BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 09:29 AM

"Interesting figures."
Totally impossible to calculate as Israel has declared that 'New Antisemitism' is opposition to the State of Israel and is regarding all criticism of Israeli policy as "opposition", which it is not.
The main victims of Israel's redefinition of antisemitism are the Jewish people who are blamed indirectly by Israelis for their ethnic cleansing policy - that is the inevitable result of claiming all criticism of its policies are "antisemitic".
The few details of Labour so-called antisemitism that have emerged ar criticism of Israel and not the Jews.
Of course, it would be helpful if some self-described supporters of the Jewish People didn't invent Parliamentary pacts of silence (the classic antisemitic slur, dating back to the Nazis is "a Jewish Plot")
It would also helpp if hypocrites who go ballistic at ny criticism of Israel, had the balls to condemn such 'Jewish pacts of silence' despite the fact that the culprit is one of his gang
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 09:25 AM

Ah Terikins coming out as the phantom flasher

Who is he, don't know
is he here, probably
think I see him sitting next to you
the famous phantom flasher

(from the singing of Gary & Vera Aspey)

Don't know about biter bit, foot in mouth springs to mind more readily.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: akenaton
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 09:16 AM

"By the way Gnome the incident you mention might have been that time in the summer of '75, I could send you a glossy 10x8 of it if you like. You'd recognise it immediately as it would bear a striking resemblance to what you see every time you look into a mirror. "

:0)....Brilliant! The biter bit I think!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 08:29 AM

Interesting figures.

To put them in context we need to understand that the population of the USA is in excess of 300,000,000.

There were 1354 reported hate crimes according to the FBI figures.

I am NOT suggesting those crimes should be overlooked but in the great scheme of things they are rare.

You have a reasonable chance of being struck by lightening in the USA 267 per annum on average.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 07:55 AM

Of the 1,402 victims of anti-religious hate crimes:

    52.1 percent were victims of crimes motivated by their offenders' anti-Jewish bias.

    21.9 percent were victims of anti-Islamic (Muslim) bias.

    4.3 percent were victims of anti-Catholic bias.

    4.1 percent were victims of bias against groups of individuals of varying religions (anti-multiple religions, group).

    3.6 percent were victims of anti-Eastern Orthodox (Russian, Greek, Other) bias.

    3.4 percent were victims of anti-Protestant bias.

    1.3 percent were victims of anti-Other Christian bias.

    0.6 percent were victims of anti-Mormon bias.

    0.4 percent were victims of anti-Hindu bias.

    0.4 percent were victims of anti-Sikh bias.

    0.1 percent were victims of anti-Jehovah's Witness bias.

    0.1 percent were victims of anti-Buddhist bias.

    0.1 percent were victims of anti-Atheist/Agnostic bias.

    7.6 percent were victims of bias against other religions (anti-other religion).

Source: FBI 2015 Hate Crime Statistics

The numbers for Canada and the EU are very similar if not worse - look them up if you dare.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 07:38 AM

Mr Carter, I would suggest that you look up what is involved in "colonising" any lump of land. You could then tell me how a country of less than 18 million people could "colonise" a massive land mass inhabited by over 350 million people. On the particular subject of "India" it did not become a country until 1947 prior to that it consisted of areas directly administered by the United Kingdom, which were collectively called British India, and those ruled by indigenous rulers, but under British tutelage or paramountcy, and called the princely states - India was NEVER a British colony, between 1600 and 1858 the British Government only interest in India was supporting any policy that ensured the best interests of the Honourable East India Company (A trading organisation). It was only after the Indian Mutiny of 1857 that the British Government stepped in.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 07:22 AM

I always like the words attributed to Mahatma Gandi, David. When asked what he thought of Western civilisation he replied that it would be a good idea :-) I suspect it is an urban myth but would love it to be true.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 07:18 AM

So, in the words of your mate Keith then, Teribus, come up with some of these lies I have told and hypocrisies I have committed.

