BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 06 Mar 17 - 06:01 PM

I would not normally refresh a thread that had run it's course (several times over), however time and time again we read of child abuse by the clergy and by teachers.

Here is yet another, was this person doing the abuse because of "culture" or was he doing it because he was both a TEACHER and a VICAR. Is the culture of these groups responsible.

Link

Could I suggest that each time you read of such an occurance that they are posted here in order to get a balanced view of this problem.

Teachers and vicars do seem to be a major factor in child abuse, perhaps someone who has been a teacher and is a practicing member of a church could throw light on this.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Mar 17 - 04:52 PM

Reminds me of an incident in the late seventies when I was an Inner London Teachers' Association delegate at a London NUT meeting. My old mucker Blair Peach was my co-conspirator at that meeting and we sat at the back of the hall as the chairperson called a register, forced by the right wing (aka the communists - honest! 😂), in order to make sure that the upcoming vote on industrial action was going to be fair (things were fraught like that in those gloriously militant times). It took ages for all eighty names to be called and there was a goodly amount of insolent piss-taking during the proceedings. One of the delegates was called Littlejohn (he lived on a canal narrowboat as I recall). The chairman called "Littlejohn?" and yer man called "Present!" Before the chairman could call the next name, Blair, who had a bad stammer but triumphantly overcame it on that occasion, bellowed "Friar Tuck?" and the whole place collapsed in utter mirth. Those were the days!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Mar 17 - 04:27 PM

You can be anything you like, Raggy, but I must warn you that the anagram of Alan-a-Dale is AA Land Ale.

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Mar 17 - 04:22 PM

Could I opt to be Alan-a-Dale

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Mar 17 - 04:13 PM

You can be Robin of the Hood, yo Steve. Raggy - Fancy the job of Will Scarlett? Jim, that leaves Little John for you.

Anyone can make Marion. (Sexist, I know. Sorry. Poor puns are my forte.)

Keith can be The Sheriff of Knotty Ash, Teribus can be Prince John (American terminology) and Ake can be a cute Guy of Gisbum posing in see through boxers :-)

Boy, this beats politics into a cocked hat.

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Mar 17 - 03:42 PM

Well without underpants I would have unsupported assertions, though things are getting less assertive the older I get... 😳 Unfortunately, I still have an unopened five-pairs-for eight-quid Asda pack of bebuttoned boxers, so I'm currently not in the knicker market. Friar Tuck? Tria F**k? I'm not offering to be Maid Marian, pal!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Mar 17 - 01:37 PM

BTW. Don't follow that link I gave you for underpants. You will be plagued by adverts for what I can only refer to as gentleman's lingerie. Unless you want to buy something special to wear for Mrs Steve?:-)

Are spittle flecked rants like little speckled pants?

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Mar 17 - 01:28 PM

Sounds better than spittle flecked rants, lies and historians, Steve. If we are going to be an official band of outlaws can we all have new names? If so can I be Friar Tuck? Spoonerised if possible :-)

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Mar 17 - 04:18 AM

"TTFN. I'll try not to be back, but I can't guarantee it."
Ah Cmon Backie
Is it something we said?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 07:49 PM

I was with you in spirit, Raggytash, and I was even up north, but I had to give Mother priority (as ever). Just to say that the rather flippant-sounding account of the incident outside Prestwich M&S Simply Food was accurate in every detail!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 07:02 PM

Had a fabulous weekend raising monies for the Runswick Bay Rescue Boat.

Brill !!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 06:13 PM

I've decided, in my infinite wisdom, to not ask the mods to shut this thread. There are far better ways of defeating the gentlemen to our far-right. Ridicule, recipes, wild flowers, joviality, Yorkshire Dales, jokes, calling them piles of poo...that's the way to do it! Show them that we are humanity personified and invite them to join the human race! They lose! There can be no more vile threads! Sherlock Steve and his merry band/gang/mob/pack will subvert at will! Mods, you can retire!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 04:21 PM

Knock knock

Who's there?

Big Issue!

Bless you!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 04:13 PM

Never been to Alton Towers in my life, Jim - my idea of absolute hell!

When I said I'd been away, I meant 'away from Mudcat'. I've been trying to wean myself off this mad-house, and this is about the longest I've ever managed.

But, if you regard sessions, a singaround or two, playing a couple of gigs, and attending an Archie Fisher concert as 'nice' (and I do!), then I've been to several 'somewheres nice'!

