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Drunken Sailor song protested

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DRUNKEN SAILOR


Related threads:
In bed with the captain's daughter (50)
(origins) Origins: Drunken Sailor-Dickens question for Gibb (38)
Help: Meaning of a few Drunken Sailor verses (39)
What can you do with a drunken sailor? (63)
A Horrible example of 'Drunken Sailor' (45)
Help: meaning of 'in bed w/ captain's daughter (70)
Lyr Add: What Shall We Do with the Grumpy Pirate? (18)
P.C. version Drunken Sailor (47)
(origins) Origins: Drunken sailor .. wayhey or hif ho (17)
Folklore: What shall we do with the Drunken Sailor (4)
Lyr Add: Ebrio quid faciamus nauta (13)
Chord Req: Banjo tuning for 'Drunken Sailor' in Em (9)
BS: What shall we do with the Drunken Sailor (15)
(origins) Origins: Drunken Sailor (21)
Same Tune? Drunken Sailor/Oro se do (16)
Lyr Add: Drunken Sailor parody (anti-war) (2)
Drunken Sailor...that not so old thread? (12)


Peg 24 May 00 - 04:09 PM
McGrath of Harlow 24 May 00 - 04:21 PM
Peg 24 May 00 - 04:27 PM
Peter T. 24 May 00 - 04:27 PM
joeler 24 May 00 - 04:27 PM
MMario 24 May 00 - 04:28 PM
SINSULL 24 May 00 - 04:31 PM
SINSULL 24 May 00 - 04:31 PM
GUEST,John Bohannon 24 May 00 - 04:33 PM
McGrath of Harlow 24 May 00 - 04:42 PM
wysiwyg 24 May 00 - 04:47 PM
Rick Fielding 24 May 00 - 04:51 PM
MMario 24 May 00 - 04:53 PM
Allan C. 24 May 00 - 04:54 PM
catspaw49 24 May 00 - 04:59 PM
MMario 24 May 00 - 05:03 PM
wysiwyg 24 May 00 - 05:03 PM
George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca 24 May 00 - 05:05 PM
SeanM 24 May 00 - 05:06 PM
MMario 24 May 00 - 05:06 PM
MMario 24 May 00 - 05:10 PM
catspaw49 24 May 00 - 05:11 PM
SeanM 24 May 00 - 05:16 PM
wysiwyg 24 May 00 - 05:16 PM
Mbo 24 May 00 - 05:28 PM
Hollowfox 24 May 00 - 05:39 PM
Amergin 24 May 00 - 05:40 PM
Amos 24 May 00 - 05:54 PM
katlaughing 24 May 00 - 06:13 PM
paddymac 24 May 00 - 06:16 PM
Gary T 24 May 00 - 06:42 PM
catspaw49 24 May 00 - 06:55 PM
wysiwyg 24 May 00 - 07:12 PM
McGrath of Harlow 24 May 00 - 07:29 PM
fulurum 24 May 00 - 09:43 PM
Gary T 24 May 00 - 11:27 PM
Mbo 24 May 00 - 11:30 PM
DougR 24 May 00 - 11:35 PM
Amergin 24 May 00 - 11:42 PM
Gypsy 25 May 00 - 01:16 AM
Bugsy 25 May 00 - 01:23 AM
Chanteyranger 25 May 00 - 05:07 AM
Sailor Dan 25 May 00 - 07:14 AM
Hollowfox 25 May 00 - 09:17 AM
SDShad 25 May 00 - 09:42 AM
Peg 25 May 00 - 10:00 AM
Greg F. 25 May 00 - 10:27 AM
Mark Clark 25 May 00 - 10:52 AM
Amos 25 May 00 - 11:00 AM
Wesley S 25 May 00 - 11:32 AM
Uncle_DaveO 25 May 00 - 11:43 AM
Peg 25 May 00 - 11:52 AM
Dave (the ancient mariner) 25 May 00 - 11:59 AM
Penny S. 25 May 00 - 01:39 PM
Bert 25 May 00 - 01:47 PM
Penny S. 25 May 00 - 02:14 PM
SeanM 25 May 00 - 02:35 PM
Petr 25 May 00 - 03:23 PM
Sailor Dan 25 May 00 - 03:37 PM
Penny S. 25 May 00 - 04:33 PM
McGrath of Harlow 25 May 00 - 09:20 PM
GUEST,Ole Bull 26 May 00 - 12:59 PM
Chanteyranger 27 May 00 - 03:31 AM
Melani 27 May 00 - 10:55 PM
GUEST,Heather 05 Nov 03 - 10:15 AM
Amos 05 Nov 03 - 10:26 AM
Uncle_DaveO 05 Nov 03 - 10:55 AM
McGrath of Harlow 05 Nov 03 - 11:09 AM
Charley Noble 05 Nov 03 - 12:06 PM
swampy-the-spark 05 Nov 03 - 04:57 PM
Dead Horse 05 Nov 03 - 05:05 PM
Wolfgang 05 Nov 03 - 05:53 PM
Blackcatter 05 Nov 03 - 06:06 PM
Heely 05 Nov 03 - 06:43 PM
Noreen 05 Nov 03 - 09:53 PM
dick greenhaus 06 Nov 03 - 12:14 AM
Jeanie 06 Nov 03 - 04:16 AM
Melani 06 Nov 03 - 02:00 PM
Micca 06 Nov 03 - 02:30 PM
GUEST,Allen 18 Apr 05 - 12:18 PM
GUEST,Allen 18 Apr 05 - 12:35 PM
Muttley 18 Apr 05 - 08:37 PM
EBarnacle 19 Apr 05 - 11:23 AM
GUEST,Melani 19 Apr 05 - 05:38 PM
Flash Company 20 Apr 05 - 12:05 PM
GUEST,Uncle DaveO 20 Apr 05 - 12:40 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 20 Apr 05 - 03:26 PM
Gurney 21 Apr 05 - 05:36 AM
GUEST,McGrath of Harlow 21 Apr 05 - 11:38 AM
Q (Frank Staplin) 21 Apr 05 - 02:29 PM
Gurney 22 Apr 05 - 03:30 AM
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Subject: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Peg
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:09 PM

