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BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate

24 Sep 08 - 04:38 PM (#2449208)
Subject: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

John McCain will go back to Washington and suspend his campaign so that he may deal with the economic crisis.

He will have to pospone the debate with Obama


24 Sep 08 - 04:42 PM (#2449213)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Little Hawk

How is he going to deal with it? Sell his cars and houses and donate the proceeds to help pay off the national debt? Shave his head to raise money? What?


24 Sep 08 - 04:43 PM (#2449214)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

Oops, I posted this 2 days early \ pretend you didn't see this until tommorrow.


24 Sep 08 - 04:44 PM (#2449216)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: PoppaGator

Does that make Sarah the Twit the Republican nominee?


24 Sep 08 - 04:47 PM (#2449218)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: GUEST,lox

?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

huh?


24 Sep 08 - 04:52 PM (#2449220)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Alice

I just saw Obama's press conference.

He called McCain this morning re the economic crisis, then later heard back this afternoon that they want to cancel the Friday debate. Obama said that presidents need to be able to deal with more than one thing at a time, and there is no reason to cancel - that now more than ever, the voters want to hear from the candidates where they stand and what they would do. So... at this point, Obama is ready for the debate, McCain wants a time out.


24 Sep 08 - 04:55 PM (#2449223)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Amos

The "Oh no, he didn't!" Award for today goes to Sen. John McCain with his announcement that he's suspending his presidential campaign tomorrow and wants to postpone Friday's debate with Sen. Barack Obama so that he can help negotiate the bipartisan bailout of America's wrecked financial system. Oh, and he's called on Obama to put politics aside and join him. That's certainly a bold move. But why now?

This has not been a good couple of weeks for McCain, and today has been horrendous. The latest Washington Post/ABC News poll showed Obama with a clear lead over the senator from Arizona for the very first time. As if that weren't bad enough, a national poll from Fox News/Opinion Dynamics and battleground state polls from Marist appear to back up the contention that Obama is striking a chord with voters on the economy. This is giving him valuable momentum going into Friday's debate.

Then, as E.J. wrote about earlier, there was the front page New York Times story today contradicting McCain campaign assertions that the firm founded by campaign chief Rick Davis had had no dealings with Freddie Mac for three years. The story reports that Davis's firm, Davis Manafort, was paid $15,000 a month from the end of 2005 through last month.

By making such a startling announcement this afternoon, McCain has managed to most certainly change the subject -- for now.

Maybe he's putting "country first." But coming 41 days before the election and on a day of tough news for McCain, forgive me for thinking that there's more than a bit of self-interest here...."

(Capehart, WaPo)


24 Sep 08 - 04:57 PM (#2449225)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: irishenglish

Well its an interesting dilemma, because Obama has said he wants to go on with the debate. I think they should go on with the debate. I think after the debate, they should go back to Washington and work on the Senate's response to the financial crisis as Senators, rather than before hand. One of the two men will be our next leader, and most of us have been chomping at the bit to see them debate. While I don't think this is necessarily some trick up McCain's sleeve to sound statesmen-like and get one on Obama, I think its a little strange to "suspend" your campaign.


24 Sep 08 - 05:32 PM (#2449259)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: GUEST,lox

I think it may be a weak attempt on McCains part to appear "presidential" and "important".

He makes out like he doesn't have time to campaign because he has to go to the white house to deal with the important business of government.

And meanwhile Obama (not so presidential or important) should respect the severity of the situation and wait outside until presidential McCain has a moment to see him.

McCain is just a candidate as is Obama and it is up to either of them to reassure voters that they are the best candidate to save the economy when Bush stands down.

The debate is essential.

McCain is shirking.


24 Sep 08 - 05:39 PM (#2449262)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Little Hawk

They should do both. Have the debate AND join in efforts to solve the financial crisis.


24 Sep 08 - 05:57 PM (#2449273)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity

Told you a million times..they're both full of shit!! Nobody wants to touch it because to make common sense, and/or tell the truth, they'll have to 'sell out' the crooked, corrupt, assholes who are behind them, BOTH!!!!


