The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's

Subject: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: Fay
Date: 19 Nov 02 - 12:48 PM

I am doing the degree up in Newcastle and for part of this year's work I'm carrying out a study of the state of traditional song in West Yorkshire in the 60's and 70's.

I am interested in the emerging clubs, festivals, publications, broadcasts and key figures of the 'revival' scene as well as people continuing traditions in the area.

I'm trying to create an overview of what was actually happening, repertoire, setting, situation, practitioner - basically who was doing what, where, when and possibly why.

If you have any information you think I might find useful, please give me whatever you can. I might be looking for more specific things in the future, this is just a starting point to try and get my head rolling.

Thanks for your time, Love Fay

---

Click for related thread

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: nutty
Date: 19 Nov 02 - 01:08 PM

With regard to song - one of the best people to contact is Will Noble from Shepley who is a traditional singer of note in the Holme Valley Tradition.

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: Mitch the Bass
Date: 19 Nov 02 - 02:35 PM

Fay,

I was brought up in Huddersfield, leaving for University in London in 1969. I had some contact with folk clubs, musicians and dancers in the area until about 1974.

Let me know if I can help.

Mitch

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: harvey andrews
Date: 19 Nov 02 - 06:51 PM

Does "traditional" exclude us songwriters working the folk clubs and festivals then? I have a list of every venue I've ever played, fee paid etc plus press cuttings and magazines from the time. If you could give me the exact part of the country you're covering I'd be happy to pass it on.

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: nutty
Date: 19 Nov 02 - 08:57 PM

A 'PM' to Malcolm Douglas (Sheffield Area) could also reap results.

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: Greycap
Date: 20 Nov 02 - 04:58 AM

I was at Harrogate folk club as secretary for some of the 60's - any way I can help, I will.

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: greg stephens
Date: 20 Nov 02 - 05:02 AM

Boris howarth and Martin Cummins would be people to chase up. I'll have a think about contacts. Make sure you find about Jackie Beresford and family(Wharfedale) and Banjo Willie.

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: Declan
Date: 20 Nov 02 - 06:02 AM

Greetings Fay from another Fay (my surname).

If you're catchment area includes Leeds it might be worth finding out a bit about Barry Dransfield who says he learned to play the fiddle from members of the Irish community in Leeds. He and his brother Robin were singers as well as musicians and he probably collected a lot of his repertoire around the area.

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: Greycap
Date: 20 Nov 02 - 07:52 AM

Yeah,
Barry is down in Hastings nowadays. Robin and I worked together before Barry was old enough to go in pubs. Harrogate was in West Yorkshire then ( we still are in spirit ).
The originator of Harrogate folk club, Ernie Green, lives about three minutes from me.

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: GUEST,Fay
Date: 20 Nov 02 - 11:19 AM

Thanks everyone who's given names and contacts. I'll reply one by one, might get a bit tedious sorry...

Thanks Nutty, I'm aware of Will, and will be contacting him soon.

Mitch The Bass - I will be doing a survey of a broad selection of people later in the year to try and get an general overview of attitudes and activities. I would like you to be included in that.

Harvey Andrews - I want to look at what people deem to be traditional music, if you think it was/is, then your views are valid. This is a part of the repertoire subject I am studying. I am trying to limit the research to West Yorkshire, so and information you have from that area, your gigs lists, repertoire played, and press articles will be very valuable to me. I will put my personal email address on the bottom.

Nutty - sorry for my ignorance, what is a PM? and who is Malcolm Douglas?

Greycap - Venues and day/time of the club would be good. Any lisitings of artists booked in that period, or regular floor singers and members of the club and their contacts, or idea of repertoire. Other clubs operating in the area. that sort of thing would be good. I will probably be getting a questionnaire thing together for people like you who were involved in organising events, so you might want to wait for me to get that to you. Thanks for showing an interest.

