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BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh!
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Subject: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Little Hawk Date: 06 Oct 01 - 11:37 PM Okay, pedants...here's one to grind your teeth over. People who stick an "S" on the end of a word where it absolutely does not belong... Examples: "alls" ("Alls I did was tell him how I felt!") (Even worse if you put in an apostrophe...and make it "all's" "We's" ("We's are goin' downtown!") "So's" ("So's I said to him...") "You's", "Youse"...etc. (Are youse ready to order yet?") This from people who are apparently unaware that the word "you" can mean more than one person. "anyways" (So's, anyways, I told him all's I could, but he still wasn't happy about it. Whaddayouse think about that?") "a long ways" ("It's a long ways to Tipperary...") There is a veritable plague of the expression "youse" in Orillia these days, particularly among waitresses. How does something like this get started? Does anyone have any more examples of this kind of thing? - LH |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: katlaughing Date: 06 Oct 01 - 11:41 PM Hows about? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Little Hawk Date: 06 Oct 01 - 11:45 PM Ah, yes. Good one. - LH |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: wysiwyg Date: 06 Oct 01 - 11:53 PM Yeppers. ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: raredance Date: 06 Oct 01 - 11:55 PM So annoying especially when, as I'm sure all you all know, there are legitimate ways to separate singular "you" from plural "you". "You all (y'all)" is singular and "all you all (all y'all) is plural. No need for you's to every be confused again. rich r |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Bert Date: 06 Oct 01 - 11:56 PM Colloquialismses |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: GUEST,Whistle and Bagpipes Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:02 AM "Hows come?" My peeve is the apostraphe s where it doesn't belong - saw a sign in a store where "Banana's" were 59 a pound
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Little Hawk Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:02 AM LOL!!! We's could justs starts putting "s"'s on alls our words, if in doubt. Anyways, its' not so's youseall dont' have to express yourselves's the ways I say's cos it's a long ways from being a free country if'n we's cant' put our apostrohe's and suchlike in the same places as our Daddy's did!!! Right? Do youse follows me? - LH |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Gypsy Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:07 AM And i add my own tooth grinding for the apostrophe added unnecessarily! Since i read without contractions, the absurdity of one, when it doesn't exist, can drive me mad. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: raredance Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:10 AM LH, I beliveve that should be "iffen all youse all's in doubt" rich r |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: DonMeixner Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:11 AM Likes when your driving down the road and theres a sign that says, "No Turn Arounds" when you knows all too well it should be "No Turns Around" ? Don |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: katlaughing Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:14 AM Just sose youse knows, I nevers meant ta causes ya's'll innys trubbles at alls! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: wysiwyg Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:15 AM It useta was anyhow. ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: katlaughing Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:18 AM gawds and gawddesses, we'uns er alls startin' ta sounds likes Cletus and them Reg boyz! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Genie Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:18 AM It's the fault of the medias--phenomenon like this can be blamed on their use of the wrong criterias for spelling. They don't even know that "kudos", like "pathos" or "ethos," is not a plural. ("Kudos," like "praise," is due ... .) And they said it was a waste of time to know anything about Latin and Greek! Yeah, Whistle and Hawk, I really detest the trend to reverse grammatical and spelling rules. "Him and me went downtown and ran into the man who owes money to he and I... ." "Its too bad I cant think of other example's and illustration's." Genie |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: wysiwyg Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:22 AM Buncha damn language aficiondos. Off the beaten tract completely. That is, hearabouts. Huh, I cracked myself up! ~S~
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Clifton53 Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:24 AM How about the opposite, ex, " He gave me fifteen-cent in change". Or, " I bought six-pound of steak" Clifton |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Bert Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:27 AM "praise," is due! Wow, does WYSI know yet? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: wysiwyg Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:33 AM Uh oh! Time for these again?!?!? OY! Or my new favorite, LOL!, where with a little thought you can get things like this: What's On! Like, oh my gawd! (Who is totally Performing Where) BS: Improper letter S endings! Like, oh my gawd! Arghhh! Help: SanDiego Jams Anyway... Song Circles, Open Mics BS: GAS! Like, oh my gawd! GAS! Lyr Req: Gawd Save George Washington Muirshin or Molly Durkin? Like, I am so sure! which came 1st |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: wysiwyg Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:35 AM Hahahahahhhhhhhhhhhh............ Create a Smurfily smurfily new Thread (start a smurfily new topic) Mudcat Frequently Smurfed Questions - Newcomer's Guide Mudcat Smurf Map and PermaThread Index What's On! (Who is smurfily Performing Where) ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Mark Cohen Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:42 AM Hey, in Pittsburgh they say "youns", which sort of rhymes with the German word "uns" only with a Z sound at the end. And I don't think they say it anywhere else but in Pittsburgh...which is one reason I'm glad to be from Philadelphia (home of the four-part vowels). Aloha, Mark |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Genie Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:46 AM OK, Bert, Some praise is due you, too! About 10 pound of it, maybe. Genie |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: wysiwyg Date: 07 Oct 01 - 01:02 AM Yes, Bert, I definitely agree. More than ten, tho. Come and get it. ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: pavane Date: 07 Oct 01 - 05:18 AM Just thought that I'd point out 'You' is already plural. The second person singular is 'Thou'.