TTFN. I'll try not to be back, but I can't guarantee it.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 02:48 PM

"enjoy the ride :-)
Speaking of which. Been anywhere nice?"
Bet he want to Alton Towers!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 01:11 PM

Well, BWM, I have reached the conclusion that it is not worth trying to communicate with some and is is far easier just to sit back and enjoy the ride :-)

Speaking of which. Been anywhere nice?

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 09:45 AM

So, I've been away for a week or two - what conclusion have you all come to? Reached any kind of agreement, compromise or accommodation?

Thought not. See ya in another couple of weeks...

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 05:30 AM

"I know, Jim, but I feel we are doing a service."
I'd let 'Mind' or 'The Percy Bilton' charities deal with that one if I were you Dave
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 05:08 AM

I know, Jim, but I feel we are doing a service. Bit like care in the community I suppose.

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 04:22 AM

"I am sure that everything that is going to be said has been, "
I couldn't agree more Dave - then why prolong it and continue to give this squalid bunch the attention they are seeking ?
They'll die of the bordome generated by their own company if we don't respond to tham
To borrow Keith's memorable phrase "my job's done here"
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 04:03 AM

Like a spiral in a spiral
Like a wheel within a wheel
Never ending or beginning
On an ever spinning reel

I am sure that everything that is going to be said has been, everything that is going to be misrepresented has been misrepresented and everyone has accused everyone else of everything by now. Best just get on with things that have not been introduced yet. Just by way of ideas -

1. Quantum mechanics
2. The role of the pigs bladder in medieval mystery plays
3. James Bond

Knock, knock.
Who's there?
Bigish
Bigish who?
No thanks I have already bought one.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 03:53 AM

"This perfectly illustrates the persistence and obsessiveness of Jew hating ideologue"
Do I have to remind you of your claiming that all Palestinians refusing to leave the area Israel claims as its own should be exterminated, or that Bedouins should be herded into compounds and made to wear identification tags, or chemical weapons should be used to keep pPalestinians in order, or the massive cut-'n-paste you7 dredged from fascist sites like Muslim Watch and The White Supremacist claiming that Arabs were't fit to de described as humans?
Please take your antisemitic linking of criticism of Israel with hatred of the Jews elsewhere and come back when you are prepared to criticise your friend's claim that Jews in Parliament would rather defend their party than expose antisemitism
You are a hypoctite as well as an antisemite
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: akenaton
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 03:30 AM

I think Steve has finally found his true level, Mr T.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 04 Mar 17 - 01:06 AM

Further examples of what you consider to be "measured and careful argument" there Shaw?

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 09:39 PM

Poo poo is it Stevie, sorry but that's not my predilection, but whatever turns you on. Who am I to judge?

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 09:26 PM

Ooh darling! Hard to get is what I am! I'm not your type! I poo-poo you, booboo!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 09:15 PM

You don't matter! Live with it!

Your obsession with me says otherwise but you're probably just playing hard to get. I'm always up for the challenge.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 08:23 PM

Bobad pobad poobad poorbad poorbear poobear poor hair pube hair poo sticks poor bastard. Say goodnight to the folks, Poor Do! You don't matter! Live with it!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 08:18 PM

Well Dave, me Mum always buys a Big Issue off t'bloke who's always outside Prestwich M&S Simply Food. She sez to me this affy, hey Steve, 'ave yer got change for t'Big Issue man? Ah sez back, yeah, how much d'yer need? She sez two quid. Ah sez TWO QUID? TWO BLOODY QUID??! That's not "change," ah sez! My idea o' change is an absolute max of 47p. Owt above that is brass, not "change." Any 'ow, I 'ad ter stump up. Two bloody quid down on t'deal. Bloody good job I'm not a tyke, otherwise I'd 'a slit me own bloody throat wi' rusty machete by now!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 08:03 PM

Hey Shaw, love the self portraits, they capture your essence, if you know what I mean.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 07:44 PM

You're another pile of poo too, poobad!

Nyah nyah na nyah nyah!

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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 07:31 PM

(UK) Whither the Labour Party
Opened by Keith A of Hertford

Keith A of Hertford - PM
Date: 29 Apr 16 - 03:49 AM

On this thread, Jim attacked Israel on 29 Apr 16 - 06:23 AM

This perfectly illustrates the persistence and obsessiveness of Jew hating ideologues. It reminds me of a time on Mudcat with a different group of the same persuasion. IIRC it was during another war where Israel was forced to defend itself against Hamas attacking it. That, as usual, spawned several 1000+ post threads with the self proclaimed champions of justice railing against "Israeli" atrocities. The discussion got around to why the focus on Israel when there are so many atrocities going on in the world at the time, Darfur etc. The then "usual suspects" proclaimed themselves to be just as concerned about those as well despite there being no threads on that topic let alone 1000+ ones denouncing them. That led me to start a thread titled something like "Atrocities Other than Israeli" to give them opportunity to show us their concern about all the other injustices going on in the world, not only Israel's . Well, as you can probably guess, it took but all of three or four posts to that thread before Israel was brought into it. And they try to make everyone believe that they are not Jew haters.....lol.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 07:25 PM

You may be a prophet but can you make a profit? Like Keith says, I'm just an immoral shit so I suppose I am allowed to scrounge money off you?

