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Meltham, Yorkshire folksong
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Subject: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,Don Hirst Date: 16 Aug 04 - 02:59 AM I am an Australian singer/songwriter and am looking for a traditional song from the Meltham,Yorkshire area to record on my next cd. My great grandfather was born in Meltham and immigrated in 1884.I know of "Dalesman's Litany" but wonder if there is a song that actually refers to Meltham, or comes from that immediate area. Don Hirst |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: nutty Date: 16 Aug 04 - 03:35 AM Hi Don , You need to be looking for material recorded by Will Noble or John Cocking or the Holme Valley Tradition who sing songs traditionally sung in that area of Yorkshire. |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,Raggytash Date: 16 Aug 04 - 04:18 AM Don The next village is Holmfirth with the famous Holmfirth Anthem Abroad for pleasure as I was a walking on one sunny summer evening clear etc etc But I do not know of any song that pertains especially to Meltham but I will make some enquiries |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: Ned Ludd Date: 16 Aug 04 - 06:04 AM Don't know of one from Meltham, but if anyone knows one Will Noble will! Got one from Honley though...Na then Mrs Holroyd can tha feel owt! |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: Red and White Rabbit Date: 16 Aug 04 - 11:02 AM Don Cant help you with traditional songs beyond what has been mentioned but I have written three songs about the Colne Valley - I live in Longwood- the other end of the Valley from Meltham and most ofr my songs have a 'traditional'feel One is called the Golcar Lily - which is about another village just up the road from Meltham on the other side of the Colne River and is about the history of the pub there called the Golcar Lily Another is called Prospect's Old Lady and is about the growth and demise of the mills in the Colne Valley The third is called Scars of Blue and is about the demise of the Coal pits in the Huddersfield area it mentions Linfit Pit which is the pit between Meltham and Slaithwaite as well as Rowley Pit which is another pit in that area but not exactly sure where. If you are interested and want to e-mail me Longwood4@aol.com I will send you the lyrics sue |
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Subject: Meltham folksong From: GUEST Date: 17 Aug 04 - 11:29 PM Wanted. Meltham folksongs |
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Subject: RE: Meltham From: Sorcha Date: 18 Aug 04 - 12:31 AM 1) Do you have a name, other than Guest? Even Guest, Meltham would do so we know who we are responding to. 2) Put meltham in the white search box up top, I found several threads. 3) I know Meltham is in N. Yorkshire, but specific titles or lyric snippets would help if you have any. |
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Subject: RE: Meltham From: GUEST,Sarah Date: 18 Aug 04 - 04:03 AM Slight correction Sorcha - Meltham is in West Yorkshire and I know because I live there. Never heard any specifically Meltham songs though. Cheers Sarah |
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Subject: RE: Meltham From: GUEST,Sarah Date: 18 Aug 04 - 04:41 AM Actually, not folksongs as such, but there are two carols which Melthamers have adopted as their own. 'Tenderley Sleeping' is also called the Meltham Carol, and 'Christmas Bells' is also considered personal to the village. These seem to follow the South Yorkshire tradition of localised carols and South Yorkshire is only over the next hill! But then, I'm only an 'incomer'. Cheers Sarah |
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Subject: RE: Meltham From: Red and White Rabbit Date: 18 Aug 04 - 09:06 AM Hi I put a couple of things on another thread about Colne Valley songs which are the area but dont specifically mention Meltham - if you are the same guest then you know all about them if not let me know and I will poat them again here |
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Subject: Lyr Add: MELTHAM CAROL / TENDERLY SLEEPING From: GUEST,Sarah Date: 18 Aug 04 - 09:32 AM Hi Don, I live in Meltham and the only song I know which is identified specifically with Meltham is called the Meltham Carol which is otherwise known as 'Tenderly Sleeping.' I have no idea of the history of it as I am an incomer. It could be Wesleyan! The words are as follows - I know the tune and could play it for you but I will try and locate the music on the net: Tenderly sleeping, so tranquil and sweet; Jesus the loving and mild. Bright was the day-beam that circled His head, Guarding the Holy Child. Quickly the wise men from far distant lands Hasted their homage to pay, Bearing their gifts and their treasures of gold, Crowning His natal Day. Lifting