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: gnu Date: 07 Oct 01 - 05:36 AM PLEEEEASE don't say to me that you are going to, "... try AND do something." It is, "... try TO do something." If you ARE going to do something, why would you say you are going to TRY ? This is so pervasive that I have had to try and ignore it. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: John MacKenzie Date: 07 Oct 01 - 05:38 AM I'm afraid that the common misuse of English that annoys me is the adding of an "s" on the end of words like stadium and forum etc.. The best spoken English in a radio interview that I have heard recently, was from a Finnish politician being interviewed on BBC Radio 4. Jock |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Liz the Squeak Date: 07 Oct 01 - 06:41 AM How about compared to/with. It drives me up the wall. And who rattled WYS' cage, is she still taking the medication? Made no sense to me at all! LTS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: DMcG Date: 07 Oct 01 - 07:01 AM Off thread, but a great media and media favourite: percentage inflation We used to have to give 100% of our effort or comitment to things, but it then drifted up to 110%, and I've been hearing 200% quite a bit lately My other main complaint in spelling on official notices (not it typing emails, you understand!). The biggest supermarket near where I live has had a spelling mistake in the notice over the aisles listing the products for over three years now. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: DMcG Date: 07 Oct 01 - 07:03 AM That should have been 'media and management' of course. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Allan C. Date: 07 Oct 01 - 07:36 AM In reference to "We's" ("We's are goin' downtown!") I agree that this is totally wrong. "We's" is clearly a contraction for "We is". Thus, folling it with an additional (plural) verb is just not right. I have taken the liberty of correcting one other glaring error. The sentence should properly read: "We's a-goin' downtown!" For some reason this all reminds me of a prep order I once received when I was a hospital orderly. Some fine, young nurse from the backwoods had written instructions for preparing a man for testicular surgery. The order, as she wrote it, said: "Please shave Mr. _______ 's growin area." (She spelled it exactly as she pronounced it!) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Donuel Date: 07 Oct 01 - 08:48 AM When octopi make love it is a many tentacled thing. Each of their "arms" have their own nerve center/brain and most likely have their own alias'. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Banjer Date: 07 Oct 01 - 09:05 AM It irritates me when otherwise educated people, in responsible positions, misuse the language. Many times in advertising for hardware products that we receive at our shop I am amzed at the copy writers that don't know the difference between a coarse thread and a course thread. A recent sign in the grocery store where my wife works told the employees to put the carts they brought in into 'Two row's of cart's only'. Is it any wonder young people can't learn proper usage and spelling when people in the public eye continue to set bad examples? I'll never forget walking of the office of the Dean of Boys at my son's school many years ago. This educator had just said, "Your chile bees disruptly in his classes" My thought was that if my child had no better teachers that this Administrator it was time for me to become 'disruptly'. Unfortunately my complaints to our local school board fell on deaf ears. That is why Florida is ranked 48th (out of 50 states) in the quality of education. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: AliUK Date: 07 Oct 01 - 10:32 AM WISIWYG: GAS! GAS! was actually a quote from the poem that is contained in the thread. The use of the exclamation mark in cases of speech is not wrong, infact it is what it was invented fro. Perhaps you should look at the context before making joke of it. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: wysiwyg Date: 07 Oct 01 - 10:34 AM AliUK, that was not the intent at all. I was just showing what one of the links I found, that translates things into different dialects, would do to a thread list. I think it's very strange how often Mudcatters make assumptions about others' motives in posts. ~Susan
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Jim Dixon Date: 07 Oct 01 - 11:39 AM Little Hawk: The syndrome you describe in your first post must be a regional thing. I don't hear it here in Minnesota. Here, the plural form of "you" is "you guys." |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Peg Date: 07 Oct 01 - 11:40 AM anyways...grrr in writing: "suppose to" instead of "supposed to"...grrr... or "supposively" instead of "supposedly"...grrr or "cut and dry" instead of "cut and dried"...grrr... BayBanks (when it was called BayBank; the bank was bought out and does not exist anymore but it used to make me go grrrrr when people added an S)...grrr As a film critic I notice when people get film titles wrong: like "sex, lies and videotapes"...grrr people also used to pronounce the film "Cinema Paradiso" as if it were "Cinema Paradisio"...grrr or "Mississippi Marsala" instead of the proper "Mississippi Masala"...grrr or when I used to work at a little art house theatre in grad school, people though they were cool when asking for tickets by saying the first word of the title...like "Wild" for "Wild at Heart"...or "Life" instead of "Life is Sweet"...grrr...I would pretend I did not know what they were talking about...heh heh heh...
