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BS: brexit matters

Iains 10 Sep 17 - 03:30 AM
SPB-Cooperator 09 Sep 17 - 05:50 PM
Backwoodsman 09 Sep 17 - 05:38 PM
akenaton 09 Sep 17 - 05:10 PM
Big Al Whittle 09 Sep 17 - 05:07 PM
Nigel Parsons 09 Sep 17 - 04:55 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Sep 17 - 04:43 PM
Stanron 09 Sep 17 - 04:22 PM
SPB-Cooperator 09 Sep 17 - 04:16 PM
Iains 09 Sep 17 - 02:15 PM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Sep 17 - 01:34 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Sep 17 - 12:40 PM
Teribus 09 Sep 17 - 11:57 AM
Teribus 09 Sep 17 - 11:47 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Sep 17 - 10:48 AM
akenaton 09 Sep 17 - 10:35 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Sep 17 - 10:02 AM
Backwoodsman 09 Sep 17 - 09:54 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Sep 17 - 09:52 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Sep 17 - 09:40 AM
Stu 09 Sep 17 - 09:17 AM
SPB-Cooperator 09 Sep 17 - 09:01 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Sep 17 - 08:45 AM
SPB-Cooperator 09 Sep 17 - 08:24 AM
Stu 09 Sep 17 - 07:10 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Sep 17 - 06:28 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Sep 17 - 06:19 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Sep 17 - 05:40 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Sep 17 - 05:35 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Sep 17 - 05:28 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Sep 17 - 05:27 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Sep 17 - 05:22 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Sep 17 - 05:13 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Sep 17 - 05:10 AM
Steve Shaw 09 Sep 17 - 05:01 AM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Sep 17 - 04:43 AM
Dave the Gnome 09 Sep 17 - 04:29 AM
Iains 09 Sep 17 - 04:00 AM
Teribus 09 Sep 17 - 02:14 AM
Steve Shaw 08 Sep 17 - 07:30 PM
Teribus 08 Sep 17 - 05:49 PM
MikeL2 08 Sep 17 - 02:49 PM
Dave the Gnome 08 Sep 17 - 01:51 PM
MikeL2 08 Sep 17 - 11:01 AM
Stu 08 Sep 17 - 10:54 AM
Nigel Parsons 08 Sep 17 - 10:42 AM
Iains 08 Sep 17 - 10:26 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Sep 17 - 10:12 AM
Stu 08 Sep 17 - 09:53 AM
Dave the Gnome 08 Sep 17 - 09:27 AM
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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Iains
Date: 10 Sep 17 - 03:30 AM

A toon for the Remoaners!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_pUgkECn9s


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 05:50 PM

There is a world of difference between levelling the playing field and charity, especially where our history has contributed to the inequality.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 05:38 PM

Just seen a comment on FB by a BrexShit supporter claiming that long waits for appointments to see your doctor are the result of our membership of the EU.

To think that we're being driven by these shit-for-brains twats towards the cliff-edge and on to disaster. God help us.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: akenaton
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 05:10 PM

"Of course there are some who believe that UK should have the right to focus on its own economy at the expense of others"   :0)

Isn't that exactly what has been happening under the auspices of the EU's "freedom of movement" policy? Rich countries exploiting poorer ones as part of an economic policy which disregards social consequences.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 05:07 PM

No I'd say that was a pretty standard remainer view.

fuelled by hatred of the excesses of the empire, and guilt for it.

a generation who grew up in a country with virtually no industry or understanding of it cultural importance in our society.

the endless jibes of being a little Englander ......based on the lack of understanding of the history of our country - because it is no longer taught in any depth.

basically we've been tied to a gang of countries who look round and say ...nothing to with me guv when shit happens. perhaps because of our imperial past - we know that's not always an option.   our interventions have not always been well conceived - but at least they were performed by people who had to face the music at the ballot box.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 04:55 PM

Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: SPB-Cooperator - PM
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 04:16 PM
Of course there are some who believe that UK should have the right to focus on its own economy at the expense of others, and these are the lowest of the low pathetic excuses for human existance.The sooner this country has its holier than thou arrogance wiped of its face, the better. These are often the same people who resent paying taxes as they earn enough not to need anything from the state.