Slipped back into poor cliches with insults I'm afraid. You really do need to work harder at it. As to bullies - I find the best way to deal with them is take the piss. You don't like it much do you?

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 07:03 AM

When it was colonised by the British, Teribus. Its certainly as much Western world as Russia which you seem to be including.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 06:59 AM

No Gnome just exposing you lot for the lying hypocrites that you undoubtedly are. As always with your brand of "socialism" one law applies to you and your pals while all others are held to a far more stringent standard - it is the only way you can enter any discussion, however when confronted, like all bullies, you turn and run.

Keep those hairy little fat knees of yours pumping away Gnome and remember to wear your hat - don't want to dazzle oncoming traffic do we Gnome? Mind your specs don't fog up.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 06:51 AM

So there we have it.

An admission of guilt.

Terrikins did moon at 14 old ladies in Blackpool.

Remember folks you read it here first.

Cheers Teri, you have brightened up my morning.

Off on my travels later so won't be here as much (I'm know that will please you Teriblossom so there's no need to respond)

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 06:48 AM

Not bad Teribus - Bit more imagination there. Keep it up and people may think, eventually, that you are not as bad as you seem :-)

So, as you are now supporting the act of posting unsupported assertions and expecting people to disprove them I suppose you are also saying it is OK for anyone to do it. Or is it only unsupported assertions that you and your mates make that are allowed?

Just wondering like.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 06:41 AM

The numbers, please. "Jews are targeted more than all other religious groups combined in most of the western world today." That's what you supported. Well support it with numbers. You or bobad, I don't care.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 06:34 AM

When did India become part of "the western world" Mr Carter (UK)?

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 06:33 AM

Dave the Gnome - 13 Mar 17 - 04:44 AM

"I quite like this game, Steve. It means you can make any assertion you like and it is up to other people to disprove it."

We all know that you like the game Gnome, you and your pals have been playing it for years and so far on so many threads that is exactly what the likes #, Lighter, Iains, Akenaton, bobad, Stanron, Keith A of Hertford and myself have done. In doing so we have exposed your dearly held myths, half-truths and misrepresentations. We have also exposed a number of your lot as liars and dissemblers, with the result that all that you are left with is to waffle on inanely about anything that comes to mind provided that it is as far from the subject under discussion as possible. Please do keep it up, it lets everyone know that you have run out of argument and steam - best you go look out one of your Hawaiian shirts, get on your bike and peddle down to the pub smelling wild flowers on the way - might require a "Wide Load" escort though which must detract a little from the pleasure of it.

By the way Gnome the incident you mention might have been that time in the summer of '75, I could send you a glossy 10x8 of it if you like. You'd recognise it immediately as it would bear a striking resemblance to what you see every time you look into a mirror.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 06:19 AM

This is pure comedy. The point is about backing up the assertion thst bobad made, not about my ideology or anything else. As a matter of fact, irrelevant though it is to the point, I have no axe to grind at all over the targeting of one religious group over another. It's all equally disgusting. I see that you've gone from unqualified support to "seeming" to support. His assertion was a matter of quantity. You make assertions of that nature if you have the numbers to back them. So where are the numbers?


And did you really show your arse to old ladies off Blackpool Tower? Bloody nippy up there. Can't think of a quicker way of exacerbating the piles,,...

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 05:28 AM

Can't say I recall ever discussing hate crimes in the USA.

The FBI "figures" you do provide cannot be put into context as we don't know the numbers of Islamic or Jewish people in the States.

If the population of Jewish people were 665 and 664 reported hate crime against themselves that would be a highly significant figure, If there were 6.64 million Jewish people that figure of reported hate crime becomes less significant.

That figure could also be distorted by one person making a high number of reports.

So many variables, none of which Bobad cites.

I don't know about anyone else but I would consider that Bobad has an axe to grind.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 04:51 AM

You havn't looked at India though have you, Teribus.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 04:44 AM

I quite like this game, Steve. It means you can make any assertion you like and it is up to other people to disprove it. I could say, for instance, that Teribus once showed his arse off Blackpool Tower and 14 old ladies fainted in horror. It would then be true until proven otherwise. Not that I would do a thing like that of course because, as we all know, it would be stupid.

