Lyr Req: Schooldays Over?/Schooldays End (MacColl)

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Schooldays Over?/Schooldays End (MacColl)
From: GUEST,Charles Macfarlane
Date: 23 Nov 18 - 09:01 AM

Where else on the web can you reply to a post that's almost 20 years old ?-)

> From: Liam's Brother
> Date: 28 Oct 99 - 10:44 AM
>
> The original label was Argo, as I recall.

Yes, that's right. I have here a digitised copy of my old vinyl "The World Of Ewan MacColl & Peggy Seeger", Argo, SPA-A 102, Decca. I also scanned and transcribed the cover, which gives a list of their other recordings on Argo:

THE BALLAD OF JOHN AXON, RG 474 mono
SINGING THE FISHING, RG 502 mono
THE BIG HEWER, RG 538 mono
THE FIGHT GAME, RG 539 mono
THE TRAVELLING PEOPLE, DA 133 mono
ON THE EDGE, DA 136 mono
THE ANGRY MUSE, ZDA 83 stereo, DA 83 mono
THE AMOROUS MUSE, ZDA 84 stereo, DA 84 mono
A MERRY PROGRESS TO LONDON, ZDA 46 stereo, DA 46 mono
SWEET THAMES FLOW SOFTLY, ZDA 47 stereo, DA 47 mono
PEGGY ALONE, ZDA 81 stereo, DA 81 mono

However, I don't have any of these others, only "World Of ...", and it doens't have 'Schooldays O'er' but has some others from the various Radio Ballads. For anyone who's interested, here are the sleeve notes for the tracks:

SIDE ONE

DIRTY OLD TOWN
Written by Ewan MacColl in 1946 for a Theatre workshop production, 'LANDSCAPE WITH CHIMNEYS', a documentary play about Salford, Lancs.

THE MANCHESTER RAMBLER
Written by Ewan MacColl in 1933, and became the official song of the Ramblers Federation. Since then it has travelled as far as the logging camps of British Columbia, where the words have been adapted to suit the logging industry.

THE FIRST TIME EVER I SAW YOUR FACE
Written by Ewan MacColl in 1958, this song has been sung by at least a dozen popular groups and singers.

FREEBORN MAN
Written by Ewan MacColl in 1966 for a radio-ballad entitled 'THE TRAVELLING PEOPLE', this song has since passed into the folk tradition and is sung by gypsies and travellers in Scotland, England and Ireland.

SPACE GIRL
Written by Ewan MacColl in 1952 for a short ballad-opera, to be performed by Theatre Workshop, entitled 'YOU'RE ONLY YOUNG ONCE'.

BLACK VELVET BAND
A traditional song, from the singing of Harry Cox, agricultural labourer from Catfield, Norfolk.

THE BIG HEWER
Written in 1961 for a BBC documentary radio-ballad on coalminers, 'THE BIG HEWER'.


SIDE TWO

THE SHOALS OF HERRING
Written in 1961 by Ewan MacCo11 for a radio-ballad on the herring fishing, entitled 'SINGING THE FISHING'.

MAIDS, WHEN YOU'RE YOUNG
A traditional song, collected from Sam Larner of Winternon, Norfolk, in 1961.

THIRTY-FOOT TRAILER
Written by Ewan MacCol1 in 1966 for the radio-ballad, 'THE TRAVELLING PEOPLE'.

PEGGY GORDON
Learned by Peggy Seeger from Elizabeth Cotton, a North Carolina negro woman, this song became very popular in 1959 and 1960.

POOR PADDY WORKS ON THE RAILWAY
A traditional song, collated by Ewan MacCol1 in 1952 from two separate versions.

BALLAD OF SPRINGHILL
The Springhill mining disaster of 1958 was the first to receive world-wide television coverage. Ewan and Peggy saw it during a visit to Paris and this song - a joint composition - was the result.

SWEET THAMES FLOW SOFTLY
Written for an experimental production by the Critics Group, based on ROMEO AND JULIET, which was broadcast to schools in May 1966.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Schooldays Over?/Schooldays End (MacColl)
From: GUEST,threelegsoman
Date: 23 Nov 18 - 02:57 AM

I uploaded this song on YouTube in 2009:
12-string Guitar: Schooldays Over

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Schooldays Over?/Schooldays End (MacColl)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 22 Nov 18 - 06:46 PM

