Guitar: Are bruised fingertips common?

Subject: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Homeless
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 10:31 AM

I've been trying to learn to play guitar off and on (mostly off) for about 10 years now. I've gotten used to my fingertips getting tough and then peeling. But this morning I woke up and noticed that the every fingertip on my left hand is bruised. I've never had that happen before and was wondering if this is common? Is it common for someone who is just starting to play? Are there any other ailments I might need to watch out for? (BTW, I'm playing a cheap Yamaha classical guitar if it makes any difference.)

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: bbelle
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 10:58 AM

I went through a period of my fingertips being red and swollen and very painful, but not visibly bruised. I kept practicing but for short periods of time. It takes a while for good calluses to build up. The other problem I had was blisters on my picking fingers ... I learned to pick with different fingers during that time to ease the blisters.

I belong to the Flatpick L list and there have been a myriad of discussions on calluses and what to do when your callus peels off and you gotta play. Most pickers subscribe to the super glue method.

Here are a couple of suggestions which I copied out of my email.

"Some time ago I remember the list discussing what to do about skin cracks on the ends of fingers. Note that there is an article on page A1 of The Wall Street Journal today about dermatologists who recommend using Krazy Glue for small paper cuts. This may be of help for calluses that crack. The article also mentions Dermabond, a cement approved by the FDA for use on skin that is more flexible. I assume a doctore could prescribe this, but not Krazy Glue."

"For me the use of isopropyl alcohol daily on the fingertips will build stronger calluses over time that won't crack. Although the super-glue trick is a good short term fix, nothing beats tough, leathery calluses. Also using a cottonball with the alcohol on the fingertips will clean out the dirt/rust from playing, allowing for a faster recovery. At the Kamp I was wiping down my fingertips 3-4 times a day, it definitely helped."

I'm going to try the isopropyl alcohol method, myself. I've now got pretty good calluses, but they need to be better if I'm going to play for hours on end.

Good luck ...

moonchild

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Midchuck
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 11:21 AM

Wiser heads than mine have pointed out that it is only necessary to "mash the strings on down" (E. Tubb) hard enough to make firm contact with the frets, which doesn't mean you have to press them firmly against the fingerboard, especially if you're fretting the string in the right place, i. e. right next to, but not on,the fret you want it to strike. (Halfway between frets is no good.)

Experiment and see how light a touch with the left hand you can use and still not have a buzz on the fret.

Peter.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Áine
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 01:35 PM

Dear Homeless,

I had the same problem, until I figured out I was pressing down too hard with my left hand (see Midchuck's message above). However, I did find that putting a cupla ice cubes in a plastic bag and holding it on my fingertips for a few minutes after I practiced helped a lot with the soreness. Also, can you adjust the bridge on your guitar? If you can, you might want to lower it, as well as lightening up on the pressure on the frets.

Good luck to you, Áine

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: SDShad
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 01:52 PM

Homeless--

I've never had the bruises either, but when I've not been playing for quite a while and have no calluses, the fingertips on my right hand (I play lefty) can hurt like a son-of-a-bitch. I like the suggestion of isopropyl alcohol for helping to build them up, and will have to try it--thanks moonchild!

But what I use when my calluses are mostly gone and I can barely chord after 10-15 minutes is an over-the-counter liquid bandage called New Skin. You can buy it at most any pharmacy, in either a brush-on form or a spray. The spray doesn't work so well for fingertips, although it's nice for its originally-intended bandaging purposes. It also comes off very easily with fingernail polish remover, especially the kind that comes in a cylindrical jar with a sponge soaked in the stuff. You shove your fingertips into the holes in the sponge, wiggle them about in the sponge for a second or two, wipe 'em on a paper towel, and the New Skin is gone. And Hypatia, looking over my shoulder, just suggested that the polish remover might have some of the same benefits as isopropyl alcohol. A fair point.

I don't know if superglue is as easy to remove.

