Origins: In Old Pod-Auger Times

Subject: In old pod-auger times
From: conrad collier
Date: 26 Apr 98 - 04:47 PM

Does anyone know what a pod-auger is? If so, I would be most grateful for a definition/explanation.

You may respond to me directly at:

[e-mail]

Thanks for your help.

Subject: RE: In old pod-auger times
From: Paul Jay
Date: 28 Apr 98 - 10:23 PM

Conrad A Pod Auger was a rather large drill (brace and bit) used to drill out logs in the colonial days so that they might be used as water pipes. In Vermont the term "Pod Auger " was used detrimentially to distiguish someone as old fashioned.

Subject: RE: Origins: In Old Pod-Auger Times
From: Joe Offer
Date: 18 Oct 12 - 01:22 AM

Looks like this song could use some research. Here are the lyrics from the Digital Tradition:

IN OLD POD-AUGER TIMES (DT Lyrics)

I'll sing to you of the good old time
When people were honest and true,
Before their brains were rattled and crazed
By everything strange and new,
When every man was a workingman
And earned his livelihood,
And the women were smart and industrious
And lived for their families' good,
In the days of Andrew Jackson
And of old grand-daddy Grimes,
When a man wasn't judged by the clothes he wore
In old pod-auger times.

Young girls didn't hug nor kiss their fellows
Whenever they came to court,
Nor paddle around on roller skates,
Nor pound a pianoforte.
They kept their men at a good arm's length
And made them know their place,
And they played upon washboards and "kittles" and brooms
With amazing skill and grace.
They didn't lay a-bed 'til eleven A.M. -
Got up in the morning betimes,
And they didn't elope with the old man's coachman
In old pod-auger times.

Young fellows, they loaf about the street
And struggle with bad cigars,
They stay out late when they should be at home
With their daddies and their mas.
They wear tight trousers, likewise tight boots,
And guzzle Lager beer,
And when their daddies foot up the bills
They find them pesky dear.
When my old men were farmer's boys
We'd neither dollars nor dimes,
We worked from daybreak till candlelight
In old pod-auger times.

Oh, the young men didn't drive fast horses
Nor gamble with cards and dice,
They didn't run church lotteries,
For it wan't considered nice.
But now they gamble and drink mean rum
And lead hypocritical lives,
And wives run away with each other's husbands
And husbands with other men's wives.
Folks didn't have delirium tremens
Nor perpetrate horrible crimes,
For the cider was good and the rum was pure
In old pod-auger times.

From Vermont Folk-songs and Ballads, Flanders
Collected from Mr. Brown, West Wardsboro, VT 1930
@nostalgia
filename[ PODAUGER
TUNE FILE: PODAUGER
CLICK TO PLAY
RG

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Here's the Traditional Ballad Index entry on this song:

In Old Pod-Auger Times

DESCRIPTION: "I'll sing to you of the good old times When people were honest and true, Before their brains were rattled and crazed By everything strange and new." The singer grumbles about modern ways, and longs for "old pod-auger times"
AUTHOR: unknown
EARLIEST DATE: 1930 (Flanders/Brown)
KEYWORDS: nonballad
HISTORICAL REFERENCES:
1829-1837 - Presidency of Andrew Jackson
FOUND IN: US(NE)
REFERENCES (3 citations):
Flanders/Brown, pp. 69-71, "In Old Pod-Auger Times" (1 text, 1 tune)
Linscott, pp. 251-253, "In Old Pod-Auger Times" (1 text, 1 tune)
DT, PODAUGER*
ST FlBr069 (Partial)
Roud #3739
CROSS-REFERENCES:
cf. "The Good Old Days of Adam and Eve" (theme) and references there
NOTES [164 words]: We really need a keyword "Whining-about-the-end-of-the-good-old-days." See the cross-references for similar songs.
The song lists the time of Andrew Jackson as the ideal, but I can't see anything in it that's specific to that era.
Linscott states that this comes from Comical Brown's Songs, after "Comical Brown," whom she describes as a nineteenth century solo performer. She gives no other details, however.
According to Young,p. 134, "pod auger days" or "pot auger days" refer to "a long time ago. From the era when fireplaces were used for cooking. A pot auger was an adjustable pot hanger which could raise and lower the pot over the fire to control the cooking temperature." StoryKirwinWiddowson, p. 384, cite various American usages, the earliest in 1833 (i.e. just about the time Andrew Jackson was re-elected) and the last in Maine in 1887, but cite eight Newfoundland uses; it would appear that the term is still in use there, but probably not in the United States. - RBW
Bibliography
• StoryKirwinWiddowson: G. M. Story, W. J. Kirwin, and J. D. A. Widdowson, editors, Dictionary of Newfoundland English, second edition with supplement, Breakwater Pres, 1990
• Young: Ron Young, Dictionary of Newfoundland and Labrador, Downhome Publishing Inc
Last updated in version 4.3
File: FlBr069

