Origins: Time to Remember the Poor

Subject: Time to Remember the Poor
From: GUEST,Stefan Kayat
Date: 14 Jan 04 - 06:51 PM

Hello,
I've listened to an old Martin Best LP on which there appears a song with the title "Time to Remember the Poor". I have some difficulties making out the lyrics and would appreciate if anyone could supply me with them? There is also, on the same record, another song called "The Wooing Rogue", which appears to be a parody of a poem by Christopher Marlowe. Any information on any of these two songs would be welcomed.
Cheers!
Stefan Kayat

Subject: Lyr Add: THE WOOING ROGUE
From: Burke
Date: 14 Jan 04 - 07:07 PM

THE WOOING ROGUE (The Tune is, My Freedom is all my Joy.)

Come live with me and be my Whore,
And we will beg from door to door,
Then under a hedge we'l sit and louse us,
Until the Beadle comes to rouse us.
And if they'l give us no relief,
Thou shalt turn Whore and 1'l turn Thief,
Thou shall turn Whore and 1'l turn Thief.

2. If thou canst rob, then I can steal,
And we'l eat Roast-meat every meal:
Nay we'l eat White-bread every day,
And throw our mouldy Crusts away,
And twice a day we will be drunk,
And then at night I'l kiss my Punk,
And then at night I'l kiss my Punk.

3. And when we both shall have the Pox,
We then shall want both Shirts and Smocks,
To shift each others mangy hide,
That is with Itch so pockifi'd;
We'l take sone clean ones from a hedge,
And leave our old ones for a pledge,
And leave our old ones for a pledge.

Miscellaneous Bawdry,
from Love and Drollery, comp. John Wardroper
New York: Barnes & Noble, 1969
I found it Here

According to this site The source is:
Westminster Drollery, 1671. Mock of Marlowe's 'Come live with me and be my love.'

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: kendall
Date: 14 Jan 04 - 07:15 PM

Ed Trickett recorded a song with that line. (Remember the poor) It's on Folk Legacy.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 14 Jan 04 - 07:16 PM

If it's the song that begins,

"Cold winter is come with its cold chilling breath,
And the leaves are all gone from the trees,
And all seems touch'd by the finger of death
And the streams are beginning to freeze."

This is the version from Kidson's Traditional Tunes, as noted down by Mr Lolley from an East Riding Singer. The notes observe that the words are on broadsides. I expect Malcolm Douglas knows more versions, but if no-one makes a better offer I'll post the words given in Traditional Tunes.

Kitty

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: rich-joy
Date: 14 Jan 04 - 07:20 PM

"Time to Remember the Poor" is on Lisa Null's very excellent "American Primitive" LP from 1980 - " ... comes from the repertoire of Carrie Grover, a Maine woman who collected and learned the songs of her Nova Scotia family and childhood ..." - (she published it in "A Heritage of Songs" 1973, Norwood, PA)

If I get time soon and no-one else has come to your rescue in the meantime, I'll try and transcribe it for you ...

Cheers!
R-J

Subject: Lyr Add: 'TIS TIME TO REMEMBER THE POOR
From: Burke
Date: 14 Jan 04 - 07:30 PM

A Google search turned up many variants on Time to Remember the Poor. There's an image of a broadside HERE
If this is not the version you heard, search "time to remember the poor' on Google & look at the others.

'TIS TIME TO REMEMBER THE POOR
Printed and sold by Thomas Batchelar

Now winter is come with his cold chilly breath,
And the leaves are all fled from the trees,
All nature seems touch'd with the finger of death
And the streams are beginning to freeze,
Now, you gay gallant youths, on the river who slide,
Since summer attends you no more,
While with plenty we sit by a good fire side,
Can we murmur to think on the poor.

Here's the white feather'd snow, which in flakes soft descends
And so white is the prospect all round;
Here's the keen cutting wind from the northward is sent,
Which so furiously sweeps o'er the ground;
When the hills and vallies are cover'd with white,
And the rivers congeal'd on the shore,
When the bright twinkling stars all proclaim a cold night,
That's the time to remember the poor.

Now the poor harmless hare to the woodlands get trac'd.
His footsteps all hinted with snow,
And with his feet and with fingers with blood all o'er lac'd,
The marks-men snipe shooting go
Now the poor robin red breast approaches our cot
While icicles hang at each door,
And our dishes are smoaking with something that's hot,
That's the time to remember the poor.

If thet thaw should insue and the waters increase,
And the streams in rude murmurs should flow,
Each fish from its prison obtains a release,
While in danger the travellers go,
When the meads are oerflown with a proud swelling flood,
And the bridges are useful no more,
While with plenty we share ev'ry thing that is good
Can we murmur to think on the poor.