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: AliUK Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:15 PM Susan, suitably chastized. A thousand apologies...or is that apologii? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Bat Goddess Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:51 PM Sigh. And one of the biggest disappointments so far in my life was finding a type in a headline (yes, one of those apostrophe s things) on the front page of the New York Times -- below the fold, but nonetheless very disappointing. Sigh. (In some circles I'm a type goddess.) Bat Goddess |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Bill D Date: 07 Oct 01 - 01:19 PM ..unfortunately, disdain for correct grammar seems to be 'in', whereas it once was mostly due to poor education and just plain 'dumbness'....There are many causes, but since so many managers and 'educators' are unable to write & speak clearly & correctly, it is hard to mount a movement to correct the problem. (I should have "beed disruptly in MY chiles classes" a bit more I suppose) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: wysiwyg Date: 07 Oct 01 - 01:40 PM It occurred to me, after hastily writing what ALiUK took as chastisement, that "smurfs" and "valley girls" may be unknown creatures in the UK. At least with the resource of Mudcat we can learn enough to know we understand little! No apology needed, no harm, no foul? *G* ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Noreen Date: 07 Oct 01 - 01:47 PM Another teeth-grinder that seems to bother no-one else: a local taxi firm has big printed signs on all their cars advertising the phone number for Advanced bookings. I'm still trying to work that one out... I'm obviously not advanced enough. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Wyrd Sister Date: 07 Oct 01 - 02:20 PM "Different to"? Does that mean we have to have "similar from"? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Little Hawk Date: 07 Oct 01 - 02:55 PM Then there's mispronunciation of names. Back in the famous Canada-Russia hockey series in 1972, the Russians had a star forward named Valeri Karlamov (I hope I spelled it right...well, Russian employs a somewhat different alphabet anyway...maybe should be an "h" in there somewhere). Most of the Canadian announcers couldn't handle "Karlamov" for some reason and insisted on reversing the letters and pronouncing at "Karmaloff", like "marmalade". Gad! What idiots they made of themselves. Despite the almost universal mispronunciation of the man's name, he earned the grudging respect and outright admiration of the frustrated Canadians, as he had an uncanny ability to both skate and put the puck in the net. So uncanny, that I believe the Canucks arranged to injure him and get him off the ice. Dirty pool! Not that the Russians didn't do some dirty play themselves...quite a bit of it. Now why has G.W.B. not shown up on this thread? Oh yeah, there's a war on... - LH |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Donuel Date: 07 Oct 01 - 03:17 PM The B word is not to be sullied under threat of extreme predjudice. Even the TV show Politically Incorrect has been banned from all affiliates in the Washington DC area. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Ebbie Date: 07 Oct 01 - 03:59 PM "The B word is not to be sullied under threat of extreme predjudice." Boy howdy, am I out of it- What does that mean, Donuel? Ebbie |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Ebbie Date: 07 Oct 01 - 04:23 PM A local store has signs above the clothing aisles: Ladies', Boy's, Children's, etc. I once even saw a sign that read Mens'. I would prefer to respond with laughter but it irritates me. One of my peeves is a small one, I grant you: "I would like to thank..." Why not do it? Just say, My thanks to..." Eb |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Little Hawk Date: 07 Oct 01 - 05:17 PM Ebbie - I think he means it's hands off George W. Bush at the moment, as in no making fun of the commander-in-chief in time of war. Either that, or he's talking about borscht. :-) - LH |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Mr Red Date: 07 Oct 01 - 05:50 PM datums, gymnasiums, symposiums, referendums, operas (yes operas AND opuses). |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: pavane Date: 07 Oct 01 - 06:03 PM If you are speaking English, it is proper to form regular English plurals - even of imported words. No need for Radii, radiuses will suffice. Form the Latin plural if you are speaking Latin |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Dicho (Frank Staplin) Date: 07 Oct 01 - 08:21 PM Lots of confusion here. Why equate the vulgar vernacular with correct, formal English? (WYSIWYG- The song you are searching for is Geawge Warshington warshes his clos- or his hans in a variant version). I agree that newscasters and newspaper writers should speak and write proper English (or American, as the case might be), but why shouldn't we add color to our language when speaking informally? The vernacular also helps to denote our home ground. Where do people say Alabamer (two answers, one for England, one for the United States). I am going to home? I'm fixin' to go to town? I be ready to go? Etc. Moreover, what was wrong when I was a child (see "Anglicised" plurals) seems to be gaining currency today. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Genie Date: 07 Oct 01 - 10:23 PM Here are a few of my pet peeves among language errors: " ...between ten to 15 minutes..." "up to 50% -- and more!"
Yuppies using "i.e." (usually pronounces, "aieeee") when they really mean "e.g.," because they don't know what either term means and are too pretentious to say "for example," or "such as." E.g., I've seen potluck announcements that say something like, "Bring a dessert, i.e. cookies." (What? No pies allowed?)
Yeah, DMcG, someone might earn 110% of my income, and I might spend 110% of my income (by borrowing), but you can't give more than 100% of yourself to a job, relationship, etc. You can't keep your eyes on the road 110% of the time!
AllanC., a friend threatened to "revoke my poetic license" because I complained about Woody Guthrie's having written "...laid it on to she and me..." and about that type of grammatical error in many country/western and popular songs.
Banjer, have you seen the hardware stores that advertise "duck tape?"
When did people start saying "purposely" instead of "purposefully? We don't say "aimly" or "thoughtly" or "prayerly" or "hopely."
Then there's "normalcy." DON'T GET ME STARTED...
How about "jive" instead of "jibe."
Speaking of funny things we often say, the brilliant Steve Allen used to say "Needless to say..." and leave it at that!
Pavane, I'll accept "phenomenons," and "arenas," and "forums," but I gag when I hear about "a phenomena."
Dicho, I, too think there are places where the vernacular should be colorful. And language does evolve. I am not going to say, "Woe is I," or sing "I've Got To Be I." Nor do I think blues would sound right without using phrases like "I ain't had not lovin'." But since songs are no longer expected to rhyme, if a language error is NOT a regionalism or dialect and does not enhance the poetry, I find it really irritating when bad grammar shows up in songs just because of ignorance. [E.g., there's a c/w song that says, "...till death do we part..." and another that says something about giving thanks "to he who made the stars." It's like chalk on the blackboard to me! Genie |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Little Hawk Date: 07 Oct 01 - 10:32 PM I have to point out that Bob Dylan did more to mangle the language than probably anyone else in the songwriting field...because he was trying to emulate Woody Guthrie, and various old time blues singers, and so on. He knew good English, but frequently chose not to use it. And yet us pedants love Bob! (Well, I do anyway...) This is weird. It just goes to show that Dylan is, as usual, allowed to do whatever he pleases, regardless of the usual rules. It's the DYLAN EXEMPTION...one of the things that makes him so fascinating to people like me. :-) - LH |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Jim Dixon Date: 07 Oct 01 - 11:23 PM Genie: There is a brand of duct tape called Duck Tape. So if it's capitalized, that might have been what they were referring to. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Genie Date: 08 Oct 01 - 12:08 AM Yeah, Jim, I've seen the brand, but I'm referring to signs about generic products. I'd guess that the brand name was born of the common error. Re: hardware stores, is it "furring strips" or "firring strips?" I've seen it printed both ways on store signs. Where does that term come from, anyway? Genie |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Crazy Eddie Date: 08 Oct 01 - 01:08 AM As a wannabe pedant, I need to know which of the following is correct. Please help. A is different from B A is different to B A is different than B Other Favourites : "Stationary Cupboard" What, you expected it to MOVE? "They're coats are over their with there hats" Also, your/you're/you'r/youre.
