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BS: Buying a house; your best tips?
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Subject: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Peg Date: 04 Jan 02 - 09:34 AM Yes, I am buying a house with two friends of mine (only reasonable way we coud think to do it--they can't find an affordable one-family in the city and I can't afford to do it on my own so we are chipping in on a two-family). Just curious if anyone has any "Gee I wish I'd known this" sort of advice before we jump into this process (which none of us has done before). Anything we might not think of that we should? Your advice is appreciated! (I bet there are good stories as well).
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Cappuccino Date: 04 Jan 02 - 09:38 AM While not wishing to offer a downer, please prepare your get-out before you get in. Thirteen years on, I'm still suffering the effects of a joint purchase with someone who turned out to be a completely unreliable and untrustworthy co-owner. It happens... so make sure you have a fair and legally-agreed exit route, just in case. Good luck. - Ian |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Midchuck Date: 04 Jan 02 - 09:46 AM 1) Use a lawyer of your own. Even if the bank has a lawyer who'll "take care of everything for you." Have someone who's working for you at least go over the paperwork and explain it to you. 2) Have that lawyer hired before you sign a purchase and sale contract. The more anxious the broker is for you to sign the contract first and talk to a lawyer later, the less you should trust him/her. 3) Have the lot surveyed, even if it isn't required by the lender in any event. 4) Have a professional home inspection done. 5) Make sure you purchase owners (as opposed to just lenders, which will probably be required in any event) title insurance, with the extended coverage for zoning, etc., violations if it's available in your jurisdiction. Caveat: All this advice is based on practice in Vermont, US. How much of it is relevant to real estate practice in your area, I have no idea. But a lawyer in your area, who has an active residential real estate practice, would. Caveat #2: All of the above will increase you closing costs. Omitting any of them could cost you a great deal more, later. Your judgment call. Peter. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Steve in Idaho Date: 04 Jan 02 - 09:52 AM Buying a place with friends - took nearly 20 years to become friends again. Have the place inspected by a professional, and certified/bonded, home inspector. Retain legal counsel for the exit clause just like Ian and Peter have suggested. Call other folks who have purchased homes recently and find the best realtor you can to represent you. The seller's realtor is not working for you. The very best of luck to you - Steve |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Amos Date: 04 Jan 02 - 09:53 AM IF its an older house, you want to look into homeowner's policy for maintenance work -- they are called different things in different places but it is like HMO coverage for the house. It CAN save you lots of dough if a serious issue comes up. The caveat is to make sure you read the details as to what the company will cover and what they will not. Real estate agents CAN be flexible as to the percentage points of the deal they get as commission. These are actually negotiable but the impression is that they are standardized. They sometimes will give up a few points if a deal is falling apart over the last few x thousand bucks, in order to put it together. A GOOD RE agent who knows the territory and is working for you, knows how to handle negotiations and care for customers, is worth her weight in gold in saved stress. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Charley Noble Date: 04 Jan 02 - 10:10 AM Well, there's some good advice above. You may want to talk with some housing co-op people as well, another flexible way of sharing private property while establishing guidelines for cycling individuals in and out. I helped establish a 7-person co-op in a 2-family home in Michigan back in 1972 and while none of the original members are still in residence the Rivendell Co-op is still functioning; we set it up so that people could move in and out for the equivalent of a security deposit. Members had no equity interest in the property, title being held by the Co-op corporation. This option will not be everyone's cup of herbal tea, but it worked well enough for us so that there were seldom more than 2 people being replaced in any one year. We had a lovely set of bylaws which hopefully the current members can find...Good luck, Peg! Landlady's Daughter, not to be confused with Charley Noble |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Rick Fielding Date: 04 Jan 02 - 10:54 AM EXCELLENT ADVICE! Take stock of just HOW important that friendship is to you. Since I came of age during hippie times, I remember quite a few folks banding together to buy affordable dwellings. I'm afraid the results were disastrous in all cases. Just make sure you and the others have drawn up a contingency plan to use in the event of divorce or unresolvable differences. Most of the folks I knew HATED the idea of lawyers, but all ended up needing them, and having to pay big bucks to get untangled. Jeez, sorry for being so negative, but experience is a great teacher. Rick |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: SINSULL Date: 04 Jan 02 - 11:18 AM Peg, I do know one woman who bought two different houses with two sets of friends and they live happily ever after. They are all show people - maybe that made a difference. But they also had clearly defined legal parameters for getting out. Good luck with your new home. I can't wait for mine to happen. Mary |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: mack/misophist Date: 04 Jan 02 - 11:31 AM It may be too late for this kind of thing but here's what I know about it. Never, ever buy a house on a flood plain, even if it hasn't flooded for 50 years Check out the availability and quality of emergency services - fire, ambulance, and police. Some places don't really have any. I met someone who lived so far back in the hills that the sheriff said they were better off shooting a threatening intruder and calling the police later. ( It's 45 minutes off the highway.) You mentioned children: how are the schools and transportation to them? I once heard of two families living in the same large house.....happily.....for many years. Good luck to you.
