 08 Mar 17 - 11:50 AM
Raggytash 08 Mar 17 - 12:21 PM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Mar 17 - 01:08 PM
Dave the Gnome 08 Mar 17 - 01:09 PM
Jim Carroll 08 Mar 17 - 01:18 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Mar 17 - 02:51 PM
Dave the Gnome 08 Mar 17 - 03:00 PM
Raggytash 08 Mar 17 - 03:22 PM
Dave the Gnome 08 Mar 17 - 03:31 PM
Raggytash 08 Mar 17 - 03:50 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Mar 17 - 05:11 PM
Dave the Gnome 09 Mar 17 - 03:24 AM
Raggytash 09 Mar 17 - 03:42 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Mar 17 - 04:09 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Mar 17 - 04:17 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Mar 17 - 04:34 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Mar 17 - 04:39 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Mar 17 - 04:43 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Mar 17 - 04:49 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Mar 17 - 05:24 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Mar 17 - 05:27 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Mar 17 - 05:45 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Mar 17 - 06:07 AM
Raggytash 09 Mar 17 - 06:15 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Mar 17 - 06:15 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Mar 17 - 06:48 AM
Raggytash 09 Mar 17 - 06:54 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Mar 17 - 06:55 AM
Raggytash 09 Mar 17 - 06:58 AM
bobad 09 Mar 17 - 07:02 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Mar 17 - 07:03 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Mar 17 - 07:05 AM
Raggytash 09 Mar 17 - 07:28 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Mar 17 - 07:35 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Mar 17 - 07:38 AM
bobad 09 Mar 17 - 07:43 AM
Raggytash 09 Mar 17 - 07:58 AM
bobad 09 Mar 17 - 08:14 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Mar 17 - 08:17 AM
Raggytash 09 Mar 17 - 08:20 AM
Teribus 09 Mar 17 - 08:25 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Mar 17 - 08:25 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Mar 17 - 08:28 AM
Raggytash 09 Mar 17 - 08:36 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Mar 17 - 08:51 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Mar 17 - 09:00 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Mar 17 - 09:11 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Mar 17 - 09:18 AM
Teribus 09 Mar 17 - 10:21 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Mar 17 - 10:24 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Mar 17 - 10:59 AM
Raggytash 09 Mar 17 - 11:01 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Mar 17 - 11:21 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Mar 17 - 11:43 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Mar 17 - 12:37 PM
Dave the Gnome 09 Mar 17 - 01:25 PM
Jim Carroll 09 Mar 17 - 03:00 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Mar 17 - 03:31 PM
Keith A of Hertford 10 Mar 17 - 05:13 AM
Dave the Gnome 10 Mar 17 - 05:50 AM
Jim Carroll 10 Mar 17 - 05:55 AM
Steve Shaw 10 Mar 17 - 06:00 AM
Keith A of Hertford 10 Mar 17 - 07:32 AM
Keith A of Hertford 10 Mar 17 - 07:43 AM
Raggytash 10 Mar 17 - 07:44 AM
Keith A of Hertford 10 Mar 17 - 08:16 AM
Jim Carroll 10 Mar 17 - 08:39 AM
Dave the Gnome 10 Mar 17 - 09:43 AM
Steve Shaw 10 Mar 17 - 09:53 AM
Keith A of Hertford 11 Mar 17 - 04:01 AM
Keith A of Hertford 11 Mar 17 - 04:08 AM
Dave the Gnome 11 Mar 17 - 04:18 AM
Steve Shaw 11 Mar 17 - 05:49 AM
Dave the Gnome 11 Mar 17 - 06:27 AM
Jim Carroll 11 Mar 17 - 06:34 AM
Keith A of Hertford 11 Mar 17 - 09:32 AM
Keith A of Hertford 11 Mar 17 - 09:38 AM
Keith A of Hertford 11 Mar 17 - 09:46 AM
Teribus 11 Mar 17 - 11:29 AM
Dave the Gnome 11 Mar 17 - 11:54 AM
bobad 11 Mar 17 - 11:56 AM
Dave the Gnome 11 Mar 17 - 12:19 PM
Dave the Gnome 11 Mar 17 - 12:24 PM
Steve Shaw 11 Mar 17 - 12:26 PM
Steve Shaw 11 Mar 17 - 12:31 PM
Dave the Gnome 11 Mar 17 - 12:36 PM
Keith A of Hertford 11 Mar 17 - 01:36 PM
akenaton 11 Mar 17 - 02:09 PM
Steve Shaw 11 Mar 17 - 03:15 PM
Steve Shaw 11 Mar 17 - 03:18 PM
akenaton 11 Mar 17 - 03:39 PM
Dave the Gnome 11 Mar 17 - 04:06 PM
akenaton 11 Mar 17 - 04:08 PM
Teribus 11 Mar 17 - 04:12 PM
Steve Shaw 11 Mar 17 - 04:36 PM
akenaton 11 Mar 17 - 04:42 PM
Steve Shaw 11 Mar 17 - 04:58 PM
Steve Shaw 11 Mar 17 - 05:01 PM
akenaton 11 Mar 17 - 05:13 PM
Steve Shaw 11 Mar 17 - 05:32 PM
Dave the Gnome 12 Mar 17 - 04:25 AM
Steve Shaw 12 Mar 17 - 04:49 AM
Dave the Gnome 12 Mar 17 - 05:12 AM
Steve Shaw 12 Mar 17 - 07:18 AM
bobad 12 Mar 17 - 08:31 AM
Raggytash 12 Mar 17 - 09:03 AM
Steve Shaw 12 Mar 17 - 11:57 AM
David Carter (UK) 12 Mar 17 - 12:20 PM
bobad 12 Mar 17 - 02:48 PM
Raggytash 12 Mar 17 - 03:36 PM
Steve Shaw 12 Mar 17 - 03:51 PM
David Carter (UK) 12 Mar 17 - 04:16 PM
bobad 12 Mar 17 - 05:39 PM
Steve Shaw 12 Mar 17 - 06:57 PM
Teribus 12 Mar 17 - 07:23 PM
Teribus 12 Mar 17 - 07:27 PM
Steve Shaw 12 Mar 17 - 07:47 PM
Greg F. 12 Mar 17 - 07:55 PM
Steve Shaw 12 Mar 17 - 08:20 PM
Teribus 12 Mar 17 - 08:51 PM
Steve Shaw 12 Mar 17 - 09:08 PM
Teribus 13 Mar 17 - 02:57 AM
Teribus 13 Mar 17 - 04:03 AM
Dave the Gnome 13 Mar 17 - 04:44 AM
David Carter (UK) 13 Mar 17 - 04:51 AM
Raggytash 13 Mar 17 - 05:28 AM
Steve Shaw 13 Mar 17 - 06:19 AM
Teribus 13 Mar 17 - 06:33 AM
Teribus 13 Mar 17 - 06:34 AM
Steve Shaw 13 Mar 17 - 06:41 AM
Dave the Gnome 13 Mar 17 - 06:48 AM
Raggytash 13 Mar 17 - 06:51 AM
Teribus 13 Mar 17 - 06:59 AM
David Carter (UK) 13 Mar 17 - 07:03 AM
Dave the Gnome 13 Mar 17 - 07:18 AM
Dave the Gnome 13 Mar 17 - 07:22 AM
Teribus 13 Mar 17 - 07:38 AM
bobad 13 Mar 17 - 07:55 AM
Raggytash 13 Mar 17 - 08:29 AM
akenaton 13 Mar 17 - 09:16 AM
Raggytash 13 Mar 17 - 09:25 AM
Jim Carroll 13 Mar 17 - 09:29 AM
bobad 13 Mar 17 - 10:01 AM
Raggytash 13 Mar 17 - 10:19 AM
Dave the Gnome 13 Mar 17 - 10:27 AM
Keith A of Hertford 13 Mar 17 - 10:48 AM
Raggytash 13 Mar 17 - 10:50 AM
bobad 13 Mar 17 - 10:05 AM
Jim Carroll 13 Mar 17 - 12:12 PM
Keith A of Hertford 13 Mar 17 - 12:27 PM
Keith A of Hertford 13 Mar 17 - 12:40 PM
Jim Carroll 13 Mar 17 - 01:47 PM
Jim Carroll 13 Mar 17 - 01:47 PM
Keith A of Hertford 13 Mar 17 - 01:57 PM
Steve Shaw 13 Mar 17 - 02:04 PM
Iains 13 Mar 17 - 03:44 PM
bobad 13 Mar 17 - 03:57 PM
Dave the Gnome 13 Mar 17 - 04:31 PM
bobad 13 Mar 17 - 04:38 PM
Iains 13 Mar 17 - 05:05 PM
Steve Shaw 13 Mar 17 - 05:06 PM
Teribus 13 Mar 17 - 06:46 PM
Steve Shaw 13 Mar 17 - 07:10 PM
Teribus 14 Mar 17 - 02:30 AM
Dave the Gnome 14 Mar 17 - 02:46 AM
akenaton 14 Mar 17 - 03:07 AM
akenaton 14 Mar 17 - 03:10 AM
Dave the Gnome 14 Mar 17 - 03:11 AM
Keith A of Hertford 14 Mar 17 - 04:17 AM
Teribus 14 Mar 17 - 04:22 AM
Jim Carroll 14 Mar 17 - 04:38 AM
Iains 14 Mar 17 - 04:56 AM
Steve Shaw 14 Mar 17 - 05:17 AM
Dave the Gnome 14 Mar 17 - 05:26 AM
Jim Carroll 14 Mar 17 - 05:28 AM
Keith A of Hertford 14 Mar 17 - 07:19 AM
bobad 14 Mar 17 - 07:55 AM
Jim Carroll 14 Mar 17 - 08:00 AM
Dave the Gnome 14 Mar 17 - 08:06 AM
Steve Shaw 14 Mar 17 - 08:21 AM
Raggytash 14 Mar 17 - 09:24 AM
Steve Shaw 14 Mar 17 - 10:00 AM
Teribus 14 Mar 17 - 10:42 AM
Keith A of Hertford 14 Mar 17 - 10:49 AM
Greg F. 14 Mar 17 - 10:53 AM
Dave the Gnome 14 Mar 17 - 10:55 AM
Keith A of Hertford 14 Mar 17 - 11:03 AM
Raggytash 14 Mar 17 - 11:51 AM
Steve Shaw 14 Mar 17 - 12:17 PM
Steve Shaw 14 Mar 17 - 12:22 PM
bobad 14 Mar 17 - 12:33 PM
Dave the Gnome 14 Mar 17 - 12:52 PM
Steve Shaw 14 Mar 17 - 01:11 PM
Dave the Gnome 14 Mar 17 - 01:27 PM
Greg F. 14 Mar 17 - 02:32 PM
Jim Carroll 14 Mar 17 - 02:35 PM
akenaton 14 Mar 17 - 03:01 PM
Greg F. 14 Mar 17 - 03:13 PM
akenaton 14 Mar 17 - 03:29 PM
Greg F. 14 Mar 17 - 03:37 PM
bobad 14 Mar 17 - 03:39 PM
akenaton 14 Mar 17 - 03:45 PM
akenaton 14 Mar 17 - 03:47 PM
akenaton 14 Mar 17 - 03:52 PM
Greg F. 14 Mar 17 - 04:18 PM
Dave the Gnome 14 Mar 17 - 04:28 PM
Greg F. 14 Mar 17 - 04:37 PM
Steve Shaw 14 Mar 17 - 05:08 PM
Greg F. 14 Mar 17 - 05:12 PM
Teribus 14 Mar 17 - 05:24 PM
bobad 14 Mar 17 - 05:45 PM
Steve Shaw 14 Mar 17 - 06:06 PM
Steve Shaw 14 Mar 17 - 06:09 PM
Teribus 15 Mar 17 - 03:09 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 03:50 AM
Teribus 15 Mar 17 - 04:23 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 05:10 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Mar 17 - 05:17 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Mar 17 - 05:26 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Mar 17 - 05:30 AM
Jim Carroll 15 Mar 17 - 06:03 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 06:05 AM
Jim Carroll 15 Mar 17 - 06:05 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 07:14 AM
Steve Shaw 15 Mar 17 - 07:23 AM
Steve Shaw 15 Mar 17 - 07:45 AM
Jim Carroll 15 Mar 17 - 07:45 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 07:47 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Mar 17 - 08:39 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Mar 17 - 08:50 AM
bobad 15 Mar 17 - 09:13 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 09:21 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 09:33 AM
Teribus 15 Mar 17 - 09:40 AM
Teribus 15 Mar 17 - 09:49 AM
Steve Shaw 15 Mar 17 - 09:53 AM
Jim Carroll 15 Mar 17 - 09:55 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 10:04 AM
Jim Carroll 15 Mar 17 - 10:05 AM
Teribus 15 Mar 17 - 10:08 AM
Teribus 15 Mar 17 - 10:19 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 10:20 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 11:00 AM
Raggytash 15 Mar 17 - 11:12 AM
bobad 15 Mar 17 - 11:16 AM
akenaton 15 Mar 17 - 11:26 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 11:38 AM
akenaton 15 Mar 17 - 11:55 AM
Raggytash 15 Mar 17 - 12:26 PM
Jim Carroll 15 Mar 17 - 12:33 PM
Steve Shaw 15 Mar 17 - 12:48 PM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Mar 17 - 12:49 PM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Mar 17 - 12:54 PM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 01:16 PM
Jim Carroll 15 Mar 17 - 01:46 PM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Mar 17 - 02:42 PM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Mar 17 - 02:43 PM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 02:53 PM
Steve Shaw 15 Mar 17 - 03:30 PM
Jim Carroll 15 Mar 17 - 04:03 PM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 04:12 PM
Steve Shaw 15 Mar 17 - 06:00 PM
Dave the Gnome 15 Mar 17 - 06:04 PM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Mar 17 - 05:34 AM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Mar 17 - 05:58 AM
Dave the Gnome 16 Mar 17 - 06:11 AM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Mar 17 - 06:53 AM
Steve Shaw 16 Mar 17 - 07:08 AM
Dave the Gnome 16 Mar 17 - 07:35 AM
Steve Shaw 16 Mar 17 - 08:29 AM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Mar 17 - 09:18 AM
Dave the Gnome 16 Mar 17 - 09:20 AM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Mar 17 - 09:23 AM
Jim Carroll 16 Mar 17 - 09:36 AM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Mar 17 - 09:41 AM
Dave the Gnome 16 Mar 17 - 10:11 AM
Jim Carroll 16 Mar 17 - 10:21 AM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Mar 17 - 10:29 AM
Jim Carroll 16 Mar 17 - 10:52 AM
Dave the Gnome 16 Mar 17 - 11:07 AM
Jim Carroll 16 Mar 17 - 12:26 PM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Mar 17 - 01:23 PM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Mar 17 - 01:38 PM
bobad 16 Mar 17 - 01:59 PM
Jim Carroll 16 Mar 17 - 02:15 PM
Jim Carroll 16 Mar 17 - 02:34 PM
Jim Carroll 16 Mar 17 - 03:36 PM
bobad 16 Mar 17 - 03:40 PM
Dave the Gnome 16 Mar 17 - 03:41 PM
bobad 16 Mar 17 - 03:44 PM
Steve Shaw 16 Mar 17 - 04:47 PM
Dave the Gnome 16 Mar 17 - 05:01 PM
Steve Shaw 16 Mar 17 - 06:52 PM
bobad 16 Mar 17 - 06:57 PM
Steve Shaw 16 Mar 17 - 07:25 PM
akenaton 16 Mar 17 - 07:53 PM
Steve Shaw 16 Mar 17 - 08:01 PM
Jim Carroll 16 Mar 17 - 08:55 PM
Jim Carroll 16 Mar 17 - 09:18 PM
akenaton 17 Mar 17 - 03:53 AM
Jim Carroll 17 Mar 17 - 04:50 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Mar 17 - 05:06 AM
Dave the Gnome 17 Mar 17 - 05:08 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Mar 17 - 05:27 AM
Jim Carroll 17 Mar 17 - 06:12 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 06:16 AM
Dave the Gnome 17 Mar 17 - 06:48 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 06:54 AM
Jim Carroll 17 Mar 17 - 08:23 AM
Jim Carroll 17 Mar 17 - 08:31 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Mar 17 - 08:41 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 08:54 AM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 08:59 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Mar 17 - 09:01 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 09:17 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Mar 17 - 09:33 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Mar 17 - 09:50 AM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 09:50 AM
Dave the Gnome 17 Mar 17 - 09:51 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Mar 17 - 09:58 AM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 10:13 AM
Dave the Gnome 17 Mar 17 - 10:15 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 10:16 AM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 10:20 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 10:25 AM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 10:30 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 10:32 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 10:45 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 10:55 AM
Dave the Gnome 17 Mar 17 - 11:34 AM
Greg F. 17 Mar 17 - 02:00 PM
Jim Carroll 17 Mar 17 - 02:09 PM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Mar 17 - 02:37 PM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Mar 17 - 03:04 PM
Dave the Gnome 17 Mar 17 - 03:17 PM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 03:48 PM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 04:04 PM
Jim Carroll 17 Mar 17 - 04:18 PM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 04:30 PM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 05:34 PM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 06:22 PM
Greg F. 17 Mar 17 - 06:26 PM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 06:45 PM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 07:03 PM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 07:08 PM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 07:53 PM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 08:19 PM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 08:26 PM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 08:47 PM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 08:49 PM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 09:02 PM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 09:07 PM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 09:31 PM
Steve Shaw 17 Mar 17 - 09:56 PM
bobad 17 Mar 17 - 10:32 PM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Mar 17 - 05:15 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Mar 17 - 05:19 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Mar 17 - 05:25 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Mar 17 - 05:28 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Mar 17 - 05:43 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Mar 17 - 06:04 AM
Dave the Gnome 18 Mar 17 - 06:58 AM
Steve Shaw 18 Mar 17 - 07:02 AM
bobad 18 Mar 17 - 08:26 AM
Dave the Gnome 18 Mar 17 - 08:41 AM
bobad 18 Mar 17 - 08:52 AM
bobad 18 Mar 17 - 09:04 AM
Dave the Gnome 18 Mar 17 - 09:10 AM
Dave the Gnome 18 Mar 17 - 09:13 AM
bobad 18 Mar 17 - 09:15 AM
Steve Shaw 18 Mar 17 - 09:53 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Mar 17 - 12:21 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Mar 17 - 12:49 PM
Dave the Gnome 18 Mar 17 - 01:03 PM
Steve Shaw 18 Mar 17 - 01:04 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Mar 17 - 01:09 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Mar 17 - 01:20 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Mar 17 - 01:42 PM
Raggytash 18 Mar 17 - 02:20 PM
bobad 18 Mar 17 - 03:58 PM
Greg F. 18 Mar 17 - 04:49 PM
bobad 18 Mar 17 - 07:01 PM
Steve Shaw 18 Mar 17 - 07:26 PM
Steve Shaw 18 Mar 17 - 08:40 PM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Mar 17 - 02:24 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Mar 17 - 02:31 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Mar 17 - 02:40 AM
Teribus 19 Mar 17 - 02:45 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Mar 17 - 02:45 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Mar 17 - 02:55 AM
Dave the Gnome 19 Mar 17 - 03:51 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Mar 17 - 05:22 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Mar 17 - 05:41 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Mar 17 - 06:06 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Mar 17 - 06:21 AM
Dave the Gnome 19 Mar 17 - 07:05 AM
Steve Shaw 19 Mar 17 - 07:18 AM
Dave the Gnome 19 Mar 17 - 07:26 AM
Steve Shaw 19 Mar 17 - 10:54 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Mar 17 - 11:48 AM
bobad 19 Mar 17 - 11:55 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Mar 17 - 12:00 PM
akenaton 19 Mar 17 - 12:14 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Mar 17 - 12:20 PM
Jim Carroll 19 Mar 17 - 12:25 PM
Dave the Gnome 19 Mar 17 - 12:37 PM
akenaton 19 Mar 17 - 12:43 PM
Dave the Gnome 19 Mar 17 - 12:43 PM
Jim Carroll 19 Mar 17 - 12:45 PM
Dave the Gnome 19 Mar 17 - 12:58 PM
Jim Carroll 19 Mar 17 - 02:14 PM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Mar 17 - 02:45 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Mar 17 - 03:07 PM
Dave the Gnome 19 Mar 17 - 03:18 PM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Mar 17 - 03:23 PM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Mar 17 - 03:28 PM
Jim Carroll 19 Mar 17 - 03:33 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Mar 17 - 03:33 PM
Jim Carroll 19 Mar 17 - 03:36 PM
bobad 19 Mar 17 - 04:12 PM
Dave the Gnome 19 Mar 17 - 04:39 PM
Dave the Gnome 19 Mar 17 - 04:39 PM
Jim Carroll 19 Mar 17 - 04:59 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Mar 17 - 05:00 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Mar 17 - 06:03 PM
Jim Carroll 19 Mar 17 - 06:03 PM
bobad 19 Mar 17 - 06:25 PM
Dave the Gnome 19 Mar 17 - 06:29 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Mar 17 - 08:04 PM
bobad 19 Mar 17 - 08:24 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Mar 17 - 08:34 PM
bobad 19 Mar 17 - 09:19 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Mar 17 - 09:36 PM
Jim Carroll 19 Mar 17 - 09:46 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Mar 17 - 09:56 PM
Dave the Gnome 20 Mar 17 - 04:03 AM
Dave the Gnome 20 Mar 17 - 04:12 AM
Keith A of Hertford 20 Mar 17 - 04:21 AM
Keith A of Hertford 20 Mar 17 - 04:24 AM
Keith A of Hertford 20 Mar 17 - 04:32 AM
Steve Shaw 20 Mar 17 - 06:13 AM
Iains 20 Mar 17 - 06:35 AM
Steve Shaw 20 Mar 17 - 06:49 AM
Teribus 20 Mar 17 - 07:14 AM
Steve Shaw 20 Mar 17 - 07:54 AM
Jim Carroll 20 Mar 17 - 08:18 AM
Keith A of Hertford 20 Mar 17 - 08:24 AM
Jim Carroll 20 Mar 17 - 08:30 AM
bobad 20 Mar 17 - 10:01 AM
Steve Shaw 20 Mar 17 - 11:17 AM
Dave the Gnome 20 Mar 17 - 11:29 AM
Keith A of Hertford 20 Mar 17 - 11:33 AM
bobad 20 Mar 17 - 12:27 PM
Jim Carroll 20 Mar 17 - 01:38 PM
Keith A of Hertford 20 Mar 17 - 03:31 PM
Jim Carroll 20 Mar 17 - 03:59 PM
Steve Shaw 20 Mar 17 - 05:28 PM
Dave the Gnome 20 Mar 17 - 05:52 PM
Steve Shaw 20 Mar 17 - 06:09 PM
bobad 20 Mar 17 - 06:20 PM
Steve Shaw 20 Mar 17 - 07:20 PM
bobad 20 Mar 17 - 07:36 PM
Steve Shaw 20 Mar 17 - 08:42 PM
Keith A of Hertford 21 Mar 17 - 04:20 AM
Keith A of Hertford 21 Mar 17 - 04:27 AM
Teribus 21 Mar 17 - 04:42 AM
Jim Carroll 21 Mar 17 - 05:09 AM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 05:26 AM
Dave the Gnome 21 Mar 17 - 05:53 AM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 05:57 AM
Iains 21 Mar 17 - 06:12 AM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 06:45 AM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 06:48 AM
Teribus 21 Mar 17 - 07:14 AM
bobad 21 Mar 17 - 07:44 AM
Dave the Gnome 21 Mar 17 - 08:00 AM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 08:34 AM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 08:43 AM
Teribus 21 Mar 17 - 08:46 AM
Dave the Gnome 21 Mar 17 - 08:55 AM
Teribus 21 Mar 17 - 09:16 AM
Dave the Gnome 21 Mar 17 - 09:29 AM
Donuel 21 Mar 17 - 11:05 AM
Jim Carroll 21 Mar 17 - 11:19 AM
Teribus 21 Mar 17 - 12:38 PM
Jim Carroll 21 Mar 17 - 01:26 PM
bobad 21 Mar 17 - 01:51 PM
Jim Carroll 21 Mar 17 - 02:07 PM
Keith A of Hertford 21 Mar 17 - 02:29 PM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 02:30 PM
Keith A of Hertford 21 Mar 17 - 02:35 PM
Keith A of Hertford 21 Mar 17 - 02:46 PM
Teribus 21 Mar 17 - 02:46 PM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 02:47 PM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 02:48 PM
Keith A of Hertford 21 Mar 17 - 02:59 PM
bobad 21 Mar 17 - 04:08 PM
Donuel 21 Mar 17 - 04:26 PM
Dave the Gnome 21 Mar 17 - 05:18 PM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 05:30 PM
Dave the Gnome 21 Mar 17 - 05:54 PM
bobad 21 Mar 17 - 06:33 PM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 07:19 PM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 07:28 PM
bobad 21 Mar 17 - 07:33 PM
Greg F. 21 Mar 17 - 07:44 PM
bobad 21 Mar 17 - 07:55 PM
Donuel 21 Mar 17 - 08:16 PM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 08:19 PM
bobad 21 Mar 17 - 08:34 PM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 08:41 PM
bobad 21 Mar 17 - 08:55 PM
Steve Shaw 21 Mar 17 - 09:02 PM
Teribus 22 Mar 17 - 02:59 AM
Steve Shaw 22 Mar 17 - 04:22 AM
Keith A of Hertford 22 Mar 17 - 05:13 AM
Dave the Gnome 22 Mar 17 - 05:57 AM
Keith A of Hertford 22 Mar 17 - 07:32 AM
Jim Carroll 22 Mar 17 - 07:41 AM
Dave the Gnome 22 Mar 17 - 07:49 AM
Keith A of Hertford 22 Mar 17 - 07:51 AM
MikeL2 22 Mar 17 - 07:56 AM
Jim Carroll 22 Mar 17 - 09:25 AM
Dave the Gnome 22 Mar 17 - 09:53 AM
Keith A of Hertford 22 Mar 17 - 09:57 AM
bobad 22 Mar 17 - 10:33 AM
Steve Shaw 22 Mar 17 - 11:09 AM
bobad 22 Mar 17 - 11:25 AM
Dave the Gnome 22 Mar 17 - 11:26 AM
Steve Shaw 22 Mar 17 - 11:34 AM
Raggytash 22 Mar 17 - 12:09 PM
Dave the Gnome 22 Mar 17 - 02:04 PM
Jim Carroll 22 Mar 17 - 03:53 PM
Steve Shaw 22 Mar 17 - 03:54 PM
Steve Shaw 22 Mar 17 - 05:53 PM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Mar 17 - 05:11 AM
Steve Shaw 23 Mar 17 - 05:54 AM
Jim Carroll 23 Mar 17 - 06:06 AM
Dave the Gnome 23 Mar 17 - 06:22 AM
Donuel 23 Mar 17 - 06:23 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Mar 17 - 06:24 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Mar 17 - 06:29 AM
Dave the Gnome 23 Mar 17 - 06:42 AM
Jim Carroll 23 Mar 17 - 06:55 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Mar 17 - 07:30 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Mar 17 - 07:36 AM
Jim Carroll 23 Mar 17 - 07:49 AM
Steve Shaw 23 Mar 17 - 07:55 AM
bobad 23 Mar 17 - 08:00 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Mar 17 - 08:34 AM
Dave the Gnome 23 Mar 17 - 08:49 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Mar 17 - 09:44 AM
Steve Shaw 23 Mar 17 - 09:57 AM
Dave the Gnome 23 Mar 17 - 10:01 AM
Dave the Gnome 23 Mar 17 - 10:14 AM
bobad 23 Mar 17 - 10:18 AM
Steve Shaw 23 Mar 17 - 10:37 AM
bobad 23 Mar 17 - 10:39 AM
Iains 23 Mar 17 - 11:08 AM
Dave the Gnome 23 Mar 17 - 11:09 AM
Iains 23 Mar 17 - 12:15 PM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Mar 17 - 12:34 PM
Jim Carroll 23 Mar 17 - 12:51 PM
Raggytash 23 Mar 17 - 01:11 PM
Steve Shaw 23 Mar 17 - 01:23 PM
Raggytash 23 Mar 17 - 01:31 PM
