BS: US Meaning of 'Take'

Subject: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: Senoufou
Date: 26 May 17 - 08:38 AM

I've been listening to lots of very old recordings of the Memphis Jug Band, and adore the voice of Will Shade, which sounds very like that of Joseph Shabalala (Ladysmith Black Mambaso)

I was intrigued by the Cocaine Blues song, and the words are rather confusing. He sings about having a bad cocaine habit, and he can't get any because Mr Lehman has a sign saying No More Dope. But the chorus goes, "Take a whiff etc honey take a whiff on me"

What I want to know is, does this mean he's offering the stuff to all and sundry, or does 'take' mean 'give me' ? (As in 'take a chance on me', which means 'give me a chance') It would seem more logical that he was begging his lady friend to give him some coke. If he hasn't got any, he can hardly be giving whiffs to others can he?

Anyone from that part of the USA (Tennessee I imagine) enlighten me?
(I do like to get to the bottom of things!)

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: gillymor
Date: 26 May 17 - 08:44 AM

I've always assumed that in this instance take=have.

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: Greg F.
Date: 26 May 17 - 08:49 AM

As in "take a drink".

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 26 May 17 - 09:53 AM

I'm guessing that in nearly all circumstances 'take' means 'take'.
Even in 'take a chance on me' 'take' doesn't mean 'give'.
'Take a chance on me' is not the same as 'give me a chance'.
Take a chance on me suggests putting oneself (or ones money) at risk in allowing 'me' an opportunity.
'Give me a chance' does not really mean that the person giving the chance is risking anything of their own.

My understanding only.

Cheers
Nigel

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: gillymor
Date: 26 May 17 - 10:41 AM

I learned the MJB's Cocaine Habit Blues more than 4 decades ago which doesn't make me an expert but to me "Honey take a whiff on me" means "let me give you a snort of cocaine" or "allow me to provide you with a sniff of cocaine" or "have a bump of cocaine from my stash".

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: Senoufou
Date: 26 May 17 - 12:03 PM

Ah I see. So at the moment of his singing the cocaine song, he did have some to offer around. He was merely recounting the time when Mr Lehman hadn't any, but since then he has found an alternative supply, which he's generously using to give to a lady.

As we're dealing (sorry about the pun) with my pedantry, what about the words to 'On The Road Again'? He went to his house and the door was locked, but he looked in and saw a n***** in his bed. So he shot through the window and hit the unfortunate unofficial lodger 'in the leg', then adds he'd never seen a little n***** run so fast. I would have thought he really meant to sing shot him 'in the ass' which would rhyme in a way with 'fast'. Perhaps 'ass' wasn't allowed to be sung in those days?
Once I've got these things sorted out, I promise you'll hear no more about it.

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: gillymor
Date: 26 May 17 - 12:31 PM

Another great old song. The Grateful Dead substituted
"Shot through the window, broke the glass,
I never seen that little rounder run so fast." to avoid using the despicable n-word, I suppose, in their excellent cover that they played throughout just about the entire life of the band. They did start out as a jug band.

I like the original lyric by MJB (I don't find the n-word offensive when used in that context by a black man) though I suppose "shot him in the ass" would be a good alternative but perhaps it was considered taboo in those old country blues recordings as you suggest.

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: Senoufou
Date: 26 May 17 - 12:48 PM

It just shows how times have changed doesn't it gillymor? When I was young (late forties, early fifties) the 'n' word was perfectly acceptable, and used with no intention to insult anyone.
I've told my husband he must never use it in public, not even about himself. He finds this hilarious.

And isn't it strange that singing gaily about one's cocaine habit wasn't taboo either?

I don't know what it is about these Memphis Jug Band songs; I heard them for the first time on a BBC TV programme last week, and I seem to be getting obsessed. There's just something about them that I absolutely love! I think it's because they're raw and real. You can hear and feel the toughness and the poverty, plus the effervescence of the men determined to make the best of their difficult lives. It's very African, as well as American.

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: gillymor
Date: 26 May 17 - 01:03 PM

"You can hear and feel the toughness and the poverty, plus the effervescence of the men determined to make the best of their difficult lives."
What a lovely sentence, it really captures the appeal of jug band music for me.

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: fat B****rd
Date: 26 May 17 - 01:56 PM

Hi, Senoufou. I trust you are well. I've always liked "Take A Whiff On Me" and many ears ago used to collect versions of it! (poor old thing). Amongst the many versions, as well as "Cocaine (yonder comes my baby etc)" the lyrics are usually naughtily entertaining. You Tube it and see. My favourite verse goes "Cocaine's for horses not for me, they say it's gonna kill ya but they don't say when".

Just a thought. Best regards from Charlie

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: fat B****rd
Date: 26 May 17 - 01:57 PM

Whoops.....horses not for MEN

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: Senoufou
Date: 26 May 17 - 02:14 PM

Hello there fat B****rd! Nice to hear from you, and yes I am very well thank you.
Hope you are too.

You're right, some of the Memphis Jug Band's (and others') lyrics are very naughty, which makes them all the more fascinating and as you say, entertaining.
"I love my whiskey and I love my gin
But the way I love my coke is a doggone sin..."

