Origins: Froggy Went A-Courtin'

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: Joe_F
Date: 21 Sep 04 - 06:30 PM

There are two versions in _Rise Up Singing_ -- one under "Froggie Went a-Courtin'", which finishes them off with a cat *and* a snake, and a modern one by Leslie Haworth under "Here's to Cheshire, Here's to Cheese", with a jolly chorus that contrasts ever more poignantly with the turn of events. It ends

Well, this is the end of him and her
Ding dang dong go the wedding bells
Won't be no tadpoles covered in fur
Ding dang dong go the wedding bells

Here's to Cheshire, here's to cheese
Here's to the pears and the apple trees
And here's to the lovely strawberries
Ding dang dong go the wedding bells

Pete Seeger sang that one, and I like it a lot.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Mar 07 - 02:02 PM

Does anyone know if a version of Froggy went a-courtin' by Shug Fisher exists??...I'm referring to the version he sang on Tom & Jerry's Pecos Pest cartoon....
I know Shug was a member of the Sons of the Pioneers and there is a cd called the Teleway transcriptions that has a version on it...but I'm not sure if Shug sings it.....any help out there please??

Travis

Subject: ADD: Mouse on the Hill
From: Joe Offer
Date: 10 Oct 08 - 01:51 AM

This is a very unusual version of "Froggy" - no frog.

MOUSE ON THE HILL

There was an old mouse that live on the hill, uh-hunh,
There was an old mouse that live on the hill, uh-hunh,
There was an old mouse that live on the hill,
He was rough and tough like a Buffalo Bill,
Uh-hunh, uh-hunh, uh-hunh.

One day he said he was going for a ride...
With his sword and pistol by his side...

Well, he rode up to Missus Mousie's door...
And he knocked and he knocked 'til his fist got sore...

Well, I asked Missus Mousie would she marry me....
All she said, Just wait and see....

Missus Mousie says I can't do that...
You have to ask my Brother Rat...

Brother Rat had gone to town...
To buy Missus Mousie her wedding gown...

The wedding was said on the big oak tree (?)...
They had corn bread, cabbage, and black-eyed peas...

There was a piece of corn bread laying on the shelf...
If you want any more, you gotta sing it yourself....


This uses the usual tune.

As sung by Warner Williams
transcribed by ear from the Smithsonian Folkways compilation, Classic African-American Ballads

-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 30 Oct 08 - 04:14 PM

All great information.   My Grandmother knew the Sons of the Pioneers and Shug Fisher, so good history for me. Still wondering where tabs are? Can't read sheet music to save my soul and would like to teach this to my son.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 10 Jul 10 - 08:40 PM

The French-Canadian band, Genticorum, sing a song they call Pinson et Cendrouille, which also goes by the name of La Noce Des Oiseaux, The Birds' Wedding, on their CD, La Bibournoise. Although it's about birds, not a frog and a mouse, it follows much of the story line, with various other animals bringing things to the wedding. It even ends when a cat disrupts the proceedings.

I suspect that Froggy and La Noce have a common ancestor.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: Charley Noble
Date: 11 Jul 10 - 08:28 PM

My mother painted a series of illustrations of this delightful song for her sister-in-law back in the 1930's. If there is any interest, I can post the digital images on my Facebook page with a link here; you will have to sign up as a member of Facebook to view them but that's not too hard.

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: GUEST,josepp
Date: 19 Jun 12 - 12:11 PM

The melody of "Froggy" was used in an old ragtime tune from the 1890s called "You Been a Good Ol' Wagon but You Done Broke Down." I have a vocal version of it from that period but the lyrics are racist.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: PHJim
Date: 20 Jun 12 - 12:29 AM

My dad used to sing this to us when we were kids. The main story was the same, but there was a different form to the song. I recall the last two verses were:

They rowed their boat across the lake,
Heigho, says Roly!
They rowed their boat across the lake,
And got swallowed up by a big black snake,
With a roly-poly, gammon and spinach,
Heigho, says Anthony Roly!

That was the end of him and her,
Heigho, says Roly!
That was the end of him and her,
Now we won't have tadpoles covered in fur,
With a roly-poly, gammon and spinach,
Heigho, says Anthony Roly!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 20 Jun 12 - 12:39 PM

"You've Been a Good Old Wagon" as sung by Bessie Smith can be heard on
www.redhotjazz.com/bessie.html
(recorded 1-14-25, Columbia 14079-D)

See thread 92186 for lyrics posted by Mike Pearce.
You've been a good old wagon

The lyrics in Bessie's version are humorous but not 'racist'.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 20 Jun 12 - 12:54 PM

Joe Offer posted the Harney and Biller version in thread 23092.
Good Old Wagon

A fine ole song.

Any resemblance of the tune to "Froggy" seems coincidental to me.

Subject: ADD Version: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: GUEST,Mr. Trashcan Bass
Date: 25 Aug 12 - 01:18 PM

Here's the variant I like to do.