I think my choir did this song in high school, too...times are changin'...

From today's Boston Globe:

Song about drunken sailor upsets parents By Associated Press, 5/24/2000 08:53 WEST HARTFORD, Conn. (AP) After learning that a high school choir planned to sing ''What Shall We Do With the Drunken Sailor?,'' some parents are reaching for the anchor.

As word spread that one of Conard High School's choirs would perform the offbeat song in tonight's spring choral concert, it prompted a quick and mixed reaction.

At least two parents contacted the school recently, saying they were concerned about whether the tune -- often a drinking ditty -- is appropriate for a high-school choir to sing.

''The concern was that singing a song which uses the phrase `drunken sailor' may be offensive to someone who's been dealing with alcoholism,'' said Alphonse ''Chuck'' Landroche, the school's principal.

Landroche said school officials discussed the issue and agreed that although the choir could sing the song tonight, it would be preceded by a disclaimer to emphasize that it is not intended to glorify drinking or mock alcoholism.

Some choir members believe political correctness is being taken too far and say they are pondering whether to conduct a silent protest by turning away while the disclaimer is read.

''We interpret it completely different, that the sailor partied too much last night and his buddies are trying to sober him up,'' said Christopher Fitzpatrick, an 18-year-old member of the choir.

The song is known as a ''shanty,'' or ''chantey,'' tunes that sailors sang while performing their various seafaring duties.

The song is often in the repertoires of Ivy League institutions.

The Conard choir's version includes only a few of the song's many verses. Some of the racier verses are not being sung, such as: ''shave his belly with a rusty razor'' and ''put him in bed with the captain's daughter.''

''We're not doing a really wild version,'' Fitzpatrick said. ''The version we're doing is pretty tame


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:21 PM

I reckon they make this stuff up on a dull news day, and then persuade some jokers to put their names to the quotes...

All right, we won't sing that one. Now all together lads "WHIP JAMBOREE"


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Peg
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:27 PM

No, McGrath, sadly it is quite true...New Englanders these days are getting mighty uptight about such things; several months ago in Amherst, Mass, the community wanted to ban a high school production of "West Side Story" for its supposedly-racist depictions of Hispanics...


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Peter T.
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:27 PM

This is the sort of thing that drives people to drink or to sea. Entering the era of Eisenhower II.

yours, Peter T.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: joeler
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:27 PM

I was in the Navy for four years and I hardly remember a thing. The true should be known. Sing the damn songs kids, sing it out!


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: MMario
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:28 PM

I thought the verses they were cutting were some of the TAMER verses....they can get pretty downright crude...face it, it was probably "ballocks" long before it was "belly" - and even that it tame compared to "twist his pizzle into a bowline" or


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: SINSULL
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:31 PM

A school in Buffalo recently banned the annual reading of "The Giving Tree" because the tree is female and presented in a subservient role. I guess if she had fallen down and killed the guy who picked her apples it would have been OK.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: SINSULL
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:31 PM

Then again, we wouldn't want to introduce the theme of suicide.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: GUEST,John Bohannon
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:33 PM

Weve always sung "throw him in bed with Margaret Thatcher." I never knew the real line "...the captain's daughter." Thanks!


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:42 PM

I'd find the term "Hispanic" offensive if I came from Puerto Rico - like being called "Caucasian" when you come from Tipperary.

So West Side Story wasn't seen as racist about the Italians?

I have to admit, when I saw it I wasn't at all clear which was which.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: wysiwyg
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:47 PM

Oops, needs new updated verses! Here's a few!

Send him off to school to learn how to be PC...

Censor his logbook and change the history...

Plan an intervention and sober his ass up...

Ask the crew if they would like to form an Alanon...

Blame his drinking on his dysfunctional family...

Pour all his rum right overboard smartly...


Sur-lie in the morning!


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:51 PM

"Put 'em in charge of the Exxon Valdiz".......

Rick


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: MMario
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:53 PM

y'pour me rum overboard and yer dang tootin' I'm goin' be surly! 'sides the fakt thas jes' plain ol' alcohol abuse, do y'ken how much that bottle cost me?