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I found the same lyrics as the DT in 101 Plus 5 Folk Songs for Camp, by Mike Cohen (1966, Oak Publications), pp. 34-35.
Notes from the Cohen book:
A Pod Auger was a large twist drill which was used to hollow out the inside of logs to make water pipes out of them. This song tells about the way the young folks were acting foolish and getting out of hand. It was written in the late 1800’s. So take heart kids, folk songs may prove that the complaints you hear from adults today are the same complaints which were heard from adults seventy years ago. The problem just might be that adults like to complain.

Helen Flanders writes in A GARLAND OF GREEN MOUNTAIN SONG:

“Recorded by Mr. Brown, August 27, 1930, in West Wardsboro, Vermont, from the singing of Mr. Almon Robinson, a well known fiddler. This old woods song is known also in Maine. Mr. Robinson learned the song from an old Brattleboro man who sing it in a local concert. He recently dug up some old wooden piping made with a pod-auger that may still be seen in the village.

Mr. H. G. Tupper (deceased) a native of Bakersfield wrote: “You know they used to refer to a lawyer as a ‘pod-auger lawyer,’ meaning a lawyer who was behind the times and old-fashioned. Mr. Darling sent me a copy of this song which he cut out of the Boston Sunday Globe, and said that he heard Hank White sing the song onetime in Chelsea. It may interest you to know that Rev. R. A. Beardslee of Springfield has one of the old-fashioned pod-augers.”

Subject: RE: Origins: In Old Pod-Auger Times
From: Joe Offer
Date: 18 Oct 12 - 07:59 PM

Other versions?

Subject: RE: Origins: In Old Pod-Auger Times
From: kendall
Date: 19 Oct 12 - 07:31 AM

The pod auger has no screw like a "screw auger" has, and that made it harder to work. Where I come from, pod auger means hard work.

Subject: RE: Origins: In Old Pod-Auger Times
From: Jack Campin
Date: 19 Oct 12 - 07:38 AM

What is the etymology of the word?

My initial guess before reading the whole thread was that it had to be a dialect pronunciation of "podagra".

Subject: RE: Origins: In Old Pod-Auger Times
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 19 Oct 12 - 10:47 AM

It's obviously a type of auger so we're only looking for the meaning of 'pod' in this context.

Surely the song is directly related to the American song 'In Good Old Colony Times'.

Subject: RE: Origins: In Old Pod-Auger Times
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 19 Oct 12 - 01:47 PM

Running Pod Auger through Google, then selecting "images" brings up an assortment of pictures and diagrams of tools, but also includes images of sheet music for the tune. Pod Auger. One of theImage links is to the Digital Tradition Mirror at http://sniff.numachi.com
Quack!
GtD.

Subject: ADD Version: In Old Pod-Auger Times
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Oct 12 - 05:45 PM

The Digital Tradition MIDI links aren't working just now, but most of the "sheet music" and online MIDI files seem to come from the Digital Tradition.

The version in Linscott isn't much different:

IN OLD POD-AUGER TIMES
(Comical Brown)

I'll sing to you of the good old times
When people were honest and true;
Before their brains were addled and crazed
By everything strange and new;
When every man was a workingman
And earned his livelihood;
And the women were smart and industrious
And lived for their family's good;
Of the days of Andrew Jackson
And of old Grandfather Grimes;
When a man wasn't judged by the clothes he wore
In old pod-auger times.

