Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!

Subject: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 24 Sep 02 - 12:28 PM

Well we hit the magic 100 so we go round again. I'm enjoying every bit of this thread.

Do you sing with your eyes open or closed? Why?

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Crane Driver
Date: 24 Sep 02 - 05:42 PM

Closed. I hate to see people suffer.

Andrew

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Noreen
Date: 24 Sep 02 - 06:20 PM

Continued from:Eyes open or closed?

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: CraigS
Date: 24 Sep 02 - 06:55 PM

I try to sing with my eyes open - but when I sweat, the sweat is acid, and it makes my eyes sting. If I'm nervous, I sweat more. If I'm not playing as I sing, I wipe the sweat out of my eyes as I go along. If I'm playing, I close my eyes because otherwise it hurts. If I've been playing in public frequently I'm less nervous, so I can go four to five songs without shutting my eyes. Two weeks ago I played a two-song floorspot in a club for the first time in three months. Just before I went on someone told me that a man in the audience would give our new band it's first gig if I was good. My eyes were shut before I'd played two lines! (We got the gig)

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: GUEST,Boab
Date: 25 Sep 02 - 04:54 AM

By closing your eyes, you exclude most of what goes on around you, and thereby make mental concentration easier. As an engineering apprentice, one of the first things I learned from the old hands was, in attempting to fit a nut on a fine-pitch thread in an awkward position, to close my eyes and concentrate on the touch sense. It works, time and time again!

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Schantieman
Date: 25 Sep 02 - 01:53 PM

I agree - it does make concentration easier. Many's the time I've been distracted by something going on and nearly (or actually) stopped singing.

On the other hand, it does make communicating with the audience harder (someone must have said this before!). I suppose it depends how well you know the song - and there's only one answer to that!

Steve

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: An Croenen
Date: 25 Sep 02 - 06:16 PM

I try to keep my eyes open because it allows me to communicate/connect with the audience, but when I'm well into an emotional song I will close my eyes or look sideways so that I don't see anybody. i don't go off into my own world unless I'm sure I've got the audience with me. An

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: An Croenen
Date: 25 Sep 02 - 06:16 PM

I try to keep my eyes open because it allows me to communicate/connect with the audience, but when I'm well into an emotional song I will close my eyes or look sideways so that I don't see anybody. i don't go off into my own world unless I'm sure I've got the audience with me. An

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 29 Sep 02 - 02:41 PM

Jaws is another one! Have you noticed any one singing with their jaws clamped shut? It exudes a strangulated sound.

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: RWJ
Date: 29 Sep 02 - 02:47 PM

I try to keep my eues open to stop the audience walking out

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 14 Oct 02 - 08:19 AM

#;-) eye'm still watching, but only with one eye!

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 Oct 02 - 08:31 AM

How about closing your eyes while you are listening to a song of a piece of music? I quite often do that.

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Kim C
Date: 14 Oct 02 - 10:19 AM

Bruce Springsteen is notorious for the jaws-clamped-shut thing. It makes too much stress on the neck and face. Ouch.

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 15 Oct 02 - 09:49 AM

I find that if I close my eyes when singing, I hear myself better. As a result, I sing more in tune and keep better control over the tone.

I don't sing to the public, so the question of looking at others doesn't arise. I do recommend practicing with your eyes closed to anyone.

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Thomas the Rhymer
Date: 15 Oct 02 - 10:55 AM

When I'm at home, I often sing with my eyes closed. But then again, I'm often reading lyrics, and thats even more removed from the present visual moment. If I'm distracted by a beautiful woman, I often like to look at everyone but her... unless she is actually into the music... If we're in love and it's OK... eye contact with her durring the songs is fantastic! In the last year or so, I've been watching the scene a lot more while I'm playing. It is just so much more fun to notice the "where it's at"...