Greg Stephens - The names mean nothing to mem at the moment, but I will look into them. If you could give me anymore to go on, like where they sang/lived that would be useful, or contact details if you feel it appropriate. Thanks, keep throwing names my way!

Declan & Greycap - I will be looking at Barry and Robin Dransfield. Thanks for reminding me of them!

OK. Ta very much to all of you. my personal contact is:
[e-mail]

if you are sending large quantities of stuff or things you don't want to be publicly seen, otherwise, I will keep checking back to this link. This is a great way to do research!

Thanks again, love Fay xx

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: nutty
Date: 20 Nov 02 - 12:58 PM

Fay - a PM is a Personal message which mudcat members can send to other members using 'personal pages' (found at the top of this page). These messages are entirely private and are often used by members to give information that they do not want to give in an open forum.
Malcolm Douglas is a mudcat member who lives in the Sheffield Area. He has an extremely wide knowledge of the folk scene and folk music.

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: selby
Date: 20 Nov 02 - 01:08 PM

Fay I have already sent you a PM to Fay the origanator of the thread if you havn't picked it up a good starting point might be your OLD mate Mike Soar there are others on the PM I sent you if you havn't recieved it let me know and i'll start again
Keith

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: GUEST,Rhiannon
Date: 20 Nov 02 - 01:55 PM

I was brought up in the West Riding (nearest town: Wombwell) and I remember the best folk club around was Room At The Top, which was held at the top of the Civil Centre in Barnsley. Our resident singers were Dave Burland who is still very much on the folk scene, Tony Heald, Derek and Dorothy Elliot (Yorkshire Relish). Mick (MCP) tells me that the Elliots now run a shop in Whitby - a gift shop more or less at the base of The Steps, so should be easy to track down.

Room At The Top was a very well attended club with a mixture of traditional and modern music. Many wonderful memories of my time there. I hope this gives you a couple more leads.

Rhiannon
>^..^<

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: bradfordian
Date: 20 Nov 02 - 02:43 PM

Wow, Fay, Hornets nest springs to mind. The Topic, the Grove, Morris Dancing, Country dancing, Tom Paxton had arrived, The Watersons, ( a big influence) Derek & Dorothy Elliot, The High Level Ranters. The Primary organ was (& still is) THE TYKES NEWS, all west Yorks folk history is there! This is a must for your research.- Put out an appeal here and someone will have ALL the back copies and more names will start appearing. One that comes to mind is musician John Browell & his wife Hazel, they've been around forever in the West Yorks scene(& I mean that nicely John), you MUST chat with them. I can give you his phone number if you've learnt how to PM.
Cheers Bradfordian (In Nottingham now though)

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: GUEST,Lynn Wood
Date: 20 Nov 02 - 06:19 PM

Hi Fay, Steve was secretary of the Bacca Pipes when it was in the Albert (late 60's?)and still has the address/contact book for performers. Give us a ring if you want further info.
Lynn

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: BanjoRay
Date: 21 Nov 02 - 04:07 AM

Fay - there seems to be some confusion about the area you are interested in. Is it the modern West Yorkshire or the old West Riding of Yorkshire, which included what is now South Yorkshire. Harrogate is North Yorkshire. If you define the area more closely, you may get fewer false leads.
Cheers
Ray

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: GUEST,Fay
Date: 21 Nov 02 - 08:52 AM

I am just starting out in the research, and haven't defined my boundries yet. Looking at the response and sheer amount of leads I could follow up, I'm thinking of narrowing it down to a detailed look at circular area around Bradford, and having a less detailed view over the whole area. Ideally I would like to include everywhere, old and new boundries, as we all know, music doesn't stop dead geographically, and the boundry issues have probably thrown up a few songs as well. If anyone knows any such songs, please let me know!