Keith A of Hertford 23 Mar 17 - 02:31 PM
Jim Carroll 23 Mar 17 - 02:42 PM
Jim Carroll 23 Mar 17 - 02:45 PM
Jim Carroll 23 Mar 17 - 02:45 PM
MikeL2 23 Mar 17 - 03:39 PM
Dave the Gnome 23 Mar 17 - 04:32 PM
Steve Shaw 23 Mar 17 - 04:44 PM
bobad 23 Mar 17 - 05:05 PM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Mar 17 - 05:50 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Mar 17 - 05:58 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Mar 17 - 06:11 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Mar 17 - 06:50 AM
Jim Carroll 24 Mar 17 - 07:13 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Mar 17 - 07:38 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Mar 17 - 10:45 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Mar 17 - 10:55 AM
Jim Carroll 24 Mar 17 - 01:48 PM
Raggytash 24 Mar 17 - 03:57 PM
Jim Carroll 24 Mar 17 - 04:18 PM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Mar 17 - 05:25 PM
Dave the Gnome 24 Mar 17 - 06:27 PM
Keith A of Hertford 25 Mar 17 - 02:50 AM
Dave the Gnome 25 Mar 17 - 03:54 AM
Jim Carroll 25 Mar 17 - 03:57 AM
Keith A of Hertford 25 Mar 17 - 05:11 AM
Jim Carroll 25 Mar 17 - 06:56 AM
Raggytash 25 Mar 17 - 10:03 AM
Greg F. 25 Mar 17 - 10:22 AM
Raggytash 25 Mar 17 - 10:28 AM
Keith A of Hertford 25 Mar 17 - 11:06 AM
Jim Carroll 25 Mar 17 - 11:29 AM
akenaton 25 Mar 17 - 11:53 AM
Raggytash 25 Mar 17 - 12:19 PM
Jim Carroll 25 Mar 17 - 12:27 PM
Jim Carroll 25 Mar 17 - 12:38 PM
Dave the Gnome 25 Mar 17 - 02:05 PM
Dave the Gnome 25 Mar 17 - 02:06 PM
akenaton 25 Mar 17 - 02:12 PM
Dave the Gnome 25 Mar 17 - 02:28 PM
Jim Carroll 25 Mar 17 - 02:36 PM
Keith A of Hertford 25 Mar 17 - 02:38 PM
Jim Carroll 25 Mar 17 - 03:56 PM
Dave the Gnome 25 Mar 17 - 07:13 PM
Steve Shaw 25 Mar 17 - 09:14 PM
bobad 25 Mar 17 - 09:48 PM
Keith A of Hertford 26 Mar 17 - 04:08 AM
Dave the Gnome 26 Mar 17 - 04:35 AM
Dave the Gnome 26 Mar 17 - 04:41 AM
Jim Carroll 26 Mar 17 - 04:52 AM
Keith A of Hertford 26 Mar 17 - 07:17 AM
Steve Shaw 26 Mar 17 - 07:34 AM
Dave the Gnome 26 Mar 17 - 07:42 AM
Dave the Gnome 26 Mar 17 - 07:47 AM
Jim Carroll 26 Mar 17 - 08:06 AM
Steve Shaw 26 Mar 17 - 09:21 AM
bobad 26 Mar 17 - 10:06 AM
Dave the Gnome 26 Mar 17 - 11:02 AM
Greg F. 26 Mar 17 - 11:30 AM
Raggytash 26 Mar 17 - 11:35 AM
Steve Shaw 26 Mar 17 - 11:35 AM
Keith A of Hertford 26 Mar 17 - 01:45 PM
Keith A of Hertford 26 Mar 17 - 01:49 PM
Dave the Gnome 26 Mar 17 - 01:53 PM
Steve Shaw 26 Mar 17 - 04:01 PM
Dave the Gnome 27 Mar 17 - 04:02 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Mar 17 - 04:21 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Mar 17 - 04:34 AM
Jim Carroll 27 Mar 17 - 04:58 AM
Dave the Gnome 27 Mar 17 - 05:15 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Mar 17 - 06:29 AM
Jim Carroll 27 Mar 17 - 06:33 AM
Dave the Gnome 27 Mar 17 - 06:36 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Mar 17 - 06:42 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Mar 17 - 06:47 AM
Dave the Gnome 27 Mar 17 - 07:12 AM
Steve Shaw 27 Mar 17 - 08:59 AM
bobad 27 Mar 17 - 09:25 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Mar 17 - 09:41 AM
Teribus 27 Mar 17 - 09:51 AM
Raggytash 27 Mar 17 - 10:16 AM
akenaton 27 Mar 17 - 10:48 AM
Raggytash 27 Mar 17 - 11:50 AM
Steve Shaw 27 Mar 17 - 12:59 PM
Dave the Gnome 27 Mar 17 - 01:14 PM
Raggytash 27 Mar 17 - 01:23 PM
Dave the Gnome 27 Mar 17 - 01:27 PM
Jim Carroll 27 Mar 17 - 01:57 PM
Jim Carroll 27 Mar 17 - 02:11 PM
Jim Carroll 27 Mar 17 - 02:44 PM
Dave the Gnome 27 Mar 17 - 03:32 PM
Jim Carroll 27 Mar 17 - 03:40 PM
Dave the Gnome 27 Mar 17 - 03:42 PM
Dave the Gnome 27 Mar 17 - 03:57 PM
Dave the Gnome 27 Mar 17 - 04:10 PM
Steve Shaw 27 Mar 17 - 05:29 PM
Dave the Gnome 27 Mar 17 - 05:58 PM
Steve Shaw 27 Mar 17 - 07:20 PM
Teribus 27 Mar 17 - 08:59 PM
Steve Shaw 27 Mar 17 - 09:05 PM
Teribus 27 Mar 17 - 09:10 PM
Steve Shaw 27 Mar 17 - 09:39 PM
Jim Carroll 28 Mar 17 - 03:44 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Mar 17 - 04:20 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Mar 17 - 04:25 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Mar 17 - 04:45 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Mar 17 - 04:49 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Mar 17 - 05:52 AM
Raggytash 28 Mar 17 - 11:15 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Mar 17 - 11:19 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Mar 17 - 11:36 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Mar 17 - 12:50 PM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Mar 17 - 12:54 PM
Jim Carroll 28 Mar 17 - 12:59 PM
Raggytash 28 Mar 17 - 02:13 PM
Jim Carroll 28 Mar 17 - 02:33 PM
Jim Carroll 28 Mar 17 - 02:49 PM
Teribus 29 Mar 17 - 02:22 AM
Keith A of Hertford 29 Mar 17 - 03:14 AM
Dave the Gnome 29 Mar 17 - 03:22 AM
Jim Carroll 29 Mar 17 - 04:22 AM
Keith A of Hertford 29 Mar 17 - 05:18 AM
Jim Carroll 29 Mar 17 - 05:23 AM
Teribus 29 Mar 17 - 02:01 PM
Jim Carroll 29 Mar 17 - 02:27 PM
Keith A of Hertford 29 Mar 17 - 03:06 PM
Jim Carroll 29 Mar 17 - 03:40 PM
Teribus 29 Mar 17 - 10:59 PM
Keith A of Hertford 30 Mar 17 - 04:16 AM
Jim Carroll 30 Mar 17 - 05:25 AM
Teribus 30 Mar 17 - 05:58 AM
Teribus 30 Mar 17 - 06:43 AM
akenaton 30 Mar 17 - 07:01 AM
Jim Carroll 30 Mar 17 - 07:04 AM
akenaton 30 Mar 17 - 07:11 AM
Jim Carroll 30 Mar 17 - 07:31 AM
Keith A of Hertford 30 Mar 17 - 08:02 AM
Teribus 30 Mar 17 - 09:03 AM
Jim Carroll 30 Mar 17 - 09:12 AM
bobad 30 Mar 17 - 09:28 AM
Jim Carroll 30 Mar 17 - 09:36 AM
bobad 30 Mar 17 - 10:00 AM
Jim Carroll 30 Mar 17 - 11:08 AM
Teribus 30 Mar 17 - 11:43 AM
Raggytash 30 Mar 17 - 11:50 AM
Jim Carroll 30 Mar 17 - 01:30 PM
Keith A of Hertford 30 Mar 17 - 01:33 PM
Steve Shaw 30 Mar 17 - 01:34 PM
Dave the Gnome 30 Mar 17 - 02:13 PM
akenaton 30 Mar 17 - 02:18 PM
Dave the Gnome 30 Mar 17 - 02:46 PM
Jim Carroll 30 Mar 17 - 03:38 PM
bobad 30 Mar 17 - 03:46 PM
bobad 30 Mar 17 - 03:55 PM
Jim Carroll 30 Mar 17 - 04:53 PM
bobad 30 Mar 17 - 05:11 PM
bobad 30 Mar 17 - 05:17 PM
Steve Shaw 30 Mar 17 - 05:21 PM
bobad 30 Mar 17 - 06:39 PM
Steve Shaw 30 Mar 17 - 07:31 PM
bobad 30 Mar 17 - 07:38 PM
Jim Carroll 30 Mar 17 - 08:06 PM
Steve Shaw 30 Mar 17 - 08:55 PM
Steve Shaw 30 Mar 17 - 08:59 PM
bobad 30 Mar 17 - 09:04 PM
bobad 30 Mar 17 - 09:48 PM
Teribus 30 Mar 17 - 11:32 PM
Teribus 30 Mar 17 - 11:37 PM
Teribus 31 Mar 17 - 01:35 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 Mar 17 - 05:12 AM
Keith A of Hertford 31 Mar 17 - 05:12 AM
Keith A of Hertford 31 Mar 17 - 05:15 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 Mar 17 - 05:26 AM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 05:36 AM
Keith A of Hertford 31 Mar 17 - 05:41 AM
Jim Carroll 31 Mar 17 - 05:43 AM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 05:45 AM
Keith A of Hertford 31 Mar 17 - 06:01 AM
Jim Carroll 31 Mar 17 - 06:07 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 Mar 17 - 06:28 AM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 06:40 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 Mar 17 - 06:43 AM
bobad 31 Mar 17 - 08:06 AM
Keith A of Hertford 31 Mar 17 - 08:25 AM
Teribus 31 Mar 17 - 08:54 AM
Teribus 31 Mar 17 - 09:08 AM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 09:10 AM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 09:15 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 Mar 17 - 09:30 AM
Iains 31 Mar 17 - 09:33 AM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 09:43 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 Mar 17 - 09:50 AM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 10:02 AM
akenaton 31 Mar 17 - 10:05 AM
Jim Carroll 31 Mar 17 - 10:14 AM
Iains 31 Mar 17 - 10:14 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 Mar 17 - 10:18 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 Mar 17 - 10:35 AM
Jim Carroll 31 Mar 17 - 10:47 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 Mar 17 - 10:57 AM
bobad 31 Mar 17 - 11:20 AM
Raggytash 31 Mar 17 - 11:29 AM
Jim Carroll 31 Mar 17 - 11:32 AM
bobad 31 Mar 17 - 11:47 AM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 11:53 AM
Raggytash 31 Mar 17 - 12:14 PM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 12:26 PM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 12:28 PM
Jim Carroll 31 Mar 17 - 12:28 PM
bobad 31 Mar 17 - 12:46 PM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 12:51 PM
bobad 31 Mar 17 - 12:56 PM
Keith A of Hertford 31 Mar 17 - 01:00 PM
Keith A of Hertford 31 Mar 17 - 01:04 PM
bobad 31 Mar 17 - 01:08 PM
Jim Carroll 31 Mar 17 - 01:14 PM
bobad 31 Mar 17 - 01:21 PM
Jim Carroll 31 Mar 17 - 01:39 PM
Dave the Gnome 31 Mar 17 - 01:53 PM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 02:33 PM
Keith A of Hertford 31 Mar 17 - 03:33 PM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 03:46 PM
bobad 31 Mar 17 - 03:55 PM
Teribus 31 Mar 17 - 03:55 PM
Teribus 31 Mar 17 - 04:18 PM
Steve Shaw 31 Mar 17 - 06:37 PM
Jim Carroll 31 Mar 17 - 08:02 PM
Teribus 31 Mar 17 - 09:06 PM
Teribus 31 Mar 17 - 09:17 PM
Jim Carroll 01 Apr 17 - 02:55 AM
Keith A of Hertford 01 Apr 17 - 03:24 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Apr 17 - 03:50 AM
Teribus 01 Apr 17 - 03:53 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Apr 17 - 04:06 AM
Teribus 01 Apr 17 - 04:08 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Apr 17 - 04:40 AM
Keith A of Hertford 01 Apr 17 - 04:51 AM
Steve Shaw 01 Apr 17 - 05:12 AM
Steve Shaw 01 Apr 17 - 05:31 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Apr 17 - 05:41 AM
bobad 01 Apr 17 - 06:02 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Apr 17 - 06:03 AM
Teribus 01 Apr 17 - 07:20 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Apr 17 - 07:54 AM
Teribus 01 Apr 17 - 08:48 AM
Raggytash 01 Apr 17 - 08:56 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Apr 17 - 10:05 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Apr 17 - 10:10 AM
Teribus 01 Apr 17 - 10:24 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Apr 17 - 10:31 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Apr 17 - 10:54 AM
Teribus 01 Apr 17 - 11:30 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Apr 17 - 11:53 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Apr 17 - 12:09 PM
Keith A of Hertford 01 Apr 17 - 12:31 PM
Keith A of Hertford 01 Apr 17 - 12:36 PM
Keith A of Hertford 01 Apr 17 - 12:48 PM
Dave the Gnome 01 Apr 17 - 01:27 PM
Jim Carroll 01 Apr 17 - 02:07 PM
Raggytash 01 Apr 17 - 03:51 PM
Steve Shaw 01 Apr 17 - 06:43 PM
Steve Shaw 01 Apr 17 - 07:16 PM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Apr 17 - 04:48 AM
Jim Carroll 02 Apr 17 - 05:11 AM
Jim Carroll 02 Apr 17 - 05:25 AM
Teribus 02 Apr 17 - 05:36 AM
Jim Carroll 02 Apr 17 - 05:50 AM
Jim Carroll 02 Apr 17 - 05:59 AM
Steve Shaw 02 Apr 17 - 06:03 AM
Jim Carroll 02 Apr 17 - 06:55 AM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Apr 17 - 07:36 AM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Apr 17 - 07:54 AM
Jim Carroll 02 Apr 17 - 08:22 AM
Steve Shaw 02 Apr 17 - 08:59 AM
Jim Carroll 02 Apr 17 - 09:46 AM
Teribus 02 Apr 17 - 10:23 AM
Raggytash 02 Apr 17 - 10:34 AM
Jeri 02 Apr 17 - 10:39 AM
Jim Carroll 02 Apr 17 - 11:18 AM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Apr 17 - 11:38 AM
Donuel 02 Apr 17 - 11:51 AM
Steve Shaw 02 Apr 17 - 11:52 AM
Jim Carroll 02 Apr 17 - 11:53 AM
bobad 02 Apr 17 - 11:58 AM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Apr 17 - 12:07 PM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Apr 17 - 12:15 PM
Jim Carroll 02 Apr 17 - 12:35 PM
Jim Carroll 02 Apr 17 - 12:49 PM
bobad 02 Apr 17 - 12:50 PM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Apr 17 - 01:20 PM
Jim Carroll 02 Apr 17 - 01:28 PM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Apr 17 - 03:47 PM
Raggytash 02 Apr 17 - 04:43 PM
Steve Shaw 02 Apr 17 - 06:45 PM
Raggytash 02 Apr 17 - 07:10 PM
Jim Carroll 02 Apr 17 - 07:56 PM
Teribus 03 Apr 17 - 02:59 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Apr 17 - 03:56 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Apr 17 - 04:10 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Apr 17 - 05:02 AM
Teribus 03 Apr 17 - 05:17 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Apr 17 - 05:26 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Apr 17 - 05:41 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Apr 17 - 05:49 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Apr 17 - 06:01 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Apr 17 - 06:05 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Apr 17 - 07:24 AM
Teribus 03 Apr 17 - 07:29 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Apr 17 - 07:38 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Apr 17 - 07:52 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Apr 17 - 08:46 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Apr 17 - 08:52 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Apr 17 - 08:54 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Apr 17 - 09:03 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Apr 17 - 09:11 AM
Teribus 03 Apr 17 - 09:14 AM
Teribus 03 Apr 17 - 09:16 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Apr 17 - 10:07 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Apr 17 - 10:11 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Apr 17 - 10:21 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Apr 17 - 10:26 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Apr 17 - 10:44 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Apr 17 - 10:51 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Apr 17 - 11:02 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Apr 17 - 11:06 AM
Raggytash 03 Apr 17 - 11:24 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Apr 17 - 11:37 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Apr 17 - 11:44 AM
Teribus 03 Apr 17 - 01:00 PM
Jim Carroll 03 Apr 17 - 01:21 PM
Dave the Gnome 03 Apr 17 - 01:51 PM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Apr 17 - 01:52 PM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Apr 17 - 02:12 PM
Jim Carroll 03 Apr 17 - 02:20 PM
Dave the Gnome 03 Apr 17 - 02:21 PM
Dave the Gnome 03 Apr 17 - 02:23 PM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Apr 17 - 03:00 PM
Dave the Gnome 03 Apr 17 - 04:13 PM
Steve Shaw 03 Apr 17 - 05:40 PM
Teribus 03 Apr 17 - 09:03 PM
Dave the Gnome 04 Apr 17 - 01:44 AM
Teribus 04 Apr 17 - 02:46 AM
Dave the Gnome 04 Apr 17 - 03:08 AM
Teribus 04 Apr 17 - 03:11 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Apr 17 - 03:19 AM
Teribus 04 Apr 17 - 03:26 AM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Apr 17 - 03:45 AM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Apr 17 - 03:49 AM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Apr 17 - 03:53 AM
Dave the Gnome 04 Apr 17 - 04:11 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Apr 17 - 04:13 AM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Apr 17 - 04:23 AM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Apr 17 - 04:27 AM
Dave the Gnome 04 Apr 17 - 04:42 AM
Steve Shaw 04 Apr 17 - 05:08 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Apr 17 - 06:08 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Apr 17 - 07:05 AM
akenaton 04 Apr 17 - 07:34 AM
Dave the Gnome 04 Apr 17 - 07:56 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Apr 17 - 08:13 AM
bobad 04 Apr 17 - 08:27 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Apr 17 - 08:34 AM
Teribus 04 Apr 17 - 11:15 AM
Steve Shaw 04 Apr 17 - 11:38 AM
bobad 04 Apr 17 - 11:44 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Apr 17 - 11:57 AM
Teribus 04 Apr 17 - 02:36 PM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Apr 17 - 03:03 PM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Apr 17 - 03:14 PM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Apr 17 - 03:36 PM
Iains 04 Apr 17 - 04:17 PM
Dave the Gnome 04 Apr 17 - 04:29 PM
Raggytash 04 Apr 17 - 04:40 PM
Steve Shaw 04 Apr 17 - 05:48 PM
Steve Shaw 04 Apr 17 - 06:07 PM
Steve Shaw 04 Apr 17 - 06:12 PM
Steve Shaw 04 Apr 17 - 06:44 PM
Teribus 05 Apr 17 - 01:53 AM
Jim Carroll 05 Apr 17 - 02:41 AM
Teribus 05 Apr 17 - 02:50 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Apr 17 - 03:16 AM
Jim Carroll 05 Apr 17 - 03:16 AM
Keith A of Hertford 05 Apr 17 - 03:30 AM
Keith A of Hertford 05 Apr 17 - 03:36 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Apr 17 - 03:36 AM
Teribus 05 Apr 17 - 03:39 AM
Keith A of Hertford 05 Apr 17 - 03:47 AM
Keith A of Hertford 05 Apr 17 - 03:50 AM
Keith A of Hertford 05 Apr 17 - 03:54 AM
Iains 05 Apr 17 - 03:55 AM
Keith A of Hertford 05 Apr 17 - 04:12 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Apr 17 - 04:12 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Apr 17 - 04:48 AM
Jim Carroll 05 Apr 17 - 04:48 AM
Keith A of Hertford 05 Apr 17 - 05:37 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 06:04 AM
Iains 05 Apr 17 - 06:39 AM
Teribus 05 Apr 17 - 06:53 AM
Keith A of Hertford 05 Apr 17 - 06:57 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 07:21 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 07:28 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 07:29 AM
Teribus 05 Apr 17 - 07:30 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 07:37 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 07:39 AM
Jim Carroll 05 Apr 17 - 08:10 AM
Teribus 05 Apr 17 - 08:13 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Apr 17 - 08:43 AM
Jim Carroll 05 Apr 17 - 09:10 AM
Jim Carroll 05 Apr 17 - 09:21 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 09:39 AM
Iains 05 Apr 17 - 09:39 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 09:43 AM
bobad 05 Apr 17 - 09:44 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 09:45 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 09:49 AM
Iains 05 Apr 17 - 09:50 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 09:52 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 09:56 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Apr 17 - 10:08 AM
bobad 05 Apr 17 - 10:47 AM
Jim Carroll 05 Apr 17 - 11:11 AM
bobad 05 Apr 17 - 11:36 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 11:44 AM
bobad 05 Apr 17 - 12:40 PM
Dave the Gnome 05 Apr 17 - 12:45 PM
Jim Carroll 05 Apr 17 - 12:59 PM
bobad 05 Apr 17 - 01:07 PM
Jim Carroll 05 Apr 17 - 01:50 PM
bobad 05 Apr 17 - 02:03 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 02:09 PM
Keith A of Hertford 05 Apr 17 - 02:29 PM
Dave the Gnome 05 Apr 17 - 02:58 PM
Jim Carroll 05 Apr 17 - 03:13 PM
Jim Carroll 05 Apr 17 - 03:23 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 04:35 PM
bobad 05 Apr 17 - 05:15 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 05:48 PM
Jim Carroll 05 Apr 17 - 07:47 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 17 - 08:00 PM
Teribus 05 Apr 17 - 10:37 PM
Jim Carroll 06 Apr 17 - 03:32 AM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Apr 17 - 03:50 AM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Apr 17 - 03:54 AM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Apr 17 - 04:03 AM
Jim Carroll 06 Apr 17 - 04:35 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 Apr 17 - 04:49 AM
Steve Shaw 06 Apr 17 - 05:20 AM
Steve Shaw 06 Apr 17 - 05:26 AM
Steve Shaw 06 Apr 17 - 05:35 AM
akenaton 06 Apr 17 - 06:06 AM
Jim Carroll 06 Apr 17 - 07:00 AM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Apr 17 - 07:28 AM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Apr 17 - 07:36 AM
Jim Carroll 06 Apr 17 - 08:27 AM
Steve Shaw 06 Apr 17 - 09:03 AM
Raggytash 06 Apr 17 - 09:31 AM
Stu 06 Apr 17 - 09:52 AM
Jim Carroll 06 Apr 17 - 10:16 AM
Teribus 06 Apr 17 - 10:45 AM
bobad 06 Apr 17 - 11:06 AM
Jim Carroll 06 Apr 17 - 11:38 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 Apr 17 - 11:39 AM
Teribus 06 Apr 17 - 01:14 PM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Apr 17 - 01:28 PM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Apr 17 - 01:52 PM
Keith A of Hertford 06 Apr 17 - 01:57 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Apr 17 - 02:18 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Apr 17 - 02:20 PM
Greg F. 06 Apr 17 - 02:50 PM
Jim Carroll 06 Apr 17 - 03:27 PM
bobad 06 Apr 17 - 03:49 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Apr 17 - 04:00 PM
Jim Carroll 06 Apr 17 - 05:06 PM
Teribus 06 Apr 17 - 07:12 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Apr 17 - 07:26 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Apr 17 - 07:33 PM
Jim Carroll 06 Apr 17 - 07:51 PM
Teribus 07 Apr 17 - 03:28 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Apr 17 - 03:31 AM
Teribus 07 Apr 17 - 03:41 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Apr 17 - 04:07 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Apr 17 - 04:24 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 Apr 17 - 06:01 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Apr 17 - 06:18 AM
bobad 07 Apr 17 - 07:28 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Apr 17 - 08:26 AM
bobad 07 Apr 17 - 09:09 AM
bobad 07 Apr 17 - 09:41 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Apr 17 - 09:43 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Apr 17 - 09:56 AM
bobad 07 Apr 17 - 10:03 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Apr 17 - 10:09 AM
Steve Shaw 07 Apr 17 - 10:10 AM
Jim Carroll 07 Apr 17 - 10:25 AM
bobad 07 Apr 17 - 10:53 AM
Teribus 07 Apr 17 - 12:05 PM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Apr 17 - 12:21 PM
Steve Shaw 07 Apr 17 - 01:10 PM
Teribus 07 Apr 17 - 01:12 PM
Dave the Gnome 07 Apr 17 - 02:00 PM
Keith A of Hertford 07 Apr 17 - 02:14 PM
Jim Carroll 07 Apr 17 - 03:08 PM
Dave the Gnome 07 Apr 17 - 05:38 PM
Steve Shaw 07 Apr 17 - 06:04 PM
Steve Shaw 07 Apr 17 - 06:35 PM
Steve Shaw 07 Apr 17 - 06:36 PM
Steve Shaw 07 Apr 17 - 07:13 PM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Apr 17 - 03:59 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Apr 17 - 04:40 AM
Raggytash 08 Apr 17 - 04:48 AM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 05:03 AM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 05:52 AM
Jim Carroll 08 Apr 17 - 06:31 AM
Teribus 08 Apr 17 - 08:28 AM
Jim Carroll 08 Apr 17 - 08:34 AM
bobad 08 Apr 17 - 08:58 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Apr 17 - 09:13 AM
Teribus 08 Apr 17 - 09:43 AM
bobad 08 Apr 17 - 09:51 AM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 10:03 AM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 10:06 AM
bobad 08 Apr 17 - 10:26 AM
Teribus 08 Apr 17 - 10:55 AM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 11:09 AM
Jim Carroll 08 Apr 17 - 11:15 AM
bobad 08 Apr 17 - 11:25 AM
Jim Carroll 08 Apr 17 - 12:16 PM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Apr 17 - 12:18 PM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Apr 17 - 12:28 PM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Apr 17 - 12:45 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 12:48 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 12:52 PM
Jim Carroll 08 Apr 17 - 01:36 PM
bobad 08 Apr 17 - 02:29 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 02:34 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 02:37 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 04:58 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 05:09 PM
Teribus 08 Apr 17 - 06:22 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 06:39 PM
Teribus 08 Apr 17 - 06:57 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 07:09 PM