Chris

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Gary T
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 02:54 PM

Super glue should dissolve in acetone, which is what most nail polish remover consists of.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: bbelle
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 03:13 PM

Chris ... thanks for the tip about New Skin!

re the super glue ... the point is to not take it off. It will wear off by itself and you will have built up some calluses.

Be sure to use just a teensy tiny drop, though, because you don't want it running down your fingers and onto whatever comes next (she says with educated experience).

And, it's not just beginners or people who haven't played in a while that have sore fingertips. The tips from the Flatpick L list came from a couple of very famous flatpickers.

moonchild

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Midchuck
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 04:54 PM

Moonchild, I didn't think there were any Flatpickles on here too except me & bigchuck. What name to you use there? Or do you lurk?

Peter.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Homeless
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 05:34 PM

I know you're supposed to press just behind the fret, but when I'm doing an A, with all three of my fingers smashed together, my index finger is still just in front of the first fret. I have to press like a dickens in order to keep from buzzing. Also, I don't know if I have soft, fatty fingers or something, but when I press a string, my fingertip (on either side of the string) will almost touch the fretboard before the string touches the fret. I've found that I can't play after taking a shower - my fingers are too soft.

When Bill and Allan were here, Allan remarked that this particular guitar would be difficult to learn barre chords on. I asked if it was because the action was too high and he told me that the action was OK. (It was because the fingerboard is very wide.)

I'll try some of the "fake fingertip callus" tips. I'll also see if I can lighten up on the pressure some. Maybe if I start trying to use some finesse instead of brute force I'll be better off.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: bbelle
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 05:36 PM

I didn't know you were a Flatpickle, either. I use moonchild jenny.

I get info, give info, and sometimes lurk.

Did you go to Kamp Kaufmann?

My cousin, Biscuit Dave Jarvis, is the one who pointed me to the mudcat 3 1/2 years ago and then persuaded me to get on the Flatpickle list.

moonchild

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: GUEST,Ely
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 05:36 PM

I had some bruises when I first started playing (I was learning on my mother's Guild F-30, which has very high action and, even with medium-lights, is very tightly strung). I don't get them any more, even after not playing in awhile, but my own guitar is much gentler on my hand.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Sorcha
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 05:59 PM

OK, I'll bite. If it is not a flatpickle, is it a round pickle? Are these native to Florida? I am not a pickle of any shape, but hammering on can cause bruises, even on fiddle. Lower the nut? Lower the bridge? Get a new guitar (not an option, right now, I know)Practice less at a stretch, as we advised Jenny?

Another hot tip: Good judgement comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgement.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Mbo
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 06:06 PM

Woo, try and switch from Classical to steel string to fiddle all in one night! The Superglue technique reminds me of Classical guitar playing. If your fingernail breaks, a lot of players Superglue the broken piece back on.

--Mbo (nursing a broken fingernail..first time since Sept '98)

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: bill\sables
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 06:27 PM

I remember trying to learn to play piano when I was young, I had brused fingers for weeks when my brother slammed the lid down while I was playing.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Jul 00 - 07:18 PM

Don't rush it, Homeless. I know you said you;ve been trying to ,wearn on and off for 10 years - but then you talked about just learning to play, which suggests it's been more off then on till recently.

Since it's a classical guitar, I assume it's nylon strings rather than steel, which rules out suggesting you switch to nylon. But while your hands are toughening up, I'd suggest you avoid A shapes. I'd avoid the chemical fixes myself. Some people suuggest sticking fingers in a salt bath. I'd say, go easy on the playing, and play stuff that doesn't hurt, and take it easy, but be persistant with it. It maybe has to hurt a little bit, but it shouldn't be agony.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Midchuck
Date: 17 Jul 00 - 08:00 AM

Homeless, A is a bitch if you have fat fingers (I do) and try to make it with the first three fingers. Try making it with the last three, leaving the index finger out of the picture. They fit better.

