UK Licensing - Contact your MP

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: GUEST,vectis at work
Date: 30 Apr 07 - 04:09 AM

My MP signed without a murmer, good lad, but he doubts that it will do much good.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 13 Apr 07 - 10:11 AM

Still only 50 names.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 08 Apr 07 - 01:26 PM

The following are the only Labour MPs to have so far signed this EDM.

Etherington, Bill
Gerrard, Neil
Jenkins, Brian
McDonnell, John
Simpson, Alan
Vis, Rudi

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 08 Apr 07 - 08:30 AM

http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:Yfu8R_JAJlwJ:www.scottishpubs.co.uk/Aboutus/News/scotland-PR%2520Licensing%2520Reassurance%2520Final.pdf+Licensing+reform+Scotland+2007&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=uk

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 08 Apr 07 - 08:25 AM

Perhaps it would be easier to establish the names of those Scottish MPs (especially the many Labour ones representing Scottish seats) who spoke and voted against it?

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Jack Campin
Date: 08 Apr 07 - 04:38 AM

There has been no move from the Government or the Labour group in the Scottish Parliament to try anything like this. (It would be a devolved matter).

I signed an e-petition about this months ago.

Which Scottish MPs (if any) voted for this?

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 08 Apr 07 - 03:10 AM

Where it is true that this Act does not currently apply in Scotland - I am sure that our new Scottish Prime Minister in-waiting will soon be claiming his Government's Act to be such a success, that the momentum to impose it or similar measures in Scotland also, will prove to be unstoppable.

And the days of pedantic, 'I'm alright Jock' messages like these will end.

For the appeal for posters to contact their MP does apply equally to those living in Scotland - even when the legislation itself does not apply there.

For the major injustice here is that MPs in Scottish seats are equally responsible for voting for and inflicting legislation that does not apply in Scotland - upon the poor souls of England and Wales.

The point being that perhaps those living in one country whose elected members can inflict legislation on other countries without the risk of upsetting their own constituents - should not perhaps risk sounding quite so smug about living in a country that is doing fine without the rubbish legislation, that they are fortunate to avoid by living there.

So far.........................

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 07 Apr 07 - 08:54 PM

And yes, it is just as pedantic to post only to complain that having UK in the thread's title is not strictly accuarate as it is for those posters in the USA, Oz and elsewhere to post asking that UK is added to the title.....................

As they do.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Jack Campin
Date: 07 Apr 07 - 08:40 PM

It is not just pedantic to protest that this is ***NOT*** a "UK" act. It's for England and Wales. Nothing like this is in force in Scotland, or proposed for Scotland.

The point being that you don't have to look very far to find a country that's doing fine without it.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 07 Apr 07 - 08:27 PM

It seems to be stuck on 50.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 29 Mar 07 - 05:51 AM

50 names now.

http://edmi.parliament.uk/EDMi/EDMDetails.aspx?EDMID=32810&SESSION=885

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Folkiedave
Date: 26 Mar 07 - 12:20 PM

Tell all your friends and don't vote for him is the best remedy.

And after a while tell him you are doing it..........

It will probably not make much difference - since most constituencies (but not all) tend to go with the national swing........but it might give you some satisfaction.

Set up a website saying what a lazy ghit he is............

Tell the newspapers................

Go on radio phone ins...........

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: GUEST,Rob
Date: 26 Mar 07 - 11:20 AM

Problem is that my MP never replies to any letters I send him :-( which are mainly about there being too many stupid laws.

He shouldn't be allowed not to reply ...

Maybe there should be a law against MPs not replying to constituents correspondence ....

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 25 Mar 07 - 03:41 PM

46

http://edmi.parliament.uk/EDMi/EDMDetails.aspx?EDMID=32810&SESSION=885

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 25 Mar 07 - 02:59 AM

So what alternatives are suggested by those who judge EDMs and petitions to be a waste of time?

The past EDMs and petitons HAVE made a big difference.

Not enough of one - which is why these new ones should be supported.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: GUEST,Steve in Sidmouth
Date: 24 Mar 07 - 11:38 PM

Anyone who knows anything about the workings of Parliament will know that Early Day Motions (EDMs) aren't worth the paper they're printed on.