their heads from the altar of pray'r, Rob'd in their garments of white, Mercy and Truth and the angel of Peace, Met at the gate of light: Prophets and patriarchs, gone to their rest, Welcome that beautiful morn, Blessed Redeemer, the gift of the soul, Gladly we bring to Thee. How can we honour the Saviour divine, Seated in glory above? How can we thank Him for what He has done? How can we sing His love? Thus we will honour and hallow His Name, This shall our offering be: Blessed Redeemer, the gift of the soul, Gladly we bring to Thee. |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,Don Hirst Date: 20 Aug 04 - 10:44 PM Dear All, Thankyou one and each for your assistance so far. How could I contact Will Noble or John Cocking? Don Hirst Message for Sue in Longwood: I would be interested to hear more about your songs but my emails to you keep being returned as incorrect. Is Longwood4@aol.com right? My email is: donald_hirst@hotmail.com |
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Subject: Meltham Yorkshire folksongs From: GUEST,Don Hirst Date: 23 Aug 04 - 10:14 PM Actually this is a message for Sue, from Longwood to perhaps see this. Sue, I am interested in some of your songs you mentioned on the previous thread, but your email is incorrect. Mine is:- donald_hirst@hotmail.com. Please contact. It's an underscore between the names, not a hyphen. Regards Don Hirst |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: Red and White Rabbit Date: 29 Aug 04 - 11:28 AM Hi Don sorry I have been away so my in box was probably full! also had my computer stolen so that also delayed things have sent you an e-mail but in case it doesnt get through to you let me know which songs etc. you want |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: Skipjack K8 Date: 29 Aug 04 - 08:51 PM Spooky, just got in from playing a wedding ceilidh at the Durker Roods in Meltham, but sadly the revellers weren't asking for folksong at all, local or otherwise. |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,don Date: 30 Aug 04 - 02:26 AM Hi Sue. I'd be interested to hear Prospect's Old Lady' and 'Scars of Blue'. You may be interested in my tune to 'A Dalesman's Litany'.I never thought the tune written for it in 1960 was the right Yorkshire sound - too much like 'Greensleeves'. Let me know. I await your email. Don |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: Red and White Rabbit Date: 30 Aug 04 - 04:47 AM Don e-mail me your address and I will post you a CD with Prospects old Lady and Scars of Blue on unless I can get my computer to send out MP3's - love to hear your tune |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,Don Date: 30 Aug 04 - 11:36 PM Sue, Your email will not work - and I've yet to receive yours. I can't figure it out. I don't have the set-up to receive MP3's so we'll have to do it via snail mail. Send to: Don Hirst 6/117 Park Street St Kilda W. 3182 Melbourne Victoria Australia I am recording at the end of the month and when done will send you a copy whcih includes A Daleman's Litany. |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST Date: 31 Aug 04 - 02:02 AM okay Don I have had problems receiving mail but your test got through will try to get it sent off to you tomorrow Sue |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: Red and White Rabbit Date: 31 Aug 04 - 03:50 PM Don cd sent off good luck with yours sue |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,Don Date: 02 Sep 04 - 03:20 AM Sue, Thanks. I look forward to receiving the cd soon. It looks as though we have to communicate via Mudcat until your email problem gets sorted out so keep an eye on this thread. If you wish I can send you a cassete cut of A Daleman's Litany. Let me know. Regards Don |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,Raggytash Date: 02 Sep 04 - 04:44 AM Don I know John Cockings address but will not put it on a thread for all to see, if you PM me I will speak to John and ask if it is OK to forward his address to you Sarah, you may live in West Yorkshire but I live in The West Riding of Yorkshire, I will not allow a beaurocrat sitting in some London office to change with a pen a county boundary that has lasted a thousand years and served Yorkshire so well to mark the borders with the old enemy. (and that's coming from someone born and bred in the County Palatine of Lancashire) |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,padgett Date: 02 Sep 04 - 08:03 AM Meltham may well feature in one or two hunting songs of the Colne Valley hunt, but that's is as far as can go at the moment Dalesman's Litany tune perfectly good, I have recorded this also ~ Gordon Tyrral reckons my versions definitive, but how he got my Cd I'll never know!! |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,Don Date: 07 Sep 04 - 11:01 PM Sue, Received your cd yesterday. Thanks. Have enjoyed it