I also adore Sugar Pudding ("Take your fingers off it, Don't you dare touch it, You know it don't belong to you!") The double entendre is so funny.

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: wysiwyg
Date: 27 May 17 - 12:33 PM

'Take a whiff on me' could also mean 'take a dose of me'-- could be that 'me' is the coke calling ppl to snort it.

It must be said that as in the Negro Spirituals (African American Spirituals), US Black vernacular might refer to multpile meanings simultaneously-- for a variety of reasons.

US Black vernacular English was/is made from a unique life experience that european-heritage people can only approximately understand... true 'translation' is neither feasible nor desirable.

When I try to bring these historical gems forward in time and across cultures, I hear the Black grandmothers in my mind saying, "It is what it is; either just go with it or rewrite it to your own understanding."

Ah, sweet Mystery!

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: Donuel
Date: 27 May 17 - 06:44 PM

That ain't no lie wysiwyg. Its that way by design.
By the time white society understands it, it has already evolved to something new to avoid comprehension and translation by 'go fay crackers'. (*100 years old)

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: gillymor
Date: 28 May 17 - 11:38 AM

"'Take a whiff on me' could also mean 'take a dose of me'-- could be that 'me' is the coke calling ppl to snort it."

Hadn't occurred to me, maybe so.

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: gillymor
Date: 28 May 17 - 11:53 AM

I think Leadbelly's "Take a Whiff on Me" makes Susan's conjecture seem even more plausible:

Walked up Ellum and I come down Main
Tryin' to bum a nickle, just to buy cocaine
Ho, ho, honey take a whiff on me.

Take a whiff on me, take a whiff on me
And everybody, take a whiff on me.
Ho, ho, honey take a whiff on me.

Went to Mr. Lehman's on a lope
Sign in the window said: "No more coke".
Ho, ho, honey take a whiff on me.

Take a whiff on me, take a whiff on me
And everybody, take a whiff on me.
Ho, ho, honey take a whiff on me.

Goin' up State Street, comin' down Main
Lookin' for the woman that uses cocaine.
Ho, ho, honey take a whiff on me.

Take a whiff on me, take a whiff on me
And everybody, take a whiff on me.
Ho, ho, honey take a whiff on me.

I'se got a nickle, you'se got a dime...
You buy the coke and I'll buy the wine.
Ho, ho, honey take a whiff on me.

Take a whiff on me, take a whiff on me
And everybody, take a whiff on me.
Ho, ho, honey take a whiff on me.

The blacker the berry, the sweeter the juice
Takes a brown-skinned woman, for my particular use.
Ho, ho, honey take a whiff on me.

Take a whiff on me, take a whiff on me
And everybody, take a whiff on me.
Ho, ho, honey take a whiff on me.

Cocaine's for horses and not for men
Doctors sat t'will kill you but they don't say when.
Ho, ho, honey take a whiff on me.

Take a whiff on me, take a whiff on me
And everybody, take a whiff on me.
Ho, ho, honey take a whiff on me.

Whiff-a-ree and whiff-a-rye
Gonna keep on a whiffin' boys, 'till I die.
Ho, ho, honey take a whiff on me.

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: Senoufou
Date: 28 May 17 - 01:22 PM

I've just learnt a new word. I see that a 'rounder' is a disreputable person or a even a criminal type'. I'd never heard this word used in this context before. (Here, a 'rounder' is what one scores when playing a UK game called Rounders, a tiny bit like baseball.)

I've now listened to all the offerings on Youtube of 'Cocaine Habit'/'Take A Whiff On Me', and I still think the Memphis Jug Band is the best.
I've played it so often now, Youtube will be asking me for a subscription.
Thank you so much all who have replied.

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: Thompson
Date: 28 May 17 - 03:08 PM

When I was taught this song, in the early 1960s by a friend of my parents that I always assumed to be a deeply respectable lady, she taught it to me like this:

"Take a (sniff) take a (sniff) take a (sniff) on me
"Everybody take a (sniff) on me
"Hey, hey, everybody take a (sniff) on me"

and so on (actually, I'm not sure if she sang "take" or "have". But the "(sniff)" - and this is the reason I put it in brackets - was not the word "sniff", but you actually sniffed.

I understood it to be a generous offer - "take a sniff of what I have bought and am offering you". When I asked her what (sniff) meant, she told me that it was a funny way of saying "kiss", as far as I remember; do I imagine that I saw a flash of warning into the back of the car from my mother?

It wasn't till many years later that I realised this was a cocaine song - but that was a cokey generation, with songs like Minnie the Moocher suggesting "kicking the gong around" - ie taking cocaine.

As for the word that amuses Senoufou's husband, it's not said now because it was used for so long to demean a group; he finds it funny because it's not in his childhood, being lashed by that sneering word. It has no power over him.

Subject: RE: BS: US Meaning of 'Take'
From: Thompson
Date: 28 May 17 - 10:52 PM

By the way, why is this below the fold, as it were, as it's a thread about music?