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Allan C.
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:54 PM

I recently heard a version which featured such verses as:

"Get him to admit that he has a problem."

"Soon he'll understand that he is co-dependent."


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: catspaw49
Date: 24 May 00 - 04:59 PM

Christ almighty....I can't take it!!! Lemmee guess....If you sing this and play musical chairs too, your ass is going straight to hell. We ought to start taxing stupidity; it seems to be in good supply and indeed, running rampant. We could completely do away with sales tax.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: MMario
Date: 24 May 00 - 05:03 PM

No matter that the tune is
as old as the blue hills
that the song's been sung forever
across the seven seas
They have banned it now in Boston
And they'd burn it if they could
And many of those who haven't
say "we should!"

No matter that it's upbeat
with tempo smart and quick
and the words have all been censored
'til they're saccharine and sick
They have banned it now in Boston
And they'd burn it if they could
And many of those who haven't
say "we should!"


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: wysiwyg
Date: 24 May 00 - 05:03 PM

Tie him in a chair then pull it out from under him...

Say it's a disease then thrown him overboard anyway...

Gee, maybe it isn't so much fun to be a drunken sailor, at least in these times!

~S~


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca
Date: 24 May 00 - 05:05 PM

McGrath, yes, West Side Story is specifically about the Hispanics and inter-relating with the more established ethnicities which were prevalent in New York. I think the Jets were your North American mix of races, and the others were the immigrant Puerto Ricans.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: SeanM
Date: 24 May 00 - 05:06 PM

I love this!

So let's see... a song that lists off all the punishment the poor "drunken sailor" is getting inflicted on him is glorifying alcoholism, and "put 'im to bed with the captain's daughter" (as I remember, basically saying "beat him unconscious with the bloody great stick or whip the captain uses to administer discipline") is lascivious... Gee, glad they didn't get ahold of "make him kiss the gunner's daughter" (oft interpreted as pressing the gent's face to the barrel of the cannon as it is fired). We'd probably have a case for pedophilia on our hands.

Keeeee-rist.

M


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: MMario
Date: 24 May 00 - 05:06 PM

gee- and here I thought it was romeo and juliet updated to a modern setting....


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: MMario
Date: 24 May 00 - 05:10 PM

Sean - most people don't KNOW the correct interpretations of the phrases, and only see the double entendre, taking it at face value. I'd been singing "Drunken Sailor" for thirty years before I had an inkling that there WERE alternate meanings to the various phrases, and then it was only because I read the same phrases in a novel.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: catspaw49
Date: 24 May 00 - 05:11 PM

Has this school got an e-mail? Or is there a local addy of some sort? Anybody know? Something for this group that's "concerned?" Anybody know???

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: SeanM
Date: 24 May 00 - 05:16 PM

Yeah! I'm with 'spaw on this one!

Perhaps a letter stating the real meanings of what they're singing could do some good... Gods know it'd be better than some pusilanimous "we're sorry we're singing, we just don't know any better" apology before the song.

Maybe something along the lines of "Back in the days of sail, there was little worse on board a ship than a man who was drunk on watch. The sailors despised such a man to a point as to create a shanty specifically laying out the punishments due to such an offender."

Couldn't hurt.

M


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: wysiwyg
Date: 24 May 00 - 05:16 PM

LOL! We could make them a tape, each one add a verse and send the tape on to the next!

What do you do when the schools have gone stupid...

Get an education that is based on Pablum...

Choke the living sh*t out of every cultural expression...

~S~


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Mbo
Date: 24 May 00 - 05:28 PM

Good gravy what are these people thinking? I learned this song when I was 5 years old, in Catholic School Kindergarten music time. So it can't be that bad can it?!

--Mbo


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Hollowfox
Date: 24 May 00 - 05:39 PM

Back in 1998, the O'Fallon (Missouri) high school marching band was going to use the Jefferson Airplane song White Rabbit in a performance. Someone protested, the band was ordered not to play it, a lawsuit came about, and tons of high school students who only knew it as an instrumental number looked up the lyrics on the Internet, thus introducing them to the dopelore that the complainer was trying to prevent them from exploring. (People Magazine gave it a small article in the November 16, 1998 issue)


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Amergin
Date: 24 May 00 - 05:40 PM

Next thing we know On Top of Spaghetti will be promoting eating disorders.

Amergin


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Amos
Date: 24 May 00 - 05:54 PM

This is a mild but insidious form of mass insanity. Anyone who is that terrified of ideas will never be able to think, which is sort of a circular argument. We ought to bombard the PTA e-mail with MP3s of the bawdier verses of the Good Ship Venus, or hire a bunch of gentle jolly walkers to attend their next meeting and argue on behalf of genuine passion. How do these lamebrains think they got here? Half of them were only spawned because some sailor got drunk!!


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: katlaughing
Date: 24 May 00 - 06:13 PM

Unfuckingbelievable!! I knew Amherst was PC, but not THAT PC when I lived across the river in Noho. Do these people feel so out of control of their own kids and their minds that they will ban everything??? Of course, a lot of that loss of control probably came about while they were trying to raise them by the PC-code (which used to mean something more balanced).