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: mack/misophist Date: 04 Jan 02 - 11:32 AM I see you didn't mention children. Senility, here I come. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: NicoleC Date: 04 Jan 02 - 11:40 AM Some great stuff above. But just to add my two pennies -- get your own real estate agent, and explain exactly what you are looking for. The MLS is also online in most cities, so you can do your own hunting as well. But your own agent will help steer you away from bad deals and work in your interest. If she's good, that is. Remember: the agent (even your own) works for the SELLER. The bank works for YOU. I know it sounds mixed up, but it's true. Before digging into the legal issues of buying with a friend, you might look at condos. That's what I did. After carefully reviewing pounds and pounds of financial statements and CC&R's and so forth, I was able to pick a great complex on very sound financial footing. (That means no additional monthly assessments down the road.) Not everyone likes condos, but you never have to mow the lawn on a beautiful Saturday! :) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: GUEST,JTT Date: 04 Jan 02 - 12:05 PM Bring a light meter to every house you look at, and compare it to the light in the house you now live in. Go and see houses when it's rainy, when it's dusk, when it's cold - as well as when it's nice. Work out how hot or cold both families like to keep a place, in case one lot likes it tropical and the other arctic. Make a list of ground rules on good manners for everyone. Eat together at least once a week, at table, with nice music playing, both families. Work out what is your absolute ideal house, for each family, and use the two ideals as guidelines. Work out how you're going to dole out the rooms - who gets to divide, who gets to choose - and the same with kitchen space. Try to get a place with two bathrooms and two car parking spaces. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Jim Dixon Date: 04 Jan 02 - 12:12 PM This may be trivial, considering the above, but don't buy a house due west of the place where you work. If you do, you'll be driving into the sun both morning and evening. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: artbrooks Date: 04 Jan 02 - 12:23 PM You didn't say, but assuming you're in the US... In addition to the things already mentioned, decide who gets the tax breaks for real estate taxes and interest. If it's shared, make sure that there is some sort of legal document acceptable to the IRS. BTW, if your bank/lender insists that taxes and home owners insurance have to be paid to them (in an "escrow" account, so they can play with your money) find another bank. Make regular (group) payments into your own account for this, and have a party at the end of the year with the interest. Consider some sort of regular payment by all occupants into a home maintenance fund. I'd suggest that this account have at least enough in it all times to replace the hot water heater when it blows up at 2:00 am on a Sunday morning in February. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Peg Date: 04 Jan 02 - 12:25 PM great advice everyone! We want a two-family house with two completely separate dwellings, as far as I know. Yet having meals together is still a great suggestion! We do that already on occasion. The co-op model sounds intriguing but since it is only two parties it may not be the best for us. The idea is for everyone involved to have some financial equity in this, for us all to be part of the investment over the long haul. But the "get-out" part is important in case any of us decides to move away for a job etc. My coven (of which this couple is also a part) owns a house nearby and they bought it as a co-operative many years ago. Over the years others have lived there and paid rent, and been part of the co-op, but now there are only two owners. I think I will ask them what sort of legal arrangement they had. The advice re: careful about living with friends is very sound. I have had friends as roommates and it was not always good. But since we have a model of this already in people close to us we may be able to avoid pitfalls. I have known them for several years and lived with them briefly, too.