immensely! Reply in mail. In meantime, can you post here the words to "Prospect"? I have trouble with some of the place names. Sorry for the hassle. Don |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: Jonibee Date: 04 Feb 10 - 12:00 PM Sarah, et al, I lived in a hamlet to the north east of Meltham (Helme) for the first 20 odd years of my life before moving around the country, finally ending up in Dorset, where I have lived for the last 30 odd years. My connections with Meltham (in The West Riding of Yorkshire !!) are now quite tenuous, but I well remember very cold Christmas Eve nights carol singing in Meltham market place and surrounding areas, starting at midnight with 'Christians Awake' and finishing around 5.30am However, I consider myself very fortunate in owning a cd of 'Meltham's Favourite Carols', recorded in St Bartholomew's Church Meltham some time ago. The church choristers performed the necessary, and the carols included:- Hear ye now, the gladsome tidings Christians awake Morning Star The Hallowed Season Salvation (Sweet Chiming Christmas Bells) Peaceful, Gladsome Christmas Morning Tenderley Sleeping and ending with 'Goodnight', a total of 20 carols, the ones above having a particular 'Meltham' feel about them. Incidentally, my wife hails from Holmfirth (home of 'Pratty Flowers'), and I also remember many a happy Saturday evening spent at The Royal Oak in Upperthong singing the hunting songs of Holme Valley Beagles ilk (Gossip John etc). Raggytash mentions his pride of living in one of Yorkshire's 3 Ridings. Being a true Yorkshireman, I do not recognise 'South Yorkshire', and therefore any correspondence emanating from my home address to that glorious County will have the appropriate Riding attached as part of the address!!! |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,padgett on lap top Date: 04 Feb 10 - 01:36 PM Some great tracks here! Many here fall into the category of Yorkshire carols, nearest to Meltham being held annually in the George at Upper Denby (was at The Fountain, Ingbirchworth for very many years) The Sheffield carols still being extremely popular ~ Royal at Dungworth, Sheffield These songs can still be heard locally too See also Holmfirth festival of folk, also Will Noble/John Cocking/Barry Bridgwater. Andrew Rogers and Mark Davies of the Pennine Foxhounds and there is still a sing at TheRoyal Oak at Upperthong on occasions Ray |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: Steve Gardham Date: 04 Feb 10 - 02:45 PM Quite a few of the songs in the Holme Valley Beagles Hunt book of 'Hunters' Songs' mention Meltham Hounds and hunting from Meltham. There are no tunes in the book but in most cases the tunes are obvious as the songs are based on existing songs like the White Hare. |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,bradfordian, abroad Date: 12 Feb 10 - 08:46 AM One song relating to some of the smaller towns and villages around Huddersfield, and which may be associated with the Holme Valley tradition begins:- There's Linfit and Slawit and Marsden 'otel Bills o' Jacks Meltham and Crossland - Crab Well........ Cho. Encore, encore, we'll 'ave a glass more Encore, encore, there'e time fer one more Encore, encore, we'll 'ave a glass more, An' then we'll go quietly 'ome, bow, wow. Is anyone familiar with this in Kirklees, or beyond? |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: theleveller Date: 12 Feb 10 - 09:18 AM "Being a true Yorkshireman, I do not recognise 'South Yorkshire', and therefore any correspondence emanating from my home address to that glorious County will have the appropriate Riding attached as part of the address!!!" Well, it took us a long time to get the East Riding back and the dreaded North Humberside abolished. Interestingly (or not), whereas the North and West Ridings are usually abbreviated to North Yorkshire and West Yorkshire, the East Riding is usually speleed out as The East Riding of Yorkshire. |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: Steve Gardham Date: 12 Feb 10 - 10:19 AM And my two sons were born in Humberside which doesn't exist. They're too old to play for Yorkshire now anyway. If the folk who live in South Yorkshire are hapyy to be in South Yorkshire then that's up to them. I wouldn't presume. I was born when the old boundaries were in existence and they'll always be those boundaries to me. |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,Ebor_fiddler Date: 12 Feb 10 - 04:18 PM Amen to that, Stephen! |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,dozy rozy Date: 13 Feb 10 - 01:26 AM Raggy, have you moved back from whitby? |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,padgett on lap top Date: 13 Feb 10 - 11:09 AM dosy ~ check out the dates on the threads and all should become clearer!! Ray |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: Matthew Edwards Date: 