Adjectival forms used instead of adverbial forms. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Liz the Squeak Date: 08 Oct 01 - 02:09 AM People who list things by saying 'A, it's not there and secondly.... AAARRRRRGGGGHHHHH!!!!!! LTS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Little Hawk Date: 08 Oct 01 - 03:01 AM Then there are those people who say "fecking" and "shite" all the time, when you know that's not what they mean to say at all. These same people use the word "git" far too frequently, usually in the phrase "stupid git". - LH |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: KitKat Date: 08 Oct 01 - 08:42 AM I hate 'off-of' instead of 'off' - oh yes - and people 'laying on the bed' instead of lying on it. It always makes me want to ask them if they laid a good clutch. Kit Kat
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: SharonA Date: 08 Oct 01 - 09:41 AM In addition to the "arghhhs" listed above (in with which I chime): "nucular" instead of the proper "nuclear" "it's" instead of "its" (the snake DOES NOT shed IT'S skin) "chomping at the bit" instead of the proper "champing..." And the one that REALLY annoys me: "ax" instead of the proper "ask"!!! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Snuffy Date: 08 Oct 01 - 09:49 AM In Liverpool, youse is the accepted plural of you. When a teacher says to a kid "Stand up, Hughes", the whole class gets to their feet. They could of misunderstood, of coarse. WassaiL! V |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Orac Date: 08 Oct 01 - 11:07 AM Another one that gets to me is the way "alleged" is getting pronounced these days. If it is used as an adjective "an alleged crime" it should be "alleg-ed" ... in "It was alleged" it is a verb and is a different pronunciation. There are many similar words eg, aged (it was aged but an ag-ed person), (It was learned but a learn-ed person) So the rule is quite simple... so why can't even the bods on the BBC get it right these days. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Gypsy Date: 08 Oct 01 - 11:16 AM How about the in-laws? As in "My daughter in laws"? Always wondered what laws were being discussed. DAUGHTERS IN LAW, damnit! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: mousethief Date: 08 Oct 01 - 11:19 AM Bravo, pavane! As for sticking S's on the ends of words: here in the Other Washington, we like to pretend any and every public establishment is named after somebody, with the apostrophe of ownership. Thus we have grocery stores like Safeway's and Alberson's and Fred Meyer's, and the warehouse club Costco's, and so forth. What I hate are people who can't tell the difference between a regionalism and an error in grammar. :) Alex |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: SharonA Date: 08 Oct 01 - 11:20 AM "could of" instead of the proper "could've" or "could have" (sorry, Snuffy!) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: GUEST,Noreen in the library Date: 08 Oct 01 - 11:26 AM Crazy Eddie, A is different from B is correct. Who will join me in cringeing at a myriad of apostrophes? Myriad is more often than not used wrongly, it should be a myriad apostrophes. You wouldn't say a million of stars, would you? Noreen |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: GUEST,Noreen Date: 08 Oct 01 - 11:30 AM Snuffy, LOL! Been there... (Sharon- it was intentional, and compulsory in Li'pool.) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Grab Date: 08 Oct 01 - 11:40 AM Genie, it's interesting that Webster's quote "kudos" as being from Greek. I always believed it was from French, "coup d'os" meaning "pat on the back". Graham. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Dicho (Frank Staplin) Date: 08 Oct 01 - 01:30 PM A few notes. Furring is preferred, but the OED accepts the variant firring (these strips are often made of fir). Hateful phrases like "Drive decent." I can't resist saying "ly," which produces a blank stare. In the USA, alleged now is dominantly two-syllable; the-ed syllable is disappearing (Webster's Collegiate now places that pronounciation second. The same is happening to other -ed words, but I have difficulty in pronouncing learned without the second syllable. Kit Kat, a person lies on the bed but what about a dead body? Noreen, there are millions of stars, not a million stars (Your example is one that gives immigrants trouble). Gee, all (of) these folks jiving each other about grammar, chomping at the bit to add their pet peeves (chomping at the bit is at least 150 years old, why go back to the English champing unless you are English? To the guillotine with all who say co-vert rather than cov-ert! In a few short years, the correct cov-ert has all but disappeared, even the dictionaries have given it first place. But after all, it is usage that eventually determines what forms are correct. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Genie Date: 08 Oct 01 - 01:45 PM Grab, I used to think it was pronounced "coo-doze," and I thought it was plural, like "tacos" or "winos" or "rhinos" (one person deserves one kudo, but someone else deserves two kudos). Then I heard (or read) a discussion of it, in which it was pointed out that it was a Greek word comparable to "ethos" or "pathos," and pronounced "coo-doss" or maybe "coo-dose." You can give "some kudos," just like a play can contain "some pathos," or you can refer to someone deserving "kudos," without the adjective, but there is no such thing as giving someone "a kudo or two," anymore than one can "put on a clo or two," instead of just putting on "some clothes." Even though you may deserve "more kudos" than Bert does, it is not correct to say that "more kudos are due you." It would be "more kudos is due you... " Genie |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: SharonA Date: 08 Oct 01 - 01:53 PM Noreen: A myriad? I thought it was just "myriad" (a kaleidoscope displays myriad patterns). According to the dictionary I have at hand, "myriad" has several meanings: 1) "ten thousand"; and 2a) "innumerable, multitudinous", 2b) "having innumerable aspects or elements". Now, for definition 2b, it gives this example: "the myriad activity of the new land" –Meridel Le Sueur. So I guess that "a myriad" would be proper if one is referring to something that can't be counted (such as "activity"), but is it proper in all cases (such as counting stars)? Dicho: Again according to the dictionary I have here (Webster's New Collegiate, Springfield, Massachusetts [USA!!! Not England!], 1973), of the two words "chomp" and "champ", only "champ" is defined as "to show impatience of delay or restraint – usually used in the phrase 'champing at the bit' ". Perhaps people have been saying "chomping" for the last 150 years but that doesn't make it proper. I'm sure that people have been saying "youse" (and any number of the other grammatical misuses complained about in this thread) for longer than that. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Wyrd Sister Date: 08 Oct 01 - 02:15 PM And to throw a Spaniard into the works (or should that be spammer these days?), although a self-confessed pedant where written English is concerned (for heaven's sake(heavens' sakes for the multiversed), I have to stop myself correcting graffiti) I value true dialect forms in speech. "He were" and "they was" are everyday terms in my home city. Makes teaching them to read interesting..."They was this man in' garden, an' he were messin wi' us shed!" |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Jim Dixon Date: 08 Oct 01 - 02:54 PM Here are some weird things I've noticed recently: People needlessly repeat the word "is" as in, "The problem is, is that nobody listens." Or "The stupid thing is, is that we've done this before." The plural of "process" pronounced as if it were a Latin word: "process-ease." "They will have to build confidence in the normal political process-ease." "Antibiotics" pronounced "anti-bee-otics." Nonsense! It should be consistent with biology, biography, etc. "Centimeter" (or "Centimetre" if you prefer) pronounced the French way: "Sawntimeter." Doctors and nurses seem fond of this pronunciation. (They're nearly the only ones who use the metric system in the US.) Baloney! It's an English word now, so pronounce it consistently with century, cent, and centennial. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Chicken Charlie Date: 08 Oct 01 - 03:02 PM Towards, perhaps. It's thread creep, but by anti-fave is "The point being is that..." |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Dicho (Frank Staplin) Date: 08 Oct 01 - 03:11 PM Webster's Collegiate USA, 10ed, 1996, cites chomp as "alter. of champ." This change from a to o also occurs with strop (leather strap for stropping a razor) (See Mencken, The American Language). Some words have been incorrect in the eye of the beholder ever since Johnson and others tried unsuccessfully to pin English down, but they will never die. Ain't is an example. By the 1920s, Mencken reported that ain't "is already tolerably respectable in the first person, where English countenances the even more clumsy aren't" (the Appalachian am't I for am I not has now disappeared). The word shit (shite) goes back to Old English but currently is not accepted in "polite society," except in parts of Wales, etc. It is usage which determines correctness or incorrectness, and usage is constantly shifting (only slightly more stable than popularity polls). |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Bill D Date: 08 Oct 01 - 03:25 PM gantlet-gauntlet! old story...a student was talking to his English professor about a late assignment, and promised "I'll get it done quick." "No", said the teacher, "You'll get it done 'quickly'" "Aww," grumped the boy,"What difference does an 'ly' make? You know what I mean." "Well," replies the professor, "it can make a lot of difference....see that pretty girl over there? Now do think it makes a difference whether you look at her 'sternly'...ot at her stern?" |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: John MacKenzie Date: 08 Oct 01 - 04:09 PM Umbarella- Febuary- totally unique- ex Dutch politician etc. etc. Jock |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: SharonA Date: 08 Oct 01 - 05:32 PM Dicho says: "It is usage which determines correctness or incorrectness". If that were entirely true, then every single grammatical misusage noted in this thread, the "For pedants only" thread and any other thread that deals with the subject would be correct, since they are all in use. However, they are of course incorrect in the PRESENT state of the language. It is true that language does evolve. Common grammatical and pronunciational mistakes often gain acceptance with time (in that sense, the language devolves rather than evolves!) but it seems that the people who use the correct versions must die out before the versions themselves do; it took many generations (150 years?) for the definition of "chomp" to change to include "alternate of 'champ' ", and even so "champing at the bit" is still acceptable and perhaps preferred (in your dictionary, Dicho, is "champ" defined as an alternate of "chomp"? If not, I venture to say that the writers still don't consider "chomping at the bit" to be on equal footing with "champing at the bit"). Even when a word or phrase becomes "tolerably respectable", it still isn't necessarily "proper" (appropriate or suitable). For instance, we still teach our children that "isn't" is correct and "ain't" isn't! Correctness certainly determines usage to a great extent; otherwise, how would we have learned to read? We need the correctness of rules and definitions to keep the language from devolving to the point at which no one can make himself understood to anyone else who supposedly speaks the same dialect! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Bill D Date: 08 Oct 01 - 05:58 PM about 20 minutes ago, on NPR, I heard an interview with a New York official who wanted us to realize that, because of the recent events and higher security, we might well see large 'contingencies' of police officers if there were a perceived threat. I worry that he meant exactly what he said... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: mousethief Date: 08 Oct 01 - 06:02 PM Well said, Noreen, except it's "Cringing" not "Cringeing". Alex |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Dicho (Frank Staplin) Date: 08 Oct 01 - 06:24 PM In an earlier post I put "I be ready to go," old Black vernacular which has become synonymous with inner city Black speech. I thought someone might comment because it is a source of worry to teachers in areas where it is prevalent. Some have quit trying to fight it and accept it in classroom speech. Is it correct? No. Can it be stopped? No. Some of the students who manage to go on to higher education eventually conquer it because they have become associated with people who heard somewhat correct language at home. Sharon A, I am not trying to throw down the gantlet (just needle a bit). In another thread a couple of months ago a teacher in California said thankfully that grammar no longer was taught. I must confess that I tend to agree with you since I was schooled at a time when two years of Latin was compulsory and much time was spent on grammar and the parts of speech. In the 60 or so years since that time, I have seen changes that have led me to become more tolerant; now I only become upset over Microsoft grammarians (an oxymoron?) who impose their basic English in Word, the move toward(s) political correctness in every form of communication, and words like proactive. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: brid widder Date: 08 Oct 01 - 07:22 PM £5 is five pounds not five pound, 'monies'or 'moneys' money is money a little or a lot! obligated rather than obliged and 'to be pacific'...NO specific!!is being an ocean more precise? aghhhhhh!!! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Ebbie Date: 08 Oct 01 - 08:09 PM When did people start saying "purposely" instead of "purposefully? Genie, the difference to me is that 'purposely' is done 'on purpose' or not by accident, as in saying something like "ain't", for instance. 'Purposefully 'to me means 'with purpose', as in something like "I told him that I had seen his wife with a stranger at the hotel". I haven't looked it up, so this is just my working grasp of it... I'm curious as to whether others make that distinction. Ebbie |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Snuffy Date: 08 Oct 01 - 08:11 PM It may be age-d to you, but every month I print out an Aged Debtors List, not an Age-d Debtors List. And in many parts of England it is customary to use the singular form of a noun after a numeral - forty pound, fiteen mile, four foot etc - the number tells you it's plural anyway, so pluralising the noun is redundant. (Doesn't Russian use the genitive singular after numbers bigger than 4?) WassaiL! V |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: AliUK Date: 08 Oct 01 - 09:48 PM Sharon A: if it is customarily used then it often passes into the common idiom. Just ask the people at the Collins Co-Build foundation, where they look at all language in its common usage ( corpora). Words and phrases that are used often usually pass from the vernacular into the official. A few years ago the word "like" was officially recognised as a conjunction as well as a verb. i.e: "I was walking down the road,like. When I saw this bloke,like". The possessive 's is another story altogether and is down to incorrect teaching ( or no teaching whatsoever). |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: ddw Date: 08 Oct 01 - 10:13 PM Here in the automotive capital of Canada, a lot of people work for GM, but even more work for Chrysler's and Ford's.... I've given up.... david |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: AliUK Date: 08 Oct 01 - 10:18 PM hahahaha I'd like to meet Mr. Chrysler. Maybe Monseuir Citroen and Signor Fiat will be there. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Allan C. Date: 08 Oct 01 - 10:18 PM The sad fact is that our dictionaries are not, nor were they ever actually intended to be used as the deciding sources for definitions and pronunciations. They are unfortunately designed to show current usage, citing previous usage only for historical reference. An example of this is that many of the American English dictionaries released this year show that in current usage, "infer" is, indeed, used interchangeably with "imply". No matter how much it might tighten your jaws to read this, the horrible truth is that what was formerly regarded as uncommon usage (or by some, "misusage",) is now considered to be a part of the language as it is commonly used. There are many other examples that would bring most of my English teachers to tears. English, as well as any other language, is in a constant state of flux. New words and new usages are created every moment. Some of them are adopted and others fall by the wayside. Old words and usages are often discarded or altered as well. Here's an example of a now commonly used word that probably didn't exist before 1964: GRODIE. It's first documented usage was by none other than Ringo Starr in the movie, "Hard Day's Night". (I personally believe that he said, "grotie", though, [with a T] as a contraction of "grotesque". Lazy tongues changed it to a D.) The day he said it, it was largely, if not entirely unknown in the world. Some dictionaries list it now without necessarily indicating it to be a slang word. The unfortunate plight of the dictionary is that it is not actually the place for finding "wrong" or "right" definitions, spellings and usage. By its very nature, it can never be more than merely a guideline to what was currently and predominantly in use as the volume went to print. If you think about this long enough, it will give you a headache. If you really understand it, you can have a lot of fun at your next game of Scrabble. The whole concept is truly a kerflunction. *G* |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: GUEST Date: 08 Oct 01 - 10:41 PM Six of the current eight top threads are B.S.
And people wonder, "what has happened to the DT/MC |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Dicho (Frank Staplin) Date: 09 Oct 01 - 12:41 AM ddw, people worked at McLaughlin's long ago (building wagons and cars before it was taken over and became Buick's (later the impersonal GM). Why not work at Ford's or Chrysler's?. The men are dead, but their efforts live on. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Genie Date: 09 Oct 01 - 03:08 AM What Sharon said.
