Tech: Home recording - uk

Subject: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: GUEST,Fred Flintstone
Date: 18 Dec 03 - 10:43 AM

I am thinking of recording some tracks at home

What's the best bit of budget kit on the market

I have tried computer software but haven't had a lot of luck

Four tracks would be enough

Oh, & happy christmas

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: Amos
Date: 18 Dec 03 - 12:07 PM

Check out the hardweare at MOTU (Mark of the Unicorn) for starters. There are also several websited dedicated tyo computer-driven music studios, MIDI, and auxiliary equipment.

A

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: Ed.
Date: 18 Dec 03 - 05:01 PM

Some more details would help...

Are your 'four tracks' for overdubbing yourself, or to record a band?

What price do you consider 'budget' to be?

What exactly are you trying to achieve?

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: greg stephens
Date: 19 Dec 03 - 03:40 AM

I use a Yamaha 8 track..I cant remember exactly but I think it was in the £8-900 range. I've made a couple of CDs with it, and it seems fine. Is that in line with your budget? I should always consider 8 rather than 4 tracks if the the money will stretch to it it. 4 -tracks make a great sort of musical note-book, but you'll have a lot more fun with 8 if you arae trying overdubbing, or working with friends.

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: GUEST,Fred Flinstone
Date: 19 Dec 03 - 03:51 AM

Many thanks to you all

I've written some songs & I would like to get a good copy

It would only be my input so not to many compplications

I thought I'd probably need a guitar & couple of vocal tracks with one spare for either a drum beat or another instrument

I thought up to £500.00 would be budget but £1000.00 isn't a lot of money theses days

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: John Robinson (aka Cittern)
Date: 19 Dec 03 - 04:53 AM

I've been reasonably happy with my Fostex VF80 (cost me about £600 but I think it is considerably cheaper now). This is an 8-track hard disc recorder.

I have seen similar devices advertised which do not have a built in hard disc but instead use memory cards. These look very good value for money.

The main advantage of a digital recorder over the cassette based four trackers is that they come with built in effects, most of which are pretty good quality considering the low cost of the machines. You will need some basic reverb at least.

I have been using a Mac based Pro Tools system in the studio recently and intend to upgrade to one of these at home (things are getting serious!) - but actually the Fostex does almost everything you need for basic home recording.

Do be aware that you may need to obtain some Mic preamps though. The preamps in the Fostex are really weak. We ran the signals through the mixing desk from our live gear first (no EQ - so we were just using the desk for the preamps), but there are cheap and chearful preamps out there which would probably be sufficient.

Hope this helps.

All the best
John Robinson
http://www.JulieEllison.co.uk

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: The Barden of England
Date: 19 Dec 03 - 05:20 AM

I've been using a Zoom MRS 1044 for the last 2 years, and have no complaints whatsoever.

It sounds to me that what you are looking for would be something like the Zoom MRS4 - digital 4 track recording. Try this - http://www.soundslive.co.uk/moreinfo.asp?id=200 - there's one there for £169 + postage. Well worth it for what you are after.

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: clansfolk
Date: 19 Dec 03 - 06:07 AM

MRS -4 is ok but stores as MP3 if I'm not mistaken? and maybe a little too compressed.

1044 is ok (and has your built in drummer and bass) - although they had some problems with hum and the early models ;-)

I must admit I like and have used a lot the Tascam 788 (8 track) - about £300-400 on the current market.

Love sound forge for mastering the final takes.

Thomann

sell some very reasonable studio mikes etc... in fact I noticed that this month's flyer is offering a studio vocal condenser mic for £20.00!!! P+P is about £15 whatever you buy or how much you buy (see if your mates want anything at the same time) and no import duty or VAT to be added on arrival!


For your £500 you should be able to get a nice little set-up that will give you a master capable of reproducing pro-cd pressings.

Try and make sure the recorder you get can record at a high quality (above CD quality) then any effect etc you use during processing will work better then drop the quality to CD when you make your master.

Try and "add" a analogue stage to add warmth to the recording - digital is a "little" to bright for most peoples ears.

accept the fact that whatever you buy will be out-of-date and worth a lot less than you paid for it buy the time you've unwrapped it!

Have fun - and don't forget the January sales are around the corner...

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: greg stephens
Date: 19 Dec 03 - 06:32 AM

FRom what you say you want it for, I'll say again: go for 8-track. If you think you need 4, believe me, when you start doing it you will assuredly find 8 is better.It's so much easy to save stuff, compare stuff, trying different ways of doing things etc.

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: Bernard
Date: 19 Dec 03 - 06:46 AM

I've just bought a Tascam 788 hard disk based machine, which has four mic/line inputs and two aux inputs. 250 virtual tracks, of which any eight can be accessed simultaneously for bouncing or final mixdown. It also has a SCSII port for a CD writer.

I feel it is excellent value for money - although I was able to buy mine direct as we are dealers...!

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: GUEST,Fred Flinstone
Date: 19 Dec 03 - 07:46 AM

Many thanks for all your advice - it's really helpful

Keep it coming - many thanks

Don't worry - it's not to overrun the world with my songs - it's mainly just to produce something that will live beyond me

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: clansfolk
Date: 19 Dec 03 - 12:20 PM

Tascam 788 Brochure PDF
                   pricewise had a look here £369 - ex demo £299 - £369.00 appears to be the average discount price on the net.... not sure where you are in UK but many local dealers will match web prices for a quick sale and at least you have someone nearby if things do go wrong!

