BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: DougR
Date: 05 Nov 00 - 01:52 AM

Happy to oblige, Guest S. Keep laughing! It's good for you.

Carol C: why couldn't you?

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Thomas the Rhymer
Date: 05 Nov 00 - 12:19 AM

Well now....,

Did anyone see Bush's paid political speach that was played on the networks? It was long, and he read it from a prompter by the camera... I can still see his eyes twitching! The approach he took was generally fumbling over words and dull, the word choices were unnaural to him and it may have contained words he didn't understand or use... at least that's what it sounded like.

DUI. Lying about it. Playing the "character card" like it was trump... Allowing his handlers to tell him what to "think", hiding behind "not leaving any kids behind" with the CEO's and their tedious strings attached... Why yes, it is true! Bush is a puppet dictator waiting to be born! He has no creativity, no origionality, and maybe no conscience either... polution and death in Texas... But by golly the boy EVENTUALLY does what he is told...

I for one, would like to see Clinton discuss nuts-and-bolts with Bush on policy, foreign policy, human rights, economics, political history, etc.... Clinton is a Rhodes scholar! He did his homework! Bush on the other hand... He is simply an idiot. The lights are on, but there is noone home. His convictions are mostly vague " 'cause I belong in the White House, that's why..." arguements. Bush is bunk.

The people who want him in office are just plain "out of touch". It is as if they are saying... "BRING ON THE 1984 VERSION OF OUR DISNEY_WORLD STYLE SUBURBAN RETIREMENT THEME_PARK!" "...OH,... AND ONLY THE VERY WEALTHY NEED APPLY". Anyone remember "TRICKLE DOWN"?

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Greg F.
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 11:08 PM

Continued HERE

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: GUEST,Stackley
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 11:03 PM

Oh, and Doug- I almost forgot- GREAT one-liner about Dubya's problem being PRESS BIAS!! PRICELESS!! ROFL!! Great stuff. That was Tricky Dick's problem, too, wasn't it? He wasn't a crook, the PRESS was OUT TO GET HIM!!! Too much, Doug!! Look out Jay Leno!

Cheers.

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Troll
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 10:40 PM

THANK YOU CAROL!!!

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Greg F.
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 10:31 PM

Carol-

I LOVE IT!

Best, Greg

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: GUEST,Stackley
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 10:27 PM

Oh, you're very welcome, Doug-- but I don't admit that an attempt on your part to change the subject answers any questions about o'l Dubya, does it? Nice try- and I don't think anyone could have done it better, but the task's too heavy, even for an old hand like you.

But please keep at it, you're cracking me up! You should take your act on Comedy Central- much too good to restrict it to the 'Cat. You could be the new Henny Youngman: "Take my candidate- PLEASE!"
Cheers.

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Troll
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 10:21 PM

I never said it was a GOOD defense, merely a possible one. At any event, both candidates seem to be ignoring the whole thing anyhow.

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: CarolC
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 10:18 PM

Sorry, just can't help myself...

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Greg F.
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 10:16 PM

Yes, that's true, and I could conceivably argue that the world was flat. But that wouldn't make it so. Sorry, Troll, that dog won't hunt.

Best, Greg

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Troll
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 10:08 PM

Greg, if the record was expunged, the ARREST does not exist legally. Of course the act still exists but legally the arrest never happened.
If Bill Clinton can argue that fellatio isn't sex, and Al Gore can claim no legal authority in the Bhuddist temple fund raising, then George W. Bush COULD CONCEIVABLY argue that he did not lie about his arrest record because LEGALLY the arrest did not exist.
Thats what I meant and thats all I meant.
I asked about who broke the story because I was and am interested. I've read several conflicting reports and I'd like to know the truth.