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: gnu Date: 04 Jan 02 - 12:30 PM Re the home inspection, most important are the qualifications of the inspector. Almost as important is the liabilty of the inspector under contract. I know of a guy who is "certified" by a national organization. He bought a franchise and became a member of the local real estate organization, got a lot of referrals from real estate agents, wrote the exam and got certified. He had no previous experience or training in building construction or building codes. I've had a LOT of complaints about this guy. His contract limits liability to the price of the inspection. Shop for an inspector before you make an offer to purchase and read the contract BEFORE you choose an inspector. Above all, remember that an inspection is not a guarantee or an insurance. No one can eliminate risk, but it can be reduced. BEWARE of companies offering limited guarantees. Usually, the limitations virtually absolve the inspector of any liability by time period and by what's covered. BEWARE of any inspector who is a member of the local real estate organization. Try www.carsondunlop.com, the LEADERS in home inspection... they do not franchise, but their reporting system and Home Reference Maqnual are tops in the business, and the most widely used in North America. There is also an excellent disussion of frequently asked questions at A&E Building Inspection and Engineering. You can link to A&E's page through Carson Dunlop's site under "links". I think it's under "Finding a Home Inspector" near the bottom of the Links Page. If you have any specific questions regarding home inspections, home inspection franchises, or the home you are considering purchasing, just ask me. Only too glad to help. Don't expect - inspect ! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Sorcha Date: 04 Jan 02 - 12:32 PM Sounds like there are going to be quite a few of you--check out the storage space. Is it adequete? Is it easily acessible?
Is the kitchen large enough to cook for a group?
If there is a fireplace/woodstove, HAVE IT INSPECTED!! AND CLEAN THE CHIMNEY!!
Check "covenants" on the property. Can you have animals? What kind? How many? Can you plant trees, tear up the yard for a garden? Are there noise regulations in the neighborhood? I'm sure there are more I will think of.
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Naemanson Date: 04 Jan 02 - 12:39 PM Peg, good luck to you. A lot of the posts above talk about a negative outcome in such a move. Back in the early 1980's one of my co-workers joined another co-worker to buy a house. It was a single family house My point is that they made it work. They were very happy there and things worked out well. The only advice I would add to the above is to make sure the housing inspector gives you a WRITTEN report. I expected one when I bought my current house but didn't get one and later on I needed it. If you haven't owned a home before you are in for an adventure. It is a great experience and, if you plan for problems by putting money aside, it is a happy experience. Enjoy, Brett |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: gnu Date: 04 Jan 02 - 12:45 PM By the way, Carson Dunlop also has a self-help type book about buying a home... don't. There is no way you can gain the expertise from a thirty dollar book that you can buy from a home inspector for three hundred. Your money would be better spent on the reference manual. There may even (probably) be an inspector in your area who uses "The Book" and includes it in the price of the inspection. Here's a direct link to A&E's page www.propertyguys.com/vmall/AAE.html |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: gnu Date: 04 Jan 02 - 12:50 PM Sorcha's comment re neighbourhood noise regulations is excellent. Check into such regulations. Some neighbourhoods don't even allow clotheslines ! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Sorcha Date: 04 Jan 02 - 12:59 PM If the house comes with appliances other than water heater, check them out! Check out the water heater, too. Is it new? Is it safe? (carbon monoxide, fire, gas leak, etc) Does the fridge/cooker, etc. need replacing? Are they big enough? It's common in the States for houses to come with appliances, but they usually aren't all that great. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Lonesome EJ Date: 04 Jan 02 - 12:59 PM Congratulations Peg! No more piss-ant landlords, eh? Check the following carefully 1)condition of the roof. If it's over 20 years old, deduct the cost of replacement from the purchase price 2)check all electric outlets, make sure wiring is up to current code 3)check age and condition of water heater, furnace and other "power plant" systems 4)ask for heating bills from the previous winter 5) check flow, pressure and water quality in plumbing system. Make sure you aren't dealing with lead pipes. 6)Make sure all floors, ceilings and roof ridges are flat, and all walls plumb. 7)If there's a basement, examine baseboards, walls, and floors and carpets for any evidence of flooding. 8)check foundation for any cracking or crumbling. Check all interior and exterior walls for cracking that may indicate uneven settling. This may also show in edge-cracking of tile floors. Good luck! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Sorcha Date: 04 Jan 02 - 01:01 PM Peg, you still want to buy a house? grin........OH, yes, outside maintnence....paint? Siding, brick, mowing, shoveling snow........how much of each? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Grab Date: 04 Jan 02 - 01:26 PM Things I wish we'd looked at more closely in our various houses:- - Fit of exterior doors and windows. If they don't fit, it gets cold. And it's not cheap to replace them. - Security of exterior doors. If the exterior doors are thin plywood, or single-glazed, then anyone can get in easily. - Fit of interior doors and amount of interior repairs/redecoration required. This is minor, but it clocks up the time and money you'll need to spend on the house. - Are there enough mains sockets, and in the right places? If not, you'll need comedy quantities of extension cables running round the place, or you'll need to hack out the walls and replaster to put in extra sockets. - Do the taps drip? Do the waste-pipes from the sinks leak? Or worse, do the sinks not drain at all? - Can you fit a washing machine, a tumble-dryer and a dishwasher in the kitchen simultaneously? Or is there anywhere else you could put these? - Is there a shed/garage to store gardening stuff, bikes, etc? If not, is there a space where you could put one? If there is a garage, can you get your car in it? And can you open the doors, or do you have to climb out of the sunroof? - Is the central heating up to the job? Go house-hunting in the depths of winter and check this out. And does the central heating boil one room and leave the rest of the house still freezing? - Can you open the windows enough to get ventilation in summer? - Drive past the place a few times at random evenings (especially Friday and Saturday nights, especially at closing time). Is it on the main route to the pubs? Can you hear the local pub's jukebox/DJ/band? - Do the current owners have a cat? If so, you can guarantee that every carpet will need replacing due to cat pee (or worse). - If the garden's a jungle or a mud-bath, do you have the time and inclination to sort it out? Starting from scratch, it'll take most of your free time for 2 years to replant. And check on the types of trees/shrubs used - some grow very fast and require you to be out every month trimming them. Graham. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Jerry Rasmussen Date: 04 Jan 02 - 01:28 PM My wide and I bought a house last April, and it looks like all the most important issues are covered here. Yes, be sure to get a professional inspector. The bank that we took our mortgage REQUIRED that it be a licensed inspector. Don't get your brother-in-law to do it for free. Free costs too much. Once you've had the inspection, you have leverage to have the seller reduce his price. One more light-hearted bit of advice. Check the prevailing wind direction and see how many trees your neighbor has. We have one little 3' tall tree in our front yard, and I raked 25 large bags of leaves before one leaf fell off mine. I am on intimate terms with my neihgbor's trees. Jerry |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: GUEST,Charmion at work Date: 04 Jan 02 - 01:29 PM 6)Make sure all floors, ceilings and roof ridges are flat, and all walls plumb. 7)If there's a basement, examine baseboards, walls, and floors and carpets for any evidence of flooding. 8)check foundation for any cracking or crumbling. Check all interior and exterior walls for cracking that may indicate uneven settling. This may also show in edge-cracking of tile floors. All good advice, but hardly practical for anyone who is not in the market for a brand-new house! Until 1998, when my husband and I purchased a hole in the ground upon which a delightful townhouse was constructed just for us, I had been living for many years in elderly houses with trapezoidal doorframes, shims under the fronts of all bookcases, and occasional trickles of groundwater across the cellar floors -- and lived happily, healthily and safely, at that. The thing is to manage your expectations and learn how to accommodate the structural deficiencies most common in your area, because you will not find perfection on this mortal plane. And never store anything vulnerable to damp in the basement in a cardboard box -- use a plastic bin will a lid that seals. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Ebbie Date: 04 Jan 02 - 01:34 PM It can work. I know of a case where four long-time friends- a musician/story teller, a highschool teacher, a chef and a university professor/writer- were able to afford home ownership by pooling resources. My next door neighbors (all single men at the time) went together more than 15 years ago and bought an old house. Each one took a flat. Skylights and decks and entrances and more windows have been added in the years since. Each flat has separate meters and appliances. Each year they undertake one large project (one year having blown-in insulation added, another year they replaced an underground oil tank, etc)funded by pooled money. Eventually each man married and continued living there. About a year ago one of the couples moved out when they bought an entire house with acreage, backed up to a forest. They sold their share of the original house to the other three owners, who are currently renting out that flat until they decide what to do with it. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: M.Ted Date: 04 Jan 02 - 03:21 PM You can also find a realtor who is a "buyers representative", who will take your side in this, it won't cost you extra, and it will be a great help. Next thing, you seem to be looking for a duplex--different places have different types of houses--are there a lot of houses like this available in the area where you are looking? If not, reconsider what you are looking for. In many older urban areas(Philadelphia, for instance), each side of the duplex is dealt with as if it were a separate home, and each side is offered for sale separately, which means you may need yet another plan B-- Nother important consideration--what is the inventory like in your area? Though there is talk about "recession", housing sales are still hot in a lot of places, which means that prices are higher, less negotiable, and the good houses get snapped up fast--There are houses that available, but they are houses that have serious problems. Beware of fixer-uppers! Kitchen and bathroom remodelling, new heating systems, and water supply upgrades are expensive and time consuming--before you decide to deal with any of this, rent "Mr. Blandings Builds his Dreamhouse"-- You have to find out about things like crime rates, neighborhood demographics, and whether values are rising or falling in the area on your own--the realtors are prevented by law from telling you--You should do this, because if these factors are wrong, it can be more trouble than all the blown up water heaters and cracked drain tiles that you will ever run across. Last bit of advice--in order to make a good choice, you have to learn a lot, not just about houses, but about what you really need in a house--This applies to first time house buyers only--after you've bought a house and lived in it, you know what you need and what want, what you can afford, and why you didn't get it the first time.
