Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV

Subject: BS: Pope Francis has died
From: keberoxu
Date: 21 Apr 25 - 09:10 AM

The Pope died after midnight,
so he lived long enough to experience
his last Easter Sunday.

After he left that clinic,
his doctors ordered him to rest,
and he didn't rest,
so he pushed himself too far.

I guess that is the way that he wanted to go,
being before the people and working.

Subject: RE: BS: Pope Francis has died
From: keberoxu
Date: 21 Apr 25 - 09:33 AM

The press articles gave a brief description of
camerlengo,
and the duties that go with that temporary post.
It sounded as though this person kept the Church running
until the conclave that selected the next pope.

Tellingly, the current camerlengo is
the first American to hold the post.

Subject: RE: BS: Pope Francis has died
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 21 Apr 25 - 10:40 AM

What a horrible last day, to have had to sit in the same room with the U.S VP Vance. That would take a toll on anyone.

Subject: RE: BS: Pope Francis has died
From: Mary G
Date: 21 Apr 25 - 11:25 AM

I was just in Italy and took a bus tour past the Vatican. I think it is time for new blood and the next conclave should be interesting. I, without knowing enough but that never stops me, am interested in Cardinal Taigle of the Philippines. He seems like a good candidate.

I struggle to be a halfway OK catholic. don't quite succeed. I figure I am only half catholic because my mother was protestant but converted. Otherwise I probaby go back to st. patrick, and irish catholicism has a different route than other constantine based origins. Anyway, i want an option of a latin mass, better music, (the old kind), approval if not mandation of birth control, married and women and both priests, cardinals and popes.

Subject: RE: BS: Pope Francis has died
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 21 Apr 25 - 11:39 AM

The best bit of the UK TV coverage this afternoon has been seeing the interview from Westminster Cathedral with two top English Cardinals. It was a positive relief to hear interviewees sounding like *people* for once.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: robomatic
Date: 21 Apr 25 - 12:57 PM

My respects. It was a sad surprise but really not a surprise. I've been moved many times by his particular acts and graciousness. I only leanred about it from this post which I've just read, so thank you, Keb.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Mrrzy
Date: 21 Apr 25 - 03:22 PM

I rather liked this particular pope, as popes go.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 21 Apr 25 - 03:50 PM

Cause of death was reported pretty quickly, a headline said it was a stroke followed by the circulatory system collapse. I suppose if there was much of a delay in the announcement rumors would arise.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Beer
Date: 21 Apr 25 - 05:28 PM

He was a good man and representative of the Catholic Church.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Donuel
Date: 21 Apr 25 - 08:40 PM

He was a far better man than the Pope who resigned during the Vatican Bank scandal and continued to live at the Vatican while Pope Francis lived outside the Vatican at a nearby Basilica.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: The Sandman
Date: 22 Apr 25 - 02:37 AM

stilly , I agree , anyone who has to sit in the same room as an ex member of the KKK HAD A SAD ENDING

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Apr 25 - 04:42 AM

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2025/04/21/jd-vance-pope-francis-meeting/

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Apr 25 - 05:27 AM

Keb, are you suggesting that convert Vance and his wife poisoned the
Pope and has a select American to influence the Conclave?

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Jack Campin
Date: 22 Apr 25 - 06:00 AM

There was a video on FB of Vance's audience. The Pope gave him a present for his kids - a package of Kinder Eggs. Which are illegal in the US.

Francis was one of the good guys.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: weerover
Date: 22 Apr 25 - 06:32 AM

Just a day after I finished reading "Conclave" by Robert Harris.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Apr 25 - 07:56 AM

Conclave was very good.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: keberoxu
Date: 26 Apr 25 - 09:18 AM

The funeral is over and Pope Francis has been laid to rest
in the basilica, I think it is, of
Santa Maria Maggiore, in Rome.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: robomatic
Date: 27 Apr 25 - 03:15 PM

I watched the movie "Conclave" a month or so ago. Well cast, well acted, but emotionally I'm more of a "Shoes of the Fisherman" sort.

Nevertheless, Pope Francis will exert posthumous influence which we'll understand more better through his selections to the College of Cardinals.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Rapparee
Date: 28 Apr 25 - 04:56 AM

We were at Knock, a Marian shrine, when our tour leader found out. I’d picked it up on the web as we traveled along. My personal opinion is the Francis died of his allergy to pretentiousness.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: keberoxu
Date: 30 Apr 25 - 06:09 PM

They have set the date for the conclave, I think it is a week from today.
And the politicking is starting in the assemblies already,
and there are cardinals making statements to the press even.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 30 Apr 25 - 08:11 PM

requiscat in pace

Generally, it seems, a good man!