Peter (Who is gradually getting rid of his guitars that have standard [1 11/16 at the nut] width necks, because the 1 1/4 necks are so much easier to get all his fat little fingers on to at once)

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Jul 00 - 08:20 AM

Another way to make the A chord: use the index finger to make a "mini-barre" over the third and fourth strings (this requires that you bend the index finger back at the first knuckle); note the second string with the middle finger.

If you're playing a classical guitar with nylon strings, I don't see how you could be briusing your fingers, unless you're mashing down really, really hard. I've played cheap, steel-stringed guitars most of my life and have never had bruised fingertips. Try mashing down on the strings just enough next to the fret to get a clean tone from the string.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Linda Goodman Zebooker
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 12:20 PM

Yesterday I played guitar in an Open Band at the Contra Dance. I'm still just a very beginner at guitar, but this is the third month I've tried the band and now I do kind of know what I'm doing, as I have acquired some of the song books and have become familiar with a lot of the tunes. I have not yet progressed to any kind of playing the actual notes or harmonies of the tunes, but I was really stumming away with gusto, continuously holding chords for a long time (including a lot of A and D chords) having a great time. I had no discomfort whatsover, but suddenly, after about an hour and half, my left ring finger hurt a lot! It was bruised. I HAD to stop playing. ---(but then I got to go and dance!)

Now today I can barely even %$@9$#5^ type.

I think it may be because in this big band - I was in front of the wonderful marimba - I couldn't hear myself unless I really hunched over to listen. I'm a new player on a 3/4 size nylon string guitar. So, in my enthusiasm with the music, I might have been pressing the strings really hard without realizing it. Makes me think of the time my choir was singing with a Klezmer band. I was inches away from the tuba bell (I was looking right down into it), couldn't really hear much else, and it was all I could do to keep from losing my voice at that concert.

Aside from learning individual notes, which would move my fingers more, and just being (somehow) more aware of how hard I'm pressing when I'm doing chords in a band situation, is there anything I can do to know this bruising is happening or to prevent it? It just came up very suddenly, with no warning.

Linda

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Jim Lad
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 12:40 PM

I've never heard of bruised fingertips and would suggest a routine check up.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 01:39 PM

Unusual bruising, especially of the more remote bits and pieces, could - remote possibility - indicate some change/impairment of circulation, especially if it results from an activity that didn't previously produce bruises.

A routine checkup would be a good thing to consider, and doing a close and personal inspection of other extremities - especially feet/toes/ankles for any changes would be in order.

Any unusual swelling, cracking, blistering, etc., could be first symptoms of the all-too-prevalent pre-diabetic condition that creeps up on many of us as we "mature."

Of course it could just be clumsy fretwork.

I have had a couple of friends who subscribe to the "I'm so macho I can keep playing when it hurts" school, and have seen the occasional "purple finger syndrome," but it isn't - IMO - something to be proud of, or something to ignore, even if you're just doing it out of stupidity stubborness.

As one who commonly doesn't practice as I should, I have found that 10 or 15 minutes, three or four times a day, is much more effective in building the callouses needed than an hour at a time, especially for my "meat-slicer" mandolin; and usually by the second or third day I can play almost indefinitely without discomfort. If I try to hurry it by playing longer at first, the pain from the first day is still there at the end of the week.

John

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 05:48 PM

Change the A shape. If you can't do the bent-back barre, put the second finger on the fretted E, the ring finger on the fretted C sharp, and tuck the first finger tight in behind on the fretted A.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Linda Goodman Zebooker
Date: 15 Apr 07 - 01:12 AM

Thanks so much. These ideas will help - changing or varying the shape and the fingers used. I have plenty of time, because a few of the contra tunes use the same chord for as long as four measures. They are real fast measures, but even so...

I think John in Kansas has put his finger on the main problem (sorry)-- by saying that it was clumsy fretwork. Because I'd already slowly built up the callouses by following everyone's advice in the Mudcat on earlier threads, I didn't feel that kind of discomfort any more. And playing in a living room either alone or with a couple of other people (all I'd done up to now) I could hear buzzing or poor tone if I was doing something wrong and could immediately fix it.

