BS: Gaelic Roots and Paddy Glackin

Subject: Gaelic Roots and Paddy Glackin
From: GUEST,petr
Date: 24 Jun 02 - 06:53 PM

I just came back from the week long Gaelic Roots music festival/workshop in Boston College. I dont know if there were any other mudcatters there, although at least 500 musicians and dancers came. THe line up of instructors was spectacular. Fiddlers Tommy Peoples, Kevin Burke, Brendan McGlinchey, Bruce Molsky, Paddy Glackin, John Mcusker, Mairead Ni Mhainaogh (and husband Dermot Byrne) of Altan, (as well as father Francie)also Joe Cormier (concert appearance), (Randal Bays - who filled in for Tommy Peoples - who was unavailable - although on Flute There was Catherine McEvoy, Jimmy Noonan, Pipes - Paddy Keenan, Box - Jackie Daly (as well as the rest of Patrick Street - Andy Irvine, Jed Foley) on Whistle Mary Bergin - on concertina Mary Macnamara, Banjo - Mick Moloney. (as well as a host of other talented musicians, and dance teachers) overall an excellent lineup and program (evening concerts, pub sessions, outdoor dinners) and the beautiful campus of Boston College. You would think there is no reason to complain - however I had one major complaint. That is the program was structured so that everyone had to audition and was assigned to teachers according to their ability and standing. (ie. Beginner, Intermediate, and Advanced) now Im no Frankie Gavin or anything but Ive been playing violin approx. 15 yrs, the last seven (Irish) fiddle and regularly play for dances, imagine my surprise when I found myself in the beginners class next to people who just bought a fiddle in a flea market. The instructor remembered me from the audition and suggested I go to the other classes. Now a number of students (myself included) went to Paddy Glackins class - although we werent assigned to it. Paddy Glackin shows up takes one look at the class and comes back in ten minutes and pronounces that he is only teaching those (19) people on the list and everyone else has to leave (including those who asked if they could listen). Now there were maybe 30 in the classroom - although Ive been to Fiddle tunes (in Pt. Townsend) where as many as 80 people came to Liz Carolls class. (they organizers just put her in a larger class room - and there was never any problem). Imagine my shock again, when we ask the organizers what is going on - and we are told that if we dont like it we can get a refund. (Of course Ive already taken time off and flown to Boston from Vancouver) I was quite offended with Paddy Glackins attitude. Instead of being honoured that so many students came to his class - he insulted them. The organizers then did a little bit of backpedaling and said the fiddle players can go to other unassigned classes with Brendan McGlinchey and Kevin Burke (as they have no problem wiht more students.)

The following day this was changed again, there would be an open class offered with Paddy Glackin and that we should stay in our assigned classes. I have to say that I was so disgusted with Mr. Glackin that I had no desire to learn anything from him, and of course decided to go to whatever class I wanted - whether or not I was on the list (and nobody else really cared) In many ways it was an excellent workshop, and some of the instructors, especially Brendan McGlinchey and Kevin Burke more than made up for Mr. Glackin - however Id have to think twice before spending a lot of money and going this distance to a festival in which I may not even be able to take a class with the instructors that are advertised. Petr

Subject: RE: BS: Gaelic Roots and Paddy Glackin
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 24 Jun 02 - 07:01 PM

--Ive been playing violin approx. 15 yrs, the last seven (Irish) fiddle and regularly play for dances, imagine my surprise when I found myself in the beginners class next to people who just bought a fiddle in a flea market --

No offence intended, petr, but you must really have blown it on the audition.

Murray

Subject: RE: BS: Gaelic Roots and Paddy Glackin
From: GUEST,petr
Date: 24 Jun 02 - 07:17 PM

no offense taken, Murray but my audition was fine, its just that other people I knew also ended up in beginners who didnt belong there. I also knew people in the advanced classes who didnt belong there either. The major problem for the organizers was that over a 100 fiddle players showed up (mostly because they wanted to see Tommy Peoples - who for some reason was unavailable and was replace by Randal Bays (who is also an excellent fiddle player) So they had to divide up the number of players in some way. I expected that each instructor would be able to teach, a little of each (beginner, intermediate, advanced)but thats not what happened - the big names were all the advanced and intermediate classes.