I think a great deal of the problem today is that mass communication is so rapid that a mispronunciation (e.g., "nucular"), misspelled word (e.g., "alright"), misused word (e.g., "enormity" for "magnitude") or faddish word (e.g, "impact" used as a verb to substitute for "touch," "influence," "affect," "bear upon," etc.) becomes nearly standard usage almost overnight! Genie |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Steve Parkes Date: 09 Oct 01 - 03:23 AM Alan C: "grodie"? I never heard of it till now. A quick Google says it means mauch the same as "grotty", as you say, (but this is how we've always spelled it. I seem to remember it was George who said it, but that's memory for you.) Is it an Americanisation of "grotty"? I had to teacj my daughter to ask for a glass of "warder" ("ar" as in "arm") instead of "wor'a" (' is a glottal stop) when we were in Canada. Talk about "separated by a common language"! Steve |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Allan C. Date: 09 Oct 01 - 07:50 AM Steve, here is one place I found "grodie". Yes, I am fairly sure it is an Americanization. Perhaps it should be noted that we pronounce it with a long O as found in it's root word. "Grotty" would appear to have a short O. Does it?
Begin rant
This issue, I know, is something of a spin-off from the original topic. However, I have been confronted with this problem over and over - as have most others who have worked in the graphics field. It shows to us how prevalent poor spelling, poor usage, etc., are and that there seems to be little distinction as to the level of education of the people who demonstrate such poor command of the language. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Mr Red Date: 09 Oct 01 - 08:30 AM sheeps? vortexes? apexes? and otctopii (octopussies and octopodes are correct). Language is all about COMMUNICATION. If we muck about too much we have a Tower of Bable (or babble) and a rich judiciary and maybe it is too late for the latter. In the UK eventually means sometime, in Europespeak it means maybe. Try putting that into a contract and keep the lawyers from getting rich - go on - I dare you. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Orac Date: 09 Oct 01 - 08:48 AM Another slight variation from the topic at hand is the current "trendy" idea of not capitalizing names either on TV or film credits. What do mudcatter's think of this? I find it very difficult when credits are passing along the bottom of the TV screen to pick out names, especially as some names are also words in common use. I thought it was a recent thing but a while back I saw an old pre-war American film that did just this. Would anyone here write their own name without capitals?...or even anyone elses.. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: KitKat Date: 09 Oct 01 - 09:18 AM I'm with you Orac. ee cummings may be a genius but I gave up on his work as just being too damned irritating to read. That goes for James Joyce too. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Genie Date: 09 Oct 01 - 01:03 PM Allan, I sympathize with the printers, word processors, etc.--as well as with news anchors who are given badly written copy to read. Ideally, there would be two-way communication, so that errors can be corrected. When time prevents this, there is a real problem. Maybe the problem is that no one knows whose responsibility it is to edit the document. When I was doing my doctoral dissertation, there was a key, word-- "predication" (or "predicating," "predicated")--which recurred throughout the document. My typist took it upon herself to change every instance to "prediction" (or the comparable form of that verb), without asking me. She had to do the document over (back in the dark ages when people still used typewriters and white-out) and resented my not wanting to pay extra for that. I also frequently find that my real name (which can be spelled several ways) gets "corrected" in the records of credit card companies, utilities, banks, etc., after it has been spelled correctly for years! As I said above, I think the deterioration of language reflects our society's failure to value correct language usage. In an age when we Americans brag about "excellence," we don't require anything close to it for getting a job writing news copy for major networks, ad agencies, newspapers, etc!
A tangential rant: "We want to warn you, these pictures are graphic..." Back, sort of, to the original topic of the thread. I know it is considered correct to make a possessive of a name ending in "s,""sh," or "z," by just adding an apostrophe--e.g., "Chris' Steak House." But in spoken language it sounds really weird to me ("President Bush' speech ...", for example). More importantly, it seems quite silly and unnecessary. Our language is full of words like "Mrs.," "kisses," "consensus," "bushes," "hisses," etc. Why, then, should it be hard to pronounce "Joneses," or "Jones's, "Bliss's," "Chris's," etc? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Dicho (Frank Staplin) Date: 09 Oct 01 - 04:42 PM No capital letters? No apostrophes? It can be done. read "archie and mehitable," by don marquis, one of our great classics: mehitable the alley cat and archie the cockroach who chronicles her adventures by jumping off the top of the typewriter to hit the keys a brief quote pity the poor spiders i have just been reading an advertisement of a certain roach exterminator the human race little knows all the sadness it causes in the insect world i remember some weeks ago meeting a middle aged spider she was weeping what is the trouble i asked her it is these cursed fly swatters she replied they kill off all the flies and my family and i are starving to death it struck me as so pathetic that i made a little song about it as follows to wit twas an elderly mother spider grown gaunt and fierce and gray with her little ones crouched beside her who wept as she sang this lay curses on these here swatters what kills off all the flies for me and my little daughters unless we eats we dies and we ll soon be dead and forgotten with the cost of living so dear my husband he up and left me lured off by a centipede and he says as he bereft me tis wrong but i ll get a feed and me a working and working scouring the streets for food faithful and never shirking doing the best i could curss on these here swatters what kills off all the flies me and my poor little daughters unless we eats we dies only a withered spider feeble and worn and old and this is what you do when you swat you swatters cruel and cold i will admit that some of the insects do not lead noble lives but is every man s hand against them yours for less justice and more charity. Copyright 1917 et seq. i m toujour gai wotthehell wotthehell |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: SharonA Date: 09 Oct 01 - 05:31 PM Dicho (re "No capital letters? No apostrophes?"): It can be done; it has been done; it is done. It is accepted as a way of getting one's words noticed, but as KitKat says, it's damned irritating to read and, therefore, often