BS: UK General Election

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 May 17 - 10:04 AM

"Jim dear, he was being ironic."
He isn't intelligent enough - and we all know he doesn't possess a dictionary
Doesn't matter anyway - having missed it twice, you challenged me to quote it - which is what I did
It's a little silly to claim something that is an essential part of somebody's public persona as "ironic" - he's made his views on 'Gay plaguers" quite plain here many times
"Jim fits rather neatly into Miss Coulter's definition of "liberal"
Another Klan approved quote- keep 'em coming Ake - you're building yourself quite a C>V> - she fits nicely between Breivik and Yellow Stars for refugees
"he got elected three times and it would have been four times "
Remind me how many times Thatcher was elected Al - and she was a self-declared fascist.
The wars may have happened anyway - but Blair made us part of them
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: akenaton
Date: 07 May 17 - 10:53 AM

Please explain something Jim, how does writing "Racist Fascist Homophobe" in the context of a quotation make me any of these things?

I fear you are becoming more confused. Some time ago, I recommended time away from these pages to regain some of your lost equilibrium; the interruption to posting for all members over the last week appears to have had the opposite effect?
I hope you are not dabbing elsewhere Jim? Moonlighting on left wing websites pretending to be a proper socialist? Naughty!!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 May 17 - 11:53 AM

"Racist Fascist Homophobe""
I didn't say it did - not to Keith anyway
He challenged my claiming you had already referred to is, suggesting I was lying - I merely pointed our where you had, proving he was an idiot
You make no bones about being any of those things, but that's well known enough not to have to be arsed arguing it here
Give my love to "Miss Coulter", if you're not too busy!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 May 17 - 12:01 PM

By the way
"pretending to be a proper socialist?"
I once asked you your views on some of the major aspects of "being a socialist, public ownership" and the right to a voice in the workplace - you refused to respond other than to claim that the British people would never accept socialism.
So much for your understanding of the term
If I ever need to know about 'National Socialism' I I'll know who to ask.
A soclialst who supports Assad, Trump, Mayfly, Andreas Breivik and forcing refugees to wear badges of identification - Charlie Marx would have loved you!!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: akenaton
Date: 07 May 17 - 02:01 PM

Jim, I would explain Ann Coulter's quote to you, but other members would probably think that I was trying to embarrass you.
It was a piece of gentle (for her) irony.....I don't understand your interpretation of that post.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 07 May 17 - 02:12 PM

So who'll take a punt at the Conservative majority in the next government? I would guess that it will be in the region of 180!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Teribus
Date: 07 May 17 - 02:16 PM

Charlie Marx??? Luxembourgian Communist Charles Marx? Or were you somehow attempting to refer to Karl Marx? What a grasp of detail Jim - you really are priceless!!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 May 17 - 06:39 AM

There is little to be unpopular in Labour's new policies.
If they continue to be unpopular despite that, why?


Stephen Kinnock recently said Labour had moved toward the "hard left" and was out of touch with the electorate.
Is that the problem?

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 08 May 17 - 07:13 AM

i think the basic problem is Jeremy Corbyn.

People don't like him. He's not what I'd call hard left.

No one will take on the bankers. FRance has just elected one.

THey don't like his promises of generosity - which always seems to end up in the wrong hands.

they're not sure about his unilateralism, which seems to be based on his sensibility rather political reality.

they don't like his dress sense - sort of Rick's bar in Casablanca.
THey don't like his beard.
i think theres only me voting for him, and i'm not that keen.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 May 17 - 07:19 AM

"He's not what I'd call hard left."
Don't know what newspapers your read Al
He may not be "hard" enough - here's hoping that's a passing phase, but the bum-wipe press are treating him like a fart at Mass - that's good enough for me
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 May 17 - 07:57 AM

"you really are priceless!!"
Then you'll have to start saving the pennies
ALWAYS the IDIOT
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Teribus
Date: 09 May 17 - 05:17 AM

Congratulations another pointless link Jim.

So who was this Charlie Marx then Jim.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 09 May 17 - 09:43 AM

Stephen Kinnock recently said Labour had moved toward the "hard left" and was out of touch with the electorate.
Is that the problem?