Of course, there's always the opportunity to base arguments on facts (annoying as that may be)
As far as charitable giving is concerned, the UK comes out top in Europe. According to The CAF world giving index 2016
Not bad for a country of heartless self-serving bastards, is it?


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 04:43 PM

You should be asking Teribus and/or Keith, Iains, not me. Sorry mate. They are the can't-back-up-what-they-say merchants.

Keith, your silly, tedious hotel metaphor doesn't hold water, so do us a favour and give it up, will you. When I book into a hotel it's a mutually-beneficial, time-limited arrangement with all parameters amically agreed in advance. I book to stay for a specified period of time, after which I check out in an orderly and timely manner. I do not suddenly jump ship half way through my stay, leaving the hotel in the lurch, expecting them to handle all the losses they incur by my suddenly vacating my room. I should not expect to be able to leave paying nothing towards the previously-agreed part of my stay that I've welched on. Yes I know that there is no agreed time factor in the agreement regarding our EU membership. But, by suddenly deciding to leave, we are dumping on them. Not as much as we seem to think. But they are well within their rights to charge us a hefty fee for leaving. And we need to be humble and we ought to hear what they say and be extremely polite about any efforts to reduce the sum. Any other attitude to the situation would be us thinking Queen/Empire/who won the bloody war anyway/we're the dog's dangly bits and who are these Johnny Foreigners demanding money off of us. Not only that, the attitude would result in an adverse outcome for us. Davis and his motley bunch of hubris-laden little Englanders have got a lot to learn. At the moment they are being laughed at and pissed on, deservedly. Be honest and drop the Colonel Blimp shite. Once we leave, which I hope we never will, we'll soon find out what small fry we really are in this big wide world of ours. Actually, it may do us good. But I'd rather be where we are. I like the hotel, in spite of the ants in the bedroom and the skidmarks on the towels. It's warm and cosy and the view is to die for.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Stanron
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 04:22 PM

SPB-Cooperator wrote: Of course there are some who believe that UK should have the right to focus on its own economy at the expense of others, and these are the lowest of the low pathetic excuses for human existance.The sooner this country has its holier than thou arrogance wiped of its face, the better.

Wow. I suppose that this might be humour.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 04:16 PM

We are a net contributor because we recognise that it is mutually beneficial to strengthen economies that are lagging behind so that we become a community of equals. Bearing in mind that each state is coming from different postions, and have their own pressures - East Europe decades of the economies controlled fro Moscow, Mediterranean country emerging form fascism. Noone pretends that this is easy to do.

Of course there are some who believe that UK should have the right to focus on its own economy at the expense of others, and these are the lowest of the low pathetic excuses for human existance.The sooner this country has its holier than thou arrogance wiped of its face, the better. These are often the same people who resent paying taxes as they earn enough not to need anything from the state.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Iains
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 02:15 PM

"You have given us an unsupported list of supposed cases where the EU has allegedly breached its own rules and guidelines but you have failed to provide any details."

how's about supplying some audited accounts as a starter for 10, or is that a bit of a problem to understand?


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 01:34 PM

Steve,
So WE don't have to justify anything. THEY have to do the justifying.

Obviously yes.
They are making a charge on us. Of course they should say what they are charging us for.

If we think a charge unjustified, of course we must challenge it.

When you check out of a hotel, do you keep making offers until they accept one, or do you wait for the bill and then check it?


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 12:40 PM

You have given us an unsupported list of supposed cases where the EU has allegedly breached its own rules and guidelines but you have failed to provide any details. The only one that you and Keith have supposedly backed up is one that you have completely misinterpreted. In fact, you've just churned it out again despite the fact that I've already cleared it up for you. I reckon I'd know which house was yours as I passed by as it would be the one with steam coming out of the roof and bullshit oozing from under the doors. Why don't you just calm down (dear) and think before you explode forth here? It's very unimpressive.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Teribus
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 11:57 AM

SPB-Cooperator - 09 Sep 17 - 09:01 AM

"Of course we must pay into the EU indefinitely to compensate half-billion people for the effect our pathetic little hissy fit will have on the structural development of EU member states that are economically lagging behind."