Subject: RE: BS: Gaelic Roots and Paddy Glackin
From: GUEST,p
Date: 25 Jun 02 - 01:43 PM

any other mudcatters at Gaelic Roots?

Subject: RE: BS: Gaelic Roots and Paddy Glackin
From: GUEST,Sharon G
Date: 25 Jun 02 - 05:50 PM

Hi there I was also at Gaelic Roots for the fiddle classes- and I was one of the ones who WAS placed officially with Paddy Glackin. I have a lot of comments on this year's fiddle classes too.

The staff experimented with the structure of the classes this year and instead of having two teachers, fiddle students went to the same teacher morning and afternoon, based on the placements. I overhead Seamus Conolly say that the instructors felt there were very few "advanced" students, and considered most of us intermediate. (I have been playing Irish fiddle for 8 years, and though I'm not a Frankie Gavin either, I do perform regularly in concerts and play for dancers. So that was an "interesting" remark.

The placements were supposed to group students by ability. Overall, in my class that was mostly true, though I was aware of some inconsistencies. Another part of the problem this year was that the scheduling of Paddy Glackin's orginal class was not during the main lesson times, but during the "alternate" classes. Therefore, people who were in any of the other classes might have felt it was more of an "elective" class- the other options at that time were Scottish or Appalachian Fiddle.

In mild defense of Paddy Glackin, he appeared completely overwhelmed by the numbers that first class. He wanted to listen to students individually at times to correct them until they got it "right". There were far too many in the room for him to do that. Also, I think he was following the model of schools like the one at Willie Clancy week, which uses placements. Althouh Paddy is a great player, he didn't really have a lot of "charisma" and didn't connect personally with the students. Maybe it is shyness, or just personality. He relaxed more by the end of the week, but never enought to try to learn any of our names.

WHen I attended Gaelic Roots in 1999 and 2000, the well-known players each taught an "intermediate" and "advanced" class. In 1999 we self-selected the class. In 2000, Kevin Burke & Martin Hayes were instructors. There were supposed to be placements that time, but Martin got all the fiddle students together and told them to choose intermediate or advanced based on how quickly they thought they would learn the tunes by ear. I attended the advanced classes and felt like I was in the right level, though clearly not the most advanced student.

I was anxious about the placements in the first place- I thought for a long time about what to play, and decided on a set dance (the Blackbird) instead of a reel. I played about 8 bars, and asked, "Is that enough?" They indicated it ws, but to my surprise, Paddy Glackin then asked me "Can you play any jigs?" (in a way that sounded to me like he was asking: like- do you know how to play a jig). Okay..... so I did play part of a jig for them.

I actually had wanted to study with Brendan McGlinchey, and attended his 1st class and his "extra" class. I would have gone to his morning class everyday, but then they changed Paddy's class to 9 am and it conflicted. I was disappointed with this year's structure because I wanted to study with more than one of the teachers.. I think Seamus Connolly did try to fix it as best he could, but he had already painted himself into a corner with the next structure.

I sympathize with you Petr, because it wasn't what either of us expected. I hope you felt like it was worthwhile overall.

Sharon

Subject: RE: BS: Gaelic Roots and Paddy Glackin
From: Barry Finn
Date: 25 Jun 02 - 09:34 PM