MacColls song was bsed on actuality recordings of Miners
If you listen to 'The Big Hewer' you will here a miner describing his first day at the pit basically that it was what the song is about
I've seen the same claimed of 'Shoals of Herring'
While none of these songs actually sound like folk songs, their genius lies in the fact that they all use the vernacular of the people involved - road workers, miners, fishemen, Travellers....
It's all there in the preparatory field recordings, which, as far as I know, are housed in the Charles Parker Archive in Birmingham Central Library
We have some of it here in our own archive
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Schooldays Over?/Schooldays End (MacColl)
From: Richard Mellish
Date: 22 Nov 18 - 05:22 PM

An instance of McColl's skill is his use of different names and terms for the job in the three verses. John is starting as a pitman (Northeast England), Dai as a miner (South Wales), and Jim as a collier (Scotland). But I've heard singers mix these up, having presumably failed to perceive the significance.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Schooldays Over?/Schooldays End (MacColl)
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Nov 18 - 09:57 PM

Hello folks. I know this song is credited to Ewan, and I'm disputing that in any way but an Irish ballad singer once told me that the Ewan version of Schooldays Over was actually based upon, or "borrowed" from, an old Welsh mining song. If anyone knows anything about that, please let me know. The name Dai is, according to some, an old Welsh name. Not that that would be enough to go on! Cheers!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Schooldays Over?/Schooldays End (MacColl)
From: harmonic miner
Date: 05 Jul 12 - 08:56 AM

Oh, sorry to hear that Michael.
And thanks Dave for your reply

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Schooldays Over?/Schooldays End (MacColl)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 05 Jul 12 - 06:15 AM

But alas Guest, no use addressing questions @ Sandy Paton: he has been dead for three years!.

~Michael~

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Schooldays Over?/Schooldays End (MacColl)
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 05 Jul 12 - 05:39 AM

Sark is normally a shirt in general, as in 'Cutty Sark', a short shift or shirt, though like all words it can take on specific local meetings.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Schooldays Over?/Schooldays End (MacColl)
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Jul 12 - 04:30 AM

By the way, the song was recently performed by The Chieftains with The Low Anthem on the Dave Letterman show (see Utube)!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Schooldays Over?/Schooldays End (MacColl)
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Jul 12 - 04:28 AM

@Sandy Paton
Date: 26 Oct 99 - 07:59 PM

Is a 'sark' a specific type of shirt, or a local word for a shirt in general? Just curious - the old interweb onl comes up with references to the Channel Island!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Schooldays Over?/Schooldays End (MacColl)
From: GUEST,kAREN Woods Duffy
Date: 09 Oct 10 - 10:56 AM

I haven't read all the responses here so apologies if I am a bit late with this info. The song has been recorder by Damien Dempsey and I think there is probably a Clancy Brothers recording as well as the Dubliners but definitely you can try Damien Dempsey on his album 'The Rocky Road' a great artist if you haven't discovered him already.....

Subject: RE: searching:
From:
Date: 31 Jan 00 - 08:15 AM

Thank you very much Wolfgang !

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Wolfgang
Date: 21 Jan 00 - 08:14 AM

here Wolfgang

Subject: RE: searching:
From: GUEST,Remi from Paris
Date: 20 Jan 00 - 10:50 PM

Also recorded by the much regreted Luke Kelly on "Luke Kelly and friends" and "Luke Kelly - worker's songs".

Subject: RE: searching:
From:
Date: 20 Jan 00 - 10:51 AM

Hi everybody !!

I am a french student, and am looking for the words of the song "School Days Over", sung by Mary BLACK (CD : "Song for Ireland"), just because, as a french, I don't understand everything. Does anybody fnow where I can find it ?

Thanks !

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Ewan McVicar
Date: 29 Oct 99 - 09:30 AM

Another fine recording of this was made by Mary Black. Much recommended, though she turns anthracite into atracite.

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Liam's Brother
Date: 28 Oct 99 - 10:44 AM

The original label was Argo, as I recall.

We were talking not too long ago about the fact that the folk-styled songs of certain composer-singers are often sung better by others than by the composer. That was hardly the case with Ewan MacColl. He was something!

All the best,
Dan Milner

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Bugsy
Date: 28 Oct 99 - 06:13 AM

Slight threadcreap here (or Creapthread?) Sandy's post reminds me of the pianist in the restaurant that always used to sing "Eva".....

"Eva picture paints a thousaned words......"

cheers

Bugsy

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Graham Pirt
Date: 28 Oct 99 - 05:51 AM

Hi Louis

Nice to see you on Mudcat. Hope you're keeping well and look forward to seeing you sometime

Graham

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Jack (Who is called Jack)
Date: 27 Oct 99 - 12:33 PM

Here's the chords as I know em, in a key I can sing. Ye might have ter bump it up or down 'less yer a deep baritone like me.