R.I.P.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Donuel
Date: 03 May 25 - 08:56 AM

Black smoke-no consensus, white smoke a Cardinal got a plurality of votes.
Red smoke, a Cardinal was incinerated.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 04 May 25 - 04:11 AM

I hope that whenever Donuel posts, he's posting misinformation. It's just not worth the energy to post fact checks on him.
But it takes a 2/3 supermajority for white smoke to appear, not a mere plurality.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 04 May 25 - 08:09 AM

Never mind supermajority'. 'Plurality' doesn't even (necessarily) mean a majority. It just means more than anyone else.
If there are 5 people in the running a majority has to be 50%+. A plurality can be as low as 20%+.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 07 May 25 - 08:35 AM

schisms in the catholic church??? something to read while the world awaits for the the white smoke?

Bad Faith by Kathryn Joyce, VAnity Fair, October 2024 From exiled actors to academics, influencers to intellectuals, VF gets under the hood of the Catholic rights celebrity conversion industrial complex.

... Since his election in 2013, Pope Francis—the first non-European pope in more than 1,200 years—has faced bitter opposition. His early calls for Catholics to lessen their “obsessive” focus on sexual issues marked him as a liberal to conservative critics; his emphasis on poverty and the environment proved him a “Marxist globalist” for the same crowd. Cardinals issued formal dubia (demands for clarification); clergy called for his resignation; some declared him an “antipope”; some prayed for his death.

As the divisions reached a fever pitch in 2020, they mapped neatly onto American politics, pitting “bad Catholics” Joe Biden and Pope Francis against Trump (the non-Catholic) and the faithful remnant. Trump’s campaign recognized as much, bypassing Church bishops to court Catholics through non-establishment leaders, including many on the “radical traditionalist” fringe ...

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 07 May 25 - 07:23 PM

Only black smoke on the first puff from the portable chimney.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 08 May 25 - 12:24 PM

The white smoke appeared this evening, we await the name of the new one. All I can say is that it will be a man. Probably a white man.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 08 May 25 - 01:16 PM

Wow - a first - an American Pope.

Cardinal Robert Prevost from Chicago.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 May 25 - 01:30 PM

He’s a Bigly Pope. How long before The Fat Orange Buffoon in the White House tries to claim credit for getting him elected? ;-)

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Donuel
Date: 08 May 25 - 02:29 PM

From: Donuel - PM
Date: 22 Apr 25 - 05:27 AM

Keb, are you suggesting that convert Vance and his wife poisoned the
Pope and has a select American to influence the Conclave?

Keb, you win the Grand Pope Prize, you should write the book. It should sell as well as Angels and Demons.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis has died (1936-2025)
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 08 May 25 - 07:05 PM

I read an interesting account of the new pope being a jazz trombonist, but then in the remarks the author made the suggestion that it was something made up from Chat GPT and the guy was running a "social experiment." If it turns out to be accurate I'll undelete the new thread i originally put up (a Pope who fit into the Mudcat scene!), but in the meantime, lets see what turns up about the interests of the new Pope from Chicago.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: robomatic
Date: 08 May 25 - 09:19 PM

i have been told he's a Cubs fan.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: robomatic
Date: 08 May 25 - 09:41 PM

according to NBC, they texted the answer was his preference was White Sox. So at least He's a Chicago homie.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Joe Offer
Date: 09 May 25 - 12:10 AM

Please take a listen to the Senior Gossip Columnist for the Vatican Enquirer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmRVuB5exLM

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 09 May 25 - 02:20 AM

He’s younger than me. Suddenly I feel very old…

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: gillymor
Date: 09 May 25 - 08:55 AM

He's a Villanova grad which could mean the Nova Knicks in 4, if he so decrees.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 09 May 25 - 09:13 AM

Please take a listen to the Senior Gossip Columnist for the Vatican Enquirer:

Well, that's 8 minutes of my life I'll never get back. ;-(

DC

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 09 May 25 - 11:53 AM

His family's life will change dramatically. His brother who lives in Illinois was interviewed by the New York Times; the only part that left a gap in the information was the line "In addition to John and Robert, now Leo, the Prevosts had one other son, who now lives in Florida." Hoping there isn't a rift or the odd one (like a Billy to Jimmy Carter). Does this make him a "Florida man?" (I just finished reading a long piece in The Atlantic about Carl Hiaasen, who writes Florida Man like no one else.)