I agree with Spaw, we need to start an email campaign. If nothing else, we can all send letters to the Boston Globe by clicking here.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: paddymac
Date: 24 May 00 - 06:16 PM

The version in the DT has 12 verses (or six couplets, whichever you prefer), all "nautical". There's probably a thousand more out there that have no relation to things nautical beyond being stuck into this particular song. The song is amazingly adaptable to whatever happens to be in today's news - which is probably the reason it's so well liked by folkies and pub singers (and listeners). For example,:
"Put him in a chorus in West Hartford" or
"Send him back to school at Conard High",
coupled (sorry gang, no hidden meaning intended) with "I wouldn't do that with a drunken sailor". The phrase "banned in Boston" has been a great advertizing gimmick for decades, or more. Maybe this little episode could be used in pubs for a lyric contest - might even spawn a "rebirth" of the song. Too bad there's no "Hit Parade" anymore.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Gary T
Date: 24 May 00 - 06:42 PM

I understood the Jets in West Side Story to be from a Polish neighborhood. At one point Bernardo calls Tony a "Pollock".


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: catspaw49
Date: 24 May 00 - 06:55 PM

He called him a fish?

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: wysiwyg
Date: 24 May 00 - 07:12 PM

He was an Alaskan Polack?


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 24 May 00 - 07:29 PM

I'm reminded of the story about the bunch of street kids planning the night's action.

"Yeah, well Tony's a Wop, and Spikes a Nigger, and I'm a Mick and Al's a Yid, and Jose is a Spic - but we're all Americans..." Cries of doubtful approval.

"So we've got to stick together when we go down to the parking lot and stomp those Arabs..."

You could change the names and the labels and the locality round if you like. But we were talking about West Side Story.

And I alsways thought the Jets were Italian. If I say all these New Yorkers tend to look and sound pretty well the same to me would that be racist? I think it's more of a compliment.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: fulurum
Date: 24 May 00 - 09:43 PM

attention students. you may bring your weapons of choice into the school. but please check your offensive songs and literature at the door.thank you.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Gary T
Date: 24 May 00 - 11:27 PM

Well, I would have spelled it right but I'm sure Bernardo spent more time being tough than studying spelling, and he probably would have spelled it wrong, and since he's the one who said it...this excuse doesn't sound fishy, does it?


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Mbo
Date: 24 May 00 - 11:30 PM

The fish comment is OBVIOUSLY a reference to the line in Romeo and Juliet "O flesh, o flesh, how art thou fishified!" **BG**

--Mbo


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: DougR
Date: 24 May 00 - 11:35 PM

Peter T: Don't follow your reference to Eisenhower. Would you amplify a bit? Just curious.

DougR


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Amergin
Date: 24 May 00 - 11:42 PM

If I can't bring my thoughts into the school, at least I can still bring my gun...


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Gypsy
Date: 25 May 00 - 01:16 AM

"Put him in charge of an Exxon Tanker
put him in charge of an Exxon Tanker
Put him in charge of and Exxon Tanker,
Then we'll start the cleanup!


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Bugsy
Date: 25 May 00 - 01:23 AM

Some people are SO narrow minded.

IT's PATHETIC!

CHeers

Bugsy


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Chanteyranger
Date: 25 May 00 - 05:07 AM

Sean M's idea of an explanation of the meaning of the song would have been much better than some disclaimer, Sean's being just an honest presentation of what the song is about. This whole controversy is an embarrasment. I hate to think what would happen if this highly constricting level of PC became majority opinion. This is sheer puritanism. Reminds me of the time someone complained that "John Cherokee" was insulting to Native American Indians! This person was totally misinformed of the meaning of the song and of the ethnicity of John Cherokee (West Indies). Same thing happening in MA: PC based on misinformation. On top of all this, kids LOVE to sing this chantey. It's rousing, easy, and very fun. They are not concerned with whether it promotes alcholism. Only adults think that's what children are thinking.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Sailor Dan
Date: 25 May 00 - 07:14 AM

First of all, you people here on the mudcat must have compassion, Please.

Those parents who went to the school to complain suffer from a very serious disease. The all suffer from whatis know as "Rectalcranialinversion." Please feel compassion. I mean after all how would you like it if you had your head stuck up your ass and all you could see was brown. It might just give you a shitty outlook on life.

Coming from the Big CIty of NY. West Side story is about the Puerto Rican Influence vs the Irish/Italian etc faction on the upper West Side of Manhattan in the areas of West 80's to West 110th area. In the 1950 & 1960 era the situation as depicted wasn't far off the actual truth.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Hollowfox
Date: 25 May 00 - 09:17 AM

Thanks, Sailor Dan. Now I know the formal medical term fro cerebral hemorrhoids.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: SDShad
Date: 25 May 00 - 09:42 AM

I can't imagine cutting "shave his belly with a rusty razor"! I sing that one with a kind of gravely voice to indicate how rough the shave might be--and every kid in the audience is usually giggling before I finish the first line!

That's too risque? Yeesh!

