BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 01:07 PM

"Duck it? I have already acknowledged it, and more than once."
So you agree with their conclusions - do I have that right?
"Now Jim, do you believe that Watson tells lies against his own Party?
If so, what is his motivation?"
For Christs sake Keith - I've just given it for the third time
Where has the report claimed Labour to be guilty of attisemitism? - you lied
Where is your evidence that evidence exists? - you lied
Where are your examples of antisemitism - you have produced none
Where has the Labout party ever admitted to a serious problem with antisemitism - it never has - you lead
"Continue? I never have and never would. Made up shit instead of argument again Steve."
What the ****s this then
"It was the reputable CST report that concluded that Labour's anti-Semitism probably contributed to the rise in such attacks."
You lied
Why are you7 lying to denigrate a decent leader
You are sa serious piece of work - you need another holiday
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 01:42 PM

THe position remains exactly the same as it was when Keith started all this all those centuries ago
Not one scrap of evidence has come to light that Labour has ever has a problem with antisemitism - serious or otherwise.
No evidence ahs been found, no admissions have been made, no antisemitism has ever been specified to suggest that there is a "serious" problem
We do know that the original accusation came within weeks of Corbyn declaring his support of BDS
The accusations have disappeared twice, only to be revived when right wing "Friends of Israel" returned from sponsored visits there.
No-one has ever described the type of "antisemitism" that is supposed to be coming from The Labour Party and no figures have ever been produced.
Two enquiries have taken place - both found no evidence.
End of story
We also know that last April the Tory Party was accused of Islamophobia by respected leaders of the British Muslim community.
The only response has been to appont Borish Johnson, a racist, Home Secretary
The Tory Prime Minister has now climbed into bed with Arch-racist, Donald Trump who has has his racist policies halted by the American Courts and who ha declared that he will quash any law that makes his racict and unconstitutional policies illegal   
May's bedfellow has also appointed an arch-antisemite onto his staff - a nice three-in-a-bed for Mayflower
Who are the racists in Britain - Labour or Tory - answers on a postcard please
Let's leave keith to stew in his own bile
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 02:38 PM

Steve,
Can you prove that each of those organisations called the report "reputable?"

The media organisations reported the CST report without expressing any reservations or misgivings about the CST.
If they did not consider it reputable, they would report criticisms of it. None did.
Re Police,
BBC, "The CST, which works with police to gather data, said recorded incidents last had increased by 36% on 2015."

The police would not work with an organisation they did not believe to be reputable.
And, that is the source if the stats. that you question.

Can you prove that I'm the only person in the world who agrees with Jenny Tonge?

Not provable. There might be some other nut somewhere, but I can't find one. Can you?

Jim,
So you agree with their conclusions - do I have that right?

Not qualified Jim, but they are a reputable group so they should not be dismissed.

If so, what is his motivation?"
For Christs sake Keith - I've just given it for the third time

You mean his allegiance to Israel? That is why he lies against Labour?

Where is your evidence that evidence exists?

I have shown, with quotes, that the leadership acknowledges the fact.

"It was the reputable CST report that concluded that Labour's anti-Semitism probably contributed to the rise in such attacks."
You lied

No. That is the truth.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Feb 17 - 03:25 PM

Backwoodsman's right again lads
PLEASE DON'T FEED THE TROLLS
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 05:38 AM

Of course you can all withdraw from the discussion, but do not blame it on non-existent trolling.
You are just incapable of replying, or of making a case.

I am disappointed Jim that you could not answer the simple, unloaded question, "Do you believe that Watson lies against his Party."
You say as much over and over, but when made to see how ridiculous it is, you scurry off and hide.
At least I have made you rethink some of your delusional beliefs.

Likewise your claim that Watson is "a poodle of" and "a mouthpiece for" the Israeli Government!
No wonder you feel you have to hide!
You have made yourself ridiculous.

BWM, nothing I have said here can be described as trolling.
Just discussing facts.
Sadly they are facts that some people here can not deal with.

Steve, I have answered all your points.
I take it you have nothing else to say either.
Off you go then.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 05:48 AM

CAN SOME HUMANE FORUM FAIRY WHO HAPPENS TO BE IN THE VICINITY PLEASE CLOSE DOWN THIS MINDLESSLY OBSESSIVE ONE-MAN CAMPAIGN - IT REALLY IS THE KINDEST ACTION TO TAKE.
SOMEONE PUT HIM OUT OF ALL OUR MISERIES, PLEASE!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 05:52 AM

DON'T FEED THE TROLLS! YOUR RESPONSES ARE FOOD, DRINK AND OXYGEN TO THEM. DO NOT RESPOND TO THEM!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 06:28 AM

The other thread got closed before you had chance to answer my question, Keith. Probably best that you start another thread to do so though.

