Divide chorus into two parts

Subject: Divide chorus into two parts
From: GUEST,Tonia
Date: 01 Feb 01 - 12:19 PM

Hello. Anybody knows a clever way to divide a chorus to two parts? How can I get them into two parts-lower and higher parts? Shall I listen to each child individually and put each child into the two parts? But this will consume a lot of rehearsal time. So how do I do that?

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: black walnut
Date: 01 Feb 01 - 12:25 PM

Tonia, what kind of singing group are you talking about? How many are in it? What age group is involved? What kind of song is it? .....

~black walnut

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: GUEST,Tonia
Date: 01 Feb 01 - 12:31 PM

The chorus consists of elementary age children (6 years to 11 years old). There are about 20 or less children. The song is about a cat and says Niaou niaou one cat with pink nose. And the other song is about a secret that the singer wants to keep it for herself.

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: GUEST,Tonia
Date: 01 Feb 01 - 12:50 PM

The song with the cat is in the "Cha-cha" style and singers sing "Cha-cha-cha" very frequently in the song. Thanks.

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: black walnut
Date: 01 Feb 01 - 12:50 PM

From what you've told me, if it were me, I'd teach the whole group both parts. Spend an equal amount of time on both parts. I'd divide the group into two equal sections only after everyone felt very, very comfortable with each part when sung on its own. Two part singing requires much repetition on the single lines so that when two parts are put together, each group can sing with equal confidence and not be thrown by the other section. Dwell on the helping the children to really get to know the music, rather than on you spending time listening to individual voices. Teach the words and the music by rote, and divide your chorus into sections only when the group is quite ready.

Any other ideas/opinions from other 'catters....?

~black walnut

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: Allan C.
Date: 01 Feb 01 - 01:07 PM

When I was a child of about that age, the group was divided for the first time into two groups for a similar purpose. However, my teacher did not begin in the way BW describes above - and which I think is a wonderful idea. The division was simple. We practiced in the auditorium seating area. Usually, we took up the first two rows of the center section. The choir teacher simply gave one part to the first row and the other part to those in the second. But she told us that if anyone had any difficulty in reaching the notes of either part, they were to let her know and she would consider changes. There were a few changes after the first few attempts on the song. But after that no time was wasted in practicing the song.

The song, BTW, was "The Ash Grove".

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: mousethief
Date: 01 Feb 01 - 01:12 PM

Play the lowest note in the low part. Ask the children to sing it. Those who can, raise their left hand. Now play the highest note in the high part. Ask the children to sing it. Those who can, raise their right hand. Have any children who are only raising one hand to stand to the left or right. Divide the children raising both hands in such a way as to make the groups even. Children raising neither hand, treat as BW suggests above.

It's a thought.

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From:
Date: 01 Feb 01 - 01:31 PM

I agree with black walnut's suggestion. The worst thing that can happen to the children is that they learn twice as much music. Also, you won't have any problems with trying to keep one group quiet while you're teaching the other group their part. As far as dividing them later, the girls should be able to sing either part at that age. If your boys' voices are unchanged, they should too. The suggestion about raising hands could be interesting to try. Theoretically, at this age you should be able to divide based upon QUALITY of the voice and not so much on RANGE. Put those who sound nice on the high part on that part, and those who sound nice on the low on the low. You can listen to them as they all sing each part. Those who are versatile can rove.

cinn

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: black walnut
Date: 01 Feb 01 - 01:34 PM

i've taught choirs before, and i guess i'm approaching this a bit differently than whether or not the children can hit the high or low notes. i don't know who this group is, who they are performing for, or how much experience tonia has in teaching music, but i am thinking that the whole song will sound better and the children will enjoy singing it more if they know it really well....and by knowing it i mean the notes, the rhythms, the words....

untrained children's voices can have quite a limited range, and just the act of singing freely and openly will stretch the range considerably. the range can be more limited on a day when a child is tired or unwell or just screamed at a hockey game or is unhappy or tense or is not really concentrating for any reason. i don't think it's overly helpful to think too much about the highest and lowest notes of the parts, at least not when first starting to teach the song. i think it's more important to make sure that here are at least a couple of strong, enthusastic and happy kids, who like to sing,on each part. they'll be the fuel for the fire!

~ black walnut

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: AllisonA(Animaterra)
Date: 01 Feb 01 - 02:11 PM

Black walnut, I'm with you. I have a lot of experience with a. choirs and b. singing with children and you've hit the nail on the head.
Other considerations:
Is the music accompanied or un? If so, who is doing the accompanying, you or someone else? If you, will you be able to cue from the piano or whatever instrument?
If you are blessed with a good accompanist, one thing I often do when starting to split the two groups is have the accompanist play with one part while I sing the part of the other side, then switch.
Keep drilling it over and over again, but to keep it from getting tedious, add little challenges, such as dynamics, watching the director for cut-offs, pronunciation of final consonents (the infernal s and t sounds have to be crisp and simultaneous)- make it a game to watch you, so you don't trick them this time!
Practice sitting, then do your first "performance" which just means standing as if in front of an audience, hands at their sides, heads forward, staring at you - at which point I whip out a nutty hat or nose mask or something unexpected which makes them want to stare in disbelief if nothing else! (this is less effective if the song is quiet and serious- great for a song where they need to smile throughout!)
Most important, you need to show how much you love the music, and how great they sound, and how much better they were this time, and how super they look, and so on.
Have fun! In my book, there's nothing more rewarding then getting kids to sing well and enjoy themselves doing it!

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: black walnut
Date: 01 Feb 01 - 02:22 PM

well said, 'terra!

~'nut

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: GUEST,Tonia
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 05:10 AM

Dear black walnut

How do yourself teach by rote?

Tonia

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: black walnut
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 07:15 AM

What I mean is that you would teach the song without giving them words or notes on paper. Maybe you would sing a line, they sing it back to you, then you sing it again, they sing it back to you, then you sing it again and add a bit more, they sing it back to you....that kind of idea.
There are lots of ways to have fun with that kind of teaching.

~black walnut

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: AllisonA(Animaterra)
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 03:22 PM

I don't try to teach chorus any other way than by rote. I have "general music class" for note reading, sight screaming, ear straining, etc. Chorus is for sound production, listening to the group as a whole, and singing for the joy of it most of all.

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: GUEST,Tonia
Date: 03 Feb 01 - 08:18 AM

Dear blakc walnut

Can you explain me what is the item "Voices" which is highlighted under your name thread?

Tonia

Subject: RE: Divide chorus into two parts
From: Snuffy
Date: 03 Feb 01 - 09:48 AM

Black Walnut didn't put that green clicky thing in - the Mudcat did. You'll see lots of them underneath people's name in various threads here. Click on it and find out why!

Wassail! V