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BS: The Mother of all BS threads

Acme 15 Oct 05 - 04:02 PM
Acme 15 Oct 05 - 11:45 AM
Rapparee 15 Oct 05 - 10:23 AM
Bunnahabhain 14 Oct 05 - 06:43 PM
Acme 14 Oct 05 - 03:55 PM
Rapparee 14 Oct 05 - 03:35 PM
Rapparee 14 Oct 05 - 12:15 PM
Bunnahabhain 14 Oct 05 - 12:13 PM
Acme 14 Oct 05 - 10:21 AM
Rapparee 14 Oct 05 - 09:17 AM
Rapparee 13 Oct 05 - 09:55 PM
Bunnahabhain 13 Oct 05 - 07:51 PM
Rapparee 13 Oct 05 - 06:23 PM
Acme 13 Oct 05 - 06:21 PM
Rapparee 13 Oct 05 - 06:06 PM
Bunnahabhain 13 Oct 05 - 05:52 PM
Acme 13 Oct 05 - 05:37 PM
Rapparee 13 Oct 05 - 05:05 PM
Donuel 13 Oct 05 - 04:00 PM
Donuel 13 Oct 05 - 03:54 PM
Rapparee 13 Oct 05 - 03:53 PM
MMario 13 Oct 05 - 03:51 PM
MMario 13 Oct 05 - 03:50 PM
Rapparee 13 Oct 05 - 03:49 PM
Rapparee 13 Oct 05 - 03:42 PM
Acme 13 Oct 05 - 12:41 PM
Bunnahabhain 13 Oct 05 - 12:11 PM
Rapparee 13 Oct 05 - 12:00 PM
Bunnahabhain 13 Oct 05 - 11:32 AM
Rapparee 13 Oct 05 - 11:24 AM
MMario 13 Oct 05 - 11:14 AM
Acme 13 Oct 05 - 11:05 AM
Rapparee 13 Oct 05 - 09:11 AM
Amos 13 Oct 05 - 09:08 AM
Bunnahabhain 13 Oct 05 - 08:07 AM
Rapparee 12 Oct 05 - 10:51 PM
Acme 12 Oct 05 - 10:22 PM
Rapparee 12 Oct 05 - 09:59 PM
Acme 12 Oct 05 - 09:55 PM
Rapparee 12 Oct 05 - 07:17 PM
Bunnahabhain 12 Oct 05 - 07:03 PM
Rapparee 12 Oct 05 - 06:40 PM
Amos 12 Oct 05 - 06:31 PM
Amos 12 Oct 05 - 05:38 PM
Bunnahabhain 12 Oct 05 - 05:19 PM
MMario 12 Oct 05 - 04:09 PM
Acme 12 Oct 05 - 03:57 PM
Acme 11 Oct 05 - 10:47 PM
Amos 11 Oct 05 - 06:35 PM
Rapparee 11 Oct 05 - 05:08 PM
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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 15 Oct 05 - 04:02 PM

A Loaf! A Loaf! My kingdom for a Loaf!

Hehehe. Talking to myself today, cause everyone's out doin' interesting stuff. Me, I'm just cleaning up around here, putting in laundry, playing with the dogs, running to the post office.

[scuffs shoe in dusty turf] Maybe someone will drift along soon. The excitement is over, the sheriff arrested that guy who was parking overnight in the woods across the street from our house (yeah, like no one would notice a car parked in the woods in a residental neighborhood?). Ho hum. . .


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 15 Oct 05 - 11:45 AM

Add some sweet paprika if you didn't have linguica, correct the other seasonings, and search with toasted sourdough bread slathered in good butter.

What you you be searching for, with your loaf of bread? A spoon?

Sounds like a great recipe.

Right now I'm working on a sort of goulash of my own. I'm defragging a very old laptop, and the screen image of the drive is a mess to behold. This one is being retired from online use. I tried updating the Symantec in the poor thing last night and it nearly ground to a halt under the ponderous program. I uninstalled it this morning and the little machine (about 10 years old) breathed a huge sigh of relief.