has the opposite effect: the words are often ignored. BTW, in the case of "archie and mehitabel", the story was that archie didn't use capital letters because he was too small to hold down the shift key and type a letter key at the same time! Sorry, Dicho, if you got the impression that I was dueling with you earlier; it was intended as a friendly debate. No gauntlets. I'm one of those people in the graphics field that Allan C. mentioned, and my avocation is songwriting and performing my songs, so communication is my life's work. I'm a stickler for clarity and structure (I receive comments all the time concerning the highly structured nature of my songwriting, and at work I'm referred to as the "style guru" because of my insistence on consistency of punctuation, etc., throughout our publications). So if I seem a little too passionate about sticking to the rules, at least you now know why! (Actually, I do bend and even break the rules in my songwriting once in a very great while... but it is never my intention to sacrifice substance for style!) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Little Hawk Date: 09 Oct 01 - 05:38 PM 12 of the 15 most pointless non sequitors on the top-running 10 threads are by GUEST. And people wonder, "what has happened to the DT/MC?" What indeed? - LH |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Steve Latimer Date: 09 Oct 01 - 05:52 PM My grade ten English teacher overheard one of my classmates say youse guys. He very loudly said "you use a hammer, you use a saw, you don't youse guys". I doubt that the student ever said it again. I despise spelling mistakes, especially public ones. I once told a boss of mine to send a plaque back to the engraver because "they" had made a mistake on a piece that we were presenting to the owner at a grand opening of a new building. It said something like "To Mr. John Smith. Congradulations on your Grand Opening". I was horrified and told the boss he should jump all over the engraver for making such a glaring mistake. I then noticed the instructions from the boss to the engraver. They were identical. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: GUEST,Eclipse Date: 09 Oct 01 - 06:40 PM my favorite to use to bug people... I de-thawed the freezer (meaning I thawed the freezer) -Eclipse |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: AliUK Date: 09 Oct 01 - 08:14 PM Pronunciation has a lot to do with it. I am a british English teacher currently teaching at an American Bi-National centre. I'm having to drop my Ts ( wader instead of WaTer. Beudiful instead of Beautiful etc.) and learn how to spell again ( neighbor, color) and say Skedule instead of the correct schedule) *G* |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: ddw Date: 09 Oct 01 - 08:37 PM Hey AliUK, Where did you learn to schedule? In the school? Oh well, you Brits will hang onto your minority linguistic foibles, won't you? *BG* david |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: ddw Date: 09 Oct 01 - 08:49 PM Duh... That should be "learn to say schedule"
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Dicho (Frank Staplin) Date: 09 Oct 01 - 09:05 PM AliUK. True, a number of words are pronounced differently in the USA and Canada. We often accuse French-Canadians of saying "wader" for water, and these comes out "dese," but you are right, T IS less distinct overall among the general public. Another noticable difference is in words like Military, pronounced with two strong syllables in American (mil' i tar' y) while the English (at least on BBC) put greatest emphasis on the first syllable and rush over the "tar" part of the word. I think someone has already mentioned American fu'tul and English (and Canadian) fu-tile. And of course my mother's sister is an ant, the u lost. Why don't the English say shool for school if they say shedule rather than skedule? I once had an English-born teacher for freshman (1st year Univ.) Mod. Lit. in Texas; he became quite frustrated when we would read passages from one of the English writers. Army is vs. army are, etc., etc. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: wysiwyg Date: 09 Oct 01 - 09:08 PM PART TWO I took the liberty of titling part two in such a fashion that the folks in the "Pedants" thread might consider it for their continuing discussion as well. ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: AliUK Date: 09 Oct 01 - 09:40 PM is the army countable or uncountable...it depends on your point of view. It took me a long time to get rid of my regional accent when I first began teaching. This was embarassingly brought to my attention when one of my students said at the end of the lesson ..."teacher why are people always dying when you speak?" "Huh?"sez I..."yester-die, mon-die" . Yu cuduh knocked me doun wiv a feather, as my old gran used to say. I originally come from bedfordshire in the south east of england and we have some perculiar ways of saying things down there. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Dicho (Frank Staplin) Date: 10 Oct 01 - 12:13 AM You= yew, yu = yoo? I was raised in an area with a large Hispanic population and I still can't remember to pronounce "u" consistently; it often ends up oo when it shouldn't. The BBC newscaster heard on BBCCanada TV says tewsday and it makes me jump because I say Toosday. This thread has wandered far from improper letter S endings. There was the thread about the difficulty of learning English, the pedant thread, and others in the past, all worried about pronunciation (which I generally spell as pronounc... unless I proof read later) spelling and grammar (always pronounced grammer). It shows that we are interested in the language, regardless or irregardless of how well we handle it. It wasn't all our schoolmasters fault that we differ- may we never lose all the regionalisms, dialects, vernacular, vulgar usage that make English the most interesting of languages. On a Schoolmaster Here lie Willie Michie's banes; O Satan, when ye tak him, Gie him the schoolin' of your weans, For clever deils he'll mak them! Robert Burns
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: wysiwyg Date: 10 Oct 01 - 12:44 AM This thread takes a LONG time to load--
PLEASE, CONTINUE IN PART TWO.
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Subject: RE: BS: Improper letter S endings! Arghhh! From: Orac Date: 10 Oct 01 - 05:56 AM I think that the reason Americans pronounce so many words wrongly is because in the early days many non-English speaking settlers learnt (or at least "improved" their English) by reading books or dictionaries. This meant that they learnt many new words by pronouncing them how they were spelled with no one to correct them. Words like Squirrel which is Squi-rrel not Squir-rel. As for the T thing ... well thats just lazy speech. To say things like wader or innernational is just appalling. Is there an outernational too? How on earth call you tell the difference between inner city and inter city if you cant speak properly? ... clean up yout act over there!! |