"Hard Left"? Once you've taken all the soft options that's all you've got ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 May 17 - 10:10 AM

"So who was this Charlie Marx then Jom."
Piss of Teribus - if you can't work out that Charlie is a diminutive of Charles which is derived from the German Karl you really shouldn't be here
It was a flippant comment which you appear to be attempting to make Capital (pun intended) from (get somebody to explain it to you)
It is none of your business anyway - my remark was addressed to your goosestepping mate not to you - wrong goose-stepper.
Were no never told that morons should be seen and not heard?
I really have managed to get up your nose big-time, haven't I?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 May 17 - 11:15 AM

Grammar School Bullies...

Once upon a time in the long past era of the 11 plus...

It was given that any kid selected for Grammar was supposed to have at least a minimum level of intelligence
above that of the average population...

But it seemed the typical Grammar School bully was at the lower spectrum of that elite percentage..
Bully boy was so full of his own sense of superiority
that he seemed completely oblivious to how thick he was compared to his geekier class mate victims..

Bullies were generally slow on the uptake and easy to take the subtle piss out of with irony.
It was a kind of russian roulette to see how far you could get with sarcasm before they twigged and got physical.
My gang had a pet bully.
He couldn't make his mind up if he wanted to join and be our friend, or just habitually beat us up..

He'd bound across the playground like a big soppy dog to greet us with a knee to the groin and a crap joke he got off last night's telly.
Then join us for a chat until he got distracted by a weaker victim passing nearby...

Wouldn't be surprised if he grew up to be a tory party official..

Dunno why.. but that's what Teribus just reminded me of...??? 🙄

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Teribus
Date: 09 May 17 - 11:51 AM

Naw pfr your Grammar School Bully was more of your left wing militant Labour Derek Hatton type ("Hatton attended the Liverpool Institute for Boys from 1959 to 1964. His subsequent academic success was limited." You seem to have described him to a "T")

As to Jim's rather poor explanation. I would think that if you gave as the answer to a question such as who wrote "Das Kapital" the name Charles, or Charlie Marx you'd be laughed out of the building.

Never mind pfr keep up with your sarcasm (It has after all always been recognised as being the poorest form of wit).

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 May 17 - 11:57 AM

"Never mind pfr keep up with your sarcasm. It has after all always been recognised as being the poorest form of wit"

yes... mostly by unimaginative dullards, lacking a single creative original amusing idea in their entire lives... 😜

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 May 17 - 12:12 PM

"As to Jom's rather poor explanation."
Yup - really did get under your skin
Take your thrashings like an adult
"you'd be laughed out of the building."
Only by those with a sense of humour
Stupid boy!!
Nothing more about those Traveller "dynasties" yet, I presume......
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Teribus
Date: 09 May 17 - 12:48 PM

Don't know about you pfr but I would hardly describe Oscar Wilde as being an "unimaginative dullard", completely lacking a single creative, original amusing idea ......😜😜😜😜😜😜.

Jim I barely give you a thought. You are a proven liar and a hypocrite in addition to being probably the most intolerant, biased and bigoted person on this forum. Your idiotic posts are so full of errors and display glaring gaps in your understanding and knowledge of the topic being discussed that they aren't worth reading. The only way you can muster an argument is to "make-up-shit", and claim people have said things that they most certainly have not.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 May 17 - 01:13 PM

nah... cheeky Oscar was being really sarcastic...

it's all the dull wits who followed on after thinking they are clever merely by repeating literary quotes by rote,
that I'm having a good chuckle at... 🤣

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 May 17 - 01:22 PM

2You are a proven liar and a hypocrite in addition to being probably the most intolerant, biased and bigoted person on this forum."
You say the nicest things - pity you never live up to your compliments with actual evidence
I think the last tie you made an effort was to produce a list of disagreements which, extraordinarily, you appear to regard as "lies" - megalomania gone wild
You could try again, but I won't hold my breath
Nor will I do so awaiting proof of your racist smears of the Travelling community - and you accuse me of inventing things!!!
As you say "priceless"
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Teribus
Date: 09 May 17 - 01:36 PM

It would appear that you are easily pleased and amused pfr.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 May 17 - 01:59 PM

"It would appear that you are easily pleased and amused pfr."

Teri - depends on the mood, and the quality of the social company / antagonists...

It's better to at least try to smile.
Certainly if we are doomed to a generation of tory domination... 😣

No point becoming an old closed minded misery if I can possibly avoid it...