It is going the way of the "Old Typewriter," my wonderful reliable little Olivetti that I worked my way through college with. It became a kids toy and I think they finally did it in. My Dad's old 66hz laptop has actually been the favorite of the kids because they use it in their rooms for solitaire and for Word documents (their "big" computer is in the living room). His is great for both of those things and it starts relatively fast because there isn't much else on it any more. Now the Acer will go into a kids' room for solitaire and Word documents. It's a 133hz computer, fast in its day, but a relic now. It was my emergency backup computer. Now we have five computers in the house (my Dad's old Amiga is here also, never been out of the box since I got it out of storage a couple of years ago). My "big" computer is okay using the dialup or the DSL, so if DSL dies, we'll just plug in a phone line. I guess it will be its own backup.

I wonder how it's going for the Getaway folks? Is Amos singing his heart out, or getting himself into trouble as the sole representative of the Golden Globe society?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 15 Oct 05 - 10:23 AM

Put cans of preseasoned, chopped up tomatoes in a pot (how much of any depends upon the number to feed). Add whatever veggies you might have -- bits of carrots, onions, garlic, cut-up broccoli stems, corn (whole kernel, canned or frozen or fresh), bits of potatoes, whatever. Add sliced linguica sausage if you can, or a mildly spicy anything sausage if you can't (use the kind of sausage in casing, or fry up bulk). Add some pearl barley and let everything kind of cook together for a couple hours (add more liquid if necessary, but keep it covered). Add some sweet paprika if you didn't have linguica, correct the other seasonings, and search with toasted sourdough bread slathered in good butter.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 14 Oct 05 - 06:43 PM

So they're cold and wet? Some nice hot Oatmeal is what they want.
Or a great big thing of scrambled eggs. Those are good in the middle of the night. Last year, 150 of us had them at 4 am, over in Germany. It was a festival, and it seemed a good idea at the time....
Or, if the cold's really got to you, hot chocolate, with a good slug of whiskey in, and nutmeg.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 14 Oct 05 - 03:55 PM

Poor long suffering woman!

Yeah, my kids suffer with garden food also. I'm out of most of it now, but I still have some onions and garlic in baskets in the pantry. It's always nice when I'm getting ready to make something to go get one of MY onions. There are some tomatoes in the freezer.

Our Mudcat friends at the Getaway are probably getting pretty wet this weekend. Maybe Mom ought to whip up some nice veggie soup and deliver it to them.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 14 Oct 05 - 03:35 PM

My mother used to lament in much the same way, Stilly. She'd walk around, wringing her hands and wailing, "Oh, my poor depraved children!"


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 14 Oct 05 - 12:15 PM

Or, Mom, I can heat up a can of corned beef hash, toast up some Wonder Bread, slather it with generic grape jelly and oleomargarine, and make you a glass of Tang. And some good old instant coffee with flavored Coffee Mate. Maybe a Pop Tart, too, so you can get some more fruit. Wadda ya say?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 14 Oct 05 - 12:13 PM

Depriving them of their daily intake of Plastic, additives and a bunch of stuff you need a science degree and a run-up to pronounce? How Cruel!

Next you'll be making the eat stuff fresh from the garden and other tortures...


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 14 Oct 05 - 10:21 AM

Oh--my children are so deprived! They had none of those wonderous things for breakfast. We had a loaf of homemade whole-wheat bread (baked in time for dinner last night) to gnaw on today. They chose to toast theirs, butter it, and sprinkle it with cinnamon suger.

My poor deprived children, having to eat homemade bread instead of getting that marvelous pre-sliced store-bought bread.

Booo hooo.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 14 Oct 05 - 09:17 AM

Fair day to you, good Mother! Wouldst like a cup of tea upon arising? Perhaps some toast and marmalade to begin, with a brekky of scrambled eggs with oak-smoked salmon from the lochs of Scotland, fried Black Klimt tomatoes, and a touch of freshly made hashbrowns?

