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BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off?
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Subject: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Froodo Date: 27 Jan 00 - 12:52 PM You practice and practice. You love to play. But you just don't have "it." You keep playing and playing because you love it, but still...it'd be nice to have folks really enjoy your hard work. What to do when you love to play and entertain people, but sort of suck. Anyone like that?
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: TerriM Date: 27 Jan 00 - 01:56 PM How do you know you suck?? What I've learned is that music is subjective, some people will like what you do and some people won't. If you enjoy it, who cares? |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Allan C. Date: 27 Jan 00 - 02:03 PM Hell yes! We are (or have been) (or are and don't know it) all in that state of affairs at one time or another. But I will tell you that none of that matters to some of the folks in nursing homes, hospitals and even elementary schools. I can still remember how positively magical I thought it was for someone to be able to make their own music right there in front of me. I would bet there are still people around who would react much the same way. Some would be glad just for the effort to let them know someone thinks they might enjoy listening to something besides daytime TV. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: MK Date: 27 Jan 00 - 02:11 PM The short answer is, if YOU enjoy it and it gives YOU pleasure, then keep doing it. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Bert Date: 27 Jan 00 - 02:13 PM You have to concentrate on what you CAN do. I don't play the guitar very well and like you, practice hasn't helped a whole lot. But I can sing (I think), so I do that the best that I can. There's others who can play very well but don't sing too good so they stick with just playing. There's room for all of us. Keep doing what you ARE good at and maybe the other stuff will improve with time. Bert. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: GUEST,Terapln Date: 27 Jan 00 - 02:29 PM Froodo, don't sweat it. I think I suck but I still get out there and do it. Everyone likes different stuff. I'll listen to the worst blues player in town (me?) and enjoy it alot more than the best introspective singer-songwriter type because I like blues. It's all relative. I've played gigs and thought it went terrible and then had a guy come up and say, "man that was great, do you give slide lessons?" I'm thinking, "is this guy nuts?" But to him, it was good. So that, for whats it's worth is my rambling, hopefully coherent opinion. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Jon Freeman Date: 27 Jan 00 - 02:41 PM Some people seem to be luckier than others in terms of natural ability and will get further musically but I believe that practice does work for all of us. The trouble with me and I'd suspect with many others is that we tend to look for instant improvement... Sometimes, it is useful to look back at where you were say a year ago... I remember one thinking "If I could only play Harvest Home", I learned it, but then I thought I was useless because I couldn't get the MerryBlacksmith right... and I still have a long way to go to be the player I would like to be (and probably will never get there)... I also agree with those who have said enjoy it etc. That is the most important thing and accept the fact that few of us are ever going to be top class players no matter how hard we try. Jon
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Dave (the ancient mariner) Date: 27 Jan 00 - 02:41 PM I used to sing a lot, but now my voice sucks, so I sing to meself and enjoy the music. Sometimes when my voice can handle a bit I sing to others, But mostly it sucks and I know it. I just dont care I love to sing. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: M. Ted (inactive) Date: 27 Jan 00 - 02:57 PM As singers and musicians, we tend to be like the dog at the end if its teather, obsessed with whatever is currently just beyond our reach, generally without thinking much about how far we've managed to stretch the leash-- "talented" or not, you do a lot of work, and you feel like you're not getting anywhere, no matter how much time you put in, there are going to be a lot of people who don't care for what you do(I said, in another thread, that even the Three Tenors, when they perform, know that most of the audience likes the other two better) but there will always be those moments when you say, "I don't know what anybody else thinks, but I think that I did something a little bit special there" Besides, the longer you are around, the more people you will encounter who are worse than you!!! |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: JedMarum Date: 27 Jan 00 - 03:12 PM the joy of the music that is true measure of its value, performance talents are always secondary ... the gift you give the performance from your personal involvement with the tune is what makes the song worthwhile ... a heartfelt perfomance will usually find its "voice" despite the performers skill level. sing what you love, love what you sing ... the rest falls into place! |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: MMario Date: 27 Jan 00 - 03:15 PM Then again , some people go further, not because they are "better" or have more natural talent, but because they "push" harder. I can think of several acquaintences who have gotten membership in choirs, paid gigs, inclusion on CD's being cut, not because they were good, but because they basically made such a nuisance of themselves that it was done to placate them, |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Amos Date: 27 Jan 00 - 03:20 PM Been picking and singing for thirty years on and off, and I still suck. But I have learned lots of little vocal and digitary* techniques that cover up how much I suck by distracting the audience; as a result I can fool most folks for short intervals, and get all sorts of kind compliments, even tho' I am acutely aware internally of all the shortcomings and missed notes.