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 04 Nov 02 - 01:33 PM

refresh

((X))

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Nov 02 - 02:17 PM

I was observing myself at the weekend's Winter Sing in Buntingford, and I found that more often than not I found myself closing my eyes to listen to other singers. It just seems to sound better.

Mind, this kind of thing makes it harder to be sure whether the singers were closing their eyes too...

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Crane Driver
Date: 04 Nov 02 - 02:29 PM

Reminds me of a time a friend was singing a long, bad salad with his eyes shut, and we all crept out. When he finished and looked around, he was alone. Laugh? We nearly started.

Andrew

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Deni-C
Date: 10 Mar 03 - 08:16 AM

You don't just communicate with eye-contact. I sometimes like looking at singers who sing with their eyes closed, because free from any embarrassment caused by my staring at them, I can concentrate on the song and enjoy how much they are getting into their performance. I don't feel shut out. I feel included.


who's going to start a new thread.

'Singing with mouths open or closed.....'

Remember that guy from amen corner who sang with his teeth together. If you can't see their fillings it's not folk....


Deni

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: beadie
Date: 10 Mar 03 - 03:02 PM

If you want the classic image of clenched teeth singing, get a video of an old George Jones performance. The man looks like a frustrated ventriloquist.

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Jul 03 - 01:18 PM

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Jul 03 - 04:49 PM

"Do you sing with your eyes open or closed? Why?"

Yes. Because I've never learned to do anything else with them. :)

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Deckman
Date: 15 Jul 03 - 08:19 PM

Open ... because I like to see myself! Bob

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Kim C
Date: 15 Jul 03 - 08:36 PM

Since we first started this discussion, and so many people said they thought it was rude to sing with eyes closed, I have tried to be more conscious of it. There are still some situations that require me to not look at anything, lest I lose my concentration.

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Deckman
Date: 15 Jul 03 - 08:45 PM

Kim C ... are we still talking about singing? Bob (hee hee)

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Rapparee
Date: 16 Jul 03 - 09:00 AM

Open. Definitely wide open. How else can you dodge what the audience is throwing?

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: GUEST,minkest
Date: 16 Jul 03 - 09:20 AM

Even if my eyes are open, very often I'll not register anything visually until I finish the song - then its always a weird shock as my senses come back online. Occasionally I'll see very darkly, but its almost like 2d - mostly I'm not aware of anything but the act of singing.
I am not whether its chicken or egg, but when I'm singing less completely then I hear and see more of the outside world (or vice versa).

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Deckman
Date: 16 Jul 03 - 11:53 PM

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Aug 03 - 02:06 AM

Isn't THIS a music thread stuck below the line? Where are the clones?

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: mousethief
Date: 04 Aug 03 - 02:24 AM

I thought it must be about kissing.

Alex

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: JennyO
Date: 04 Aug 03 - 08:11 AM

.....send in the clones,
there aught to be clones.........

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 31 Mar 05 - 06:21 AM

Any new ideas on this subject?

Sal

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: GUEST,MBSLynne
Date: 31 Mar 05 - 06:38 AM

Only just seen this thread for the first time. I usually sing with my eyes open, because I like to see audience reaction, especially when I'm singing funny songs. You couldn't really sing a music hall type song with your eyes shut! However, when I sang the four-part song at Miskin at the weekend, I found it was easier with my eyes shut, partly because I could then concentrate better on my part, and partly because it increased the sensation of being part of a group and blending our voices together. Having discovered this, I may try closing my eyes when I sing a serious song occasionally and see how that feels.

I've only just started playing my recorder in public and I've found that I am far less nervous and make less mistakes if I close my eyes to play.

Love Lynne

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 02 May 06 - 05:43 PM

Here I am again...Any new ideas on this subject?