The Motions are never debated in the House of Commons. They never have any hope at all of becoming law. They are completely ignored by the leaders of both main parties. They are just a publicity tool used by publicity-seeking MPs.

Hugo Swire is no fan of folk music. It is his own Conservative local authority here in Devon who cut all their funding to the Sidmouth Festival a couple of years ago and precipitated the funding crisis which the Festival is still having to recover from.

Mr. Swire did nothing to help then and anyone with a genuine interest in folk music should be very wary of his support now.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 24 Mar 07 - 08:49 PM

I agree Mr. Happy, But you still can't give up and let them think they've no opposition.

Don T.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Mr Happy
Date: 24 Mar 07 - 11:46 AM

We went through all this a couple of years ago, petitions & so on.

Never made a blind bit of difference.

Democracy can't work against New Labour/Fascist indifference

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 23 Mar 07 - 04:43 PM

Thank you Roger, tho' a swift look at that thread would elicit the information that I have already responded to it.

I find myself on the horns of a dilemma, namely that I have information that might just possibly shake the useless sod out of his smug belief in Tony, and the Live Music Forum (spit, spit) and persuade him to sign the EDM, but I can't, out of respect for Andy's wishes, use it.

Ho Hum, I guess we'll have to forego the pleasure of using the bludgeon and look for something subtle. It won't be half as much fun, tho'.

Don T.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 23 Mar 07 - 08:13 AM

Nope, no sign of a change from mine, but after hearing today that Miskin Folk Festival is cancelled, due to heavy handed use of the new law by the local authority, he is about to receive a very angry communication from this constituent.

Don T.

The following thread is (now) about the late cancellation of this festival.

Miskin 2007

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 22 Mar 07 - 09:22 PM

You misunderstand - there is no offence involved in playing in a pub, for the people playing. It's the landlords who are under threat if they don't stop it happening where there's no licence covering it. They are subject to massive fines and can lose their licences.

Playing in the street without a licence would of course escape that problem. Theoretically they could probably come after us for some kind of breach of public order or whatever, but I suspect they wouldn't bother. Might be worth trying, when the weather is a bit better.

"I'll bet the new rules don"t apply to the Commons Bar !!!" True enough. But then virtually no rules apply inside a Commons Bar because it's in the Palace of Westminster and that means its exempt from just about everything, though I suppose murdering a fellow member would count as contempt of the House of Commons.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: bubblyrat
Date: 22 Mar 07 - 08:44 PM

I really don"t understand why everybody doesn"t just go ahead and do what they want, and stuff the consequences !! Are the government, the police, the local authorities, going to put tens of thousands of people in jail for having a sing-song in a pub ?? What jails ?? How many police will it take ?? The police won"t even come out if you"ve got armed robbers in your house --!! Does anyone REALLY think that the traitor and criminal, Tony Blair, is going to set up special hit-squads to deal with the menace of folk-singers in pubs ?? Of course not !! It is beyond belief that, in these troubled and uncertain times, the so-called "government " of this once great and respected nation, have got bugger-all better to legislate against than the possibility of a few simple souls singing the traditional music of their country in their village pubs !! I "ll bet the new rules don"t apply to the Commons Bar !!!

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Bonecruncher
Date: 22 Mar 07 - 08:19 PM

Perhaps Jim Knight M.P. and others including local Councillors should be reminded that they are elected to represent their constituents, not the government of the day.

Colyn.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: bubblyrat
Date: 22 Mar 07 - 08:16 PM

Years ago, I was at the Naval Air Station at Brawdy, near St. Davids, in Wales . In those days, the pubs were all closed on Sundays, which didn"t bother us to be honest, as we had the NAAFI . Our attitude was " Bugger the miserable Welsh gits ! " , but eventually, commonsense prevailed, and Welsh Sundays became satisfyingly wet, but now----well, blow me down if the Cambrian Killjoys aren"t at it AGAIN !! No Miskin festival, because , let"s face it, the Welsh loathe the English , and , even worse, they hate themselves even more, so what better way to self-flagellate than to ban a popular festival ?? It would never happen in France !!