A. *The correct word would have been digital, but it got preempted sometime in the last decade by a bunch of TV repairmen. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Chet W. Date: 27 Jan 00 - 03:50 PM Hey the right answer is above, keep doing it if you enjoy it. But I will say that in terms of improving your playing and singing abilities, there is nothing nearly as important as learning to listen. It takes time. Try listening very carefully to musicians that you like, find out what makes their stuff good, and at least some of it will come to you, I guarantee it. Must be patient though. What's really a pleasure is when you get to be older than young and realizing that the music you're making is the best you've ever made. Don't give up, Chet |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: GUEST,FP Date: 27 Jan 00 - 04:10 PM Play a rare instrument; then it doesn't matter if you suck - you've got novely value! |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: GUEST,Neil Comer Date: 27 Jan 00 - 04:17 PM If you recognise your shortcomings, then you are getting better |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 27 Jan 00 - 04:22 PM William Blake wrote somewhere ""The fool who persists in his folly will beciome wise."
Chesterton said "If a thing is worth doing it is worth doing badly."
And I reckon that, when it comes to small group music, like Irish or Old Timey/Bluegrass, a bunch of people playing together who aren't all that great separately can often make music just as good, or even better than a bunch of virtuosi. Well, I would say that - but I still think it's true. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Molly Malone Date: 27 Jan 00 - 04:27 PM Hard work always pays off. It's just a matter of what you consider "pay-off." And truthfully, a lot of it is luck, and being in the right place at the right time, hardly something you have any control over.:) |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Roger in Baltimore Date: 27 Jan 00 - 04:35 PM I agree with several suggestions given above. One, as Liam says, love the song. Two, there are many non-paying venues who would love to have you, Allan C. lists just a few. Persistance pays off. I know a local artist whose performing talents I would rate as mediocre. However, she is a hard worker and a good promoter. She does those things very well (she should be an agent). She is getting out and singing several times a week and has developed some routine gigs (like the first Friday of every month, play at this restaurant). It is her persistance that carries her. Finally, learn to live within your limitations, it is a source of creativity. I have developed a "unique" approach to some songs simply because I could not sing and play them in the traditional way. Keep on playin' and singin'! Roger in Baltimore |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: catspaw49 Date: 27 Jan 00 - 05:29 PM Well Frood, the situation is simple. Obviously you suck. Whirlpools suck less than you do. You couldn't play tiddly winks if your fingers were tiddles and your mouth was the cup. When people say you sing like a bird, they are referring to one that died three years ago. You are missing "IT" in every aspect including your gross lack of ability to perform sex, even with yourself. When you practice, yaks become sterile, and on those times you practice singing in the shower, the only benefit comes from killing mold and mildew which cannot live in those conditions. Entire Sanitariums have been opened to accomodate innocent bystanders who have accidentally stumbled into one of your gigs which are now limited to frogs at night. Give up. Feel better now? Good. Now take all the advice above and join the rest of us on this thread who also suck at least to themselves and forget about the whole damn thing....Enjoy the passion and fockit. Spaw |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Amos Date: 27 Jan 00 - 05:38 PM Oh, 'Spaw, yer nothin but an ol' frog at night your own self! But nicely ranted, man. Thanks fer the grin.br> A. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: catspaw49 Date: 27 Jan 00 - 05:43 PM Yeah, it was really a piece of introspection and more's the pity!!!(:<)) Spaw |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Bert Date: 27 Jan 00 - 05:46 PM And remember, you don't have to have a good voice to be a singer. Take Louis Armstrong for instance. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Terry Allan Hall Date: 27 Jan 00 - 05:46 PM Hard work ALWAYS pays off...not always as fast as we want it to, but rest assured...hard work always pays off.