Teribus 08 Apr 17 - 07:13 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 17 - 07:41 PM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Apr 17 - 01:46 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Apr 17 - 01:56 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Apr 17 - 02:45 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Apr 17 - 02:49 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Apr 17 - 03:18 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Apr 17 - 04:43 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Apr 17 - 06:25 AM
bobad 09 Apr 17 - 08:07 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Apr 17 - 08:21 AM
Teribus 09 Apr 17 - 09:09 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Apr 17 - 12:27 PM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Apr 17 - 12:44 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Apr 17 - 06:22 PM
bobad 09 Apr 17 - 06:41 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Apr 17 - 07:40 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Apr 17 - 08:19 PM
Teribus 10 Apr 17 - 01:41 AM
Keith A of Hertford 10 Apr 17 - 03:37 AM
Steve Shaw 10 Apr 17 - 06:23 AM
Keith A of Hertford 10 Apr 17 - 08:26 AM
Teribus 10 Apr 17 - 09:35 AM
Keith A of Hertford 10 Apr 17 - 11:18 AM
Steve Shaw 10 Apr 17 - 11:43 AM
bobad 10 Apr 17 - 01:21 PM
Keith A of Hertford 10 Apr 17 - 01:32 PM
Keith A of Hertford 10 Apr 17 - 01:35 PM
Steve Shaw 10 Apr 17 - 01:52 PM
Keith A of Hertford 10 Apr 17 - 02:07 PM
Teribus 11 Apr 17 - 05:13 AM
Raggytash 11 Apr 17 - 05:52 AM
Teribus 11 Apr 17 - 08:12 AM
Raggytash 11 Apr 17 - 09:08 AM
Teribus 11 Apr 17 - 11:25 AM
Steve Shaw 11 Apr 17 - 11:35 AM
Raggytash 11 Apr 17 - 12:06 PM
Dave the Gnome 11 Apr 17 - 12:06 PM
Keith A of Hertford 11 Apr 17 - 01:43 PM
Teribus 11 Apr 17 - 02:10 PM
Steve Shaw 11 Apr 17 - 03:05 PM
Steve Shaw 11 Apr 17 - 03:06 PM
Greg F. 11 Apr 17 - 08:12 PM
Steve Shaw 11 Apr 17 - 09:07 PM
Keith A of Hertford 12 Apr 17 - 03:59 AM
Keith A of Hertford 12 Apr 17 - 04:10 AM
Steve Shaw 12 Apr 17 - 08:09 AM
Teribus 12 Apr 17 - 01:02 PM
Keith A of Hertford 12 Apr 17 - 01:13 PM
Teribus 12 Apr 17 - 01:21 PM
Dave the Gnome 12 Apr 17 - 01:36 PM
Keith A of Hertford 12 Apr 17 - 01:46 PM
Dave the Gnome 12 Apr 17 - 01:48 PM
Keith A of Hertford 12 Apr 17 - 01:57 PM
Dave the Gnome 12 Apr 17 - 03:40 PM
Jim Carroll 13 Apr 17 - 03:20 AM
Jim Carroll 13 Apr 17 - 03:35 AM
Teribus 13 Apr 17 - 03:44 AM
Keith A of Hertford 13 Apr 17 - 03:56 AM
Jim Carroll 13 Apr 17 - 04:47 AM
Dave the Gnome 13 Apr 17 - 04:59 AM
Steve Shaw 13 Apr 17 - 05:13 AM
Jim Carroll 13 Apr 17 - 05:53 AM
Teribus 13 Apr 17 - 06:31 AM
Jim Carroll 13 Apr 17 - 06:38 AM
Keith A of Hertford 13 Apr 17 - 07:19 AM
Raggytash 13 Apr 17 - 07:21 AM
Keith A of Hertford 13 Apr 17 - 07:33 AM
Keith A of Hertford 13 Apr 17 - 07:42 AM
Jim Carroll 13 Apr 17 - 08:02 AM
bobad 13 Apr 17 - 08:03 AM
Jim Carroll 13 Apr 17 - 08:53 AM
bobad 13 Apr 17 - 09:18 AM
Jim Carroll 13 Apr 17 - 09:30 AM
Jim Carroll 13 Apr 17 - 10:31 AM
bobad 13 Apr 17 - 10:42 AM
bobad 13 Apr 17 - 11:02 AM
Jim Carroll 13 Apr 17 - 11:57 AM
Jim Carroll 13 Apr 17 - 12:38 PM
Keith A of Hertford 13 Apr 17 - 01:32 PM
Teribus 13 Apr 17 - 03:23 PM
Raggytash 13 Apr 17 - 03:44 PM
Teribus 13 Apr 17 - 04:26 PM
bobad 13 Apr 17 - 04:49 PM
Steve Shaw 13 Apr 17 - 07:59 PM
bobad 13 Apr 17 - 08:40 PM
Teribus 14 Apr 17 - 03:14 AM
Keith A of Hertford 14 Apr 17 - 03:31 AM
Raggytash 14 Apr 17 - 04:04 AM
Jim Carroll 14 Apr 17 - 04:26 AM
Steve Shaw 14 Apr 17 - 05:31 AM
Dave the Gnome 14 Apr 17 - 05:52 AM
Jim Carroll 14 Apr 17 - 05:54 AM
Steve Shaw 14 Apr 17 - 06:01 AM
Keith A of Hertford 14 Apr 17 - 06:14 AM
Dave the Gnome 14 Apr 17 - 06:15 AM
Jim Carroll 14 Apr 17 - 06:39 AM
Jim Carroll 14 Apr 17 - 07:27 AM
Dave the Gnome 14 Apr 17 - 09:32 AM
Keith A of Hertford 14 Apr 17 - 10:14 AM
Dave the Gnome 14 Apr 17 - 10:18 AM
Keith A of Hertford 14 Apr 17 - 10:21 AM
Jim Carroll 14 Apr 17 - 11:28 AM
Steve Shaw 14 Apr 17 - 11:34 AM
Dave the Gnome 14 Apr 17 - 11:36 AM
Keith A of Hertford 14 Apr 17 - 01:03 PM
Jim Carroll 14 Apr 17 - 02:10 PM
Steve Shaw 14 Apr 17 - 02:12 PM
Dave the Gnome 14 Apr 17 - 02:28 PM
Jim Carroll 14 Apr 17 - 09:02 PM
Steve Shaw 14 Apr 17 - 09:23 PM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Apr 17 - 03:46 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Apr 17 - 03:47 AM
Raggytash 15 Apr 17 - 04:27 AM
Jim Carroll 15 Apr 17 - 04:27 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Apr 17 - 04:48 AM
Raggytash 15 Apr 17 - 04:56 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Apr 17 - 05:04 AM
Raggytash 15 Apr 17 - 05:17 AM
Steve Shaw 15 Apr 17 - 05:26 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Apr 17 - 07:48 AM
Raggytash 15 Apr 17 - 08:02 AM
bobad 15 Apr 17 - 09:02 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Apr 17 - 09:27 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Apr 17 - 09:34 AM
Raggytash 15 Apr 17 - 09:37 AM
Dave the Gnome 16 Apr 17 - 03:55 AM
Dave the Gnome 16 Apr 17 - 04:06 AM
Jim Carroll 16 Apr 17 - 04:33 AM
Dave the Gnome 16 Apr 17 - 05:37 AM
Raggytash 16 Apr 17 - 05:57 AM
Steve Shaw 16 Apr 17 - 06:19 AM
Jim Carroll 16 Apr 17 - 07:23 AM
Steve Shaw 16 Apr 17 - 10:30 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Apr 17 - 01:56 PM
Keith A of Hertford 17 Apr 17 - 02:02 PM
Jim Carroll 17 Apr 17 - 02:42 PM
Dave the Gnome 17 Apr 17 - 02:47 PM
Raggytash 17 Apr 17 - 03:23 PM
Teribus 17 Apr 17 - 04:41 PM
Steve Shaw 17 Apr 17 - 06:21 PM
Steve Shaw 17 Apr 17 - 07:10 PM
Teribus 18 Apr 17 - 04:04 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Apr 17 - 04:06 AM
Raggytash 18 Apr 17 - 04:16 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Apr 17 - 04:18 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Apr 17 - 05:09 AM
Steve Shaw 18 Apr 17 - 05:42 AM
Dave the Gnome 18 Apr 17 - 05:42 AM
Steve Shaw 18 Apr 17 - 06:02 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Apr 17 - 06:21 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Apr 17 - 06:26 AM
Steve Shaw 18 Apr 17 - 06:46 AM
Dave the Gnome 18 Apr 17 - 06:51 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Apr 17 - 07:14 AM
bobad 18 Apr 17 - 07:48 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Apr 17 - 08:04 AM
bobad 18 Apr 17 - 09:06 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Apr 17 - 09:32 AM
Steve Shaw 18 Apr 17 - 10:54 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Apr 17 - 10:59 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Apr 17 - 11:33 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Apr 17 - 11:41 AM
Raggytash 18 Apr 17 - 11:42 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Apr 17 - 11:56 AM
Steve Shaw 18 Apr 17 - 11:58 AM
Raggytash 18 Apr 17 - 11:59 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Apr 17 - 12:31 PM
Dave the Gnome 18 Apr 17 - 12:36 PM
bobad 18 Apr 17 - 02:07 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Apr 17 - 02:30 PM
Teribus 18 Apr 17 - 02:46 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Apr 17 - 03:03 PM
Teribus 18 Apr 17 - 06:21 PM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Apr 17 - 04:34 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Apr 17 - 04:39 AM
Dave the Gnome 19 Apr 17 - 05:52 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Apr 17 - 06:23 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Apr 17 - 08:37 AM
Dave the Gnome 19 Apr 17 - 08:48 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Apr 17 - 11:51 AM
bobad 19 Apr 17 - 03:33 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Apr 17 - 05:44 PM
Jim Carroll 19 Apr 17 - 07:45 PM
Dave the Gnome 22 Apr 17 - 03:21 AM
Steve Shaw 22 Apr 17 - 04:52 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Apr 17 - 04:26 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Apr 17 - 04:29 AM
Raggytash 27 Apr 17 - 04:49 AM
DMcG 27 Apr 17 - 04:54 AM
Keith A of Hertford 27 Apr 17 - 05:25 AM
Jim Carroll 27 Apr 17 - 05:46 AM
Jim Carroll 27 Apr 17 - 06:27 AM
bobad 27 Apr 17 - 02:28 PM
Steve Shaw 27 Apr 17 - 07:06 PM
bobad 27 Apr 17 - 10:00 PM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Apr 17 - 03:01 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Apr 17 - 03:08 AM
Raggytash 28 Apr 17 - 03:39 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Apr 17 - 03:40 AM
Steve Shaw 28 Apr 17 - 04:02 AM
bobad 28 Apr 17 - 07:44 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Apr 17 - 10:38 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Apr 17 - 11:16 AM
Raggytash 28 Apr 17 - 03:18 PM
Steve Shaw 28 Apr 17 - 06:21 PM
Steve Shaw 28 Apr 17 - 06:49 PM
bobad 28 Apr 17 - 07:38 PM
Steve Shaw 28 Apr 17 - 07:50 PM
bobad 28 Apr 17 - 07:56 PM
Jim Carroll 28 Apr 17 - 08:05 PM
bobad 28 Apr 17 - 08:43 PM
Steve Shaw 29 Apr 17 - 04:29 AM
Keith A of Hertford 29 Apr 17 - 05:04 AM
Raggytash 29 Apr 17 - 05:09 AM
Jim Carroll 29 Apr 17 - 06:38 AM
bobad 29 Apr 17 - 07:18 AM
Dave the Gnome 29 Apr 17 - 07:55 AM
Steve Shaw 29 Apr 17 - 05:31 PM
Steve Shaw 29 Apr 17 - 06:08 PM
Teribus 30 Apr 17 - 01:24 AM
Keith A of Hertford 30 Apr 17 - 05:52 AM
Raggytash 30 Apr 17 - 05:58 AM
Raggytash 30 Apr 17 - 06:30 AM
Teribus 30 Apr 17 - 06:31 AM
Steve Shaw 30 Apr 17 - 06:31 AM
Steve Shaw 30 Apr 17 - 06:35 AM
Jim Carroll 30 Apr 17 - 08:32 AM
Keith A of Hertford 30 Apr 17 - 02:48 PM
Jim Carroll 30 Apr 17 - 03:18 PM
Teribus 01 May 17 - 01:39 AM
Raggytash 01 May 17 - 02:15 AM
Jim Carroll 01 May 17 - 02:42 AM
Raggytash 01 May 17 - 02:48 AM
Iains 01 May 17 - 03:46 AM
Keith A of Hertford 01 May 17 - 04:05 AM
Keith A of Hertford 01 May 17 - 04:11 AM
Raggytash 01 May 17 - 04:15 AM
Raggytash 01 May 17 - 04:22 AM
Jim Carroll 01 May 17 - 04:28 AM
Iains 01 May 17 - 04:53 AM
Jim Carroll 01 May 17 - 05:17 AM
bobad 01 May 17 - 06:42 AM
Raggytash 01 May 17 - 06:57 AM
Iains 01 May 17 - 07:01 AM
Jim Carroll 01 May 17 - 07:18 AM
bobad 01 May 17 - 08:35 AM
Raggytash 01 May 17 - 08:52 AM
bobad 01 May 17 - 08:57 AM
Raggytash 01 May 17 - 09:06 AM
Iains 01 May 17 - 09:29 AM
Jim Carroll 01 May 17 - 10:06 AM
bobad 01 May 17 - 11:22 AM
Jim Carroll 01 May 17 - 12:54 PM
Steve Shaw 01 May 17 - 12:59 PM
Keith A of Hertford 01 May 17 - 01:14 PM
Keith A of Hertford 01 May 17 - 01:24 PM
Jim Carroll 01 May 17 - 01:35 PM
Raggytash 01 May 17 - 05:11 PM
bobad 01 May 17 - 05:46 PM
bobad 01 May 17 - 05:54 PM
Greg F. 01 May 17 - 06:06 PM
bobad 04 May 17 - 09:34 PM
Greg F. 05 May 17 - 09:17 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 May 17 - 09:29 AM
Keith A of Hertford 05 May 17 - 09:41 AM
Keith A of Hertford 05 May 17 - 09:46 AM
bobad 05 May 17 - 10:01 AM
bobad 05 May 17 - 10:24 AM
Raggytash 05 May 17 - 10:31 AM
Greg F. 05 May 17 - 12:02 PM
Keith A of Hertford 05 May 17 - 01:46 PM
Jim Carroll 05 May 17 - 03:29 PM
Jim Carroll 05 May 17 - 03:53 PM
Dave the Gnome 05 May 17 - 06:22 PM
Jim Carroll 05 May 17 - 07:03 PM
Keith A of Hertford 06 May 17 - 05:21 AM
Jim Carroll 06 May 17 - 07:20 AM
Keith A of Hertford 06 May 17 - 07:26 AM
Jim Carroll 06 May 17 - 08:35 AM
Dave the Gnome 06 May 17 - 10:30 AM
Keith A of Hertford 06 May 17 - 10:49 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 May 17 - 04:19 AM
Keith A of Hertford 07 May 17 - 06:36 AM
Dave the Gnome 07 May 17 - 08:54 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 May 17 - 05:34 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 May 17 - 06:12 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 May 17 - 06:35 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 May 17 - 06:45 AM
Teribus 08 May 17 - 09:17 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 May 17 - 09:18 AM
Jim Carroll 08 May 17 - 10:16 AM
Jim Carroll 08 May 17 - 10:40 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 May 17 - 10:40 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 May 17 - 11:26 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 May 17 - 11:46 AM
Jim Carroll 08 May 17 - 11:54 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 May 17 - 01:51 PM
Raggytash 08 May 17 - 02:02 PM
Dave the Gnome 09 May 17 - 03:00 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 May 17 - 04:06 AM
Keith A of Hertford 10 May 17 - 04:08 AM
Keith A of Hertford 10 May 17 - 04:11 AM
Jim Carroll 10 May 17 - 05:09 AM
Teribus 10 May 17 - 06:26 AM
Jim Carroll 10 May 17 - 06:50 AM
bobad 10 May 17 - 09:09 AM
Keith A of Hertford 10 May 17 - 09:17 AM
Jim Carroll 10 May 17 - 11:02 AM
Keith A of Hertford 10 May 17 - 11:22 AM
bobad 10 May 17 - 11:46 AM
bobad 10 May 17 - 12:22 PM
Teribus 10 May 17 - 01:33 PM
Jim Carroll 10 May 17 - 01:56 PM
Jim Carroll 10 May 17 - 02:09 PM
Keith A of Hertford 10 May 17 - 02:35 PM
Jim Carroll 10 May 17 - 02:51 PM
Keith A of Hertford 11 May 17 - 03:45 AM
Jim Carroll 11 May 17 - 04:13 AM
Teribus 11 May 17 - 06:23 AM
Jim Carroll 11 May 17 - 09:06 AM
Keith A of Hertford 11 May 17 - 10:35 AM
Teribus 11 May 17 - 10:36 AM
Jim Carroll 11 May 17 - 12:26 PM
bobad 11 May 17 - 02:20 PM
Jim Carroll 11 May 17 - 03:18 PM
Teribus 11 May 17 - 03:30 PM
bobad 11 May 17 - 06:52 PM
Steve Shaw 11 May 17 - 08:11 PM
Steve Shaw 11 May 17 - 08:54 PM
Teribus 12 May 17 - 02:16 AM
Jim Carroll 12 May 17 - 02:40 AM
Jim Carroll 12 May 17 - 02:40 AM
Steve Shaw 12 May 17 - 05:36 AM
bobad 12 May 17 - 07:56 AM
Jim Carroll 12 May 17 - 09:00 AM
Steve Shaw 12 May 17 - 09:36 AM
Teribus 12 May 17 - 10:26 AM
bobad 12 May 17 - 10:57 AM
Steve Shaw 12 May 17 - 11:56 AM
Keith A of Hertford 12 May 17 - 12:13 PM
Steve Shaw 12 May 17 - 12:43 PM
Jim Carroll 12 May 17 - 12:43 PM
Jim Carroll 12 May 17 - 01:00 PM
bobad 12 May 17 - 05:28 PM
Teribus 13 May 17 - 03:55 AM
Jim Carroll 13 May 17 - 04:01 AM
Steve Shaw 13 May 17 - 04:46 AM
Keith A of Hertford 13 May 17 - 05:02 AM
Steve Shaw 13 May 17 - 05:53 AM
Jim Carroll 13 May 17 - 07:39 AM
Keith A of Hertford 13 May 17 - 11:30 AM
Keith A of Hertford 13 May 17 - 11:35 AM
Teribus 13 May 17 - 11:39 AM
Jim Carroll 13 May 17 - 12:50 PM
bobad 13 May 17 - 01:14 PM
Steve Shaw 13 May 17 - 01:19 PM
Jim Carroll 13 May 17 - 01:31 PM
Jim Carroll 13 May 17 - 01:40 PM
Jim Carroll 13 May 17 - 01:48 PM
Jim Carroll 13 May 17 - 01:52 PM
bobad 13 May 17 - 02:07 PM
Steve Shaw 13 May 17 - 02:11 PM
Keith A of Hertford 13 May 17 - 02:16 PM
Teribus 13 May 17 - 02:26 PM
Raggytash 13 May 17 - 04:42 PM
Teribus 13 May 17 - 04:46 PM
Steve Shaw 13 May 17 - 05:29 PM
Teribus 14 May 17 - 03:28 AM
Jim Carroll 14 May 17 - 03:48 AM
Steve Shaw 14 May 17 - 04:41 AM
Teribus 14 May 17 - 04:58 AM
Steve Shaw 14 May 17 - 05:51 AM
Keith A of Hertford 14 May 17 - 05:57 AM
Jim Carroll 14 May 17 - 06:05 AM
Teribus 14 May 17 - 06:10 AM
Teribus 14 May 17 - 06:14 AM
Steve Shaw 14 May 17 - 06:20 AM
Teribus 14 May 17 - 06:49 AM
Jim Carroll 14 May 17 - 07:21 AM
Jim Carroll 14 May 17 - 07:47 AM
bobad 14 May 17 - 08:32 AM
Steve Shaw 14 May 17 - 09:07 AM
Jim Carroll 14 May 17 - 09:12 AM
bobad 14 May 17 - 09:18 AM
Teribus 14 May 17 - 10:41 AM
Jim Carroll 14 May 17 - 11:12 AM
bobad 14 May 17 - 11:29 AM
Steve Shaw 14 May 17 - 11:37 AM
Jim Carroll 14 May 17 - 11:44 AM
Keith A of Hertford 14 May 17 - 11:45 AM
Steve Shaw 14 May 17 - 12:03 PM
Steve Shaw 14 May 17 - 12:04 PM
Teribus 14 May 17 - 12:40 PM
bobad 14 May 17 - 01:06 PM
Jim Carroll 14 May 17 - 01:35 PM
Teribus 14 May 17 - 01:46 PM
Jim Carroll 14 May 17 - 02:20 PM
Jim Carroll 14 May 17 - 02:27 PM
Jim Carroll 14 May 17 - 02:54 PM
Teribus 14 May 17 - 03:03 PM
bobad 14 May 17 - 03:32 PM
Teribus 14 May 17 - 03:50 PM
Steve Shaw 14 May 17 - 05:42 PM
bobad 14 May 17 - 08:08 PM
Steve Shaw 14 May 17 - 09:05 PM
Jim Carroll 15 May 17 - 02:42 AM
Teribus 15 May 17 - 03:02 AM
Jim Carroll 15 May 17 - 04:16 AM
Steve Shaw 15 May 17 - 05:08 AM
Jim Carroll 15 May 17 - 06:43 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 May 17 - 07:40 AM
Steve Shaw 15 May 17 - 07:47 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 May 17 - 07:53 AM
bobad 15 May 17 - 07:54 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 May 17 - 07:54 AM
Steve Shaw 15 May 17 - 08:33 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 May 17 - 08:38 AM
bobad 15 May 17 - 08:41 AM
bobad 15 May 17 - 08:47 AM
bobad 15 May 17 - 09:03 AM
bobad 15 May 17 - 09:06 AM
Steve Shaw 15 May 17 - 09:53 AM
bobad 15 May 17 - 10:12 AM
Steve Shaw 15 May 17 - 10:48 AM
Teribus 15 May 17 - 11:16 AM
Greg F. 15 May 17 - 11:25 AM
bobad 15 May 17 - 11:38 AM
bobad 15 May 17 - 12:11 PM
Greg F. 15 May 17 - 12:23 PM
Steve Shaw 15 May 17 - 12:36 PM
Steve Shaw 15 May 17 - 12:44 PM
Keith A of Hertford 15 May 17 - 12:53 PM
Steve Shaw 15 May 17 - 01:56 PM
Teribus 16 May 17 - 02:24 AM
Steve Shaw 16 May 17 - 04:50 AM
Teribus 16 May 17 - 05:30 AM
Steve Shaw 16 May 17 - 06:26 AM
Teribus 16 May 17 - 12:35 PM
bobad 16 May 17 - 07:12 PM
Keith A of Hertford 17 May 17 - 05:00 AM
Keith A of Hertford 17 May 17 - 05:18 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 May 17 - 05:09 AM
bobad 18 May 17 - 07:59 AM
Steve Shaw 18 May 17 - 09:18 AM
bobad 18 May 17 - 10:25 AM
Steve Shaw 18 May 17 - 10:35 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 May 17 - 01:24 PM
Keith A of Hertford 18 May 17 - 01:25 PM
Steve Shaw 18 May 17 - 06:55 PM
bobad 18 May 17 - 07:43 PM
Steve Shaw 18 May 17 - 08:18 PM
bobad 18 May 17 - 08:50 PM
Steve Shaw 18 May 17 - 09:04 PM
Teribus 19 May 17 - 02:56 AM
Steve Shaw 19 May 17 - 04:17 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 May 17 - 05:22 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 May 17 - 05:30 AM
Steve Shaw 19 May 17 - 06:22 AM
Teribus 19 May 17 - 07:04 AM
bobad 19 May 17 - 07:09 AM
Steve Shaw 19 May 17 - 07:13 AM
Steve Shaw 19 May 17 - 07:22 AM
Teribus 19 May 17 - 07:43 AM
bobad 19 May 17 - 07:49 AM
Steve Shaw 19 May 17 - 08:02 AM
bobad 19 May 17 - 08:16 AM
Steve Shaw 19 May 17 - 08:21 AM
bobad 19 May 17 - 08:24 AM
Steve Shaw 19 May 17 - 08:42 AM
bobad 19 May 17 - 08:45 AM
Teribus 19 May 17 - 11:12 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 May 17 - 01:12 PM
Teribus 19 May 17 - 01:19 PM
Keith A of Hertford 19 May 17 - 01:34 PM
Steve Shaw 19 May 17 - 03:56 PM
Steve Shaw 19 May 17 - 04:04 PM
bobad 19 May 17 - 04:54 PM
Steve Shaw 19 May 17 - 05:24 PM
Steve Shaw 19 May 17 - 07:45 PM
Jim Carroll 19 May 17 - 07:46 PM
Steve Shaw 19 May 17 - 07:52 PM
Greg F. 19 May 17 - 08:06 PM
Teribus 20 May 17 - 01:44 AM
Keith A of Hertford 20 May 17 - 04:49 AM
Jim Carroll 20 May 17 - 08:14 AM
bobad 20 May 17 - 08:37 AM
Jim Carroll 20 May 17 - 09:38 AM
Keith A of Hertford 20 May 17 - 10:08 AM
Keith A of Hertford 20 May 17 - 10:45 AM
Teribus 20 May 17 - 10:59 AM
bobad 20 May 17 - 10:59 AM
bobad 20 May 17 - 11:25 AM
Jim Carroll 20 May 17 - 11:28 AM
Jim Carroll 20 May 17 - 11:46 AM
Teribus 20 May 17 - 12:02 PM
Keith A of Hertford 20 May 17 - 12:15 PM
Jim Carroll 20 May 17 - 12:50 PM
Keith A of Hertford 20 May 17 - 02:41 PM
Jim Carroll 20 May 17 - 08:16 PM
Keith A of Hertford 21 May 17 - 10:55 AM
Jim Carroll 21 May 17 - 11:31 AM
Keith A of Hertford 21 May 17 - 01:22 PM
Teribus 22 May 17 - 01:43 AM
Jim Carroll 22 May 17 - 03:11 AM
Keith A of Hertford 22 May 17 - 04:04 AM
The Sandman 22 May 17 - 06:36 AM
Keith A of Hertford 22 May 17 - 06:57 AM
Teribus 22 May 17 - 07:06 AM
The Sandman 22 May 17 - 08:05 AM
Jim Carroll 22 May 17 - 11:11 AM
Jim Carroll 22 May 17 - 11:36 AM
Jim Carroll 22 May 17 - 12:48 PM
Keith A of Hertford 23 May 17 - 05:08 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 May 17 - 05:28 AM
Steve Shaw 23 May 17 - 05:49 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 May 17 - 06:01 AM
Jim Carroll 23 May 17 - 06:02 AM
Steve Shaw 23 May 17 - 06:24 AM
bobad 23 May 17 - 06:31 AM
Steve Shaw 23 May 17 - 06:52 AM
Jim Carroll 23 May 17 - 06:59 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 May 17 - 07:06 AM
bobad 23 May 17 - 08:03 AM
Steve Shaw 23 May 17 - 08:25 AM
Jim Carroll 23 May 17 - 09:30 AM
Jim Carroll 23 May 17 - 10:27 AM
Jim Carroll 23 May 17 - 10:30 AM
Keith A of Hertford 23 May 17 - 12:08 PM
Jim Carroll 23 May 17 - 01:06 PM
Jim Carroll 23 May 17 - 01:42 PM
Keith A of Hertford 24 May 17 - 04:36 AM
Jim Carroll 24 May 17 - 05:00 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 May 17 - 06:09 AM
Jim Carroll 24 May 17 - 11:18 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 May 17 - 02:32 PM
Jim Carroll 25 May 17 - 04:14 AM
Jim Carroll 25 May 17 - 05:21 AM
Keith A of Hertford 25 May 17 - 12:26 PM
Jim Carroll 25 May 17 - 01:25 PM
Keith A of Hertford 25 May 17 - 02:28 PM
Jim Carroll 25 May 17 - 03:17 PM
Keith A of Hertford 26 May 17 - 04:29 AM
Jim Carroll 26 May 17 - 06:35 AM
Keith A of Hertford 26 May 17 - 10:31 AM
Jim Carroll 26 May 17 - 11:22 AM
Jim Carroll 26 May 17 - 01:13 PM
Keith A of Hertford 26 May 17 - 01:41 PM
Jim Carroll 26 May 17 - 03:02 PM
Keith A of Hertford 27 May 17 - 05:42 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 May 17 - 04:35 AM
akenaton 28 May 17 - 11:12 AM
Raggytash 28 May 17 - 12:24 PM
Steve Shaw 28 May 17 - 03:13 PM
DMcG 29 May 17 - 04:06 AM
MikeL2 29 May 17 - 02:59 PM
Dave the Gnome 30 May 17 - 06:03 AM
Keith A of Hertford 30 May 17 - 06:08 AM
Dave the Gnome 30 May 17 - 06:30 AM
Steve Shaw 30 May 17 - 06:44 AM
MikeL2 30 May 17 - 06:58 AM
Steve Shaw 30 May 17 - 07:07 AM
Dave the Gnome 30 May 17 - 07:41 AM
Iains 30 May 17 - 07:46 AM
DMcG 30 May 17 - 08:28 AM
Keith A of Hertford 30 May 17 - 08:33 AM
Steve Shaw 30 May 17 - 08:45 AM
Steve Shaw 30 May 17 - 08:46 AM
Dave the Gnome 30 May 17 - 09:31 AM
Keith A of Hertford 30 May 17 - 12:03 PM
akenaton 30 May 17 - 03:44 PM
Steve Shaw 30 May 17 - 04:14 PM
Dave the Gnome 30 May 17 - 05:10 PM
DMcG 30 May 17 - 05:31 PM
Teribus 31 May 17 - 02:04 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 May 17 - 02:53 AM
Teribus 31 May 17 - 03:39 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 May 17 - 04:12 AM
Keith A of Hertford 31 May 17 - 04:26 AM
Keith A of Hertford 31 May 17 - 04:41 AM
Iains 31 May 17 - 04:43 AM
Steve Shaw 31 May 17 - 04:51 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 May 17 - 05:11 AM
DMcG 31 May 17 - 06:07 AM
Keith A of Hertford 31 May 17 - 06:18 AM
DMcG 31 May 17 - 06:38 AM
Keith A of Hertford 31 May 17 - 06:42 AM
Keith A of Hertford 31 May 17 - 06:45 AM
Steve Shaw 31 May 17 - 07:22 AM
DMcG 31 May 17 - 07:22 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 May 17 - 10:46 AM
akenaton 31 May 17 - 11:33 AM
Keith A of Hertford 31 May 17 - 12:39 PM
Keith A of Hertford 31 May 17 - 12:46 PM
DMcG 31 May 17 - 12:50 PM
Dave the Gnome 31 May 17 - 01:02 PM
Greg F. 31 May 17 - 01:48 PM
akenaton 31 May 17 - 04:24 PM
Keith A of Hertford 01 Jun 17 - 03:12 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Jun 17 - 05:10 AM
Steve Shaw 01 Jun 17 - 06:19 AM
Keith A of Hertford 01 Jun 17 - 06:39 AM
Steve Shaw 01 Jun 17 - 08:06 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Jun 17 - 10:20 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Jun 17 - 10:29 AM
Greg F. 01 Jun 17 - 10:59 AM
Keith A of Hertford 01 Jun 17 - 11:40 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Jun 17 - 11:48 AM
Keith A of Hertford 01 Jun 17 - 11:50 AM
Keith A of Hertford 01 Jun 17 - 11:53 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Jun 17 - 12:05 PM
Steve Shaw 01 Jun 17 - 12:19 PM
Keith A of Hertford 01 Jun 17 - 02:21 PM
Steve Shaw 01 Jun 17 - 05:09 PM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Jun 17 - 04:27 AM
bobad 02 Jun 17 - 08:14 AM
bobad 02 Jun 17 - 08:21 AM
Steve Shaw 02 Jun 17 - 08:36 AM
bobad 02 Jun 17 - 09:01 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Jun 17 - 09:53 AM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Jun 17 - 10:58 AM
Keith A of Hertford 02 Jun 17 - 11:02 AM
Raggytash 02 Jun 17 - 11:55 AM
Greg F. 02 Jun 17 - 12:06 PM
Steve Shaw 02 Jun 17 - 01:37 PM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Jun 17 - 04:25 AM
Dave the Gnome 03 Jun 17 - 05:23 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Jun 17 - 08:32 AM
Keith A of Hertford 03 Jun 17 - 02:01 PM
bobad 03 Jun 17 - 02:23 PM
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Subject: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 06:24 AM