24 Sep 08 - 06:07 PM (#2449276)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

The first mono DEBATE


24 Sep 08 - 06:14 PM (#2449281)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Alice

On MSNBC, Barney Frank just said they have made progress with the crisis, and if McCain tried to come in to the hearings with his entourage, he would just interrupt the progress that both Democrats and Republicans working together now are making.
They have at this point included some ownership of assets of the financial institutions, not just the debt, which the president did not have in the original plan. They have also included some help for home owners facing foreclosure and stopping the executives of the institutions from unfairly profiting from this.


24 Sep 08 - 06:20 PM (#2449287)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

idea from Don Firth


24 Sep 08 - 06:26 PM (#2449291)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Little Hawk

"Nobody wants to touch it because to make common sense, and/or tell the truth, they'll have to 'sell out' the crooked, corrupt, assholes who are behind them, BOTH!!!!"

That's for sure, GfS. ;-) However, given the fact that Obama and McCain are running for office, I think they should by all rights do the debate...as well as pretend that they are telling the truth about the financial crisis and working together on solving it... (grin)

I mean, heck, you're playing a part in a fantasy drama, well...you should play it properly I think.

Check out Dennis Kucinich for some honest words about the overall situation.


24 Sep 08 - 06:43 PM (#2449292)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Bobert

First of all, John McCain has an ad runnin' where he says that he warned the country of this crisis 5 years ago... Well, if that is the case then where the heck has McCain been since this dire warning??? So the real deal here is yet another Lee Atwater trick and here's how it plays:

1. Obama goes back to Washington and then McCain runs an ad that says "I was right about The Surge and Obama finally got it and now I am right on the economy and he finally got it..."

or...

2. Obama does not go back to WEashington and then the ad goes, "I'm here trying to fix this crisis and all Obama wants to do is campaign..."

There are no other choices...

This is 100% typical Republican bullsh*t on McCain's part but to me it shows desperation...

All mcCain needs is a commercial with him riding up to the Capitol steps on a large white horse, racing up the steps in his armor and thousands of people cheering as he has come to save America...

What a bunch of crap...

If I'm Obama I refuse to cancel the debates and show up and debate an empty chair and balst McCain for usiong the usual Republican trickery and ask the American people if they really want someone who can only do one thing at a time...

B~


24 Sep 08 - 06:45 PM (#2449294)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: artbrooks

So, McCain wants to suspend his campaign and return to Washington so he can "demonstrate leadership" as the Democrat-controlled House and the Republican-controlled Senate try to come to some kind of agreement to either accept Bush's take-it-or-leave-it bailout or come up with something of their own.   And he will not be doing this as a Presidential candidate, huh? Is that bridge in Brooklyn still up on eBay?


24 Sep 08 - 07:25 PM (#2449304)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

John Stewart asked Obama last month "You are so wonderful, how will you break our hearts?"

Now we know.

Obama urges Congress to pass a clean bail out as written.


24 Sep 08 - 07:30 PM (#2449307)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: GUEST,lox

Art,

Yes, let me just pm you my bank details so you can transfer through the £5,000,000 I'm asking for it ...


24 Sep 08 - 07:36 PM (#2449310)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Peace

"Told you a million times..they're both full of shit!!"

Bull. That is FLAGRANT hyperbole. I have admired your posts for ages. I KEPT COUNT. The real number is 987,362. Sheesh!


24 Sep 08 - 07:37 PM (#2449313)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: artbrooks

Lox, there are no stock yards here, but there are some dairy farms not too far away. I'm sure I can come up with 5 million pounds if necessary...


24 Sep 08 - 07:44 PM (#2449315)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Sorcha

Has the man lost (what little is left of) his MIND?

I have a couple feedlots near here too...count me in for a couple million more pounds of the stuff.


24 Sep 08 - 07:53 PM (#2449330)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Little Hawk

Peace - Ha! ;-D Good one.


