Lyr Req: A Song for Grace (Ted Egan)

Subject: At the Going Down of the Sun - Who?
From: Franz S.
Date: 22 Jun 04 - 06:56 PM

Another song on Loafer's Glory #55, "Down Under", is At the Going Down of the Sun".   The chorus is taken from Lawrence Binyon's famous poem from WWI, but the rest of the song is about three brothers who go off and either don't come back or come back damaged. I'd like to know who wrote the song (haven't been able to find the lyrics anywhere, but since I have the recording...) and who made the recording Phillips played.

Subject: RE: At the Going Down of the Sun - Who?
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 23 Jun 04 - 05:23 AM

Franz, it sounds like your query is a follow-on from some other discussion? By Phillips, I assume you mean Utah Phillips. It should be fairly easy to get in touch with him - you'll find contact details on his website, HERE.

Good luck!

Subject: RE: At the Going Down of the Sun - Who?
From: Franz S.
Date: 23 Jun 04 - 10:48 AM

Peter,

Phillips doesn't know. See my note to Bob Bolton on the "Andy's Gone With Cattle" thread. (I haven't mastered blue clickies yet.)

Subject: RE: At the Going Down of the Sun - Who?
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 23 Jun 04 - 07:33 PM

G'day Franz S,

That certainly sounds like a song by Australian Country / Folk singer Ted Egan (I think the story may be based on the family history of his partner Nerys Evans ... ?). I just bought a bundle of Ted's CDs ... maybe to keep his singing in mind over the next three years while he is Administrator (roughly equivalent to Governor) of The Northern Territory (of Australia)!

Is the song presented by a woman? ... I seem to remember Nerys singing it on some recordings.

I will dig out the notes, scan in whatever is appropriate and post them from home tonight. I will also post the full words, as they may be of interest to the list in general.

Regards,

Bob Bolton

Subject: RE: At the Going Down of the Sun - Who?
From: Franz S.
Date: 23 Jun 04 - 11:13 PM

Bob,
Yes, it was a woman, and there was a fair amount of orchestration. It's a very powerful song. Thank you very much.

Good God! A folkie as governor? Ours (Jimmie Davis in Louisiana, among others) have not been real shining lights, but maybe that's because they were elected.

Subject: RE: At the Going Down of the Sun - Who?
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 23 Jun 04 - 11:31 PM

G'day again Franz,

... fair amount of orchestration ...

That sounds like the take of this song on Ted's The ANZACs, one of his "Faces of Australia" book / recording (variously LP, Cassette and then CD) series started for the Australian Bicentenary (1988). The ANZACs were the soldiers of the First World War Australian and New Zealand Army Corps (1914 - 1918) ... and, by extension, any Aussie and/or Kiwi troops in later wars. ANZAC Day (April 25) is one of the most reverently observed Public Holidays in Australasia.

Th addres the second point: Ted was a long-serving and popular officer with the Northern Territory's Dept. of Aboriginal Affairs (and a lot of his fellow officers were not ...). I'll agree that the real workers and peacemakers don't usually win gubernatorial honours ... but Ted is a great bloke - and he's a great Adminstrator!

Regards,

Bob Bolton

Subject: Lyr/Tune Add: A SONG FOR GRACE (Ted Egan)
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 07:12 AM

G'day Franz,

Ted's name of this song is actually a Song for Grace .

I seem to have misremembered its story … Ted wrote this song on the basis of the stories of his own mother Grace (neé Brennan). The story of his grandfather's stubborn grief reduced him to tears, at age 12, when his mother recounted it … and clearly stayed with him. Nerys certainly normally sings the song (and I haven't heard anyone else do it). I seem to have variations of this track on three Ted Egan CDs – it segues from a reminiscence of an old Digger (Australian soldier) on The Anzacs , TED005 and is presented straight on The Dover's Boy – A Celebration of Australian Women and his newest 2-CD set The Land Down Under, EVGR 001. The track has a light 'orchestral' backing … and finishes with a short bugle call: The Last Post - the normal last call of the military day … and military funerals.

I have scanned in Ted's own 'official' words from the book of The Anzacs - and I've inserted Nerys's departures within normal (round) brackets for extra words she uses and [square] brackets for variations. This ought to be sufficient to identify the track you have as hers or someone else's. Another point may be that the track is about 5' 55" long, in all instances.