Maybe a percentage of the money you make modelling underpants?

In the immortal (or is it immoral) words of Mrs Doyle

Go on, go on, go on, go on, go on.

I'm sure someone will...

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 05:04 PM

And you're just a big pile of poo! Nyah nyah na nyah nyah!

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Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 04:48 PM

No Shaw simply a dissembling liar.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 04:00 PM

I'm a prophet! I'm a prophet! 🕺🏻


🕵🏼‍♀️

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 03:52 PM

The rant and delusions of someone trapped by a bankrupt ideology.

Thread Summary

Born out of two previous threads that were both closed down
1: (UK) Whither the Labour Party
Opened by Keith A of Hertford

Keith A of Hertford - PM
Date: 29 Apr 16 - 03:49 AM

Only a few months into JC's leadership and they are in real trouble.
What is it with the hard left and anti-semitism?

By way of explanation Ken Livingston had just been suspended by the Labour Party for making anti-Semitic remarks.

On this thread, Jim attacked Israel on 29 Apr 16 - 06:23 AM.

The thread was closed one post after this from Steve Shaw:

Steve Shaw - 05 Oct 16 - 02:01 PM

There are now two Labour threads. This one is utterly toxic and infested by trolls. We don't need two threads. I appeal to the moderators to shut this one down.

2: Labour Party Discussion
Opened by MGOH and closed by Joe Offer with an explanatory note appended to the last post from Steve Shaw:
I don't care who's right and who's wrong - I just want the fighting to stop.
Thread closed. Feel free to start a new thread on the subject, but don't open old wounds. Talk about the frickin' subject."

On the subject of opening old wounds on this thread Jim Carroll attacked Israel on 15 Aug 16 - 02:40 AM.

3: Uk Labour Party discussion II
Keith A opened it after MGOH's thread had been closed

As to opening old wounds on this thread:
Who was it brought up an off topic thread from 2011 - Jim Carroll
Who was it dragged up an off topic thread from 2014 - Steve Shaw

In the course of this thread - on off topic subjects that they themselves introduced - both have been exposed as liars.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 03:04 PM

"How about backing up your claims with evidence for once?"
You are one of those who whinge that I provide too much evidence
Make up yourr mind
You'll find that everything I have4 said is fully verifiable from any historian.
The list of Hitlers backers are official
The assassination of Trotskt=y in Mexico is an incontrovertible fact
Britain's appeasement of Germany is part of our history
"And remember Jim that Stalin was Hitler's ally"
And remember that Stalin was Britain's Ally - Good old Uncle Joe - Russia having been previously invaded by fourteen countries, including Britain, in order to assist the return of the Tzar
Pissss off Keith - you have no concept of history other than that you have gleaned to "win" something.
We have argued every last one of these points ad nauseum - you failed to "win" then - little chance of you "winning now.
I do not defend what Stalin did, he betrayed the left in doing what he did.
You seem to forget that Russia only had a revolution to escape the mindless Imperial bloodbath of World War One.
Piss of and go and persecute Muslim families that can't fight back - that seems to be what turns you on.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 02:34 PM

I'll model the underpants, Dave, as soon as I've had my next Brazilian and have secured the right to have the caption "Down, girls!" placed at the bottom of every shot.

Thread summary:

Keith starts silly thread, having the usual ulterior motives.

Keith defends the indefensible.

Teribus defends both the indefensible and Keith, who is already indefensible.

Teribus gets obsessively repetitive, forgets to tell the truth, misses points left right and centre, gets all irrelevant, then defends Keith again.

Teribus attacks anyone who is not slightly to the right of Mussolini. This is repeated ad nauseam. We know who we are.

Keith maintains his efforts to make thread all about him then complains that we are making thread all about him.

Teribus and Keith maintain that lies told years ago are OK because they are no longer lies.   

Too many normal, sane people, known as the gang/mob/pack, etc., get sucked in and thereby threaten their own sanity.

Steve writes to mod asking for insane thread to be closed.

Teribus and Keith crow that we're only trying to get thread closed because we haven't got an argument.

Keith says "you lose."