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: kendall
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 10:07 PM

I'll answer you Doug. Gore stretches the truth, Bush flat out lied to the reporter who asked him if he had been arrested after 1968. He said "NO" Now, it turns out that he has been arrested not once, but three timesin his earlier past. Gore has never been arrested ever. He got a speeding ticket. You seem to be willing to let Bush up on the lie thing..now let Gore up on the Buddist temple thing.At least, there is SOME room for doubt there.

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: DougR
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 09:52 PM

Guest, Stackely: Thank you. One of the most satisfying things in life to me, is providing you with good belly laughs.

No one responded, though to my question, which was, why don't you Gore folks hold your candidate to the same standards that you expect of Bush? Hmmmm? Never mind what Bush says about Gore, I'm interested in what you think about Gore's integrity.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Frankham
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 08:50 PM

DUI is a minor traffic incident? We're in big trouble.

Can we really trust this guy? He calls Gore on character but as the old saying goes, point a finger and three point back.

There was a former president who had a credibility problem when he lied to Congress. In those days, they called it "plausible deniability".

I'm afraid that it's too late to bring this DUI detail to the attention of the public. The so-called "dirty trick" is ill-timed. If it were going to work, it would have had to surface earlier. Gordon Liddy wouldn't have done it this way. He'd allow for more lead time.

It's a nasty business when you call someone a liar. It's a nasty thing to do and reflects poorly on the office of the presidency.

So much for honoring the highest office in the land.

I'll vote for Gore although I like Nader's policies, he wouldn't make a good pres IMHO. I consider him divisive.

Frank

I'm afraid the country is about to make a tragic mistake.

Frank

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: kendall
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 08:01 PM

A local lawyer whom I have met overheard a judge talking to a lawyer about Dubbyas arrest. He is a loose cannon in the democrat party, and, he went to the local Fox affiliate with the story. The reporter went to the Police in Kennebunkport, and the rest is history. I dont think it will hurt Bush, too late for that, and, anyway, we have had 8 years of a liar. Now we might have a liar and two boozers. We really do get what we deserve. I voted for Bradley.

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 07:49 PM

Michael Moore for president! That's an interesting open letter of his to Bushkin. I liked that bit about Bush claiming that his favourite book as a child was one that wasn't published until after he had graduated (which is something that seems to have less attention than Gore getting mixed up about which union song he was supposed to hear in his cradle).

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Greg F.
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 07:45 PM

No, Troll, the case CANNOT be argued from that nonsensical point of view. Please look at what you wrote. It means the RECORD was expunged. It doesn't un-do the ACT, for God's sake. And what does it matter "who broke the story"? It's not a "story", its an official public record.

Best, Greg

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Troll
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 06:49 PM

Kendall, if the arrest record was expunged, that means it is as if the arrest never happened. A small point, I know but the case could be argued from that point of view. Exactly who did break the story. you said it was a Maine newspaper?

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: kendall
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 06:42 PM

Doug, the thing I have against him is he lied.Then, he claimed the moral high ground. This makes him a hypocrite.I've said it before, I'll say it again..there is only one candidate who is qualified to run this country. Al Gore. He does not inspire respect or admiration in me, but, he is the best we have to be able to handle the job.

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: kendall
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 06:40 PM

Doug, the thing I have against him is he lied.Then, he claimed the moral high ground. This makes him a hypocrite.

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Troll
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 06:37 PM

If a reporter broke the story, why is the democratic candidate for governor of Maine taking credit for it. I have a feeling that all the facts aren't in yet.

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: M. Ted (inactive)
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 05:33 PM

The arrest was not exactly a matter of public record--it had been expunged--and the arrest details that Bush gave were not accurate, either--see the following, from Michael Moore's mail list:

>Delivered-To: [e-mail]
>Delivered-To: [e-mail]
>From: "Mike Mail"
>To:
>Subject: [Mike's Message] That's THREE Arrests for Bush -- How Many More?
>Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 02:10:58 -0800
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>X-Priority: 3
>X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
>X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200
>Sender: [e-mail]
>Precedence: bulk
>Reply-To: [e-mail]
> >THREE STRIKES AND YOU'RE OUT, MR. BUSH
> >November 3, 2000
> >Dear friends,
> >With the revelation last night of the drunk driving
>arrest and conviction in 1976 of George W. Bush,
>this marks the THIRD arrest -- that we know of --
>involving this man who would be President.
> >Let me ask you, the readers of this letter: How
>many times have YOU been arrested? Me, none.
>Most of you -- once? twice? This guy has been
>arrested AT LEAST THREE TIMES! How many
>people do you know have been arrested three
>times? Go ahead, do a quick count on your fingers.
>The answer? NONE!
> >Yet, we are being asked on Tuesday to vote for
>a man who has been arrested THREE TIMES.
>For President of the United States! Are they
>kidding? The Republicans must take us all for
>idiots.
> >The first arrest of George W. Bush was for
>theft at a hotel. The second arrest was for
>disorderly conduct at a football game. The
>third arrest, we've now learned, is for a very
>serious crime -- drunk driving. What's the next
>crime committed by George W. Bush that we
>will learn of? When will we learn it? It is time for
>everyone to demand the truth from Governor
>Bush. I'm telling you, we haven't heard the last of
>his criminal behavior.
> >But next Wednesday will be too late to find out.
> >The press should be ashamed of itself for its
>laziness. I cannot believe it took a young woman,
>Erin Fehlau -- at a FOX affiliate, no less -- up in
>Maine to stumble onto this story and do the
>necessary work to uncover it. Where have the
>big networks' investigative reporters been?
>
>I'll tell you where: ASLEEP AT THE WHEEL!
>
>After seeing this local Maine reporter on "Nightline"
>last night explain how a policewoman told her she
>overheard a conversation between a lawyer and a
>judge, and then the reporter started digging around
>and found out the facts, it was clear the story was
>not planted by the Gore campaign, as Bush and his
>people have been insinuating.
>
>The real story here is how did this conviction get
>covered up for so many years? I spoke to a lawyer
>last night familiar with these kinds of cases. She
>said that a D.U.I., in and of itself, is not something
>worth covering up. Had Bush revealed this himself,
>he would have found the public forgiving of his
>infraction.
> >No, my lawyer friend continued, the only reason
>to cover it up would be that there was something
>ELSE connected to the arrest that night -- e.g.,
>drugs or resisting arrest. This other potential charge
>could have been dropped and expunged. The
>reporter was shown only the court docket which
>listed Bush's name, address, and the charge to
>which he pleaded guilty. What we need to see
>is the actual POLICE REPORT from that night.
>Assuming it hasn't been doctored, that will tell us
>the truth
. >
>The Bush people have already lied about the
>nature of the D.U.I. arrest (they said the cop
>pulled Bush over because he was "driving too
>slowly"; the arresting officer last night said it
>was because Bush had "swerved off on the
>shoulder of the road"). Bush himself lied last
>night when asked about the night he spent in
>jail. "I didn't spend time in jail," he insisted. The
>officer told the local reporter that Bush, in fact,
>was handcuffed, taken to the station, and held
>in custody for at least an hour and a half.
> >This is not just some simple traffic ticket. I
>don't want to hear one word comparing this
>drunk driving conviction to Clinton's
>transgressions. Lying about consensual sex you
>had with another adult is NOT the same as
>getting behind the wheel of a car when you are
>drunk and endangering the lives of others
>(including the life of your own sister, Mr. Bush,
>who was in the car with you that night).
> >It is NOT the same as Gore volunteering he
>smoked pot in his youth. That act endangered no
>one's life and he did not try to cover it up.
> >And don't tell us that the drunk driving and the
>"drinking problem" was just a "youthful indiscretion."
>You were NOT a "youth" when you were in your
>THIRTIES on the night you were arrested while
>careening off the road. The fact is, according to your
>own admission (if not in these words), you were a
>drunk and a bum 'til the age of 40, living off your
>rich daddy who spent his time bailing you out of
>trouble.
> >For crying out loud -- if any Republican is reading
>this, I implore you: this man does not deserve to
>be placed in the highest and most respected office
>in the land! Bush voters, come to your senses! If
>you can't bring yourself to vote for Nader or Gore,
>then show your love for your country and just stay
>home next Tuesday.
> >Please, save our nation this incredible, unfolding,
>never-ending embarrassment.
> >Yours,
> >Michael Moore
>[e-mail]
>www.michaelmoore.com
> >P.S. Last night, just as the news was breaking about
>George W. Bush's arrest and conviction for driving
>while drunk, I sent out an open letter toGovernor Bush
>click on:www.michaelmoore.com/2000_11_02.html ,
>asking him to answer three questions which I believe
>affect our national security:
> >1. Are you, Mr. Bush, unable to read and write on an
>adult level?
> >2. Are you an alcoholic and, if so, how will this affect
>your performance as Commander-in-Chief?
> >3. You say that you have not committed any felonies
>since 1975. What felonies did you commit PRIOR to
>that date?
> >I implore our nation's media to demand answers to
>these questions before Tuesday's election. The people
>have a right to know.
> >P.P.S. "The Awful Truth" is pre-empted tonight. Our
>election special marathon is on Bravo, this Sunday
>afternoon, beginning at 4pm ET
>