24 Sep 08 - 10:36 PM (#2449406)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: CarolC

Ole Miss Officials: Debate Cancellation Would Be $5.5 Million Loss

Ironically enough, if John McCain goes through with his threat to skip the foreign policy debate scheduled for this Friday for the sake of prolonging and complicating the ongoing negotiations over the Paulson bailout package, it may end up creating another distressed asset -- the University of Mississippi's investment in Friday's face-off. Officials from Ole Miss told ABC News today that a cancellation would be "devastating" to the University -- and that a postponement might not be possible:

Andrew Mullins, special assistant to University Chancellor Robert Khayat, told ABC News that the Ole Miss campus has been transformed to accommodate the candidates and the press. Road blocks are in place on campus and in the community and the debate television set for the candidates has already been constructed. He said the university has spent roughly five and half million dollars getting ready for the debate.

Mullins also noted that if the Commission on Presidential Debates asks the campus to hold the debate at a later date, he is not sure the university would be able to accommodate them.

"It's huge. You cannot just say that you're not going to do this thing," Mullins said. "I don't have any idea whether we do the debate" at a later date. "[We] probably wouldn't do it."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/24/ole-miss-officials-debate_n_129057.html


24 Sep 08 - 10:42 PM (#2449409)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: CarolC

This is what Obama had to say about the bill (when he said, "clean bill", he was talking about not adding any earmarks to it... he didn't mean pass it as is)...


"I believe that several core principles should guide this legislation.

First, there must be oversight. We should not hand over a blank check to the discretion of one man. We support an independent, bipartisan board to ensure accountability and complete transparency.

Second, we need to protect taxpayers. There should be a path for taxpayers to recover their money, and to turn a profit if Wall Street prospers.

Third, no Wall Street executive should profit from taxpayer dollars. This plan cannot be a welfare program for CEOs whose greed and irresponsibility has contributed to this crisis.

Fourth, we must help families who are struggling to stay in their homes. We cannot bail out Wall Street without helping millions of families facing foreclosure on Main Street.

Fifth, we both agree that this financial rescue package should move on its own without any earmarks or other measures. We have different views about the need for other action, but this must be a clean bill."

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2008/09/24/obama_and_mccain_issue_joint_s.html


24 Sep 08 - 10:54 PM (#2449411)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Amos

Hell, that gets it all said in one neat set of requirements.

Wonder what McCains "set of requirements" would sound like if he were to articulate them?



A


24 Sep 08 - 11:15 PM (#2449421)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: SINSULL

He has missed three days of testimony on the bailout and now he is going in to "save the day"?

Meantime Bush wants to meet with Obama, McCain and Congress for a bi-partisan love fest.

What a crock!


25 Sep 08 - 12:15 AM (#2449432)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Peace

'Wonder what McCains "set of requirements" would sound like if he were to articulate them?'

I suspect it woud be along the lines of, "Give us your money free of all conditions because we CARE."


25 Sep 08 - 12:18 AM (#2449433)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: katlaughing

He's a little kid holding his breath, saying "pass this bail out" or I won't go to the debate! He actually did say they HAVE to pass something or he will NOT go to the debate. Arrogant bastard. He is going with the wind...whichever way he thinks it's going to blow, he'll try to go with it, hoping something will work on his spin into the dirt. His own party's congresspeople won't let him steal their limelight over this; some of them are just as much against the shrub's bail out as the Dems. They are NOT going let McCain take any credit for that!


25 Sep 08 - 12:33 AM (#2449436)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Genie

" While I don't think this is necessarily some trick up McCain's sleeve to sound statesmen-like and get one on Obama, I think its a little strange to "suspend" your campaign."

Forgive me if I sound cynical, but the first thing that popped into my mind when I heard McCain's call for him and McCain to "suspend" their "campaigns" was,
"Yeah, sure. You and your opponent suspend your OFFICIAL campaign appearances and ads for a couple crucial weeks -- while the 90% right-wing-dominated radio talk shows and the TV "pundits" (working for media companies owned by defense corporations, oil corporations, big pharma, etc.) and the unofficial 527s continue their propaganda unabated.
How conveeeeeeenient!