Thanks, for continuing support, Fay xx

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: Greycap
Date: 21 Nov 02 - 03:49 PM

Ok Fay,
Harrogate F/C. Started about '62 at the Belford ( now the Tap & Spile ), lasted about 3 weeks there and moved to the West Park Hotel, later to the Empress ( back there now) then back to the West Park.
Some of the guests at that time, but not in any order were:
Matt McGinn, Josh MacCrae, Lou Killen, Johnny Handle, Mike Seeger, Martin Carthy, Dave Swarbrick, Pete Stanley & Wizz Jones, New Lost City Ramblers,Cyril Tawney.... I'll keep thinking...it's 40 years ago.

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: Tig
Date: 21 Nov 02 - 05:54 PM

Oh dear my past is catching up with me again! I started going to the Leeds clubs in the late 60's and am still around the scene.

I've probably got some stuff from that time in one of the cupboards but would suggest you include The Grove in your research as some of those going now went then too!

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: GUEST,Fay
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 10:00 AM

Thanks again for your information. I know it's a while ago now, but it might be nice for you to try and remember what it was all like then, back in the good ol days!

I am in the process of producing a questionnaire form type thing which I would like many of you to complete for me. I can email it to people, or post it, or try this PM thing. Please send it on to as many people as you can, who you think won't mind, and would be relevant. I want all kinds of activities, not just folk clubs, though I know they are a good starting point, and valuable area.

Thanks again, Fay x

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 12:31 PM

A useful contact list for Folk clubs and Dance clubs can be found in the Diary Website belonging to Tykes News, the quarterly folk magazine for West Yorks. The web site can be found here Filofolk.
The Topic Folk Club in Bradford has been running since November 1965, and as far as I know, there are still some people about who have contact with members and organisers from the period you are interested in. The Grove in Leeds and the Bacca pipes at Keighley have also been going for a long time. Boars Head Morrismen in Bradford were the first Cotswold team in the area although few of the current members have been with the side that long (one of the originals was Dave Mallinson of Mally's Music Publications).
Whitby is now the home of several West Riding ex-patriots (or ex-patriates). Derek and Dorothy Elliot can be found via the Enamel Workshop, on Church Street. Mick Haywood, who collected a lot of material around the Batley area (or thereabouts) sings with Whitby group Coblers Monday. Bluesman (and for many years a member of the Topic Folk Club committee) Roger Sutcliffe also lives near Whitby.
There are some other people I know who you might find useful to question, but I would not put their address on an open forum unless they were performers, or Mudcatters. If you wish to contact me, I could find out if they are able to contribute something to your project.
Best luck!
Quack!
Geoff the Duck.

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: greg stephens
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 01:08 PM

Fay: Jackie Beresford was part of a family of traditional (not folk revival) musicians in Wharfedale.You will find out a fair bit about him in Chapter 3 of Bob pegg's book "Folk": and a great deal more if you talk to Martin Cummins who is absolutely a prime source for you, active folk revival musician in that period in Bradford/Wharfedale. I will ring him to see if he minds my passing on contact details to you, and then PM you. Banjo willie was another traditional performer in the area, martin Cummins will tell you more, and has some of his songs. Boris(aka Maurice) Howarth was active in Harrogate/Bradford area in early 60's, singer, piper and concertina player. Went on to direct Welfare State International, highly infuluential avant garde theatre company. I will ask him if he minds passing on contact details, likewise.

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: Greycap
Date: 23 Nov 02 - 04:49 AM

Greg,
Pass on my regards to Martin Cummins - tell him Eileen & Roger Knowles say 'Hello'. Thanks in advance.

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: GUEST,Fay
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 01:05 PM

Thanks again. I'll keep my eye out for PM's

Love Fay xx

Subject: RE: The scene in West Yorkshire in the 60's
From: bradfordian
Date: 01 Dec 02 - 03:31 PM

And Fay DO also talk to Dave Burland. He should easily be contactable. He certainly played the clubs from the early sixties and of course is going going strong. You can PM me re the questionaire as I started my folk interest in the mid sixties in Bradford.
Cheers Brad.