though I haven't been to a "Roots" fest in a number of years, living in or near the Boston area, the festival has become huge in comparsion to yrs before. Sharon when you mention what Seamus Connolly said about the experience level you may take a moment to peak at it from his eyes. He is one of a handful concidered to be among the best in the world, then you have Paddy Glackin, Kevin Burke, Tommy Peoples though not there is also an old style teacher. And the past yrs the teachers list reads like a who's who. I don't know about what Seamus's enviorment is now but yrs ago & for yrs it was very common to hit a session or pary with him & the likes of Paddy Cronin, Frankie Gavin, Johnny Cunningham, etc, in one place not to mention their equals on other instruments. It's mentioned that none here are a Frankie Gavin. If I had only been playing for 8-15 yrs I would not take any offence (that's not an insult if you see yourself from their eyes), most of them have been playing near 50 yrs, continuously & constantly, with the fiddle as a limb & in a life style where eating tunes is the family (Seamus's brother is his peer on the box) breakfast & digesting them by evening is the local supper. Where growing up & living in a village where playing is not a social event it's a part of life, past on from grandparent to godchild from neighbor to shopkeeper, they really do come from a world that's grows smaller every day with the constant passing of the oldtimers, that musical lifestyle is disappearing so give a little slack if it wasn't the ideal musical experience god knows they've also given a life's worth trying, mostly with great results, after all look where it come from in the past 50 yrs. Knowing Seamus for at least 25 yrs, I'm not going out on a limb by saying his only intention's for Irish music & the fiddle is to give it, out of love, back in the best why he can to those that love or just like it &/or want to embrace it. I don't know if it got out of hand, if a wrench got into the works of if a new plan didn't work out right, but I am sure that he'll make it right the next time around, the record of this week long festival speaks for itself, it's alway been growing & like any thing else it has some of the same growing pains that any musician has. I hope none took any offence here, I didn't intend it, just wanted to show what maybe a different view from a maybe different kind of life experience. Sorry to blab on, Barry

Subject: RE: BS: Gaelic Roots and Paddy Glackin
From: GUEST,petr
Date: 25 Jun 02 - 09:59 PM

thanks for your comments Sharon,

I have a great deal of respect for Seamus Connoly, its a huge undertaking to organize this kind of festival and to keep everyone happy (both students and instructors). However, when I go to a festival that advertises certain instructors, I expect to be able to take classes from them. If I had stayed in my assigned class - I would not have had a chance to go to Brendan McGlincheys class, or to Kevin Burkes or Paddy Glackins (I have nothing against Laurel Martin or Randal Bays - they are wonderful players but that was not why I went there. Its not an inexpensive workshop and its also fair distance from Vancouver).

I was really disappointed at Sandy's (Seamus' wife) attitude that - 'if you dont like it you can have a refund' I didnt want a refund, I just wanted to study with the well known players. (in the end I did anyway and no one had a problem with that - except Paddy Glackin.

To be fair, the way the class was posted there were not many other obvious classes on Mon. morning so its understandable that so many people went to Paddys class - but I dont think he handled it terribly well - it was quite rude in fact - and there werent 80 people as Seamus joked in the concert (there were maybe 30 at best).

As someone whos attended Fiddle Tunes at Port Townsend for the last 5yrs - where people go to whichever instructor they want - it would be an outrage to be kicked out of a class because theres too many people.

(of course people have different personalities and some are much better teachers than others - I would rank Liz Carrol among the best as well as Randal Bays, and Bruce Molsky who clearly have thought a lot about the subject. while some fiddle players, may be excellent players but not necesarily good teachers - (Kentucky Fiddler Charlie Walden comes to mind - who once told one of the players to 'airbow' at the band lab concert )

I also see the organizers standpoint that they dont want everyone to go to the big name players - as the instructor may never come back. INterestingly Sandy said Bruce Molsky asked 'please dont put me in a class with 300 students' but then suggested that we either go to either Bruces or John Mcuskers (scottish) class after the Paddy Glackin 'incident'.

Overall I found it a very enjoyable festival, and I really liked Brendan McGlincheys as well as Kevin Burkes classes - I especially found Brendan a very friendly and helpful person - he never did get to know us by name but he did recognize and talk to me a few times outside of the classes.

I also really enjoyed Peter Barnes beginner whistle class. He was an excellent teacher and a really fun personality.