Praise, I'm gonna have to add "Plan an intervention and sober his ass up" to my version. To by followed by "get him to admit that he has a problem," of course. And Rick and Gypsy--I added the Exxon verse years ago. Always a crowd-pleaser. Another one we added years ago was:

I don't know what to do with a drunken sailor
I don't know what to do with a drunken sailor
I don't know what to do with a drunken sailor
Earl-eye in the mornin'

Must be half-spoken-half-sung in a rambling, rushing, drunken slur, so as to be barely intelligible and to fit into the line since it doesn't scan quite right....

Shad


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Peg
Date: 25 May 00 - 10:00 AM

I am reminded of when I was working at an art cinema theatre in Northampton, MA a few years ago...yes, the Happy Valley, as they call it, is a bastion of kneejerk liberalism (which I don't mind so much) but even more so a bastion of kneejerk political correctness (which really got on my nerves sometimes)...and even the local movie house felt the ripples of it...at the theatre we were playing a French film called "How to Make Love to a Negro without Getting Tired" and the title referred to the book written by a black man (Isaak de Bankole, of Chocolat and Night on Earth) about his own exploits. It is a controversial title but the film itslelf since the main character understands the irony and stereotyping in his use of these words, is actually rather sweet and inoffensive, execpt that this guy does have a tendency to use women sexually but they all love him and it is a silly romantic comedy so everyone is happy...

But we got calls at the theatre and people threatening to boycott us and everything else you could imagine. One woman who called was all righteous and indignant. She said "I can't believe you're playing this film at your theatre." And I asked "Why?" and she said, blustering, "It is racist, and sexist." I asked, "Ma'am, have you seen this film?" and she said "No." And I asked "Then how do you know it's racist and sexist?" "Well I can tell by the title." I said "So it's the title you object to, not the film." She hung uop eventually, rather upset that I did not want to listen to her rant and rave about how racist and sexist the management of my workplace was...

I submit that many of the parents protesting this wonderful old song have not even bothered to look at the lyrics. I also submit that nary a one of them understands that it is very educational and enriching for school children to sing songs which have historical and cultural relevance...when I was in school our choir director loved that genre of songs known as "Negro Spirituals." We sang them often. These days, I wonder how many music teachers who love this music think twice about having their kids perform them simply because the historically-customary name of this song category is offensive to people...

In the meantime, letters to the Globe might do something...it was an AP story, I believe, and letters to the school would probably be even more effective...there were lots of letters about the "West Side Story" debacle in Amherst...

That's Conard High Scool in West Hartford, CT. The phone number is 860-521-3610.
Their mailing address is:
Conard High School
110 Berkshire Road
West Hartford, CT 06107

Tell 'em Peg sent ya. ;)


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Greg F.
Date: 25 May 00 - 10:27 AM

A quote I've seen attributed to Frank Zappa might be appropriate here; hope I have it correctly:

"Some scientists claim that hydrogen, because it is so plentiful, is the basic building block of the universe. I dispute this. I say there is much more stupidity than hydrogen, and THAT is the basic building block of the universe."

Best, Greg


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Mark Clark
Date: 25 May 00 - 10:52 AM

Well at last we have the explanation for the widely publicized shortage of corn cobs! We now know where each of them has gone. It's offensive to have this sort unmitigated prudishness given a label that includes the word correct.

"Drunken Sailor" has always been one of my favioite songs. My children and grandchildren learned that one at an early age. I wonder how these folks would like another favorite of mine, "Sam Hall"?

I read in the paper yesterday that some group in Boston has determined that all the G-rated films are actually too violent for children. I suppose we can forget about singing "Pretty Polly," "Ommie Wise" and "Little Joe The Wrangler" any more.

Looks as though the US needs another Free Speech Movement, what's going on at Berkley these days?

Grumble, grumble, gripe,

      - Mark


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Amos
Date: 25 May 00 - 11:00 AM

Peg, your approach is certainly more rationale and more economical. And might be more effective. But I like the idea of swamping them with jolly walkers. It'd be a helluva lot more fun! We could deck 'em up in sailor suits, like, and have them do a chorus line singing naughty sea-songs...

A


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Wesley S
Date: 25 May 00 - 11:32 AM

Trust me there arn't going to be any alcoholics in the audience to offend if there are any bars open at the time. So it really doesn't matter.

Also on the PC front - a local theater group put on a stage adaption of the "Maltese Falcon" a few years ago and cast a black man as Sam Spade. You can imagine the phone calls they got on that one.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 25 May 00 - 11:43 AM

MANY years ago, when I climbed mountains, we had a version of this song:

What shall we do with the drunken climber? (3X)
Feed him slack when he asks for tension
Ear-lye etc.

Feed him prunes on a five-day backpack

Wrap his crampons in his air mattress

and some othe lines I disremember now.

Dave Oesterreich


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Peg
Date: 25 May 00 - 11:52 AM

Amos; I like that idea! Certainly any public protest of the baning of the song in question should include performances of the song in question...in full costume of course...