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 22 Mar 07 - 07:24 PM

Nope, no sign of a change from mine, but after hearing today that Miskin Folk Festival is cancelled, due to heavy handed use of the new law by the local authority, he is about to receive a very angry communication from this constituent.

Don T.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: BB
Date: 22 Mar 07 - 05:00 PM

Yep - had an e-mail confirming that he has. But 41 does seem a pretty poor show. It really does seem worth nagging them, with a reasonable argument.

Barbara

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 22 Mar 07 - 05:27 AM

Only 41 and I thought that more would sign yesterday, as most of them would have attended for the Budget.

Is your MP's name there yet?

http://edmi.parliament.uk/EDMi/EDMDetails.aspx?EDMID=32810&SESSION=885

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 21 Mar 07 - 01:56 AM

39.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 20 Mar 07 - 01:53 AM

36 MPs have now signed.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Folkiedave
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 03:53 AM

It is normally referred to as the "Payroll Vote".

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 02:01 AM

There also seems to be convention that a way to prevent your own MPs from signing any EDM that may be critical of that Government - is by giving them all a token job as a junior minister...............

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Mary Humphreys
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 12:46 PM

There is a convention in Parliament that members of the government do not sign EDMs.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Mr Happy
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 07:54 AM

As a member of the Government I cannot sign EDMs?

What's he mean?

He's an MP just like all the other MPs who are part of govt.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 06:15 AM

29 MPs have now signed.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 17 Mar 07 - 05:55 AM

This is my letter to, and the reply from my MP.

10 March 2007

Dear Mr Knight

Could you please add your name to the following EDM?

EDM 1069
IMPACT OF THE LICENSING ACT 2003 ON SMALL-SCALE LIVE MUSIC
07.03.2007

Swire, Hugo
That this House expresses concern at the impact of the Licensing Act 2003 on small-scale live music after the abolition of the `two in a bar' rule; regrets the Government's handling of the implementation of the legislation and the additional costs created for local authorities and applicants; notes the petition signed by some 38,000 people on the Downing Street website on the burdens created by the Act on music and dance across the UK; and calls on the Government to acknowledge the errors in the legislation and take steps to ensure that the future of small-scale live music is not put at risk.

Roger

STOP PRESS.

In February 2007, The New Star in Fortuneswell applied and obtained Premise Licence Entertainment Permission for live music and indoor sports: as local authority advice was that this was a requirement of the Licensing Act 2003.

Despite that it would now be considered as legal and the new licensees ringing me and asking if the regular Wednesday session could restart - this is not going to happen. For since the Council's part in preventing it from continuing (without complaint) under the old legislation and from restarting (without complaint) under the new, the participants have made alternative arrangements - in Weymouth.

According to the Act - neither participatory music making nor indoor sports - when not intended for an audience or spectators is Regulated Entertainment. This is not the advice being provided by the Council's officers - to licensees and its elected members.

Could you write and point this out to Weymouth and Portland Borough Council? And the fact that the Act's Statutory Guidance requires the Local Statement of Licensing Policy to be revisited when this has been shown to have prevented a cultural activity, such as this session. I would be grateful if you could advise me of their response and of any other action you may decide is appropriate to record and address this situation locally and nationally.

Yours sincerely
---------------------------------------------------------------------

I6 March 2007

Dear Mr Gall

Thank you for your letter. I understand that this is an issue which has been causing concern for you. Of course it is very important to ensure that the changes within the Licensing Act (2003) are clear and that they do not harm small-scale live music.

As a member of the Government I cannot sign EDMs but I have written to Weymouth and Portland Borough Council and asked them to clarify the guidelines relating to licences for the form you refer to, and to check that the advice given complies with the Act.

I will keep you informed of their response.

With best wishes

Jim Knight
MP South Dorset

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 15 Mar 07 - 06:02 PM

Nope, seems the bugger's run out of guts again.

I had a reply from him basically rehashing the government spin, so it looks like he's turned his coat.