But in the band - with about 30 other instruments- fiddles, flutes, guitars, mandolins, banjos, bones, bodhran, a grand piano etc etc, plus lots of foot stomping, plus 200-300 dancers and a caller, I didn't get that kind of feeback. I couldn't hear subtle mistakes I was making and I bet I was probably slipping and banging my poor finger right into the fret a number of times without seeing or feeling it till it was too late.

Linda

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Gurney
Date: 15 Apr 07 - 01:29 AM

Had them go purple a few times. I did it by playing through the pain, when I hadn't done any guitar for a while.
The fingertips go sore first, numb next, then purple for a couple of days. When I had jobs that didn't involve manual work, it was worse.
Does that sound familiar?

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 15 Apr 07 - 01:41 AM

sounds worrying, I'm not sure your doctor will rise to the challenge. If you offer them an explanantion - most of them will jump at it. does anything else, apart from guitar playing bring this bruising on?

Make sure your guitar is not set up like a egg slicer - that the strings are set a sensible action. go to a guitar maker to sort it out - costs money. but its the most obvious explanantion.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Nick
Date: 15 Apr 07 - 06:23 AM

I have played for longer than I care to remember but had a problem with one of my left hand fingers a while back. If you have a look here it suggests it's quite common and may not even be related to the guitar playing (though it's likely).

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Nick
Date: 15 Apr 07 - 06:32 AM

Mine occurred when I went back to playing bass and after a prolonged session my little finger had a pronounced bruise on the finger tip (that's b-r-u-i-s-e, pronounced brooz :), sorry couldn't resist an old Spike Milligan throwaway line).

My left hand fingertips are generally pretty solid and calloused from acoustic guitar playing but the fingers probably fret the bass strings in a different place and that my have caused it.

As an aside I now have two sets of callouses on my left hand fingers and a separate set on my right hand first and second fingers as the size and width of the bass strings sure knock the hell out of your fingers early on. But as a bonus I can fingerpick all day and night on my acoustic with this new protective layer!

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Betsy
Date: 15 Apr 07 - 07:14 AM

I'm with Jim Lad - never heard of it in 40 years - you may need a check-up ,especially as you are only playing a classical guitar, which are much gentler on the fingers, compared to steel strings.Most guitarists have generally gone through the terrible finger-pain of learning and perhaps a bit of bleeding - but bruising ?- may be bad circulation.
Regarding the hard tips on the fingers - having a bath is the easiest way of losing these most useful pads - it doesn't happen when I take a shower or swimming , but if you MUST bathe in a tub - keep your hands out of the soapy water.Why it happens I don't know - but it does !
More friviously Homeless , you don't work in a shop with an old fashioned till do you? ,if so this matter may be totally unconnected to the guitar !!.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 15 Apr 07 - 11:17 AM

If your tips are soggy from the bath, a partial recovery may be obtained from rinsing them, perhaps repeatedly with drying in between, with a little alcohol. Alcohol and moisture combine readily, so the moisture goes with the rinse when it runs off, and the remaining alcohol dries quickly.

This won't get rid of water that's "soaked in" deeply, but will at least dry the surface layers fairly efficiently. To be effective for this, you need at least ~70% propanol or equivalent, so dipping your fingers in your martini isn't really too helpful. Also, not necessarily recommended for general use on all your tips - just the ones that need a little surface "toughening."

John

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Stringsinger
Date: 15 Apr 07 - 11:25 AM

You'll have to use a "distributed" method of practice rather than a "massed" method.

Play for short periods of time consistently rather than try to play a lot at once.

Check the action on your guitar with a reputable repair person.

Use the corners of your fingers rather than the whole area and don't bend back your fingers while you are playing (unless you are playing certain jazz chords).

Keep your left hand relaxed and avoid all unecessary tension in it. Pressure light but tension free.