That is a joke right?

The structural development of the EU, once we leave has got S.F.A. to do with us. Just as in exactly the same way the structural development of the EU BEFORE WE JOINED IT had S.F.A. to do with us. It is an inherently corrupt organisation and we have been doing our best to promote reform from within for over 43 years and we have got nowhere - time to draw stumps and let them get on with it - perhaps us leaving will actually stir them into action that they should have taken decades ago. One thing is for certain if they carry on as they are doing now the whole enterprise will collapse.

By the way SPB-Cooperator there is not a single person in the EU today that says it does not need to be reformed.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Teribus
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 11:47 AM

Cases Shaw? what ones would you like to discuss?

Importation of British Lamb to the EU?

Importation of British Beef to the EU?

EU Fishing Quotas?

The British rebate discussions and agreements made that the EU never honoured?

The various supposedly hard and fast national debt to income ratios that were just swept under the carpet when it proved convenient?

Please, please, please DO take me on, on this Shaw because I will massacre you on the subject.

But let us take this as the starting point:

1: "The EU wants the money they think we should be paying." - Steve Shaw

No, they appear to have picked a nice round figure out of thin air. - Nigel Parsons.

So tell us Shaw how did the EU arrive at their figure? Fact is you can't, but more importantly, neither can they.

2: "If you have good reason to dispute the amount they're asking for, let's be having it, preferably without the little Englander hubris." - Steve Shaw

If they won't tell the UK how this figure has been arrived at, how can we dispute it, either in total or line by line? - Nigel Parsons

I know that you have never worked in any sort of commercial, or contractual, environment Shaw but if you present a bill to anyone you must be able to justify your entire bill item by item if requested to do so by the party you expect to pay it. If you cannot then you have to compromise and come to a mutually agreed figure. This I know presents the EU Commission with a great problem, after all they have not been able to present ONE set of audited accounts in the entire history of the EU.

3: "And it's perfectly right that they want a financial settlement resolved before discussing trade arrangements. Why would any rational negotiator want those two issues enmeshed?" - Steve Shaw

Maybe we should agree the payment in order to get things moving, and then re-negotiate it later. But better yet, let's get on with things.
The EU may not want the two items enmeshed, but they need to take account of their own instructions. - Nigel Parsons

Well then Shaw here are the EU's guidelines:

"According to European Council (Art. 50) guidelines for Brexit negotiations ". Negotiations under Article 50 TEU will be conducted in transparency and AS A SINGLE PACKAGE. In accordance with the principle that nothing is agreed until everything is agreed, individual items cannot be settled separately."

So according to their guidelines it most certainly is NOT "perfectly right" to separate the issues IS IT SHAW?? The EU in adopting the stance they have are clearly disobeying their own guidelines. I take it Shaw that you do know what a SINGLE PACKAGE means don't you? The EU Commission clearly don't.

I do like your line Why would any rational negotiator want those two issues enmeshed? as I have made clear above that it is the EU that has enmeshed the two, and so, are being described by you as irrational! - Nigel Parsons

If ever there was a "Game, Set & Match" on this forum Nigel Parsons destruction of your post (Steve Shaw - 07 Sep 17 - 05:30 PM) was it.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 10:48 AM

You have that arse about face. They don't need us and they know it. In any case, do you suppose for one minute that, once we're gone, you'll never see another VW, Audi or Beamer on our roads ever again? They are being tough on the terms of our leaving not because they're desperate for us to stay (we've been a pain in the arse ever since Maggie, after all) but because they need to make it clear to all members that leaving has dire consequences and that you can't expect favours. That's not blackmail. That's real life.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: akenaton
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 10:35 AM

"Walk away Renee".....The EU needs us more than we need them.