Now the time will soon come* when our saviour was born,
And we must agree with one voice,
Each heart must contribute to hail the blest morn,
And the earth and all in it rejoice,
Tho' death will ensue, yet depriv'd of his sting,
The grave it shall triumph no more,
But angels and men hallelujahs shall sing,
And the rich shall rejoice who remember'd the poor.

*Or hath arriv'd.

Subject: Lyr Add: TIME TO REMEMBER THE POOR
From: Anglo
Date: 15 Jan 04 - 12:17 AM

This text from the singing of Nowell Sing We Clear on "Just Say Nowell,"
GHM-105 www.goldenhindmusic.com

TIME TO REMEMBER THE POOR
------------------------------------------------------------------------

A remarkable tune from Kidson's Yorkshire collection, this time from his Traditional Tunes (pp. 170-171; see above #3). The text is found on broadsides though we couldn't improve on the set used by Dave Townsend and the Mellstock Band on their recording Tenants of the Earth.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
TIME TO REMEMBER THE POOR

Old Winter is come with its cold chilling breath
And the leaves are all gone from the trees
All nature seems touched by the finger of death
And the lakes are beginning to freeze
When your minds are annoyed by the wide swelling flood
And your bridges are useful no more
When in plenty you enjoy everything that is good
That's the time to remember the poor

The cold air and snow will in plenty descend
And whiten the prospect around
The keen cutting wind from the north will attend
And cover it over the ground
When the hills and the dales are all candied with white
And the rivers are froze on the shore
When the bright twinkling stars they proclaim the cold night
That's the time to remember the poor

The poor timid hare through the woods may be traced
By her footsteps indented in the snow
When our lips and our fingers are all dangling with cold
And the marksman a-shooting doth go
When the young wanton lads on the river slide
And the icicles hang at your door
When in plenty you are sitting by a warm fireside
You will tremble to think of the poor

For the times fast a-coming when our Savior on earth
All the world shall agree with one voice
All nations unite to salute the blest morn
And the whole of then earth shall rejoice
When grim death is deprived of its killing sting
And the grave rules triumphant no more
Saints angels and men hallelujah shall sing
Then the rich must remember the poor

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 15 Jan 04 - 04:50 AM

Number 1121 in the Roud Folk Song Index. It was widely published on 19th century broadsides; examples have already been quoted. Here is a list of examples at  Bodleian Library Broadside Ballads:

('Tis Time to) Remember the Poor

Various folk song collectors seem to have found it in oral currency in England and America, but most didn't publish it; I would think because it obviously derived from print. In the USA it also appeared in various popular songsters.

There is very little to add on the subject of The Wooing Rogue; except that the tune to which it was set was also known as I am a Poor and Harmless Maid, and was used for various songs during the second half of the 17th century. It can be found in Simpson, The British Broadside Ballad and Its Music, 1966, 328-329.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: kendall
Date: 15 Jan 04 - 08:14 AM

Those are different words than what Ed sings.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: nutty
Date: 15 Jan 04 - 11:33 AM

There's a different song called "Remember the Poor" on the Library of Congress site. The sheet music can be viewed here ......

Remember the Poor

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: kendall
Date: 16 Jan 04 - 09:16 AM

nutty, I have 20/20 vision and I can't read that small print!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: nutty
Date: 16 Jan 04 - 12:17 PM

Depends on what size monitor you have Kendall .....I read 90% with no problems on my 17 inch.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 17 Jan 04 - 11:18 AM

I had forgotten that there is a set at Martin Graebe's Sabine Baring-Gould and the folk songs of South-West England:

Time to Remember the Poor (PDF)

It was noted from John Taylor of Postbridge, likely in 1888 or 1890.

Subject: ADD: Time to Remember the Poor
From: Joe Offer
Date: 10 Jul 06 - 02:53 PM

I came across this song this morning, and thought it might be worth exploring more deeply. As Anglo says above, you'll find a recording on the Just Say Nowell CD by Nowell Sing We Clear. Can anybody help me find the Trickett recording?