Hopefully he'll pay for it in lost votes. He certainly won't be getting mine

Don T.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: BB
Date: 15 Mar 07 - 02:19 PM

Apparently not. And I haven't even had a reply from him to my e-mail a few days ago. He's a Lib Dem, so perhaps he's feeling too guilty from when the legislation went through. We shall see...

Barbara

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 15 Mar 07 - 12:24 PM

Si far a total of 25 MPs have signed the EDM.

Is the name of your MP among them?

http://edmi.parliament.uk/EDMi/EDMDetails.aspx?EDMID=32810&SESSION=885

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 09:15 AM

Sorry - that should read.

and that the Lib Dem peers did NOT fully exploit their all-powerful position.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 09:13 AM

The following thread charts the final blow-by-blow progress of the Bill becoming the Act.

The Licensing Act - the future

It makes interesting reading - as will see that there was much confusion at the time about what exactly the final concessions were.

It shows that certainly many Labour MPs were under the wrong impression that more was conceeded than actually was, and that the Lib Dem peers did fully exploit their all-powerful position.

had they stoos firm, at that point, the Government's side would have given them anything they demanded - rather than lose the Bill.

If only......................

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 08:52 AM

The guy from the Lords was Lord Reedsdale (a nice hornpipe) who seemed a good chap - leader of the revolt?

Leader of the revolt - I think not.

He and hs fellow Lib Dem Peers could have ensured that this unfortunate piece of ill-considered rubbish never became law.

They had argued against it and held up proceedings but by deciding to vote with the Governments' side at the final stage (but to still argue against it) - they were the ones that sold out all those who opposed this Bill and ensured that it did become law.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: GUEST,GUEST - Trevor Bennett
Date: 12 Mar 07 - 05:54 PM

The guy from the Lords was Lord Reedsdale (a nice hornpipe) who seemed a good chap - leader of the revolt? on Saturday Live. I emailed them: did they or any good lawyer know whether the Morris men could play in the pub afterwards? If the street corner, village green or pub car park doesn't need a licence for them to play/dance, perhaps they carry some sort of permission zone around with them; those too old or incapable of dancing could play nearby to them?

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 12 Mar 07 - 05:12 PM

This is not the first time that comment has been made bubblyrat.

The only problem is that it's the licensee who cops a packet for your rebellion, so you are unlikely to find many to host your battle.

Don T.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: bubblyrat
Date: 12 Mar 07 - 01:59 PM

The time has surely come for all folk musicians, morris dancers, traditional singers, cloggies, flat-footers,rappers,mollies, and mummers to TOTALLY IGNORE any inconveniences put upon them by the government of the criminal & traitor ,Tony Blair, and , basically, do as they bloody well please. !! If this government can"t find more important things to legislate upon, then God help us all !!

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: GUEST,North West Cloggers
Date: 11 Mar 07 - 10:27 PM

Recorded Morris Dancers anyone?

Or amplified!

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: danensis
Date: 11 Mar 07 - 12:10 PM

According tosome guy from the Lords who was on the radio yesterday morning the government were perfectly aware of what they were doing when they passed the bill. It was thrown out by the Lords three times, and on the fourth attempt they "did a deal" and offered Morris Dancing (but not Clog Dancing). The parliamentary draughtsmen suggested it would be difficult to separate the two, so it ended up as Morris Dancing was allowed, but acoustic music was not. Recorded Morris Dancers anyone?

John

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Leadfingers
Date: 11 Mar 07 - 11:27 AM

I've put my Tuppence in !!

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 11 Mar 07 - 10:34 AM

Done!

My MP was a signatory to the last one, but didn't have the balls to vote against the whip when the chips were down. And him an ex Morrisman. Still of course, his lot got an exemption.

I hope he has more commitment this time, but don't hold yer breff.

Don T.

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 11 Mar 07 - 05:51 AM

This was the response to the last one. At least all those MPs who signed that one should be prepared to sign the new one.

Commons Early Day Motion 331

Subject: RE: UK Licensing - Contact your MP
From: The Shambles
Date: 10 Mar 07 - 07:34 PM

UK Licensing Act - Another petition