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Dave (the ancient mariner)
Date: 25 May 00 - 11:59 AM

Hic..Burp... scuse me mates... just cant seem to stand up straight and steer a straight course at all must be all the booze I drank...Hypersensitivity and Political correctness are forms of censorship by stupid people. They create a society full of rancour, but devoid of spirit. The sooner it stops the better. Yours, Aye. Dave


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Penny S.
Date: 25 May 00 - 01:39 PM

Allan Ahlberg has a version they might approve.

What shall we do with the grumpy teacher?...

In "Heard it in the playground"; it suggests a series of appropriate punishments. Keep him in at lunch to watch the children eating, that sort of thing. Children just love it.

Penny

Don't know about that sort of teacher though.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Bert
Date: 25 May 00 - 01:47 PM

Got any more verses of that version Penny?


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Penny S.
Date: 25 May 00 - 02:14 PM

Copyright problem, I think.

However.

It is now 19.08 GMT. I have spent over an hour running two versions of scandisk and defrag on a hard disk that reports problems on booting, but then doesn't have any. The virus scanner reprots nothing. I have put the thing right three times now this week. Tomorrow we have inservice training on boosting self esteem and circle time. If the computer had not now just finished running its stuff, I would have gone and got the book, which I recommend. It has a number of poems set to tunes.

eg. Goodbye old school (to Goodbye old Paint) In the classroom sits a teacher The bell is ringing, for school to begin The teacher and the children should be friends

and my favourite, which demands to be sung

I've got the teach them in the morning Playground duty Teach them in the afternoon blues....

and to be sung now.

Anyway, I've got to get home and eat and write reports.

I'll pick up the book on the way, and see what I can do - it does invite improvistion, though, doesn't it?

Penny


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: SeanM
Date: 25 May 00 - 02:35 PM

To Sailor Dan's call for compassion for victims of Rectalcranialinversion, I answer:

There is hope! A recent procedure has been developed, "plexiotomy", wherein a portion of the abdomen is replaced with a clear plexiglass sheet so that the sufferer can still see with their head lodged up their rectum.

Levity... A full time job.

M


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Petr
Date: 25 May 00 - 03:23 PM

I know Someone beat me to it but this is the version I heard.

put him in charge of an Exxon tanker 3x on the Alaskan coastline.

petr


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Sailor Dan
Date: 25 May 00 - 03:37 PM

Sean M

They would not be able to live with the installation of a plexiotomy, It would be take away there shitty outlook on life. Then what would they complain about. The pain in there necks???? LOL

Dan


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Penny S.
Date: 25 May 00 - 04:33 PM

I went to get my copy of Heard it in the Playground, to find it had joined the Potter books down the worm hole. So Ahlberg has made a new sale, which modifies my attitude to putting it here.

Chorus: What shall we do with the grumpy teacher? (x3)
Early in the morning.

Hang her on a hook behind the classroom door.
Tie her up and leave her in the PE store.
Make her be with Derek Drew for evermore,
Early....

Please, Miss, we're only joking, Don't mean to be provoking. How come your ears are smoking? Early...

Chorus

Send him out to duty when the sleet is sleeting. Keep him after school to take a parent's meeting. Stand him in the hall to watch the children eating, Early...

Please, Sir, we're only teasing, Don't mean to be displeasing. Help - that's our necks your squeezing! Early...

Chorus

Tickle her toes with a hairy creature. Leave her in the jungle where the ants can reach her. BRING HER BACK ALIVE TO BE A CLASSROOM TEACHER! Early - in the - morning!

Allan Ahlberg 1989 Puffin Books ISBN 0-14-032824-6


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 25 May 00 - 09:20 PM

An odd song to pick on. I always get the suspicion that in this kind of situation there's someone manipulating things behind the scenes. "Now if we can get someone to ask for a ban on this it'll really make the PC crowd look stupid."

Mind there are shanties that you'd use cautiously. Whip Jamboree, to which I posted a link at the start of this thread, used to have different sets of verses according to whether there were female pasengers on board or not, according to Stan Hugill. And he had verses to "In Amsterdam there lived a maid" that he'd never put in print, and I don't blame him.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: GUEST,Ole Bull
Date: 26 May 00 - 12:59 PM

Hey yoou guys;

Make fun all you want but this doesn't appear any different to me than all you Mudcatters who, in other links, wanted to ban or censor any old song that makes most any reference what so ever to black people or slaves.

And speakin' of Drunkin' Sailors, isn't "Blow the Man Down" even more offensive? Especially if you consider it's first cousin, the song "Knock a Nigger Down," (one of the songs that may deserved to be knocked down). Although no-body complains about the later folkies that converted the suject from a black to a preacher (Some folks say a ---- won't steal,.....)


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Chanteyranger
Date: 27 May 00 - 03:31 AM

Okay, here are the contents to the new publication, The Conard Book of Chanteys for All Occasions:

Root Beer Johnny; The Good Ship Ven..er..Lollipop; Whup Boy Scout Jamboree; So Early In The Morning The Sailor Loves His Waffle-O; The Senior Citizen Moke Pickin' On A Banjo; New York Women, Do You Not Know How To Dance The Polka?; Greenland Trout Fisheries. Any additions, Mudcatters?