Teribus comes up with spittle-flecked rant and alt-truth version of thread summary. Unless Keith beats him to it.

(The last four points haven't happened yet. Stop me if you dare!)

Sherlock

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 02:08 PM

Dunno, Keith. You are the font of all knowledge. I am just an immoral shit.

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 02:03 PM

Jim,
"Not true. "
Go find a decent historian Keith

How about backing up your claims with evidence for once?

Stalins main victims were "the left"

Medevedev's grim bookkeeping included the following tragic episodes: 1 million imprisoned or exiled between 1927 to 1929; 9 to 11 million peasants forced off their lands and another 2  to 3 million peasants arrested or exiled in the mass collectivization program; 6 to 7 million killed by an artificial famine in 1932-1934; 1 million exiled from Moscow and Leningrad in 1935; 1 million executed during the ''Great Terror'' of 1937-1938; 4 to 6 million dispatched to forced labor camps; 10 to 12 million people forcibly relocated during World War II; and at least 1 million arrested for various "political crimes" from 1946 to 1953.

And remember Jim that Stalin was Hitler's ally when they both invaded Poland, and the far left here cheered them on.

Dave,
But it is based on the ridiculous premise that any dictator can be justified by saying he is not as bad as another.

That is a ridiculous premise, but who has made it?

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 12:40 PM

"Not true. "
Go find a decent historian Keith
Stalin removed all the socialists from the Soviet leadership and had the main one, Leon Trotsky, murdered
Stalinism has sweet fulck all to do with Socialism - it was a system gone wrong, whith Stalin the main cause of its downfall
On the other hand, Hitler was supported into power by German Capitalism - it was a natural progression of the defeat of the left in Germany
The main supporters of Nazism were the giant companies - Krupps and Essen among the greatest, along with numerous American financiers   
E. Roland Harriman Vice president of W. A. Harriman & Co., New York
H.J. Kouwenhoven Nazi banker, managing partner of August Thyssen Bank and Bank voor Handel Scheepvaart N.V. (the transfer bank for Thyssen's funds)
J. G. Groeningen Vereinigte Stahlwerke (the steel cartel which also funded Hitler)
C. Lievense President, Union Banking Corp., New York City
E. S. James Partner Brown Brothers, later Brown Brothers, Harriman & Co.
Politicians in Britain, included Churchill, while not becoming directly involved, appeased the rise of German fascism, looking on "New Germany to act as a bulwark against Bolshevism"
America's greatest ally in Vietnam was self proclaimed Hitler admirer, Marshall Kee, the murderous Greek Junta, supported by Britain and the Chilean fascists, led by Mrs Thatcher's friend, mass murderer, Augusto Pinochet were all extreme right wing dictatorships
We know exactly how "cenrte" your right-wingism is.
Dream on Keith - fascism is the province of the right - and remained so throughout the 20th century.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 11:54 AM

LOL, relax Dave, not aimed at yourself as I'm sure you know.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 11:36 AM

That could SO be to me Raggy :-)

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 11:34 AM

Can't speak for anyone else (remember we are not gang/mob/clique etc etc) but I think you've lost the plot.

A rest before you next post might be advisable.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 11:23 AM

I have an idea for a new game show.

"My dictator is better than yours"

You pick from your favourite extremist dictator and, from a set of pre-defined criteria and without knowing each others choice, chose whichever aspect you think will beat the opponents. Things like 'People Killed', 'Countries invaded', 'Human rights removed' or 'Wars started'. Sort of like the 'Top Trumps' card games where you pit football players or cars against each other. To add interest the winner gets to chose the method to eradicate the loser, their family and whatever cultural demographic they support.

Probably shouldn't mention it to Donald Trump. Although he may be added as a choice in the not too distant future.

:D tG

BTW - For those who take these things literally, that was a joke. But it is based on the ridiculous premise that any dictator can be justified by saying he is not as bad as another.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 11:06 AM

Rag, tell your friend to stop taking them then.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 10:58 AM

Must be the tablets.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 10:56 AM

Jim,
Stalins main victims were "the left"

Not true. Then there was Mao and the Kims.

Wsan't talking about "here" - I was referring to right wing politics

We were talking about members here.
Just Centre Left and Centre Right.
The very people who chose, hopeless as it seemed, to make a stand against Hitler when the Far Left were in bed with him!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Mar 17 - 10:32 AM

just spotted yet another, how shall we put it to be kind, 'misrepresentation' :-)

You say that everyone should be free to use any tactics to silence someone with differing views.

I have never said anything like that. I have never advocated violence or threats for instance. If I have ever said that anyone should be free to use 'any tactic', I would like see where!

DtG