Schooldays (C) over, come (Am) on the John (Dm) Time to be gettin' yer (F) pit boots (G) on (C) On with yer sark and yer (Am) moleskin (Em) trousers (Am) Time you were (Em) on (Am) yer (G) way. (C) Time you were learnin' a (Am) pit mans job and (Dm) Earnin' a pit man's (G) pay

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 26 Oct 99 - 07:59 PM

That's not a "sack" in the first verse, however. It's a "sark" (shirt). I've heard a lot of the words of this song misunderstood. One singer I know used to sing "hip boots" instead of "pit boots," etc.

Good to see you're checking up on us, Lou! You can and, I hope, will contribute a great deal of value to this forum.

Sandy

Subject: RE: searching:
From: lamarca
Date: 26 Oct 99 - 02:21 PM

Topic has re-released CD editions of all 8 of the Radio Ballads; Wally Macnow at Camsco.com has them. They are truly wonderful, and a must-listen for anyone planning to perform one of Ewan's songs, as you will understand the background, history and emotion behind the songs much better after hearing them interwoven with the words of the people he was writing about!

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Jack (Who is called Jack)
Date: 26 Oct 99 - 01:06 PM

I got chords at home. I'll dig em out and post.

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Doctor John
Date: 26 Oct 99 - 12:38 PM

Dave Burland does a wonderful version of this; I have an air shot but don't know if he recorded it. Dr John

Subject: RE: searching:
From:
Date: 26 Oct 99 - 01:08 AM

The song "School Days Over" was written by Ewan McColl. Do you know the chords perhaps? And if you do, could you be kind enough to e-mail them? Thanks much - John DeSantis

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Wolfgang
Date: 04 Feb 98 - 10:21 AM

Dick Gaughan does it on "True and Bold"

Subject: RE: Schoolday's End
From: Al B
Date: 04 Feb 98 - 09:50 AM

Dick Gaughan does a wonderful version of this. Have a look on his hom epage for details. Unfortunately I do not have it with me at the momant.

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Bruce O.
Date: 03 Feb 98 - 01:04 PM

Louis, If you want a long text of a very old Northumberland ballad, "Go to the kye with me Johnny", from a Scots MS of the 1740's reply 'yes' to [e-mail] so I can get an e-mail address for you and sent it on. The song is set a little west of Newcastle. Dave Harker's edition of John Bell's Newcastle MSS has a fragment, as do a couple of Scots works, and only tune I know of came from a Scots work. [I have not gotten ahold of an edition of the Atkinson MS, which could conceivable have a Northumberland tune for it.]

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Bruce O.
Date: 03 Feb 98 - 12:43 PM

Louis, someone asked me about a month ago if I knew what had happened to you. I said as far as I knew you were still on Bain. Is. My sister moved away from there about 2 years ago. (I'm originally from Bremerton.)

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Louis Killen
Date: 03 Feb 98 - 04:26 AM

Here's a little more information on "School Days Over" It was written by Ewan MacColl for his radio ballad "The Big Hewer" broadcast on the BBC in 1961. I had the great honor and pleasure of performing in that program and sang the first verse. The 2nd was sung by Ewan and the third by A.L.(Bert)Lloyd. In between the verses was "actuality" - sounds of men and boys talking about what it was like to go down into the pit for the first time. The program was eventually released on a Decca subsidiary whose name escapes me at the moment but it was the same that put out a couple of Peter Bellamy's records (perhaps some other can supply the name). It might be possible to get it from Decca or the BBC. It was a good program and ranked up there with "Singing the Fishing" and "The Travelling People", both of which supplied great songs to the folk movement. Listen to Ian Robb on his CD ( the one before "Finest Kind") singing "Go Down", also from the "Big Hewer"

Subject: RE: searching:
From:
Date: 17 Jan 98 - 05:31 AM

Thank you Susan!

Subject: RE: searching:
From: Susan of DT
Date: 16 Jan 98 - 06:39 PM

It's in the database under "Schooldays End" or search for pitman's

Subject: searching: "school days over"
From:
Date: 16 Jan 98 - 03:45 PM

I'm looking for the song "school days over" sung i. E. by the early Dubliners. Sounds like: "School days over, come on then John, time to getting your pit-boots on. On with your sack and your moleskin trousers, it's time you'll be on your way, time you will learning the pitman's job and earning the pitman's pay"

Anyone can help me? Thanx a lot!