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 08:02 AM

I'm a troll
You're a troll
Kiss me
And I'll turn into a prince
Suddenly

With apologies to Robert Charlebois.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 09:19 AM

Dave,
Glad you enjoyed it, Keith and that you are back safe and sound. Shame nothing seems to have altered on here :-( Do you not fancy sharing your holiday experiences with us instead of going through all the same old arguments with the same people?

I would be delighted to share my holiday stories, but in PMs.
I get very annoyed when others start talking about such things on a discussion thread, and I doubt I am alone in that.

This was not "the same old arguments " though. It was a new discussion about a brand new report, though it was relevant to the previous discussion.

Jim, do you really believe that Watson tells lies against his own Party for the Israeli government, for which he is a "poodle" and a "mouhpiece?

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 09:29 AM

I'll answer that. Watson can't be trusted. He's right-wing old guard in sentiment and hates Corbyn and he's very pro-Israel regime. Now, would you like to hear of my fantastic week in Puglia last June?* Or my sojourn in Siracusa in September? You won't regret it! I can tell you about the best wines and recommend great eateries and gelateria!



*Unfortunately, I was in Puglia during the week England got kicked out the Euros and the UK got kicked out of the EU. The Puglian people I spoke to were devastated by both events. I did vote by post, by the way. I'm not telling you which way.   Mind yer biz!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 09:46 AM

Ah well. One can but try to make the world a better place.

Yes please, Steve. I would love to hear about it. We are off on our sheep shagging weekend in Ribblehead in a couple of weeks. Won't get the Italian sunshine but the tales will be very tellable :-)

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 09:58 AM

Well where shall I start, Dave? Like to hear about our day trip to Alberobello to see the trulli houses that are in all those Grauniad holiday ads? Lovely place! And we saw a wedding there which appeared to be attended by a small contingent of mafiosi (the blokes all seem to dress like that for weddings in Italy, to be fair). By the way, I hope this is annoying almost no-one here! Happy birthday by the way, Dave!


Now where were we...

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 10:04 AM

Hey Dave, I did a two-week field course at Malham Tarn Field Centre in 1970. The sun hardly went in and it almost burnt our arses off. If I ever get skin cancer I'll put it down to that fortnight. Mind you, it was July, not back-end. Are the ewes more receptive at this time of year? Er Dave, it is just ewes I hope...😜

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 10:10 AM

Thank you Steve. I can't see how pleasantries can annoy anyone but as they say in Cleckhuddersfaxwyke, there's nowt so queer as folk.

I think I have related the tale before. The fist debate I attended was at 6th form college (De La Salle, Salford. 1969) I have no idea what the debate was about but it was won by the lad who discovered his opponent had been involved with a young lady rubbing 'Pretty Peach' body lotion on his chest. That type of things happens all over the place, including parliament (pigs heads anyone?) Dunno why some think it should not happen here.

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 10:14 AM

Only ewe can make the world go round

I know I'll never find another ewe

Any more?

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 10:16 AM

De La Salle? We played them a cricket in 1968 when I was in the Thornleigh first eleven. They won. We should have had a fist debate instead. We were reet bloody hard, us Thornleigh lads, tha knows...

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 10:21 AM

Hear about the sheep who got sunburned on holiday?


It had gone to the baaaa-hamas...

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 10:23 AM

Trolls!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 11:04 AM

Nah, boobs, this is MUCH nicer than Keith burbling on about "Labour's antisemitism problem!" We've been hearing about that for yonks! Bor-ing! Where did you go on YOUR last holiday? Lemme guess! Mecca??

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: bobad
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 11:14 AM

Troll!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 11:35 AM

It's much better than his usual comments, Steve, and makes about as much sense.

I think he probably went to Trondheim.

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 11:36 AM

Little Sir Echo!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 11:38 AM

I played Cricket for De La Salle in 1968 and was in the debating society all through my years there (1966 to 1972)

However in 1968 I was thirteen and not in the first team.

That year I discovered girls and motorbikes, my interest in cricket and debating subsisded somewhat.

Referring to holidays I visited a cracking bar in Tully Cross, Co Galway last month had a stupendous afternoon singing and playing.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 01:06 PM

That's better.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 01:09 PM

You couldn't discover girls at Thornleigh. Well you could go up to the other end of Bolton to the convent school but there was an impregnable armed guard of nuns awaiting. And non-Catholic girls would have seen us cast into hellfire, so that wasn't an option. I made it though. More about my early life on request. Don't mention The Summer Of Love.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 01:10 PM

Steve,
I'll answer that.

When please. The question was does he lie against his own Party as an Israeli Quisling?

Watson can't be trusted. He's right-wing old guard in sentiment and hates Corbyn and he's very pro-Israel regime.

