Opinions on using backing tracks.

Subject: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: GUEST,singer
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 08:04 AM

Does anyone have any opinions, for or against, about using backing tracks?

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 08:06 AM

in what circumstances?

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: GUEST,singer
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 08:35 AM

I suppose, creating backing tracks of your favourite songs to play guitar and sing along with in venues that would accept this.

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: treewind
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 08:38 AM

in venues that would accept this

Says it all, IMHO.

Anahata

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 09:33 AM

If you make them yourself, perhaps. But any time I see a busker using a backing track, I'm pretty sure to walk on by. And if I'm in a pub and there's someone using one, I'm unlikely to stick around long.

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: GUEST,KB
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 09:38 AM

I know its not a logical response, but it always seems like cheating to me. However - perhaps I've just seen it badly done.

I think I would appreciate it more if the backing track were unusual in some way that added more to the performance than just background mush.
Or if it were very sparse so that the ratio of sound was very heavily in favour of the live performer/s

Kris

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: Leadfingers
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 09:42 AM

Its just a cut price way of getting a band for the cost of a solo act
Undercutting other working musicians.Even if you do the backing tracks yourself it is NOT ethical!

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: Bobjack
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 09:47 AM

No opinion either way really, having never used them, but isn't this sort of thing called karaoke?

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 09:51 AM

Perhaps if enough recorded music was given away it would become uncommercial and most of it would stop.

Maybe people would go out and find live music which is always more exciting than recorded music.

If only the technology existed to give away lots of recorded music.

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: GUEST,session man
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 10:28 AM

Its just a cut price way of getting a band for the cost of a solo act
Undercutting other working musicians.Even if you do the backing tracks yourself it is NOT ethical

would this also apply to Keyboard players that are used to replace other instruments or midi guitars, harmonizers (bang goes the backing singers) - drum machines...... etc????

if there's the venue, audience and it brings pleasure - just pay your dues for the backing tracks... (keeps session musicians/singers in a job) and go for it!!!!

If people don't want it you won't get gigs!!

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: pavane
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 12:21 PM

If you are in the UK, bear in mind that when you use a backing track, even if you made it yourself, you are NOT covered by the (soon to be abolished) licencing concession. The 2-in-a-bar rule does NOT apply. The premises then DO need a licence.

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: pavane
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 12:26 PM

As for the point about getting a band for the price of a solo act, in my experience, the fee available in pubs etc. doesn't vary significantly with the number of performers. There is a limited budget for entertainment, therefore a band is out of the question. It is a case of one person being paid or no-one being paid. Yes, you do occasionally see duos, but not often more than 2.

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: Bassic
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 12:36 PM

3 words

Keep Music Live

(And I include the session musicians who make backing tracks.............thus depriving the local drummer...bass man....keyboard player of paid work!)
If I go to see live music I dont want to see a recording. Neither do I want to hear one. I could just as well by the video or CD.

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: greg stephens
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 12:39 PM

A lot of fans of Jim Moray seem to post to Mudcat. He's a backing track sort of bloke isnt he?

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: M.Ted
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 01:19 PM

Setting aside for a moment the "ethical" question, when I have heard people using backing tracks, it has tended to sound thin, tinny, and extremely cheesy--the exception being in Casino floor shows, where there was dancing involved, and a full scale theatrical sound system was used--though even in these situations, a live musician or two(often percussionists) are often used to give the sound a bit more depth(though the cheesiness doesn't disappear)--

"live" music has an energy level that it that is noticably missing from canned music--even if you are just a singer accompanied by a guitar--if you're not loud enough you can always turn up the volume--

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: GUEST,cardboard cutout
Date: 12 Feb 04 - 02:49 PM

I believe the string quartet, drums and bass on Jim Moray's BBC Radio 2 Folk Awards performance were all live. We'll have to watch the TV on Friday to find out.....

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: greg stephens
Date: 13 Feb 04 - 03:54 AM

He does work with live musicians, but I believe he works with backing tracks as well.

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: GUEST,Jody
Date: 13 Feb 04 - 04:24 AM

I remember the first time I heard a drum machine I was quite annoyed. When I first heard a keyboard player sounding like an orchestra I was less so. That's the way "progress" is.

If pubs and clubs require backing then use it. Perhaps it is the songs that are important. Folk clubs are absolutely jammed at the moment so I wouldn't bother trying to infiltrate them.

You could always stay in your bedroom.