Frank Hamilton

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: GUEST,Nick
Date: 15 Apr 07 - 06:14 PM

RE: Are bruised fingertips common
That would depend upon who's nose you stick them in I should think...
(Sorry could snot help myself!)
Nick

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: GUEST,John Oz
Date: 21 Apr 07 - 10:12 PM

Ive been playing for 27 years. I play thoughout the weekdays at home every night and generally have a guitar in my hands what ever im doing
(not everything i do).
On the weekends i play in rock bands in the club/pub circuit.
Yet my finger tips on my fretting hand are soft and i have minimal calluses. One person wrote about not being macho and stop playing when it hurts,
- but when your playing to paying customers youve got to play.
All of my guitars are setup good however the style of music im contracted to play requires a lot of string bending a finger vibrato which tears my fingers to shreds.
Ive used supa glue but found that it makes your tips slippery (not good when bending strings with vibrato). and used alcohol both internally and externally on the tips.
I would love to find a solution to soft finger tips.

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Bert
Date: 22 Apr 07 - 06:05 PM

You're not practising enough. They should be bleeding!

Subject: RE: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: GUEST,Guest Tim
Date: 22 Apr 07 - 06:56 PM

Soak your fingertips in pure gum spirits of turpentine, before, during and after playing. Turp won't hurt the fingerboard, in fact it's good for the wood, just don't get any on the neck finish.
Turp will take the pain away and will help toughen your fingertips. Been using this for years. The smell will help clear your sinuses also.
Tim

Subject: RE: Guitar: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Muttley
Date: 22 Apr 07 - 10:17 PM

Dear Homeless
Regards playing your 'A' - if you have 'broadish' fingertips then try playing the 'A' with only two fingers and 'dropping the angle of your hand/wrist slightly. I
use my index and middle fingers to hit an 'A' and an 'E sus 4' (same fret, three strings but the 'E-sus' is played one string higher - (G,D & A strings as opposed to B,G & D strings) and then raise the wrist angle to play the A7, Em type chords.

Still worth a try - especially if one finger just will not do as it's told!

Muttley

Subject: RE: Guitar: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: pirandello
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 08:58 AM

Anything containing detergents-shampoo, washing up liquid-will destroy your callouses. I recommend not washing.

Subject: RE: Guitar: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Bee
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 09:07 AM

HHouse work involving detergents destroys those lovely callouses, but gardening is great for them.

I now have pretty good callouses, but have no solution for the fact that my fingertips dent after an hour or so, to the point where flesh meets fingerboard before string meets fret. My fingertips don't seem particularly fat, so I've no idea why this happens.

Subject: RE: Guitar: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Muttley
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 09:57 AM

From that last post; It sounds like your action is too deep/high - possibly a 'setup' at a music store will help.

My fingertips aren't overly broad either, but the Fender acoustic I play is a steel-string and has a fingerboard that is on the narrow side. However, I am planning on buying a Maton later this year - for a richer sound which will better compliment the music I prefer to play.

Slainte

Muttley

Subject: RE: Guitar: Are bruised fingertips common?
From: Linda Goodman Zebooker
Date: 23 Apr 07 - 05:51 PM

I've analyzed more of what I was doing wrong. Now that my bruised finger has healed up (it took a week) I realize that in addition to banging it on the fret, I was probably gripping much harder than usual. At the dance my small nylon string guitar was the quietest of the about 32 instruments playing, and I couldn't hear my guitar unless I hunched over it -- not cool to do on a stage, even in the third row!

I usually just use fingers and I'm not used to doing much strumming with a plectrum. It had felt to me during the dance like I really had to press down with my left hand to get any sound - but I see now that's not the case.

I experimented with strumming at home in my quiet living room yesterday and saw that the pressure for struming didn't seem to actually be any different from the pressure needed for fingerpicking. It certainly FEELS very different to my left hand, but I tried using lighter and lighter pressure and I still got a clear sound.

So next time, I'll just have to trust that I'm audible!

Linda