Why can he not be trusted?
So what if he is on the Right of the Party?
Does he hate Corbyn any more than the rest of the PLP, most of whom have expressed no confidence in him?

Of course he is not pro-Israel regime!
He is of the Left and would have no truck with the current Right wing regime.
His affiliation is with Israel's Labour Party.
Has he ever defended the settlements?
No, and that is why.

You and Jim are just smearing him because he disagrees with you and you have no other answer.

Steve, do you agree with Jim that he lies against his own Party to help Israel?

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 01:16 PM

Joe asked us, very politely, to stick to the subject or have the thread closed.
The problem is that you people want debate shut down when it does not go your way.

He could just delete the offending posts, but I fear he is too nice for that.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 01:16 PM

Oh God, Keith, stop trying to go off-topic!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 02:24 PM

By the way, Dave, this has been nagging at me ever since you mentioned it. Was the lad at De La Salle who lost the debate whose girlfriend had rubbed Pretty Peach lotion on his chest...Raggytash??

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 04:02 PM

I dunno, Steve. I came into De la Salle from an oiks Sec Mod - Ambrose Barlow in Swinton. We were not allowed to mix with the royalty who were already there :-( I was right impressed that we were allowed to smoke in the 6th form common rooms though.

Not that this has anything to do with the Labour party of course. But then again neither do most of the other posts on here...

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 04:21 PM

We never played against lowly secondary mods, Dave, and never against any proddydog school. I'm sure you can tell from my general demeanour on this forum that this has helped to maintain my purity of thought and even-handed approach come what may. I'll not be contradicted on that, of course.

Labour? Who?

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 04:42 PM

Proddydog school? PRODDYDOG SCHOOL? Who do you think Ambrose Barlow was FFS? His skull is still in the Bishop of Salfords downstairs lavvy or some such place. I am as Catholic as the pope I'll have you know!

BTW - Came across this gem as I was searching for something entirely different. Sorry to be on topic... ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Theresa May's new year message
From: Keith A of Hertford - PM
Date: 11 Jan 17 - 06:45 AM

Dave,

The Labour party cannot be antisemitic. It is not in it's manifesto.

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Feb 17 - 05:43 PM

You were the lowly sec mod, Dave, not the prods. We had houses in my primary school and I was in Barlow, so I knew he wasn't one of them heathen proddies. Anyway, at least we won't meet any of them in heaven. The priests told us that. Phew!

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 03:12 AM

Ahhh - Gotcha. Thanks Steve. I was at Sec Mod until the 5th year then went on to Grammar School for 6th form. Destined to do A level History, Economics and British Constitution and Government at A level as well as some O level resits. But I found it too much like hard work and needed the money anyway as I, like Raggy, had discovered girls in the shape of Mrs Gnome to be. So I left and started a job at Worsley Urban District Council. Who sent me off to do an ONC in Business Studies.

You wouldn't get that under this new Labour party who do nothing but abuse people would you...

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:15 AM

Dave,
What you posted as a "gem" was your own statement.
I just quoted it.

Here it is again with my contribution included this time.

Dave,

The Labour party cannot be antisemitic. It is not in it's manifesto.

Exactly true. It has a serious problem with some of its members, but the party itself can not be said to be anti-Semitic and no-one has suggested it is.

A footballer's contract is different. A manifesto sets out the aims and views of the Party.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:28 AM

I know Keith - You just said it was true. Like someone said at some time or another, there is no need to keep quoting the whole thing when it has already been posted. Can't remember who said it.

In a nutshell though, you do not believe that the Labour party is antisemitic. You do believe that some of the members are. Just like in any other walk of life? Or do you believe that people who support the Labour party are more prone to antisemitism than anyone else?

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:36 AM

As to

Subject: RE: BS: welcome home from holiday Keith A
From: Keith A of Hertford - PM
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:09 AM

...is not the same as a group ganging together to swamp a thread with trivia because they feel they are losing...

I don't feel I am losing anything. In fact I don't recall entering a contest that could be won or lost. Simply an exchange of views like people have sometimes. Do you see this as a contest?

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:39 AM

Or do you believe that people who support the Labour party are more prone to antisemitism than anyone else?

I believe that Labour has a particular problem with anti-Semitism, because the leadership and many prominent members have acknowledged that fact.

Remember the report Labour commissioned into anti-Semistism in the Oxford University Labour Club? We discussed it at some length.

The NEC has just decided not to implement its recommendations.

The Oxford Student,
"The news that the two members of OULC who had been accused of anti-semitic acts have been cleared by the Labour Party's disputes committee was revealed by the Jewish Chronicle last week.
Baroness Royall reacted to the findings with dismay, saying "I am deeply disappointed by the outcome and fear it will further harm relations between the Jewish community and our party by confirming a widely held view that we do not take antisemitism seriously." "

http://oxfordstudent.com/2017/01/30/labour-mps-wade-oulc-anti-semitism-scandal/

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:42 AM


I don't feel I am losing anything.

