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BS: Not In My Name

Mrrzy 21 Apr 17 - 11:50 PM
keberoxu 21 Apr 17 - 03:14 PM
Mrrzy 20 Apr 17 - 10:36 PM
leeneia 20 Apr 17 - 09:37 PM
Mrrzy 19 Apr 17 - 11:36 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Apr 17 - 09:17 PM
Mrrzy 19 Apr 17 - 08:48 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Apr 17 - 08:13 PM
Mrrzy 19 Apr 17 - 07:41 PM
Steve Shaw 19 Apr 17 - 06:01 PM
Nigel Parsons 19 Apr 17 - 09:48 AM
Mrrzy 19 Apr 17 - 09:15 AM
Mrrzy 18 Apr 17 - 09:45 PM
Steve Shaw 18 Apr 17 - 08:24 PM
gnu 18 Apr 17 - 07:03 PM
Joe Offer 18 Apr 17 - 06:33 PM
Donuel 18 Apr 17 - 06:31 PM
Teribus 18 Apr 17 - 05:48 PM
Mrrzy 18 Apr 17 - 05:33 PM
Greg F. 18 Apr 17 - 03:10 PM
Teribus 18 Apr 17 - 02:31 PM
Bill D 18 Apr 17 - 02:28 PM
Mrrzy 18 Apr 17 - 10:03 AM
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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Mrrzy
Date: 21 Apr 17 - 11:50 PM

Thanks. Far too many.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: keberoxu
Date: 21 Apr 17 - 03:14 PM

better late, than never, Mrrzy:

my commiserations as well.

There must be so many families the world over who are in concert with yours.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Mrrzy
Date: 20 Apr 17 - 10:36 PM

Xo


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: leeneia
Date: 20 Apr 17 - 09:37 PM

Mrzzy, I am so sorry for what happened to your family and for what you are living with today.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Mrrzy
Date: 19 Apr 17 - 11:36 PM

In my case, it helps that I'm a coward. I was always sure they'd hurt me worse if I fought back.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 19 Apr 17 - 09:17 PM

I think I'd struggle. Fortune has dictated that I've never been called on.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Mrrzy
Date: 19 Apr 17 - 08:48 PM

Yeah - I can't fight, but that's me. I have never hit back.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 19 Apr 17 - 08:13 PM

Didn't say it was. Just that I don't buy blanket pacifism, though I don't know whether I'm right.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Mrrzy
Date: 19 Apr 17 - 07:41 PM

Sure, but this ain't one of'm.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 19 Apr 17 - 06:01 PM

Well I agree with that, but I also think that if you don't want to be controlled and terrorised by a Pol Pot or a Hitler or a Papa Doc you have to fight. Not with gratuitous, Dresden-style violence, not with vengeance. I do struggle with this, but Jesus was wrong to tell people to offer your enemy, the guy who might murder your family, your other cheek. There are good fights to be fought.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 19 Apr 17 - 09:48 AM

Thanks Mrrzy.
This hits a spot.

Together with the recent comments of Melissa Cochran "I feel no hate in my heart"

Thanks
Nigel


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Mrrzy
Date: 19 Apr 17 - 09:15 AM

Upon rereading, pacifism involves working against violence without using other violence, not so much turning the other cheek. Atheists can be pacifists too.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Mrrzy
Date: 18 Apr 17 - 09:45 PM

Thank you all for your kind words.

Thank you even more for your deep thoughts.

This is an ongoing issue, obviously.

And yeah, Donuel, the quakes are neat people.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Apr 17 - 08:24 PM

I also appreciate your post, for the following reason. Almost every day I hear of massacres by car bombs, suicide bombs and rocket attacks. Or mass drownings in my beloved Mediterranean Sea. Twenty killed, a hundred killed, many killed... I need a personal story in order to reset this brain of mine that gets dulled by news of hundreds of anonymous people killed in far distant lands, people who I don't know and can't connect to and who generally crop up on page 19 at the bottom. A personal story makes me think that there but for fortune go I and my family, my lovely Mrs Steve, my two lovely kids, my one and only beautiful grandson, eighteen months old and making us laugh as he staggers giggling around the park....you know what I mean. Every stupid loss of a precious life is a grievous loss to a mother, a spouse, the kids, a family...