25 Sep 08 - 01:08 AM (#2449442)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Barry Finn

MaCain's call to cancel was a sweet but stupid move. He took a bit of the limelight & got it focused so it would shine on himself but it's shinning on his ass. He's a fool to panic & use his reflex for flight instaed of fight. He's not a good enough debater against Obama & Shara will be squash under Biden's foot. But it looks like a good rescue plan if one doesn't take the time to think about it to much & MaCain like Bush shoots from the hip & thinks later. Obama on the other hand decleared that MaCain isn't running his campain which again puts MaCain up as the fool to ever ask before anticapating Obama's reply. He didn't cover his bases before he shot off his mouth.
The public has been waiting for some debates so the canadates can really expose themselves, their plans, thoughts & policies to the voting nation, we want to see them put forth their best sales pitch, we want to see whose got the right moves, brains, charm, disposition, temperment, vocabulary, whose lying & whose holding back? This is not the time to hide what you don't have, this in not the time to run for cover, this is the time to tell the nation what they have in store for US for the next 4yrs & they need to say in what direction they'll bring the economy in, this well be a huge part of the election. The economy is the topic at hand & they better say something about how they see it's future.
Of course MaCain can stay in Washington where's he been for the past few decades, it is after all where he is most comfortable not on
the Campuses of the nations Universities where he gets nervous around those who are educated & who he has downplayed. He does not like the highly educated as shown from his campain position on thsoe that have attended Harvard. What's he got against brains?

Barry

Barry


25 Sep 08 - 01:51 AM (#2449453)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Big Mick

I want you kids to put on your thinking caps here, and think like the devious little p***ks a lot of you are..... ****chuckle***

Ready? McCain wants to forgo Friday and move the first debate to the 2nd, right? Whose debate is currently scheduled for the 2nd? Yep, it's the Palin and Biden debate. Now I wonder when we will hear that McCain will say that it really isn't necessary to reschedule the VP debate? Just a thought. He knows she will get wiped in her debate and, just maybe, he has a plan to use this as an excuse to put the VP debates to pasture.

Just thinking here,

Mick


25 Sep 08 - 03:02 AM (#2449468)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: akenaton

Can't believe you guys.
You continually complain about messy "Party politics", yet the first time I remember anyone suggesting that they suspending Party squabbling in the face of what could become a National/ International disaster, all you can do is make the cheapest of remarks.

On UK TV this morning, Mr Obama seemed completely out of his depth in trying to summarise the financial situation, whereas Mr McCain was more assured.

I think Mr McCain was correct, this is a serious juncture and neither of the candidates have any meaningful input on how to rectify the damage.

Just carrying on with the same shitty rhetoric gives out the wrong message to the people of America and other countries affected by the financial crimes.


25 Sep 08 - 03:33 AM (#2449476)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Big Al Whittle

like these buggers give a damn about national/international disasters, and there has been no time to address these matters in the last god knows how long....

wise up ake!

Big Mick has divined the situation. the minute Palin gets on that podium, the games up......if she rises above frothing at the mouth and blaming the commie muslim 1960's students for worshipping the devil and taking drugs for the economy - it will be hailed as a major success - but theres little chance of that. Mind you that worked as a tactic for Thatcher ....'the enemy within' and all that crap.

the name of the game is damage limitation. Concealing how far round the bend the VP candidate is.

if they gave a shit about the economy, they wouldn't have initiated two wars they couldn't afford.


25 Sep 08 - 07:00 AM (#2449567)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: GUEST,Spooked by speech

McCain's ghost speech at debate


25 Sep 08 - 07:18 AM (#2449578)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Riginslinger

"Now I wonder when we will hear that McCain will say that it really isn't necessary to reschedule the VP debate? Just a thought. He knows she will get wiped in her debate and, just maybe, he has a plan to use this as an excuse to put the VP debates to pasture.'