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: BTMP
Date: 13 Feb 04 - 12:36 PM

I saw a live performer once who recorded his music via Cakewalk - all instruments and voices (harmonies too!) on separate tracks. He had his laptop handy on stage, and he muted the tracks with the lead vocal and whatever instrument he wanted to play - guitar, keyboard, etc. - and it sounded great! The music and vocals were all his, i.e. no prerecorded stuff. Ethically and musically, I don't see anything wrong with a setup like this. Using other musicians' work, however, must be acknowledged and 'OK'd' depending on the local legal requirements.

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: GUEST,session man
Date: 13 Feb 04 - 01:01 PM

All various forms of entertainment no better or worse than one another and certainly neither right or wrong - you choose the path you want to take! Whether a solo artist with an acoustic instrument, DJ, Singer using backing tracks it's down to you....

I remember seeing and "Irish Rock" duo (Celtic Cross?) about five years ago using mini disk backing tracks along with their instruments. the backing tracks were also them playing (they had trouble playing more than one instrument at once!) the sound and enthusiasm was fantastic - I say "well done" and they were far more enjoyable than a three piece folk group who were on at the same venue... I bought their CDs (which were also home made!) Good Luck Lads....

Live Music = Air Pressure...   Ban, PAs effects.... etc.... Let's not get silly - Yes Keep Music Live but in all its variations - Tunnel vision is bad for progress!!!!

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: DMcG
Date: 13 Feb 04 - 01:09 PM

Not strictly a backing track, and certainly not folk/blues, but you may interested that "Nearly half the orchestra in the long running London musical Les Miserables are to lose their jobs when it moves to a smaller theatre next month. Nine musicians out of 21 will be replaced by an electronic synthesiser of a kind being used for the first time in the West End".

I gather this device is already used extensively on Broadway.

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: Johnny in OKC
Date: 13 Feb 04 - 01:11 PM

There's no excuse for this in Folk music.
Don't tell me there aren't 600 guitarists who
wouldn't love to have the work.

Love, Johnny

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: GUEST,Session Man
Date: 13 Feb 04 - 01:25 PM

There's no excuse for this in Folk music.
Don't tell me there aren't 600 guitarists who
wouldn't love to have the work

what???????

not sure what this is in reply to???? if it was to my post why hire someone to do what you can do yourself???

Remember No Musician had a "Right to Work" you have to earn it - very few people in this world do what they want and earn a living from it!

DMcG - Hey that's 12 Musicians in a job! - Duh whats a backing track then???

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: GUEST,Dan Abnormal
Date: 13 Feb 04 - 01:32 PM

Jim Moray does indeed use backing tracks for most gigs, but they consist mostly of sound effects - backwards vocals, the other 7 parts of harmony vocal on one track, some strings (on dates when the quartet can't make it) and the odd bit of electronic whooshing noise.

You would be hard pushed to find any small-to-medium level rock act that hasn't used some backing tracks in recent years (no, this is not a bad thing...) Coldplay have an 'extra keyboard and guitar player' in the form of a laptop for example, and The Darkness have all thier harmonies from a backing track. If you want to be ambitious AND consistant live there isn't really any other way short of having a really large band. It was actually pioneered by The Who in the era of 'won't get fooled again' you know...

Watch the orchestral version of 'Early One Morning' on the folk awards tonight to see how its done. Playing live were four strings, two drums, bass and guitar, on the backing track were another four strings, sixteen odd extra drummers and the electronics. And four squirrels, six rabbits, six badgers and five hedgehogs. In suits. Playing the flute. All will be explained on BBC4 tonight...

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: GUEST,Session Man
Date: 13 Feb 04 - 01:49 PM

don't forget the Partridge and the Pear Tree!

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: M.Ted
Date: 13 Feb 04 - 04:19 PM

*Not* in use on Broadway--

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: Mooh
Date: 13 Feb 04 - 04:40 PM

I use them as a glorified metronome at home for electric jamming with myself and with students to approximate a band, but I rather dislike backing tracks in a live act. I do have a friend who depends on them for his act, and uses them to good effect about half the time for rock tunes and musician/jukebox/prostitute type arrangements, but even he does solo voice and guitar the rest of the time.

Personally I like a spontaneous feel when I play live and when I listen to live acts.

Peace, Mooh.

Subject: RE: Opinions on using backing tracks.
From: Cluin
Date: 13 Feb 04 - 08:30 PM

It's kinda like shtupping with a strap-on, IMO. If that's what you need to get by, then I guess you gotta go for it. It's not a preferable state-of-affairs though.

The best part of a live performance is the group dynamic and energy of the live musicians, even with a solo act.