Wow. But I don't believe we should turn the other cheek. I still can't find it in me to be a pacifist. Confused or what!


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: gnu
Date: 18 Apr 17 - 07:03 PM

Oh, Mrrzy. I am so sorry to read this. Words are useless on my part. Yours are powerful. Thank you for sharing.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Joe Offer
Date: 18 Apr 17 - 06:33 PM

All I can say, Mrr, is that I really appreciate your post.
-Joe-


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Apr 17 - 06:31 PM

"Sorry but" Is something a social psychopath might say when they feel no empathy.

Mrrzy I had no idea you sprouted from such noble cosmopolitan roots.
To me the home of brave include Quaker homes.

An eye for an eye revenge blinds more slowly than mass revenge.
Unless repeatedly called for, most of us do not need revenge.

Even a blind man ( a victim of revenge) can still have answers to very real questions but it seems you are facing this ongoing tragedy with your eyes open.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Teribus
Date: 18 Apr 17 - 05:48 PM

Ah good so there is no war that we are being asked to volunteer for.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Mrrzy
Date: 18 Apr 17 - 05:33 PM

The US has been bombing the middle east since October 2001.

No draft; everybody is a volunteer, they think it will be like a video game, fun.   No wonder there is so much PTSD and rampant suicide among our vets.


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Apr 17 - 03:10 PM

Yo, T-bird: is there a draft in the UK or in the US?


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Teribus
Date: 18 Apr 17 - 02:31 PM

Sorry but what war is anybody being asked to volunteer for?


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Subject: RE: BS: Not In My Name
From: Bill D
Date: 18 Apr 17 - 02:28 PM

Well... I was right here in this house in suburban MD, north of Wash DC.. reading sad news in the Wash Post.
Maybe about that time Michael Cooney was doing concerts, singing "The Bankers and the Diplomats Are Going in the Army". We liked the song, but we weren't fooled about the possibilities.

I have no answers... except the small power of my vote and my voice.


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Subject: BS: Not In My Name
From: Mrrzy
Date: 18 Apr 17 - 10:03 AM

Long, triggery post, mostly aimed at young Americans, but I'd appreciate your all reading it.

Where were you on this day in 1983? I was at Roots & Growth, the hippie culture house at Tufts, making 1000 origami cranes for the upcoming peace festival. No cell phones. No email. No CNN.

As a result, I didn't find out till late that night. My eldest sister, in her grief, had had to spend the day trying to reach me, to tell me that terrorists had blown up the Beirut embassy, and "they couldn't find daddy" and that the embassy had told mom that "there was very little hope" that he could still be alive.

My dad, a Quaker, a pacifist, was one of the 60-some odd people, 17 Americans, killed by the first suicide carbombing of any American embassy. In fact, they thought the truck had been detonated by remote control, at first.

I didn't get the postcard that said he'd gotten there ("Beirut is lovely") till after they found his body, which was the next day, my time. That was still the longest night of my life. The following week, waiting for Mom to get back from Thailand (she hadn't finished packing out their prior post), was also interminable. I have never really been right in the head since.

And what was the US government's response? Not a thing, that I recall, while they slaughtered Americans wholesale overseas throughout the eighties and nineties.   Then came 9/11, and suddenly, the rest of America found out what my family had known for decades – there are people out there who will die to kill us. It's worth it, to them. And now what was the government's response? Oh, we can't let them kill us, so let's go kill them, to teach them not to kill us.

How's that working out for you, America?

Daddy wasn't in the military. He didn't volunteer to go into a danger zone. The US government had dropped the embassy barricades, ***taken everybody off danger pay*** and restaffed the embassy with non-essentials and other civilians, just that week. We had been assured, in so many words, by the government, that he'd be safe. We were lied to.

You are also being lied to.   War is not glorious. Killing people over there will not teach them not to kill us over here. Do not volunteer for this war, I beg you. Not In My Name.


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Mudcat time: 30 April 12:56 PM EDT

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