Time to Remember the Poor

1 Now the winter is come with its cold chilling breath
And the leaves do fall off from the trees
All nature is touched with the finger of death
And the streams do begin for to freeze
When the wanton young boys on the water will slide
And the frost overcovers the moor
When with health rich enjoy everything that is good
That's the time to remember the poor

2 When the cold feathered snow does begin for to fall
And whiten the prospect around
When the hills and the dales are all buried in wreaths
That cover all over the ground
When green things are withered and gone out of sight
And the rivers are froze on the shore
When with health rich enjoy everything that is good
That's the time to remember the poor

3 When the poor harmless hare to the woods may be traced
by the print he has left in the snow
When our lips and our toes are turned blue with the frost
And the sportsman a shooting do go
When a poor Robin Redbreast approaches our cot
And icicles hang o'er the door
When the bright twinkling stars proclaim the cold night
That's the time to remember the poor

4 When the sea shall enlarge and the waters increase
And the rivers shall vehement grow
When the fish from their station obtain a release
And in danger the travellers go
When your journey is stayed by the wide swelling flood
And your bridges are useful no more
When with health rich enjoy everything that is good
That's the time to remember the poor

5 O the time draweth nigh when the seasons on Earth
All the world will agree with one voice
All nations unite to salute the blessed morn
And the ends of the Earth will rejoice
When death is deprived of his cold chilly sting
And the grave is a terror no more
When angels and men alleluja shall sing
Then the rich will lie down with the poor

John Taylor, Postbridge aged 85, Tune not recorded in Killerton Ms but can be found in the Rough Ms. Baring-Gould gives a second
version which he says is closer to the broadside ballad..
K3 p297

from Sabine Baring-Gould and the folk songs of South-West England

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Click to play

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Here's the Traditional Ballad Index entry on this song:

Remember the Poor

DESCRIPTION: "Cold winter is coming with his keen cutting breath...." With the fields barren and the cold coming on, the listeners are urged to remember the poor. This is urged both because the listeners have something to spare and because it is the Christian thing
AUTHOR: Words: John Fielding / Music: H. T. Dyring (source: broadside LOCSheet, sm1877 01347)
EARLIEST DATE: 1812 (The Ulverston New Poetical Miscellany)
KEYWORDS: poverty help religious nonballad
FOUND IN: Britain(England(North,South)) US(SE)
REFERENCES (5 citations):
Wiltshire-WSRO Mi 720, "That's the Time to Remember the Poor" (1 text)
Kidson-Tunes, pp. 170-171, "Time to Remember the Poor" (1 text, 1 tune)
Warner 161, "The Snow Is on the Ground" (1 field text plus a songster version, 1 tune)
WolfAmericanSongSheets, #1993, p. 134, "Remember the Poor" (1 references
ADDITIONAL: The Ulverston New Poetical Miscellany: Containing a Selection of the Most Fashionable Songs, with Many Originals, Not Inserted in Ashburner's Vocal and Poetic Repository, G. Ashburner, Ulverston, 1812 (available on Google Books), p. 31, "A Winter Song" (1 text)
ST Wa161 (Partial)
Roud #1121
BROADSIDES:
Harding B 11(843), "Remember the Poor," Angus (Newcastle), 1774-1825
LOCSheet, sm1877 01347, "Always Remember the Poor", [publisher illegible] (Jersey City), 1877
Murray, Mu23-y1:079, "Remember the Pooor," James Lindsay (Glasgow), 19C
ALTERNATE TITLES:
Cold Winter is Coming
NOTES [19 words]: According to the broadside in WolfAmericanSongSheets, this was "sung by Mr. T. Bryan, with unbounded applause." - RBW
Last updated in version 3.5
File: Wa161

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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 11 Jul 06 - 02:22 AM

Look at your copy of Ed Trickett's "People Like You," Joe. Folk-Legacy CD-92. I'm sure it must be in your shelves.
    Sandy

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: GUEST,JMR in KY
Date: 11 Jul 06 - 11:46 AM

The Ed Trickett version of this song is also on a 1990 recording called "Three Log Night. Umcommon Music for the Holiday Season", Skylark Productions, Chapel Hill, N.C.
In an accompanying book of lyrics, credit is given to Morman Songs from the Rocky Mountains by Thomas E. Cheney.

Subject: Lyr Add: REMEMBER THE POOR (J. M. Kieffer)
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 12 Jul 06 - 08:47 PM

Here's the song from The Library of Congress American Memory Collection, which Nutty posted the link to above:

REMEMBER THE POOR
J. M. Kieffer, 1872.

1. Oh! bright is the fire on the hearthstone tonight,
And sweet are our echoing songs.
The hours bring delight when fond hearts reunite
And music the pleasure prolongs;
But we'll not forget those who sorrow tonight:
The gentle, the loving, the true,
Whose hearts ne'er unite in the strains of delight,
Whose voices a song never knew.

CHORUS: Remember the poor. (Remember the poor.)
The cold world (the cold world) cannot know (cannot know)
All the sunniest hearts (all the sunniest hearts) may endure (may endure)
When hope's ruby glow has been darkened by woe.
Remember, remember the poor.

