Song circles: How to get started?

Subject: Song circles: How to get started?
From: Jon W.
Date: 01 May 98 - 11:13 AM

I've read with jealosy the song circle threads. There don't seem to be any in my area. I've given a little thought to starting one, but since I've never been to one I need to know how they are run, what are typical formats, etc. Do you all sit in a circle and sing the same song together, or do you sit in a circle and take turns performing songs solo while everyone else listens? Any advice would be appreciated.

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: Alice
Date: 01 May 98 - 11:31 AM

Jon, you can do either/both. We have done a 'round robin', each person taking a turn in the circle sining a song, and if the singer wants others to join in, they can. Since you are just starting, I assume you will have a small circle of friends to begin with. I think it is easier that way, because you can set it up with what you are comfortable with (guidelines of what type of songs if you want to do that) and then as others join in, you will have a foundation of the group in place. There are probably as many ways to do it as there are groups.

Alice, montana

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: Alice
Date: 01 May 98 - 11:36 AM

'sining' a song...ooops. That's singing, folks, singing! ...alice

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: Bert
Date: 01 May 98 - 01:15 PM

Well, we just sit around the room and take it in turns. When it is your turn you can do whatever you like. Perform a song, perform a solo instrumental, choose a song that everyone can sing or even start an instrumental jam session.

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 01 May 98 - 01:52 PM

Hi, Jon - I think it helps if you have a core group that can give the circle stability at the beginning. I helped start a circle in Auburn, near Sacramento. The core group was women from one church there, but it soon grew into a more diverse group of about 15 "regulars."
Our three groups in this area used the "Rise Up Singing" (RUS)songbook, and we go around the circle and let each person have a turn at choosing a song for the whole group to sing. As time has gone on, some of us with more sophisticated musical interests have grown tired of RUS, so we've been having an extra, separate jam session with 5 or 6 people who want to fool around with more traditional stuff - but we still return to the Mother Circle (?) every month.
For our regular circles, group singing from RUS works well for us because it gives everyone a chance to participate; but we encourage people to introduce songs that aren't in the book if that's what they'd like to do. If you have too many songs that most people don't know, I think you lose their interest. People like to learn new songs, but won't stand for a whole night of nothing but new stuff.
We bought a case of songbooks (Sing Out! gives a big discount for quantity orders) and set aside a few as loaners, and encouraged "regulars" to buy their own books. It's best to have at least one guitar for accompaniment.
We've found that living rooms work best for meeting places, although it's a challenge to fit everyone in when 40 people show up at the Sacramento circle. The smaller circles (10 to 15 people) meet in the same place every month; but the Sacramento Circle moves around, and we have a recipe box of postcards for notification. You buy 3 cards for a buck and put your address on them, and the host of the next circle is responsible for pasting an announcement on cards and sending them out.
I think it helps to have the circle at a consistent time and day, so people set that day aside. Don't stop for summer - beginning again in the fall will be like starting the circle all over again. Beginning circles seem to work best if they're at the same location every time; but going round-robin helps a large number of people take "ownership" of the Sacramento circle.
So, that's what we do in Sacramento, and it seems to work very well for us.
-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: Moira Cameron
Date: 02 May 98 - 02:44 AM

Like Joe Offer says above, starting with a core group helps. That's what we did here in Yellowknife. We sing in a circle and take turns. Some people pass, but most have something to contribute. We try to discourage people from requesting songs of others in the group, unless it's an all-together chorus number.

The "Rise Up Singing" book by Sing Out! is so well used at our ceilidhs that we refer to it reverently as "The Bible".

Good luck, and remember to have fun!

Moira

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: steve t
Date: 04 May 98 - 06:28 PM

To start a song circle you need:
- a ROUGH idea of where you'd like to end up
- two people who can confidently lead songs
- a place to sing
- some ideas for getting new people

Goals:
In a very large community (or a very homogeneous community) you might be able to decide beforehand on what you want - maybe a circle exclusively for: unaccompanied, traditional cowboy songs with no lyric sheets and at least one verse of yodeling. But your goals will USUALLY have to be tempered by the goals of the other people you find to help you lead the group, but you should be ready to outline SOME goals or nobody will take you seriously.

Core group:
Two confident singers who will show up regularly is a must, at least for me. Everyone else can be gathered slowly over months and months. It requires great determination and pig-headedness for a lone song leader to carry a song circle without help. I've met one guy who managed it though, on his third try.

Look for confident singer(s) at:
- coffee houses and open stages - watch especially for anyone who leads a sing-along song or two
- folk concerts in small venues - ask the proprietor, ask local singers/musicians/organizers who they know
- music stores - ask the people behind the desk for advice on contacts
- music/singing teachers - ask them for contacts
- yes, ugh, you might even find good people in kareoke bars
- church (or ask your friends/relatives who they know at church who might be interested)

It may be much easier for you to find five or six confident singers who promise to show up once a month than to find one who will show up every week. Whatever you do, be prepared to give out your phone number/e-mail and to ASK for phone numbers/e-mail addresses - getting the initial group together may take a long time, circumstances may change, and there may be good reason to call back people who were initially hesitant.

Places to sing include:
- people's houses
- community centers
- church lounges
- university/college lounges
- bars (especially bars with one room for singing and another for talking)
- a park (consider late night mosquitoes when choosing a location).

To get more people you can:
- use word of mouth
- advertise in music stores, coffee shops, telephone poles
- advertise in entertainment guides, newspapers, and community newspapers
- make a one sentence announcement at musical events where you perform

Music circles:
Generally in a music circle, everyone takes turns. They can either:
- lead a song,
- request a song,
- or pass.
In some venues, one can recite a small story or poem. Also, some music circles give people turns but have a GUEST ARTIST who leads every third or fourth song.