Oatmeal from pinhead oats on the side? Brown or Demarara sugar? Heavy cream or milk?

Jamaica Blue Mountain or pure Kona or Kenya AA coffee to finish? Sugar? Cream?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 09:55 PM

I have a tie in that plaid, among other plaids.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 07:51 PM

I wasn't limping, just walking in discomfort. I know all too well, if you change the way you use the muscles in an area to spare an injury, it'll hurt more than the injury sharpish.

I think I met them (the men of the lavender kilts) a few years back. Not sure if I should take it as a compliment...

It was a proper autumn day today. Beautiful, crisp air, amd a sunset that turned the hil orange. Shame it won't last.

Also, you do not wear a sporran whilst Highland dancing. Well, you can, but are unlikely to be able to dance for very long. As for my tartan, it's somewhat purlply, but not lavender.href="http://www.clanlindsay.com/lindsay_modern.htm">My tartan


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 06:23 PM

Or the Highlanders of the Leaping Sporran.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 06:21 PM

Or the LLLLSLD (the League of Limping men Laid Low by Scottish Leaping Dances).


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 06:06 PM

You kinda, you know, mincing along? If so you might meet a whole new class of people -- the Men Of the Lavender Kilts.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 05:52 PM

You know, in the Westminster Parliment, a member can call a debate by crying "I spy strangers" and pointing if there's anyone but members about. One of those old rules that isn't used much.


BTW, I went to Highland Class. I landed a leap wrong, I think, and now can't walk properly...


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 05:37 PM

Except, of course, a cast iron skillet.

I hope it didn't dent the skillet?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 05:05 PM

Well, yes, usually it's pretty rare on the macro scale. But it does happen. Just the other day the Halfmaster of the Legion, Ol' Ole, was seen by his wife in the company of Half Moon Hattie, one of the local filles de joie, up at the Legion Hovel. But when Mrs. Ol' Ole got home to git the skillet ready for Ol' Ole's head, there was Ol' Ole on the couch, red in the face and panting like a dog in August. She thought he'd seen her and run all the way home, only he said that he'd been shoveling snow or cutting grass and got all tuckered out and had just a few minutes ago come in to rest. Mrs. thought he couldn't be two places at the same time, but Ol' Ole explained to her all about quantum mechanics and the stuff we've been discussing here and she allowed that yes, maybe he could have been in both places at the same time

But she clobbered him anyway, because quantum physics or not he shouldn't have been with Half Moon Hattie. She said that if he was going to be in two places at once, the other one had better be church.

And Ol' Ole said that when that skillet connected it felt like it passed clear through his body down to his toes, only it didn't leave any mark except on the top of his head.

So there you have it. Proof positive of bilocation AND passage through a solid object (and there are danged fewer objection solider than Ol' Ole's headbone).


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 04:00 PM

Anyone else here ever have a two places at once type of experience?
How about solid matter passing through other matter without a trace of impact?
3 personal incidents come to mind and a fourth that happened to a policeman in Rochester NY.

It is supposed to be a very rare phenomenon when the scale is large and not quantum.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 03:54 PM

Amos , in the movie "WHAT THE BLEEP DO WE KNOW" the two places at once quantum scenario is central to its theme.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 03:53 PM

As I heard one of the bowmen say that day, "Swivin' Crispin...."


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: MMario
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 03:51 PM

Swithin, crispin - what do I know?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: MMario
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 03:50 PM

St. Swithin's day, wasn't it?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 03:49 PM

If we are mark'd to die, we are enow
To do our country loss; and if to live,
The fewer men, the greater share of honour.
God's will! I pray thee, wish not one man more.

Rather proclaim it, Westmoreland, through my host,
That he which hath no stomach to this fight,
Let him depart; his passport shall be made
And crowns for convoy put into his purse:
We would not die in that man's company
That fears his fellowship to die with us.

This day is called the feast of Crispian:
He that outlives this day, and comes safe home,
Will stand a tip-toe when the day is named,
And rouse him at the name of Crispian.