2. We've gathered tonight 'neath the rooftree of home,
A joyous and warmhearted band.
Our souls bud and bloom 'neath its bright, genial dome,
And peace gives a welcoming hand.
Alas! For the many who sorrow alone,
Where shivering want keeps the door,
With neither a bone nor a crust of their own.
Remember, remember the poor.

3. Oh! how the young chooks flush with rosy delight
As music and laughter go round,
And eyes sparkle bright as the stars of the night,
And hearts beat their merriest bound.
Alas! for the many who sorrow tonight:
The gentle, the loving, the true,
Whose hearts ne'er unite in the strains of delight
Whose voices a song never knew.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 12 Jul 06 - 10:11 PM

This isn't the same song Ed Trickett recorded, Jim, which probably should be searched for under the title "Cold Winter is Coming."
    Sandy

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: Peace
Date: 12 Jul 06 - 10:27 PM

It's on his CD entitled "People Like You".

Subject: ADD Version: Cold Winter Is Coming
From: Joe Offer
Date: 13 Jul 06 - 03:08 AM

Oh, fer dumb. I looked at Ed Trickett's People Like You CD three times and missed that song. "Cold Winter Is Coming" wasn't a strong enough clue to tip me off. I guess I should have listened all those times that Dick Greenhaus told me that song titles can be deceptive.
Thanks for pointing this out, Sandy. Ed's recording of the song is wonderful. Where'd he get this version from?
-Joe Offer-

Cold Winter Is Coming

Cold winter is coming, there's frost in the air,
The beautiful summer is past.
The flowers are all dying that once were so fair,
Their fragance is gone with the past. (?)
Oh, the tops of the mountains are covered with snow,
The north wind blows under your door;
And if you are able to pay what you owe,
It's time to remember the poor.

Cold winter is coming, his footsteps are near,
He will spread desolation around;
And make the earth dreary and frosty and sere,
And scatter the snow o'er the ground.
Oh, the leaves have turned yellow and fallen from trees,
The beautiful harvest is o'er;
And the beautiful brooks are beginning to freeze,
'Tis time to remember the poor.

Cold winter is coming, his cold, icy breath
Is whistling through mountain and dell.
All nature he'll touch with the finger of death,
And lock up the earth with his spell.
He will laugh at the needy and mock at the poor,
As widely he opens their door;
Then try to spare something, a mite every day
A blessing will seem to the poor.

Cold winter is coming, where plenty abounds,
A dance and a song will be heard.
With mirth and with music your halls will resound,
And many will bow at your word. (?)
And remember the poor, let their hearts be made glad
By something you spare from your store.
It will nourish the feeble and cheer up the sad,
So be sure to remember the poor.


Transcribed by ear from People Like You a Folk-Legacy CD by Ed Trickett

Subject: ADD: The Snow Is on the Ground
From: Joe Offer
Date: 13 Jul 06 - 04:31 AM

Here's another version:

The Snow Is on the Ground

From Anne Warner, Traditional American Folk Songs from the Anne &
Frank Warner Collection, #161, pp. 365-366. From the singing of
Eleazar Tillett of North Carolina (1951)

Cold winter is come with his keen cutting breath,
And the birds is all dropped from the trees.
All nature seems touched at the finger of death,
And the streams are beginning to freeze.
When the hills and the dales are all covered in white
And Flora attends us no more,
You sit by your fireside reviving and hot,
Will you grumble to think on the poor?

When the north wind's ascending ascending and chilling the ground
And the sportsmen again shooting go,
And the happy young lads o'er the rivers can slide
And the bridges are useful no more.

When the lakes are all froze with winter's cold breath,
And the rivers congeal to the shore,
You sit by your fireside, reviving and hot,
It is time to remember the poor.

When the poor harmless hare is tracked to the woods
With his footsteps all dandied in snow,
And the robin red breast he approaches your cot,
And icicles hang at the door.

The time it will come when our Saviour we'll see,
All nations shall join in one war,
When the saints and the angels hallelujah now sing,
And the rich will remember the poor.


-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: GUEST,julia
Date: 10 Jun 09 - 02:31 PM

Can someone clarify which version is the Carrie Grover one and provide a melody? Thanks

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Time to Remember the Poor
From: Jon Bartlett
Date: 10 Jun 09 - 04:00 PM

The Warner set mentioned above ("The Snow is on the Ground") is on Jeff Warner's "Jolly Tinker" CD(and jolly well sung, too!).

Jon Bartlett