Our young men loaf about the streets
And struggle with bad cigars,
They stay out nights when they should be home
With their daddies and their ma's;
They wear tight trousers, likewise tight boots,
And guzzle lager beer,
And when their daddies foot the bills
They find 'em pesky dear;
But when we old men were farmers' boys
We'd neither dollars nor dimes,
But we worked from daybreak till candlelight
In old pod-auger times.

Young gals didn't hug nor kiss their fellers
Whenever they came to court,
Nor paddle around upon roller skates,
Nor pound the pianoforte;
But they kept the men at a good arm's length,
And made 'em know their place,
And they played upon washboards and kettles and brooms
With amazin' skill and grace;
They didn't lie abed till eleven A.M.
But got up in the morning betimes,
And they didn't elope with the old man's coachman,
In old pod-auger times.

The old men didn't drive fast hosses,
Nor gamble with keerds (cards) and dice,
Nor they didn't run church lotteries,
For it wasn't considered nice;
But now they'll gamble and drink mean rum,
And lead hypocritical lives,
And wives run away with each other's husbands,
And husbands with other men's wives;
Folks didn't have delirious trimmin's (delirium tremens),
Nor perpetuate horrible crimes,
For the cider was good and the rum was pure,
In old pod-auger times.

Notes: from the book of Comical Brown's Songs

This very popular ballad of the last century was composed by Comical Brown, an itinerant entertainer who traveled through the East giving a one-man show. The pod-auger was a bit used to bore wooden piping.

lyrics and notes from Folk Songs of Old New England, collected and edited by Eloise Hubbard Linscott (The MacMillan Company, 1939) [1993 Dover reprint of the 1962 Second Edition], page 251.

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I haven't found a recording of this song, but it appears that Rich Bala may have recorded it on his Hudson Valley Traditions album. If anybody would like to record it for us, I'll be glad to post an MP3. The Linscott book does have a melody. I'll transcribe it on request.

-Joe Offer, [e-mail]-

Subject: RE: Origins: In Old Pod-Auger Times
From: barefootboy
Date: 20 Oct 12 - 03:50 AM

Hi Joe and all,

Rich Bala here, and yes Joe, I did record the song on my "Hudson Valley Traditions" album. It is available on CDBaby.com, which has "mp3's" of all the tracks, so you can get the tune from there.

I learned it from an LP ("Stay on the Farm", Philo, 1978) by the "Arm & Hammer String Band" of Vermont, which consisted of Sid Blum, Joel Eckhaus, Pete Sutherland, and Hilary Woodruff. In the liner notes, they credit the Flanders collection as their source.

My understanding of what a "pod auger" is matches Paul Jay's description, with the word "pod" meaning the tripod on which it was placed.

As far as I know, it is not related to "In Good Old Colony Times" (which I also perform), as that song originated in England, whereas this one is native-born.

Great "sleuthing" folks, and thanks to you Joe, for your thorough research! I can always count on you Mudcatters to get to the bottom of things, and I mean that in a good way!

Take care, and stay tuned,
Rich

Subject: RE: Origins: In Old Pod-Auger Times
From: MartinRyan
Date: 20 Oct 12 - 04:17 AM

Several sources suggest the "pod" element is essentially as "peas in a pod" i.e. there is no thread. To me, that suggests more an apple-corer than an auger but that's what they say. Any evidence for the (tri)pod theory?

Regards

Subject: RE: Origins: In Old Pod-Auger Times
From: kendall
Date: 20 Oct 12 - 07:39 AM

The pod auger was a heavy tool used to make big holes in wood. An old man once told me that. He had used one himself.
One of his sayings was, "God damn savagrus, pod auger days".

Subject: RE: Origins: In Old Pod-Auger Times
From: Joe Offer
Date: 21 Nov 12 - 12:48 AM

I hadn't seen Rich's post, but I bought his Hudson Valley Traditions album the day I last posted. It's a wonderful album - great artwork on the cover, too.

-Joe-