He that shall live this day, and see old age,
Will yearly on the vigil feast his neighbours,
And say 'To-morrow is Saint Crispian:'
Then will he strip his sleeve and show his scars.
And say 'These wounds I had on Crispin's day.'

Old men forget: yet all shall be forgot,
But he'll remember with advantages
What feats he did that day: then shall our names.
Familiar in his mouth as household words
Harry the king, Bedford and Exeter,
Warwick and Talbot, Salisbury and Gloucester,
Be in their flowing cups freshly remember'd.

This story shall the good man teach his son;
And Crispin Crispian shall ne'er go by,
From this day to the ending of the world,
But we in it shall be remember'd;

We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
This day shall gentle his condition*:
And gentlemen in England now a-bed
Shall think themselves accursed they were not here,
And hold their manhoods cheap whilst any speaks
That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 03:42 PM

Billy-Bob Shakespeare. Henry V. Hank rallying his troops before Agincourt or Calais or something.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 12:41 PM

There are many people who attend Getaway for the listening, or so I have been told. That is how I would go, and I'd sing along under my breath when the occasion arises, but I wouldn't be up there playing an instrument and performing for others.

Mom has even been known to tap her foot and try a few fancy Scottish steps at shindigs like this.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 12:11 PM

Nah, it's just the Atlantic in the way, and a total lack of musical ability make the gaetaway a bit ambitious...

That was some fancy quote from somewhere important, wasn't it? A rallying call for Millions, spurring them onto heroism and glory!

Dr Who?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 12:00 PM

We three -- Bunn, SRS, and myself -- will keep the home fires burning. We will rally 'round the flag. We will not be moved. We will remain. We shall remain.

We, the few, the proud...we few, we band of brothers (and a sister)...in years to come, when grandchildren crawl upon your knee and lisp, "What did you do at Getaway 2005, ya old fart?" we will be able to say, "We cared for Mother."

And those little tykes will pause and a tear will form in their eye, and they will know of Us, the few who cared enough to remain the very best.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 11:32 AM

I'm not. I'll be here with Crystal, going to a wedding ceilidh, and baking Christmas cake. And keeping Mom up as well, of course.

Must go and get ready, I'm going to a more advanced Highland dance class from tonight. New and different way to break my feet!!!( and knees, and ankles,)


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 11:24 AM

MOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOm! they're all going to Getaway and I don't ever get to go ANYwhere! Make them stop!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: MMario
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 11:14 AM

see you tomorrow Amos!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 11:05 AM

Have fun, Amos! I wish I were going also. I didn't know when the refinance closing was going to happen or I'd have been able to schedule a trip and maybe even pay for it! (Last week, with a few hours notice, is when it happened, with follow-up papers this week). Maybe next year.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 09:11 AM

This twice now....

I posted that at about 8:30 a.m., EDT, October 13, 1971, I walked into the Burton Public Library and began a temporary job that lasted 12 years. Or 34, because it was my first professional job....


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 09:08 AM

Well, the evening was spent choosing things to stuff into bags and worrying about having forgotten which the things were I was trying not to forget. And pondering questions like "How cold is cold, given that we don't use the word much in these parts?"

Crack o'dawn flight to Baltimore, a city whose very names resonates with history and song. I put new strings on the Martin and left them tuned way down, put the Martin in the case with a pillow under its head, and put the case in a Clamshell traveling box suspended on dense foam joints. I put Fragile stickers all around the outside. I can only pray it arrives when and where I do, intact.

See ya'll Tueday, I reckon.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 13 Oct 05 - 08:07 AM

Cute, maybe, but not a real pig. They're hairy, vicious and evil minded
Like these


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 10:51 PM

Well, I didn't find a picture of a hog I liked, but I did run across an ad for "Sleezer Genetics." They impregnate sows. I didn't read any further than that.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 10:22 PM

Dunno. I just came back to post this. Aren't they cute as can be?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 09:59 PM

Yeah. Is there another one? Have I missed something?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 09:55 PM

Tagalog as in Philippines language? That must be one far-reaching story you were posting!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 07:17 PM

It's not liking me today...I just posted the story of Pig Latin, Ol' Ole, Sandeye, and the Tagalog language and it didn't take!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 07:03 PM

Plunge it in the depth- it comes forth the fairer.

