Good Rabbie Burns CD's

Subject: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: GUEST,Jean
Date: 24 Jan 00 - 02:35 PM

I want to buy some CD's with the songs of Robert Burns. However, with so many of them out there, I would appreciate suggestions from others as to what ones are good, and what ones are bad. I don't particularly like the 'warbly, music hall' style of singing. Any ideas?

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 24 Jan 00 - 03:21 PM

Any of Jean Redpath's series!

Malcolm

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: Margo
Date: 24 Jan 00 - 04:59 PM

Yes, I am currently in love with the Jean Redpath series of Robert Burns songs. Seven albums on four CD's. The series is a very interesting amalgam.

Working on the project was Serge Hovey, who (according to the liner notes) did exhaustive research on the melodies Burns intended for use with his lyrics. It is wonderful to hear the melodies and know they're really traditional.

The next aspect is interesting: Hovey arranged all the songs using a full orchestra. Not every peice has a symphonic accompanament, but he uses a wide range of instrumentation. I am figuring out my own guitar chords for the songs I like, and they work just fine! So the original melody still stands well on it's own with either orchestra or one instrument.

And last but certainly not least, you have the singing of Jean Redpath. Jean is considered to be Scotland's foremost singer of Scottish traditional songs. Being Scottish herself, her interpretations have the wonderful nuances of the Scots language. I actually heard the last CD first, and decided from that one that I wanter the rest.

I haven't had the time (or money) to buy other CD's of Burns songs, so I'm interested in other's suggestions too. Margo

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: GUEST,Peter F. from TLT
Date: 24 Jan 00 - 05:59 PM

What is good? Linn Music is still continuing with a sieies of CDs covering "all" the songs of Robert Burns. Featured on these recordings are the best singers currently performing in Scotland( although so far there have been some strange choices and quite a fiew ommissions). Overall though pretty good. Also worth checking out "Rod Patterson Sings Burns" Greentrax CDTRAX 117. Rather naff cabaret title but good selection of songs fron a first class singer. cheers.

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: GUEST,Al
Date: 25 Jan 00 - 01:31 AM

Andy M. Stewart's (Ex Silly Wizard) "Songs of Robert Burns" is excellent. I'm not wild about the arrangements of Jean Redpath's Burns Collections, although it is amusing to hear her sing (on the "Merry Muses" version of "Ode To Spring" on vol 7 of the set) . . "When mawkin bucks at early fucks in dewy grass are seen, sir . . ". There is also a 1995 (Various Artists including Davy Steele, Tich Frier, Fiona Forbes, et al) CD "Robert Burns' The Merry Muses" containing 19 ribald songs.

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: GUEST,Sheila
Date: 25 Jan 00 - 02:27 AM

The Fury's have a few Burns' songs but I have find the titles, when I do I'll report back.

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: GUEST,Rab
Date: 25 Jan 00 - 11:28 AM

Definately, the Linn Series, The Complete Songs of Robert Burns. The first two CD's are good but the rest are excellent. They have simple arrangements using traditional instruments and singers who sing without the 'warble'. Best of all, everyone can sing along with them. Volume 7 is due out soon, I believe.

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: Margo
Date: 25 Jan 00 - 03:05 PM

What is traditional instrumentation? Are you speaking generally of any ecoustic instrument, or are there specific instruments that were popular in Scotland in Burns time? I'd like to know.... Margo

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: Penny S.
Date: 26 Jan 00 - 02:24 PM

Thread creep coming up - a speaker on BBC Radio 4 last night put forward the idea that Burns was writing proto-blues, as were other Scots writers of the time. Something to do with the music of the people under oppression.

Penny

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: GUEST,Rab
Date: 26 Jan 00 - 04:24 PM

Yes, Rab did write many terribly sad songs about the oppression and poverty of the Scottish people. He knew all about poverty as he was dirt poor all his life and he hated certain members of the aristocracy who he felt sold Scotland out to the English. But he wrote some hilariously funny songs too.

Traditional Scottish instruments include the whistle, bodhran and fiddle.

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 26 Jan 00 - 04:38 PM

One vote for Ewan MacColl's Folkways recording of Burns' songs. Should be available, at least on cassette, from Smithsonian/Folkways. Can Camsco get it, Dick?

Sandy

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: GUEST,Celia
Date: 27 Jan 00 - 10:15 AM

I'd like to know more information about the Linn series, The Complete Songs of Robert Burns'. Anyone know anything about the singers or the series?

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: GUEST,Mbo
Date: 27 Jan 00 - 10:31 AM

Oooh, I'd love to hear the Andy M. Stewart one. I love Andy! I'm not into Jean Redpath too much. She sounds really old...I'm not sure what it is. There is hope that one day, my friends, you'll see my Robert Burns album. I've done arrangements of several of his songs--some well known, and others not so. I know The Cast does some beautiful arrangments of Burns song. And who could forget Deaf Shepherd's heart-rending version of "Winter O' Life"?

--Mbo

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: Margo
Date: 27 Jan 00 - 10:41 AM

MBO, what does "old" sound like?

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Jan 00 - 02:27 PM

I'd like to ask Peter F from TLT what singers from the Linn series he thought were 'strange choices' and also who he would have liked to hear singing. Just interested. I really liked Wendy Weatherby and Lesley Hale's singing.

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: GUEST,Mbo
Date: 27 Jan 00 - 05:07 PM

Darn! I shouldn't have said anything! A lot of people really like her. I just don't find her very interesting. I don't want to explain what exactly "old" sounds like at risk of being pelted with large objects. Everyone to their own taste, as the old lady said when she kissed the cow.