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 09 May 17 - 02:21 PM

well not long now!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Teribus
Date: 09 May 17 - 03:45 PM

Always found that after "years of Tory domination" the country has been in far better shape economically than after "years of Labour domination" that have usually left the country on the bones of it's arse.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 May 17 - 05:36 PM

nah... labour builds the nation up again for the tories to come along and asset strip it..

errrrmmm.. that's why the tories allow labour to win every decade or so... 😉

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Stanron
Date: 09 May 17 - 05:54 PM

There weren't many assets left after the last Labour Government. Remember the "no money left" note?

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 May 17 - 06:30 PM

"There weren't many assets left after the last Labour Government. Remember the "no money left" note?"

Hah.. bet that pissed off the tory vultures waiting to pounce on the spoils after labour were beat out of government...

.. all the crooked international banker cronies had already scarpered off with the loot
and left everyone else [labour & tory] to pick up the pieces... 😜

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Stanron
Date: 09 May 17 - 06:37 PM

After a leverage inflated bubble bursts there aren't that many assets left. It was mostly imaginary money that just ceased to exist.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 May 17 - 06:52 PM

"After a leverage inflated bubble bursts there aren't that many assets left. It was mostly imaginary money that just ceased to exist."

yeah... but profit greedy tories are bound to sniff out even the last remaining stale crumbs to privatise... 🙄

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: The Sandman
Date: 10 May 17 - 06:38 AM

Interesting tactic of corbynd to attemt to divert the lection away from brexit, clever ploy

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 10 May 17 - 08:59 AM

yeah.. shame on that potty old beardy godless lefty trouble maker for distracting away from brexit,
the only issue in heaven and on earth that exists and matters for god fearing patriotic englishmen
and their good lady wives, and bulldogs..... 😡

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: akenaton
Date: 10 May 17 - 10:58 AM

Ha ha.....you remoamers thought it was the end of the world!   I like Mr Corbyn and his socialist ideas though they are a bit wishy washy for me.
The problem is the mass of the Parliamentary party who want him out and a nice "liberal" installed in his place.....someone like Ummuna, Johnstone, even (god help us) Mr Blair. These people are always screaming that there is not a realistic opposition to the Tories....but they are no opposition at all, except at election time, they are worse than the Tories, spending all the money, never coming up with an original idea, promoting the EU and mass immigration.

Useless! I hope Mrs May gives them a good kicking and the Party is forced to split.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Teribus
Date: 11 May 17 - 01:54 AM

See Labour's draft manifesto is being panned for its attempt to turn back time - Corbyn may yet succeed in his dream of rehabilitating Trotsky yet. One thing he isn't going to do is win the election in June.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 11 May 17 - 03:08 AM

"Corbyn may yet succeed in his dream of rehabilitating Trotsky "
Rhetorical garbage and a spectacular display of ignorance of politicis in anty shape or form.
Where has Corbyn ever proposed ever proposed the theory of 'Permanent Revolution' or suggested the taking and holding of power by armed struggle, or anything resembling the ideas of Trotsky
You have a nasty dose of the 'Norman Tebbits'.
If anything, Corbyn is proposing a return to the principles and ideas that brought about the Labour party - they resemble the ideas of Michael Foot, or those introduced by the post war Labour Government which rebuilt Britain following W.W.2. - a fair policy which gave us social housing, a decent medical service, an industry that was run for the people of Britain rather than the enrichment of the few - and a voice in the workplace - oll eroded and eventually destroyed by fascists like Thatcher.
Head-cases like you seem happy to go with what has been acheived by here and her jackbooters - a rapidly increasing inequality - no industry and an uncertain economy
Trostkyism my arse
Right-wing politicking in the extreme
Don't suppose you'd like to point oout any specific examples of "Trotskyism" in the Labour manisfesto
No?
Thought not
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Teribus
Date: 11 May 17 - 03:21 AM

Corbyn & Trotsky

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 11 May 17 - 03:29 AM

From: punkfolkrocker - PM
Date: 10 May 17 - 08:59 AM

yeah.. shame on that potty old beardy godless lefty trouble maker for distracting away from brexit,
the only issue in heaven and on earth that exists and matters for god fearing patriotic englishmen
and their good lady wives, and bulldogs..... 😡