If that was not the case, they would not be trying so hard to stop us leaving! The walls of the monolith are crumbling and the departure of the UK will result in collapse.
Make Britain Great again!


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 10:02 AM

By the way, the EU is NOT breaching its stated negotiating guidelines in the way you allege. From the Guardian:

[stated EU policy:] "Negotiations under article 50 will be conducted as a single package. In accordance with the principle that nothing is agreed until everything is agreed, individual items cannot be settled separately."

Superficially, this sounds promising. Downing Street wants everything on the table at once, so it can use trade and security as leverage. But the EU is actually only making the point that this principle applies to article 50 talks, ie the terms of exit, not what follows after.


Try again. And do try to apply a dose of honesty this time.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 09:54 AM

There's a live feed on FB at the moment from the anti-BrexShit demo in London. A great many of the 'comments' rolling up on it are from Pro-BrexShitters, and a considerable number of those proclaim that they 'voted for democracy', and that anyone who disagrees with them is a 'traitor' who should be forced to leave the UK,

Oh, the delicious irony! Sadly, those thick dipshits don't even get it.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 09:52 AM

And just get a load of this piece of little-Englander drivel:

"Of course they have to justify the sum they are demanding.
Of course we should only pay what we consider we rightfully owe."

So WE don't have to justify anything. THEY have to do the justifying. WE should tell them what's fair for us to pay. WE know what we "rightfully owe" and THEY don't get a penny more. End of.

Tell you what, Keith. Why don't you add on to your little analysis "And who won the bloody war anyway?"


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 09:40 AM

I am debating honestly.

You said,
"The EU wants the money they think we should be paying. If you have good reason to dispute the amount they're asking for, let's be having it, preferably without the little Englander hubris.

And it's perfectly right that they want a financial settlement resolved before discussing trade arrangements."

It reads like we should pay what "The EU wants" and that you support them breaking their own rule by demanding the bill is agreed separately and first.


It reads like no such thing. Once again you indulge in your slimy, disreputable trick of deliberately misinterpreting your opponents' posts in order to make a vacuous case against them. My words are clear. Take them or leave them but don't come on this forum with your silly, disreputable mischief.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Stu
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 09:17 AM

"An itemised bill is expected."

Then brexit will take forever. Fine by me.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 09:01 AM

Of course we must pay into the EU indefinitely to compensate half-billion people for the effect our pathetic little hissy fit will have on the structural development of EU member states that are economically lagging behind. If we do not continue to live up to our responsibilities, either remaining or leaving (= paying but not wanting any of the benefits). Of course there will be people here with a f*** everyone else attitude, but I do not want to be labeled as a nasty, isolationist piece of excrement.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 08:45 AM

Stu,
By going into the negotiation with one or other saying their opposite has to justify everything, this could take forever and comes across as belligerence.

Of course they have to justify the sum they are demanding.
Of course we should only pay what we consider we rightfully owe.

We are leaving them, not the other way around so the onus is on us to make sure we reach a compromise,

When you check out of an hotel, if you consider the bill excessive, you go through the itemised bill and check that you agree with what you are being charged for.

An itemised bill is expected.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 08:24 AM

"The ability to do exactly as we like whenever we like will be severely curtailed."

So you want to take away from those beneath you the right to chose their career, and be told the type of work to prioritise the 'states' needs. This has the stench of Stalinism/Naziism doesn't it.

So is this going to start with redeploying those in cushy, well-paid jobs into the agricultural, personal care and sweat-shop sectors - there are plenty of skilled people from overseas who are qualified to employ into skilled, professional and management work.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Stu
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 07:10 AM

"It will have to be arrived at by negotiation, with EU justifying every item."

There are two sides in this negotiation, and it's incumbent on both of them to reach agreement, so BOTH sides have to reach compromise. By going into the negotiation with one or other saying their opposite has to justify everything, this could take forever and comes across as belligerence.

