Rhythm in secondary level

Subject: Rhythm in secondary level
From: GUEST,Rachel
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 10:57 AM

How can we introduce effectively the concept of rhythm and of quarter, eighth ,half and whole notes to adolescent students of ages 13 up to 18 years olds????

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: catspaw49
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 11:03 AM

Relate it to drugs......Like a dime bag's a whole note and a nickel bag is a half note down to a roach being a 32nd note.

Sorry.....it was just laying there and I had to say it.................

Spaw

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: IanS
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 11:07 AM

Beat it into them.

Ian S

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: MMario
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 11:25 AM

yegads! If I recall correctly this was covered in 2nd grade when I was in school. and I don't remember how they did it.

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 11:49 AM

No shortcut as far as I know. Just the old One-Two-Three-Four. One-and,Two-and,Three-and,Four-and. One-tap-tap-tap, Two-tap-tap-tap, Three-tap-tap-tap, Four-tap-tap-tap.

I start to run out of silly noises to make after quarters!

Also helps if you can make the counts between the beats of a SLOW metronome.

I did start the submision as a serious one, honest, but just realised that I can't help myself (Phsychiatrist needed please)

And you don't get a much slower metroGnome than me after a few bottles of vin on the Paris underground....

Dave the Gnome

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: GUEST,Bill in Alabama
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 12:19 PM

Rachel-- I have a friend who was a middle-school music teacher until recently--I'll try to find out a suggestion from him. Keep checking this thread, or email me. you can find my address in the Mudcat Resources under Quick Links at the top of the page.

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: Sorcha
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 12:31 PM

It's basically fractions--ask the Math teacher for help here. Pies, you know? Whole note is a whole pie.....it's actually pretty easy.

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: Grab
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 12:35 PM

One-a-tap-a-tap-a-tap-a Two-a-tap-a-tap-a-tap-a...

Then some bugger speeds the metronome up.

Grab.

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: Bert
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 12:41 PM

Rap

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: Mark Clark
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 12:56 PM

Kids that age already know this, they simply aren't aware that they know it. The music they listen to every day is rhythmically sophisticated. Put on some rap or some popular dance music, get them up dancing and then stop them and get them to analyze their body motions. Show them how their bodies are subdividing the beat into rhythmic bits and they'll get it. Then give them a score that lines out their dance rhythms and they'll see it as well.

Just an idea.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: bflat
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 01:10 PM

I am wondering if I could start a bit of thread creep here? I am going to be bringing one of my good guitars and two of my knockabout guitars to a group of 9 and 10 year olds, at their school, who have various developmental problems. My friend is the special needs teacher of the group and she feels the music and hands on would be enjoyed by the kids. I have a few ideas but this place is such a furtile field for ideas that I thought I would ask for your help. Anyone have prior experience? What works and what doesn't. My friend and I could see the possibility of this becoming a regular enrichment to their studies. There are also two full times aides in this classroom.

Ellen

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: Sorcha
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 01:17 PM

bflat, I have taken instruments into schools a lot. My advice--take junkers. Do NOT let them touch your good guitar. Do not let them touch instruments unsupervised. Make them take turns--line them up and have one aide help you and the other mind those waiting a turn. If you can do one on one, that is great, but never more than 2 kids to one adult and instrument.

Guitars are difficult for small hands. I usually use 1/2 size violins, lap dulcimers and lap harps. Do not take any percussion instruments unless you want to go bonkers very soon. Uh, I know I will think of other stuff. Oh, stash a bottle of booze at home.....you will need it when you get there!

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: bflat
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 01:45 PM

Sorcha, great ideas. I read your post with such speed that I found myself dizzy without the booze. Very funny at the end. Thanks.

Ellen

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: AllisonA(Animaterra)
Date: 12 Jan 01 - 02:01 PM

Rachel- watch the "Stomp Out Loud" video if you can find it- it's got some great examples of rhythm patterns ranging from easy to complex. I have done some of the ball-bouncing and recycled percussion activities with grade 5, but they would apply to older kids as well.
Create "rap" rhymes (I can't believe I'm saying this!) and have the kids notate them. You'll have to notate the first simple ones, and you'll want to teach dotted and syncopated rhythms as soon as you can. Good luck!

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: John P
Date: 13 Jan 01 - 09:21 AM

Get them in a drum circle (I can't believe I'm saying this).

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: Bernard
Date: 13 Jan 01 - 09:30 AM

Bum titty bum titty bum titty bum...

Aaaargh! Infected with 'Spaw disease....

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: AllisonA(Animaterra)
Date: 13 Jan 01 - 04:13 PM

There's actually a great World Music Percussion curriculum recently out; if you email me at school I can get you the info: [e-mail]
It doesn't teach notation, but gives the kids a great sense of rhythm!

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 13 Jan 01 - 11:09 PM

I have a friend who is an excellent piano teacher. She taught me some things which I use with adults.

1. Counting and math work for long notes (quarter and longer). Shorter than that, use syllables, because music is based on speech, not math.