Now, tell me more about this flying chocolate teapot.

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 04:03 AM

PS Shaw - If indeed you do want figures (Which I very much doubt) look them up for yourself.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 13 Mar 17 - 02:57 AM

Having looked at the USA, UK, EU and in Russia the numbers seem to support what bobad stated. I couldn't give a toss what you might think or believe, your ideology, like most "liberal socialists" blinds you to reality. Should I go through the list and document each country by country? Nope, as you have stated your position you wouldn't accept any substantive evidence from any source, so why should I bother?

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 09:08 PM

Stick to the point. You are defending bobad's allegation that "Jews are targeted more than all other religious groups combined in most of the western world today." Do you agree with that? YES OR NO, Teribus? I have severe doubts. As such, I want the figures. Do you have them? Can you get them from bobad? YES OR NO, Teribus? You routinely accuse your adversaries of baseless assertions. Can you support bobad's assertion with numbers? YES OR NO, Teribus?? No mucking about now! Deliver, Teribus!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 08:51 PM

Steve Shaw - 12 Mar 17 - 07:47 PM

"We don't do belief, Teribus. We prefer evidence."

There's that "WE" again non-gang member.

If that indeed was the case Shaw all would be well and good, but the fact is you never do bring any evidence to back up anything you say including your baseless accusations and allegations, in fact you are down on record as stating that it was not needed - So - Are you lying again Shaw?

Your pal Greg F states succinctly how you and your little gang approach things beautifully.

FBI figures state that the rise in anti-Islamic hate crimes has been something in the order of 67% up from 154 reported instances to 257 - Meanwhile anti-Semitic hate crimes rose by 9% in the same period to 664 reported incidents. UK statistics are worse - look them up Huffington Post.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 08:20 PM

No worries, Greg. These people are easy to deal with. When their backs are to the wall they deliberately miss the point. If you don't believe me, just watch Teribus's next post! 😂

Damn fine pasta bake tonight. Home-made tomato sauce with white onion, chilli and basil. No bloody garlic. Layered with orecchiette pasta, masses of shredded mozzarella and loads of parmigiano reggiano. Parmesan to the non-in-crowd. I'll live forever. Washed down gorgeously with Nero d'Avola. I was in Avola last September, beautiful Sicilian town. Jaysus, the romance! Pasta con le sarde on the menu this week. See Sicily then die!


[You're OK, the Mafia don't let their guys bother tourists - they need our money too much!]

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Greg F.
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 07:55 PM

Evidence? EVIDENCE???

We don't got to show you no steenkin' EVIDENCE!

These are Trumpists we're dealing with, Steve.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 07:47 PM

We don't do belief, Teribus. We prefer evidence. Until that arrives, we suspect that boobs is making baseless assertions. I'm sure you'd agree that, if he makes the charge, it's down to him to produce the evidence. If I tell you that a chocolate teapot is in orbit round Mars, it's down to me to provide the evidence, not for you to refute it. Geddit?

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 07:27 PM

Same goes for David Carter (UK) if you dispute what has been said then come up with figures that support your point of view and take on things. As bobad says the figures are readily available if you want to look for them. Just making a point blank statement that you don't believe him does not have any credence at all.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 07:23 PM

1: Raggytash - 12 Mar 17 - 03:36 PM

"Unless you can offer PROOF of that hate crime, your assertion does not carry any credence."

2: Steve Shaw - 12 Mar 17 - 03:51 PM

"...in fact Jews are targeted more than all other religious groups combined in most of the western world today." - bobad

"Prove it."

Raggy, Shaw, if you do not believe the statement then produce figures that counter what has been said. You have come out with the same in the past when I had stated something similar with regard to hate crimes in the USA. I gave you the source - FBI statistics - For some obscure reason, or other, these were still not good enough for you.