Sal

Subject: RE: BS: Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: keberoxu
Date: 08 May 16 - 06:27 PM

Not for me to decide where this thread belongs in relation to The Line. I came here from the earlier thread that started the discussion. [Yes, it should have been in the music section. -Joe Offer-]

Yes, this question, regarding singing in public, in concert, with the audience directly before you, does polarize people. My own experience comes out of recitals of classical music: those I have attended myself; and the legendary singers I am too young to have seen, but whom people recall seeing. There are vivid opinions both ways.

I recognize the sentiments and the choices of words, not at the OP of this newer thread, but in the OP of the earlier thread (August 22, 2002).   It is like the echo of a conversation that I recall from many years earlier: I was a young student, the speaker was a retired classical singer, and he was speaking of the late Marian Anderson.

Marian Anderson was on the concert/recital stage for years and years, both when her voice was in its prime, and, sadly, long after her voice was too aged to sound as it had once done. And Ms. Anderson was well-known for shutting her eyes when she poured that deep great voice into any given song, be it the German Lied or an African-American spiritual -- she sang both with equal authority.

The older singer of whom I spoke, had spent much of his career in opera and in the theater, with some distinction, he was a very worldly, sophisticated person. Eyes Open was his default position. And he sounded as frustrated as Mrs. Lemon, if not more so, when he spoke of looking at Ms. Anderson with her eyes shut and singing away: "She cut herself off from her audience!" he protested, and passionately too, I can still hear his vehemence.

Ms. Anderson was venerated, adored, by many -- ever see that television interview with Odetta (Dick Cavett), when she described how she first walked up to Ms. Anderson in order to say something about how much she meant to her, and she -- Odetta the Great -- dissolved into tears on the spot? So I can just imagine all those people in the audience who would respond indignantly and vehemently that Ms. Anderson could do no possible wrong. As she was well before my time, I never experienced anything but the documents/recordings she left behind.

But I prefer not to generalize with singers, for singing is such a particularly intimate engagement of one's individual character, and what works for one singer will be thoroughly inappropriate for another singer. From what I can observe of Marian Anderson, when she closed her eyes and sang, she did what was most natural and characteristic for her, regardless of the expectations of the public.   She certainly had people coming out in their droves to attend her performances, regardless.

Subject: Please Open Your Eyes!
From: Andy7
Date: 26 May 16 - 06:42 PM

A plea to all folk singers: please open your eyes, when you're singing to an audience!

I see very many singers - including amazingly good singers! - go through a whole song with closed eyelids.

Yes, I can totally appreciate that you're 'in the zone', and feeling very deeply the song that you're performing.

But your audience - whether a packed auditorium or a handful of fellow members at a folk club - would love to see your eyes, and have that personal connection with you as you sing!

Subject: RE: Please Open Your Eyes!
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 May 16 - 06:50 PM

And I'd add people who play instruments too. For years I thought I could play only with my eyes tight shut. Someone told me off so I made the effort, and I never looked back. I was more relaxed, more in touch with the audience as well as the other chaps in the session - and I'll swear that I played better!

Subject: RE: Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: meself
Date: 27 May 16 - 01:14 AM

There's something wrong with anyone who thinks there's something wrong with someone closing their eyes when they're singing or playing an instrument. If you don't like it, ask for your money back.

Subject: RE: Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: vectis
Date: 27 May 16 - 06:38 AM

I have noticed that singers that perform to large audiences and are used to being unable to see them are more prone to singing with their eyes closed. Folk club performers destroy the intimacy of their performance when they close their eyes and I, personally, find it rude.