I came across it when looking up something else, and thought it fitted MOAB well.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 06:40 PM

Well, dang! I'll try it agin.

merses profundo: pulchrior evenit.

Means "beauty don't last, cookin' do", don't it?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 06:31 PM

Now on a more immediate frame, we have this piece of wionderful news -- the return of the Tasmanian tiger. If this works it will be the first time we have ever reversed extinction:

SCIENTISTS PLAN TO CLONE EXTINCT TASMANIAN TIGER, October 12
Australian scientists have revived a project to try to bring an extinct animal, the fabled Tasmanian tiger, back to life, the team leader said Wednesday. Renewed determination to recover genes from the bones and teeth of the tiger in museums had impressed sceptics, the dean of science at the University of New South Wales, Professor Mike Archer, told ABC radio here.

Full story at http://www.physorg.com/news7169.html

See y'all at the Getaway. Don't wait up, Mom.

A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 05:38 PM

Yes. It is ALL Dual, both at the same time. Local and non-local at once, wave and particle at once, now and then, here and there, located and not.

And, it's dependent on viewpoint whether it is one- or the other-seeming at any point.

Short enough? Either leg is twice as long.

A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 05:19 PM

I'm out there, trying to get in, but the 'cat wasn't open.

merses profundo: pulchrior evenit.       -Horace


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: MMario
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 04:09 PM

Remember when you shoot the breeze that air doesn't have much stopping power and watch where you point the weapon!

I'm still in "recover from the wedding" mode. For the first time I am glad I don't have kids of my own. Associated adult is exhausting enough!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 03:57 PM

Mom, I'm feeling better today, though things still ache a little. Narcotic painkillers do have a role to play in our lives. Nothing like taking something at bedtime so you don't wake yourself up every time you move on the sore spot.

Bee-you-tee-ful sunny crisp fall day here today in North Texas. Warming up a bit too much this afternoon, but it will get better every day. The culmination of good fall weather is when this darned Daylight Savings Time ends and we get the pleasure of sleeping an hour longer. (It's even better if your bladder doesn't insist you get up at the old time).

I'm just shooting the breeze until someone else comes along to take up the slack. Rapaire, Amos, BWL, Rustic, Bunn--anyone out there?

Hellooo ooo ooo


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 11 Oct 05 - 10:47 PM

Groaannnnn. . .

It was one of those days, lots of battles to wage, won most of 'em, a couple are pending. Had a chunk of skin (that wouldn't heal) frozen on my thumb and got a tetnus shot (did it on the same arm, might as well not have BOTH sides feeling bad). That puts long pithy science posts way outta my league. Want to write a little summary for us, Amos?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 11 Oct 05 - 06:35 PM

I don't think they were in time for them. But they were all top-rated professional dictators, all right.

In other news, the mystery of the universe continues to unfold, or split, as the case may be:

Can an Electron be in Two Places at the Same Time?


October 11, 2005
      
Max Planck Researchers in Berlin show that for electrons from nitrogen molecules, the wave-particle character exists simultaneously.

In something akin to a double-slit experiment, scientists at the Fritz Haber Institute of the Max Planck Society, in co-operation with researchers from the California Institute of Technology in Pasadena, California, have shown for the first time that electrons have characteristics of both waves and particles at the same time and in virtually the push of a button can be switched back and forth between these states.

Normally, we think of building blocks as static objects.

The researchers provided evidence that disrupting the reflective symmetry of these molecules by introducing two different heavy isotopes, in this case N14 and N15, leads to a partial loss of coherence. The electrons partially begin to localise on one of the two, now distinguishable, atoms. The results could have implications for the building and control of "artificial molecules", which are made of semiconductor quantum dots, and are a possible component of quantum computers. (Nature, September 29, 2005).