2. Get a regular beat going. For quarter notes, say "Coke," getting one syllable per beat. A quarter and two eighths are "Coke pizza" (Make sure the pizza fits in one beat) Four eighths are "Henrietta". Waltz time is "wonderful". Six eights (jig) are "one lolly, two lolly." But six eights in a waltz are "Henrietta Evans." To do a triplet, squeeze "wonderful" into one beat.

3. If anybody has a good way to teach dotted notes, I want to hear about it.

This is an effective and accepted way to teach rhythm. It is based on the work of a man named Carl Orff. My local university offers Orff workshops every summer. So if you try it, and people sneer, just tell them that.

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: GUEST,MusicLaw
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 10:33 AM

If you want them to learn note values teach them to tap their foot when they listen or play. 4 foot taps: whole note 2:Half note 1: quarter note. a pair of eighths: one when your foot is down, the other when your foot is up. a dotted quarter: down-up-down.

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: GUEST,Rachel
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 06:21 PM

I would like to teach them dances rhythms like: 9/8 quarter, dotted quarter, quarter, quarter and like: 7/8 dotted quarter, quarter, quarter. But I must certainly first teach them rhythm because most of the students do know about music. And yes I would have to go through dotted and syncopated rhythms. Help!!! how can I teach them this??? Here's what I came out of all this. Thank you all for your advice:

1) Dots on the board and they clap eight times to the dots all together.

2) Music can be divided into equal measures. Make the eight dots quarter and divide the eight notes into two measures.

3) When we clap ONCE for each note, we call it clapping the RHYTHM.

4) I call out a student. I play quarter notes on a drum and the student walks and claps to the rhythm of the drum.

5) Another student walks twice as fast with smaller steps to the rhythm of eighth notes which I play on the drum.

6) I explain that when the second student walks with smaller and faster steps we symbolize that with |-|and we say Ti-Ti.

7) Explain the concept of time signature

8) When we are at a 4/4 tim signature then one beat of the pulse equals with 1 quarter (show a quarter note). Like a quarter of a pie. 4 pieces of pie make a whole pie. Likewise we need to have 4 quarters in a measure, the upper number of the time signature tells us, so that we can have a whole measure, a whole pie.

9) When 4/8 the 8, the lower number of the time signature, then the eighth note is a quarter of a pie. 4 eighth notes makes us a whole measure or 4 quarters of a pie make us a whole pie.

9) When 9/8 we neef 9 eighth notes to make us a whole measure the pie.

10) When we habe 7/8 we need 7 eighth notes to make a whole measure, a whole pie.

11) Show quarter and say it equals with 2 eighth notes. The dotted quarter equals with three eighth notes.

12) Everybody then claps the four dance rhythms A)

12) Then hand out the papers with the dance rhythyms. A) 9/8 quarter, dotted quarter, quarter, quarter B) 7/8 dotted quarter, quarter, quarter C) 2/4 Quarter quarter, eighth eighth eighth eighth D) 9/8 Quarter quarter quarter dotted quarter

13) Divide class in four groups to practice their own group rhythm.

14) Perform their rhythms and record. Playback. Discuss performance.

15) Listen 4 different dances. Find which music suitable for their group's rhythmic pattern.

16) Play rhythms each group with the suitable for their group music as an ostinato rhythm over and over again

17) Have them notate the rhythms of the music they hear.

CAN ANYONE GIVE SOME FEEDBACK FOR THE ABOVE LESSON PLAN PLEASE? Is it too complicated?

Many Thanks!!!

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: Snuffy
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 07:04 PM

In Ireland (and England) 9/8 is usually 3 dotted quarters, or 3 x quarter+eighth, not 3 quarters and a dotted one (i.e. only three beats in the bar, not 4)

Plenty of slip-jigs (Rocky Road to Dublin, The Foxhunt) or country dances (Sir Roger de Coverley). I've heard tell that tunes in this triple rhytm tend to be much older than a lot of 4/4, 2/4 or 6/8 tunes, but I can't prove it.

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: AllisonA(Animaterra)
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 08:07 PM

Rachel, that's an awful lot to learn in one lesson! I would suggest sticking with quarter and eighth notes for one lesson, time signatures for the next, dotted rhythms for the next- and even that's loading them down with a lot of info in a little time. Younger students, at least, need a few lessons for the info to sink in and stay in, before moving on to the next concept. The activities sound great- but is this a one-day workshop or a semester-long class?

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: AllisonA(Animaterra)
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 08:08 PM

BTW, sorry if I sound like a scolding older teacher; I just started my new student teacher and I'm in "cooperating teacher"mode at the moment!

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: Marion
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 08:14 PM

Hello bflat! First, here is an old thread that may interest you: Music and the mentally handicapped

I'm an assistant at a L'Arche community so I spend a lot of time in musical play with people with learning disabilities, and I give private guitar lessons to two people with Down's Syndrome.