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: GUEST,Stackley
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 05:25 PM

Doug, was wondering what became of you-this was really worth waiting for! I haven't laughed so hard in years!! What a flippin' hypocrite you are! go back and read yopur own posts, fer chrissakes. Your boy got caught with his hand in the cookie jar, fair and square and you're STILL trying to weasel him out of it. Bloody marvellous. You're a pip.
Cheers.

and I'll save you from having to append your usual witty reparteé- I know "its only my opinion".

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Troll
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 04:40 PM

Yes, McGrath, I know that Gore was instrumental in getting funding for the internet but he embellished his role just as he has in other instances. For example, he supported some changes in a major tax bill (something to do with capital gaines? I don't recall) and then claimed responsibility for the bill itself, which had passed two years BEFORE he was elected!
So you don't like Bush. Fine. No problem. I don't care very much for him either. So why not state the real reasons instead of flogging this dead horse?

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 04:25 PM

Surely all this goes to prove what a regular lad Bush is, tells lies to protect himself just like the rest of us. Only a Goody Two Shoes would ever own up to something like that until he'd been nailed...

Seems that Bushkin wins both ways. When he hasn't been caught lying, it's such a refreshing contrast to that rascally Al Gore (even when that Internet "lie" is confirmed as nothing of the kind) - and when he gets caught, that's just because he's human, and all the better for a few imperfections.

But how come all these pundits have been saying that Bush is the kind of bloke most red-blooded Americans would sooner have a drink with - but there's no way the man would ever have a drink anyway? And if he's got any sense, he would stay away from anywhere that regular drinking is going on. Which would include the White House, I suppose...

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Troll
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 04:05 PM

Mick. Agreed. But that's politics in this country and has been for a long time.Carter was probably the best example of what a President should be a insofar as character is concerned. He just wasn't real effective.
But he makes a helluvan ex-President.

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Big Mick
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 03:53 PM

Courage and integrity would have been to fess up before he got caught. If no one had ever found out, he would have never confessed, and would have continued to berate the Vice President for lack of moral courage and integrity. This is a shallow man, and his convictions run as deep as they need to to get elected. And more importantly, he is a hypocrite.

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: DougR
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 03:47 PM

I feel truly honored to be in a community where all of it's members are without sin! This thread reminds me of the preacher preaching to the believers.

I haven't read any comments from the majority contributing to this thread on the lies Gore has been caught telling. What about the Buddist Temple fund-raiser? "No legal authority?" Why don't you hold your candidate to the same standards you expect of Bush?

