anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)

Subject: anyone know this song
From: GUEST,johntm
Date: 06 Jul 02 - 08:16 PM

In "At Swim, Two Boys", novel by Jamie O'Neill there is a reference to a woman walking along singing a song about a swan over a lake, black water, swan dipping down, white wings flasing, slowing, slowing, slowing 'til silver riplles carried it home."

Speaker said Yes this is Ireland.

Anyone have any idea what song he might have been referring to? No indication in the book

Johntm

Subject: RE: anyone know this song
From: Helen
Date: 06 Jul 02 - 08:26 PM

I thought the novel was called "At Swim Two Birds" and that the author's name (or pseudonym) was Flann O'Brien. But my knowledge of the novel ends there, I'm afraid. Used to have a copy, tried to read it because people told me it was worth reading and funny, but gave up and sold it when the wof was at the door, financially speaking.

The "song" isn't a reference to any of William Butler Yeats' poems is it?

Helen

Subject: RE: anyone know this song
From: Jon Bartlett
Date: 07 Jul 02 - 07:41 PM

No, this is a new book, not At Swim Two Birds. Sorry, can't help with the song ref.

Subject: RE: anyone know this song
From: katlaughing
Date: 07 Jul 02 - 10:28 PM

Nothing on the song, but one can view some beautiful photographs of the areas written about, plus read some comments by the author, contact the author (and ask him?), and even read the first chapter by clicking here. It sounds like a very good book, judging from the reviews on Amazon and elsewhere.

Thanks,

kat

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: Mrrzy
Date: 08 Jul 02 - 02:38 PM

Not Polly Von?

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: Emma B
Date: 08 Jul 02 - 03:16 PM

I think Polly/Molly Bhan (sorry about the fada) was shot on dry land! I can't think of any jury member who'd accept the white pinafore plea!

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: vectis
Date: 08 Jul 02 - 07:57 PM

Could it be a song about the children of Lir? They were changed into swans but stayed on the lake near their home. Can't remember the rest of the story though.

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: GUEST,johntm
Date: 08 Jul 02 - 08:38 PM

Kat and others

Thanks. I emailed Jamie O'Neill. Waiting for an answer.

The book is beautifully written, incredible vocabulary, somewhat schematic but the humor and writing carry it along. Interesting picture of Padraig Pearse..

I dont know what Polly/Molly Von or Bhan is.

JohnTm

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: Helen
Date: 08 Jul 02 - 08:43 PM

vectis,

The Children of Lir connection was what I was thinking about (hidden in vague recollections of my subconscious) when i mentioned Yeats' peoms: The Wild Swans at Coole - is that related to the Lir story?

Helen

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: GUEST,johntm
Date: 09 Jul 02 - 08:42 PM

Were the Wild Swams of Coole ever set to music?

Still no answer from Mr O'Neill to my query at his web site.

John M

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: vectis
Date: 09 Jul 02 - 08:53 PM

I think the "Children of Lir" was a traditional fairy story from Ireland. I heard/read it so long ago I can only remember fragments.

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: alison
Date: 09 Jul 02 - 09:08 PM

you can read about the children of Lir here

slainte

alison

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: Allan C.
Date: 09 Jul 02 - 09:38 PM

One of the songs that refers to that story is "Silent O Moyle".

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: The Pooka
Date: 09 Jul 02 - 10:19 PM

For whatever relevance, my old edition of The Norton Anthology of English literature footnotes The Wild Swans at Coole with, "I.e., Coole Park, Lady Gregory's country estate, where Yeats was a frequent guest." The Yeats chapter's introduction states that beginning in 1897, at this Galway estate he "discovered the attractiveness of the 'country home ideal', seeing in an aristocratic life of elegance and leisure in a great house a method of imposing order on chaos and a symbol of the neo-Platonic dance of life."

Another oldie-and-moldie text, The College Survey of English literature, includes the volume entitled "The Wild Swans at Coole" among Yeats' later work, in which he moved away from songs (in the poet's words) -

Covered with embroideries Out of old mythologies.

In 1924 he wrote: "My friends and I loved symbols, popular beliefs, and old scraps of verse that made Ireland romantic to herself; but the new Ireland, overwhelmed by responsibility, begins to long for psychological truth."

Now, whether and/or how this may or may not pertain to the Children of Lir, I dunno.

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: The Pooka
Date: 09 Jul 02 - 10:25 PM

Wrong clickie above, sorry; hope this one works - Click here

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: GUEST,johntm
Date: 10 Jul 02 - 02:22 PM

Thanks guys. Does not sound the song that the author writes about although the theme and words in Silent O Moyle are close. Still have not heard from Mr. O'Neill

johnm

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: GUEST,Sophie
Date: 10 Jul 02 - 02:31 PM

Im sure this is not an Irish song im almost certain i heard RONNIE DREW singing this song last year.

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: The Pooka
Date: 10 Jul 02 - 06:05 PM

As referenced above, Molly Bawn (Polly Vaughn 2) in the DT. I think John McCormick recorded a different "Molly Bawn", but I haven't searched for it.

Have to get "At Swin, Two Boys"; thanks for the info. (Must confess some partiality toward "At Swim-Two-Birds", owing to the devilish O'Brien/na gCopaleen character named The Pooka Fergus MacPhellimey. (mmmWAAA-ha-haaaa :)

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: GUEST,johntm
Date: 10 Jul 02 - 06:43 PM

The Pooka

Thanks for Molly Bawn correction.

At Swim Two Boys copies some other things from At Swim-Two Birds.....multiple openings, debates between good and evil representatives,, etc....

Subject: RE: anyone know this song: swan over a lake (Ireland)
From: GUEST,johntm
Date: 12 Jul 02 - 09:06 PM

I heard from Jamie O'Neill. The song is of his own making, a type of Irish wistfulness. "She Moved Through the Fair" sung by Sinead O'Connor on The Long Black Veil by Chieftains helped inspire him.

John TM