I can easily believe what bobad is saying is the truth considering how the "liberal left" has embraced the cause of Yasser Arafat's invention - The "Palestinians".

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 06:57 PM

So, boobs, you haven't got any evidence then. Just weasel words. We get it! 😂😂😂

Gorgeous sunny but windy afternoon this end. Walked over the downs past the Bude sea pool. The sea's different every day, and we've seen it almost every day for thirty years. Wizard!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 05:39 PM

You may be correct in this assertion but you offer no evidence.

We have been down this road before and the statistics were provided, they are easily obtainable if anyone is interested in doing so.

As far as the far right being the preserve of anti-Semitism, that was once the case but the far left is today just as, if not more, anti-Semitic than the far right. Plenty evidence available - remember, Google is your friend.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 04:16 PM

Yes that assertion by bobad does stretch credulity, there is far, far too much religiously motivated hate crime in the world, against people of a variety of religions, but I would have thought that such crimes in South Asia rather outweighed those in the Middle East, if only because of the very large populations there.

But as far as anti-semitism goes, the parallel between the UK and France is of course that anti-semitism, like islamphobia, is largely the preserve of the political right.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 03:51 PM

"...in fact Jews are targeted more than all other religious groups combined in most of the western world today."

Prove it.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 03:36 PM

Bobad,

You state that Jews are targeted more than all other religious groups in the world today.

You may be correct in this assertion but you offer no evidence.

It could be that people of the Jewish faith are more inclined to raise issues of hate crime, it could be that people of other faiths are less inclined to raise the matter.

Unless you can offer PROOF of that hate crime, your assertion does not carry any credence.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 02:48 PM

David, in case you didn't notice the topic of this thread is UK Labour Party Discussion. If you would like to discuss anti-Semitism in the French elections I suggest you start a thread on that. Anti-Semitism and hate crimes directed against Jews are a growing problem in the world, in fact Jews are targeted more than all other religious groups combined in most of the western world today. In the UK alone hate crimes against Jewish people are at record levels having risen by more than a third from previous years. Thank you for your interest and for shining a light on the situation in France where Jews are fleeing in record numbers in fear for their safety.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 12:20 PM

Bobad, maybe you can look at something more current, and somewhere there is much more of problem, such as Les Républicains.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 11:57 AM

*Yawn*

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 09:03 AM

I think all these points have been discussed at length already, do you have a NEW point to raise ...............

................... no? thought not.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 08:31 AM

Timeline: Labour's anti-Semitism crisis

February 16 2016

Oxford University Labour Club co-chair resigns after claiming that its members have "some kind of problem with Jews" and sympathise with terrorist groups like Hamas.

March 6

Two former shadow Cabinet ministers, Michael Dugher MP and Rachel Reeves MP, accuse Jeremy Corbyn of trying to "bury" the Party's problem with anti-Semitism after refusing to publish an investigation into harassment of Jewish students at Oxford University.

March 15

Vicki Kirby, the vice chair of the Labour's Woking branch is suspended after tweeting that Jews have "big noses" and "slaughter the oppressed". MPs attacked the Party leadership after they initially refused to suspend her.

March 16

Jeremy Newmark, national chair of the Jewish Labour Movement, says Jeremy Corbyn is "impotent" in his failure to tackle a resurgence of anti-Semitic views

March 20

Labour peer Lord Levy threatens to leave his party unless Jeremy Corbyn publicly rejects antisemitic comments made by party members.

March 25

Labour Chancellor John McDonnell says he wants to take a "harder line" against anti-Semitism, adding that anyone making anti-Semitic remarks should be thrown out of the party

April 2

President of the Board of Deputies of British Jews warns that Jeremy Corbyn is "failing to lead" Labour away from a damaging trend of anti-Semitism

April 10

Labour councillor Aysegul Gurbuz is suspended over a series of anti-Semitic tweets in which she praised Hitler as the "greatest man in history" and said she hoped Iran would use a "nuclear weapon" to "wipe Israel off the map".