Bush didn't lie. He just didn't volunteer to reveal something that he knew would cause a feeding frenzy by the press. Since it was a matter of public record, and some enterprising investigative reporter had not reported it, the Bush folks may have figured that it wasn't that important. It certainly was a miscalculation if that's the case. That's about all you have seen on TV the past two days. I still wonder why the press hasn't spent even a small percentage of time investigating and reporting on Gore's transgressions that they hve spent on Bush, unless, there is some bias in the press.

Surely not.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: mousethief
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 03:06 PM

Again troll you have missed the point. Sure Gore prevaricates like a politician. But he hasn't made being Mr. Honesty the keystone of his campaign. Dubya with his "My opponent is a liar and I'm an honest guy" bullsh*t has finally been smoked out. He's a liar. I could accept that a lot easier if he hadn't been so holier-than-thou about being so goddamned honest.

Alex
O..O
=o=

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: kendall
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 02:48 PM

Right again Troll. We gotta quit agreeing..we might stagnate

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Troll
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 02:40 PM

OK. He lied. He thought he could get away with it and he didn't. But a lot of people are focusing on the DUI and the drinking problem as if thats a major flaw. To me, the fact that he COULD quit says a lot for his will-power. The fact that Bush was caught out doesn't make Al Gore any MORE honest,it simply proves what the less naive have always known:politicians lie.
Very few will admit it until they are caught. Some won't admit it then.
Take your choice.

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: kendall
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 02:29 PM

Troll BECAUSE HE LIED thats why. The creep flat out lied to a reporter. I heard him say he had not been arrested since 1968. Then he takes the moral high ground..damned hypocrite.
How could a public figure get away with that? How did JFK get away with it? He was high on pain killers during his whole time in office.
Furthermore, Clinton was cleared by republicans and democrats. Our own two senators, both republicans, voted against impeachment.

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: mousethief
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 02:24 PM

You've missed the point, troll. The point is not the dui, it's the mr. self-righteous, better-than-thou, squeaky-clean honest guy tone Dubya has been taking throughout the campaign. Then we find out he has made a big goof -- in fact in April of this year he told a reporter point-blank that he had not been arrested since 1968 (heard this on NPR). So he LIED. And after all this sh*t he's been dishing about Al's honesty, it's stomach-wrenching.

Funny how the Republicans said, about Clinton's tete-a-tete with Lewinsky, "it's not the sex it's the lying." And yet when it's a Republican in the same position (no pun intended), the lying is not the issue at all, it's the infraction, which was long ago and not all that bad so they suggest it doesn't matter.

You can't have it both ways. Is it the honesty, or isn't it?

Alex
O..O
=o=

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Troll
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 02:16 PM

Clinton got caught and lied about it all the way up to impeachment. But thats OK 'cause he's a Democrat and a liberal.
For your information, McGrath, I do not approve of driving while drinking. I think that ANYONE caught DUI should lose his/her license FOREVER and if they are ever caught behind the wheel again-except in police verifiable life or death situations- should do a long stretch in jail.
There are all sorts of ways that Bush could have tried to down-play that DUI; his spin-doctors could have worked on it. But he didn't. He simply said that yes, it happened, he wasn't proud of it,he quit drinking and lets move on.
What would you like; sackcloth and ashes? That he drop out in remorse? Maybe there IS more to be disclosed. Don't you think Al Gore has a task force working on that right now?
Why can't everyone give the man the benefit of the doubt. He made a mistake. He paid what the law required. He has, to all reports, quit drinking. If there were more to be disclosed, I think it would have come out by now.

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 01:43 PM

"Bush was found out and, to his credit, admitted it without trying to excuse or minimize it."

If you get found out and it's something that's a matter of public record, you don't have much option to admitting it. And of course he's been trying to minimise it - what is saying that it doesn't really matter but minimising it?

"That, to my way of thinking, takes courage."

Not courage. A lot of nerve, maybe. Or Chutzpah - yes, I think that's the most fitting word.

