Rolling of the stone - origin?

Subject: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: pavane
Date: 17 May 04 - 07:47 AM

The Young Tradition recorded a song (Fragment?) called The rolling of the stone (on Galleries, I think). I was looking for some information on the origins, but I can't find the song in a search here.
I remember the following, and can post the rest tomorrow (Can't remember the first verse, about the rolling of the stone)


2:
Will you drink of the blood
The white wine and the red
Or will you go and see pretty Susie
When that I am dead

3:
Susie charms the birds from the skies
The fish from out of the sea,
And there she lay in her true loves arms
And there was content to be

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: A Wandering Minstrel
Date: 17 May 04 - 08:25 AM

As in

Will ye gae tae the rollin of the stanes
The playing at the ba'
or will ye gang to see pretty susie
dance amang them a'?

I suspect itrefers either to a curling match or some scots strongest man type competition where very large sones are turned over. (see also throwing of the tree)

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: JudyB
Date: 17 May 04 - 08:29 AM

Bok, Muir and Trickett recorded a version of this on Folk Legacy CD 1004, Vol II, The First 15 Years. Ed's notes say that it's a version of Child ballad #49 learned from Helen Schneyer. Joe Hickerson reports that some scholars haveinterpreted the ballad as describing an incestuous relationship between Susie and her brother. "Regardless, it's a chilling song of mystery, magic and love."

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 17 May 04 - 02:46 PM

"Wandering Minstrel"'s stanza has had its spelling altered to make it appear Scottish, but it isn't. The form of the song "Pavane" asks about is American, as are almost all the examples with tunes in Bronson (a few from Scotland, recorded by the School of Scottish Studies in the 1950s/1960s, appear in the appendix).

The song has been discussed here before; there is no need to post either the verses that the Young Tradition got from Oscar Brand (I don't know where he found them) or the longer set; I have already posted text and tune as noted from tradition, and what appears to be an edited and/or collated set is in the DT. See Two Brothers (Rolling of the Stones), where I gave some specifics (and a couple of guesses).

The line in this particular variant that people have taken to imply an incestuous subtext appears to be a modern interpolation; it is clear that Susie or Susanne, when she appears, is not the sister but the "truelove" of the dead brother. There may be other factors in other variants which might perhaps imply something of the sort (there's at least one recent study that I haven't read so far), though for what it's worth, I am not yet convinced.

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: pavane
Date: 18 May 04 - 08:37 AM

Thanks. I didn't find it when I did a search (wonder why?)

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: LadyJean
Date: 19 May 04 - 12:35 AM

It was on a record by Oscar Brand and Jean Ritchie that my sister used to own. As I remember, Brand said it was about Lady Mondegreen who was killed with the Earl of Moray. OH Well, mondegreens happen.

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 19 May 04 - 01:24 AM

I strongly suspect that rolling of the stones refers to a game of marbles. Not everything has earth-shattering significance.

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Apr 05 - 09:50 PM

i have ......susie charmed the birds &c.......she charmed youg john all out of his grave and there in his ams did lay,
what do want of me susie
what do you want from me
one kiss
one kiss from your cold clay lips then its back to your grave

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: Willa
Date: 01 May 05 - 04:39 PM

Eileen McGann sang this at Whitby and has recorded it on 'Heritage' DRGN 005CD
Sleeve notes relate it to Child 49 'The Two Brothers'... 'The earlier song makes it clear that it is his own brother who kills te young man at the dance because he wants pretty Susie for himself. Rolling the stones and tossing the ball were the games the two brothers used to play togeher (as Dick suggested) before jealousy came between them'

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: Tannywheeler
Date: 02 May 05 - 01:20 AM

(Wow! My cookie's back!)
Guest of 30 April,'05 -- sounds/looks like a relative of "Th' Unquiet Grave", a version of which is done by Rosalie Sorrels(Sorels?).      Tw

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 02 May 05 - 03:54 PM

See the other thread I indicated a year ago. Eileen McGann is only guessing when she says "The earlier song makes it clear..." (it doesn't) but most people only guess, so there's nothing unusual in that.

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: Ramblingsid
Date: 02 May 05 - 04:06 PM

dick greenhaus said:

"I strongly suspect that rolling of the stones refers to a game of marbles"

Or possibly dice/die?

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: Richie
Date: 16 Feb 12 - 08:37 AM

Hi,

I've posted Oscar Brand's lyrics here: http://bluegrassmessengers.com/the-rolling-of-the-stones--brand-ny-1959.aspx

Also I believe "the rolling of the stones" was once "the putting of stones" or "the throwing of the stones." Here's an excerpt from Child B, collected by Motherwell from Widow McCormick, January 19, 1825; Westbrae, Paisley:

It's whether will ye play at the ba', brither,
Or else throw at the stone?'

Richie

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: Lighter
Date: 16 Feb 12 - 09:28 AM

See Malcolm Douglas's post of May 11, 2002, here:

thread.cfm?threadid=47394#709060

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 20 Jun 20 - 10:26 PM

Looks like this needs some more work

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: RTim
Date: 21 Jun 20 - 11:24 AM

I recorded a version on my "Home From Home" CD......On Ian Robb's Fallen Angle Records, Ottawa.

Tim Radford

The Rolling of The Stones

A version of the ballad "The Two Brothers" (Child No.49),
with a tune learned via The Young Tradition, who sang a three verse version.
My words were obtained only relatively recently from Maine, U.S.A., via the Internet!
I had heard about and been looking for a full version of this song for many years - thank the Lord for technology.

The Song

Will you go to the rolling of the stones
Or the dancing of the ball?
Or will you go and see pretty Susie
And dance among them all.

I will not go to the rolling of the stones
Or the tossing of the ball
But I will go and see pretty Susie
And dance among them all

Will you drink of the blood
The white wine & the red
Or will you go and see pretty Susie
When that I am dead.

They hadn't danced but a single dance
More than twice around
Before the sword at her true love's side
Gave him his fatal wound

They picked him up and carried him away
For he was sore distressed
They buried him all in the greenwoods
Where he was wont to rest

Pretty Susie she came a wandering by
With a tablet under her arm
Until she came to her true love's grave
And she began to charm

She charmed the fish out of the sea
And the birds out of their nests
She charmed her true love out of his grave
So he could no longer rest

Will you go to the rolling of the stones
Or the dancing of the ball?
Or will you go and see pretty Susie
And dance among them all

I will not go to the rolling of the stones
Or the tossing of the ball
But I will go and see pretty Susie
And dance among them all.

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: JHW
Date: 21 Jun 20 - 04:59 PM

Blowzabella used to sing this and they sang very little, mainly did tunes as you'll know. Excuse to check my albums.

Subject: RE: Rolling of the stone - origin?
From: Reinhard
Date: 22 Jun 20 - 12:01 PM

Blowzabella sang The Rolling of the Stones in 1983 on their Plant Life album In Colour.