One of the things I like about the 788 is the fact that you have more than two inputs (many new machines only have 2 and appear to be aimed at "a guitarist/singer") - but there may be times when you will want more inputs e.g. We will often use 2 or more mics just for one acoustic guitar...

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: clansfolk
Date: 19 Dec 03 - 12:24 PM

PS forgot to mention all the input jacks are balanced (TRS) - stereo type which was a nice3 touch....

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: Bernard
Date: 19 Dec 03 - 09:00 PM

Agreed - my only 'complaint' is that there is no Phantom Power provision for condenser mics. As my microphones are Behringer B2 Pro condensers, I need to provide phantom externally - fortunately I have a pair of EMO dual phantom supplies which I use with my old Teac 3440 open reel four track.

I splashed out and bought the dedicated external SCSII CDRW - apparently any software updates can only be performed using this device... sounds like sales patter, but it may be true!! I'm not too worried, as the lad at Tascam did me a special deal as it was for my personal use (ooh, Matron!).

One other point - the manual is misleading... the internal hard drive is NOT SCSII! It's a plain ordinary EIDE 20GB unit, which can easily be swapped for an 80GB unit - version 2 of the software supports four partitions of 16Gb each, but a 64Mb drive is somewhat rare... 80Gb are common, and are nearer to 75Gb when formatted anyway!

A nice touch is the provision of a pre-recorded 'song' for you to practice with - you can try out all the mix-down and mastering techinques, and the edit is 'non-destructive', too.

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: GUEST,Fred Flinstone
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 06:18 AM

Blimey Bernard

Have read that 300 times and still can't work out if you're swearing at me or insulting my Mother

Many thanks all the same

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 06:30 AM

£500 - that's a pretty healthy budget. It all depends on what kind of quality you are going for.

I've got fairly lo-fi ears, and I'm pretty satisfied with the results from a Sharp ghetto blaster with built-in mikes that I bought at a garage sale, together with a free Goldwave CD program I downloaded to turn the tapes into wav files and clean them up a bit, together with a CD burner internal to teh PC, that cost about £30 from PC-world, for CDs that can play on any CD player.

That doesn't allow for overdubbing and that, but if you just want to record one singer with a single instrument you don't need much mre than that.

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 06:31 AM

£500 - that's a pretty healthy budget. It all depends on what kind of quality you are going for.

I've got fairly lo-fi ears, and I'm pretty satisfied with the results from a Sharp ghetto blaster with built-in mikes that I bought at a garage sale for £5, together with a free Goldwave CD program I downloaded to turn the tapes into wav files and clean them up a bit, together with a CD burner internal to teh PC, that cost about £30 from PC-world, for CDs that can play on any CD player.

That doesn't allow for overdubbing and that, but if you just want to record one singer with a single instrument you don't need much mre than that.

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: greg stephens
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 08:45 AM

The Yamaha 8 track has phantom power for condenser mics, but the 4 track doesnt. Or at least that was the situation three years back.

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: John Robinson (aka Cittern)
Date: 21 Dec 03 - 01:20 PM

Fred, if Bernard's post was greek to you then I suggest that you get some basic ideas of:

* the different between condensor and dynamic mics (this will also explain phantom power)
* the basics of mixing and mastering

Whatever recording device you opt for the importance of a good mic or mics cannot be underestimated. Condensor mics are now very affordable (we have a B2 Pro mic and like Bernard we are really pleased with the quality and cost effectiveness of this mic).

Learning about the basics of mixing and mastering will enable you to know more about what you need from the recorder.

Searches on google on these terms will generate a wealth of material, and if you wanted to go further you can get hold of some of the "Basic" series of books on recording by Paul White.

The basics are straightforward so you shouldn't be frightened away by what appears to be complex terminology.

Alternatively send me a personal message and I will send you some of my notes on these topics (I am currently working through a sound engineering course as well as recording my better half at home).

Hope this helps.

All the best
John Robinson
http://www.JulieEllison.co.uk

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: Ross
Date: 15 Jan 04 - 11:48 AM

Hi Everyone

Many thanks for all the help

Think I might go for the Tascam 788

Anyone know somewhere cheap to buy it near Bedfordshire

Regards

Fred Flintstone

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: clansfolk
Date: 15 Jan 04 - 02:30 PM

Thomann
                   are doing some great deals on Studio large diaphragm condenser mics ----- £20 each YES £20 and they are as good as £80-£120 range I have used - need phantom power supply but Thomann have these at a good price as well.... and only £15 P=P however much you buy.....

lots of other cheap (but quality) goodies as well...

Subject: RE: Tech: Home recording - uk
From: dermod in salisbury
Date: 16 Jan 04 - 07:33 AM

McGrath of Harlow modestly doesn't mention that a very useful step by step guide to making your own CDs or streaming your songs on the web is available on his personal website. The broke but ambitious should take a look. You get there by navigating through the profiles section of Mudcat.