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Instrument??on Oscars
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Subject: Instrument??on Oscars From: Jen M Date: 29 Feb 04 - 09:58 PM What was the instrument which accompanied "You Will Be My Ain True Love" on the Oscars? |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: GUEST,Martin Gibson Date: 29 Feb 04 - 10:06 PM I would also like to know what this was that Sting played (or cranked). |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: GUEST,Ollie Date: 29 Feb 04 - 10:09 PM That looked like a Hurdy Gurdy |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: JamesLogan Date: 29 Feb 04 - 10:13 PM Whatever it was It certainly didn't look that difficult to play. |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Jen M Date: 29 Feb 04 - 10:20 PM It looks like a lute back hurdy gurdy http://www.hurdygurdy.com/products/luteback.htm |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: GUEST,Martin Gibson Date: 29 Feb 04 - 10:25 PM Well, to tell you the truth, why did Sting bother? You couldn't hear it anyway. And where was his monkey? Now all I can hear is that stupid old Donavon song that he saying with way too much vibrato in my head about the Hurdy Gurdy Man. I was much more impressed with the second Alison Krause song with Elvis Costello playing what I think was an ancient Style O Gibson. |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Stilly River Sage Date: 29 Feb 04 - 11:06 PM I think you could hear that instrument, but I couldn't tell how he was getting his different tones--was he fingering it at the end opposite of the crank? SRS |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Stilly River Sage Date: 29 Feb 04 - 11:31 PM I haven't seen any of these movies (I usually don't see them until they come out on video). As they present awards they play theme music, and I'm hearing what sounds like Vaugh-Williams' "Variations on a Theme of Thomas Tallis." Was that the theme music for Master and Commander? Or am I confusing a different Vaughn-Williams piece? SRS |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Paul Mills Date: 01 Mar 04 - 12:37 AM The instrument was indeed a hurdy gurdy. The crank turns a rosined wheel which rubs against a set of drone strings (which I could actually hear on the broadcast sound). The keys (which Sting didn't use because he probably doesn't know how to) bring melody strings into contact with the turning wheel. It's a fascinating instrument. Paul |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Stilly River Sage Date: 01 Mar 04 - 12:48 AM Paul, Doesn't Sting collect all sorts of instruments from around the world? I saw an interview with him sometime last year--I thought a collection was part of the tour. Maybe on 60 Minutes? Some of these folks will surprise you with the depth of their musical knowledge. SRS |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: IvanB Date: 01 Mar 04 - 12:57 AM I, like Paul, heard the hurdy-gurdy just fine. Since he played nothing but a drone it wasn't too obvious, but it was there. |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Blackcatter Date: 01 Mar 04 - 02:08 AM That's was the best and most exciting performance I've seen of Sting since the Police. As bland as he's become (maybe he should change his name to Stang), it was nice to see an unusual instrument featured on national TV. |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: mouldy Date: 01 Mar 04 - 02:39 AM SRS - Ralph Vaughan-Williams' "Variation on a Theme by Thomas Tallis" was used on the soundtrack of "Master and Commander". It was also played on the end credits, if I remember rightly. We videoed the Oscars, as it started at 1am here). #2 daughter informed me when I woke her up for college 30 minutes ago at 7am, that she'd watched the lot up in her bedroom. It finished at 5. Andrea |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: GUEST,Arne Langsetmo Date: 01 Mar 04 - 02:40 AM Yes, it was a hurdy-gurdy. And it you couldn't "hear" it, you just don't know what you were listening for. The hurdy-gurdy has a continuous drone from the drone strings, and then a melody string that can be keyed with the keyboard, giving a somewhat bagpipish quality (but with a string timbre complete with lots of overtones, which sounds quite "buzzy"). Unlike a bagpipe though, the volume and rhythm of the notes can be controlled through the speed of the cranking. In the hands of a good player, it can be quite an instrument. I'd love to have one myself (already have a couple of autoharps). A much under-appreciated instrument. Go get "Two-A-Roue" from Jake Walton and Jez Lowe and open your eyes. Cheers, -- Arne Langsetmo |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Splott Man Date: 01 Mar 04 - 08:08 AM Hurdy Gurdy players don't have monkeys as far as I know. Hurdy Gurdy is a British (English?) misnomer for Barrel Organ, I think that was what Donovan was thinking of. |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 01 Mar 04 - 08:10 AM I have a Symphonie - which is a simpler earlier version of the Hurdy Gurdy - it DOES NOT HAVE TO SOUND BUZZY! It only sounds buzzy cause that's the 'traditional way' that the strings are set up! If a violinist/fiddler bears down on the strings hard enough, you get the same horrible scraping sound - my Symphonie has the strings