13 Feb 10 - 12:37 PM Did Don, the original poster, ever complete his CD? He said on another thread he had a poem about the 1832 Bill o' Jacks murders at the Moorcock Inn, Greenfield which Bradfordian's verses reminded me about. I can't find any more of Bradfordian's song in the Holme Valley book - please do post it here. The Colne Valley Beagles hunt have a song in their book 'Songs of the Scarlet & Green' called The White House Hunt writen by Malcolm Hawkswell, which you can hear sung at the White House in Meltham on YouTube (I think the singer is John Cocking). This song is based on an older Meltham hunting song The Keepers and the Drivers which has been in the Holme Valley Hunters' Songs song book since 1923. I think it is safely out of copyright by now so I can add it here. Matthew |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Add. The Keepers and the Drivers From: Matthew Edwards Date: 13 Feb 10 - 12:40 PM The Keepers and the Drivers The keepers and the drivers, likewise some sporting men, To have a day of hunting, lads, it was their hearts' intent; So they went to Baron Kilner, and asked him for his ground, To have a day of hunting, so they sent for Holmfirth hounds. Laddie full light full la-rol-la, Laddie full light full la-rol-la, Laddie full light full la-rol-rol, Laddie full light full la-rol-la. So they choose a captain, likewise they choose a day, At the Rose and Crown at Meltham, lads, the drivers' hunt was there; They sent out invitations, they sent them a long way, 'Be sure to be at Meltham on that appointed day.' The huntsman and the whipper-in, with sixteen harriers came, And breakfast it being over, lads, he said "Now where's your game?" The captain said to the huntsman. "The dogs they make a row, Go fetch um yat ut stable, turn out at Royd Edge Brow." They had not been out very long, when Sportsman he gave mouth, "Hark! forward," said the huntsman, "she's lying to the south"; The hare, it being a stout one, she ran up Harden Clough, And every honest sportsman there had pleasure quite enough. This hare she gave a double, turns her head towards the west, But Monitor and Lady, they did not let her rest; For as they ran o'er Madge Knowle, the hounds were in full cry, Away they went o'er hill and dale, till they came to Isle of Skye. Charles Heaton and Sam Pogson said, "This hare's been over run, We'd better leave the ground," they said, "her staying power is done." Just then our worthy captain made just one remark, "Let's wend our way to Meltham before it gets too dark." And when we gate to Meltham, Walker Wood he took the chair, And every honest sportsman there, his orders did obey; Now some could sing and some could play, Joe O'Lukes could tell a tale, Joe Brook he sings "Old Charlottee", John Brook filled us some ale. John Schofield sang a hunting song, Joe O'Lukes he tells a tale, And captain said to landlord, "Just fill this jug with ale"; But before he finished off his tale, he said "his hund was roe," He'd walked all gate thrut Isle of Skye, as it began to snow. Ben Kinder he came down thrut Royd, he sang a Russian air, I think they called it "Sambo", why, he sang it very fair; He played a foreign instrument, he played it very neat, He played his own accompaniment with his elbows, knees and feet. There was one gamekeeper, he jumps up, "Before I do depart, I'll bid adieu to Captain, lads, before I make a start; For there's one think that is certain, he's got a name for life, But he says he's near o' been Captain, but for Arthur Earnshaw's wife. So here's adieu to huntsmen, and all invited guests, It's been a pleasant evening, lads, it's been one of the best; John Brook, he being the landlord, said "It is now closing time," So the drivers' hunt was ended, in nineteen hundred and nine. Source: Hunters' Songs, Traditional Songs Sung By The Holme Valley Beagle's Hunt, IV Edition 1990. No author credited. Notes I don't think the song has been recorded; it isn't included in the Roud Index, but AlanG has sung it a few times at the Snug at Lymm. The references are very local; the place names can be followed on a 1;25 000 map although the Isle of Skye refers to a a former pub of that name on the Holmfirth road over Saddleworth Moor. The song gives a wonderful picture of a hunting singing session from before the First World War. Mr Barron Kilner of Wakefield wasn't a peer but was a member of the family famous for manufacturing glass jars. The Colne Valley Beagle hunt song book 'Songs of the Scarlet & Green' has a photograph taken in 1949 at High Moor, Saddleworth, which includes an elderly, but still sprightly looking, Joe O' Lukes. Matthew |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: Steve Gardham Date: 13 Feb 10 - 01:32 PM Matthew, Is the Colne valley book still in print? What is its publishing date and is it appreciably different to the Holme Valley book