Still, I suppose the number of voters who've driven when they are drunk outnumbers the number who have had family members killed by drunk drivers, so I imagine he'll gain votes rather than lose them over this...

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Troll
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 01:27 PM

So you'll vote for a known liar instead; the inventor of the internet, the inspiration for "Love Story", the list goes on.
Bart, I agree. Bush should open up the files and come clean on everything. But even if he did, there are those who would not believe him. Gore has been less than candid in regard to fund raising. Who knows what else is there. One does not rise in the ranks of power without gathering a few skeletons along the way.
Kendall, you know as well as I do how hard it would be to hide alcohol or drug abuse for that many years in as public a figure as Bush has been, at least in Texas. No, I'm afraid that dog won't hunt.
But this thread does show one thing; that , at least in some peoples eyes " Once a drunk, always a drunk" and always under suspicion.

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 12:38 PM

I heard a telling quote from Bush regarding this story. He said "the American people know about me,and based on that they have made their decision...rather,are making their decisions."

As close as this election is,George seems to be thinking he's got it in the bag.Hey GW,remember Thomas E Dewey?

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: M. Ted (inactive)
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 12:34 PM

Troll--Is it more important that we select a competent leader to the most powerful position in the world, or it is more important that we give a recovering abuser a chance to prove that he's changed? Wait, let me change that, that we give a recovering liar a chance to prove that he's changed?

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: kendall
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 12:32 PM

How do we know he has been clean all these years? He lied about the conviction, why wouldn't he lie about being sober? He is a caught liar, and I dont trust him.

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Jim the Bart
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 12:14 PM

Troll - In my first post I said that it's not the OUI that matters now, it's how he has dealt with it and how he will deal with it's revelation. All he has to say is that there are no other surprises waiting to be sprung - and he can't do it. All I want to see for this to go away is CANDOR from the man who said "what you see is what you get". I see a guy who'e hiding something.

Assuming that Al has something to hide is totally unfair and uncalled for. I know plenty of people who have never even colored outside the lines and Al strikes me as that type (Although my sister says that he displays a lot more depth in private - I believe she recommended an interview in Redbook - than in his "candidate suit"). Some people don't have the kind of imagination that it takes to transgress, some people have the will power that it takes to resist. I think Al falls somewhere in between.

I commend GWB for getting sober, but he has put himself in a position where this won't be forgiven or forgotten until he 'FESSES UP.

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Lucius
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 12:04 PM

I've already disquallified myself from public office. I've never hoisted a moral standard, but if I did then I would expect to hang on it if I were caught. Its not just that he lied, its also that he made such a grand fuss over Al Gore's exaggerations.

Lucius

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Troll
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 11:36 AM

And of course Gore, et al, have NEVER driven while they were drinking and so are above reproach.
Yeah.Right!
I'll bet every one of us has something we wouldn't want our loved ones to find out about. Bush was found out and, to his credit, admitted it without trying to excuse or minimize it. That, to my way of thinking, takes courage. Should he have admitted it early on? Probably.
He has admitted to a drinking problem. Could he fall of the wagon? Of course. But whoever is elected could crack beneath the strain and START using drink or drugs to help them cope. The fact that he has been dry for years in the dog-eat-dog world of big business is a strong indicator that he WON'T crack.
Understand, I'm not voting for the man. I just want to see him get the fair shake that I would want for any recovering abuser.

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: kendall
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 09:29 AM

Well said Barry.