Yes, the problem is that until UKIP forced the issue both the 'main' parties (and the Lib Dems)concentrated on 'all the other issues' even though many of them could not be properly dealt with while we didn't have the power to deal, ultimately, with the problems.
Brexit is a one-off matter. Once dealt with, as the priority it is, the UK government of the day will be free to go back to dealing with everything else, without having its hands bound by the EC.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 11 May 17 - 03:47 AM

"Corbyn & Trotsky"
Having the=achievements of revolutionaries is not suggesting their policies are suitable for Britain, any more than recognising the achievements of our historical figurs is a suggestion that we accept their ideas
I asked what particular aspects of Trotsky's policies, Corbyn is suggesting - not whether he should be admired.
From your link
"The injustices that scar society today are not those of 1945: want, squalor, idleness, disease and ignorance. And they have changed since I first entered parliament in 1983.
"Today, what is holding people back above all are inequality, neglect, insecurity, prejudice and discrimination."
Key policies announced so far:
Promote economic and social justice
Force companies with more than 21 staff to publish information about pay, hours and grade of every job
Kickstart the Brexit process by triggering Article 50 straight away
Against renewal of Trident

Trotskyism?
In my arse Troskyinm!!
You are a rather dim stereotype
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 11 May 17 - 03:53 AM

easy to say that- but they both had a beard..

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Iains
Date: 11 May 17 - 06:01 AM

Mr Shaw your excuse for not making links is repetitive. So for you a personal guide.
1) copy the URL of the article of interest e.g.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4493596/Labour-s-manifesto-Britain-1970s.html
2)open up "make a link(blue clicky)"
3)In the top line paste your copied URL in the box labelled "Link URL"
and hit the "create link" button and the link is created.
4)Now comes the cunning bit. Copy the second line down in it's entirety.
as

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Iains
Date: 11 May 17 - 06:06 AM

4)Now comes the cunning bit. Copy the second line down in it's entirety.
as

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Iains
Date: 11 May 17 - 06:11 AM

4)Now comes the cunning bit. Copy the second line down in it's entirety.

5)Paste this into your post NOT the test this link blue clicky line.

6)when opened up subsequently a link/blue clicky is created,

Do not. do not. do not copy the third line blue clicky when creating the link.

This should enable you create a blue clicky link. Good Luck


IF a kind forum fairy could delete my middle post it would be appreciated. Apparently to post an example of the "link URL" line craters the remaining post.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Teribus
Date: 11 May 17 - 06:13 AM

"I asked what particular aspects of Trotsky's policies, Corbyn is suggesting"

Never suggested that Corbyn WAS suggesting adoption of Trotsky's policies - I accused Corbyn of wishing to turn back time. For some idiotic reason he seeks to return the UK to the shambolic chaos of the 1970s where Trades Union bosses dictated to our elected government. Another pet "hobby-horse" of Corbyn's is that he wishes to internationally rehabilitate the reputation of Leon Trotsky.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 11 May 17 - 06:44 AM

"Never suggested that Corbyn WAS suggesting adoption of Trotsky's policies"
Then Trotsy is no more than a red herring in this discussion
His name crops up enough in realtion to the Labour party
Your rest is a stupidly distorted account of the time when Trades Unions (which are for more democratically organised and answerable to their membership that any political body is) were acting on behalf of their members in response to politicians and economic undermining of the rights and living standards of their members
There were two sides to what happened in the seventies - right wing clowns like you never regard that working people might actually have an opinion worth considering in those events.
Thatchers's mob came to power on the slogan "Labour isn't working" and added a million or so to the dole queues
The "shambles of the seventies" was followed by the systematic of dismantling of British industry, destruction of communities around those industries and the creation of a two-nation Britain sharply divided into those with jobs and a future and those without.
You shower of bollocks carefully ignore the current situation which is, if Britain is ever to be independent, it has to return to the pre-Thatcher era and start from scratch in giving Britain an industrial base - and that has to include giving working people a voice in their own lives.
As it is, all Britain can decide today is who to be dependent on
"pet "hobby-horse""
Total load of shite
It is a "pet" nothing; he mentioned it in passing and as never taken it any further - (or maybe he is holding secret classes in Trotskyism that we don't know about"
This really is stereotyping garbage.
Anyone serious about politics learns from past achievements and mistakes - whether you are a socialist, a Marxist, a supporter of the present system or whatever
Politicians go tho the past for their inspiration - Thatcher's inspiration was J M Keynes (a contemporary of Trotsky)
If you have an argument put it and stop spouting propagandist rhetoric
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 11 May 17 - 07:05 AM

You shower of bollocks carefully ignore the current situation which is, if Britain is ever to be independent, it has to return to the pre-Thatcher era and start from scratch in giving Britain an industrial base - and that has to include giving working people a voice in their own lives.