April 27

Labour MP Naz Shah is suspended after backing calls for Israel to "relocate" to America. She had resigned as an aide to the Party's shadow chancellor the previous day, but Jeremy Corbyn was criticised by MPs for initially declining to suspend her from the party whip.

April 28

Ken Livingstone becomes embroiled in the row. In a BBC interview he defends Naz Shah, saying, "I've never heard anybody say anything anti-Semitic, but there's been a very well-orchestrated campaign by the Israel lobby to smear anybody who criticises Israeli policy as anti-Semitic."

The resulting outcry leads to his suspension from the Labour party.

May 4

Britain's Chief Rabbi enters the row for the first time to call on Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn to take "decisive action". Rabbi Ephraim Mirvis criticised the "poisonous invective" and "politics of distortion" from party members such as Ken Livingstone, and in an article for the Telegraph warns that "there must be no place for anti-Semitism in our politics".

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 07:18 AM

I can't read sandals, Dave, but I can wear the Guardian. 🤣

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 05:12 AM

The two I have left are really good quality ones. One is made by Fat Face. I would not usually pay their prices but I think this was from a charity shop! The other I got in America. Make is Columbia who I usually associate with hiking/outdoor gear. Skipton market had some good ones at one time but not for the last couple of years. Charity shops are sometimes a good source and you are also helping the environment by recycling. Should appeal to sandal reading hippies...

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 04:49 AM

Trouble with Hawaiian shirts is (a) I don't want to spend a fortune on 'em, (b) the internet is awash with suspiciously cheap ones. Where to buy?

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Mar 17 - 04:25 AM

Bell tent, Teribus? As ever, your imagination let's you down. Not a bad attempt but clichéd. 2/10 for effort.

To be honest, Steve,it was an unfair challenge. He could never measure up to anything of mine :-)

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Mar 17 - 05:32 PM

You're just jealous because we deservedly thrashed Scotland. Och the bleedin' noo.

"I have a wee touch of heartburn, Doctor Cameron!"

"Aye, Janet, get your tit oot o' ma porridge..."

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: akenaton
Date: 11 Mar 17 - 05:13 PM

I know a safe place for you and your raggle taggle band Stevieboy, the "Alternative Facts" thread, you can sit there with Gilly Greg and Don, cursing Donal John and the electoral process to your hearts content. No one will hear you or disagree with you, you will be in "Bigot heaven"    :0)

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Mar 17 - 05:01 PM

Jesus, I think I may have just had the first ever sensible exchange with akenaton that any of us have ever had! D'you think he's going to spoil it any minute now?

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Mar 17 - 04:58 PM

No-one wants to martyr you, little Scotsperson. Why, we'd all LOVE you to stay and make the rest of us feel so superior! Dunno about the mods, though. I think you'd be well advised to steer clear of ignorant assertions about the American political scene. You know what I mean, eulogies about Donal-Jerk the scrotus, etc. They shout at you if you do that, rightly so. Still, free speech an' all that. Och, magillycuddy reeks! I'm all ocht tae muckty! It's bin a broad bracht moonlacht nacht the nacht! Who wud nae facht fae Charlie! Scots what hae wi' Wallace bled!   Triple Ardbeg for me please, neat, room temp if ye don't mind...

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: akenaton
Date: 11 Mar 17 - 04:42 PM

My it's gone quiet Teribus, I imagine that I can hear the small birds singing in the trees.   :0)

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Mar 17 - 04:36 PM

Bellend? 🤣

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Teribus
Date: 11 Mar 17 - 04:12 PM

"but can you fit yourself into Dave's Hawaiian shirts? Now there's a challenge!" - Steve Shaw

Judging by the girth of the little F**ker get two of them and they'd serve as a Bell Tent. Where's the effin' challenge in that???

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: akenaton
Date: 11 Mar 17 - 04:08 PM

BTW Stevieboy, YOU or anyone like you will never drive me away.

I view your desperate antics with mild amusement and it is particularly satisfying to see your disgusting attacks on Keith being smacked down by people who are many levels above you in every department.