Joe said it is OK to continue if we stick to the subject.
Please do not try to make this another Israel thread, which some here simply can not discuss rationally.

Jim, following Steve's dismissal of The Community Security Trust (CST) report widely reported in the media, you posted a lot of stuff about the Labour Deputy Leader.
Why?

Do you also dismiss the report Jim?
Watson was elected Deputy Leader by the membership. Why should anyone care what you think of him?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 06:38 AM

Tom Watson has been involved in opposing BDS - the Israeli link to accusations of antisemitism in The Labour part has been well established.
The accusations first appeared when Corbyn announced his intention to support BDS
They died down and then re-appeared when a delegation led by Tom Watson visited Israel.
They died down again and have now resurfaced, prompted by Tom Watson, as Israel has gone viral on expanding illegal settlements on Palestinian owned land - a coincidence too far.
Until someone produces firm evidence of the type of "antisemitism" Labour is supposed to be involved in and how many people are involved in attacking The Jewish People, these are no more than unfounded allegations by pro-Israeli opponents of BDS and right wing political opponents of Jeremy Corbyn's leadership - they have no foundation whatever.
The fact that Israel regards all criticism of their policy as antisemitic is a clear indicartion of what Labour "antisemitism" is - criticism of the Isreali regime
No definition of the term includes that
Produce your examples of antisemitism and you may have an argument - until you do, you haven't
Why should anybody care about Tom Watson's report if it has no foundation in actual fact?
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 06:45 AM

You are seriously out of order with your obsessive dredging-up of this, Keith. And I can't believe that you think we won't see through your disingenuousness in trying to insist that we shouldn't make this another "Israel thread." That is precisely what you want and precisely what we don't need all over again. You are a very tiresome man. Remember when you went off on your holiday with your parting shot that you wouldn't be taking any of this shit with you?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 07:17 AM

Incidentally, I did not "dismiss" the report. I dismissed your gnawing away at this well-sucked old bone.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 07:52 AM

to be honest there are more areas of concern than Tom Watson and Israel in the Labour Party.

In many ways one senses it must be a pleasing distraction for those who will not address the problem of how the hell we are going to get elected in the forseeable future.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 08:19 AM

"to be honest there are more areas of concern than Tom Watson and Israel in the Labour Party."
Not really Al
Interference in the affairs of a major political party by a right-wing foreign power is as concern-making as it gets.
If Corbyn is not allowed to live up to his promises it doesn't matter two monkeys whether Labour attains power or not - who wants another Blair or Kinnock.... or any of the quislings who have sold out Labour Party principles down the decades?
If a Socialist Labour Government is not possible, a principled and articulate opposition is infinitely preferable to more of the same.
Put the right back into leadership and once they get their feet under the Parliamentary table, you'll never shift them.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 08:57 AM

'If a Socialist Labour Government is not possible, a principled and articulate opposition is infinitely preferable to more of the same.'

well that's where we disagree. England is a very conservative country. Alot of people voted for a character like Thatcher. Foot, Corbyn and even the much despised Kinnock - their perception by the broad mass of society is that they too left wing.

The Labour Party - even in the hands of flawed individuals has done wondrous things for ordinary people. mobility Allowance, The Open University, minimum wage - things that the tories would never think of.

Fuck principled opposition the people need protecting from the Thatchers of this world. And that means compromises and the tricky business of acquiring power.

If I have a vision of why Labour must be in power - its seeing that bastard Botmmley making up a Gilbert and Sullivan parody sneering at those of of us who spend our lives looking after a disabled partner to a cheering tory conference. They are arseholes, and I don't want them in power.

Yes i would like a more extreme left wing government, but given the disposition of the English people -its not going to happen. A right wing Labour party admisitration is all that is achievable.

And thanks to the dicking about of those who keeping whining about Blairite scum. Even that is looking like a remote possibility.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 09:00 AM

"Anti-Semitic incidents within the Labour party contributed to a record rise in attacks on Jews in the UK last year, a charity report has found."
Totally unsubstantiated - there has been no evidence put forward and no research carried out to suggest that alleged antisemitism in the Labour Party has been the cause of any attacks
It is quite likely that any increase in antisemitism has been caused by those who have linked Israeli policy with The Jewish People - the main culprits being the Israeli regime themselves who have described criticism of its behaviour as "antisemitic"
There is as much evidence to suggest the behaviour of Labour Party has caused attacks on Jews as there is of there being a serious problem with antisemitism - none whatever, and there never will be until that anti-Semitism is defined and enumerated.
"So tell us all Shaw, what is your take on this report that you do not dismiss? "
Why not point out the evidence that the Labour party has had anything to do with attacks on Jews - such serious allegations need substantiation - so far we have only more of the same.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 09:16 AM

How is it possible to discuss this without reference to Israel when the premise of this thread refers to a report on antisemitism?

Also please note that the original Labour party discussion thread was started with no reference to Israel or antisemitism at all

Subject: BS: Labour party discussion
From: McGrath of Harlow - PM
Date: 13 Aug 16 - 01:50 PM

Since the thread about 'Whither the Labour Party" has drifted far from home and turned into a rather unpleasant series of skirmishes about matters of peripheral relevance, I thought I'd start up one where we could talk about the current hurly burly. Preferably without getting into slanging matches. But that might be too much to ask. Coherent and even-tempered slanging matches, at least?
..............................

The latest court finding would apear to mean that the NEC could perfectly properly retrospectively bar from voting everyone who has joined the party after any date it chooses to name. Strange.

One thing that strikes me is that the manoeuvre by which recent members were barred from voting - waitng enough of those who would have opposed it has left the room before tabling the motion - was just the kid of "Trotskyite" ploy that Militant were always being accused of. I rather suspect that all those kind of tricks were very much part of theculture of Labour (and other parties) since they were founded.


So to call this thread part 2 of that one does not make much sense.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 09:25 AM

It is interesting to read through the various accounts of this report, including those in the Jewish Press.
Nowhere is it suggested that Labour is the cause and increase in these attacks, in fact The Jewish Press quotes a suggestion that British populism leading up to and following Brexit are responsible.
The suggestion that Labour is in anyway responsible comes from Tom Watson and his anti-BDS stance has been long established - back to the Israeli regime again - another coincidence maybe?
As Sherlock Holmes once said - "the Universe would not be so clumsy"
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 09:47 AM

As this and the previous thread have continued without agreement for more than 550 days and almost 2000 individual posts it seem reasonable to assume that agreement will never be reached by the various parties.

Perhaps it is time for all parties to hang up the keyboard.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 09:48 AM

all my computer says is

'RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II'


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 10:31 AM

Regarding what the report actually says, this is the only mention The Labour Party gets in its actual wording.

"These factors included the conflict in Gaza and Israel in summer 2014; terrorist attacks on Jewish communities in France and Denmark in 2015, and other terrorism in Europe; and in 2016, high profile allegations of antisemitism in the Labour Party; a perceived increase in racism and xenophobia following the EU referendum, including an increase in recorded racial and religious hate crime; and regular, high-profile discussion of antisemitism, racism and hate crime in mainstream media, politics and on social media during the year."

The other causes that were actually suggested were The Gaza Conflict, Terrorist attacks in France, Denmark, and elsewhere, an increase following THE BREXIT REFERENDUM and media discussion of hate crimes - all carefully avoided in his crusade to show that it was Labour wot dun it!!
Labour involvement remains unsubstantiated accusations by anti BDS groups and anti Corbynites, prepared to use any mud to have him removed.
Using this report as evidence of Labour party antisemitism is a desperate attempt to denigrate it - utter and complete agenda-driven nonsense.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 11:05 AM

Something else carefully omitted by our OP was included in the report - I wonder why?
This deathless piece of prose on a hand-written leaflet headed and footed by Swastikas was delivered to a charity shop in November.

BREXIT - TRUMP - The final solution
Fuck you kikes, dykes, fags and Niggers
You are all going to the Oven!


Perhaps Mr T and Keith would like to remind us where they stand on Brexit and Trump!!
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 11:24 AM

Well, let's see. Reported antisemitic incidents went up considerably last year. So Keith, rabidly anti-Labour, finds a report in the Telegraph, rabidly anti-Labour, and they connive in shamelessy applying that well-known logical fallacy, post hoc ergo proper hoc, to the findings, namely that the attacks are the result of the "antisemitism crisis" in Labour. I notice Keith didn't choose the BBC report instead, which makes a brief, passing reference only to Labour. Oh no, that wouldn't do because it didn't fit Keith's Labour-smearing mission. Neither did he want to quote Jenny Tonge's sharp criticism of the CST, who accused it, rightly in my view, of displaying a perpetual victim mentality and of failing to help real decent Jewish people.

Neither Keith, the Telegraph nor I know why the reported incidence of attacks went up last year, but I should like to put up a few ideas for consideration:

1. If you fish for reports of attacks you'll get more reports.

2. The self-same right-wing media that appeals most to xenophobes, racists and bigots had been obsessed with antisemitism talk for months in their attempt to smear Labour as much as possible.

3. Global terrorism has fuelled anti-Muslim sentiment, which has a polarising effect on communities such as those in north Manchester and London where large populations of Jews and Muslims are found side by side.

4. The long runup to the referendum was replete with anti-foreigner sentiment which was strengthened by lies about the adverse effects outsiders have on the British way of life, "taking us over" sort of thing. Seems to fit very nicely with the abhorrent conspiracy theories about how Jews are taking over...

5. The continuing actions of the Israeli regime in discriminating against Palestinians and stealing land for illegal settlements whips up anti-Jewish sentiment.

Now I don't know to what extent, if any, those or other factors may have contributed to increased reports of attacks. But here's the crux: neither does Keith, neither does Teribus, neither does the CST and neither does the Telegraph. So to focus on the issue within Labour implying that you've found the cause is dishonest and unscientific. By the way, my little list is in no way intended to imply excuses or justification for these attacks. I shouldn't have to say that, but you never know who's waiting to pounce on you round here, as we found yesterday.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 11:37 AM

Teribus/Keith/Bobad - If we accept as given that we all understand how "divide and rule" works,
and which ideological sectors of UK society would most probably succeed in winning from it..

Then you 3, as persistent and obsessed as you are, are mere infinitesimal minor players / disrupters
within the confines of a folk forum of such little consequence
that the wasted time & effort you put into trying to annoy 'us' lefty liberals is just laughable.... 🙄


..as you can probably guess, i've hit a tedium threshold doing houshold chores
and had a quick look here in mudcat..


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 12:13 PM

I've just been doing that as well. Bloody wind blew coal ash all over me as I was emptying the fire just now. 😡Left the hoovering for Mrs Steve - team work. 😉Just off into the kitchen to assemble my ingredients for the whore's spaghetti we're having for tea and I've just found a £7.99 magnum of Lidl's Nero d'Avola I didn't know I had. 😜


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 12:24 PM

You've had a summary of the report Keith highlighted, you either cross-posted or or decided to pass it off as a "load of made-up shit"
Doesn't matter really - the report says what it says and Brexit features large in it - Labour does not
Keith used it to attack Labour - Heaven forfend that you two should fall out
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 12:40 PM

Steve,
"unbelievable!" was my response to Keith having the brass neck to reopen this shagged-out topic,

It was back in the news Steve.
It was on the BBC R4 Today Programme yesterday morning, on the BBC site, Sky News, Evening Standard and in the Telegraph, so not widely considered to be "unbelievable."
A serious report suggesting that Labour anti-Semitism contributed to a rise in anti-Semitic attacks.
Of course that merited a mention in a thread for discussing the party, especially when endorsed by the Deputy Leader!

Jim, again you post loads of stuff about Watson without telling us how it is relevant!

Dave, of course we can discuss the Labour Party, including its anti-Semitism, without needing to bring Israel into it!
Israel seems to be an obsession with some people.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 12:44 PM

Jim, I know other contributory factors were suggested for the rise in anti-Semitic attacks, but Labour's anti-Semitism was up there and that makes it relevant to any current discussion about Labour.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 12:54 PM

Dave, of course we can discuss the Labour Party, including its anti-Semitism, without needing to bring Israel into it!

How much do you want to bet that it can't happen here?

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 12:56 PM

Yes Dave, but Joe has given the gypsies' warning to keep to the subject and he might enforce it with deletions.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 01:02 PM

Now listen up for once, cloth-ears. I shall say this only twenty more times (my calculation as to how many times I'll have to say it before it finally sinks into whatever pile of poo passes for your brainbox). "Unbelievable" referred to you dredging this tired old rubbish up yet again. It most emphatically did NOT refer to any column, item, newsflash, bulletin, anecdote, report, op-ed, programme, or anything else. It really was all about you, Keith. As most things you "discuss" are all about you anyway, I thought you'd be delighted. And it really is only about the Labour Party in the most tangential way anyway, isn't it? Oops, sorry, except in the minds of the Daily Torygraph and your good self, of course, and whatever ragbag collection of other anti-Labour pro-Israeli regime obsessives you can muster. Now toddle off and go and pester someone else. Sorry, Jim, I don't mean you.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 01:27 PM

As new and relevant news items come up, of course it is right and proper that old threads are revived.

The report was not specifically about anti-Semitism it dealt with the increase in reported "Hate Crime" in 2016 and it highlighted various causes. It mentioned that anti-Semitic hate crimes accounted for one-third of all hate crimes reported and again IIRC that was the largest single category. The main identifiable reason given for the increase in 2016 was the apparent lack of concern about "high profile allegations of anti-semitism in the Labour Party"


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 01:28 PM

"but Labour's anti-Semitism was up there and that makes it relevant to any current discussion about Labour."
No it wasn't Keith - accusations of Labour was up there - no suggestion that the accusations were ever substantiated and certainly no suggestion that Labour antisemitism was in any way a contributory factor to the rise in antisemitism
It is yet another attempt by you to denigrate Labour and, as with all the others it has bounced up and smacked you in the nose.
You know as well as I do that if any substance o the accusations against Labour had in any way featured in the rise of antisemitism it would have featured large in the report.
"Jim, again you post loads of stuff about Watson without telling us how it is relevant!"
Please don't start this again Keith - you put up this reort to denigrate Labout - the only person in the report who makes accusations against Labour is Watson - Watson is Israel's poodle and he almost certainly was the cause of the accusation reaching the proportions it did.
Please do not suggest again that I have not explained why information on Watson is relevant.
The fact that he appeared in your carefully edited piece about the report make any information we have on him relevant to this discussion - you introduced him - not me, and you have used him for a large part of this argument   
He is a right wing, anti Corbynite mouthpiece of the Israeli regime and his dishonest behaviour in Parliament makes him an extremely unreliable source of information - a greedy career politician .
We can safely assume that, although they both feature the report RAISED BY YOU neither Trump not Brexit are going to be responded to by you.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 01:50 PM

"The main identifiable reason given for the increase in 2016 was the apparent lack of concern about "high profile allegations of anti-semitism in the Labour Party"

And who identified this "reason?" Where's the evidence that the allegations led to the increase? There IS no evidence, is there? It's just a supposition to fit the agenda of anti-Labour obsessives. If you have evidence for a link, let's be having it. Both Jim and I have given you plenty of other potential factors that may plausibly be involved. We can't prove any of those either and we haven't tried to. But I'm damn sure you can't prove this one. I suggest that you contemplate whether the distrust of The Other whipped up by the likes of your hero Farage might just have a little to do with it. Can't prove that either but it isn't too easy to dismiss, is it? Dare say you'll try...


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 02:33 PM

One of the nastiest cases of shooting oneself in the foot I've ever come across
If there had been antisemitism in the Labour party, it would have been described as just that instead it was "allegations"
It would have featured largely in the report as "figures of authority committing acts of antisemitism" instead of allegations.
It does implicate the racist attacks as a result of Brexit, which put's the OPer and his mate, both Brexiters, in a position of having to respond to or (more likely) ignore that Brexit is partially responsible for the rise in antisemitism
The report also includes the Fascist leaflet implicating Trumpists
Oh dear!!
Nurse - the screens, the screens!!
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 03:50 PM

The continuing actions of the Israeli regime in discriminating against Palestinians and stealing land for illegal settlements

Which, of course they don't do - it is their land and they have every right to build and live on it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 05:26 PM

Why, of course! 😂😂😂


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 03 Feb 17 - 06:48 PM

Truth is elusive to those who refuse to see with both eyes but I see you're coming around 😂😂😂


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 02:54 AM

"And who identified this "reason?" Where's the evidence that the allegations led to the increase? There IS no evidence, is there? It's just a supposition to fit the agenda of anti-Labour obsessives." - Steve Shaw

How about OULC, Baroness Royall, Labour's NEC, The Community Security Trust, UCL. Strange that the vast majority of these "anti-Labour obsessives" all happen to be members of the Labour Party innit Steve?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 03:32 AM

£Where's the evidence that the allegations led to the increase"
THere is no evidence - only unfounded accusations.
The report refers only to "allegations" - no evidence
Allegations are not evidence in any civilised court.
These allegations have been generated by a foreign power and taken up by the right wing of he Labour Party who are opposed to Corbyn's leadership - not the slightest bit "strange"
There is evidence that Brexit is part of the rise of antisemitism - that''s cited in the report, but any evidence that points to the "wrong" conclusion is not worthy of discussion to some people.
It's a fairly safe bet that Trump's Trumpeters will add to the problem, but of course, that won't be worth considering either
The greatest threat to the Jewish People today comes from those who implicate them in the crimes of the Israeli regime - as those crimes continue unchecked, the threat will become a reality.
That's not worth discussing either.
Much of this is covered by Keith's repoort - no longer worth discussing either - a definite backfire
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 05:08 AM

Steve,
"Unbelievable" referred to you dredging this tired old rubbish up yet again.

Yes, you said that, but I did not dredge anything up. I referred to a breaking news story relevant to the discussion, so what is so unbelievable?

And it really is only about the Labour Party in the most tangential way anyway, isn't it? Oops, sorry, except in the minds of the Daily Torygraph and your good self, of course, and whatever ragbag collection of other anti-Labour pro-Israeli regime obsessives you can muster

The membership elected Deputy Leader of The Labour Party said it was about the Labour Party. Which of those categories does he fit Steve?

Jim,
It is yet another attempt by you to denigrate Labour

It was a prominent news story Jim. I had nothing to do with the conclusions of that report. You are just shooting the messenger.

Keith - you put up this reort to denigrate Labout -

I did not put it up. BBC R4, BBC News and various publications did.

the only person in the report who makes accusations against Labour is Watson

Watson was not involved in the report!

- Watson is Israel's poodle and he almost certainly was the cause of the accusation reaching the proportions it did.

Please clarify this statement Jim.
You seem to be claiming that Labour's Deputy Leader lies against his Party in the service of Israel.
Is that what you really believe Jim?

He is a right wing, anti Corbynite mouthpiece of the Israeli regime

You really do believe that Labour's Deputy Leader lies against his Party in the service of Israel!!!!

We can safely assume that, although they both feature the report RAISED BY YOU neither Trump not Brexit are going to be responded to by you.

I did respond.

The report refers only to "allegations" - no evidence

Yes. It cites them as a contributing to the sharp rise in anti-Semitic attacks.

If the Labour leadership says that anti-Semitism is a serious problem for Labour, your denial of it is worthless Jim.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 05:23 AM

I invite you to peruse the thread slightly more carefully, Teribus, in order to find out why you have completely misinterpreted what I've been saying about cause and effect. You either did it on purpose or you're not very bright. The floor is yours.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 05:26 AM

If that isn't dredging up tired old arguments, Keith, well I'm the Queen of Sheba.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 05:32 AM

Steve,
You either did it on purpose or you're not very bright.

Third alternative, you are not very good at explaining what you mean.
Good example, your one word post "unbelievable."

If that isn't dredging up tired old arguments, Keith, well I'm the Queen of Sheba.

It is not, Your Majesty.
It is adding discussion of a highly relevant breaking news story to the original debate.

If you are tired of it, why do you keep trying to join in?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 06:02 AM

Well then Jim apply your self same arguments to you claiming that the Brexit campaign and vote resulted in an increase in "hate crime".

The CST commented on the increase in the number of hate crimes reported in 2016 and the fact that one third of them were anti-Semitic attacks. The CST identified the possible reasons for the increase.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 06:58 AM

"It was a prominent news story Jim"
Which had nothing to do with Labour and nothing to do with the title of this thread - which you chose.
"I did not put it up. BBC R4, BBC News and various publications did."
You put the report up as an attack on Labour - it was nothing of the sort - all your own work again
"Watson was not involved in the report!"
Watson's comment was included and he has been a part of accusing Labour of antisemitism on the part of his Israeli mates.
"You really do believe that Labour's Deputy Leader lies against his Party in the service of Israel!!!"
Do I believe politicians lie - tough one that - you're going to have to help me out there
Your "in the services of Israel" distorts what I say - deliberately, no doubt.
He is against BDS - true or false, he is a supporter of the Israeli regime - true or false?
He has helped revive attacks on the Labour Party on at least two occasions after visits to Israel - true or false?
This is an example of your gargantuan effort to denigrate the Labour party by smearing them with charges of antisemitism - true or false?
You have never produced a shred of evidence - true or false?
You have not responded to the Brexit link to antisemitism
The report implicates Brexit in the rise of Antisemitism in Britian - DO YOU AGREE WITH IT?
By including that Nazi poster, it also implicates Trump's victory in that rise - DO YOU AGREE WITH IT?
A simple yes or no will do in either case
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 07:20 AM

Well we can all come up with "possible reasons," can't we. But, Teribus, "possible reasons" are not proven causes. You've been given plenty of "possible reasons" for the perceived increase in hate crimes by me and Jim. But you and Keith are obsessed with just one "possible reason," and you seem to wish to eliminate from consideration all the other "possible reasons" and you are trying to erase the word "possible." In my view, the most plausible major reason for any increase in hate crime directed at ethnic minorities last year is the anti-foreigner talk that dominated the referendum campaign for months. I can't prove that but you can't dismiss it either. I do understand that that won't sit well with you and Keith as you both doughtily and unstintingly supported the main anti-foreigner racist, Nigel Farage, but that's your problem, and trying to shift all the blame on to the Labour Party is just blinkered.