--Mbo

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: Margo
Date: 27 Jan 00 - 05:43 PM

Oh MBO, I'm just curious what old sounds like, not in any way connected with whether or not I like Jean Redpath. I'm 45, so I want to know if I sound "old". I'm serious. Message me if you don't want to say in the forum. Margo

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: Mbo
Date: 27 Jan 00 - 06:55 PM

Alright, I'll say it! First let me put on my bulletproof vest and hardhat...I don't like her because she sounds like she's 200 years old. **Covers eyes with hands** I probably doesn't have to do with age at all, just voice quality. But to me she has this dry tremolo sound, kind of like someone trying to be an opera singer when they're not. I guess "old" really doesn't have anything to do with it. Mary Black's mother has a great voice, as do a lot of older folks. Heck, Robert Plant becomes more of a better singer as he gets older! Improvement comes with age and experience, I guess! BTW when I first heard Murray Head sing in Jesus Christ Superstar, I thought he was "old." It turned out he was 19. I guess it's just a matter of opinion, and I'm sure you have a wonderful voice! **Takes duck & cover stance**

--Mbo

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: GUEST,Alison
Date: 28 Jan 00 - 08:52 AM

It is just a matter of opinion. I think Jean Redpath's voice is too 'operatic' to be singing Burn's songs, which he himself wanted to be sung simply and without vibrato.

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: Margo
Date: 28 Jan 00 - 11:12 AM

Hmmm. This is really interesting. MBO, you just don't like the way she sings. I understand she has had no formal training.

Alison, how do you know that Burns meant the songs to be sung without vibrato? Is there actually a reference to that in his writing? I am very interested to know. Margo

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: Mbo
Date: 28 Jan 00 - 11:18 AM

Ahhh... no formal training...that's actually kinda hard to believe. It sounded to my like she did, but her voice wasn't so hot. But, then again, it's time to use my new catch line--it's not bad--it's raw. And raw rules! (As Spaw can attest to!)

--Mbo

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: Margo
Date: 28 Jan 00 - 11:29 AM

Mbo, I have had the unfortunate background of having had formal training. Opera, as a matter of fact. I love folk music, and try very, very hard to sing simply. I find that I can. But it takes concentration. I don't think Jean has had formal trainging because of certain aspects of her tone which training would have changed (besides the fact that it is in the liner notes of her CD). My latest "gigs" are at my son's preschool. I sing every morning for the kids in the main hall before they all go to class. They love my singing for them. Since I've found such an appreciative audience, I'll stick with them. :o)

But seriously, I do have plans to record a children's CD. I am writing the songs now. They are all Robert Louis Stevenson's poems from A Child's Garden of Verses. I had wanted to put them to music for a long time but had no inspiration. Then I found out RLS was born and raised in Scotland. I've been listening to the Burns songs for inspiration from the traditional melodies that he used for his lyrics. It's been so much fun. When I finally come out with a CD I'll toot my horn loudly here! Margo

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: GUEST,Alison
Date: 28 Jan 00 - 01:48 PM

Margo, It has long been known in Scotland that Burn's didn't like his folk songs to be sung with vibrato, and this has been talked about in many books. Dr. Fred Freeman who produced the CD series, The Complete Songs of Robert Burns, says in Vol. 1 of the series:

"What interests me is that Burns himself, along with the early music theorists whom he knew and respected (William Tytler and James Beattie) was deeply involved in the self-same battle as the modern Scottish folk artists. Only his battle was (from their point of view historically) before the fact: with the advent of classical and early romantic trends he disapproved of for folk song - especially the more homophonic texture of the music; the heavier articulation and vibrato in singing; the less communal the character of performance".

He also wrote the song "Amang the trees where humming bees' which makes fun of the opera. He grew up with his mother, and another woman who stayed with them, singing all the old songs of the day. He loved that anybody could sing them, whether they were decent singers or not. Burn's was a peasant and wasn't a good musician or singer. His wife, Jean, would sing the songs for him, which was a great pleasure in his life.

The reason many people stopped listening to Scottish songs was that the record companies would only release records which had the likes of Peter Morrison and Moira Anderson singing on them. Yes, they are wonderful singers, but they aren't right for the songs of Robert Burns. People just got fed up with them. Now, thankfully, CD's like Dr. Fred's are coming out with singers who sing in a voice the way Burn's would have approved of.

By the way, I love opera, and in fact next week I'm going to see Lucia de Lammermoor! And I'm sure you sing the songs of Burns beautifully and I would hope that you seek out some of the obscure Burn's songs, which tend to be the most beautiful. Try Gloomy December or one of the many others.

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: Margo
Date: 28 Jan 00 - 03:37 PM

Thank you, Alison! I just love it here because I learn so much from our "chit chat". Oh yes, I am very paranoid of someone hearing me sing folk music and saying "she sounds like an opera singer". I want to get set up with a mike so I can sing on one of the HearMe song circles. I really enjoyed MBO's last sing (he was kind of the MC) but I could only type, lacking the mike. Once I get set up you'll be able to let me know if I sound "operatic" or "old". It's really important to me to get opinions... Margo

Subject: RE: Good Rabbie Burn's CD's
From: Mbo
Date: 28 Jan 00 - 04:24 PM

Oh, Margo--sounding like an opera singer is a GOOD THING! My definition of Jean's voice wasn't the fact that she sounded like an opera singer--just a kind of wheezy, querilous one. I love opera as much as folk, and my findings are this: there are good opera singers and bad opera singers, and good non-opera singers and bad non-opera singers. Some singers have really nasty voices--and I like them--I love Paul Brady, but my family thinks he has a horrible voice. On the other hand the Scottish opera singer Mairi MacInnes has a voice I cannot stand! BTW what opera do you sing? I'd like to hear it!

--Mbo