who's heard of Cockersdale?

Subject: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: breezy
Date: 22 May 04 - 03:07 PM

I'm sure many of us have, and have actually heard them.
many of us are familiar with the songs of the late Keith Marsden, only I learned yesterday that maybe all groups must go through quiet periods and that they can vanish in time.

Last night we in St Albans were treated to a super evening with the smooth talking John oceltic Hagan, Sam's dad Graham Pirt and Val 'the voice' Marsden.

I want you catters out there, to let me know how well known you think they are today please.

Please include your geographical location if you dont mind or not as the case may be.

thank you

this Friday we have Cloudstreet on their way to Chippenham FF

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: GUEST,harlowpoet
Date: 22 May 04 - 03:28 PM

Breezy

I've come across them twice, and think they are excellent.

Can you say hello to Cloudstreet for me John. I met them in Broadstairs last year. They were going back to Oz this October, when I spoke to them.

They are well recommended by this person

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Jeri
Date: 22 May 04 - 03:36 PM

I'd never heard of them before Mudcat. Graham used to post here, and he and I traded PMs and e-mails. I wound up with several CDs, and love 'em! I know Graham had said a couple of times they'd been planning US tours, but as far as I know, they never made it.

New Hampshire, USA.

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 22 May 04 - 03:38 PM

They're big in Chesham

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 23 May 04 - 12:46 AM

I can't believe there are folk-type people who have never heard of Cockersdale!

They've been, for many years, one of the leading harmony-singing groups in the UK and it's almost impossible not to hear at least one of their songs at any folk club on any night you'd care to think of. It feels as though I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of occasions I've been to a club and not heard one of the old favourites - Old Peculier, The Manch, The Funeral Song, The Drovers, Hessle Road et many al.

Is it maybe that people don't make the connection between the writing of the late, great Keith Marsden and the group? Or have they had their 'quiet time' since Keith's death? Whatever, they're still around and, from what I've heard, they're still a great turn.

Oh, BTW - they'll be appearing at the Gainsborough Folk Festival in October, watch this space!!

Johnny :0)

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Sooz
Date: 23 May 04 - 05:00 AM

You just beat me to it Johnny!

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 23 May 04 - 05:37 AM

They're a great club act, plus they present a slide show with Keith's songs ("Picking Sooty Blackberries") at festivals.

Kitty

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 23 May 04 - 05:44 AM

And they can be seen/ heard at the Folk for MS concert on 11 June!

http://folk4all.net/HergaFolk4MS.htm

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: GUEST,Peter from Essex
Date: 23 May 04 - 09:51 AM

I wouldn't be surprised if somebody from the south of England who wasn't a festival goer didn't know who they were. A lot of people are only aware of their local circuit.

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Cllr
Date: 23 May 04 - 10:24 AM

I echo Strolling Johnny's comment's a they are are excellent Phot and I did a support for them on a charity night for uxbridge FC a tear or so back.

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 23 May 04 - 12:18 PM

One of my faavorites. They have four CDs out, all fine music. Available at CAMSCO, of course.

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 23 May 04 - 01:11 PM

If somebody from the South of England hasn't heard of Cockersdale they need to get out more! (LOL). They are an 'A' list act, have a number of CDs, a songbook, and their songs are sung far and wide. As I said earlier, maybe some people don't make the Marsden connection?? :0) :0)

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 23 May 04 - 01:47 PM

IIRC, a pub in Kensington had the words of "Bring us a barrel" on a blackboard, attributed as "trad".

Kitty

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 23 May 04 - 01:52 PM

Philistines!
Mind you, isn't it the ultimate accolade for a writer to find his song described as 'Trad'? I'm sure Connolly thinks so!
Johnny :0)

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: GUEST,Peter from Essex
Date: 23 May 04 - 02:42 PM

Johnny - "they need to get out more" Why? If people are happy going to local sessions and singarounds that is fine. There is no reason to expect them to have heard of any recording artist.

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 23 May 04 - 03:32 PM

Maybe, Dear Peter, they also need to lighten up and grow a sense of humour! It was a lighthearted quip and anyone but an Essex-Boy (or Girl) would have realised that by the two smiley faces at the end. That was another light-hearted quip by the way - here's the smiley faces to prove it :0) :0)

Johnny :0)

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 23 May 04 - 03:38 PM

I'd actually heard several of Keith Marsden's songs before I heard Cockersdale -- mostly sung by Brit singers (such as Geoff Thompson from Sheffield) who happened to be in the States for awhile. Then Jeri (and Mudcat) introduced me to their CDs. And I've met Sam Pirt and finally made the connection with his dad.