And do give it a rest, Keith.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 08:05 AM

"Well then Jim apply your self same arguments to you claiming...."
Apart from your infantile use of a continuing use of a typo (seems to be yor comfort blanket) - can we drop the "my claiming" - I "claim" nothing - I put up the findings of the report
Your mate's report links Brexit and Trump with the rise in antisemitism, not me.
You are obviously not going to respond and I doubt if he will, but you, like he, were quick to defend the findings of this report until its implications were pointed out to you.
Of course Brexit was an issue - within days of the announcement racist incidents has rocketed ant there were reports of non-British residents being approached and asked when they were "going home" on the same day.
Trump's racist agenda and his inclusion of an antisemite on his staff is guaranteed to have the same effect.
The persistent practice of the Israeli regime with have the effect of targeting the Jewish People in the same manner, and the fact that he has drawn his support from groups like The Klan and The Tea Party are going to make the U.S. a hotbed of antisemitism, racism and cultural intolerance.
Good days ahead.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 08:14 AM

Sorry - should be two separate sentences
" The fact that Trump has drawn his support from groups like The Klan and The Tea Party are going to make the U.S. a hotbed of antisemitism, racism and cultural intolerance.

The persistent practice of the Israeli regime with have the effect of targeting the Jewish People in the same manner,
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 09:12 AM

Jim,
Do I believe politicians lie - tough one that - you're going to have to help me out there

Not what I asked Jim.
I asked if YOU believe that THIS politician lies against his OWN PARTY on behalf of the government of Israel.
The two quotes make it very clear that you do, but it is so bizarre that you should clarify your position.
Will you Jim, or like Diane Abbott are you ashamed to reveal what you think?
Please do not duck this one.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 09:31 AM

Steve,
Well we can all come up with "possible reasons," can't we. But, Teribus, "possible reasons" are not proven causes.

It was the reputable CST report that concluded that Labour's anti-Semitism probably contributed to the rise in such attacks.
Such a thing is not capable of proof, any more than it can be proved that Brexit contributed to racist attacks, but Jim made a big issue of that!

But you and Keith are obsessed with just one "possible reason,"

No. We acknowledged the other possible reasons but this thread is about Labour.

and you seem to wish to eliminate from consideration all the other "possible reasons"

No. We just highlighted the one that was relevant to this thread.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 10:54 AM

I'm sorry, but, if you wish to continue to try to pin the blame on Labour for the alleged rise in hate crime, then all the other possible reasons are highly-relevant to this thread, and you are not going to dictate to us what we can and can't include. Were it not for you bringing this up as a blame-Labour issue yet again we wouldn't even be discussing those other possible reasons, would we? And your calling the CST "reputable" in order to dignify your claims (do you ever do anything honestly?) is highly debatable. Jenny Tonge didn't think so, and, though I'm no fan of hers, I'd take her opinion over yours any day of the week.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 11:29 AM

Repeat after me...

DON'T
FEED
THE
TROLLS


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 11:47 AM

I agree Backwoodsman, Keith should stop feeding the trolls.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 12:18 PM

"I asked if YOU believe that THIS politician lies against his OWN PARTY on behalf of the government of Israel."
You are loading this question by ignoring every other fact concerning this man
He is a right wing opponent of Corbyn who has demanded he resign - he would certainly bend the truth at acheive that, as would very other right winger
He is a career politician who has been discovered fiddling expenses - he, and every other politician of his ilk would lie in their teeth to preserve his job
He is a member of Friends of Israel and has led two sponsored delegations there - nice work, if that's what turns you on.
He is opposed to BDS and has been cited in the Israeli press for his support for the Regime's cause.
He is a politician - lying is a recognised part of the job description
Of course he would lie if it served his agenda and his personal interests – does the Pope wear a frock?
Corbyn gives all the appearance of being an honest, principled politician – it says what needs to be said your politics when you are prepared to put in so much time and effort to denigrating such a man
Haven't we had enough shitty, dishonest politicians?
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 12:28 PM

"It was the reputable CST report that concluded that Labour's anti-Semitism probably contributed to the rise in such attacks."
No it was not - it never accused Labour of antisemitism - it only said there had been accusations - and that is all there have been
There is no evidence that these accuastions are true and it would underline the entire report if it had suggested there was
The exact wording was "high profile allegations of antisemitism in the Labour Party; "
I ask again
The report accuses both Brexit and Trum of being the cause of the rise in Antisemitism - do you agree with this
PLEASE DO NOT DUCK THIS ONE
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 12:41 PM

Steve,
I'm sorry, but, if you wish to continue to try to pin the blame on Labour for the alleged rise in hate crime

Continue? I never have and never would. Made up shit instead of argument again Steve.

What do you mean " alleged rise in hate crime?"
Are you denying the fact?

Were it not for you bringing this up as a blame-Labour issue yet again

Made up shit instead of argument again Steve.
I did not play any part in the compilation of the report that implicated Labour's anti-Semitism. I just posted about it because it was completely relevant to this discussion.

And your calling the CST "reputable" in order to dignify your claims (do you ever do anything honestly?) is highly debatable.

The police, BBC, Independent and Huff Post regard it as reputable.
No-one except you has defended what Tonge said about them.

Jim,
The report accuses both Brexit and Trum of being the cause of the rise in Antisemitism - do you agree with this
PLEASE DO NOT DUCK THIS ONE


Duck it? I have already acknowledged it, and more than once.
Your wording is wrong though. The report does not "accuse" anything of being the "cause."

There is no evidence that these accuastions are true

Well, the Party leadership have recognised Labour's anti-Semitism problem, so your denial of it is worth nothing.

Now Jim, do you believe that Watson tells lies against his own Party?
If so, what is his motivation?
Please do not duck this yet again!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 01:02 PM

Yes, alleged. I know that the only reason you wish to consider is "Labour's serious antisemitism problem," so in your blinkered state you neglected one of my other potential reasons, which was that you'll get more reports if you fish for them. Alleged means I'm not convinced, though I'm not dismissive, as yiu seem to think. And you seriously gave yourself away apropos of the rest of your denial bullshit when you referred in your post to "Labour's antisemitism problem." Perhaps, if you don't want to be accused of obsessive bias, you should do what I did and consider using the word "alleged."

Can you prove that each of those organisations called the report "reputable?" Can you prove that I'm the only person in the world who agrees with Jenny Tonge? As a matter of fact, the report is nowhere near as supportive of your cause as you seem to think. Nuance in language is not your strong point, as you proved with your Wheatcroft fiasco. Go and have another read. Do take your time.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 01:07 PM

"Duck it? I have already acknowledged it, and more than once."
So you agree with their conclusions - do I have that right?
"Now Jim, do you believe that Watson tells lies against his own Party?
If so, what is his motivation?"
For Christs sake Keith - I've just given it for the third time
Where has the report claimed Labour to be guilty of attisemitism? - you lied
Where is your evidence that evidence exists? - you lied
Where are your examples of antisemitism - you have produced none
Where has the Labout party ever admitted to a serious problem with antisemitism - it never has - you lead
"Continue? I never have and never would. Made up shit instead of argument again Steve."
What the ****s this then
"It was the reputable CST report that concluded that Labour's anti-Semitism probably contributed to the rise in such attacks."
You lied
Why are you7 lying to denigrate a decent leader
You are sa serious piece of work - you need another holiday
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 01:42 PM

THe position remains exactly the same as it was when Keith started all this all those centuries ago
Not one scrap of evidence has come to light that Labour has ever has a problem with antisemitism - serious or otherwise.
No evidence ahs been found, no admissions have been made, no antisemitism has ever been specified to suggest that there is a "serious" problem
We do know that the original accusation came within weeks of Corbyn declaring his support of BDS
The accusations have disappeared twice, only to be revived when right wing "Friends of Israel" returned from sponsored visits there.
No-one has ever described the type of "antisemitism" that is supposed to be coming from The Labour Party and no figures have ever been produced.
Two enquiries have taken place - both found no evidence.
End of story
We also know that last April the Tory Party was accused of Islamophobia by respected leaders of the British Muslim community.
The only response has been to appont Borish Johnson, a racist, Home Secretary
The Tory Prime Minister has now climbed into bed with Arch-racist, Donald Trump who has has his racist policies halted by the American Courts and who ha declared that he will quash any law that makes his racict and unconstitutional policies illegal   
May's bedfellow has also appointed an arch-antisemite onto his staff - a nice three-in-a-bed for Mayflower
Who are the racists in Britain - Labour or Tory - answers on a postcard please
Let's leave keith to stew in his own bile
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 02:38 PM

Steve,
Can you prove that each of those organisations called the report "reputable?"

The media organisations reported the CST report without expressing any reservations or misgivings about the CST.
If they did not consider it reputable, they would report criticisms of it. None did.
Re Police,
BBC, "The CST, which works with police to gather data, said recorded incidents last had increased by 36% on 2015."

The police would not work with an organisation they did not believe to be reputable.
And, that is the source if the stats. that you question.

Can you prove that I'm the only person in the world who agrees with Jenny Tonge?

Not provable. There might be some other nut somewhere, but I can't find one. Can you?

Jim,
So you agree with their conclusions - do I have that right?

Not qualified Jim, but they are a reputable group so they should not be dismissed.

If so, what is his motivation?"
For Christs sake Keith - I've just given it for the third time


You mean his allegiance to Israel? That is why he lies against Labour?

Where is your evidence that evidence exists?

I have shown, with quotes, that the leadership acknowledges the fact.

"It was the reputable CST report that concluded that Labour's anti-Semitism probably contributed to the rise in such attacks."
You lied


No. That is the truth.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 03:25 PM

Backwoodsman's right again lads
PLEASE DON'T FEED THE TROLLS
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 05:38 AM

Of course you can all withdraw from the discussion, but do not blame it on non-existent trolling.
You are just incapable of replying, or of making a case.

I am disappointed Jim that you could not answer the simple, unloaded question, "Do you believe that Watson lies against his Party."
You say as much over and over, but when made to see how ridiculous it is, you scurry off and hide.
At least I have made you rethink some of your delusional beliefs.

Likewise your claim that Watson is "a poodle of" and "a mouthpiece for" the Israeli Government!
No wonder you feel you have to hide!
You have made yourself ridiculous.

BWM, nothing I have said here can be described as trolling.
Just discussing facts.
Sadly they are facts that some people here can not deal with.

Steve, I have answered all your points.
I take it you have nothing else to say either.
Off you go then.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 05:48 AM

CAN SOME HUMANE FORUM FAIRY WHO HAPPENS TO BE IN THE VICINITY PLEASE CLOSE DOWN THIS MINDLESSLY OBSESSIVE ONE-MAN CAMPAIGN - IT REALLY IS THE KINDEST ACTION TO TAKE.
SOMEONE PUT HIM OUT OF ALL OUR MISERIES, PLEASE!!

Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 05:52 AM

DON'T FEED THE TROLLS! YOUR RESPONSES ARE FOOD, DRINK AND OXYGEN TO THEM. DO NOT RESPOND TO THEM!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 06:28 AM

The other thread got closed before you had chance to answer my question, Keith. Probably best that you start another thread to do so though.

Cheers

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 08:02 AM

I'm a troll
You're a troll
Kiss me
And I'll turn into a prince
Suddenly

With apologies to Robert Charlebois.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 09:19 AM

Dave,
Glad you enjoyed it, Keith and that you are back safe and sound. Shame nothing seems to have altered on here :-( Do you not fancy sharing your holiday experiences with us instead of going through all the same old arguments with the same people?

I would be delighted to share my holiday stories, but in PMs.
I get very annoyed when others start talking about such things on a discussion thread, and I doubt I am alone in that.

This was not "the same old arguments " though. It was a new discussion about a brand new report, though it was relevant to the previous discussion.

Jim, do you really believe that Watson tells lies against his own Party for the Israeli government, for which he is a "poodle" and a "mouhpiece?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 09:29 AM

I'll answer that. Watson can't be trusted. He's right-wing old guard in sentiment and hates Corbyn and he's very pro-Israel regime. Now, would you like to hear of my fantastic week in Puglia last June?* Or my sojourn in Siracusa in September? You won't regret it! I can tell you about the best wines and recommend great eateries and gelateria!



*Unfortunately, I was in Puglia during the week England got kicked out the Euros and the UK got kicked out of the EU. The Puglian people I spoke to were devastated by both events. I did vote by post, by the way. I'm not telling you which way.   Mind yer biz!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 09:46 AM

Ah well. One can but try to make the world a better place.

Yes please, Steve. I would love to hear about it. We are off on our sheep shagging weekend in Ribblehead in a couple of weeks. Won't get the Italian sunshine but the tales will be very tellable :-)

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 09:58 AM

Well where shall I start, Dave? Like to hear about our day trip to Alberobello to see the trulli houses that are in all those Grauniad holiday ads? Lovely place! And we saw a wedding there which appeared to be attended by a small contingent of mafiosi (the blokes all seem to dress like that for weddings in Italy, to be fair). By the way, I hope this is annoying almost no-one here! Happy birthday by the way, Dave!


Now where were we...


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 10:04 AM

Hey Dave, I did a two-week field course at Malham Tarn Field Centre in 1970. The sun hardly went in and it almost burnt our arses off. If I ever get skin cancer I'll put it down to that fortnight. Mind you, it was July, not back-end. Are the ewes more receptive at this time of year? Er Dave, it is just ewes I hope...😜


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 10:10 AM

Thank you Steve. I can't see how pleasantries can annoy anyone but as they say in Cleckhuddersfaxwyke, there's nowt so queer as folk.

I think I have related the tale before. The fist debate I attended was at 6th form college (De La Salle, Salford. 1969) I have no idea what the debate was about but it was won by the lad who discovered his opponent had been involved with a young lady rubbing 'Pretty Peach' body lotion on his chest. That type of things happens all over the place, including parliament (pigs heads anyone?) Dunno why some think it should not happen here.

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 10:14 AM

Only ewe can make the world go round

I know I'll never find another ewe

Any more?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 10:16 AM

De La Salle? We played them a cricket in 1968 when I was in the Thornleigh first eleven. They won. We should have had a fist debate instead. We were reet bloody hard, us Thornleigh lads, tha knows...


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 10:21 AM

Hear about the sheep who got sunburned on holiday?


It had gone to the baaaa-hamas...


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 10:23 AM

Trolls!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 11:04 AM

Nah, boobs, this is MUCH nicer than Keith burbling on about "Labour's antisemitism problem!" We've been hearing about that for yonks! Bor-ing! Where did you go on YOUR last holiday? Lemme guess! Mecca??


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 11:14 AM

Troll!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 11:35 AM

It's much better than his usual comments, Steve, and makes about as much sense.

I think he probably went to Trondheim.

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 11:36 AM

Little Sir Echo!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 11:38 AM

I played Cricket for De La Salle in 1968 and was in the debating society all through my years there (1966 to 1972)

However in 1968 I was thirteen and not in the first team.

That year I discovered girls and motorbikes, my interest in cricket and debating subsisded somewhat.

Referring to holidays I visited a cracking bar in Tully Cross, Co Galway last month had a stupendous afternoon singing and playing.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 01:06 PM

That's better.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 01:09 PM

You couldn't discover girls at Thornleigh. Well you could go up to the other end of Bolton to the convent school but there was an impregnable armed guard of nuns awaiting. And non-Catholic girls would have seen us cast into hellfire, so that wasn't an option. I made it though. More about my early life on request. Don't mention The Summer Of Love.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 01:10 PM

Steve,
I'll answer that.

When please. The question was does he lie against his own Party as an Israeli Quisling?

Watson can't be trusted. He's right-wing old guard in sentiment and hates Corbyn and he's very pro-Israel regime.

Why can he not be trusted?
So what if he is on the Right of the Party?
Does he hate Corbyn any more than the rest of the PLP, most of whom have expressed no confidence in him?

Of course he is not pro-Israel regime!
He is of the Left and would have no truck with the current Right wing regime.
His affiliation is with Israel's Labour Party.
Has he ever defended the settlements?
No, and that is why.

You and Jim are just smearing him because he disagrees with you and you have no other answer.

Steve, do you agree with Jim that he lies against his own Party to help Israel?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 01:16 PM

Joe asked us, very politely, to stick to the subject or have the thread closed.
The problem is that you people want debate shut down when it does not go your way.

He could just delete the offending posts, but I fear he is too nice for that.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 01:16 PM

Oh God, Keith, stop trying to go off-topic!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 02:24 PM

By the way, Dave, this has been nagging at me ever since you mentioned it. Was the lad at De La Salle who lost the debate whose girlfriend had rubbed Pretty Peach lotion on his chest...Raggytash??


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 04:02 PM

I dunno, Steve. I came into De la Salle from an oiks Sec Mod - Ambrose Barlow in Swinton. We were not allowed to mix with the royalty who were already there :-( I was right impressed that we were allowed to smoke in the 6th form common rooms though.

Not that this has anything to do with the Labour party of course. But then again neither do most of the other posts on here...

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 04:21 PM

We never played against lowly secondary mods, Dave, and never against any proddydog school. I'm sure you can tell from my general demeanour on this forum that this has helped to maintain my purity of thought and even-handed approach come what may. I'll not be contradicted on that, of course.

Labour? Who?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 04:42 PM

Proddydog school? PRODDYDOG SCHOOL? Who do you think Ambrose Barlow was FFS? His skull is still in the Bishop of Salfords downstairs lavvy or some such place. I am as Catholic as the pope I'll have you know!

BTW - Came across this gem as I was searching for something entirely different. Sorry to be on topic... ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Theresa May's new year message
From: Keith A of Hertford - PM
Date: 11 Jan 17 - 06:45 AM

Dave,

The Labour party cannot be antisemitic. It is not in it's manifesto.


Cheers

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 05:43 PM

You were the lowly sec mod, Dave, not the prods. We had houses in my primary school and I was in Barlow, so I knew he wasn't one of them heathen proddies. Anyway, at least we won't meet any of them in heaven. The priests told us that. Phew!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 03:12 AM

Ahhh - Gotcha. Thanks Steve. I was at Sec Mod until the 5th year then went on to Grammar School for 6th form. Destined to do A level History, Economics and British Constitution and Government at A level as well as some O level resits. But I found it too much like hard work and needed the money anyway as I, like Raggy, had discovered girls in the shape of Mrs Gnome to be. So I left and started a job at Worsley Urban District Council. Who sent me off to do an ONC in Business Studies.

You wouldn't get that under this new Labour party who do nothing but abuse people would you...

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:15 AM

Dave,
What you posted as a "gem" was your own statement.
I just quoted it.

Here it is again with my contribution included this time.

Dave,

The Labour party cannot be antisemitic. It is not in it's manifesto.

Exactly true. It has a serious problem with some of its members, but the party itself can not be said to be anti-Semitic and no-one has suggested it is.

A footballer's contract is different. A manifesto sets out the aims and views of the Party.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:28 AM

I know Keith - You just said it was true. Like someone said at some time or another, there is no need to keep quoting the whole thing when it has already been posted. Can't remember who said it.

In a nutshell though, you do not believe that the Labour party is antisemitic. You do believe that some of the members are. Just like in any other walk of life? Or do you believe that people who support the Labour party are more prone to antisemitism than anyone else?

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:36 AM

As to

Subject: RE: BS: welcome home from holiday Keith A
From: Keith A of Hertford - PM
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:09 AM

...is not the same as a group ganging together to swamp a thread with trivia because they feel they are losing...


I don't feel I am losing anything. In fact I don't recall entering a contest that could be won or lost. Simply an exchange of views like people have sometimes. Do you see this as a contest?

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:39 AM

Or do you believe that people who support the Labour party are more prone to antisemitism than anyone else?

I believe that Labour has a particular problem with anti-Semitism, because the leadership and many prominent members have acknowledged that fact.

Remember the report Labour commissioned into anti-Semistism in the Oxford University Labour Club? We discussed it at some length.

The NEC has just decided not to implement its recommendations.

The Oxford Student,
"The news that the two members of OULC who had been accused of anti-semitic acts have been cleared by the Labour Party's disputes committee was revealed by the Jewish Chronicle last week.
Baroness Royall reacted to the findings with dismay, saying "I am deeply disappointed by the outcome and fear it will further harm relations between the Jewish community and our party by confirming a widely held view that we do not take antisemitism seriously." "

http://oxfordstudent.com/2017/01/30/labour-mps-wade-oulc-anti-semitism-scandal/


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:42 AM


I don't feel I am losing anything.


I am sorry if I got that wrong.
Please explain what is the reason for your group swamping this thread with trivia, even though Joe especially asked us all to keep to the subject


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:51 AM

Please explain what is the reason for your group swamping this thread with trivia, even though Joe especially asked us all to keep to the subject

1. I don't have a group
2. People do wander off the subject. I don't have control over that
3. I am sure Joe can handle things himself if he so decides

So. Seeing as you have not answered the question I asked can we assume that you do see this as some sort of contest?

If so, and if it makes you happy, please feel free to believe you have won something. Whatever it is...

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:56 AM

Going to the earlier response, it seems that Keith believes that Labour supporters are more likely to antisemitic than anyone else. I suppose we had all better resign our memberships and join UKIP or something. Ah well, I suppose it has something to do with socialism. Wasn't it national socialists who believed that Jews were responsible for the ills of the world. Guess the clue is in the name :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 06:18 AM

My first Missus went to Ambrose Barlow, though she is a bit younger than you, I think she is now 58 so you would have left by the time she started there.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 06:57 AM

She may have known my brother who is just turned 60. It was a good school. Still is as far as I know but has now moved to the site of the old Wardley Grammar and merged with St Georges, Walkden.

D.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:03 AM

If I remember rightly, the four houses in my primary school were Barlow, Fisher, Campion and Moore. I recall that Barlow was one of the Forty Martyrs (or one of the Four Termarters as we called them in our juvenile confusion - well it didn't help that there were four houses, innit...)

You may regard our reminiscences as "trivia," Keith, but they are not and they mean a lot to us. Calling them trivia is far more insulting than us trying our damnedest to get you off your hobby horse. Frankly, though I can't speak for everyone here with certainty, I can sense a collective raising of eyebrows to heaven here every time you insist on going on and on and on and on and on and on and on and ON about Labour's "antisemitism problem," and, as far as I'm concerned, I'll "annoy you" (now that I know how to do it) from now on every time you start burbling on about it again. You're free to discuss it, but I'm free to use any non-violent keyboard-related means to try to get you to PUT A BLOODY SOCK IN IT!

And I've had a long and happy life and I have plenty more annoying "trivia" up my sleeve. Did I ever tell you about the time I nearly fell off one of those running donkeys on Blackpool sands in 1958...?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:12 AM

The houses at Ambrose Barlow were Moore, Fisher, Campion and Southworth. I think I was in the latter if I remember rightly. Colours were blue, red, yellow and green but I cannot recall which belonged to which.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:32 AM

Ambrose Barlow also had a youth club that was the envy of the rest of Swinton in the late 60s. You reminded me talking about Blackpool, Steve. The club owned a converted Ambulance for use as a minibus. It was driven by Father Sweeney, a particularly good parish priest from St Matks in Pendlebury. We went to Blackpool on one trip and were nearly swept off the prom by waves! No health and safety regs in them days :-) I also remember having to push the ambulance up Winnats Pass in Derbyshire. Probably where I got my masochistic love of stomping around the hills :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:35 AM

Can't be coincidence that, can it? Father Davis (who ended every Mass with "Prayers For Russia") must have had a hand in both schools, seeing as 'ow they had forty to choose from. We used to get told quite a lot that horror story about how one of the women martyrs was squashed to death under a door with weights piled on top. They were imaginative in those days.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:40 AM

Was it Catherine who had her breasts cut off and went on to become patron saint of puddings? Of course I may have confused 2 stories here...

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:55 AM

Heheh. Talking about demic trundle-wagons, that reminds me of a university field weekend in 1972, up near Whitby collecting Jurassic fossils out of the sea cliffs. Just our luck - in an otherwise mild winter, that weekend we endured a force nine gale with driving snow right off the North Sea with minus two even by day. I wore every stitch of clothing I'd taken with me, including me 'jamas, on that beach. If that wasn't bad enough, the trip back to London was a nightmare. The van that our teacher had hired had one of those fan things in the middle of the roof, only this one had the fan missing and just a gaping hole. All the way back we had to take turns to sit under the hole in the teeth of a blast of freezing air from it that directed itself at one's general goolie area. The van's heater was busted as well. To cap it all the fuel gauge needle froze up and we ran out of petrol somewhere in Lincolnshire. It was a dark, freezing snowy night and Dr Alvin finally managed to stop a passing car by virtually lying down on the road in front of it. I tell you, it could be classified as a near-death experience. When we got back we just sat in the union bar for a couple of hours. It took six pints before my legs would bend at the knee again.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 08:00 AM

Dunno about that Catherine tale, but I think the squashed lady was Margaret Clitherow. I used to get that story mixed up in my childish head with the one about the princess and the pea for reasons I can't explain.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 10:58 AM

Did you stay in those railway coaches converted into dormitories at Goathland, Steve? We did when we went on a geography trip to Robin Hood's Bay. I remember marking out a piece of beach a yard square, then logging everything we found in it.

That was when I fell in love with RHB, and out of love with geography trips.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: akenaton
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 11:40 AM

This thread has obviously been Hi jacked, by a group of trolls. What are all these posts to do with the Labour Party? Perhaps someone from admin would be kind enough to remove the offending posts, as we are continuously being coached by Joe to KEEP ON TOPIC.

I thought this type of childishness had been banished with the Muskets.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 11:56 AM

My car just past it's MOT needing only 1 new tyre. Not bad for 157000 miles. Just to keep things on topic, I had it serviced as well. Biggest cost will be the labour charge...

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 12:01 PM

I will put the topic back on course with this excerpt of a review of the book The Left's Jewish Problem by Dave Rich. It is reprinted from New Statesman

Note the figure of 20 suspended members later rose to 50 after the review was written.



With Jeremy Corbyn's election as Labour leader last year, this particular leftist world-view entered the heart of the party. In 2008, Corbyn wrote of the Balfour Declaration – the UK government's promise to British Jews of a homeland in Palestine – that it had "led to the establishment of the state of Israel in 1948 and the expulsion of Palestinians . . . Britain's history of colonial interference . . . leaves it with much to answer for." The description of Israel as a colonialist enterprise, rather than a movement for sovereignty through national independence, and the culpability of an "imperial" Britain, encapsulate the twin impulses that drive Corbyn's beliefs about foreign affairs.

The problem, Rich argues, is that it is just a short step from these beliefs to the ideas that Israel should not exist and that its Western supporters, who include most Jews, are racists. Combined with a resurgence of social media-charged conspiracies about Zionist wealth and power, the left has formed an anti-racist politics that is blind to anti-Semitism. Jews are privileged; they are wealthy; they cannot be victims.