Subject: RE: Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 27 May 16 - 06:43 AM

It was suggested to me that a useful technique was to sing with your eyes open, but pick a spot slightly above the heads of the audience so that looking directly at them doesn't become a distraction to the song - they are not looking at a 'closed' face - you are looking at the song.
Eye contact is fine in some types of song, but, in my opinion, never necessary unless you have no confidence in the song working (a sort of, "nudge, nudge - know what I mean")
We once asked Walter Pardon where he looked while he was singing - he replied; "At the microphone, if there is one - if there' isn't, down my nose"
He compared singing to reading a book _ "You've got to have imagination; there's no pont of singing a song if you can't see it".
He was a prodigious reader and had read all of Dickens and Hardy at least half a dozen times and could tell chunks from them all as detailed stories.
He once said, "it's a pity you can't read with your eyes closed" much easier to get into it".
Of all the singers we met, Walter was the most insistent that you had to become involved in the songs yourself to make them work.
Not sure that is possible if you are trying to catch the attention of a sea of faces.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Jack Campin
Date: 27 May 16 - 10:00 AM

your audience - whether a packed auditorium or a handful of fellow members at a folk club - would love to see your eyes, and have that personal connection with you as you sing!

You get an even better personal connection if you sing with your flies open. Especially with a really attractive audience.

Subject: RE: Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Harmonium Hero
Date: 27 May 16 - 10:13 AM

As one of the guilty parties, I should throw in my tuppence worth, I suppose. If I'm singing a ballad, I'll probably have my eyes closed; if it's something lighter, or a chorus song, then I sing with my eyes open. It's all very well talking about communicating with the audience, but I've always been a nervous performer (although less so if I'm out singing regularly, which just isn't happening at the moment), and I often have to close my eyes, even in a song where I normally would have them open, because I'm struggling to concentrate. Which is more important - seeing my eyes or hearing the right words?
Someone above commented on audiences having their eyes closed, and I have often noticed this when I'm singing - and no, they haven't fallen asleep! There's no intention of rudeness on my part. I'm just trying to perform the song as well as I can. It's not about me; it's about the song, and it's the song that should be communicating with the audience. This ain't showbiz.
John Kelly.

Subject: RE: Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 27 May 16 - 10:48 AM

"You get an even better personal connection if you sing with your flies open. Especially with a really attractive audience."
I knowwwwwww!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 27 May 16 - 10:50 AM

I'm sure you all know the policy of Burn's Crochalan Fencibles:
"Sing a sang, tell a story or put your prick on the table".
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Ged Fox
Date: 27 May 16 - 11:01 AM

"it's about the song, and it's the song that should be communicating with the audience. This ain't showbiz."

If that were true, we might as well stay at home and listen to CDs

Subject: RE: Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: meself
Date: 27 May 16 - 11:30 AM

A singer should not only keep his eyes open, he should also roll them, widen and narrow them, squint, and, furthermore, should mug, pull faces, leer, ogle, grimace, and otherwise put his face through a series of contortions as a source of ongoing amusement - if a singer fails to do this, I will feel personally insulted. Nor will I be entirely pleased if a singer refrains from gamboling, capering, and prancing. It should be noted as well that the occasional somersault or cartwheel is never out of order, but, of course, these acrobatics are not to be overdone - it is all about the song and the singing, after all.

And don't get me started on the perversity of those instrumentalists who refuse to maintain the grin of a deranged chimpanzee while they play ... how dare they inflict such painful humiliation on their listeners!!

Subject: RE: Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: meself
Date: 27 May 16 - 11:48 AM

Don't worry - pretty soon we'll be able to just lie in our pods with electrodes or something stuck in our brains and lead completely satisfying lives without ever having to interact with another human being. And we can have all the entertainment we want on our own terms! Can't come soon enough ....

Subject: RE: Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Tunesmith
Date: 27 May 16 - 12:58 PM

I love the way Willie Nelson has his eyes open.
His eyes seem to wander over the audience but I have the feeling that he's lost in the song and doesn't really look at anything in particular.

Subject: RE: Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: meself
Date: 27 May 16 - 02:26 PM

I find it rude when I have the feeling that a singer is lost in the song and isn't really looking at anything in particular.

Subject: RE: Singing with Eyes Open or Closed? Again!
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 27 May 16 - 02:58 PM

"I find it rude when I have the feeling that a singer is lost in the song "
I feel cheated when they aren't.
He or she's there to address the song, not you.
Jim Carroll