We are leaving them, not the other way around so the onus is on us to make sure we reach a compromise, not least for the good of the people of these islands. The alternative, a hard "fuck 'em all" brexit would be the worst possible outcome, as it is there will be no winners in this lunacy, but at least our idiot Tory Brexit team should be acting like statesmen and not petulant children. For all our sakes.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 06:28 AM

I am debating honestly.

You said,
"The EU wants the money they think we should be paying. If you have good reason to dispute the amount they're asking for, let's be having it, preferably without the little Englander hubris.

And it's perfectly right that they want a financial settlement resolved before discussing trade arrangements."

It reads like we should pay what "The EU wants" and that you support them breaking their own rule by demanding the bill is agreed separately and first.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 06:19 AM

I have neither indicated that I think we shouldn't negotiate nor have I said that we should accept the first figure. Stop being a complete trolling arse. And one more time. I don't give a fig for your ONE example. "Rarely follows its own rules and guidelines" means that "ON THE MANY OCCASIONS THAT THE EU SHOULD HAVE FOLLOWED ITS OWN RULES AND GUIDELINES, IT FAILED TO DO SO IN THE VAST MAJORITY OF CASES." Now I am asking for a sufficient number of examples of those occasions, which must be set against the occasions when it DID follow the rules and guidelines, in order to substantiate what was an easy europhobic remark to make but which is very difficult to back up. If you can't debate honestly, just clear off.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 05:40 AM

Steve,
One example, which is dubious in any case,

It is not dubious and is easily verified, e.g.
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/eu-agreed-brexit-negotiating-stance-133719883.html


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 05:35 AM

So what's a reasonable figure, Keith, and who's going to arrive at it?

It will have to be arrived at by negotiation, with EU justifying every item.
You seem to be objecting to UK questioning the figure demanded.
Are you?
Do you advocate we accept the first amount they demand without itemisation?


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 05:28 AM

The apostrophe goblin strike's again...


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 05:27 AM

One example, which is dubious in any case, is not evidence that the EU rarely follows it's own rules and guidelines. "Rarely" means that it follows them on very few out of many occasions. I'm afraid that Teribus's remark was throwaway.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 05:22 AM

"Do any of you think UK should pay more than is reasonable?
Would you be happy for our negotiators to accept the first figure produced by EU?"

So what's a reasonable figure, Keith, and who's going to arrive at it?


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 05:13 AM

Steve, the example has already been given twice.

Here it is again, "2. Negotiations under Article 50 TEU will be conducted in transparency and as a single package. In accordance with the principle that nothing is agreed until everything is agreed, individual items cannot be settled separately."


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 05:10 AM

Anyway, it's raining which means I can't cut the grass which means I can watch Man City v Liverpool at 12.30. I predict Blues 1 Reds 3. The way politics should always be! My cousin has a City season ticket but, luckily, he doesn't read Mudcat.

Ok, Iains, let's be having one of your sneery insults as a nice follow-up to your last post. I may even give you a recipe if you oblige. Hypocrite.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 05:01 AM

I should like the evidence that the EU Commission rarely follows its own rules and guidelines. Only a close observer over a number of years could have come up with such a claim. So let's be having a dozen or two examples of how the rules and guidelines are flouted. Easy to say...


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 04:43 AM

Do any of you think UK should pay more than is reasonable?
Would you be happy for our negotiators to accept the first figure produced by EU?


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 04:29 AM

There is no counter argument because there is no argument in the first place. Tezzer just sychophantically repeated Nigel's post. Carry on arguing about the argument itself though by all means but don't complain when the thread gets closed.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Iains
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 04:00 AM

"Clear as mud, Bill. Try again in the morning after a couple of Anadins."