Thus, "Zionist" has become not a term to describe a political position but an insult; thus, Jews, unless they denounce Israel (their "original sin"), are excluded from the left that now dominates the Labour Party. When such ideas become normalised, anything is possible. Jackie Walker, the recently suspended vice-chairwoman of the Corbyn-supporting group Momentum, can claim with sincerity that "many Jews" were the "chief financiers" of the slave trade, a modern myth and piece of bigotry popularised by the Nation of Islam's Louis Farrakhan – a notorious anti-Semite – in a 1991 book.

By the middle of this year, as many as 20 Labour Party members had been suspended or expelled for alleged anti-Semitism. At times, Rich appears bewildered. Though he never articulates it, the question "What has happened to my party?" echoes through these pages. Is it a case of just a few bad ­apples, or is the whole barrelful rotten? The answer, Rich concludes convincingly, in this powerful work that should be read by everyone on the left, is sadly the latter.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 12:02 PM

Out of interest, ake, the thread was hijacked a long time ago. The original thread started with the post

Subject: BS: Labour party discussion
From: McGrath of Harlow - PM
Date: 13 Aug 16 - 01:50 PM

Since the thread about 'Whither the Labour Party" has drifted far from home and turned into a rather unpleasant series of skirmishes about matters of peripheral relevance, I thought I'd start up one where we could talk about the current hurly burly. Preferably without getting into slanging matches. But that might be too much to ask. Coherent and even-tempered slanging matches, at least?
..............................

The latest court finding would apear to mean that the NEC could perfectly properly retrospectively bar from voting everyone who has joined the party after any date it chooses to name. Strange.

One thing that strikes me is that the manoeuvre by which recent members were barred from voting - waitng enough of those who would have opposed it has left the room before tabling the motion - was just the kid of "Trotskyite" ploy that Militant were always being accused of. I rather suspect that all those kind of tricks were very much part of theculture of Labour (and other parties) since they were founded.


So, following your logic, everything to do with antisemitism should be deleted as well, as should your post containing, well, nothing to do with the Labour party and the issue raised at the time - IE the voting rules at the time of the last leadership election.

Not that you ever let anything like logic or facts get in your way.

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 12:06 PM

Nah, this kind of childishness has enhanced the niceness of this thread no end, Mr Po-face!

We stayed in a rather grand-looking guesthouse on Scarborough sea-front, Backwoodsman. It was February, bloody cold and I don't think there was much heating on. As it faced east and the sun wasn't out all weekend, it was exceedingly gloomy. All-in-all a very bleak weekend, but it didn't quite destroy my love of natural things. I remember spending hours staring at 10,000-year-old pollen grains down a microscope in the evenings. I amassed a nice collection of plant fossils from the cliffs (bet you wouldn't be allowed to go hacking at them like that these days). A few weeks after we got back, somebody stole them out of my cupboard in the lab, along with my geological hammer. Bastard!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 12:15 PM

"I will put the topic back on course..."

Nah, we might not let you. We are fed up of this obsession with "the left's Jewish problem," "Labour's antisemitism," etc. We are all too busy celebrating Bibi's visit to London! Now where was I?

Oh yes! Gotta buy a set of four tyres for Mrs Steve's old MX5 on Wednesday, Dave. And my trusty old Focus is making funny noises underneath, no longer drownable-out by turning the radio up, which is my main diagnostic tool for finding out whether a problem is serious enough for further investigation. Could be an expensive week.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: akenaton
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 12:16 PM

Dave, surely the charges of anti Semitism have quite a lot to do with the Labour Party. it is a considerable issue inside the Party.

I am taking no sides here but to say the discussion on Anti-Semitism does not pertain to the LP in this instance is just daft.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 12:40 PM

Dave, did I ever tell you about the times on that Malham Tarn field course when we suckered one of our mates into driving himself and four more of us down to the Buck in Malham every night? Enabled us partake freely of the jorum, all except him of course, but the price we had to pay was to all get out, pissed, and push his Morris Minor round that nasty hairpin bend on the road back up. More hazardous than you might think after you've sunk a few. It was very inconsiderate of him, we thought, to show up for a field course with his clutch slipping!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 12:51 PM

Backwoodsman, My son ( a UK citizen)lives and works in Robin Hoods Bay, you could say he LABOURS down there. It is very beautiful as you say. He also has a PARTY in his house now and then. He also enjoys a good DISCUSSION with intelligent people.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 12:59 PM

It has absolutely fuck all to do with the original topic of vote gerrymandering. It is an issue and as such deserves to be discussed but on it's own thread rather than one where the opening post specifically said ...turned into a rather unpleasant series of skirmishes about matters of peripheral relevance. I thought I'd start up one where we could talk about the current hurly burly (IE "The latest court finding would apear to mean that the NEC could perfectly properly retrospectively bar from voting everyone who has joined the party after any date it chooses to name.") Preferably without getting into slanging matches. If you want o complain about going off topic you should at least be consistent about it and moan about your heroes as well.

Malham is my nearest famous beauty spot now, Steve. I quite fancy walking there when the weather gets better but it will take at least 2, possibly 3, trips utilising the local buses which are, in that area, spasmodic to say the least.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 01:08 PM

Dave, the discussion has been about anti-Semitism within Labour and all the accusations came from within the Party.
You make yourself ridiculous by claiming that it is not relevant in a discussion about the Labour Party.

You say you have no group, but you and the same group have used this identical tactic before on threads that you all wanted stopped.

2. People do wander off the subject. I don't have control over that

People did not wander off the subject. Your little group all started talking about travel, all at once and out of the blue.
The first time you used this tactic you all started discussing beer.
The same little group of yours.

Now, the Labour peer appointed by Corbyn to lead one of the enquiries into Labour anti-Semitism has spoken of a "widely held view that we do not take antisemitism seriously." and of her disappointment that the anti-Semites she identified in her report have not been dealt with by the Party.

That is new and entirely relevant to the subject.

Steve, you said you would tell us if you really believe that Watson lies against the Party for the Israeli government.
Do you?
Why do you and Jim have such a problem answering such a simple question?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 01:16 PM

I will repeat the opening post on the original thread for you Keith, even though I did so only a few posts earlier.

Subject: BS: Labour party discussion
From: McGrath of Harlow - PM
Date: 13 Aug 16 - 01:50 PM

Since the thread about 'Whither the Labour Party" has drifted far from home and turned into a rather unpleasant series of skirmishes about matters of peripheral relevance, I thought I'd start up one where we could talk about the current hurly burly. Preferably without getting into slanging matches. But that might be too much to ask. Coherent and even-tempered slanging matches, at least?
..............................

The latest court finding would apear to mean that the NEC could perfectly properly retrospectively bar from voting everyone who has joined the party after any date it chooses to name. Strange.

One thing that strikes me is that the manoeuvre by which recent members were barred from voting - waitng enough of those who would have opposed it has left the room before tabling the motion - was just the kid of "Trotskyite" ploy that Militant were always being accused of. I rather suspect that all those kind of tricks were very much part of theculture of Labour (and other parties) since they were founded.


Absolutely fuck all to do with antisemitism and of particular note the phrase "a rather unpleasant series of skirmishes about matters of peripheral relevance" so before you whinge about going off topic you you should really put your own house in order.

You say you have no group, but you and the same group have used this identical tactic before on threads that you all wanted stopped.


No, I don't have a group. And I don't want the thread closed thank you. I am enjoying it.

I suppose we could start a group. What do you think? Raggy on guitar, Steve on mouth organ, me pretending to play concertina. What do you and ake fancy bringing to the party?

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 01:31 PM

Not a bad idea David, you and I can double up on vocals. We can split that LABOUR between us. I'm sure we could have a great PARTY but we would have to have a DISCUSSION about the material we used.

What says you Steve.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 01:36 PM

Hope you don't mind mey saying so Dave, but that was a very, very stupid thing to do - you really should have stuck with plating with the Mechano set ypu got for your birthday.
These people don't need evidence to push their extremist right-wing claims, nor do they produce any of their own.
You are arguing with people who believe you don't need to specify charges for the accused to be guilty- they make things up as they see fit.
You might as well try to reason with a rottweiler who is about to bite the arse out of your pants.
Good luck and don't forget your anti-rabies shots
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 01:38 PM

The original thread bore the heading "BS Labour Party Discussion."
OK Dave?
The OP took one particular issue but there was no suggestion that it was the only Labour Party issue that was allowed!

I resisted the drifting of that thread and the previous one onto the subject of Israel.
I only wanted to discuss the subject as identified in the thread title.
That is what I have done on this thread too.

If your little pack do not like it you do not have to open it.
If you want to discuss something entirely unrelated to the subject of the thread, you can start a new one.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 01:41 PM

Jim,
Can you identify one single "extremist right-wing claim" ?

No you can not.
You are making shit up and lying again.

But please prove me wrong.
Put up an example, why don't you?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 01:42 PM

Don't you realiuse how stupid it is to argue antisemitism with people who accuse the Jewish People for the Crimes of the Israeli regime?
A REMINDER OIF WHAT THESE PEOPLE REJECT
"Holding Jews collectively responsible for actions of the state of Israel."
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 01:49 PM

We can but try, Jim. We could not afford a Mechano set though. Ha dto make do with bits of old machinery from t'mill... :-)

If you want to discuss something entirely unrelated to the subject of the thread, you can start a new one.

Nah. Why should you be the only one to maneuver threads from sensible to senseless. I am sure the moderation team will step in if they feel that any breach of etiquette has occurred.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 01:52 PM

Hands up all those who would rather talk about beer and holidays than "Labour's antisemitism problem" for the eleventy-fourteenth time! Everyone gets one vote except for Backwoodsman who gets ten!

Malham and surrounds is God's own country, Dave. Plenty of rare plants around the Cove and in the dry valley above it. Jacob's' Ladder, Orpine, Roseroot, Herb Paris, Herb Christopher, Lesser Meadow-rue, Meadow Saxifrage, Bird's-eye Primrose, Green Spleenwort, Shining Cranesbill, loads more. There's a car park made largely on flat areas of wet bare rock at Selside that has Hairy Stonecrop. Ribblehead Quarry has the very rare Coralroot Orchid and Colt Park Wood near Ribblehead is full of lovely flora such as Yellow Star-of-Bethlehem. The latter two may be closed off to protect the habitat. Go up Penyghent in April and the limestone outcrops are covered in Purple Saxifrage. Paradise! Or just unpleasant trivia? Damn, can't decide!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 01:54 PM

"The original thread bore"


Bwahahahaha!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 01:58 PM

How do you do a hands up symbol?

Sounds grand Steve - Wish I knew what I was looking at. Half the time I cannot tell if it is an orchid or an oak. But you have been and gone and done it now. Mentioning the yellow star of Bethlehem. Surely that is picked by Labour party members and stuck to certain peoples front doors.

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 02:01 PM

The OP took one particular issue but there was no suggestion that it was the only Labour Party issue that was allowed!

By the same logic there was no suggestion that anything else was disallowed.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 02:03 PM

"We can but try, Jim."
Been there, Done that Dave - why bother when there are plenty of saner people to argue with
Here you haave someone who thinks it's ok to force refugees to wear identification armbands and suggests that a mass murdered who has just massacred 777 young people "had something to say worth listening to"; an individual who hysterically screams "Jew HaTer" whenever Israel is criticised and someone who tells lies incessantly when he can't get his way
""I asked if YOU believe that THIS politician lies against his OWN PARTY on behalf of the government of Israel."
You are loading this question by ignoring every other fact concerning this man
He is a right wing opponent of Corbyn who has demanded he resign - he would certainly bend the truth at acheive that, as would very other right winger
He is a career politician who has been discovered fiddling expenses - he, and every other politician of his ilk would lie in their teeth to preserve his job
He is a member of Friends of Israel and has led two sponsored delegations there - nice work, if that's what turns you on.
He is opposed to BDS and has been cited in the Israeli press for his support for the Regime's cause.
He is a politician - lying is a recognised part of the job description
Of course he would lie if it served his agenda and his personal interests – does the Pope wear a frock?"
"Steve, do you agree with Jim that he lies against his own Party to help Israel?"
These people are beyond the pale Dave - for ***** sake, leve them to stew in their own bilious hatred
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: akenaton
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 03:23 PM

Dave, I cannot believe that you are being serious, do you realise how crazy that sounds

A labour Party discussion should be about anything to do with the labour Party.
To start up a conversation about some completely different subject just to sabotage the thread is extremely bad forum etiquette.

I don't suppose the mods are interested in this thread, but your antics are still an insult to Mr McGrath.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 03:43 PM

Well I think it's "bad forum etiquette" to clutter up the forum with yet another "Labour serious antisemitism issue" thread. I think it's good forum etiquette instead to have pleasant little conflabs about reminiscences, wild flowers and the Dales. Think of it as painting over a soiled, flaking, graffiti-riddled wall with a lovely new layer of paint, or covering it over with a beautiful huge poster of the Birth Of Venus. Or the Rokeby Venus. Any Venus!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:02 PM

Just on a point of order, Dave and Jim, it's not 'Mechano', it's 'Meccano'. Apologies for my pedantry! 😉

And thanks for my ten votes, Steve. All ten for beer and holidays! 👍😎


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:12 PM

This is a folk and blues music forum. It has a BS section in which anything can be discussed. As far as I remember the term BS stands for Bull Shit. That is what these threads are supposed to be and, more often than not, are. To take them seriously is the crazy bit.

But, if it makes you any happier, I am sure most Labour MPs have holidays. Maybe some of them visit the Yorkshire Dales or Italy. Perhaps one or two of them even have an interest in botany. So, everything discussed here has had relevance to a discussion on the Labour party.

Now, Steve, any chance of getting in touch with Banksy to make a proper job of that paint over?

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:18 PM

On reflection, a damn sight more Labour MPs and supporters go on holiday, visit the Dales and enjoy wild flowers than indulge in antsemitic activities :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:20 PM

Thanks BWM. I guess I have to rename my leggot set as well...

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 05:02 PM

LOL! 😄


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 05:27 PM

Trolls!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 05:40 PM

Strolls?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Greg F.
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 05:56 PM

Ask not for whom the Bell Trolls. Or vice versa.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 06:14 PM

All ten votes in favour? Plus mine and Dave's and Raggytash's if I may be so presumptuous? Plus Greg's, 'appen? Then it's a wrap! They lose! We are the metaphorical Banksies!

(Well at least we're Bill the painter and decorator from up the road. No job too small, strictly cash. Times are 'ard, you know...)

I'll have to check with Jim about his vote...hope he's not doing a Diane Abbott on us...😂


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 06:29 PM

I support Jeremy Corbyn.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 06:31 PM

Me too. Good bloke. But his days are numbered, Dick.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 06:46 PM

Good bloke if that`s the kind of bloke that floats your boat. A lot of people including those in his own party will be happy to see his ass out the door. The party would do well to choose a leader who doesn`t cozy up to terrorists.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Greg F.
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 06:53 PM

It trolls for thee.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:03 PM

Didn't Ronald Reagan cosy up to terrorists? Do we count General Pinochet as a terrorist? It wasn't us lefties who cosied up to them, was it?

You're right, Greg. There's an unidentified irritant afoot!

Did I ever tell you about the time in that caravan near Cleveleys when there was a cat fight on the roof in the middle of the night? Damn near drove us home off our hols, it was so terrifying!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:16 PM

Anyway, boobs, enough of this. You are interrupting a very serious discussion of holidays, schoolday reminiscences, the lovely Dales and wild flowers. AND the Forty Martyrs, you heathen you! I've decided to ignore you completely in this thread from now on, and I may not be alone in that either. So rattle on, dear boy, rattle thou on! Shake it up, baby!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 08:00 PM

No wonder the Labour party is in the toilet when you see shit like this which, by the way, is the same shit we have seen from Mudcat's own Labour supporters :

A newly elected official in a local chapter of the UK Labour Party has accused the "Israel lobby" of controlling the British government, the volunteer-led charity the Campaign Against Anti-Semitism reported on Friday.

According to the report, Rebecca Massey, the Interim Chair of Central Hove, Brunswick and Adelaide, has been using the Twitter handle @beckycheabas not only to attack the Jewish state — calling it "pathological" and "barbaric" — but to libel Jews under the International Definition of Antisemitism, adopted by the British government in December.


The Algemeiner


On another occasion, Massey tweeted an article explaining how the "Israel lobby manufactured the UK Labour Party's antisemitism crisis", as if that crisis were not as a result of British Jews decrying egregious antisemitic statements by senior Labour Party figures. Since these allegations did not come from Israel but were from British Jews, the "Israel lobby" is a misnomer: she means a 'Jewish lobby' again deploying what the International Definition refers to as "the myth…of Jews controlling the…government or other societal institutions."

Campaign Against Antisemitism


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 08:06 PM

These people have no case - either point that out or leave it there.
Theuy ghave no evidence of antisemitism in the Labour Party - end of story
If they had evidence they would have produced it long ago - nor decent society finds anybody guilty of anything without specifying the Charges.
First Keith blamed Corbyn for suppressing the report - the report is in the mands of the Israelis yet they have nor revealed the nature of the so called "antisemitism"
Asked why the Jewish members of Parliament haven't revealed the nature of the accusations, Keith went on to blame the Jewish members for hushing it up "for the good of the party - a 'Jewish Plot' - does that remind anybody of a period of world history.
Why are you even talking to these people - so called defenders of The Jewish People who refuse to comment on Trump's appointing of an extreme antisemite and the fact that Trump's victory is being used to get France's leading antisemitic family in control of that country - LePen was even photographed at Trump Tower, gert these gallant battlers against antisemitism refuse to say a word.
One memorable phrase Thatcher used during her erign of terror as "The oxygen of publicity" and that is exactly what you are giving this sad shower.
For Christ's sake stop calling each other schoolyard names - you are as bad as one another - they are dragging you down to their level.
"Meccano"
Thanks for the heads-up BWM - I lost the box to my set a long time ago.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 08:13 PM

Hey Dave, I forgot to mention Gordale Scar, star location of the Dales and the Pennine Way (slightly off-route, as I recall), one of the few strongholds of the common juniper and home to a very rare sedge, just round the corner from Malham Cove. But what a place! And just across the road is Janet's Foss hidden in the trees, one of those little amphitheatre waterfalls where you could imagine fairies dancing around in the sprinkly light. Late May/early June on a sunshiny day is the best time to see nature in all its glory and to remember why you're an atheist!

Anybody here know Upper Teesdale?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 09:22 PM

Couple of months ago, Jim, I picked up a copy of the Jewish News in Radcliffe Asda (or was it the Jewish Telegraph, may have got the name wrong). I take my mum shopping to Prestwich and Whitefield when I'm there, an area with a large Jewish population, and we might go into a caff for a butty and a pot of tea. As far as I can see, people there are down to earth and they get on. Bit of a snapshot I know, but I was brought up round there, as was my mum and all her clan and I did a lot of my supping in the pubs round Heaton Park. Can't deny that a lot of people haven't got much time for anyone who are identifiably not of their own ethnic ilk, or whatever you want to call it, but I don't see much outright animosity. You wouldn't think so, though, reading that paper. It read like a single-minded siege-mentality anti-Labour Party campaign document. That stuff was on nearly every page. It made me bloody fume to think how the real enemies of ordinary working people, the sodding Tories, were being given a bye. Any kind of ethnic or racial intolerance has got to be sharply tackled and never overlooked or indulged, but people can't, and don't, and won't, live their whole lives under siege. I'll discuss antisemitism (as long as it's the real thing and not some pro-Netanyahu confection of the type our two resident carriers of the flame peddle) 'til the cows come home, but never letting go of it so that you can live your life is a baleful and negative way to carry on. That's how I see all these bloody anti-Labour, anti-Israeli regime-criticism threads these days. We've had a lot of it and it's well getting on me tits. I like everybody who likes me, whether they're black, white, pink, brown, Jews, Muslims or the missus.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 09:24 PM

"Anyone who ARE," dammit?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 10:14 PM

It read like a single-minded siege-mentality anti-Labour Party campaign document.

And rightly so, wot! With all the disgusting spew issuing forth from the mouths of party members one would think we're in Weimar bleedin' Germany or sumphin', eh lads.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 03:18 AM

There is some stuff in Gordale beck that goes right back to the origins of life on this planet. Tufa? Something like that. Anyway, it is the stuff that they reckon kicked off oxygenation. It was on a Bear Grills documentary.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 03:53 AM

My experience is the opposite Steve
I have never read the Jewish press in my life until recently, when I started taking Harretz on line - I should imagine that, like ny other community, the press seldom reflects the opinions of any other community across the board, just those with access to the media.
I moved from Liverpool to Manchester in 1965 and immediately, through my interests in politics and music, immediately came into contact with Jewish people who shared those interests - all either supporters of either Labour or other left-wing groups and many of them active in community groups or trades unions and virtually all from a refugee background.
They were like any other people - good, bad, intermediate.
I had know Jewish people earlier, but it hadn't registered they were Jewish - I was brought up in a family that regarded people as being people without having to hang a label on them (or sew an identification tag on their arm!).
While those who I knew were very aware of their heritage and their history, because of their recent experiences particularly, they did not cut themselves off from those outside their faith but were friends, comrades or fellow trades unionists.
It was from them I learned a little of Jewish recent history and it was eventually from them that I learned to mistrust and eventually despise those right-wingers who are now running Israel - though it lost me a treasured girl-friend in the process.
When my dad was killed in a road accident, four strangers who had seen the announcement in the Liverpool Echo, turned up for the funeral - they had fought alongside my dad in Spain and one of them had gone to Palestine after the war to fight for a new State -
We spent the afternoon talking of their experiences - an education - these people where giants of human beings compared to this little group of inhuman, extremist hate merchants.
I've never been a member of the Labour Party, but I've known enough people who have to realise that it is totally illogical to suggest, without a single practical example, that a party that was founded on the dream of improving society for the better, should be antisemitic - almost as illogical as finding someone guilty of an accusation without specifying what they re guilty of.
For ***** sake let's move on and leave these people to the comfort of their padded cells
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 04:33 AM

Jim,
Don't you realiuse how stupid it is to argue antisemitism with people who accuse the Jewish People for the Crimes of the Israeli regime?

It would be stupid Jim, but who are those people and where do they post?

Now Jim, are you going to duck this one too?
Can you identify one single "extremist right-wing claim" ?

If you can not you are making shit up and lying again.

Please prove me wrong and put up an example.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 04:37 AM

Talking of favourite places, there is a road near Clifden on the Connemara that leads out across a bog. There are a myriad of Loughs that shine like jewels all across the vast plain and a range of mountains, the Twelve Bens, that flank one side of the it. The sea provides another boundary. It is utterly beautiful, peaceful and although I know little about Botany the plant life is very varied.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 04:41 AM

Dave,
The OP took one particular issue but there was no suggestion that it was the only Labour Party issue that was allowed!

By the same logic there was no suggestion that anything else was disallowed.


Yes there was.
The thread title limited the debate to discussion of the Labour Party.

Your little group clearly do not want to discuss that any more.
Fine. Stay away.
It is trolling to try to prevent discussion by those who are interested, using bullying and intimidation from a whole pack of you to discourage decent folk from discussing what they want.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 04:54 AM

Jim,
These are not a "loaded questions."

Do you believe that Watson lies to harm his own party?

I am not asking if he ever lies at all, just whether he lies to damage his own party whose members elected him Deputy Leader.

And, if he does, does he do it for the Government of Israel.

We all know he has close ties with Israel's Labour Party, but not with its current Right Wing government which a Lefty like him reviles.
You will never hear him defend settlements.

So, Jim and Steve, do you really believe that he lies against his Party for the government of Israel?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Stu
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 04:59 AM

Unbelievable. This whole fucking thread.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:01 AM

Well who would have thought that extolling the beauty of the Dales or Robin Hoods Bay or the Connemara would one day be considered bullying and intimidating.

What a strange world we live in.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:01 AM

Jim,
Theuy ghave no evidence of antisemitism in the Labour Party - end of story
If they had evidence they would have produced it long ago -


We did.
The evidence is that the leadership, the NEC, Sadiq Khan and many others within the Party acknowledge that it is true.
Many have been suspended for it, and at least one has admitted making anti-Semitic statements born of ignorance.

Why would they all lie. It harms the Party
Have you any evidence that they are all lying to harm the Party?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:07 AM

Rag,

Well who would have thought that extolling the beauty of the Dales or Robin Hoods Bay or the Connemara would one day be considered bullying and intimidating.


It would not be intimidating on a thread entitled "Places I Have Known."

Any subject used to prevent discussion of something else, with a whole pack of people demanding that the subject be changed, is intimidating, bullying behaviour.

I would welcome discussion of those places, but not for it to be used to close down an existing debate. There is plenty of room for more threads. You do not need this one.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:29 AM

I don't think I have demanded anything on this thread.

However if you point out one of my posts where I HAVE demanded anything I will, of course, apologise.

I don't think I have been bullying or intimidating on this thread.

However if you point out one of my posts where I HAVE been bullying or intimidating I will, of course, apologise.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:33 AM

What is even stranger Raggy is the logic that says that a party that sets up an investigation into antisemitism and admits that antisemitism is a problem is the one that gets accused of being antisemitic. By that same token, as I suspect there has never been such an investigation by the BNP, then they must be less racist than the Labour party. Strange world indeed...

Still, let's get back top the sensible stuff. If you are coming to Ribblehead, email me. Chances are I will be walking on Saturday afternoon but if you are coming then I will let the others know. If you need accommodation I am sure we will find room in the bunk house but I think Christine may object to the smells and noises emanating from some bunks :-) The Station have rooms which I believe are quite good.

Cheers

D.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Stu
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:34 AM

Expect any thread discussion the Labour party will be hijacked by people flogging the same old dead horse, resulting in endless circular arguments. You're not open to persuasion, never going to agree so what's the sodding point?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:37 AM

So True Stu, isn't it so much more beneficial to discuss the beauty of the Dales.

Something I would hope we could all agree on.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:47 AM

That's the first time in my life I've ever bullied or intimidated anybody with wild flowers or Jurassic fossils, I must say. Just wait 'til I lay into you with a Victoria sponge, Keith. Lock up yer daughters!

I have a feeling that I drove on that Connemara road in 1977 when the missus and I spent a month trundling round the west of Ireland in our Morris Minor. Bloody roads -three punctures in four weeks! There's a little strand somewhere round there where bits of coral wash up. I filled a matchbox with some as a souvenir. Can't tell you the trouble that caused us back at the port. A half-hour grilling by the anti-terrorist lads who took a lot of persuading that it wasn't drugs or explosives or something. The buggers turned us upside down!

Took a little lump of tufa from Gordale Beck to show my chemistry teacher at school. He was a bit of a geology freak. He was delighted that he thought he was nurturing a future geological star. Alas, a year later he was threatening to chuck me out of 'O' level chemistry for homework failure-to-do. He even threw a piece of chalk at me once. Twat. I got a grade 2, by the way.

Dunno what I was saying that was opposite to your experiences, Jim. Complementary, more like, I should say, with similar sentiments. Not saying that discussion of this should be verboten. But I do get sorely pissed off with this pair of obsessives that have us going round in circles. Anyway, I've been studiously hijacking this for 24 hours now and have yet to receive even a small bollocking. Don't mind discussing issues with sensible, fair-minded people, of course. And that's going to get a fine response, I predict.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: akenaton
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:52 AM

Raggytash, what on earth are you playing at?
Keith is right, if you don't want to engage just leave the thread.

I don't expect Jim Dave or Steve to appreciate that, but you are above that sort of behaviour IMO and from our previous conversations.