Here are some suggestions for activities:

- cooperative guitar: you finger the chords, they strum. You might try pausing the singing if they pause the strumming, to encourage them to keep up the rhythm.

- tune the guitars to open chords (I usually use open G: DGDGBD) so that when someone is strumming without fretting the sound is more enjoyable.

- if you have three guitars, tune one to open G, one to open D, and one to open A. Then you can form an orchestra - sing a song in D and conduct by pointing to who should be strumming during each bar.

- slides! The folks I work with love slides, just to mess around with and enjoy the different sound. Also, if the guitar is tuned to an open chord, the slide can be used as a simple (if not great-sounding) way to change chords. Mark the fifth and seventh frets on the edge of the fretboard with stickers, and you've got another way to play those wonderful three-chord songs.

- if people are shy about singing, they might be more willing to participate if you leave out the last word in each line and pause until someone sings it. There's an autistic man in my community who loves doing this and has a small repertoire of songs that he requests and then fills in words for. Interestingly, he never sings the very last word of any song - I'm guessing that that's because helping me sing the other lines will cause me to continue the song, so he's "rewarded" for supplying the word, but there's nothing in it for him to end the song.

- if some of your people have physical disabilities as well, you'll have to be creative in helping them to play the instruments somehow. There's an elderly man in our community who was once a VERY avid fiddler, but cannot play his fiddle any more because of his physical deterioration. So I put his bow into his right hand, then I hold up the fiddle against the bow, and make a U with my thumb and index finger around the bow and against the fiddle body so that his bow can't go wild. When he has the energy he moves the bow, and when he doesn't I rub the fiddle against the bow. It sounds terrible, but it makes him happy, and that's what it's all about.

I'll add more if I can think of more - good luck!

Marion

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: Mark Clark
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 08:44 PM

When I think of teaching rhythm to young people, I think first of Ella Jenkins who devoted a great deal of her time to the problem. Here is an Ella Jenkins discography that includes a number of great recordings for teaching rhythm to young people.

Don't know why I didn't think of that earlier.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: Lox
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 09:09 PM

Show them a clock

1 hour = 60 minutes

1 minute = 60 seconds

Its about measuring time - accurately

tick tick tick etc

lox

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: GUEST,Jeremy J Woodland
Date: 15 Jan 01 - 01:32 PM

An effective way they teach youngsters in the Suziki method is using words and sylables that relate to rhythm Here are the basic ones.. Quarter note- "ta" 2 eighth notes- "ti ti" a triplet- tri-o-let 4 sixteenth- te-ri-te-ri

The most effective way ive found for kids is to have them verbally recite the above rhythm sounds while tapping on a desk or something

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: GUEST,Rachel
Date: 16 Jan 01 - 12:56 PM

Guest leeneia:

Which is your local University which offers Orff workshops?

Yes. If anybody has a good way to teach dotted notes, I also want to hear about it.

Thanks

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: GUEST,Susi
Date: 16 Jan 01 - 08:00 PM

For a good tip on dotted quarter notes, see the post from Music Law (above) on January 14th.

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: Marion
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 06:47 PM

Bflat, are you still checking this thread?

A few more comments:

About the safety of my instruments: my policy is to let people use my good instruments, except for one man who is obsessed with smashing guitars and has destroyed at least three (not mine!). However, I only let children or people with learning disabilities play my instruments if I am close at hand to supervise with my hands free. For example, I don't let someone play my guitar while I'm playing fiddle because if I suddenly want to protect my guitar it takes some time for me to put my fiddle and bow down in a secure way. Depending on the individual playing, I might keep one hand on the instrument. I find it hard to get children and people with disabilities to keep their hands off my bow hairs, and one woman likes to taste the bow hairs, but I've decided that this is a risk I can live with in order to be able to share my instruments. I guess it's up to you what risks you can accept.

Another suggestion: if someone isn't charmed by the instrumental play you might be able to get them involved with the right lyrics.

There is a man in my house who hates music, or so he thinks: he is stolidly indifferent to dance and instrumental play, and when anyone starts to sing or hum he says "Stop it! I hate that."

But then I discovered a little ditty about a favourite subject of his (rubber boots) and sang it to him, and he's crazy about it. Whenever he sees me with my guitar or singing something he says "Rubber boots! Rubber boots!" and then suggests people and objects as I'm singing and I work his suggestions into the verses. Heck, now I can bribe him with music ... "I'll sing to you when you're done getting dressed." Quite a conqest, I thought.

Marion

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: Marion
Date: 07 Feb 01 - 11:40 PM

Refresh for bflat

Subject: RE: Rhythm in secondary level
From: bflat
Date: 20 Feb 01 - 12:22 PM

Marion,

Thank you for the PM and the suggestions. It occured to me that I could locate this thread again by checking on my posts. These are wonderful ideas and I will use and reflect as they are appropriate. What great experiences for you. I too just want to share the joy of music with others and the opportunity for them to perhaps make some of their own is my joy.

Many, many thanks.

Ellen