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Melani
Date: 27 May 00 - 10:55 PM

You forget John Native American.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: GUEST,Heather
Date: 05 Nov 03 - 10:15 AM

I have to say, I find this particular thing very amusing - I just graduated from a highschool in southwestern Connecticut, and last year our choir sang that song. Now, loving the song like I do, when I saw that the version we had was missing some of my favorite verses (namely - shave his belly with a rusty razor) I went right to the director, showed him all these other verses, and he loved them and went ahead and added them in. It's odd how totally different the reactions were up at Conard!


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Amos
Date: 05 Nov 03 - 10:26 AM

Some people can face reality, and some canna, I reckon. Protesting a rowdy sailing song from the 1800's is like being upset because cave men were so violent with each other. Geeze Louise, people!! :>)

A


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 05 Nov 03 - 10:55 AM

Back in the dear, dead, days beyond recall when I was a sort-of mountain climber, we would sing What shall we do with a drunken climber?

As you may imagine, a drunken climber is as high on the undesirability list as a drunken sailor on watch.

This had great punishments, like, "Feed him prunes on a five-day backpack", and "Give him slack when he calls for tension", and "Wrap his crampons in his air mattress."

Not too much there, I suppose for someone to complain about. I suppose someone might take umbrage about the prunes.

Dave Oesterreich


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 05 Nov 03 - 11:09 AM

"cave men were so violent with each other"

That's stereotyping. For all we know they were gentle as hippies. Eating fruit and nuts and all that and sitting round blazing hemp fires and relating, and playing flutes and digeridoos.

"Wow, man - that thing you're painting on the cave wall. Far Out!"

Meanwhile the cavewomen might have been out chasing mammoths...


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Charley Noble
Date: 05 Nov 03 - 12:06 PM

Dave Oesterreich-

You're repeating yourself, old man! BG

Wonder how them parents in Conard would interpret this potentially obscene verse:

Boot 'im up and wipe his hard drive,
Boot 'im up and wipe his hard drive,
Boot 'im up and wipe his hard drive,
Ear-ly in the morning!

Cheerily,
Charley Noble


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: swampy-the-spark
Date: 05 Nov 03 - 04:57 PM

i spose we could definently NOT sing about the blackball line?


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Dead Horse
Date: 05 Nov 03 - 05:05 PM

Charley, that version is definately PC.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Wolfgang
Date: 05 Nov 03 - 05:53 PM

If we do not find a version that is definitely PC we still can fall back on singing one that is defiantly PC.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Blackcatter
Date: 05 Nov 03 - 06:06 PM

How in the hell do these old threads become resurrected?

This disappeared 3 1/2 years ago.

That being said, I tohught it was funny that people had a problem about the drinking in the song and not the physical abuse carried on throughout the song.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Heely
Date: 05 Nov 03 - 06:43 PM

As a Sea Chantey performer and a High School Choral Director - I have loved this link. Thanks for the great Laughs. Now you know what we deal with everyday.

So. . . .what do you think about every Kindergarten - college in America playing Elgar's "Pomp and Circumstance" at every graduation. It was written to honor England ruling the world and celebrating the success in India. Didn't we fight a war or two against England for our independance?(1776 and-1812 for those who forgot) Figure that one out? My Irish and Scottish and Austalian heritage is offended. Heely


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Noreen
Date: 05 Nov 03 - 09:53 PM

Thanks for refreshing this, Heather, it's a classic thread.

Still smiling at Greenland Trout Fisheries, chanteyranger :0)

Financially dependent senior citizen horse?


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 06 Nov 03 - 12:14 AM

Odd thing about Drunken Sailor--It seems to be a stamp-and-go shanty. Which implies a very large crew. Which suggests a naval vessel. But I'm told that shantying was forbidden on naval vessels.

Any shanty buffs care to enlighten me?


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Jeanie
Date: 06 Nov 03 - 04:16 AM

I missed this thread first time round. Where will this craziness end ? I have been banned twice (so far) from having children sing certain songs. A song for Palm Sunday, "Here Comes Jesus Riding on a Donkey", is sung to the tune of "Drunken Sailor" - this was banned, because the tune was considered too offensive to be sung in a church. (The children loved it).

Last Christmas, one of the songs in my school's production of Dylan Thomas' "A Child's Christmas in Wales" was removed at the last minute by the "thought police" because it happened to say good things about drinking parsnip wine. (The children loved it).

A friend who teaches drama in a similar (independent prep) school came across exactly the same thing with her production of Dickens' "A Christmas Carol". What are we both giving them this year ? Straight Bible readings from Genesis through to John. No more, no less. No-one can take offence at that. (In a State school, they probably would, though). I hope the children love it. Hmmmm.....


