ID this melody, talented people?

Subject: ID this melody, talented people?
From: GUEST,Bard Judith of www.santharia.com
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 11:16 AM

http://stuwww.uvt.nl/~s528998/midigifts/lansquenetslamentv4.MID

This has an interesting history - a Santharian contributor from Germany wrote a poem for our site (www.santharia.com) and had this music 'in her head' for it. She 'knows it's a folk song' but can't identify the singer, title or any lyrics.   She wrote out the tune in European notation; I read it and recognized it as well, but couldn't put my finger on any details either.   From her notation plus comments from the two of us, a musician friend from Holland 'midi'ed' the melody - this is the most recent version.

Can anyone here recognize the tune, at least the first part, and give me anything to go on towards naming the song or the singer? It would be very much appreciated! I will gladly take emails regarding this: masterbard (at) poetic (dot) com

Thank you!

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: alanabit
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 11:29 AM

I did not recognise it, but I can ask Ina later on. Why not try sending PMs to some of Mudcat's German contingent? There are Sabine, Wolfgang, Mudguard and others.

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: mooman
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 11:44 AM

It sounds familiar. I'll have a think.

Peace

moo

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: GUEST,Mr Happy
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 11:48 AM

http://stuwww.uvt.nl/~s528998/midigifts/lansquenetslamentv4.MID

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: katlaughing
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 02:05 PM

Whatever it is, it is beautiful! Thanks for sharing it with us.

kat

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Cluin
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 02:13 PM

Sandy MacFadden's Farewell to his Lunch?





;)

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 05:41 PM

It's Irish, or a composite of Irish tunes - Wolfgang will know it. ;-)

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 05:56 PM

My guess is this one - a version of it or a composite of several songs including this one:

Shule Agra/ Johnny Has Gone for a Soldier/ Buttermilk Hill

(I'm having trouble hearing the Mudcat Midis just now.)

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: open mike
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 06:24 PM

yes it brings to mind :
"here i sit on butter milk hill...
who could blame me cry my fill....
Johnny has gone for a soldier..."

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 06:29 PM

I don't think so. The opening bars are reminiscent of all sorts of things, but the rest moves away from that. I'd suspect Mainland European rather than Irish or British (and why shouldn't it be German?) but we can only guess at this stage.

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 06:44 PM

I based my guess solely on the chord progression heard in the second verse of the midi. The melody jumps around a bit.

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Joybell
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 09:54 PM

What about the English sea song - "We'll go to Sea no More/Go to sea no more/Go to sea once more/Off to sea once more". (It's a bit like "Greensleeves") too. Joy and Hildebrand.

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Gypsy
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 10:25 PM

Oh man, i would love to get the notation on this. Any chance?

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Aug 05 - 12:21 AM

Maybe, "Gabriel's Message"?

The angel Gabriel from heaven came,
his wings as drifted snow, his eyes as flame;
"All hail," said he, "thou lowly maiden Mary,
most highly favour'd lady, Gloria!"

Here's a link to a page at Amazon with a sound sample.

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: BK Lick
Date: 26 Aug 05 - 12:24 AM

Oops, that was me -- forgot to sign in.

—BK

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: IvanB
Date: 26 Aug 05 - 01:05 AM

A bit reminiscent of "Thomas the Rhymer," as in the DT.

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: masato sakurai
Date: 26 Aug 05 - 01:28 AM

According to the file name, it probably is LANSQUENET'S LAMENT. See the comment:

(The following song is well known throughout Santharia.
It is said to have its origin at the end of the Second Sarvonian War
when a bard was drawn into the warfare. Rumours go,
that not few soldiers tired of killing and getting killed deserted
after this song spread among the common troops.)

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Joybell
Date: 26 Aug 05 - 02:10 AM

So Santharia is a fantasy place? The poem was written for a fantasy site?
Anyway the tune sounds like several English tunes to us. Any takers on the ones I posted above? Cheers, Joy

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Little Robyn
Date: 26 Aug 05 - 03:55 AM

I hear a version of Geordie in the second line, but not in the rest.
Robyn

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 26 Aug 05 - 08:42 AM

Masato, is there a sound link to that one?

BK, thanks for my new Christmas song this year - and it's still just August! (I try to learn a new one every year)

Joybell, I haven't had time to check them out yet.

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 26 Aug 05 - 09:51 PM

Thought it might be this one...

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Bill D
Date: 26 Aug 05 - 10:34 PM

Gypsy, or others..here are .GIF images of the score...imported into Noteworthy as a midi, printed, then scanned as TIF and converted to GIF.

They are taller than screen, so you might have to view smaller...and the measure lines are kinda light...

http://home.comcast.net/~somethingextree/music/Lansquenetlament1.gif

http://home.comcast.net/~somethingextree/music/Lansquenetlament2.gif

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Nick
Date: 27 Aug 05 - 04:55 AM

Isn't it "The River in the Pines" as recorded by Joan Baez on "Farewell Angelina" and "Rare, Live and Classic"?

According to this site "Mary's Lament (Irish) - In Canada, this air has survived as "The River in the Pines," with tragic words. I find it to be a flexible tune; it can actually be played quite lightly if the performer is in that mood" so it may be based on an earlier Irish tune perhaps

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Nick
Date: 27 Aug 05 - 05:01 AM

River in the Pines - this clip from Amazon should confirm it. Last track on Disc 1

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 27 Aug 05 - 11:26 AM

I think you're right, Nick, good call.

I'm still curious about the similarity to other tunes...it's "pedigree." (ancestry, crossbreeding, etc.)

I like the idea of "Mary's Lament" ;-)

Subject: RE: ID this melody, talented people?
From: GUEST,Bard Judith
Date: 08 Sep 05 - 09:53 PM

Thank you all for your quick and intelligent responses! I may have to actually sign up here instead of guest-lurking... :)

Nick is brilliant - and absolutely right, coz I found an old tape the other day and recognized the piece after the first three notes Joan Baez sings.

I found the exact same site linking the tune of 'River in the Pines' to 'Mary's Lament' but then couldn't track its pedigree any farther, as all searches for the lament wound up dead-ending at contemporary compositions about (the Virgin) Mary's grief for her son. Which, of course, the old Irish song may have been as well...

'Lanquesnet's Lament', BTW, before anyone goes off on that tangent, is the title of the newly-composed poem/lyrics which my German friend wrote to go with the tune (now ID'd, thank you!) that was in her head. The lyrics exist only inside our fantasy world of Caelereth (can I put in a plug for www.santharia.com
here?) as do any references you might find in the lyrics, of course!   

Again, I appreciate everyone's input. Feel free to visit us if you like contemporary compositions, because we have a couple of our own composers. I shall certainly be back here - what a wonderful community!

Regards from the bard,
Judith