please? |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: Matthew Edwards Date: 13 Feb 10 - 02:05 PM Hi Steve, The 'Songs of the Scarlet & Green' was compiled by Simon Shaw and Ken Green in 2005 and privately printed by subscription for the Colne Valley Beagles hunt. It contains 112 songs and 7 monologues written in a parody of biblical tales by Tom Hellawell in the 1950's. There is a considerable overlap with the repertoire of the Holme Valley, and with the songs of the Cumbrian Fell Packs, but there are also many very local songs; some by fairly well known writers like Ammon Wrigley but also Malcolm Hawkswell, Bob Auty, George Hinchcliffe among others. The introduction to the book mentions that a CD of the Colne Valley hunting songs is "another pending project at the moment". I don't think the book is still in print - I found my copy in a Holmfirth bookshop - Abebooks has a copy on sale for £12.00. Matthew |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: dozy rozy Date: 13 Feb 10 - 06:05 PM You're quite right, Mr Pagett.I stand corrected.I thought for a short while that the lifeboat event would perhaps return to a more convenient venue. |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: bradfordian Date: 14 Feb 10 - 06:30 PM Matthew, "The Keepers and the Drivers" has been recorded by Bill Price probably on "Fine Old Yorkshire Gentleman" I'll post the full words for the earlier song in due course. brad |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: bradfordian Date: 15 Feb 10 - 04:12 AM Here's the full lyrics of this song I referred to earlier. I was given this by a neighbour when I lived in Huddersfield 30 yrs ago. There's Linfit an, Slawit an' Marsden 'otel Bills o' Jacks, Meltham an' Crossland - Crab Well There's Netherton Dungeon and Butternab too An' in Beaumont park there's some tunnels t' go through Cho. Encore, encore, we'll 'ave a glass more Encore, encore, there'e time fer one more Encore, encore, we'll 'ave a glass more, An' then we'll go quietly 'ome, bow, wow. There's High Moor an' Low Moor an' moors about York Northumberland, Dublin, Newcastle an' Cork Isle a Man, Isle a Wight, Gibralter an' Rome Lockwood an' Honley an' New Mill an' Holme There's Bill Barkers at Barhouse an' New Diggins tip Rabies at Sunny Bank, scissors in t' Nick Nethermoor, Waterhoil Dungeon, Woodhead If yer want onny more yer mun sing it yer sen! Linfit = Linthwaite Slawit = Slaithwaite Nick = Prison onny = any mun = must sen = self (Hmmm, I might just put this on my new CD!) Brad |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,padgett on lap top Date: 15 Feb 10 - 04:21 AM Yes I heard this sung by Bill very many years ago, a cracking chorus I will have a word with Bob Auty and Frank Garbut and see if there is a Colne Valley song book somewhere! Ray |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: Matthew Edwards Date: 15 Feb 10 - 05:59 AM Bradfordian, yes, please do add that to your new CD - and let us know when it's ready! Thanks for posting the words. I knew that when I wrote above that I didn't think anyone had recorded 'The Keepers and the Drivers' that I was asking for trouble! Besides Bill Price there was also a recording by Steve Turner on his Fellside LP 'Jigging one Now', and I think AlanG said that he had got his version from either the Wayfarers or the Notts Alliance - I'll ask him next time we meet. Matthew |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: bradfordian Date: 15 Feb 10 - 06:26 AM Matthew, this may be the poem to which you alluded earlier in this thread. From this website Bill o' Jacks murders Here lie the dreadfully bruised and lacerated bodies of William Bradbury and Thomas, his son, both of Greenfield, who were together savagely murdered in an Unusually horrid manner, on Monday night, April 2nd. 1832, William being 84 and Thomas 46 years old. Throughout the land wherever news is read. Intelligence of their sad end has spread. Those now who talk of far-famed Greenfield hills. Will think of Bill o' Jack's and Tom o' Bills Such interest did their tragic end excite. That, ere they were removed from human sight. Thousands on thousands came to see. The bloody scene of catastrophe. One house, one business, and one bed. And one most shocking death they had. One funeral came, one inquest past. And now one grave they had a last. |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,Andy Cluness Date: 12 Jan 11 - 02:01 AM Kumbla Vista by Paul Quarmby was a classic tune looking back. Went like:
Eenie meenie, heenie meenie you are decimeenie scat and frat and root and toot and rah rah rah. |
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Subject: RE: Meltham, Yorkshire folksong From: GUEST,andyval Date: 12 Jan 11 - 02:59 PM The Bill's O' Jack's poem is the inscrpition from the gravestone in Saddleworth church graveyard |
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