I hade to leave the "Trumps enemies" thread after making my point, I registered my disapproval of what I considered a nasty post, if in metaphorical form... my post was almost immediately removed by a mod, but my point had been made .....end of story, I certainly would not attempt to wreck the thread because of the political views of one moderator.   A


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:53 AM

Who's not open to persuasion by the way, Stu? I've been persuaded to change my mind here on a number of topics. I tend to keep quiet about it in case some weak-minded twat calls me a snowflake or accuses me of making up shit, etc. 😉


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:55 AM

"It would be stupid Jim, but who are those people and where do they post?"
Anybody who accuses critics of israel as "Jew Haters" and "antisemites" are "these people" and they post here - you are among them
"Do you believe that Watson lies to harm his own party?"#You have what Watson is and has doem - you decide whether he is telling the truth - you have the evidence - where's yours?
"The evidence is that the leadership, the NEC, Sadiq Khan and many others within the Party acknowledge that it is true."
The evidence came yup with the fact that the accusations had no ground - you acknowledged it when you accused Corbyn of covering up the facts - without proof
How the **** can you have produced evidence when you say you don't know what king of antisemitism the Labour party is being accused of?
You even claimed that the Jewish members of Parliament refused to produce that evidence for the love of their party
Do not dig yourself into an even deeper ohole of stupidity
There is no evidence of a problem of antisemitism - none whatever.
THere are onlty accusations - accusations are not evidence, they are not proof and no civilised society would ever convict without those accusations being fully specified
Back to your padded cell Keith - you have lied and twisted enough.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:57 AM

Rag, you do not need to use this thread to discuss places of interest or anything else.
You and your pack of bullies has made it very difficult for those of us trying to discuss the thread subject.

Dave,
a party that sets up an investigation into antisemitism and admits that antisemitism is a problem is the one that gets accused of being antisemitic.

Dave, all the accusations came from within Labour, and also the accusations that the Party was not addressing the problem.
What has kept this thread going is Jim and Steve denying that Labour has a problem with it. At least you seem to be acknowledging that fact.
See if you can get through to the others.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:58 AM

I don't really want to get involved with dog shit as we don't even have a dog, but when it appears outside our house I clean it up. It helps considerably if I think pleasant thoughts while doing it. Far better than what I would like to do to the owner.

Of course I suspect analogy is wasted on some.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:00 AM

Ake, People can discuss whatever they like. However this particular topic has been running for over 18 months on this and a previous thread with no end is sight.

The joy of walking up in the Dales or having a pint in Robin Hoods Bay or cycling the bog road between Clifden and Roundstone on the Connemara far exceeds any "joy" that has been found in the discussion of the "topic" so far.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:03 AM

Steve,

That's the first time in my life I've ever bullied or intimidated anybody with wild flowers or Jurassic fossils, I must say.


It is not the subject that is intimidating, it is your hijacking an existing debate.
With a whole pack of you doing it, many of you with a reputation for aggressive posting, then yes it is bullying and intimidating people who just want to continue discussing the Labour Party.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:05 AM

I haven't got a pack of "bullies" professor. I like the other people on this thread are not a "gang" either.

No one is being bullied or intimidated as far as I am aware, or if they are, they must indeed be sensitive little souls if they are frightened of being told of the wonders of nature.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:05 AM

I and the others have always agreed that there must be an antisemitic element in the Labour party just as there is in any other walk of life. I know you have probably forgotten as it was more than 2 posts ago but I have already said, and Steve and Jim have agreed, that antisemitism is a problem in the Labour party but no more so than in any other walk of life. What is more the party are working at reducing it which is a damn sight more than can be said of others.

The other day I asked you a question and you skirted it. You have already said that you do not believe the Labour party itself is antisemitic as that is not in its manifesto. Do you therefore believe that Labour party members are more likely to be antisemitic than anyone else? I await your response. A simple yes or no will do.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:09 AM

That beach Steve is on the road between Clifden and Ballyconneely.

I have several bags of coral and shells that one day I will continue to make into jewellery. I must take my Dremel with me next time I go over which should be in March.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: akenaton
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:11 AM

I agree Raggytash but surely the answer is to open a new thread on the beauties of the English countryside. I would be pleased to contribute as I am extremely fond of the wonderful views in my part of Scotland.
As I mentioned earlier the antics of some who obviously want the thread closed or derailed are an insult to the opening poster who's behaviour on forum is almost always impeccable.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:15 AM

Lovely Facebook group here. We love the Yorkshire Dales. I think you need to join to post but you can look at the pictures without doing so. I have not posted any pictures yet but I did give a link to the Mr Fox song 'The Gypsy' which is set in the Yorkshire Dales. I think Bob Pegg lives in Whitby now but I am not sure. Do you know Raggy?

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:15 AM

Jim,
Anybody who accuses critics of israel as "Jew Haters" and "antisemites" are "these people" and they post here - you are among them

No I am not!
I am not aware of anyone who does that.
Will you give an example?
I am still waiting for an example of "extremist Right-Wing claims" that you reported!

Withdraw one false statement before making another Jim!

you acknowledged it when you accused Corbyn of covering up the facts

I have never done that either!!!

How the **** can you have produced evidence when you say you don't know what king of antisemitism the Labour party is being accused of?

Because I have quoted numerous reliable witnesses from within Labour, including very senior officials, who report having seen it for themselves.
A reliable witness is regarded as strong evidence in any court, and a number of such witnesses would be regarded as proof beyond reasonable doubt by any intelligent jury.
Case proved Jim.

You even claimed that the Jewish members of Parliament refused to produce that evidence for the love of their party

No. I said they expected the Party to deal with it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:22 AM

Dave,
I have already said, and Steve and Jim have agreed, that antisemitism is a problem in the Labour party but no more so than in any other walk of life.

According to many within the Party, including senior figures and people who have suffered it, Labour has a particular problem which other major parties seem not to have.

You have already said that you do not believe the Labour party itself is antisemitic as that is not in its manifesto. Do you therefore believe that Labour party members are more likely to be antisemitic than anyone else?

Not just because it is not in the manifesto, silly.

As I have already explained, I do believe that Labour has a particular problem with anti-Semitism because so many senior Labour people say it does.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:31 AM

Not heard about Bob Pegg moving to Whitby but there is a strong rumour that Rob Van Sante has bought a house here.

For many years Whitby has resembled an Old Folkies Care Home though.

I once had the idea of several of us buying a mansion to split into apartments with a communal area. The idea was that you had to be a folkie to buy an apartment, you would agree only to sell to another folkie and that a management fee could be used to provide welfare cover for those nearing their time.

I still think there is some mileage in that.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:33 AM

You have still not answered the question. Do you believe that Labour party members are more likely to be antisemitic than anyone else? It really is a simple question.

As to Not just because it is not in the manifesto, silly

Here is the post I made and you responded to. Your words in bold.

The Labour party cannot be antisemitic. It is not in it's manifesto.

Exactly true. It has a serious problem with some of its members, but the party itself can not be said to be anti-Semitic and no-one has suggested it is.


DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:36 AM

Now, back to the more serious business. Sounds a good idea to me Raggy. I remember Rob from years back. He appeared at Swinton Folk Club many a time and, when we were having fun with the local 'Journal' someone submitted a write up that included the phrase Rob's aunties van in the same paragraph as Rob van Sante. They didn't complain :-)

D.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:40 AM

"No I am not!"
You have accused me of antisemitism - yes you are
"I am not aware of anyone who does that."
Then you are more stupid than you appear to be - Bobad does it all the time, so does bBearded Bruce, MtheGM did it, and numerous others, regularly
The Israeli Minister of Justice said it publicly and you supported her doing so.....
Anybody who makes such a suggestion is antisemitic by definition.
Anybody who accuses Jewish politicians of a pact of silence to cover up the nature of antisemitism to protect their party is an antisemite - you did that
Your own right wing extremist statements include describing all male Muslims of being implanted to have underage sex - straight from the philosophy that sent six million Jews to their deaths.
It doesn't come any more right-wing extreme than that.
"A reliable witness is regarded as strong evidence in any court"
What an unbelievably stupid statement - even for you
A reliable witnesses's SUBSTANTIATED EVIDENCE may be accepted or rejected alongside all evidence but never at any time would an unsubstantiated accusation be ever be taken seriously - never
You have quoted no reliable witnesses - you have repeated unfounded accusations - substantiate them or abandon your fanatical crusade against the Labour Party.
What exactly are you accusing Labour Party members of - kidnapping Christian children to use them for blood sacrifices maybe?
WHAT EXACTLY IS THIS "SERIOUS ANTI SEMITISM" IN THE LABOUR PARTY
I've asked you this several times and you have said you don't know - are you any neared to finding out yet?
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 07:00 AM

Now for something far more serious
Who is Bob Pegg?
Is he the comic actor who starred in the hilarious 'Sean of the Dead' or 'Hot Fuzz', or, 'Paul' or 'World's End'
The name rings a bell
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 07:13 AM

No - That is Simon Pegg. Bob Pegg and his wife Carolanne were the founder members of early 70's Folk/Rock band Mr Fox. Bob writes songs which often display his love of the Yorkshire dales. If you do YouTube the song I was particularly referring to is here

Mr Fox - The Gypsy

Long song but one of my favourites. Not sure if it will be your cup of tea, Jim, but even if it isn't it will be infinitely preferable to going round and round in circles :-)

Cheers

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 07:16 AM

Can't you fellers tell when you'being wound up?
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 07:38 AM

I loved Mr. Fox, and Bob's a great writer. I still occasionally do 'Fiddler's Cross'.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 07:40 AM

I did wonder, Jim, but played it safe just in case. I guess I am too used to dealing with wazzocks who treat everything said as an opportunity to score points ;-)

Have you heard the song already then?

D.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 07:45 AM

More fascistic behaviour from the usual pack of jackals as they try to close down a thread about a subject that makes them uncomfortable - welcome to the brave new world of the regressive left.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 07:57 AM

"regressive left."
The regressive right sent six million Jews to their deaths
Regressive right Pinochet oversaw the rape, torture and murder of his opponents and his friend, regressive right Thatcher described his policy as her kind of democracy
Regressive right Assad continues to massacre his own people
Regressive right Trump has appointed a raving antisemite onto his team and is consorting with historical antisemite Mm LePen (still no comment from you).
Hitler was of the regressive right, as were his supporters and his stauch ally Mussolini
It's nice to know you are happy to align yorself with this particular branch of politics - please feel free to refer to us as "the regressive left" whenever it takes your fancy
I would be happy to wear your badge with pride
Enjoy your night out at the Biergarten
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 08:02 AM

Sorry forgot to reply
"Have you heard the song already then?"
Certainly have - once was enough
Pretentious crap and impossible to follow with the noise they've wrapped around it - nothing to do with folk music as I understand it
But that's an argument for elsewhere
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 08:31 AM

Don't beat about the bush, Jim. Tell us what you really think :-) You must bear in mind of course that we are talking early 70s here. When talking pretentious crap I don't think you can hold a candle to prog. rock. I still love it though :-D And, surely, this is an ideal place for such an argument ;-)

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 08:33 AM

Regressive right / regressive left = two sides of the same coin.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 08:36 AM

"Regressive right / regressive left = two sides of the same coin."
Meaningless nonsense
You have chosen your friends, I'll stick with mine.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 08:45 AM

Sorry Dave - didn't reply - I like to seperate my friends from my foes
I have no objection to rock per-se - whatever turns you on.
It's when it is claimed to be something it is not that cause the problems, especially to a researcher - hence the "pretentious".
I grew up with and grew out of rock music - I have an extremely broad taste in music, but it doesn't include modern pop of any form - it doesn't do anything for me and it is too ephemeral to get a firm grip on - don't get me started abot the "pump up the volume" school of non-thought - musical fascism at its most extreme.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 09:05 AM

"Do you believe that Labour party members are more likely to be antisemitic than anyone else? It really is a simple question."

I agree it is really a simple question and one that anyone fully prepared to look honestly and critically at what has been going in the Labour Party since the departure of Ed Miliband could answer.

As to the question itself - Do I believe that Labour Party members are more likely to be anti-Semitic than anyone else? - Simple short answer to that on examination of the "evidence" is YES.

Reasons for arriving at that conclusion as follows (None of these reasons apply to "anyone else"):

1: After Labour failed to win the 2015 General Election Ed Miliband resigned as leader and was succeeded by Jeremy Corbyn. Jeremy Corbyn is on record as describing Hamas and Hezbollah, both proscribed terrorist organisations as being friends.

2: With the election of Jeremy Corbyn a group called "Momentum", which is basically a rework of the "Militant Tendency" of old flooded to "join" the Labour Party to ensure that Corbyn stayed as leader.

3: Anyone who challenged Corbyn's leadership felt the weight of such "dissention" - ask Angela Eagle.

4: Corbyn supports BDS, so does "Momentum" and I would say the bulk of their membership.

5: When the OULC voted on it the Jewish Co-Chairman resigned stating that the reason for his resignation centred around Jewish members not feeling safe at meetings - Does backing BDS really require that those assembled at meetings sing "Rockets over Tel Aviv"?

6: While those here draw fine lines between Jew and Israeli regime and "Palestinian" and their "leaders" the bulk of the membership of "Momentum" do not and if the "Great Leader" says that he supports BDS as a means of bringing down Israel then "his" crew are highly likely to support any "Palestinian" position against any view held by a Jew, whether in Israel or in the UK.

7: One Inquiry into the OULC led by Baroness Royall, led to another investigating racism, misogyny, intimidation. Over 50 members, some quite high profile members too, at least four Constituency Labour Parties suspended. Labour's NEC tried it's best to muzzle Royall's report, the second Inquiry led by Chakrabarti was a classic "whitewash" it's sole purpose the second the full content of Royall's report was known (No thanks to Labour or it's NEC).

8: Baroness Royall made a number of recommendations some of them she clearly stated as requiring urgent and immediate attention to address concerns related to anti-Semitism - Apparently Labour's NEC have decided to ignore those recommendations and Hamas and Hezbollah still remain firm friends of the "Great Leader".


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 09:20 AM

Good points Teribus but there is one thing missing. The question was "Do you believe that Labour party members are more likely to be antisemitic than anyone else?" Your points, albeit valid, do not address the question as they do not perform the necessary comparison with others. Do we have any statistics showing what the percentage of antismites is in the Labour party compared to incidence in the rest of the population. Unless we do, how can anyone say that Labour party members are more likely to be antisemitic than anyone else? Please note, I am talking about Labour party members in general. Not any subset of that.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 09:46 AM

Here we go again.😡

PointlesspointlesspointlesspointlesspointlessPOINTLESSpointbloodyless...


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 09:47 AM

Don't forget Mosley Jim. He more than anyone is the inspiration for the current bunch.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 10:13 AM

"Simple short answer to that on examination of the "evidence" is YES."
Nice to see the "evidence" in inverted commas at long last
The nest step is to find what it is.
Accusations are not "evidence" - they are only allusions.
Evidence proper is a full description of what accusations consist of.
I know plenty of people who find black people intimidating or don't trust Orientals or Asians
For these accusations to become tangible they need to be described
Your suggestion of post Milliband antisemitism doesn't make sense - antisemitism is the domain of the right - it was that particular school of thought that condemned six million Jews to death
This is what Corbyn said about the report accusations - makes far more sense than believing that a philosophy based on anti-bigotry suddenly about faced, coincidently when Corbyn announced his support for BDS

"Although the committee heard evidence that 75% of antisemitic incidents come from far right sources, and the report states there is no reliable evidence to suggest antisemitism is greater in Labour than other parties, much of the report focuses on the Labour party.
As the report rightly acknowledges, politicising antisemitism – or using it as a weapon in controversies between and within political parties – does the struggle against it a disservice."
Corbyn added that he believed the committee was unfair in its criticism of Chakrabarti for being insufficiently independent. "This fails to acknowledge public statements that the offer to appoint Chakrabarti to the House of Lords came after completion of her report, and was based on her extensive legal and campaigning experience," he said.

This is an official by the Jewish Socialist Group, far more authoritative that the right wing on the socialist aims of the party than career politicians like Milliband and his ilk
Jim Carroll

"Statement on "Labour's problem with antisemitism"
From the Jewish Socialists' Group
Antisemitism exists and must be exposed and fought against in the same way as other forms of racism by all who are concerned with combating racism and fascism.
Antisemitism and anti-Zionism are not the same. Zionism is a political ideology which has always been contested within Jewish life since it emerged in 1897, and it is entirely legitimate for non-Jews as well as Jews to express opinions about it, whether positive or negative. Not all Jews are Zionists. Not all Zionists are Jews.
Criticism of Israeli government policy and Israeli state actions against the Palestinians is not antisemitism. Those who conflate criticism of Israeli policy with antisemitism, whether they are supporters or opponents of Israeli policy, are actually helping the antisemites. We reject any attempt, from whichever quarter, to place legitimate criticism of Israeli policy out of bounds.
Accusations of antisemitism are currently being weaponised to attack the Jeremy Corbyn-led Labour party with claims that Labour has a "problem" of antisemitism. This is despite Corbyn's longstanding record of actively opposing fascism and all forms of racism, and being a firm a supporter of the rights of refugees and of human rights globally.
A very small number of such cases seem to be real instances of antisemitism. Others represent genuine criticism of Israeli policy and support for Palestinian rights, but expressed in clumsy and ambiguous language, which may unknowingly cross a line into antisemitism. Further cases are simply forthright expressions of support for Palestinian rights, which condemn Israeli government policy and aspects of Zionist ideology, and have nothing whatsoever to do with antisemitism.
The accusations do not refer to antisemitic actions but usually to comments, often made on social media, long before Jeremy Corbyn won the Labour leadership. Those making the charges now, did not see fit to bring them up at the time, under previous Labour leaders, but are using them now, just before mayoral and local elections, when they believe they can inflict most damage on the Labour Party led by Jeremy Corbyn.
The attack is coming from four main sources, who share agendas: to undermine Jeremy Corbyn as leader of Labour; to defend Israeli government policy from attack, however unjust, racist and harmful towards the Palestinian people; and to discredit those who make legitimate criticisms of Israeli policy or Zionism as a political ideology. As anti-racist and anti-fascist Jews who are also campaigning for peace with justice between Israelis and Palestinians, we entirely reject these cynical agendas that are being expressed by:

• The Conservative Party

• Conservative-supporting media in Britain and pro-Zionist Israeli media sources

• Right-wing and pro-Zionist elements claiming to speak on behalf of the Jewish community

• Opponents of Jeremy Corbyn within the Labour party.
The Jewish Socialists' Group recognises that ordinary Jewish people are rightly concerned and fearful about instances of antisemitism. We share their concerns and a have a proud and consistent record of challenging and campaigning against antisemitism. But we will not support those making false accusations for cynical political motives, including the Conservative Party, who are running a racist campaign against Sadiq Khan, and whose leader David Cameron has referred to desperate refugees, as "a swarm" and "a bunch of migrants". The Conservative Party demonstrated their contempt for Lord Dubs, a Jewish refugee from Nazism, when they voted down en masse an amendment a few days ago to allow 3,000 child refugees into Britain while Labour, led by Jeremy Corbyn, gave total support to Lord Dubs and his amendment.
The Jewish Socialists' Group sees the current fearmongering about antisemitism in the Labour Party for what it is – a conscious and concerted effort by right-wing political forces to undermine the growing support among Jews and non-Jews alike for the Labour Party leadership of Jeremy Corbyn, and a measure of the desperation of his opponents.
We stand against antisemitism, against racism and fascism and in support of refugees. We stand for free speech and open debate on Israel, Palestine and Zionism."


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 10:17 AM

"Don't forget Mosley Jim."
I don't David - nor do I forget that Nazi is short for national Socialist.
Totally meaningless if your aim has nothing whatever to do with Socialism.
My family weer Socialists in pre-war Liverpool and they took to the streets to stop Mosely's Blackshirts who weer being defended by the good old British bobbies
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 10:18 AM

DtG - I believe I did answer your simple question fully, giving my reasons for what I believe - something you never do, but there again you very rarely ever say anything and obviously believe very little.

Now for anyone arguing the opposite in your view wouldn't they have to have the same statistics to argue their point? And remember nobody is, or has ever argued that the Labour Party is anti-Semitic, only that there is a problem with anti-Semitism within the Labour Party that has become increasingly more noticeable since Corbyn took over. And YES for the reasons I have given - "I do believe that Labour party members are more likely to be antisemitic than anyone else?" with such a leader in charge.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 10:20 AM

"I agree Raggytash but surely the answer is to open a new thread on the beauties of the English countryside."

Oi, Connemara's in IRELAND!! Racism!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 10:29 AM

Fair enough, Teribus. You have made it quite clear that it is your belief and cannot back it up with any facts. I can live with that and have often said the same. As long as we know it is just a belief rather than a hard fact we can work round it.

I must say I love this though. but there again you very rarely ever say anything and obviously believe very little. If I rarely say anything then why do you argue with me so often? :-)

Now, back from the ridiculous to the sublime. It is my belief that the three peaks area of Yorkshire is one of the finest scenic locations in the country. And that comes from a Lancastrian! There are prettier places and there are grander places but none that I know of have such diversity in such a compact area.

Cheers

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 10:31 AM

You have still not answered the question. Do you believe that Labour party members are more likely to be antisemitic than anyone else? It really is a simple question.

It is not as simple as the questions that Steve and Jim refuse to answer.
How would I know if they are more likely to be anti-Semitic or not?
All I have to go on is the fact that Labour itself believes it has a serious problem, and who am I to argue with them?

Jim,
"No I am not!"
You have accused me of antisemitism - yes you are


I have not Jim.
I just pointed out to you that comparing Israel to the Nazis, which you do, is anti-Semitic by the most widely used definition of it.

Then you are more stupid than you appear to be - Bobad does it all the time, so does bBearded Bruce, MtheGM did it, and numerous others, regularly

Then it will be easy for you to provide an example.

The Israeli Minister of Justice said it publicly and you supported her doing so.....


I did not, and I do not accept that she did.

A reliable witnesses's SUBSTANTIATED EVIDENCE may be accepted or rejected alongside all evidence but never at any time would an unsubstantiated accusation be ever be taken seriously -

These are witnesses who say they have seen and heard anti-Semitism within Labour.
Such a witness statement is hard evidence for a court, and several would be proof beyond reasonable doubt for any intelligent jusry.
Case proven.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 10:37 AM

I made the severe error of doing the Three Peaks in a brand-new pair of boots that I'd bought the day before. We couldn't hang about either as we'd decided to do it on a gloomy day in late October. It took me five pints in a pub in Settle before the pain started to subside. Pendle and surrounds are one of my favourite areas. Only half an hour out of Bury up t'M66 an' all. All my dad's side come from round theer.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 10:38 AM

I haven't refused to answer it. I'm still thinking about it. I'll let you know. I'm a bit busy 'til November though.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 10:44 AM

Never done the three peaks all in one go. Did do the round of Kinder some years back from Hayfield - That was a killer as well. 25 miles and up and down Kinder Scout 4 times! Called in the Sportsman pub near the start of the mass trespass when we had finished and had drunk our pints before the barman had made it back with our change! One really odd thing on that walk. We started about 7:30 am and as we made our way up the Snake path there were 2 blokes coming down dressing in 1930s hiking gear. Tweeds, shirts and ties an all. Very odd.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 10:46 AM

Dave,
You have made it quite clear that it is your belief and cannot back it up with any facts.

You have had lots of facts.
Numerous suspensions.
The statement last week from Baroness Royale.
Statements from numerous prominent people including Sadiq Khan, Tom Watson, the current and former leaders of Scottish labour, and the "entire NEC" which includes Corbyn himself.

Labour has a serious problem with anti-Semitism, while other parties do not.
That is a fact, and is the full answer to your question.

Do you believe they are all lying Dave?
Do you have any evidence to justify dismissing any of them Dave?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 10:46 AM

Sorry - they were not dressing. They were already dressed. If they had have been dressing that would have been even stranger.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 10:53 AM

I have already said...

Oh, sorry, forget it was more than 2 posts ago.

I have already said that I believe that Labour does have a problem with antisemitism. I do not believe the problem is worse than any in any other group of people. You have said specifically that the problem is not the Labour party itself and you will not say whether you believe that labour party member are more prone to antisemitism than any other group of people. The only facts that you come out with is that some senior people within the Labour party have admitted that there is a problem and that they are working towards addressing it. Do you think that is a bad thing?

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 11:05 AM

Hmmmmmmmm So Momentum has FLOODED into the Labour party has it.

At the last count Momentum had 20,000 members.

The Labour Party 500,000.

I make that 4%, IF all 20,000 members FLOODED into Labour.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 11:07 AM

The Connemara is exceptionally beautiful and extremely varied. I would recommend it to anyone............. well nearly everyone.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 11:12 AM

Here is some more food for thought for you. Almost half of Britons hold antisemitic view, poll suggests .

Amongst lots of interesting facts and figures there are some gems. Including It also found that one in four (25%) Britons believed that Jews chase money more than other British people, a figure which rose to 39% of those participants who identified themselves as Ukip voters.

Now, I am sure people can so the sums but just how many people were suspended over allegations of antisemitism? Was it 50? Tell you what, I'll be kind and double that. No, hang on, Ill multiply by 10 and make it nice round 500. There are, what, 500,000 current members. 500 as a percentage of 500,000 anyone? Is it 39% like UKIP? Or 25% like the general public? Sorry, you will have to help me out here...

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 11:17 AM

Almost half of Britons hold antisemitic view, poll suggests

Doesn't surprise me in the least.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 11:25 AM

"You have had lots of facts."
None - and indicative of that fact is that once again you refuse to produce them here
You said the Jewish victims of the antisemitism refused to give dtails so how can we possinly have had them
Suspensions are inevitable when accusations are made - where are your facts
Why do yo persist in this Keith - haven't you humiliated yourself enough with your dishonesty?
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 11:27 AM

You rarely say anything, but you do ask a lot of questions, I answer them.

Oh and by the way you did ask what I BELIEVED. I detailed the facts that support that belief.

Corbyn Leader? Fact
Corbyn regards Hamas and Hezbollah as friends and is on record as stating such. Fact
Corbyn supports BDS Fact
Labour's NEC Commissioned an Inquiry into anti-Semitism in OULC. Fact
Baroness Royall stated that although not "institutionalised" anti-Semitism within the OULC did need to be addressed urgently and immediately. Fact
Royall's Inquiry prompted Labour to commission a far wider reaching Inquiry under Shami Chakrabarti. Fact
Labour's NEC fail to implement Baroness Royall's recommendations. Fact

Care to dispute any of those Facts Gnome? They've certainly unsettled and worried a number of Labour Party Members particularly Jewish members - another inconvenient Fact for you.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 11:31 AM

It is a worry and one that we should be ashamed of, bobad. Particularly considering that this survey has rates of antisemitism going down in other countries. There are factors like the number of Muslim residents who, whether we like it or not, are more likely to be antisemitic. The reasons for that are a different argument.

What it does show though is that while the other parties and the country in general do not seem to be acknowledging the issue, the Labour party is already addressing it. So, once again, we come to the point I keep trying to make. The Labour party membership are no more antisemitic than anyone else. Considerably less so if the figures add up. I know it is futile trying to get that point across though so we may as well stick to more pleasant topics like the Yorkshire dales, holidays and botany.

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 11:37 AM

I did ask what you believe, Teribus and, to your credit, you gave a good measured answer. It is still just a belief though and does not measure up to the facts produced in the surveys I have linked.