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: allie kiwi Date: 04 Jan 02 - 03:34 PM My advice is to write a list under headings that are MUSTS, PREFERRABLE, and DESIRABLE - or whatever you want to call them. It's amazing how you can fall in love with a house and not have noticed it's downpoints unless you look over your check list. I had a photocopied check list I made up on the computer and wrote the address of each property on it, plus a brief descrition so I remembered which was which. Yup, I'm an overthe top list person, but this is major money you are talking about - who wants to stuff up? Things such as checking for the number of power outlets in the rooms. Towel racks in the bathrooms, is there enough bench space in the kitchen. Storage!! Go looking with another friend who hasn't a vested interest in the place. They can looked with unloving eyes on the aplce and see all the defects your rosy tinted glasses may not be seeing. Have one person looking upwards at the ceilings, tops of closets etc etc, while another person is looking downwards. no one person can take in everything. Think about your lifestyle as it is now, and dont buy for it - buy for what you think it may be in a few years. Eg, if a baby is on the agenda, dont buy with only enough bedrooms for now. And whoever said about going house hunting on a lousy day - great idea, you see them at their worst. If you are still interested, you can go back on a good day to see how it compares. Allie |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: gnu Date: 04 Jan 02 - 03:34 PM M.Ted said... a realtor who is a "buyers representative"... ah, yeah. The "buyers representative" usually gets half the commission upon the sale, so BEWARE. I'm not saying all real estate agents are only out to make money, just all the ones I have met, and I have met a lot. I wouldn't trust em as far as I could throw em. |
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Subject: Lyr Add: THE OLD LANDLORD'S DUMP (Charles/Ritter) From: Charley Noble Date: 04 Jan 02 - 05:20 PM You must be gettng a headache reading all this! Here's an appropriate song to remind you why you no longer want to help buy the landlord's house: THE OLD LANDLORD'S DUMP (Words by Mark Charles and Sheila Ritter © 1981 Tune: parody of Cyril Tawney's Gray Funnel Line) I mind the rain coming in my roof; It's cold and wet and that's the truth; So late at night when I close my eyes, I feel it drip and I moan and sign. Chorus: It's one more day, In my old landlord's dump! I mind the cockroaches in the sink; I mind the living room painted pink; I mind the water that comes out rust; There's not a landlord you can trust. (CHO) I mind the snow piling 'round the door; When he'll shovel it, I'm not sure; I mind the cold coming through the walls; My heat bills rise as the temperature falls. (CHO) Oh, Lord, if dreams were only real, I'd find a place to buy for a steal; Then I'd drive right by that landlord's place, And stick my tongue out in his face. (CHO) My friends and I will save our dimes; We'll work and plan until that time; Then we'll buy a house that we can share, And all our lives we'll be happy there. Final Chorus: We'll live no more, In that old landlord's dump! Landlady's Daughter, not to be confused with Charley Noble
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: NicoleC Date: 04 Jan 02 - 06:04 PM When I bought my condo last year, I went to a series of three home buying and maintenence classes at a local non-profit housing organization. They cost about $10 each, and in return I got 1/2 point of my mortgage loan interest. (FHA.) I was dreading it, but will to go for that 1/2% -- turns out I had fun and learned a lot. The classes covered how to buy a house, what to look for in a home, and how to schedule maintence and how much things cost. We even covered topics like types of roofs and hot water heaters, and I got to take home a neat notebook which had all sorts of checklists and things to remember. You may have an organization who offers these kinds of classes in your area. The classes were taught by realtors and mortgage brokers who were volunteering their time (I met my third and last realtor there... he was a godsend). Duplexes around here are always sold separately as well -- if you find a pair for sale together, you might want to beware: it was probably rental property. Not only are many renters less than careful with the property, but the owners are often less than perfect about maintenece. And the investor will probably be selling because he thinks he can't turn a profit anymore. Not a good sign for your future home value. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: M.Ted Date: 04 Jan 02 - 06:33 PM Buyers Reps are registered and lisensed to be "buyers representatives"--They act on your behalf. How well they do it is another question--but, unlike the listing realtor, they represent you, the buyer--and you need someone who will look out for you-- Gnu brought up an important point though--you have to find someone that you can trust, which is not always that easy-- First thing to remember is that only a small number of realtors actually make a living at it--a lot are part-timers hoping to make some extra cash, and often have only been in the business a short time--better someone who has been around for a while-- Next, if you know someone who has had a good experience with a realtor, check the realtor out-- Nother thing, talk to the realtor about who you are and what you want, then wait and see if they pick up the ball-- and if they do, how well they understand what you are looking for--a good realtor knows the market, and knows where to find the things you are looking for in a price range you can afford(if the things you are looking for are available in a house you can afford)-- Ask around to find out who the top sales people are in the market you are looking in, and who might specialize in selling the types of homes you are looking for-- Learn to be polite but wary--distrust anyone who won't give you or get for you, firm answers about things, and if you see something you don't like, just walk on-- When it comes to financing, a lot of realtors don't know much, and will hand you off to someone else--it is in your best interest(especially since cash is tight) to find a finance person who can work with and around your special considerations, which means that you need make calls and do the footwork(or virtual footwork) on your own-- Expect that this venture will take some time--the more you know, the better things will work out, and there is a lot to learn--by the end of it, you'll feel like you could write a book!! One thing to remember, everyone will get a good sized check at the closing, except you--it will be your money, and it will take 30 years to pay all of it back--if you have a problem with that, maybe you will be happier renting--
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Burke Date: 04 Jan 02 - 06:51 PM I may also be entering the market soon as well. Keep the advice coming. How does one locate a "buyer's representative?" |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Terry K Date: 05 Jan 02 - 04:37 AM 1) When inspecting potential houses, ignore the smell of fresh brewed coffee/fresh baked bread - old ploys to make the house seem more attractive. 2) Find out if the neighbours have a dog - dog owners are hell to live next door to (and most have complete blind spots about their precious animals). Terry |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Liz the Squeak Date: 05 Jan 02 - 05:00 AM When you look for areas for sharing, also look for areas for being alone. Sharing a house with a friend is great, until you realise there is nowhere to be alone that isn't your bed or the bathroom with the door locked. The bed just encourages sloth, and being in the bathroom for hours pisses off the rest of the house and you end up with a ring round your bum. Set ground rules early on about shared areas, but be flexible, ALL of you. Good luck, and I wish you joy in your new abode. LTS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Mr Red Date: 05 Jan 02 - 07:01 AM Don't forget yourself. If you haven't moved recently it can be far more disturbing than you think. Second only to bereavement is the recieved wisdom. The longer settled you were, the worse it gets. For you &/or the other family. Have your friends primed and there is always the Mudcat (notwithstanding Max's post). Maybe the other family prevent this by their presence, or make it more noticeable. "Rules of engagement" are a good idea. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: katlaughing Date: 05 Jan 02 - 07:10 AM For lots of links and some samples of what may be available in your area, plus a search engine which lets you put in all kinds of criteria, visit www.realtor.com. It's a fun place to search through and there are usually pix, plus info on taxes, neighbourhoods, schools, etc. The links include all kinds of service, including home inspectors.
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Peg Date: 05 Jan 02 - 11:57 AM thank you thank you everyone; this is all great! I shall print this all out and share it with my friends, I am sure most of it will come in handy in the next few months! BTW, when I say we are looking for a two-family, that means SEPARATE flats in a two-family house, NOT sharing the living space...hence the advice re: "traipsing thru a bedroom to get to the bath" does not really apply... They (a couple) will live in one flat and I shall live in the other. We all have cats and so want something with hardwood floors, not carpeting (I hate carpeting anyway!!!) porches and a yard outside (but fenced in). We want an older house. We are looking in the Jamaica Plain area of Boston (which saw a HUGE increase in home and rental prices over the last few years). The market in Boston is still insane, one of the most inflated in the country at present; but the economic situation and detritus of September 11 seem to be making it a bit easier to find something...not as many people want to live in the city now...