                  Not necessarily. Just yesterday Joe Biden announced that--"When we had the stock market crash in 1929, Franklin Roosevelt went on television to assure the people..."

                  He doesn't seem to know, or care, that Hoover was president in 1929 and there was no television.

                  With gaffs like that, who will be wiping up whom?


25 Sep 08 - 09:25 AM (#2449678)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: beardedbruce

Would Bovert and Amos please tell me what Obama

1. Was elected to do?
2. Has been collecting a paychgeck for, from my tax dollars?


If he can't go to Washington as a Senator to do his job, why should he be paid OR promoted???


25 Sep 08 - 09:37 AM (#2449689)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: kendall

A good question, BB. Now how about what has McBush done TO Americans?


25 Sep 08 - 09:39 AM (#2449691)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: beardedbruce

Bush is not running, in case you didn't figure it out.


McCain is NOT Bush, any more than Obama is Clinton.


25 Sep 08 - 10:24 AM (#2449756)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: artbrooks

Since BB saw fit to start a second thread on this topic, and is making the same comments in both, perhaps some good JoeClone could combine them?


25 Sep 08 - 10:28 AM (#2449771)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: beardedbruce

Or kill them both- I started the second in comment over this thread ( name) If McCain is quitting for doing the job he was elected to do, than Obama is a thief for taking money and NOT doing it.


25 Sep 08 - 10:29 AM (#2449772)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: freda underhill

Are these bipolar cyber-diversions multiskilling or a cunning attempt to distract? while there's a debate about the debate, is BB multi-threading? are these multiple concepts a sign that we exist in a parallel dimension? the truth is out there...


25 Sep 08 - 10:31 AM (#2449777)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

John is tired. He is ill. He desperately needs rest. He has to revise his approach to appear that he was never part of the problem and that he is actually the saviour of the crisis. Besides even if his health demands a rest, he can not tell the truth for fear of effect on the Palin campaign and we the people.

But everyone knows from their own life that running away is a bad move.


25 Sep 08 - 11:05 AM (#2449832)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

From: beardedbruce - PM
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 10:28 AM

Or kill them both-




Gee Bruce, I would have to reserve that solution for the banking criminals that ran the show and paid the bribes.

Now for a little lite hearted McCain style humor...
how many spear chuckers could a spear chucker chuck if a spear chucker could chuck spears?


25 Sep 08 - 11:10 AM (#2449842)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: beardedbruce

Care to give context??


I was talking about the threads- Since there was a comment to combine them, and I protest combining them under EITHER present thread name- BOTH are blatent political statements.


25 Sep 08 - 11:16 AM (#2449852)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Amos

AMong other things, he is paid to defends the COnstitution, and has been doing, so far, a better job of it than either Palin, Bush, of McCain.

Obama is not shirking his responsibilities, and it is disingenous and fractious of you to imply that he is. However, he understands that a comeptent executive can handle multiple situations, and denying the importance of these debates on the eve of the election is an act of self-deception he is not willing to subsctribe to. At the same time, he is proposing solid, viable requirements for the debate on the so-called bailout, many of which are now beginning to creep into others' talking points. Furthermore he has contributed mor solid reasoningt to the discussion than McCain has so far.

So don't tell me he isn't pulling his weight. What he ISN'T doing is trying to turn the financial crisis into a political coup by acting it out on the national stage, which McCain is doing because it makes him look bold and important. On reflection, he is neither.

A


25 Sep 08 - 11:19 AM (#2449856)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: beardedbruce

"What he ISN'T doing is trying to turn the financial crisis into a political coup by acting it out on the national stage,"


So, all his comments about being better suited than McCain to solve the Economic problems are non-political???


25 Sep 08 - 11:32 AM (#2449875)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Amos

Those are statements, not dramatizations undertaken to substitute fo a lack of substance.


"McCain's Ploy

By Harold Meyerson
Thursday, September 25, 2008; Page A19

Slipping in the polls? Concerned that Americans may be paying more attention to the declining economy -- and even supporting economic regulation again -- than to your own stellar leadership abilities?

