New Edition of Child! - Loomis House Press

Subject: New Edition of Child!
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 28 Feb 02 - 08:43 AM

Volume 1 of Francis James Child's The English and Scottish Popular ballads is now available for purchase from our web store at http://www.loomishousepress.com/. It should also be surfacing soon in the major online booksellers. The price is $24.95 for the paperbound edition, and $34.95 for the library-quality clothbound edition. We have also added a PDF file of the first chapter to our site, for those of you who like to see what you're getting. Many of you mentioned learning about this project on email discussion lists and web boards. We would be grateful if you would pass this information along to others who might be interested. Thank you for your interest and support. Loomis House Press

This is important news to ballad lovers and scholars! The 1965 Dover paperback is going, used, for upwards of $100

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 28 Feb 02 - 08:56 AM

From a look at the pdf, it appears that the revision also includes the tunes for each text, where these are available from Child's sources. I can't think why they didn't mention that in the advance publicity, as it materially adds to the value of the edition. I wasn't originally intending to get this, already having a Dover set, but in the circumstances, and with a hardback option, I think I shall have to...

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Charcloth
Date: 28 Feb 02 - 09:02 AM

FANTASTIC!

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 01 Mar 02 - 01:41 PM

Just to point out that the man responsible for this edition, Mark Heiman, is the same one that's responsible for the Windows and the Mac versions of DigiTrad. He does good things.

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Art Thieme
Date: 01 Mar 02 - 03:17 PM

This special edition of Child incorporates all of what people here at Mudcat think is folk music----including the entire purloined text of the original "Rise Up Singing"---but, for some strange reason, not the new R.U.S. that is a work in progress. Is this a conspiracy??

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Mar 02 - 03:29 PM

Dick...DOES this have all the tunes? Is it just 'some' tunes, or everything that was in Bronson? Enquiring greedy minds need to know!

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Mar 02 - 03:32 PM

I see that it 'says' that Vol. 1 is 673 pages for 53 ballads! That might well inducate the tunes are there. I cannot believe they didn't make it clear!

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: MMario
Date: 01 Mar 02 - 03:45 PM

Well - Riddles Wisely Expounded covers 8 pages and 2 pages of appendix; This includes text for 1A through 1E, with tunes for A,B and E.

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Mar 02 - 03:54 PM

yep...that's a good sign!...If this is all basically 'Bronson' in paperback, it is amazing....

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: GUEST,E.T.
Date: 01 Mar 02 - 04:05 PM

OKay - now who's gonna start work on the accompanying set of tapes/cd's of the whole book???? As indicated on previous thread.

I know a number of people already do a lot of them, want to just post the sign-up sheet and then we can start working to "fill in the blanks"?

Elaine

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Big Mick
Date: 01 Mar 02 - 04:07 PM

Bill, the Loomis page says it is complete and that it has all of Professor Child's corrections and additions. It appears that it ultimately will be several volumes. I am going to order it hardbound.

Mick

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 01 Mar 02 - 04:34 PM

No, not "Bronson in paperback"; it just includes (I assume from the little I've seen) those tunes that go specifically with specific versions included in Child's original work; he included only a small selection of tunes at the time, his primary purpose being to provide a scholarly overview and analysis, not a songbook. Bronson aimed to include all known examples of ballad types listed by Child that had tunes, which was quite a different thing. There will still be a lot for which no tune was recorded, of course. The Loomis reissue will be in 5 volumes like the original; see the website for details.

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: MMario
Date: 01 Mar 02 - 07:51 PM

All I can say is I'm drooling - and hoping my tax return shows up soon!

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 01 Mar 02 - 11:32 PM

And Mark is planning on also releasing an electroni version on CD.

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Mr Red
Date: 02 Mar 02 - 10:18 AM

now that is a "Son of Child" I can play with!

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: GUEST,Russ
Date: 02 Mar 02 - 02:36 PM

Heads Up!

Was in the process of ordering Child Volume 1 from the Loomis website.