- jeanie


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Melani
Date: 06 Nov 03 - 02:00 PM

At my daughter's Bat Mitzvah, there was a final prayer to end the service which is tradionally sung to diffent tunes, the tune being selected especially for the Bar/Bat Mitvah kid to reflect their interests and honor them on this special occasion in their lives. My daughter sang it to the tune of "The Drunken Sailor," and the rabbi was absolutely on the floor in hysterics.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Micca
Date: 06 Nov 03 - 02:30 PM

From my own time in the Merchant Navy and my contact with a real shantyman (Bless you, Bert Gray, where ever you are) I recall, his contention was that "Drunken Sailor" was a virtuoso piece for shantymen, always started with a few standard verses then used as a platform to show off the shantymans skill at improvising verses, especialy about fellow crew mwmbers and with lots of "local colour" and in jokes, and in his (Bert's)honour, on the rare ocassions I sing it, I have tried to do the same.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: GUEST,Allen
Date: 18 Apr 05 - 12:18 PM

The Evil Ecology-Destroying Whale-Murdering Ship the Diamond.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: GUEST,Allen
Date: 18 Apr 05 - 12:35 PM

In Amsterdam There Lived a Liberated Modern Woman With Progressive Views on Lifestyle Choices


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Muttley
Date: 18 Apr 05 - 08:37 PM

This is unbelievable: How about this offering.

What shall we do with the righteous PC's
What shall we do with the righteous PC's
What shall we do with the righteous PC's
From the the Hartford PTA group

Send 'em all on a luxury sea cruise
Send 'em all on a luxury sea cruise
Send 'em all on a luxury sea cruise
On the ship 'Titanic'

PC is running stupidly rampant. I was 'reamed a few years ago by my boss for holding a door open for a couple of ladies exiting a building behind me (it was a 'welfare' office whose staff are predominantly rampant PC and feministic) - we'd been to a meeting there.
I listened politely to his diatribe and then cheerfully told him to "Go %#@!! himself" as the action had been drilled into me as politeness, courtesy and good manners by my mother and as long as I had breath in my body I would continue to do it - no matter HOW much he objected. Besides if I hold a door open for a woman and she abuses me for it; she's just as likely to be informed of her boorish rudeness and tossed BACK it.

The PC world is a TERRIBLY confusing place to a blunt-spoken Asperger who calls it as they see it. I try to be polite at all times, but PC just confuses the bejeebers outta me.

John


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: EBarnacle
Date: 19 Apr 05 - 11:23 AM

Sorry, Melani, that should have been "John the Polynesian Peasant."


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: GUEST,Melani
Date: 19 Apr 05 - 05:38 PM

John Chreokee=John Native American
John Kanaka=John Polynesian Peasant
Did I miss anyone?


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Flash Company
Date: 20 Apr 05 - 12:05 PM

Peter Grey---
Now Peter went away out west to seek his fort-i-an,
Where he was given great support by a Native Amer-i-can

I'll go now!

FC


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: GUEST,Uncle DaveO
Date: 20 Apr 05 - 12:40 PM


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 20 Apr 05 - 03:26 PM

In Japan in the 1870s, in the "Yokohama dialect," the word for sailor was dammuraisu, or "damn your eyes."

The ...red-faced foreigners in Japan, who drink brandy out of tumblers, and then in drunken fury roam the streets of Yokohama and nagasaki are not infrequently compared to the intoxicated monster beheaded by Raiko [children's fireside story]."
"The Japanese child .... is amazed at the great size of the mugs and drinking glasses ... from which the men of red beards and faces drink a liquid ten times stronger than saké."

W. E. Griffis, 1876, "The Mikado's Empire," Harper & Bros. NY, p. 493.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Gurney
Date: 21 Apr 05 - 05:36 AM

Dick Greenhaus, 2 years ago! asked: is it a naval shanty.
Well, I'm not a buff, but yes, according to Stan Hugill, it is one of the two shanties that were sung on HMShips

Can't remember if I remember this from conversation with him or reading one of his books, but I do remember it, if you see what I mean.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: GUEST,McGrath of Harlow
Date: 21 Apr 05 - 11:38 AM

What was the other one, Gurney? Spanish Ladies? (And was he talking about singing as a forebitter, or being allowed to use as a shanty?)


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 21 Apr 05 - 02:29 PM

What Hugill said-
Drunken Sailor- "This is a typical example of the stamp-'n'-go song or walkaway or runaway shanty, and was the only type of work-song allowed in the King's Navee."

In other words, Hugill was referring to a type of shanty, not particular songs. Stan Hugill, "Shanties from the Seven Seas," 1961 (and reprints), p. 108.

He explained further in 1969 that these were played by fifers and fiddlers when heaving up the anchor aboard naval vessels, but there was NO singing at the chore. "Nancy Dawson," "Drops of Brandy," and "Off She Goes" were played (reference given).
Whall was the source of the statement about "Drunken Sailor" and "Nancy Dawson" being sung on revenue cutters and smaller fighting craft, but Hugill says there is no literary proof of this.
Stan Hugill, 1969, "Shanties and Sailors' Songs," pp. 9-10.


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Subject: RE: Drunken Sailor song protested
From: Gurney
Date: 22 Apr 05 - 03:30 AM

What Q said is exactly right, I checked in my copy of SftSS, but I also had chats with Stan about shanties, and SOMEONE did tell me that Drunken Sailor was, as I said, "One of the two shanties that were allowed to be sung on RN ships". This is a 35 year old memory, and I can't be sure who said it, but that was the phrase.
Sorry, McGrath, I never did know the other. A nice red herring for the erudite to chase.


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