There will be pressure from the media to dish on the new pope, to share what friends and family think he thinks about all sorts of stuff. It probably won't be pretty to look at. (As noted above, he's a White Sox fan, not a Cubs fan.) For starters, Trump has already claimed credit for this pope's choice. Trump welcomes new American-born pope and says he can’t wait to meet him - despite Leo XIV previous criticism

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Beer
Date: 09 May 25 - 11:55 AM

That was a great laugh Joe.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 09 May 25 - 11:58 AM

”Trump has already claimed credit for this pope's choice.”

So my prediction (08 May 25 - 01:30 PM) came true!

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Donuel
Date: 09 May 25 - 12:37 PM

How exactly did the conspiracy to poison the previous Pope and pay off the conclave to pick Trump's inside man work?

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Helen
Date: 09 May 25 - 04:54 PM

Well, it might be the opposite of a Trump pick. This article suggests that Pope Leo XIV is following Pope Francis in working towards a more open church. It is worth reading the full article for a glimmer of hope.

The Catholic Church had always resisted a North American pope. Is Leo XIV the anti-Trump?

"In just a week, Donald Trump has gone from sharing the almost blasphemous image of himself as a pope to posting the uncharacteristically subdued message congratulating Chicago-born cardinal Robert Prevost on his election to the head of the Catholic Church.

"Vice-President JD Vance has also been on his best behaviour, posting a message of congratulations, saying: 'I'm sure millions of American Catholics and other Christians will pray for his successful work leading the church.'

"Trump is all about 'America First' and his supporters are self-described patriots. And the election of Pope Leo XIV has put one of their fellow citizens at the top of one of the world's oldest institutions for the first time.

"But in these deeply fractious ideological times, it is not so simple to suggest all the America First faithful would be happy with this result."

...

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: JennieG
Date: 09 May 25 - 07:58 PM

Seen on facebook this morning:

"Pope Leo must be one of the Blues Brothers, because he comes from Chicago and he's on a mission from God."

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: keberoxu
Date: 11 May 25 - 01:52 PM

The New York Times has articles every day about
the conservative majority of United States Catholics,
and how Leo XIV is a disappointment to them because
he is not conservative enough for their taste.

My last Catholic parish, which I loved, was staffed by
Dominican friars who were deeply committed to Vatican II
and to the Catholic Social Teaching espoused by Leo XIII.
So Pope Leo is a pope after their hearts.

His fellow cardinals say he is "no pushover"
so hopefully he will build on what Pope Francis started.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Donuel
Date: 12 May 25 - 11:09 AM

His friends call him Bob. Something is comforting about Pope Bob.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 13 May 25 - 11:11 PM

So it turns out that the older brother in Florida is a MAGA follower. Not as hard core as some, apparently, but it has been in his Facebook feed, now set to private, and he has said he'll tone it down.

The Pope’s Florida Brother, a MAGA Disciple, Plans to ‘Tone It Down’
Louis Prevost’s Facebook posts — no longer publicly viewable — suggest that he has embraced some of the most common complaints and conspiracy theories of the right.

You can often find the eldest brother of the Successor of the Prince of the Apostles down at the Twisted Fork restaurant in Port Charlotte, Fla., where, on Honky-Tonk Thursdays, he is most likely boot-scooting along with the rest of the line dancers.

His ringtone plays the opening riffs of Led Zeppelin’s “Immigrant Song.” He incurred $20,000 in roof damage from Hurricane Ian. And until recently, anyone could read his Facebook posts, which included vulgar potshots at Nancy Pelosi and her husband and a pronouncement that supporters of Joseph R. Biden Jr. suffered from a “mental affliction.”

Nearly a week after the Chicago-born Robert Francis Prevost became Pope Leo XIV, the world is still adjusting to the fact that he has an American family that does typically American things. The Borgias, for all their many sins, never posted crude or spicy memes to the socials. And indeed, for Louis Prevost, 73, it is the Facebook posts, which he shared online before his brother was made pope, that have earned him the most attention in the last few days.

By Tuesday, the posts were no longer publicly viewable. Among other things, he reposted an old video of Ms. Pelosi, under which the author of the original post referred to her with a vulgar sexist epithet. The original post also insinuated that Ms. Pelosi’s husband, Paul, was gay, echoing a misinformation campaign that spread among those on the right after Mr. Pelosi was brutally attacked by a man who broke into his home in October 2022.

The New York Post called the post “awful” and “gross.”

Another post written by Mr. Prevost, according to The Daily Beast, told people to “Keep [their] powder dry,” because there is a “war right here at home, a war for our streets and neighborhoods.”

By Monday, Mr. Prevost was a guest on “Piers Morgan Uncensored,” where Mr. Morgan read some of the posts back to him. “It’s quite lively stuff for a bloke who’s now the pope’s older brother,” the talk show host said.