A SONG FOR GRACE
Words & music: Ted Egan

I was a girl of thirteen when my three brothers went to the war;
Martin, (and) Robert and Jack, and as I waved from the door
I thought: 'Who in the world could have brothers as handsome as they?'
Three Australian Light Horsemen, I see their proud figures today.

Our parents were Irish, with no love for England at all,
But their sons were Australians, and each bravely answered the call,
In their turned-up slouch hats, and their feathers, and leggings, and spurs,
The Empire, as much as their [my] mother, knew these sons were hers.

CHORUS: And at the going down of the sun
And in the morning
We will (we'll) remember them
Lest we forget.

The mailman brought cards from Colombo, (and) then from Port Said.
Here's a photo of Jack, in Egypt his first camel ride
And look at young Bobby, in London here, crossing The Strand
And Martin writes: 'Mum and Dad, life in the army is grand'.

The same mailman brought us the news about our darling Jack,
'Regret to inform you your son John will never come back.
He died of his wounds at Gallipoli, so brave was he
He's awarded the Military Medal posthumously.'

CHORUS: And at the going down of the sun etc.

When the telegram came, my mother collapsed, and I had
The terrible task of breaking the news to my Dad.
With our old draught-horse, Punch, my father was ploughing the land
[When] I ran to the paddock, the telegram clutched in my hand.

The Irishman read it, said: 'Thank you, now leave me alone,
'Go on back to the house, help your mother, she's there on her own'
He called: 'Stand up, Punch; we have to get on with this job'
But I saw his slumped shoulders, and I heard his heart-rending sob.

CHORUS: And at the going down of the sun etc.

Well, Robert was gassed, and he always had pains in his head
(And) Martin was shell-shocked and he'd have been better off dead
And I - I'm just an old lady who watched them all go,
But I am the one you should ask about war for I know.
(That) All of these years have gone by, and I know the grief yet
Yes I will remember them - I can't forget

FINAL CHORUS: And at the going down of the sun
And in the morning …

(Bugle Call: The Last Post)

Here is the MIDI of the dots rendered in Alan of Australia's (no longer supported by Mudcat …?) MIDItext program. If you don't have a copy of this handy little app … at least you can extract the ABC component at the end and decode it with an ABC-Music program!

MIDI file: songgrac.mid

Timebase: 240

TimeSig: 3/4 24 8

Tempo: 128 (468750 microsec/crotchet)