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: GUEST,Barry Finn
Date: 03 Nov 00 - 11:52 PM

I can't believe what's written here the man commited a crime that carries a jail sentence not when he was a kid but when he was 30. And I do have a problem with drunk drivers even if it's 20 or 40 years ago. Ask the loved ones of a victum if they've forgotten their loss. At least in some state you couldn't get a cabbie's licence or drive a bus or work a day care center if it involved driving kids WHY?????? But you can become president, you couldn't get hire by the CIA, the FBI, the AFT with that on your record no matter how long ago it happened but as president you can oversee them? He's had a drinking problem at least since his Animal House frat days that didn't stop until he turned 40, give me a break I wouldn't have the man helping my grandmother across the street. Clinton says "but I didn't inhale", he didn't get busted or endanger anyone except maybe himself & there were many that thought that this was enough to can his election OK so Bush drove drunk what's his come back "but I didn't kill". To have hid that from ones family speaks in it's self, never mind what he would'nt tell those he didn't know but still elected him. "Still it happened so long ago" PLEASE, it doesn't make it OK it it doesn't make it go away at 30 he should at least be held responsible for his actions or maybe we should postpone that responsibility until he's out of office. Yup, you're right I don't like the man & no I've never in my life driven drunk & I'm just about 50, & no I don't expect to get your vote nor do I want it but I'd rather see a career criminal in that office before him, they admit that they knew right from wrong when they're caught they knew the risks & they knew the consequences from the start & are prepared to take what's coming to them in the end & they don't do what they do out of weakness it's out of choice & you won't have to listen to them whin about getting caught or who spilled the beans & no fair because of timing & it's sinful to no present the truth when someone else is hiding it. There are many reasons (that goes twice because of his bad sense in chosing a running mate who's got the poor judgement to have 2 DWI's)why he wouldn't get my vote or my shoulder. First I'd hate to see what would become of us if the two of them couldn't take the heat & both fell off the wagon, not an unusual thing to happen (being a clean ex junkie for the past 25 yrs I can say I can qualify as being an expert on the falling off of wagons & turnip trucks & the like) second using family values & pro life as a running platform & he's endangered the lives of others, still sees the death sentence as an answer to those that get caught but can't buy their way out & then he can't even tell his own family what he's done. Next I don't think it possible to give the top 2 jobs to people who wouldn't be allowed to drive a truck or a cab or a bus or a crane or operate heavy equipment or hold the many jobs that the common folk have to work at if they had had the same offense lurking in their past. I'm not gonna keep at this any longer. Barry

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Bill D
Date: 03 Nov 00 - 11:31 PM

he is more than a 'fumblemouth'....so many of those quotes show a man who never bothered to 'learn' and who fakes his way through life with vague approximations. I can just imagine the translators at a summit conference trying to render his ramblings into Russian...

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Troll
Date: 03 Nov 00 - 10:32 PM

Yeah, Bill. He's a fumble-mouth all right. Good reason not to vote for him.

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Bill D
Date: 03 Nov 00 - 10:17 PM

and to me, the overall sense of what Bush IS and why I'd NOT vote for him is shown in this list of Bushisms ....wouldn't he and Quayle have made a team?

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: Big Mick
Date: 03 Nov 00 - 09:56 PM

And that quote is also in The New Republic. The issue isn't about whether or not he has a DUI/DWI/OUI. Remember the standard that they held President Clinton to? It wasn't the sex as much as he lied about it. When the reporter who was questioning him with regard to his arrest in 1968 for a college prank asked him if he had ever been arrested since them. His answer was an unambigous "No". Then he started to qualify it and his handler took him by the arm. He chose not to refute it. There is a line from Shakespeare that applies. "He doth protest too loudly". His hypocritical statements about integrity and honor as if Al Gore doesn't have it ring very loudly today. All he had to do was come clean and there would have been no problem.

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Nov 00 - 08:31 PM

The issue is more than what he did thirty years ago. When questioned by a Texas newspaper in 1996 he could have fessed up. "Have you been arrested since 1968?" His answer was NO. And he hass the gall to call Gore a liar.

Lucius

Subject: RE: BS: Dubbya, Gore and DUI
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 03 Nov 00 - 08:08 PM

Twentyish may be one thing, 30 is a little different. And driving when you're drunk is "a big deal".

Suppressing the truth when you're applying for a job is quite a big deal too. In fact it's justification for terminating the employment even when you've been given the job, let alone while you're still going through the selection process.