But the group was primarily introduced to me by Jeri and Mudcat -- I don't hear them get much (any) airplay on folk shows in our vicinity.

I'm in southeastern New Hampshire, USA.

Linn

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 23 May 04 - 05:06 PM

Cockersdale - I used to work there!
Top left corner of the Rhubarb Triangle in the region near the south of Leeds and Wakefield.
Quack!
GtD.

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: GUEST,Pat Cooksey.
Date: 23 May 04 - 05:30 PM

NO JOHNNNY. It is not the ultimate accolade to have a song you have
written to find it described as traditional, John Connolly would
also agree with me I think.

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Cllr
Date: 23 May 04 - 05:57 PM

the pub was the three kings (now the famous three kings) on the corner of talgarth rd and west kensington station. it was the chorus painted on one wall they have since removed it. there are numurous stories of keith's songs being called traditional one versiob is in picking sooty blackberries

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: GUEST,padgett
Date: 24 May 04 - 04:27 AM

Keith was one of the finest writers of folk song in the traditional style that England has ever had!!
He wrote from a deep understanding of what made people tick, what they cared about, mainly from a working class male point of view; his ability to say things with few words to convey understanding is what folk song is all about, in my opinion
Cockersdale continue to bring Keith's brilliance to folk clubs in a most entertaining way ~ long may they do so

He was the main stay of the Grove folk club in Leeds, which is still going strong despite recent upheavals; if you are ever in the UK/Leeds you must visit (Fridays) and sang with Brian Senior who I believe still goes
Early versions of Cockersdale included Peter Ogley, a lovely singer.

His songs have been sung now for going on 40 years

Derek and Dorothy Elliot sang Bring us a barrel, so did the late Bill Price, who toured Canada many years ago

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Linda Kelly
Date: 24 May 04 - 04:44 AM

I don't understand the question Breezy, was attendance poor? They don't have a quiet time in Yorkshire-where they are very famous indeed. Catch them at Warwick FF this year, doing the superb 'Lest We Forget' with Anni Fentiman and Dave Weber. They have a web page with a list of their gigs. They are the ultimate harmony group .

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 24 May 04 - 06:53 AM

GUEST, Pat Cooksey - do you know John very well?

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Schantieman
Date: 24 May 04 - 07:48 AM

Keith used to delight in passing off his songs - particularly Bring Us a Barrel as traditional. There's a bit about this in Picking Sooty Blackberries - both the book and the show. Apparently he used to pretend that he'd collected them from Charlie Bloggins (I forget the name) who turned out to be one of his bank clerks!

If you're not familiar with Keith's songs, you're missing a treat.

Steve

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 24 May 04 - 10:53 AM

Pat, I forgot to say this is a friendly thread, so there's no need to shout at me - I'm neither deaf nor daft, nor blind, nor some Johnny Foreigner whose understanding of English is improved by being shouted at! :0) :0)

But I am polite (usually) :0)

J

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Willa
Date: 24 May 04 - 10:58 AM

Attended one of their singing workshops at Cottingham Live recently - a great afternoon, after which they did an evening gig. I agree with all the positive comments above.

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 24 May 04 - 04:16 PM

Actually - I first saw Cockersdale doing a floor spot in the Plough at Whitby during Folk Week. The line-up was Keith and Val Marsden, Peter Ogley and another female singer, and I'm not certain who, it being a VERY long time back. A long time before I got to know Val and Keith.
It was also about 12 months before I found myself working for the Tong-Cockersdals Countryside Scheme, which looked after parts of the Green Belt between Leeds and Bradford including Cockersdale - a small valley between the Pudsey Free State and the Independent Borough of Morley (in the Domesday Book long before Leeds was a muddy puddle).
They have always been a very entertaining act and a set of very nice people.
Quack!
GtD.