FROG WENT A-COURTIN'

Frog went a courtin' and he did try uh huh
Frog went a courtin' and he did try uh huh
Frog went a courtin' and he did try
to make miss mousie his new bride
uh huh, uh huh, uh huh

Mouse said to be a bride uh huh (x2)
Mouse said to be a bride
gotta ask dad if it's alright
uh huh (x3)

Frog asked dad if it's alright uh huh (x2)
Frog asked dad if it's alright
dad said well me oh my
uh huh (x3)

Dad knew frog was a rich man uh huh (x2)
Dad knew frog was a rich man
so he said alright you can
uh huh (x3)

Frog asked mouse if she'd wear white uh huh (x2)
Frog asked mouse if she'd wear white
mouse said something dark as night
uh huh (x3)

Frog had to think about that uh huh (x2)
Frog had to think about that
he said maybe I'll marry a cat
uh huh (x6)

Subject: RE: Origins: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: wysiwyg
Date: 24 Nov 17 - 08:26 AM

Crambone is from a Tom and Jerry cartoon (Quimby), when Uncle Pecos comes to visit Jerry.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_FyJyurljoM

~S~

Subject: RE: Origins: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 24 Nov 17 - 12:15 PM

Wysiwyg's link to 'Crambone

Subject: RE: Origins: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: EBarnacle
Date: 26 Nov 17 - 11:40 AM

One thing I don't see here is the theory that many of the American versions are meant to be commentaries of Andrew Jackson's courtship. The couplet "Not without my uncle rat's consent, I wouldn't marry the President" is believed to be a direct reference. At the time of the courtship, I believe one of them was still married to someone else.

Subject: RE: Origins: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: Charley Noble
Date: 26 Nov 17 - 08:22 PM

The two verses that Richard Dyer-Bennet composed, with the happy ending referred to above, are as follows:

Then Frog and Mouse lived happily, mm-hmm,
Then Frog and Mouse lived happily, mm-hmm,
Then Frog and Mouse lived happily,
And they were blessed with children three,
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. mm-hmm.

And one did croak and two did squeak, mm-hmm,
And one did croak and two did squeak, mm-hmm,
One did croak and two did squeak,
And they had long tails and webbed feet,
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. mm-hmm.

Cheerily,
Charlie Ipcar

Subject: RE: Origins: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: GUEST,Phil d'Conch
Date: 18 Dec 19 - 01:01 AM

“No. 109.—King John in a Cocked Hat, or Heigh Ho says Kemble.—A Parody on the famous Grimaldian Song, called "the Frog in the Opera Hat.'

        (Morning Chronicle, Nov. 7, 1809.)

John Kemble he would an acting go,
        Heigho! says Kemble;
He rais'd the price which he thought too low,
Whether the public would let him or no;
                With his roly-poly, gammon, and spinnage,
        And ho! says manager Kemble.

The mob at the door made a mighty din,
Heigho! says Kemble,
They dash'd like devils thro' thick and thin,
And over the benches came tumbling in,
                With their roly, &c.
        'Twill do says manager Kemble.

Soon as they pass'd Bill Shakspeare's hall,
        Heigho! says Kemble;
They thought the lobbies were much too small,
So they gave a loud roar and they gave a loud bawl,
                With roly, &c.
        Hollo! says manager Kemble.

“Pray what do you want (in a sort of a huff)
        Heigho! says Kemble;
Says Mr. Leigh.—"Nonsensical stuff,
Pho! none of your gammon, you know well enough.
                With your roly, &c.
        You do, great manager Kemble."

He held by the tip his opera-hat,
        Heigho! says Kemble;
"Indeed the concern's as poor as a rat;"
Says Bull, "No dam'me, we won't stand that,"
                With our roly, &c.
        'Twon't do, great manager Kemble.

He folded his arms, in a sad nonplus,
        Heigho! says Kemble;
With Queen Anne's prices he made a fuss,
Says Bull, "What the devil's Queen Anne to us,"
                With roly, &c.
        'Twon't do, great manager Kemble.

He swore to himself an oath, by Styx,
        Heigho! says Kemble;
Kind ladies and gentlemen, none of your tricks,
I love seven shillings much better than six,
                With my roly, &c.
        I do, says manager Kemble.

Then roar'd the gallery, gentle souls,
        Heigho! says Kemble;
No private boxes, no pigeon-holes,
We'll dowse your glims,* in a crack, by goles,
                With roly, &c.
        No, don't, says manager Kemble.

I can't those private boxes rob,
        Heigho! says Kemble;
With Lord O'Straddle† I drink hob and nob,
And Tm hand and glove with my Lord Thingumbob;‡
                With his roly-poly, gammon, and spinnage,
        Goodnight! says manager Kemble.

* Put out the Lights        † L—d B-y-m-e.        ‡ D-e N—f.
[The Covent Garden Journal, Stockdale, ed., 1810, pp.663-665]

Old Price Riots

And yes, same Kemble family, if the name rings a bell.

Subject: RE: Origins: Froggy Went A-Courtin'
From: GUEST,Phil d'Conch
Date: 18 Dec 19 - 10:32 PM

Mentioned upthread (dead link.) Haven't linked the stage play to John Kemble/Covent Garden yet but it seems likely.

“                SONG.
        (TUNE–“Heigho says Rowley!")
        Written by George Colman, Esq.

Thimble’s scolding wife lay dead;—
        “Heigho!" says Thimble,
“My dearest duck's defunct in bed;
“Death has cabbaged her —Oh! she's fled!
        “With her roley, poley, gammon and spinage,
                “Heigho!” says Thimble.

Thimble buried his wife that night!
        “Heigho " says Thimble;
“I grieve to sew up my heart’s delight,”
With her diamond ring on her finger tight!
        And her roley, poley, &c.

To saw off her finger, and steal the ring,
        Soon came the sexton;
She sat up an end, and she gave a fling,
Crying, damme, you dog, you steal no such thing;
        With your roley, poley, &c.
                And off run the sexton.

She stalk'd, to her home, and she made a din;
        “Heigho!” cried Thimble;
Then popp'd out his head, and said with a grin,
“You are dead, dearest duck! and I can't let you in;”
        With your roley, poley, &c.”
[Killing No Murder: A Farce in Two Acts, Hook, 1809, p.38]