Got to the last screen, only to discover that they don't take AMEX, the ONLY credit card I use.

Result: NO SALE

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: SINSULL
Date: 02 Mar 02 - 03:29 PM

Great news, Dick. Hardcover for me too.

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: GUEST, NOMADman
Date: 02 Mar 02 - 04:01 PM

Yes, the payment options are a bit limited. I elected to mail them a check. I wanted to do credit card by telephone, but they didn't give a phone number. Russ, you could try ordering it from a bookstore - one that does take AMEX. Where there's a will there's a way.

regards, John

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: GUEST,Russ
Date: 03 Mar 02 - 10:46 AM

NOMADman,

I know what my alternatives are, but the point of my post wasn't really about buying the book per se.

My complaint is about yet another website that forces me to jump through hoops rather than making online purchasing as quick, easy, and painless as possible.

There I was, every vendor's dream. An impulse buyer, credit card in hand, hot to trot. And what happens? At the last possible moment I learn that consummation is not to be.

Any number of surveys show that websites lose a huge percentage of sales because at some point the potential buyer finally says "screw this." Any of us who purchase online can offer myriad examples from personal experience.

Hell, I don't even need Child, Volume 1. I have a set of the Dover reprints that I bough 35 years ago at $2.75 apiece. I was just trying to encourage a laudable effort by voting with my wallet. I always try to buy from the source if possible to make sure that as much money as possible goes to the people who do the real work.

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 03 Mar 02 - 11:52 AM

I see your point about that; it would help if payment options were made clear at the beginning, and if there were some indication of which shipping options might be appropriate for the book; I had to guess on that one.  So far as AMEX is concerned, increasing numbers of sellers are refusing to accept it, mainly because of the extortionate transaction fees the company levies.

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: GUEST,Russ
Date: 03 Mar 02 - 05:03 PM

Malcolm,

I personally haven't noticed any decrease in the number of local merchants willing to accept AMEX. I have also found that web merchants who don't accept AMEX are the exception rather than the rule. I can recall only one such site in the last year. Same scenario. I'm ready to buy and at the last possible moment discover that AMEX isn't accepted. I didn't buy from them either.

I am not a merchant but what seems like common sense to me is that making a sale is better than not making a sale. If AMEX transactions cost more then figure out a way to factor it into the overhead.

I don't want to sound snotty, but I'd be surprised if Loomis House is doing so well that they can afford to turn away potential buyers.

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 03 Mar 02 - 05:27 PM

We can't accept Amex at Folk-Legacy either, because of their high rates and our low margins. On top of that, we are canceling our personal Amex card since they raised the annual fee. $75 a year for the privilege of flashing a Gold American Express card is simply outrageous. We will continue to accept Discover, although that's also an "ouch!", and Mastercard and Visa. Probably 70% of our on-line sales are made with Visa.

Sandy

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 03 Mar 02 - 05:58 PM

re camsco and Amex: What Sandy said. Convenience is convenience, but getting a customer when costs exceed profit is no business at all.

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: GUEST,Russ
Date: 03 Mar 02 - 11:29 PM

Let me give this a try.

First, God bless vendors like Camsco and Loomis. The world would be a much poorer place without vendors like them.

That said,

I am not suggesting that anyone lose money on AMEX purchases. That would be silly. But surely there are ways to allow people like me to use AMEX and still make the money you want to make.

I've discussed online shopping this with some of my friends and people I work with. I don't know how many of us there are, but for a surprising number of us us shopping online is primarily about three things:
1. Getting exactly what we want.
2. Not trooping futilely from store to store looking for exactly what we want.
3. Not dealing with clueless sales people whose only desire is to sell us what they want us to want.

Notice that "saving money" is not on this list.

We are definitely not people who have more money than we know what to do with. But we are people who highly value our time. All of us are willing to pay a premium to save time. We're happy to pay for convenience.