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: mouldy
Date: 25 May 04 - 02:29 AM

One of my fondest memories is from many years ago when the Goole based Barleycorn Band started off doing pub gigs - they provided a relaxing evening of songs and tunes, mostly traditional. When they came to our neighbouring village pub, we went along. (Among the lineup were Graham Pirt and his two lads!) When they started into the Cockersdale songs, I was ecstatic. As they began "Bring Us A Barrel" I flashed the Cockersdale T shirt I was wearing under my sweater, and was invited to come and join in for the chorus. I consider this a great compliment, as my singing isn't of the best, but then Graham's nice like that!

Andrea

Subject: RE: whose heard of Cockersdale?
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 25 May 04 - 10:05 AM

Keith lived in Queensbury and would sometimes drop in at the Tuesday night session at the Pineberry Inn, he didn't always sing and sometimes he would borrow a guitar and sing a Bob Dylan song. Lovely man.

eric

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 02 Jul 10 - 10:59 PM

I came across a recording by Cockersdale this afternoon, and I really liked it. Wonderful, unaccompanied harmony, and lots of interesting songs. A little research tells me that Graham Pirt is part of the group, and I've actually met him in the flesh - I had no idea he was THAT good a singer. The distaff member of the trio is Val Marsden, widow of Keith. The third member of the group is John O'Hagan, who has posted at Mudcat with the user name Cockersdale (well...he posted twice). Their Website is http://www.cockersdale.com.

And their recordings are terrific.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: breezy
Date: 03 Jul 10 - 02:23 AM

I caught them 'in the act' last year at Bodmin

They are/were looking for gigs

They are outstanding contributors to the Folk life of the U K in both material and performance

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 03 Jul 10 - 02:46 AM

I occasionally bump into John O'Hagan in our local Costa Coffee and elsewhere in the town, while he's out and about his business.

He doesn't recognise me though!   :-) :-)

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: r.padgett
Date: 03 Jul 10 - 03:22 AM

I am very pleased that Cockersdale have now a website!

We at Yorkshire Garland were keen to have some of their songs on our website!

However all panic over and I will have a quick look at their site now!

Graham Pirt popped to Barnsley folk club couple of Mondays ago (actually lives in Barnsley!) and a very busy man (son is Sam Pirt, brill musician and they have father and song CD album too

Virtually every singaround at festivals has at 2/3 Keith Marsden songs sung in my experience

A very down to earth socially aware man was Keith, a sad loss

Ray

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Lady Nancy
Date: 03 Jul 10 - 04:36 AM

In the years before Cockersdale, myself, Sue Thornton and Peter Ogley started a group called Yan Tan Thether, which became Cockersdale when other committments meant I had to leave.

How things come full circle! Pete is now a (fairly) near neighbour of mine and he and I have joioned with Annie McGrath to form a group called Street Voices. 3-part unaccompanied stuff again. We're doing it purely for fun and if anyone is free and wants to hear us for nowt, we're singing tomorrow, Sunday 4th July 10, at the Airedale Heifer, (Bradford Road, Stockbridge, KEIGHLEY) where there is a First Sunday session/singaround. Bring your voices and instruments etc. for a brill night or all sorts.

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Tattie Bogle
Date: 04 Jul 10 - 08:58 AM

Somewhere in between 2004, when this thread started, and 2010 when it was resumed, Cockersdale did a whole week of workshops at Sidmouth Festival (? about 2006 or 2007), when we learned a pile of Keith's songs, and sang them with Val, Graham and John: they did the main parts and we, the "choir" provided the choruses mainly, tho' there were some songs we sang the whole of: this was the "Picking Sooty Blackberries" project. We finished the week with a live performance, which, as described above, included film footage and commentary, and some recordings of Keith himself. It was quite an emotional and uplifting experience for all concerned.
Also I now that Cockersdale have appeared at least a couple of times in Edinburgh, so they are known to some up here too.

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 04 Jul 10 - 09:39 AM

As a songwriter Keith is up there with Woody Guthrie and Ewan MacColl, and without a doubt the finest songwriter ever from West Yorkshire.

Dave H

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Leadfingers
Date: 04 Jul 10 - 10:04 AM

The late Dave Houlden cleared a couple of his parodies with Keith before presenting them - I still perform a couple myself - Keith was always flattered at anyone else's interest in his songs .