Lovely bit of rhetoric (Not!)

Sounds like the typical, "If you want to get to there, I wouldn't start from here!"

We are where we are. We shouldn't need to dismantle everything done over the last 30 years (by governments of both main parties) in order to be able to move forwards.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Teribus
Date: 11 May 17 - 07:40 AM

"Trades Unions (which are for more democratically organised and answerable to their membership that any political body is)"

Ludicrous statement - Just take a look at how many of UNITE's 1.5 million members voted in the last leadership election and the one before that - Round about 10% turnout.

Coal:
Since 1947 something like 955 pits have been closed by the time Thatcher became Prime Minister 767 mines of the 955 had already been closed.
Thatcher closed 115, Harold Wilson had closed 253

Steel:
In 1947 when the industry was nationalised there were 96 steel firms in the UK.
By 1970 BSC consists of only 21 plants
By 1980 BSC has only 5 sites. The year started with a 13 week strike.

The industries you talk about Jim were already in terminal decline long before Thatcher came along. Fact of the matter now is that we cannot produce coal economically and today nobody wants to buy it. We cannot make steel economically as we simply cannot compete with China. If Corbyn wishes to resurrect these industries then we will be onto a hiding to nothing in situation that can only result in costly failure - Labour's stock in trade.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 11 May 17 - 08:57 AM

"Coal:"
Doesn't matter who did it - when Thatcehr came we had a mining industry
When she left - we didn't
"Steel:"
You out line the gradual rundown o the steel industry by various governments - Thatcher administerd the death blow
The strike (the first in half a century)
The workers believed they were entitled to a pay rise - they asked for 20& - the bosses offered %6
A commission of enquiry decided %16 was reasonable
Workers do not go on strike unmless they are forced to
Taking strikes out of context is meaningless
HERE'S THE CONTEXT FOR YOU
Once again you are blaming workers for standing up for their needs and nort being prepared to shoulder the responsibility for a fucked up economy
As far as democracy goes - I have no say in what my MP does once he/she is elected - I could go to a union meeting and vote on any major decision
Show me where that is in the constitution!
The industries were in decline because of lacjk of investment and opposition to them by various governments who accepted the profit ethic as being more important than long term stability and the welfare of employees.
Thatcher wielded her knife because she was able to and she left much of Britain an economic and industrial wasteland
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Stu
Date: 11 May 17 - 09:51 AM

"I have no say in what my MP does once he/she is elected"

Ours is positively dismissive, a patch of fog, sheep, ex-banker climbing the ladder to his ministerial post. He's so right-wing as to be indistinguishable from a kipper, and he latches himself onto all sorts of causes whilst not actually offering any meaningful support. He was photographed smiling at a local collection for a food bank, which just about tells you everything you need to know about him.

I call him Westminster's representative in the constituency, the very opposite of what a constituency politician should be.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: The Sandman
Date: 11 May 17 - 01:20 PM

"Thatcher wielded her knife because she was able to and she left much of Britain an economic and industrial wasteland"
Correct,
Blair then continued it in fact, domestic policy he was a thatcherite, and foreign policy apart from ireland an arse licker of the USA.
Corbyn,is a politician with principles, unlike Blair who was a THATCHERITE PRETENDING TO BE LABOUR.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General Election
From: Teribus
Date: 11 May 17 - 04:38 PM

What is correct Sandman was that in 1979 Thatcher took over a Britain considered by many in the world to be on it's last legs. A country where the electorate were sick to the back teeth of Trades Union interference and Labour incompetence. In the course of the three Parliaments she served as Prime Minister she turned that situation around so much so that in 1997 when Tony Blair won the first of his three elections no incoming government had ever been handed an exchequer or economy in a better state. Thirteen years later in 2010 Labour under the guiding hands of Blair and Brown had squandered the lot.

Now we have Corbyn attempting to turn the clock back with tired, old, disproven ideas that come attached with costs that Labour cannot quantify.