Suppose I had gone to the Loomis site and discovered that I could use AMEX, but that would incur a $5 additional surcharge. Would I have bought the book? In a heartbeat. It's a no brainer. Is it worth $5 to me NOT to have to spend 30 minutes digging out the checkbook, searching for an envelope and a stamp, driving by the postoffice, etc. etc.

Suppose a number of exclusive AMEX users come to the Loomis site ready to buy. Some pay the premium and buy. Some are annoyed by the preium and don't buy. No matter what the numbers are, Loomis comes out ahead for this group of users.

We are third millenium online shoppers, hear us roar, in numbers too big to ignore.

And yes, I am trying to tell you how to run your business. But I'm just trying to be helpful!!

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: GUEST,Mark Heiman
Date: 04 Mar 02 - 06:07 PM

We sent a note to Russ about this, but since the discussion here is digressing toward credit cards and away from ballads, I just thought I'd chime in.

We can't currently accept American Express because the credit card processor that we were able to get an account with most easily doesn't offer it. We're exploring other options, but when it was a choice between getting online quickly and not supporting AmEx initially, we did what we did. (Let's not digress into a discussion of other processors and payment options, please :)

With regard to ballads, Malcolm is correct -- the new edition incorporates those tunes that are available for the particular texts that Child uses. Some ballads have multiple tunes printed, some have none.

We're currently exploring the possibility of a Bronson edition, but naturally there are rights issues, and we know everyone is eager to see the rest of Child...

For those of you who should be receiving your copies of the book soon, please post to let us know what you think.

(I'm only a casual visitor to Mudcat, so if you need a quick response to a question, please email.)

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: DMcG
Date: 05 Mar 02 - 03:03 PM

Yes, Mark, everyone is eager for the rest of Child. But keep digging away to get Bronson!

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: RolyH
Date: 06 Mar 02 - 08:00 AM

Got mine this morning.I never saw the previous editions but this looks pretty impressive.

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: GUEST,DMcG at Work
Date: 06 Mar 02 - 10:53 AM

My copy arrived this morning. With a twenty-minute look before setting off to work, its not easy to judge but the addition of the music where possible is a major benefit. Excellent work, Mark. (Pity you didn't sign and number the copy as well!)

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Bearheart
Date: 07 Jun 02 - 10:21 PM

I am high as a kite! My dad (who first introduced me to the Child ballads as a kid in the late '60's) just bought me this for my birthday! My own copy of Vol.1! When I think of the hours I spent in the library pouring over editions so old the pages would crack in your hands... Can't wait for the next vol to come out...

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: michaelr
Date: 07 Jun 02 - 11:00 PM

To Dick Greenhaus: I limit my online transactions to absolute emergencies. Is this book available in meatspace bookstores?

Thanks,
Michael

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Gypsy
Date: 07 Jun 02 - 11:01 PM

Yippity! Another reason to get caught up, so i can get the hardbound, too. To digress a wee bit to Russ....it is quite illegal to put any kind of surcharge on credit card use. That includes having a minimum order. 3 complaints result in fines, and the loss of privileges to take the things.

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: mousethief
Date: 21 Jun 02 - 02:58 PM

Got my copy of Volume I in yesterday's mail. THank you, Dick, for starting the thread!

Alex

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 21 Jun 02 - 06:30 PM

AMEX has overcharged since its inception. Many years ago, a business associate and I went to Florida on business. The hotel refused his Amex and I paid our rooms with my MC. A check with others showed that many sites in Miami were refusing Amex at that time.
I applaud Loomis for refusing to use this extortionate company. On the other hand Amex travelers checks are the most accepted, so I am stuck with using them. My bank also uses Amex for their international money orders, which I use if I don't want to put the bill on my card, or cards not accepted.

Waiting impatiently for release of vol. 2.

Subject: RE: New Edition of Child!
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Jun 02 - 07:25 PM

I have the oldest Child in 8 Volumes (1883) as well as the Dover in 5 volumes. I have just ordered Loomis' hardbound volume I.....you just can't have too many Childs (or would it be Children?)

Larry Parish