Start

0360 1 62 080 0096 0 62 064 0024 1 62 080 0096 0 62 064 0024 1 62 080 0096 0 62 064 0024 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 67 080 0096 0 67 064 0024 1 67 080 0192 0 67 064 0168 1 67 080 0192 0 67 064 0168 1 67 080 0096 0 67 064 0024 1 67 080 0192 0 67 064 0048 1 69 080 0192 0 69 064 0048 1 67 080 0192 0 67 064 0168 1 64 080 0096 0 64 064 0024 1 62 080 1104 0 62 064 0336 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 71 080 0096 0 71 064 0024 1 71 080 0288 0 71 064 0072 1 67 080 0192 0 67 064 0048 1 67 080 0288 0 67 064 0072 1 67 080 0096 0 67 064 0024 1 67 080 0096 0 67 064 0024 1 67 080 0096 0 67 064 0024 1 67 080 0192 0 67 064 0048 1 72 080 0288 0 72 064 0072 1 71 080 0096 0 71 064 0024 1 69 080 1104 0 69 064 1416 1 69 080 0096 0 69 064 0024 1 69 080 0192 0 69 064 0048 1 76 080 0288 0 76 064 0072 1 76 080 0096 0 76 064 0024 1 76 080 0192 0 76 064 0048 1 76 080 0288 0 76 064 0072 1 76 080 0096 0 76 064 0024 1 76 080 0192 0 76 064 0048 1 76 080 0288 0 76 064 0072 1 76 080 0096 0 76 064 0024 1 76 080 0192 0 76 064 0048 1 76 080 0192 0 76 064 0048 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 72 080 0192 0 72 064 0048 1 69 080 1296 0 69 064 1344 1 69 080 0096 0 69 064 0024 1 69 080 0096 0 69 064 0024 1 69 080 0192 0 69 064 0048 1 69 080 0192 0 69 064 0048 1 69 080 0192 0 69 064 0048 1 69 080 0192 0 69 064 0048 1 69 080 0288 0 69 064 0072 1 69 080 0096 0 69 064 0024 1 71 080 0288 0 71 064 0072 1 71 080 0096 0 71 064 0024 1 69 080 0192 0 69 064 0048 1 71 080 0096 0 71 064 0024 1 73 080 0456 0 73 064 0024 1 76 080 0096 0 76 064 0024 1 74 080 1170 0 74 064 1590 1 62 080 0096 0 62 064 0024 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 67 080 0096 0 67 064 0024 1 67 080 0192 0 67 064 0168 1 67 080 0192 0 67 064 0168 1 67 080 0096 0 67 064 0024 1 67 080 0192 0 67 064 0048 1 69 080 0192 0 69 064 0048 1 67 080 0192 0 67 064 0168 1 64 080 0096 0 64 064 0024 1 62 080 1104 0 62 064 0336 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 71 080 0096 0 71 064 0024 1 71 080 0288 0 71 064 0072 1 67 080 0192 0 67 064 0048 1 67 080 0288 0 67 064 0072 1 67 080 0096 0 67 064 0024 1 67 080 0096 0 67 064 0024 1 67 080 0096 0 67 064 0024 1 67 080 0192 0 67 064 0048 1 72 080 0288 0 72 064 0072 1 71 080 0096 0 71 064 0024 1 69 080 1104 0 69 064 1416 1 69 080 0096 0 69 064 0024 1 69 080 0192 0 69 064 0048 1 76 080 0288 0 76 064 0072 1 76 080 0096 0 76 064 0024 1 76 080 0192 0 76 064 0048 1 76 080 0288 0 76 064 0072 1 76 080 0096 0 76 064 0024 1 76 080 0192 0 76 064 0048 1 76 080 0288 0 76 064 0072 1 76 080 0096 0 76 064 0024 1 76 080 0192 0 76 064 0048 1 76 080 0192 0 76 064 0048 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 72 080 0192 0 72 064 0048 1 69 080 1296 0 69 064 1344 1 69 080 0096 0 69 064 0024 1 69 080 0096 0 69 064 0024 1 72 080 0192 0 72 064 0048 1 72 080 0192 0 72 064 0048 1 72 080 0192 0 72 064 0048 1 72 080 0192 0 72 064 0048 1 69 080 0192 0 69 064 0048 1 71 080 0192 0 71 064 0048 1 72 080 0096 0 72 064 0024 1 69 080 0288 0 69 064 0072 1 71 080 0192 0 71 064 0048 1 72 080 0192 0 72 064 0048 1 71 080 0288 0 71 064 0072 1 69 080 0096 0 69 064 0024 1 67 080 1296 0 67 064 1224 1 62 080 0096 0 62 064 0024 1 62 080 0096 0 62 064 0024 1 62 080 0096 0 62 064 0024 1 62 080 0096 0 62 064 0024 1 67 080 0504 0 67 064 0096 1 67 080 0096 0 67 064 0024 1 71 080 0408 0 71 064 0072 1 74 080 0048 0 74 064 0012 1 74 080 0048 0 74 064 0012 1 74 080 1008 0 74 064 0072 1 74 080 0096 0 74 064 0024 1 74 080 0096 0 74 064 0024 1 76 080 0096 0 76 064 0024 1 74 080 0192 0 74 064 0048 1 71 080 1776 0 71 064 0144 1 76 080 0384 0 76 064 0096 1 76 080 0192 0 76 064 0048 1 74 080 0384 0 74 064 0096 1 72 080 0192 0 72 064 0048 1 72 080 1104 0 72 064 0096 1 72 080 0192 0 72 064 0048 1 69 080 0384 0 69 064 0096 1 71 080 0096 0 71 064 0024 1 67 080 1416 0 67 064

End

This program is worth the effort of learning it.

To download the March 10 MIDItext 98 software and get instructions on how to use it click here

ABC format:

X:1

T:

M:3/4

Q:1/4=128

K:C

D4DD|d2d2d2|d2GG3|G3GG2|A2G3E|D6|-D6|d6|-d2d2d2|

BB3G2|G3GGG|G2c3B|A6|-A6|A6|-A3A3|-A6|A4A2|

-A6|e6|-e3ee2|e3ee2|e3ee2|e2d2c2|A6|-A6|A6|

-A4A2|-A6|A5A|-A6|A6|-A2A2A2|A2A3A|B3BA2|

B^c4e|d6|-d6|d6|-d5D|-D6|D6|d6|-d6|d2d4|-d4d2|

d2GG3|G3GG2|A2G3E|D6|-D6|d6|-d2d2d2|BB3G2|

G3GGG|G2c3B|A6|-A6|A6|-A3A3|-A6|A4A2|-A6|

e6|-e3ee2|e3ee2|e3ee2|e2d2c2|A6|-A6|A6|-A4A2|

-A6|A5A|-A6|c6|-c2c2c2|c2A2B2|cA3B2|c2B3A|

G6|-G6|G6|-G3D3|-D6|D4D2|-D5D|DG5|GB4d/2d/2|

d6|-d3dde|d2B4|-B6|B6|e6|-e6|e4e2|-e6|d6|

-d4c2|c6|-c4c2|A4BG|-G6|G19/4||

If you really prefer a MIDI file (or can persuade me to render the CD track as an MP3 …) PM me and I can work out where to send what.

Regards,

Bob Bolton

Subject: RE: At the Going Down of the Sun - Who?
From: Franz S.
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 11:40 AM

Bob,

That's the one! I hope you are familiar -scratch that, I'm sure you're familiar with the unalloyed pleasure one gets from solving a mystery like this. Phillips may not care where his stuff comes from, but I do. Actually, since his first career was as an archivist, he cares too.

The "click here" led me to "No such address". I do have a recording of the song, in the radio program.   Like to learn the program, although I am very much a non-techie. I don't understand what follows "ABC Format" in your post. Since I've seen it before, I'll explore the archives for an explanation.

Thanks very much.   You have made my day.

Franz

Subject: RE: At the Going Down of the Sun - Who?
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 06:53 PM

G'day Franz,

Sorry, when I wrote:

"Alan of Australia's (no longer supported by Mudcat …?) MIDItext program"

I probably should have written:

"Alan of Australia's (no longer supported by Mudcat ... or Alan …?) MIDItext program"!

We haven't heard from Alan on Mudcat for some time ... and I haven't met him about the traps, in Sydney, recently. Maybe his computer work has swallowed him whole. It's a pity not to have this handy app running ... indeed, updated and improved, on Mudcat. Alan's app (MID2TXT.EXE) converted a simple MIDI file into a text string that could be e-mailed - or posted in a Mudcat thread - and then, using the second small app (TXT2MID.EXE) you could turn that text string back into a workable MIDI file. Admittedly, the file you get is now a fairly early version ... and not necessarily supported by the latest music programs - but all that could be corrected by a bit of updating by the right computer whiz (not me!).

The need to separately e-mail MIDIs to MMario complicates matters that should be made easier by this modern technology that brings us the opportunity to swap words, tunes, fact, history, ideas and the joy we find in traditional music and song!

Anyway, I certainly do know the pleasure that comes from solving the little mysteries of folksong ... that's why I have been Mudcatting for some six years now ... even enduring the odd "flaming", for my efforts, along the way. I find that Mudcat is a wonderful 'touchstone' in editing and publishing Mulga Wire / Singabout; the magazines of the Bush Music Club (Australia's oldest "folk music club" ... celebrating our 50th anniversary this year).

Ideas that flow from my Mudcat conversations always work well in the magazine context - and help flesh out a view of the other side of the world for us Antipodeans.

Regards,

Bob Bolton

Subject: RE: At the Going Down of the Sun - Who?
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 25 Jun 04 - 11:31 PM

G'day again Franz,

I probably ought to have mentioned that the chorus of Ted's song would have, quite deliberately, been intended to be very familiar to the majority of adult Australians. The words of Lawrence Binyon's poem are always recited (admittedly, these days, usually via a tape-recording played over the PA system) as The Ode in a period of reverent silence, every evening at RSL (Returned Services League [of Australia]) and RSSAILA (Returned Soldiers, Sailors and Airmen's Imperial League of Australia) clubs throughout the land … generally followed by the Last Post.

RSL (and RSSAILA) clubs became widespread after the World Wars … and are most notable now as well established concentrations of poker machines (~= "fruit machines" … gambling machines) – with some of the (vast) profits being directed to social work in the ex-services community. That said, in country towns, the local RSL is a better bet for an economical meal and drink than the local hotels – or the KFC and/or McDonald's franchises.

Regards,

Bob Bolton

Subject: RE: At the Going Down of the Sun - Who?
From: Franz S.
Date: 28 Jun 04 - 02:23 PM

Bob,

Thanks. I sort of figured that from the many websites googled up by "At the going down of the sun". Not all of them were Australian, either.

Franz Schneider