What's a Republican presidential nominee to do?

If you're named John McCain, the answer became apparent yesterday afternoon -- make the solution to the economic crisis all about you. Suspend your campaign. Pull out of tomorrow's debate -- a trivial exercise merely allowing Americans to judge the two candidates side by side. Change the terms of the nation's economic discussion from the course we should take, and the defects of the laissez-faire model that got us here, to the indispensability of John McCain, leader of leaders.

(Besides, if tomorrow's debate goes on as scheduled, it will doubtless focus on the economy as well as foreign affairs, its announced topic. McCain sees foreign policy as one area where he can outshine Obama. Only by rescheduling the debate after the crisis has passed can he be sure he will have his moment in the foreign policy sun.)

Yesterday's Post-ABC News Poll showed Barack Obama opening a nine-point lead over McCain, chiefly because of the economic anxiety flooding the nation and the belief of most Americans that Obama is more in touch with economic realities than McCain is and has a better sense of how to navigate both the current crisis and America's long-term economic challenges. But the McCain plan for victory this November never counted on Americans picking McCain on the basis of the issues.


As his strategists saw it, they had to confine the discussion to a comparison of the character of the two candidates. Alas for McCain, reality intruded over the past week, distracting the public from McCain's stellar attributes as a decisive leader with news of an impending economic collapse. So the task for his managers has been to diminish this new story to just one chapter in the ongoing saga of John McCain, the man who rides to the rescue.

Can McCain pull this off -- persuading the public to forget how he and his fellow Reagan Republicans changed the nation's economic rules in ways that allowed Wall Street to run amok, and refocusing its attention on his decisiveness at this moment of crisis? I doubt it...."
(Wapo columnist)


25 Sep 08 - 11:41 AM (#2449884)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Amos

For one thing, America may be a republic of amnesiacs, but deep in some seldom-used brain lobe, it does recall that its two political parties have differed on questions of regulation and stimulating the economy, a comparison that does not now work in Republicans' favor. For another, presidential debates aren't distractions from the business of the nation. However confining their formats may at times be, they are central to the business of democracy, and suspending that business so that a lowest-common denominator consensus can be reached in Washington -- or so that McCain can complain that Obama is an obstructionist if he doesn't go along with McCain's proposals -- is an affront to American voters.

McCain's ploy was transparent. To counter the public's preference for Obama's economics over his own, he would get both of them in a room and emerge proclaiming that they had reached agreement, that they had no differences. In fact, they have very real differences. McCain wants to retain tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans; Obama wants to create tax cuts for all but the wealthiest 10 percent of Americans. Obama favors policies -- through investments in infrastructure and education and through legislation enabling Americans to join unions without fear of being fired -- to build the base of the economy, while McCain's record is one of opposition to such policies. Obama favors trade agreements only when they raise labor and environmental standards with our trading partners and protect them here at home; McCain has supported every trade pact that has weakened such standards and has never said one word about protecting our standards or raising them abroad.

Comparisons such as these are odious, however, to McCain's prospects.

He cannot win on the strength of his positions. He can only win on the strength of his character. Problem is, McCain's character, as we have seen in his selection of Sarah Palin as his running mate, is heavy on decisiveness and weak on judgment. In this, despite his campaign's protestations, a McCain presidency would be very much an extension of George W. Bush's. The president helped McCain out last night by inviting both candidates to Washington today to put their imprimatur on a deal that seemed near completion. At the risk of making McCain's gesture look less heroic, he also made it look less self-absorbed.

But self is McCain's selling point. He is either the man on horseback riding to the rescue, or he is nothing -- or, more precisely, the loser come November. Obama, Lord knows, has his flaws, but he does not seem to believe that the nation's crises are primarily about him.

(Ibid)


25 Sep 08 - 11:50 AM (#2449899)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: beardedbruce

http://www.mail.com/Article.aspx?articlepath=APNews\financialnewsigtech\20080925\Candidates-Economic-Crisis.xml&cat=money&subcat


25 Sep 08 - 12:00 PM (#2449917)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: GUEST,lox

Art,

I'm sure even you are incapable of drinking so much that you end up producing five million pounds ...