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Midchuck Date: 05 Jan 02 - 12:23 PM Move to Vermont, Peg! You can buy a house - if you avoid the touristy and Yuppy areas - for about a year's mortgage payments in the Boston area. All you have to do is find work.... Peter. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: JohnInKansas Date: 05 Jan 02 - 02:58 PM Re finding a "buyers rep." I was recently "moved" by an employer, who hired a local realtor to "help me find a house." While they were perhaps overly interested in "getting me into something," (they do get part of the commission) they did a reasonably good job of steering us away from troublesome properties, and keeping us focused on reasonably sound properties. If you know - or know someone who knows - anyone who has been similarly relocated at company expense, they quite likely were assigned a "buyers rep" and could share at least the agency name and perhaps give you some idea of what sort of job they did. Be aware that companies tend generally to work with larger "chainstore" realters, and that relocation/travel programs are often handled by a clerk in a corporate office a few thousand miles away - so get your evaluation directly from the "victim," if possible. John |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Dicho (Frank Staplin) Date: 05 Jan 02 - 03:15 PM Lots of good advice above. Have you considered buying the house on your own and becoming a landlord to your friend? All of the problems of co-ownership are avoided. My older son, (the lawyer) says co-ownership is a real can of worms, and stinky ones at that. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: allie kiwi Date: 05 Jan 02 - 03:16 PM I don't know where you are from, Peg - just presuming the USA. downhere we have a thing called a 'cross lease' where two properties are on the same land title. not exactly like when you have apartments under one roof, but more where there are two separate dwellings on the land. They have become a headache, because if one family wants to get soething done, they have to get permission frmo the other half owner of the cross lease. It gets so that cross lease properties are difficult to sell as one never knows the difficulties you might get into. My point is try and buy a house that has resale value. Dont get yourself into a niche market where you need someone within a small group who might want to buy it. Eg houses with a 'granny flat' attached (ie, where widowed grandma lives) are difficult to on-sell, because not that many people these days have or want granny living there, so they don't even bother look at those houses.
Allie |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: M.Ted Date: 05 Jan 02 - 04:07 PM Anyone that is looking for a buyers rep, let me know where you are located, and I think I can find a few referrals--probably best to PM--I make no guarantees of any sort-- One thing about areas where prices go up rapidly--they can flatten, and even fall just as quickly--I know a number of people who bought urban homes in hot neighborhoods in the 80's, only to have the values drop below what they had paid--particularly tough when you have to sell--and sometimes, for good reasons or bad, you do have to move, even when you figured you'd be there for the duration--
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Peg Date: 06 Jan 02 - 12:58 AM Vermont!!!! yes, I would love to live there and I know the prices are amazing...but I would indeed have to find a job there...I do want to settle there someday though...I guess I could commute to Boston half the week to teach... The idea of a "grany flat" sounds so charming; can't believe people would not want this!
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Susan from California Date: 06 Jan 02 - 02:16 PM Make sure you get a list of recent comparable sales in the area, to make sure the sellers price isn't inflated and convert the sales price to an approximate "square foot" cost. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Amos Date: 06 Jan 02 - 03:13 PM In California, anyway, it is perfectly normal to have a house purchase be negotiated between two realtors, one representing the buyer and one being the 'listing agent', the realtor to whom the seller gave the job of selling the house. Typically the retail commission total on a home purchase is six per cent, which is divided between the two agents or their brokers. I have met a large number of realtors and agents and some of them are money grubbers, and all of them are doing it to make a living. But it is also true I have met some who were brilliant at understanding my needs and working to get me the best they could. I have had agents give up parts of their commission in order to make a deal easier, and provide generaous house-warming gifts to celebrate completing the deal (obviously this was because it made money for them, but the spirit of the gesture was kind). I have been saved from a bad deal with an unrevealed flooding problem by making friends with a neighbor across the street before buying, so I recommend that especially if the house stands on a separate lot which might have its own peculiar conditions. In general it is wise to stretch a little buying a little more house than the least you're comfortable spending. This is because, in general, homes tend to appreciate in value over the long term. This can be offset by local market cycles, as described above by M.Ted; so it is a good idea to find out from someone in the market business what the patterns are. Prediction , of couse, is a voodoo business. In general you should not buy the best house in the whole neighborhood. It is better business to buy a decent but not outstanding one, and then over time improve it as possible, in ways that adds to its value. Resale value -- the price you can get from selling the house -- is markedly effected by small touching details like warm wooden trim, hand-painted decor, or other quirks whose impact is really more emotional than functional. The real estate maxim of "Location, location, location" is a rule to keep clearly in mind. A great house which borders on a slum is a risk -- we had a beauty once, on a hill, but there was a low-income neighborhood half-a-mile away and we got broken into four times before we sold and moved. Find a place you can sing happily in and you'll never regret it!! One thing I learned is to be very suspicious of shelf paper that looks new -- if it has been laid on top of decades of grime, or rotten shelves. Keep a sharp eye. An inspector might miss such things -- it's not on their standard list. We had rottenshelves and mouseholes covered up this way. We ended up throwing up our hands and tearing out the whole kitchen, and were glad to do so. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: GUEST,mgarvey@pacifier.com Date: 06 Jan 02 - 03:50 PM I was a realtor in the mid 80s..the worst possible market..and I worked part time for Seattle's probable top realtor (yes, the one with the billboards all over..) Here is the sum of my knowledge: don't buy with someone unless you absolutely must and there is an exit plan...and it can take a fair amount of time to make splitting any equity worth selling.. never ever buy a house with a bad foundation...we were forbidden at my agency to sell them...get earthquake and flood insurance...get electricity and plumbing updated as soon as possible..maybe before moving in..it wasn't that much at the time..a few thousand for plumbing and likewise electricity...get separate meters...take care of dsl, cable etc. at same time...get agreements in writing about landscaping, exterior decoration, what kinds of vehicles can be parked for how long..noise levels..pets.....if one leaves to get married, travel, whatever...what kind of tenants will be allowed...if both parties move out and it becomes a rental I recommend professional management...get lots of insurance... various scenarios: one wants to move out and get married, or divorced or whatever...barely any equity built up...do you walk away, insist on selling to get $5,000. Do you insist on selling if it would put people in the hole? Other scenario: house prices triple and one wants out. Other can't afford to buy the other out. Then what? Gangs take over neighborhood. Value goes way way down. (This happened to me). Meth lab moves in next door. When and at what loss or profit do you sell? mg |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Bobert Date: 07 Jan 02 - 12:48 PM I didn't read every word of the above responses but: 1. If you can possible get financed with the other party leasing from you, this may save you some heartaches and legal fees. Most lenders will look at the money collected from a lease as income in figuring eligibility. 2. Shorter mortgages don't cost you tahe much more a month and will save you a bundle. Check into a 15 or 20 year ans compare the monthly payements and total you will pay over the life of the loan with the 30 year. If you must go with a 30 because of qualifying, try to add and extra $100 or more per month to your payment and this will save you a ton of money. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: M.Ted Date: 07 Jan 02 - 06:45 PM Short mortgages cost you more out of pocket every month--if you are like most of us, your income is relatively fixed--why pay $2389 a month on a 15 year loan, when you can pay only $1834 a month for the same house on a 30 year--or, better yet, you can buy a better house for the same monthly payment? The monthly payments on a 250,000 house financed for 15 years will buy you a 335,000 house, financed for 30 years--(These just happened to be the numbers that the mortgage calculator had in it) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: M.Ted Date: 07 Jan 02 - 06:46 PM Short mortgages cost you more out of pocket every month--if you are like most of us, your income is relatively fixed--why pay $2389 a month on a 15 year loan, when you can pay only $1834 a month for the same house on a 30 year--or, better yet, you can buy a better house for the same monthly payment? The monthly payments on a 250,000 house financed for 15 years will buy you a 335,000 house, financed for 30 years--(These just happened to be the numbers that the mortgage calculator had in it) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Peg Date: 08 Jan 02 - 10:33 AM thanks everyone! Keep 'em coming if anyone thinks of more that has not been covered. I can't wait to print this out and share it with my friends! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: M.Ted Date: 08 Jan 02 - 01:41 PM Peg--have you considered co-housing?--there is a community in progress in Jamaica Plain JP COHOUSING "Cohousing communities are mini-neighborhoods in which each household enjoys a private home along with convenient access to a "common house" with facilities such as a kitchen, a dining room, and a play room for children. There might also be guest rooms, a home office support center, a lounge/library and space for arts and crafts. Each community is different; each community decides what it wants and can afford, according to the priorities of its residents." Not for everyone, but you sound like you would like it--there have been quite a few of these set up around the country, and they have been successful. At one point, I had considered setting one up using Buckminster Fuller's ideas, and it seems like an amazing concept for folk music types, but that is another discussion thread-- |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: Liz the Squeak Date: 08 Jan 02 - 04:52 PM When you pack everything up, write a precis of the contents on the outside of the box, number the box and keep a comprehensive list separately. If you work out which box should go to which room, you can give the movers a list and all should go well. I did it when we moved, and we knew where everything was going, so did the movers and everthing was in it's proper place within an hour of arriving. LTS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: GUEST Date: 09 Jan 02 - 01:31 AM
You will be able to buy at 200% less in three years. The economy is in meltdown. Look at it worldwide! The UK is next because of the Euro. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Buying a house; your best tips? From: M.Ted Date: 09 Jan 02 - 09:39 AM GUEST--You're a bit late with this, I think I got twenty posts telling me last week, via e-mail,--why not just take your herbal viagra, and go back to earning $50,000 in the next 90 days? |