I think the organizers were quite overwhelmed by the fiddle students - most of whom obviously came to see Tommy Peoples - who backed out for some reason. I also think they felt they had a lot of intermediate students and didnt quite know what to do with them. Their ranking systems did seem to be all over the place, a lady I know from Vancouver (and Ive played with sessions and ceili dances for 6 years) was placed in Randals total beginners class. It didnt make sense.

WHile I would consider myself intermediate, I played in sessions with someone that was in Paddy Glackins advanced class - and I know that she was not more advanced than I was (I dont mean this in any superior or arrogant way - I will always consider that Im never as good as I could be, just that the ranking didnt make sense)

Seamus will probably experiment with other formats, but I feel that the best option would be to give people a choice - have the well known players offer classes in all levels and everyone is happy.

As for me, Im not sure if Ill go back. PEtr

Subject: RE: BS: Gaelic Roots and Paddy Glackin
From: GUEST,Sharon G
Date: 26 Jun 02 - 02:08 AM

Barry- I have absolutely no disagreement with any of your comments. I have great respect for Seamus Connolly - he is a genius among fiddlers, a true gentleman and has created a unique program with Gaelic Roots. & Everything you said about the traditional musicians and their experiences and perception is something I'm aware of and appreciate.

It's definitely a reality check to come to Gaelic Roots- It's easy to overestimate skills or progress when you're more isolated (like me, in Arizona) and of course, I aspire to a higher level of playing than I'm able to reach at this point in my life. I have found the experience at Gaelic Roots both inspiring and discouraging.

As far as "advanced & intermediate" - they have different connotations depending on the context. In the case of GR classes in the past, intermediate players would be those who could play a variety of tunes, but not necessarily with ornaments or up to speed, while advanced were those who could play many tunes up to speed and were more interested in style. Compared to the instructors, there really aren't very many students at GR who are truly advanced players.

Anyway - thanks for the comments- Sharon

Subject: RE: BS: Gaelic Roots and Paddy Glackin
From: GUEST,petr
Date: 27 Jun 02 - 08:12 PM

Thanks for your comments Barry, I also agree with your points and realize there are bound to be growing pains with any festival etc. However from a student point of view, I paid a lot of money and came a long way to the festival - and one would expect to be able to go to classes with the people that are advertised and not herded like sheep. On another note, a friend who came to the festival as a dancer was surprised to find out (after she got there) that if she wanted to take the written exam for teachers she must wear a suit. (which she hadnt packed of course).

one of the reasons the festival format changed this year was because Seamus went to Fiddle Tunes in Port Townsend Washington, really liked the format and wanted to model Gaelic Roots after it. (Now Fiddle Tunes has 2 classes in the morning and a bandlab in the afternoon, you can choose to go to any teacher you like as well as take his/her bandlab in the afternoon but GR ended up auditioning people for level and assigning the same teacher morning and afternoon - so unless you 'broke the rules' and went to an unassigned class you re stuck with the same instructor all week.

It would definitely make me think twice about going to a festival with that format. Petr

Subject: RE: BS: Gaelic Roots and Paddy Glackin
From: GUEST,SeanN
Date: 27 Jun 02 - 10:58 PM

I think the "problem" here (if there really is one) is down to cultural differences between the format often used in Ireland (which I find to be somewhat elitist and often alienating), and that used in the US/Canada.

The NA side of the pond, we tend to think things should be done democratically, ie, let the students choose the teacher. It is (at least at most schools I'm aware of) done the opposite way in Ireland, where the teachers/organizers place the students.

I agree that there should be a disclaimer given at NA schools like GR, where the classes will be structured and students assigned "Irish style". That way, if someone doesn't like their placement, then the refund option wouldn't seem the least bit rude, as it would have been spelled out just like that.

I honestly don't know what the "best case scenario" would be for NA festival workshops like GR, which does bring in some very fine "master players" to teach, but not very advanced players as students.

But then again, I can't imagine anyone being unhappy that they would get a week's tuition with Kevin Burke, either.