adjusted differently - sounds as sweet as a (properly played) violin... :-) Robin |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Stilly River Sage Date: 01 Mar 04 - 12:58 PM So I had the piece right, just misspelled the composer. I searched on him now--there seem to be an equal number spelling it wrong as I did. Sting's instrument did make an audible drone that we could hear (we had the program going through the receiver and a good set of stereo speakers), but there was a subtle pitch change as he played. I doubt he would stand on stage with an instrument he wasn't fully equiped to play, so the changing pitch must have been due to a subtle movement with his left hand? It didn't have to do with the speed of the crank? SRS |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Wesley S Date: 01 Mar 04 - 01:09 PM If I'm not mistaken he would have altered the pitch if he played some of the button along the center of the instrument. I doubt the speed of the crank would have altered the pitch very much. I could be wrong. And I think I would have enjoyed Elvis C's guitar more if the durn thing had been in tune. It was inaudible to me until the end of the song when he held it up to the mike. The noise I heard sounded like he was using the original strings from the 1920's. |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: GUEST,Les B. Date: 01 Mar 04 - 01:46 PM Wesley S. - Right on, on both counts ! I couldn't help but wonder if Alison Kraus, who's a fine fiddle player, wasn't just slightly irritated by the drone of the non-played hurdy gurdy, AND by the out of tune harp guitar? I figured both instruments were just "Hollywood" stage dressing for what they thought were Civil War era instruments. Highly amusing ! |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: GUEST,Martin Gibson Date: 01 Mar 04 - 03:48 PM After playing back a tape of the musical portions of the show through a TV with better sound, I did hear the hurdy gurdy. Big deal. And yes, Elvis's old Gibson did sound like it had the original strings on it. High technology of 1917. Both Sting & Elvis C. were wasted space on the same stage with Alison Krause and their "quaint" instruments really contributed nothing but something visual to distract from Alison's beauty and fine singing. |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Wesley S Date: 01 Mar 04 - 04:05 PM Why hire a fiddle player when you already have Allison K on stage ? Doesn't Hollywood think that singers can play instruments ? |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Don Firth Date: 01 Mar 04 - 04:16 PM Hurdy-gurdies have been around for a lo-o-o-o-ong time (a bit of history). Although there are a lot of people who have never seen or heard one, they do keep popping up here and there. There have been people cranking away on them for a thousand years or so. Very early instrument, often played by minstrels and troubadours (since they're easily portable), and attics in old houses sometimes cough them up, generally to a response of "What the hell is that?" Nowhere near as popular as a lot of other instruments, there are still a lot of people around who play them. A local group of hurdy-gurdy enthusiasts even put out a nude hurdy-gurdy player calendar a couple of years ago. Matthew Szostak, who makes and plays hurdy-gurdies describes a hurdy-gurdy as "a sort of mechanical violin." The right hand operates a crank that turns a rosined wheel. The wheel contacts two or more drone strings (which gives it a vaguely bagpipe sound) and the left hand operates a set of keys that stop (fret) the melody string (or strings—they're sometimes doubled) at the right length while at tne same time pressing it (them) against the rotating wheel to produce the desired note. This photo shows this pretty clearly. Scroll down a bit and there is a link to Real Audio and MP3 sound samples. Scroll all the way to the bottom and there's a graphic of a hurdy-gurdy being played by Lamont Cranston. It gives a pretty good idea of how one operates the thing. Click on "Description" on the left column and it will take you to a page with a diagram of a hurdy-gurdy and its innards. And here is another site with FAQs and stuff. And yet another, with some history of the instrument and photos of a couple of different types. I have a friend who has a hurdy-gurdy that looks like a somewhat larger version of the box-shaped ones in these photos. Very ornate. Banjo players, bodrhan players, accordion players, and others are often subject to smart remarks from guitarists like me. The standard shot at a hurdy-gurdy player is, "your cat wouldn't howl like that if you didn't keep twisting its tail!" Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: GUEST,JohnB Date: 01 Mar 04 - 04:17 PM I was out at a wedding party, so I got in late. I saw the picture of Sting with a Hurdy-Gurdy right at the end, sorry I missed it, really like the H-G. Find some Blowzabella if you want to hear one played well. JohnB |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Blackcatter Date: 01 Mar 04 - 07:02 PM Music and the Oscars have always been an odd combination. Remember back years ago the Adadamy even had a rule that the original performer wasn't allowed to perform the song on the show. |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Mark Ross Date: 01 Mar 04 - 07:28 PM Elvis Costello's Gibson O sounded like it had the original strings because it doesn't matter what kind of strings you put on that guitar. It will always sound like that! Mark Ross |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 01 Mar 04 - 07:33 PM There's a delightful French Movie - with a sequel, and the distinct possibility of a third movie... called "The Visitors" I think. with the really top French and Italian actors whose names I don't recall, basically about an early medieval French Count who has to travel thru time to fix a problem (he accidentally kills his future father-in-law) - at the wedding, if you don't blink you can catch a quick glimpse of a reconstructed very early hurdy gurdy - the two person large version... My Symphonie is a reconstruction of an approx 12C one - the Hurdy gurdy revived in the 15C to 17C - supposedly the death knell of it was the Piano accordion - funny how they are two of my favourite instruments... :-) The real Hurdy Gurdy has a "dog bridge" which gives a 'barking' sound when you move the crank handle in a certain way - gives a rhythmic beat to the music - the Symphonie has no 'dog bridge'. You can't change the pitch of the note just by turning the handle - I thought he was changing the pitch when I heard it - but if he wasn't changing the note buttons (which I didn't notice BTW), then the whole thing was definitely just him miming to pre-recorded music. Robin |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 01 Mar 04 - 07:42 PM BTW, if you are really interested, look at Dennis Havlena's fascinating web page at here which has so much stuff on making simple musical instruments (even a hurdy gurdy style inst) that he has now put it on a CD as it won't all fit on his web page any more. Robin |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Nerd Date: 01 Mar 04 - 09:09 PM Splott man is exactly correct. Because of the shared feature of the crank, the instrument known as a barrel-organ, which operates on the same principle as a mechanical music-box, is sometimes known as a "hurdy-gurdy." This is what Donovan meant, and it's the instrument associated with monkeys too. But it's no relation to the true Hurdy-Gurdy (fr. vielle a roue, sp. zanfona, etc.) which is what Sting was playing. |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Stilly River Sage Date: 02 Mar 04 - 10:10 AM Had to hold onto this note since last night--the 'cat crashed before I could post it: The Metropolitan Museum of Art in New York City has an image of a Hurdy Gurdy played by a satyr. This came from one of Don's sites, and at least for me, explains what we were seeing as far as Sting's performance:
SRS |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 02 Mar 04 - 10:19 AM You can switch the drone strings (or any of them) out - leaving just the melody string if you want... Robin |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Blackcatter Date: 02 Mar 04 - 10:21 AM To me, much of Sting's music is little better than a drone . . . |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Dave Swan Date: 02 Mar 04 - 01:19 PM Olympic Musical Instruments build beautiful hurdy gurdys. Go to their progress page to see gurdys under construction and photos (including radiographs) of hurdy gurdy restorations. The site is full of hurdy gurdy information. See also Pint and Dale where you'll find Felicia Dale who plays the hurdy gurdy and sings. What a gal. D |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: open mike Date: 02 Mar 04 - 04:10 PM Oh good i was gonna put a link to Felicia Dale, glad you did Dave!@ she gave a little hurdy gurdy workshop after their concert last year. and here is another band who came to Chico and did a concert for our folk society a few years back: ad vielle que pourra their name is a play on words--wheel fiddle (vielle a rou) is another name for hurdy gurdy, and what ever may be (vielle pourra) well it is explained better on this page... |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: John P Date: 11 Mar 04 - 12:26 AM Sting was definitely not playing the instrument. My wife has been performing on the hurdy-gurdy for many years. Nothing he was doing was really like playing. There was no mic on the instrument, and no wires coming off it, and no room inside to mount a wireless system. There was a violin player and a cello on stage with them, both playing drone-ish parts. I don't even think the instrument was his, since we heard that he was calling around trying to find a hurdy-gurdy to borrow before the Oscars. It was a prop. John Peekstok |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: Blackcatter Date: 11 Mar 04 - 12:33 AM That's not surpirsing John. I've heard rumors that Sting actually died in 1984 which is why the Police broke up. The guy who's been saying he's Sting is an imposter. |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: manitas_at_work Date: 11 Mar 04 - 08:40 AM Possibly the most famous track featuring a hurdy gurdy is Planxty's "Lakes of Pontchartrain" with Andy Irvine playing the bottle of wasps. |
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Subject: RE: Instrument??on Oscars From: GUEST,Li'l Aussie Bleeder. Date: 11 Mar 04 - 09:49 AM Picky, picky, picky. I thought it was just excellent to see and hear folk music and instruments on this show for a change. |
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