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: GUEST Date: 27 Jan 00 - 06:32 PM Amen! If you're not doing it because you like it, it won't pay off anyway, and if you like it, why worry about payoff in the first place? |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Mbo Date: 27 Jan 00 - 06:41 PM I don't use the word "suck." I saw "raw." It's sounds much more positive--remember, all the eons of musicians and singers who passed down this tradition to use weren't trained at all. If your not so good, I think of you having a "raw, earthier sound." That's a good thing. If they ever bother you about your style, remember the old Italian proverb--"As the porcupine said to the squirrel, if you don't like it here, go somewhere else." BTW Louis Armstrong had a "raw voice" too. Be proud of it! --Mbo |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: catspaw49 Date: 27 Jan 00 - 07:10 PM OK Meebo....So Raw Rules and since you "saw" raw, how many raws do you saw to get a (vocal) c(h)ord and do you stack it....cuz the sh*ts gettin' deep around here. Spaw |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Amos Date: 27 Jan 00 - 07:18 PM Rawzie doats and rairzie doats, so let 'em sing, as gives a hoot!. Cuz 'Spaw don't have to worry none, 'cuz he's got on sh**kickin' boots. An' as for raw, that's mighty kind, Sir M-bo, and Sir Honored Guest!. But as for sounds that I put down, it may be "sucks" just says it best!. A. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Amos Date: 27 Jan 00 - 07:18 PM Rawzie doats and rairzie doats, so let 'em sing, as gives a hoot!. Cuz 'Spaw don't have to worry none, 'cuz he's got on sh**kickin' boots. An' as for raw, that's mighty kind, Sir M-bo, and Sir Honored Guest!. But as for sounds that I put down, it may be "sucks" just says it best!. A. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: catspaw49 Date: 27 Jan 00 - 07:31 PM Applause...Applause,.... BRAVO......Author,,Author...... Twice Spaw |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Uncle_DaveO Date: 27 Jan 00 - 07:45 PM Terry Allan Hall said: "Hard work ALWAYS pays off...not always as fast as we want it to, but rest assured...hard work always pays off." Practice makes perfect. But bad practice makes perfectly bad. Dave Oesterreich |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: GUEST,_gargoyle Date: 27 Jan 00 - 10:08 PM I totally agree with MICHAEL K... .
Retire to a tall mountain top....suck the toe-jam from under your nails and realize . .
..............................................you ARE an adoration.
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Mbo Date: 27 Jan 00 - 10:28 PM Spaw, if you want to know what "saw raw" sounds like, check out The Electric Light Orchestra's first album, "No Answer." Especially the song "10538 Overture." Some critic say the music sounds unrefined--the cellos are too grungy, you can hear mistakes, and cello bows accidentally hitting the bridge. I call it raw. It IS folk in a sort of way...almost all acoustic--folk guitars, cellos, violin, French horn--and one electric guitar. The music is so primitive and soul shaking--if you heard those chugging cellos--yes, "sawing quite rawly" youd understand. Also, Jeff Lynne and Roy Wood combine to do this raw nasal singing--much like blues. I made a recording of myself doing this song--it's even more raw than the original. RAW DOES RULE, NOT SUCK! If you want to hear it, I can sent you the sound file ASAP. --Mbo (BTW Great song Amos! You've done it again!) |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: catspaw49 Date: 28 Jan 00 - 12:04 AM Geeziz Meebo....Loosen the strings a little or you're going to blow a headpipe at a young age. It was a joke man.....I understand raw...or I thought I did before I read your post............ Anyway, Karen loves you and wants you to know that you have a friend and compatriot in loving the Elastic Linguini Orchestra. She does too. Spaw |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Mbo Date: 28 Jan 00 - 12:12 AM Thanks, Spaw. It's always good to know that there's some ELO/folkie fans out there! BTW how many of their albums does she have? I have 8 of their 12 albums, plus 2 compilations, and 1 from ELO Part II. I can't get them out of my head! Tell Karen that Mr.Blue Sky is smiling on her! --Mbo |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Amos Date: 28 Jan 00 - 12:15 AM Mr Blue Sky? Like, "Anti-Anthropomorphicists Unite! You have Nothing to Lose but Mister Dignity!!" |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Lonesome EJ Date: 28 Jan 00 - 01:03 AM How did Roy Wood end up in that band, anyway? Did he decide the one thing missing in his life was plastic violins and moog synthesizers? And, hey, somebody tell the lead singer that singing your John Lennon impression through a megaphone doesn't make it sound any better. WHOA MBO...down boy! I was merely having some fun with you. Nobody but Leonard Bernstein could have done Roll Over Beethoven as well. HEY...ouch, that hurts! |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Bugsy Date: 28 Jan 00 - 01:08 AM I once saw an interview with John Lennon in which he stated that, had the Beatles not disbanded, he felt that they would be doing very similar music to ELO. Cheers Bugsy |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: GUEST,Mbo Date: 28 Jan 00 - 10:16 AM Amos, should I dare to mention other ELO Mr.'s, like "Mr.Radio," "Mr.Night," and "Mr.Kingdom"? EJ, Roy was only in the band for the first album. I don't miss him. Now Jeff Lynne, on the other hand--fans all over the net (including me) call him The Lynnemeister--is great. I don't think he sounds like any of the Beatles at all, and their sound of ELO became less-Beatlesesque as the went on. Jeff Lynne, now as a solo act, does mostly rockabilly--which rules too! I've never heard Leonard play Roll Over Beethoven--but ELO's pretty much rocks like there's no tomorrow. John Lennon actually said "The Electric Light Orchestra is the son of the Beatles." I find no problems with that! --Mbo |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: catspaw49 Date: 28 Jan 00 - 10:19 AM Just out of curiosity Meebo......Are you a bit pre-occupied with rules? Spaw |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: GUEST,Mbo Date: 28 Jan 00 - 10:33 AM RULES RULES! --Mbo |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: GutBucketeer Date: 28 Jan 00 - 10:53 AM Boy What a Great Question!!!! If there is one atonal, no natural talent, struggling person who LOVES music, singing, and playing its me. For years I relegated myself to playing my array of "non-real instruments" (gut bucket, jaw harp, bones...). Then finally, when I was about 35 I decided to heck with it!!! Now I play autoharp, and I am learning banjo and guitar. After 5 years I should be a virtuoso, but Banjo Bonnie I am not. At least I'm starting to hear chord changes now. I try to sing too because I just can't help myself. THE MUSIC HAS TO COME OUT SOMEHOW!!!! What I've found is that just playing for myself and my enjoyment is reward enough. However, the more relaxed I am when playing with others the better I seem to do. Any sort of formal setting or attention and I fall apart. Pass the lead to me and I'm like a deer in headlights. Find a regular event where people play together like friends on a backporch and it will help a lot. The Capital Harpers autoharp club (in D.C.) encouraged me when I needed it. The FSGW monthly sing (though I've only been twice) is the same way. In these settings you will find that it is more like friends having a good time together than performing, and all of a sudden its not work and you're amazed at how much better you are getting. Anyway, people keep starting out as beginners and passing me up, but I keep chugging along, dancing with bears and keeping myself smiling. Good luck JAB P.S. One thing I have learned is to pick your jams carefully. There are encouraging places to play and learn, but there are also jams and gatherings where a beginner should play quietly on the edges, watch and learn, and not be at the center of the circle. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Áine Date: 28 Jan 00 - 12:57 PM I think Konstantin Stanislavsky said it very well: 'Play well or play badly, but play truthfully.' -- Áine |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Jon W. Date: 28 Jan 00 - 01:59 PM JAB, my friend, I couldn't have said it better myself. Hope springs eternal. I like Allan C's approach too. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: GUEST,Tim O'K Date: 28 Jan 00 - 03:27 PM Add my name to the long list of posters here that genuinely think they have little talent. I played guitar for ten years when my little brother took up the instrumnet and in four months he was playing circles around me. People LOVED to follow me at open mics. That said, hard work does have its merits. Number one is memorization. There is no excuse for a forgotten lyric or missed chord except "I didn't work hard enough on this song." Hard work will also improve your speed and smoothness. Another thing that helps me overcome my limitations is to believe in myself. Plain old confidence. And I sing every song like it's the last one I'll ever sing in my life. Emotional involvement in what you are doing can make up for a (seemingly) lack of talent. I also surround myself with three extremely talent musicians - a bass player, another singer and my aforementioned bro - that help create a total sound that people find good. I don't dwell on the fact that I'm the weak link, I'm just part of a sound. We can't all have Leo Kottke's hands and Van Morrison's singing ability. And I am glad we can't. It's our diversity of talent that makes music the incredibly beautiful tapestry it is today. Keep playing, but don't stop working your fingers off either! |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Troll Date: 28 Jan 00 - 03:56 PM " You can't please everybody so you gotta please yourself" Find your validity within yourself and not in the opinions of others. troll |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: GUEST,Neil Lowe Date: 31 Jan 00 - 10:45 AM ...as has been alluded to above, "suck" is in the ear of the beholder, to badly bastardize a phrase. "Suck" could be applied to about half (or more) of the crap that passes for "popular" music. Can Leonard Cohen or Dylan actually sing? Didn't stop them. Could John Lennon play guitar? Not very well - he hits a lot of sour notes on his tunes. Can I play? Nope, but it doesn't stop me from occupying the kitchen table for hours on end, torturing members of my family with fumbled chord changes and off-key singing. Tastes are so diverse these days, it's never been more true that "one man's trash is another man's treasure." Neil Lowe |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Grab Date: 01 Feb 00 - 08:14 AM As other ppl have said, once you've reached one target, you always judge yourself by your next target. The thing is to accept where you are at that point, and to realise that there will always be ppl better than you and worse than you. Oh hell, this is getting into Desiderata hippie territory! Oh bugger it, you know what I mean. Anyway, I know I'll never be able to play most of Django's stuff, but I also know I can produce a reasonable version of Anji. I know I'll never be able to sing like Don Maclean, but I also know I can crack up everyone at a session with The Sicknote. I'll always try to learn new stuff so I don't get stale, but I know I've only got so much talent and so much practice time, so there's a certain skill level which I'm not going to reach. So just get a few songs you can really relate to, and do them well, the more practice the better. It doesn't matter if they're simple songs, but if you sound like you're enjoying yourself in happy songs or if you've got emotional involvement in sad songs, that comes across to everyone, and it counts for much more than fancy fingerwork. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Easy Rider Date: 01 Feb 00 - 08:49 AM What a load of crap! What do you mean "doesn't pay off"? The "payoff" is if you are having fun. If you learn a new song or a new lick, and you feel like you've accomplished something, and you get a little thrill out of playing it to yourself over and over again. The "payoff" is the joy you feel, when you learn to play a song that you have wanted to play for thirty years but never somehow got around to. I got up early this morning and played one of them, that I have just learned, and I came to work with a lightness in my soul and a twinkle in my eye. I might play it at the song circle tomorrow night or I might not. I learned it for ME not for them. I don't play and sing for others approval. I play for myself and for my own satisfaction of learning to express my creativity. Everybody has some creativity in some area of the arts, and everybody should express it a little, no matter how crudely. It enriches the soul.