I see no counter argument can be given so the normal response of insult occurs.
Strange the moderators do not appear to delete these sort of responses from certain people.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Teribus
Date: 09 Sep 17 - 02:14 AM

Clear as crystal to everybody else Shaw:

The EU Commission cannot even follow their own rules and guidelines, apart of course for on the rare occasions where it suits them. THAT has always been the major failing of the EU Project, but what would anyone expect from a lash-up as corrupt as the EU, a cosy club whose sole purpose from the outset was to keep France and Germany sweet. After the end of March 2019 with the UK out, I don't think German industry and the German people will be all that happy as it will be them that have to take up the slack and pay in even more to keep the gravy train on the rails.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Sep 17 - 07:30 PM

Clear as mud, Bill. Try again in the morning after a couple of Anadins.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Teribus
Date: 08 Sep 17 - 05:49 PM

I think that Nigel Parson's post:

Nigel Parsons - 08 Sep 17 - 05:34 AM

Is possibly the best post I have ever read on Mudcat. Beautifully succinct, it struck down a lamentably poor argument with the efficiency of a QC.

I particularly loved this bit of it:

"Maybe we should agree the payment in order to get things moving, and then re-negotiate it later. But better yet, let's get on with things.

The EU may not want the two items enmeshed, but they need to take account of their own instructions.

According to European Council (Art. 50) guidelines for Brexit negotiations "2. Negotiations under Article 50 TEU will be conducted in transparency and as a single package. In accordance with the principle that nothing is agreed until everything is agreed, individual items cannot be settled separately.

So, by their own rules, set out at the start of the process, we are not able to agree (and be bound by)their claim for an 'exit payment' at this point in the negotiations.

I do like your line Why would any rational negotiator want those two issues enmeshed? as I have made clear above that it is the EU that has enmeshed the two, and so, are being described by you as irrational!

Cheers
Nigel


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: MikeL2
Date: 08 Sep 17 - 02:49 PM

Hi Dave


makes sense really. Do you think they will allow to take cup (Cardboard) of coffee?

Gone are the days when you used to take booze on the terraces. Sales of Daily Mirror rocketed !!! lol

Regards mike


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Sep 17 - 01:51 PM

I will probably waving an empty pint pot to my mate to get them in.

Not in the stands at City :-( They were pretty strict on that whan I went.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: MikeL2
Date: 08 Sep 17 - 11:01 AM

Hi Steve

<" If you wear a very large pink carnation and wave a copy of The Guardian over your head every time a camera gets anywhere near you, I'll know it's you! ">

I will probably waving an empty pint pot to my mate to get them in.

Cheers

Mike


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Stu
Date: 08 Sep 17 - 10:54 AM

"When UK joined the common market, no severance terms were mentioned."

The terms and conditions were updated.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 08 Sep 17 - 10:42 AM

From: Steve Shaw - PM
Date: 08 Sep 17 - 05:43 AM

Had a letter from Calor Gas yesterday containing my renewed contract. If I want to leave, I have to agree to pay them £300-plus to remove the bulk tank. I don't like it, but If I ever do leave (unlikely as it happens) I have to stump up, don't I? After all, I did agree to it. No unseemly squabbling, as we're seeing Davis and his sorry ilk engaging in.


Fair enough, if, as you state, you agreed to severance terms in your contract you have to live by that.
When UK joined the common market, no severance terms were mentioned. So there is no correlation between the two situations, except possibly the attempt by the larger partner to prevent the smaller partner from leaving by applying a severance charge.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Iains
Date: 08 Sep 17 - 10:26 AM

"I am also active in a number of organisations for the betterment of my fellow man."
unlike some here that like to belittle their fellow man!


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Sep 17 - 10:12 AM

Lovely stuff in the Independent :-)

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Stu
Date: 08 Sep 17 - 09:53 AM

Community level is the only way to make a difference. National politics is too partisan and led by corporate and establishment interests and local politics also suffers from tribalism and local authorities are pretty much corrupt to the core.

Nope, the only way things happen is when folk get out and make them happen.


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Subject: RE: BS: brexit matters
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Sep 17 - 09:27 AM

Speak for yourself.

Sorry, Stu, but on here you are an armchair warrior. I never intimated that doing that precludes anyone from being a real warrior in real life. Socially or otherwise.

I am also active in a number of organisations for the betterment of my fellow man.

So there to you too :-P

DtG


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