No, I do not dispute any of your facts and there is no real need to embolden the word. None of them indicate that the Labour party have a bigger issue than anyone else though do they. In fact, they show that the Labour party are already addressing the issue while everyone else seems to have difficulty even acknowledging that antisemitism is a problem in general.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 12:07 PM

Er, look a little more closely, Dave. Corbyn, in front of a Home Affairs Select Committee, expressed regret for calling Hamas and Hezbollah friends, regretted his choice of words and giving the explanation that he was trying to be inclusive at the time, encouraging reconciliation. Issuing the "fact" Teribus-style is to intend to mislead by omission. If you leave it at the point where Corbyn called them friends and omitted the stuff I've just given you, you may be misled into thinking that that is still his opinion. Which it isn't. I think it's rather important, and far more honest, to give the full story. I know how inconvenient that can be when it flies in the face of a demonising agenda. Maybe I'll get back to the other stuff later. We had the most gorgeous rainbow here half an hour ago. Chicken and chips for tea!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 12:10 PM

Dave,
. I do not believe the problem is worse than any in any other group of people.

Why do you believe that?
No other party has had to deal with that issue. No other party has had all those complaints from within. You are in denial Dave.

senior people within the Labour party have admitted that there is a problem and that they are working towards addressing it. Do you think that is a bad thing?

No, but those people also say that Labour is not working towards addressing it. That is a bad thing.

We heard it from Labour Peer Baroness Royale just days ago, and she was appointed by Corbyn to lead an enquiry into it and produce a report which she says has been ignored.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 12:13 PM

"I do not dispute any of your facts and there is no real need to embolden the word. None of them indicate that the Labour party have a bigger issue than anyone else though do they" - DtG

"None of them indicate that the Labour party have a bigger issue than anyone else" - You mean ignoring the FACT that all the facts you accept are ALL specific to the LABOUR PARTY.

Going back to your YouGov Survey article in the Guardian - what was the percentage given of Jews questioned who no longer felt safe in the UK? Jewish Students do not feel safe attending University Labour Club debates and meetings - WHY? Because they are generally open and Labour Youth and Students vote to support BDS as does the Party Leader. Intimidation, racism and misogyny at Constituency Labour Parties. And they all seem to be at ones where dissent is shown to the Leader - Coincidence?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 12:16 PM

Why do you believe that?

Because nearly half of people in the UK display antisemitic leanings and it is nowhere near that in the Labour party. It is no so much that no other party has had to deal with it. It is that no other party has even looked yet. Do keep up Keith.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 12:19 PM

Jim,
You said the Jewish victims of the antisemitism refused to give dtails so how can we possinly have had them

They gave details to the party for them to deal with it.

We know for a fact that Labour has a serious problem because of statements from numerous prominent people including Sadiq Khan, Tom Watson, the current and former leaders of Scottish Labour, and the "entire NEC" which includes Corbyn himself.

Why do yo persist in this Keith

Only because you persist in denying it!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 12:25 PM

In May I'm taking a party of 10 on a week long tour of the Dingle peninsula. Another beautiful area.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 12:36 PM

"I detailed the facts that support that belief."
ow you are doin a Keith - if Labour is guilty of the accusations made against it what form does that antisemitism take and why is nobody prepared to describe it?

Corbyn Leader? Fact
Smokescrewen
Corbyn regards Hamas and Hezbollah as friends and is on record as stating such. Fact
No, but even if it was, that does NO mean there is a problem of antisemitism within the Labour Party
Corbyn said he regarded Hezbolah "friends" (around the time Britain was describing Assad as an ally and was still propping up the Qaddafi regime with arms and political support)
He has since withdrawn that description, saying he regretted making itit   
Corbyn supports BDS Fact
Good on him - BDS is supported by all religius denominaqtions and shades of political thought - Jews and no Jews alike - throughout the world
Labour's NEC Commissioned an Inquiry into anti-Semitism in OULC. Fact
Baroness Royall stated that although not "institutionalised" anti-Semitism within the OULC did need to be addressed urgently and immediately. Fact
And it was - it is not an indication that there was a majort problem or in anyway more of a phenomenon in the Laboutr Party - just that what there was needed to be dealt with.
Last March, the Tory Party was accused of having a problem with islamophobia - as a response, they appointed a racist as foreign secretary.
Royall's Inquiry prompted Labour to commission a far wider reaching Inquiry under Shami Chakrabarti. Fact
See above
Labour's NEC fail to implement Baroness Royall's recommendations. Fact
The enquiries that were hald found there to be no significant problem - fact
All smoke and mirrors - totally meaningless.
We are still waiting for the British Muslim's demand for an enquiry to be responded to - that we should all live that long!!!
There will be no proven problem with antisemitism in the Labour Party until it is described and quantified - until such time, it will remain merely unsubstantiated accusations.
Jim Carroll

A Jewish view of Labour antisemitism
AS A JEWISH LABOUR MEMBER, I'M SICK OF ANTI-SEMITISM BEING USED AS A POLITICAL WEAPON AGAINST JEREMY CORBYN
Michael Segalov
For years now I've travelled across the UK to report from far-right, fascist and neo-Nazi rallies. I've seen the real threat that faces Jews in the country, those who wear swastikas as badges of honour. Where was your concern for my community then?
It's become an all too regular occurrence, waking up to headlines reporting that anti-Semitism in the Labour party is now an endemic problem, and that bad feeling against Jewish people in the party is on an upward trajectory.
As a Jewish Labour Party member, they are stories that should have me alarmed. I know from experience just how dangerous anti-Semitism can really be: vast swathes of my ancestors were lost to the murderous hands of the Nazis, and observant Jewish friends of mine have been harassed and attacked on British streets. I've read the slurs, faced the trolls, had neo-Nazis shout abuse in my face.
And yet it's not just anger against bigots that hits as I scan story after story, but frustration towards those trying to use an all too real threat facing my community for their own political gain. Since Corbyn's election as Labour leader, unsupportive MPs, campaigning groups and journalists have been desperate to paint him and the movement who support him as anti-Semitic fanatics, despite knowing it's really not the case.
I could tell you about my own experiences, how I've never experienced or witnessed anti-Semitism inside the party – but that's just what I've seen, non-Jewish defenders of my religion will claim. My experiences, and those of countless other Corbyn-supporting Jewish members who I've spoken to, aren't reflective of what's really going on, apparently.
Just a few months ago, I found myself sat in the Channel 4 News studio, tasked with discussing anti-Semitism under Corbyn. Sat opposite me was John Woodcock MP, desperate to tell me it's the "hard-left" who are "associated [with] Soviet Russia" with anti-Semitic views infiltrating the party who were responsible for stirring up hatred.
Now, we only need look at the most high-profile of cases to see that anti-Semitism is by no means a product of Corbyn's supporters. Naz Shah, MP for Bradford West, was rightly suspended for sharing anti-Semitic posts on Facebook, not a Corbynite but a backer of Yvette Cooper in the last leadership election. Ken Livingstone, similarly sanctioned for his remarks about Hitler, has been a party grandee for decades. An insurgent? I think not.
Woodcock pointed me towards "a rise in anti-Semitic incidents" within the party, without having a single statistic or figure to back it up. It's an answer I hear time and time again, and for those of us – Jewish or otherwise – committed to fighting anti-Semitism, enough is enough.
It's tiring and it's frustrating, but moreover it's frankly dangerous.
For years now I've travelled across the UK to report from far-right, fascist and neo-Nazi rallies, and the counter-demonstrations that take place alongside. I've seen the real threat that faces Jews in the country, those who profess hatred for Jews and our religion, who wear swastikas as badges of honour, who'll salute like a Nazi in front of your face. Where was your concern for my community then?
It's not just the distinct absence of those MPs in Labour who now claim to be at the forefront of the fight against anti-Jewish prejudice that's striking, but the presence of those they now claim to be British Jewry's biggest threat.
It's the left, and Corbyn's supporters, who've put their bodies on the line time and time again to protect us from these racist organisations.
That's why these cries of anti-Semitism make a mockery of a real and present danger. Corbyn's commitment to fighting discrimination and prejudice has been well documented for decades. His supporters are those who've stood alongside him. Accusing these people now of peddling prejudice is nothing but political point-scoring at its worst. It undermines real hatred, and waters down the impact of calling out anti-Semitism when it rears its ugly head.
I'm not saying Labour members haven't experienced anti-Semitism inside the Labour Party, and of course, a progressive movement like Labour should hold itself to higher standards than other organisations. Those few who blindly label all incidents of anti-Semitism as anti-Corbyn slander and restrictions on critiquing Israel need to listen to the voices of victims and let conversations about Judaism and Israel be led by Jewish members: we are here and we know how to speak,
This isn't to say I don't value the concern, but I want to make a few things perfectly clear. Anti-Semitism is not a problem particular to Labour; using the words "Judaism" and "Israel" interchangeably is just as (if not more) common on the right as on the left.
Oppression, discrimination and Jewish identity are complex; the relationship between our religion and the state of Israel is constantly debated; disagreements will happen inside our community. Let us lead these discussions. Don't quickly take sides simply to advance your faction, angle or personal interests.
And if you're truly concerned about fighting racism and anti-Semitism, I look forward to seeing you stand alongside us in meetings and on the streets.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 01:02 PM

"They gave details to the party for them to deal with it."
You've given this excuse before Keith and followed it with your antisemitic suggestion that they did not describe that antisemitism publicly because of their love of the party
It is antisemitic to suggest that Jewish people would put the interests of a political organisation before that of their people
You said you had produced plenty of facts - you lied
Now you are back to your 'Jewish pact of silence' claim - make up your mind - which story are you going to stick with?.
Dig away - you'll get to Australia eventually
You don't know Labour has a serious problem - we only know Labour has treated the accusations seriously and held enquiries - a million miles from what is happening on the opposite bench in Parliament.
Put up your examples and nobody will be able to deny them - if they are substantiated.
You dishonest claimed you had already put them up - stop lying and put them up - that's what you would have to do in a court
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 01:26 PM

I loved the Dingle peninsula when we were there. Only spent a shot time there but even the journey was magical. I am sure you will be able to name the places I forgot so I will not look them up. We were staying in Finuge, hometown of Sean McCarthy, just outside Listowel. I cannot recal the full journey but I know we stopped briefly in Tralee before crossing a high mountain pass to drop down to Dingle itself. The view across the bay to Blasket (?) was stunning. After a stop in Dingle we headed off and followed a more roundabout route to get back.

They had a Sean McCarthy festival while we were in Finuge and I got to meet his widow! Part of the festivities were in the village hall which was dry but had a pub across the road. The number of people nipping out for 5 or 10 minutes at a time was quite phenomenal :-) There were also a lot of Irish rebel songs and stories, none of which I felt were threatening at all but one evening when I was in a bar in Listowel the local brancj of the Chelsea fan club came in after losing to Man United. When one asked where I was from I said Bolton :-)

Cheers

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 01:40 PM

Being a United supporter would not have mattered Dave, I drink in a pub over there that is firmly Arsenal (for some reason)never had a problem.

I spent a great afternoon in Bantry a few years back watching Ireland V England at Rugby Union, not once did I feel even slightly intimidated.

I will be watching the Ireland V England game over there again this year, not a problem.

A bit strange then that some people find any talk of holidays and botany on this site intimidating really.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 02:39 PM

Do you know the story of Mac City's manager, Steve Coppell walking down the street carrying a television set?
He bumped into his mate, who asked him, " What's with the teleevision set"
He replied, " I got it for the team"
"That was a good swap", came the reply
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 02:49 PM

if Labour is guilty of the accusations made against it what form does that antisemitism take and why is nobody prepared to describe it?

Why do we need to? I do not even care, but there is no doubt that Labour has a serious problem because all those people say so.
Or do you believe they all lie against their Party like you believe the deputy Leader does?

You've given this excuse before Keith and followed it with your antisemitic suggestion that they did not describe that antisemitism publicly because of their love of the party

I am sure that they all love their Party.
When they experience anti-Semitism within that Party, or any other kind of discrimination or intolerance, the standard thing to do is report it to the Party and let them deal with it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 02:56 PM

"Why do we need to? "
You've just said you have - are you admitted to having lied?
You chatge someone with something, you need to specify exactly what you are charging them with
What an incredibly stupid question - even for you
"but there is no doubt that Labour has a serious problem because all those people say so."
No they don't - you made that up as well
You are still anti semitically accusing the Jews of a pact of silence
You are a classic antisemite
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 03:15 PM

In 1977 we spent two lovely weeks staying at Nellie O'Neill's B&B at Cross Cloghane. We got to know her sister too, who ran Murphy's pub four miles down the road at Brandon. Nellie's lovely granddaughter Ellen served us breakfast. If we ate everything we got even more next morning. It even got to the pitch where we were getting chips on top of everything else! Saved on lunch...

That would be Conor Pass, Dave. It was a bit hairy on the day we first drove over it but I found the rare St Patrick's Cabbage up there. Not a cabbage at all, it's a saxifrage similar to the garden one called London Pride. We climbed Brandon Peak whilst there but it was a bit murky. 1977 wasn't the best summer for weather!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 03:55 PM

What did St Patrick say as he drove the snakes out of Ireland?

"Are you alright back there lads?"

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 04:05 PM

Anybody who thinks they can accuse somebody of something without specifying what is ******* insane
End of story
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: akenaton
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:00 PM

For all his faults, at least Jim sticks to the subject and the rules of the forum......the rest of you should be ashamed of yourselves.


If you want to chatter to one another do it on a thread set up for the purpose......what you are doing is forum abuse and moderation should take note.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 05:18 PM

What rules?

Careful, Jim. You've made a new friend...😂


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Greg F.
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:14 PM

With friends like that......


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 06:57 PM

......who needs enemas.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 07:28 PM

"Careful, Jim. You've made a new friend."
Go wash your mouth out
If you have anything to add to the hang-em-high non-response of these weirdos, feel free - they really are getting boring.
Meanwhile, back at the serious business:
A young black lad in Manchester was kicking a ball up against a wall when a scout for Man City spotted him.
He watched for ten minutes as the lad's skill became apparent - kicking the ball up over his head, back-heeling it, passing from heel to knee and back without hesitation.... absolutely superb.
After the display, the scout approached the lad and said, "how would you like to test for City?"
"**** off", said the lad - it's hard enough being black in this part of the world".
Or
A sweet little girl lived with her single-parent mother next to a site where they were building new houses.
Every morning she would go out and watch the men working through the wire around the site, till one day one of the men spotted her and asked her if she would like to sit down and watch.
They brought her on to the site, found her an old chair to sit on and the next day they had a whip-round and presented her with a little pink boiler-suit, a pink hard-hat and a little pink lunch-box with neatly cut cheese sandwiches and a bottle of pink lemonade inside.
At the end of the week they handed her a little pink envelope with her wages in it.
She ran home to her mother and handed her the money, and her mother said, "that's very nice dear; are you working next week?"
"It depends whether those ****** at the builders merchants deliver the blocks in time", was the reply.
G'night all
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 07:33 PM

Nora Murphy's Bar at Brandon is simply the most exquisite bar I have ever had the good fortune to drink in.

Mary Murphy was the forth generation of the family to run the bar, she was an absolute delight. So kind, so generous, a wonderful hostess. I cannot sing her praises highly enough.

The location of the bar is beautiful, wonderfully beautiful.

As one of our party said as he stood in the doorway, gazing at the amazing vista "take me God I'm ready"

Nothing in all in my 22 intervening years of drinking has come anywhere close.

Her nephew now runs the bar, I suspect it will not have changed one iota.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 07:41 PM

Sorry, Jim. He's no joke for sure. Amazing how someone like him who crows about "remoaners" as much as he does moans like a banshee when we are only doing such innocent things as telling gags, discussing the old days, reminiscing about our golden pasts, chatting about the nice places we know and cataloguing wild flowers. Disappointing coming from a man who does equally innocent things such as praising bigots like Trump and Farage, militating against equality and talking about horrendous leftie women. Remind me never to become a socialist just like him, Jim.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Feb 17 - 07:52 PM

Think we may have mentioned that bar before, Raggytash. We went there most nights during that two weeks. It was always packed out and none of the old boys bothered pouring their Guinness into glasses, shades of trendy modern types with their bottles of horse-piss lager. As the evening went on all the space under the wooden benches became taken up with dead men. One night we were treated to a girl of about ten playing the most devastatingly good tin whistle I've ever heard. Mrs Steve and I got involved in a bit of cloak and dagger, spiriting a huge salmon the provenance of which we didn't care to enquire about, down to the pub. Our reward was a hunk of the finest salmon I've ever eaten. Not from a fish farm, that one! The name Nora rings a bell. It was 1977 - does that fit time-wise? Anyway, Nellie was her sister, the lady who looked after us for a fortnight. Happy days!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 04:13 AM

Jim,
"but there is no doubt that Labour has a serious problem because all those people say so."
No they don't - you made that up as well


I can put all the quotes up again Jim, but I am sure everyone else remembers them.

You are still anti semitically accusing the Jews of a pact of silence

Ha ha! So silent that no-one knows about Labour's anti-Semitism! Ha ha!


Anybody who thinks they can accuse somebody of something without specifying what is ******* insane


When all those people say that Labour has a serious problem with anti-Semitism, anybody who thinks they are all lying to damage their own Party is ******* insane!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 05:10 AM

Put up the evidence of the accusations Keith - that'll do nicely
Until you do, you have no case
You have now reached the satage of multiple lying
you put up evidence - there is no evidence because the Jews prefer to support their party rather than their people - now back to your reinvention of what people are supposed to have said.
You really are an obsessive right wing hate monger
Know any good jokes?
If not, you really have well and truly shat in your own nest here
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 09:57 AM

there is no evidence because the Jews prefer to support their party rather than their people

No Jim. They experienced anti-Semitism and reported it to the Party to deal with.
All those women MPs who complained about Labour misogyny did the same, as did the gay MP who complained of homophobia.

Do you also claim that gays and feminists " prefer to support their party rather than their people ?"


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 10:05 AM

It's a much nicer atmosphere in the Yorkshire Dales, Jim. Or Whitby. Or Cornwall. Or Ireland or course :-)

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 10:07 AM

What Sadiq Khan said.
Do you think he is lying to damage his own Party and help the Government Of Israel Jim?
Do you like being laughed at?


Labour's leadership does not understand anti-Semitism, the party's London mayoral candidate has said as he criticised Jeremy Corbyn for not stopping "unacceptable" racism against Jews from some members.  
Sadiq Khan said recent high-profile incidents of anti-Semitism in Labour should be a "badge of shame" for the party and called for members of the ruling body to be retrained in what constitutes discrimination.
The Tooting MP also directly challenged his leader to take a "tougher stance" on the issue, saying he was "embarrassed" by the party's record and demanding it was time not just to "talk the talk" but "walk the walk"


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 10:13 AM

What the NEC said,
"The NEC are appalled by recent cases of anti-Semitic abuse. Anti-Semitism has no place in the Labour Party and is contrary to everything we stand for."

"at anti-Semitism within the Labour Party. The entire NEC recognises the seriousness of this issue "

That is the leadership, including Corbyn Jim.
Obviously you think you know much more than they do!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 10:14 AM

He's not the mayoral candidate. He's the mayor. And he's wrong.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 10:17 AM

And he's wrong.

You really believe you know more about Labour's problem than Khan does!

You must like being laughed at too Steve.
Ha ha ha.
There you go.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 10:21 AM

Instead of offering peoples opinions professor, provide some evidence.

Anyone can make a claim about anything, but to substantiate that claim evidence is needed.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 10:25 AM

Steve, I first came across the bar in 1995. Mary Murphy was the landlady then. I believe she is the daughter of Nora, after whom the bar in still named.

We had a tremendous day there that year and when I got back to the UK I dropped her a line to say Thank-You. That was at Easter. That Christmas, and every Christmas since, I have had a card from her. We've visited on numerous occasions in the intervening years and always enjoyed wonderful hospitality and it must be the best location of any bar I have ever been in.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 10:42 AM

I am not posting random opinions Rag.
These are the statements of well placed, high ranking Labour officials on their own experience of Labour anti-Semitism.

Reliable witnesses. Their statements would be considered hard evidence in any court, and put together any intelligent jury would accept them as proof beyond reasonable doubt.

Do you imagine yourself better informed than Sadiq Khan and Labour's National Executive Committee Rag?
Really?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 10:49 AM

You could cite the Queen of Sheba, without evidence it is meaningless.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 10:50 AM

I still do not know if it is any worse in the Labour party than elsewhere. No one can seem to or is willing to put a figure on this 'serious problem'. To quote from the survey I linked before

It also found that one in four (25%) Britons believed that Jews chase money more than other British people, a figure which rose to 39% of those participants who identified themselves as Ukip voters.

What is the percentage of Labour voters in this scenario. Is worse than 39% or worse than 25%? Unless the people making the claim that the antisemitism is worse in the Labour party than elsewhere then their case is not proven.

Seemples.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 10:55 AM

Rag, the Queen of Sheba is not a high ranking Labour insider.
Are you claimimg that Khan, the NEC and all the others are wrong, as Steve does, or lying as Jim does?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 11:05 AM

No professor, I am not saying they are wrong. I do not have the information to do that.

I am saying they have only offered opinion.

The reasons for their opinions could vary from a dislike for Corbyn to their having a bit on the side with May.

I do not know .......... and more to the point neither do you.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 11:24 AM

For Christ's sake Keith - when will you get it into your head that you will never convict anybody of anything unless you specify what you are accusing them of
Doesn't it occur to you as strange that you, nor anybody else is totally incapable of describing the antisemitism that is supposed to be taking place or give a figure to it?
Absolute insanity, by anybody's reckoning.
We really have been here over and over again
Sadiq Khan made his remards at the time of the mayoral election
He believed Corbyn to be a barrier to his winning and he is an opponent of his policy - of course he is goint to use an tactic to win votes at such a time
He does not specify either the type of antisemitism he is referring to nor does he give numbers - he simply refers to its existence - NOBODY ARGUES THAT THERE ARE NO ANTISEMITES IN THE LABOUR PARTY _ OF COURSE THERE ***** ARE
"Badge of shame is a bit of a soundbite with Khan - he used the term to condemn the that the fact that London only took 34 refugees is "London's Badge of Shame", but I very much doubt if he is your hero on that one, knowing your attitude to Muslims.
You have lied, you have twisted what people have said, you have repeated yourself over and over again BUT UNTIL YOU PUT A FACE AND A NUMBER TO THE ANTISEMITISM YOU ARE OBSESSIVELY ACCUSING LABOUR OF HAVING YOU HAVE NO CASE - NOT A SHRED OF ONE
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 11:28 AM

"or lying as Jim does?"
Don't you dare take what I am saying out of context again, you despicably dishonest wretch
You have exactly what I say about politicians and the reasons they do what they do
I am saying that you are deliberately taking what these people say and taking it out of context - you have always adopted the same tactic when you are in a corner - it has become part of your standard dishonesty
Now ******* stop it
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 01:43 PM

Rag,
I am saying they have only offered opinion.

No. They are reporting their experiences, not offering opinions.

Jim,
We really have been here over and over again

I know. Why did you ask for it all over again?

you will never convict anybody of anything unless you specify what you are accusing them of

I am not convicting anyone of anything.
I am just reporting that Labour has a problem with anti-Semistism according to Labour itself.

If "The NEC are appalled by recent cases of anti-Semitic abuse" then you make yourself ridiculous by denying there were any.

Note Rag, they are stating facts not offering opinions.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 01:47 PM

Jim,
You have exactly what I say about politicians and the reasons they do what they do

No we have not.
You ducked the question and refused to answer.

I will ask you again.
When they report anti-Semitism in their Party are they lying?


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 03:09 PM

No one has ever argued that there is no antisemitism in the Labour party. Just that it is no worse than anywhere else and a damn sight less than in some parties. Saying that people are denying there is any at all is classic straw man.

Jim, Raggy, Steve. Have you ever denied that there is any antisemitism? I am pretty sure you have not and I certainly haven't.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 03:27 PM

"You ducked the question and refused to answer."
I've answered it four times - stop telling lies
"When they report anti-Semitism in their Party are they lying?"
Some are - as I have said, the ones who are attempting to remove Corbyn by any method.
I have no doubt that some have lied - it has been proved beyond a doubt that foremost among those who have made claims are connected directly with Israel and have expressed their opposition to B.D.S.
Whether they are lying or whether they accept the Israeli line that opposition to Israeli policy is immaterial really - both end up in the same place - a distortion of the term "antisemitic".
Israel is mentioned 42 times in Parliamentary report on antisemitism - criticism of Israel is not antisemitic - on the contrary, to suggest it is is antisemitic by definition.   
"I know. Why did you ask for it all over again?"
I didn't ask you to rais Saiq Khan again, which was what I was referring to - I covered that particular situation months ago yet you are still raising it as if it's a new piece of evidence.
You have accused the Jewish members of Parliament of dishonesty - you said they refused to describe the antisemitism because they put the interests of the party first - how ******* dishonest if that?
Personally, I believe that is just a sign of your own antisemitism.
I have no doubt whatever that some members of the Labour Party accept the Israeli line that criticism of Israel is antisemitic - not dishonest, just agenda driven politicking.
This argument of your is pointless Keith.
You have been given acess to a long article by a large member of ordinary Jewish Labour Party Members saying that there is no problem of antisemitism and that the whole thing has been conjured up by supporters of the Israeli regime and right wing opponents of Corbyn ARE THEY ALL LYING?
You have been given statements by several life-long Jewish activists in the Labour Party saying exactly the same thing ARE THEY LYING?
The suggestion that the propaganda campaign which is spending billions attempting to offset B.D.S. manufactured the charges against Labour, first appeared publicly in a long article carried by Haaretz WERE THEY LYING?
Jewish academics and activists throughout the world have made exactly the same suggestion ARE THEY ALL LYING?
There is once certain way to find out who is lying and who is telling the truth QUALIFY AND QUANTIFY YOUR CLAIM OF A PROBLEM AND YOU HAVE MADE YOUR CASE - UNTIL YOU DO, YOU ARE MAKING AN IDIOT OF YOURSELF - BRITISH LAW CLEARLY STATES THAT A PERSON IS INNOCENT UNTIL THEY ARE PROVED GUILTY - ACCUSATIONS ARE NOT PROOF
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 03:31 PM

Large number of ordinary Jewish Labour Party Members - "large member" doesn't bear thinking about!!
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 03:40 PM

Al Jazeera uncovers the "Israeli" plot to undermine the Labour party with accusations of anti-Semitism:

The Lobby


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Greg F.
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 03:42 PM

There's that midge again, gol-dang it!


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 03:44 PM

Arabs always lie don't they Bobad?
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 03:59 PM

No one has ever argued that there is no antisemitism in the Labour party.

No Dave but they have denied that it is a serious problem even though all those senior people say it is.

Jim has just told us that he believes some are actually lying about it.
He has suggested they lie to damage their own Party, and they do it for the Government of Israel!

I would value your opinion of those views Dave.


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 04:11 PM

There is a considerable body of opinion on this forum that believe that you are a complete pain in the arse professor.

Using your own logic they must be correct.

I presume I am correct to come to that conclusion ...........


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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 08 Feb 17 - 04:16 PM

Incidentally that body of opinion also includes most of the Moderators.

Now I have no evidence of this, but as I have stated that as my opinion I trust you will accept it as fact.


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