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: GeoffLawes
Date: 04 Jul 10 - 08:40 PM

There is a clip of Cockersdale which pops up in the advertiment in the Digitrad here
Clip of Cockersdale singing Jamie Foyers

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 04 Jul 10 - 08:52 PM

Lady Nancy, do Street Voices have recordings?

-Joe-

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Lady Nancy
Date: 10 Jul 10 - 08:07 AM

No recordings yet, but watch this space....! LN

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Graham_Pirt
Date: 21 Nov 10 - 09:12 AM

Amazing how you can come across a thread like this when you've just stopped performing! :-)

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 21 Nov 10 - 10:13 AM

Cockersdale the band was greater than the sum of it's parts, but the parts were all superb.

Dave H

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: breezy
Date: 21 Nov 10 - 03:44 PM

Well there you go Graham, surprise surprise !

I were eighteen when I started this !

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: GUEST,George Stephens
Date: 21 Nov 10 - 08:12 PM

My late wife, Mary LaMarca, which were smart (to paraphrase Peter Bellamy)introduced me to Cockersdale's recordings many years ago. I don't believe they're widely known in the U.S., despite our best efforts. Keith Marsden was a genius; I'll never tire of singing "Idlers and Scivers". Confoundingly, it will likely never lose its relevance.
George

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: GUEST,padgett
Date: 22 Nov 10 - 04:19 AM

Too early for Cockersdale to retire
Session yesterday had Billy Armitage & Old Peculiar sung

Ray

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Grampus
Date: 22 Nov 10 - 06:17 AM

Is your memory failing Ray???

'Funeral Song' was also sung. 3 of Keith's songs in on afternoon!

Not bad eh?

G.

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: GUEST,Mr Red
Date: 22 Nov 10 - 06:30 AM

me

and heard 'em live, before they were reduced in numbers and after.

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Arnie
Date: 23 Nov 10 - 06:09 AM

Seeing the name Cockersdale prompted me to dig out a cassette tape I recorded off Reading Radio's Some Folk in the mid-80's. Sure enough, there are 3 songs by Cockersdale on there - Bring us a Barrel, Prospect Providence and Even as You and I. As I've now got a device to convert cassettes into MP3 format, this will be my next job.

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Carol
Date: 23 Nov 10 - 08:18 AM

Grampus, I think Ray had perhaps 'departed' before we got round to the Funeral Song.

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Grampus
Date: 23 Nov 10 - 10:15 AM

Naaah. Ray was still there.

He was of the multitudinous children mentioned in the song

;-)

G.

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Graham_Pirt
Date: 27 Nov 10 - 05:28 AM

Thanks to all for the nice comments

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Dennis the Elder
Date: 27 Nov 10 - 02:40 PM

Thanks to you Graham and to Val and John for ensuring that the songs of Keith have entertained us since Keith's untimely death 19 years ago.
We all have to retire sometime and like some professional sports players Cockersdale have done so whilst still capable of performing exceedingly well.
I still have your CDs and a recording of New Heritage to remind me of how good Keith was and you all are.
You will all be truly missed
Good luck, Dennis

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: GUEST,padgett
Date: 28 Nov 10 - 11:22 AM

O yet the Funeral song, sung at O'Dononoghues (Bull and Fairhouses now) last Sunday, Wakefield ~ I was the one doing the hand signs wasnt I! did I get thrown out? lol
Memorable afternoon!

Ray

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: FreddyHeadey
Date: 22 Jan 17 - 04:26 PM

Not often heard these days so this is worth noting

7 May 2017
Val Marsden and Graham Pirt
tiger folk Nottingham
http://www.tigerfolk.com/programme%202017.html 

The Stumble Inn - 41 Tamworth Rd
Long Eaton, Derbyshire, 
NG10 1JF
(NG10 1BD was the old venue)

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: OldNicKilby
Date: 23 Jan 17 - 09:08 AM

Great Club Great Singing just a shame that it is Disabled hostile (that's much worse than un-friendly) I really miss being unable to get in there

Subject: RE: who's heard of Cockersdale?
From: Tattie Bogle
Date: 23 Jan 17 - 06:58 PM

It has become a Middle Bar Singers (Sidmouth) "thing" that when the Funeral Song is sung, and the line comes up about sending for more chairs, all the chairs in the room get piled up into a pretty unstable pyramid in one corner of the room! Still waiting for the bar staff to come up with the "Co-op 'am sandwiches"!