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Amos Date: 01 Feb 00 - 09:10 AM Keep digging, EZ! You're closing in on the mother vein; what makes the Mudcat hum, makes us pick on, makes us play songs we don't know as well as we should, and do it anyway, makes us sing on when the audience is discussing Superbowl odds or mortgage rates....the real gold is in just what you said. This music doth enrich the soul. That also identifies why Catters are such a special brand of people (IMHO). They have rich souls. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: GUEST,Frank Hamilton Date: 01 Feb 00 - 11:10 AM Hi, I've been wrestling with this problem for years. Anyone who gets into the arena of making a living at music has to ask themselves this question. There is no easy answer and maybe there's not supposed to be. Maybe that's why we keep doing it. We relish the getting better part. I read an interesting book that deals with this issue called "The Artist's Way". I recommend it for one reason. It states that the biggest problem is our internal Critic which wants to destroy us. It makes us give up. When I was younger, I was an underacheiver in school. I figured what the hell. Sometime, I got out of the way of my self and things began to happen. I'm at the point now where I don't read any negative criticism of my work. I just do what I do and enjoy the process. That's not easy to do because I find that people tend to give me unsolicited opinions. It's hard to throw away hurtful criticisms and over the years I've found that those criticisms were not helpful in any way. This is true of professional newspaper critics or others with axes to grind. So, I do what I love and hope I can share it. Sometimes it works, sometimes not. I've found over the years that I am my own best teacher. Others can offer information but only I can learn. I've found that being original, or being the best, or being popular is irrelevant. Being honest is what counts for me. Hope I've offered something worthwhile to contribute to this important topic. Frank Hamilton
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Amos Date: 01 Feb 00 - 11:14 AM Frank, I relished your wise words and have trod a similar path, and suspect that many of us have. Thank you not only for keeping the faith, but for getting it well said, too! A |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: Peter T. Date: 01 Feb 00 - 01:37 PM Helena Norbert-Hodge tells the story of the people of Ladakh (mountain country near Tibet) where she was an anthropologist in the 1950's. Everyone sang all the time, and while everyone recognised good singers, they knew that the good singers were bad yak herders, or whatever. Then the radio arrived: the distillation of excellent specialised singing from everywhere beamed at them. From that moment, bad singers and good singers alike became ashamed of how they sounded, and the best singers began to emulated the voices on the radio, and lost their originality. Group singing became a thing of the past, or something hidden away, or focussed on the one good singer doing a performance. The non-professionals had now become a permanent audience, and not just people who were better or worse singers than everyone else, but still singers. No moral: just worth contemplating. yours, Peter T. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: JR Date: 01 Feb 00 - 02:35 PM Write your own songs, & NEVER put them on paper. That way every time you perform, your doing the song perfectly, & no one can disprove it. |
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Subject: RE: BS: What if hard work doesn't pay off? From: GUEST,Frank Hamilton Date: 01 Feb 00 - 10:31 PM Thanks Amos. Shakepeare said something like this: "What's won is done, the joy lies in the doing." What if hard work isn't fun any more? Then maybe it's time to look for something that is. I feel so lucky because playing and singing folk music has always been fun for me. There is another thread here which I believe to be very important. Folk music belongs to everyone, I believe, and as a result, we are all entitled to participate in it, unlike pop music which has become a spectator sport. Peter T. brings up an essential point. This process has been called by one Vietnamese folklorist, "Musical Imperialism". The popular media-driven culture takes over the folk culture. Others have called this kind of thing "Fordism". (The attempt to homogenize all cultures into a uniformity that is manufactured. Henry Ford took a dim view of cultural diversity. I've found that one of the beautiful things about this music is the potential for sharing it with others and receiving the benefits of other's music. To do this, I believe it's necessary to eschew the star system in this music. A folk star is an oxymoron in my view. Off and on the subject, I believe that the copyright system has endangered the acceptance of the folk process by the general public but will continue in small pockets as sub-cultures always have done. If I can't change a song, then how can it become a folk song? When we can't participate in the "process" then it it is no longer fun. I think that this is our entitlement, to be able to participate in the music of our country without being censured by copyright restrictions. Solution offered: A special fund set aside to include folk music into a public domain that is fair use for all. Micheal Cooney and Pete Seeger have both suggested this. All this sort of relates to the thread I think. Correct me please if I am wrong. Frank
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