A hundred years ago, we took the first steps in recognising, at the level of elementary physical events, the dual character of nature that had been postulated in natural philosophy. Albert Einstein was the first who saw Max Planck's quantum hypothesis leading to this dual character. Einstein suggested the photon have an electromagnetic wave character, although photons had previously been considered as particles. That was the quintessence of his work on the photoelectric effect. Later in 1926, it was deBroglie that recognised that all the building blocks of nature known to us as particles - electrons, protons, etc. - behave like waves under certain conditions.

In its totality, therefore, nature is dual. None of its components can only be considered as a particle or as a wave. To understand this fact, Niels Bohr introduced in 1923 the Complementarity Principle: simply put, every component in nature has a particle, as well as a wavelike character, and it depends only on the observer which character he sees at any given time. In other words, the experiment determines which characteristic one is measuring - particle or wave.

His whole life long, Einstein suspected that natural characteristics actually depend on the observer. He believed that there must be a reality independent of the observer. Indeed, quantum physics has simply come to accept as a given over the years that there does not seem to be an independent reality. Physics has ceased questioning this, because experiments have confirmed it repeatedly and with a growing accuracy.

The best example is Young's double-slit experiment. Coherent light is passed through a barrier with two slits. On an observation screen behind it, there is a pattern made of light and dark stripes. The experiment can be carried out not only with light, but also particles - for example, electrons. If single electrons are sent, one after the other, through the open Young double slit, then a stripe-shaped interference pattern appears on the photo plate behind it. The pattern contains no information about the route that the electron took. But if one of the two slits is closed, an image appears of the other open slit from which one can directly read the path of the electron. What this experiment does not produce, however, is a stripe pattern and situation report. For that, a molecular double slit experiment is required that is based not upon position-momentum uncertainty, but on reflective symmetry.

The double-slit was voted the most beautiful experiment of all time in a 2002 poll by Physics World, published by England's Institute of Physics. Although each electron seems to go alone through one of the two slits, at the end a wavelike interference pattern is created, as if the electron split while it went through the slit, but then was subsequently re-unified. But if one of the slits is closed, or an observer sees which slit the electron went through, then it behaves like a perfectly normal particle. That particle is only at one position at one time, but not at the same time. So, depending on how the experiment is carried out, the electron is either at position A, position B, or at both at the same time.

But Bohr's Complementarity Principle, which explains this ambiguity, requires that one can only observe one of the two electron manifestations at any given time - either as a wave or a particle, but not both simultaneously. This remains a certainty in every experiment, despite all the ambiguity in quantum physics. Either a system is in a state of "both/and" like a wave, or "either/or" like a particle, relating to its localisation. This is, in principle, a consequence of Heisenberg's uncertainty principle, which says that given a complementary pair of measurements - for example, position and momentum - only one can be determined exactly at the same time. Information about the other measurement is lost, proportionally.

Recently there has been a set of experiments suggesting that these various manifestations of material can be "carried over into" each other - in other words, they can switch from one form to the other and, under certain conditions, back again. This set of experiments is called quantum markers and quantum erasers. Researchers have shown in the last few years that for atoms and photons - and now, electrons - "both/and" and "either/or" exist side-by-side. In other words, there is a grey zone of complementarity. There are therefore experimentally demonstrable conditions in which the material appears to be both a wave and a particle.

These situations can be described with a duality relation. It can be seen as an extended Complementarity Principle for quantum physics; it can also be labelled a co-existence principle. It says that manifestations of material which would normally be mutually exclusive - e.g., local and not local, coherent and not coherent - are indeed measurable and make themselves evident, in a particular "transition area". One can speak of partial localisation and partial coherence, or partial visibility and partial differentiability. These are measurements that are connected to each other via the duality relation.




Just when you thought it was safe to go back through the double slit....


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 11 Oct 05 - 05:08 PM

In purusing the Martel Electronics catalog that came today, I find that the Dictaphone DTP1244 mini cassette portable recorder is listed as being "For the Professional Dictator."

Did Hitler have one? Stalin? Idi Amin?


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