There's a bit more to the article, follow the link.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Joe Offer
Date: 14 May 25 - 12:20 AM

I belonged to a parish in conservative Auburn CA for almost 25 years, after living in a less conservative situation in Sacramento for 20 years. But over the 25 years in Auburn, I worked hard to keep my parish from falling into the depths of this MAGA nonsense. The conservatives moved in during COVID, and turned the balance of power. They especially gained a stronghold in the religious education programs. I still taught, but I was more and more under scrutiny. It finally got too uncomfortable to stay, so I moved to a more progressive parish in the next town over. I'm the second Parish Council President who has left the Auburn parish in disgust in the last 5 years.

Pope Francis was my Dream Pope, and I think Pope Leo will be almost as good. But the balance of power in the U.S. Catholic Church is conservative, except for a few progressive parishes here and there.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Mary G
Date: 15 May 25 - 01:19 AM

My favorite was John Paul I, who took on the very corrupt and intertwined Vatican and Italian banks and oops he died after 33 days in office. He used to go jogging in a Minnie Mouse t-shirt it has been said. Pope Leo has a Creole ancestry. Maybe he can help us reduce some of the hatred in the world and the US in particular. And he had better go after the sex traffickers of children and others. I am a sucker for conspiracy theories but I think the church, holy mother the church, has been involved.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 15 May 25 - 04:25 AM

I am a sucker for conspiracy theories but I think the church, holy mother the church, has been involved.

When an organisation has managed to convince 1.3 to 1.4 billion people that a virgin can give birth, that someone can walk on water and come back from the dead, and that bread and wine changes substance when declarecd sacred by an approved official, conspiracy theories pale into insignificance.

DC

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 15 May 25 - 05:36 AM

The Ultimate Control System, Doug.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Joe Offer
Date: 16 May 25 - 07:37 PM

Doug and Backwoodsman, some of us Catholics are reasonably well-educated. We may not be the literalists you take us to be.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Donuel
Date: 16 May 25 - 09:11 PM

A positive side effect of Covid was a virtual stoppage of mass shootings. A million US deaths from disease was a poor trade off.
At the beginning of January 2021, Pope Francis expressed the view that vaccination was a moral obligation because one's own health and life as well as the lives of others were at stake, and that rejecting vaccination was “suicidal denialism”.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 17 May 25 - 05:48 AM

Even the reasonably well-educated, non-literalist Catholics must believe some of it or else they would be atheist/agnostic.

It's my guess that if you subtracted all of those from the 1.3 billion figure, there would still be more than enough to outweigh any conspiracy theory.

DC

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 17 May 25 - 06:16 AM

”Doug and Backwoodsman, some of us Catholics are reasonably well-educated. We may not be the literalists you take us to be.”

Statements like that serve to convince me, even more than I already was, of the mind-control that religious systems - not just the Church of Rome - have amassed over the centuries.

Doug expressed it much more eloquently than I could.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 17 May 25 - 07:58 AM

Joe, I think you may be reading more into my post than I am trying to say. I am not attacking the Church or anybody's beliefs.

Mary G's post of 15 May 25 - 01:19 AM referred to Pope John Paul I

.... who took on the very corrupt and intertwined Vatican and Italian banks and oops he died after 33 days in office.

...............................

I am a sucker for conspiracy theories but I think the church, holy mother the church, has been involved.

I was pointing out that the control that the Church has, both in terms of the number of aherents and in its longevity, means that even the biggest potential scandal is nothing more than a blip, an itch that needs to be scratched.

DC

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: keberoxu
Date: 18 May 25 - 06:30 PM

The inaugural mass was this enormous outdoor spectacle;
I didn't see anything but the photos of it.
I would think the pope would be exhausted afterwards.
At least there was decent weather, with all those people.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 18 May 25 - 07:34 PM

I heard that J.D. Vance was there in the crowd. Hopefully he got nowhere near the pope.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 19 May 25 - 02:26 AM

A less Christian man it’s hard to imagine. Apart from the Fat, Orange, Badly-coiffed Baboon, of course.

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: The Sandman
Date: 19 May 25 - 04:18 AM

Pope Francis should be judged by his record, according to Wiki Throughout his papacy, Francis was noted for his humility, emphasis on God's mercy, international visibility, commitment to interreligious dialogue, and concern for the poor, migrants, and refugees

Subject: RE: Obit: Pope Francis (1936-2025) /Pope Leo XIV
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 19 May 25 - 07:34 AM

”A less Christian man it’s hard to imagine.”

My above comment was in response to SRS’s post and, of course, referred to Vance, not to His Holiness Pope Leo XIV.