Manners/format:
Don't try to formally decide on all guidelines, just a few of them. As the host, you can always say, "tonight only" we're trying it THIS way. You can kill yourself with wondering how to deal with all the different sorts of harmonica players you might run into, and then never have an harmonica player show up at your song circle.

If you attend enough song circles/music circles, you'll see all these guidelines broken in ways that help the mood, and in ways that create disharmony. They aren't rules: they're issues you should be aware of.

Always:
Control of the song is given to the current song leader. You should almost never sing louder than the person who is leading the song. You should never try to "correct" the leader's version in melody, tempo, lyrics, rhythm or whatever.

Options:
Some song circles are set up as "no book" circles. Don't bring paper. Believe it or not, these can be great. Some song circles emphasize:
- unaccompanied (a capella) singing
- songs of a certain genre (camp songs, traditonal songs, …)
- theme nights (such as a sea song night or a Christmas carol night).
- chorus songs -- sometimes everyone is encouraged to ONLY sing the chorus when they are not leading.

Instruments:
I much prefer song circles where the norm is to NOT join in instrumentally, unless asked to do so. When joining in instrumentally, consider:
- whether there is already someone playing lead -- two leads can be tedious.
- whether your style matches the intention of the song leader -- I've seen a lot of nice folk songs pushed towards bluegrass by over-eager instrumentalists.
- what sound is most lacking - does there need to be a fifth rhythm guitar? Or might a shaker or percussion on your guitar top be better, or maybe THE VOCALS deserve all your attention and help?

Odd little notes:

Talking: Planning a break specifically for talking sometimes helps. People WILL talk. Try to figure out how much you'll tolerate beforehand.

Getting up during songs: It really bugs me to see several people get up to go have a smoke or talk just before a string of mediocre singers starts at a song circle.

Making up your mind: Try to make up your mind on what you want before your turn comes. If making a request, try to have at least one alternate request ready, in case your first choice can't be done.

Tuning: if you can't get tuned in half a minute, go tune out of earshot of the group.

Taking requests: Don't do a request if you're not confident you can do it well (that's the only thing I hate about the Rise Up Singing songbook -- it encourages people to ask for songs that some mixed up person then agrees to "try"). Don't sing a song in the key that the song requester would like -- support that person's vocal lead, yes, OR lead the song in your own key.

Messing up songs/forgetting lyrics and chords: It's ok to give up. Your turn will come again.

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: Susan of DT
Date: 04 May 98 - 06:30 PM

When I was in Syracuse there was a folk related concert and someone got up and said he wanted to start a group to get together and sing and to come sign a list if you were interested. If there is any kind of folk event in you r area, this would be a good place to ask for interest. An add in the paper sounds risky. You could try to get interviewed in the paper instead. Or post a sign at the college campus, or food coop, or wherever you think folkies might be. The format can be made to suit the group, but try to exert some kind of control to prevent one person from monopolizing it. Good luck!

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: steve t
Date: 05 May 98 - 12:42 AM

With respect to ads in papers: obviously they're a bad idea if you're running the circle in a private home. But if you're in a public building, in a place like Ottawa, you can usually draw in at least one new person a week with a free ad in various entertainment listings.

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: Moira Cameron
Date: 06 May 98 - 01:20 PM

I disagree with Steve t. We have run our ceilidhs in people's homes for over seven years. Although we do have our low periods as far as attendance is concerned, we tend to average one new person per ceilidh. What really makes the difference is how comfortable people feel. If they feel good and relaxed, it doesn't matter where the song circle is held.

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: steve t
Date: 06 May 98 - 08:04 PM

I was replying to Susan's "An ad in the paper sounds risky."

Moira, you're in a small town somewhere in the far north. When I say it's a bad idea to advertise in papers for events in private homes, I mean that you just don't know who you're going to get in a big city. At least you get SOME screening by relying of word of mouth for "private" events in big cities.

Or were you disagreeing with something else I said?

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: Moira Cameron
Date: 08 May 98 - 12:57 AM

Steve,

Yeah, I guess you're right about the size of the City. If I were still living in Toronto, I wouldn't really be wanting to open my home monthly to a complete bunch of strangers. I've been living in this small city of 18,000 for long enough now to forget about the disadvantages of the big towns.

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: Jon W.
Date: 08 May 98 - 11:28 AM

Thanks for the suggestions. I'm going to keep this idea churning in the back of my mind. Right now I'm leaning towards Alice's and Bert's suggestions of having it round robin format, everyone does their own thing. But as the old saying goes, "so much to do, so little time."

Jon W.

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: erica
Date: 08 May 98 - 12:01 PM

all this talk about song circles has made me want to run out and find some singers to do our thing with...
unfortunately, i don't know how much is going to happen since i have to go back to uni in a couple months. ARRGH! it's frustrating to build a music community when you're not stationary!!
ah well...i just hope i'll be able to find this and use it as reference when i actually get myself together.

Subject: RE: Song circles: How to get started?
From: Bill D
Date: 08 May 98 - 01:19 PM

wish I could invite all those who live in places that are folk-barren to come visit ours..I feel 'almost' guilty for living here in Wash DC and having a good circle for 20 years..(it's been going for 30 or so)...but, if anyone DOES get a chance, let us know... we have been know to create an evening of song for out-of-town guests at the drop of a capo...and I really hope you all find some kindred spirits where you are....