I am sorry if I got that wrong.
Please explain what is the reason for your group swamping this thread with trivia, even though Joe especially asked us all to keep to the subject

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:51 AM

Please explain what is the reason for your group swamping this thread with trivia, even though Joe especially asked us all to keep to the subject

1. I don't have a group
2. People do wander off the subject. I don't have control over that
3. I am sure Joe can handle things himself if he so decides

So. Seeing as you have not answered the question I asked can we assume that you do see this as some sort of contest?

If so, and if it makes you happy, please feel free to believe you have won something. Whatever it is...

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 04:56 AM

Going to the earlier response, it seems that Keith believes that Labour supporters are more likely to antisemitic than anyone else. I suppose we had all better resign our memberships and join UKIP or something. Ah well, I suppose it has something to do with socialism. Wasn't it national socialists who believed that Jews were responsible for the ills of the world. Guess the clue is in the name :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Raggytash
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 06:18 AM

My first Missus went to Ambrose Barlow, though she is a bit younger than you, I think she is now 58 so you would have left by the time she started there.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 06:57 AM

She may have known my brother who is just turned 60. It was a good school. Still is as far as I know but has now moved to the site of the old Wardley Grammar and merged with St Georges, Walkden.

D.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:03 AM

If I remember rightly, the four houses in my primary school were Barlow, Fisher, Campion and Moore. I recall that Barlow was one of the Forty Martyrs (or one of the Four Termarters as we called them in our juvenile confusion - well it didn't help that there were four houses, innit...)

You may regard our reminiscences as "trivia," Keith, but they are not and they mean a lot to us. Calling them trivia is far more insulting than us trying our damnedest to get you off your hobby horse. Frankly, though I can't speak for everyone here with certainty, I can sense a collective raising of eyebrows to heaven here every time you insist on going on and on and on and on and on and on and on and ON about Labour's "antisemitism problem," and, as far as I'm concerned, I'll "annoy you" (now that I know how to do it) from now on every time you start burbling on about it again. You're free to discuss it, but I'm free to use any non-violent keyboard-related means to try to get you to PUT A BLOODY SOCK IN IT!

And I've had a long and happy life and I have plenty more annoying "trivia" up my sleeve. Did I ever tell you about the time I nearly fell off one of those running donkeys on Blackpool sands in 1958...?

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:12 AM

The houses at Ambrose Barlow were Moore, Fisher, Campion and Southworth. I think I was in the latter if I remember rightly. Colours were blue, red, yellow and green but I cannot recall which belonged to which.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:32 AM

Ambrose Barlow also had a youth club that was the envy of the rest of Swinton in the late 60s. You reminded me talking about Blackpool, Steve. The club owned a converted Ambulance for use as a minibus. It was driven by Father Sweeney, a particularly good parish priest from St Matks in Pendlebury. We went to Blackpool on one trip and were nearly swept off the prom by waves! No health and safety regs in them days :-) I also remember having to push the ambulance up Winnats Pass in Derbyshire. Probably where I got my masochistic love of stomping around the hills :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:35 AM

Can't be coincidence that, can it? Father Davis (who ended every Mass with "Prayers For Russia") must have had a hand in both schools, seeing as 'ow they had forty to choose from. We used to get told quite a lot that horror story about how one of the women martyrs was squashed to death under a door with weights piled on top. They were imaginative in those days.

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:40 AM

Was it Catherine who had her breasts cut off and went on to become patron saint of puddings? Of course I may have confused 2 stories here...

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Uk Labour Party discussion II
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Feb 17 - 07:55 AM

Heheh. Talking about demic trundle-wagons, that reminds me of a university field weekend in 1972, up near Whitby collecting Jurassic fossils out of the sea cliffs. Just our luck - in an otherwise mild winter, that weekend we endured a force nine gale with driving snow right off the North Sea with minus two even by day. I wore every stitch of clothing I'd taken with me, including me 'jamas, on that beach. If that wasn't bad enough, the trip back to London was a nightmare. The van that our teacher had hired had one of those fan things in the middle of the roof, only this one had the fan missing and just a gaping hole. All the way back we had to take turns to sit under the hole in the teeth of a blast of freezing air from it that directed itself at one's general goolie area. The van's heater was busted as well. To cap it all the fuel gauge needle froze up and we ran out of petrol somewhere in Lincolnshire. It was a dark, freezing snowy night and Dr Alvin finally managed to stop a passing car by virtually lying down on the road in front of it. I tell you, it could be classified as a near-death experience. When we got back we just sat in the union bar for a couple of hours. It took six pints before my legs would bend at the knee again.