25 Sep 08 - 12:13 PM (#2449931)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Alice

McCain is not a member of the banking committee.
This is such ridiculous grandstanding on his part. Our country has crises constantly - as he says, we are in a war on terrorism and could be hit again any moment, we have troops fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan... this banking issue McCain is now responding to by thrashing around looking for another red herring to throw out to the media.


25 Sep 08 - 12:20 PM (#2449936)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

sorry bb I thought reference was to the candidates.


25 Sep 08 - 12:26 PM (#2449940)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Alice

CNN just reported on the question of which candidate has missed the most roll call votes this year.

McCain leads all senators in missing votes with 412 missed this year.

The last time McCain voted in a roll call vote was in April.
Since he had the nomination wrapped up earlier than Obama, I wonder why he was not back in the Senate more?

Obama has missed 295 roll call votes.


25 Sep 08 - 12:32 PM (#2449942)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: PoppaGator

Did anyone notice CarolC's post back at 24 Sep 08 - 10:36 PM , about how disasterous McCain's frivolous move will be to the State of Mississippi and its flagship university?

The only reason the debate was scheduled in tiny Oxford MS was that the Commission on Presidential Debates decided unilaterally tht New Orleans was incapable of handling such an event three years after Katrina. Never mind that the city has been sucessfully hosting even bigger events since late summer of '06 (e.g., the NBA All Star game last year). Also, never mind that the Oxford area does not have nearly enough hotel rooms for the national political establishement and media who would be expected to attend.

So, while rural Mississippi perhaps should not have been designated to host the debate, they have been scheduled, and have gone to great lengths and great expense ($5.5 million) to cope with a situation for which they would not normally be prepared. I wonder how the predominantly-Republican officeholders of that state feel about their party's nominee now?

If McCain doesn't change his mind back again and allow the debate to proceed as scheduled, something will have to give and ~ as Big Mick has pointed out ~ it is almost sure to be the VP debate. You can bet dollars to doughnuts that Sarah Palin will be continue to be excused from having to face live questioning.


25 Sep 08 - 12:45 PM (#2449954)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Alice

I hope Obama shows up and has a chance to spend the entire time answering the questions that were prepared for the debate... and from McCain's side, we will hear... crickets.


25 Sep 08 - 12:48 PM (#2449959)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Bobert

bb,

You apparently are not keeping up with what is happening here... There are a number of folks who are involved in the negotiations that have been working on this for several days now... They represent the Bush administartion, the Treasury Department, the Federal Reserve and Dem and Repub finance comittee people...

Anyone familiar with negoiating uderstands that you just don't go bringing people in willy-nilly... Like Barney Franks said yesterday in regards to John McCain's freek side-show antics, "He's not part of this part of the process and he isn't needed now" (paraphrased)...

Obama has been at the forefront in comjunicationg the Dems positions and you can take it to the bank (pun intended) the Dem negoitiators are in touch with Obama...

McCain, on the other hand, has been all over the place, saying whatever comes into his mind at the moment and acting like a crazy person... He says he can't be on Letterman because he has to zoom off to ****Save America**** then shows up at another interview... I'm beginning to see why he crashed so many airplanes... He has hit everything but the lottery over the last week...

B~


25 Sep 08 - 12:53 PM (#2449970)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: dick greenhaus

A modest proposal.
How about Obama pulls out of the debate, and we have McCain debating against himself, passionately championing both sides to every question?


25 Sep 08 - 01:03 PM (#2449981)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Marion

Another modest proposal:

Obama could offer to postpone tomorrow's debate with one condition: the VP debate gets moved up to take its place.


25 Sep 08 - 01:14 PM (#2449991)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

McCain appears by proxy


25 Sep 08 - 01:16 PM (#2449993)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: katlaughing

MIck, you're on to something, I think; Olbermann or Maddow opined that last night, or was it Letterman, that they would use this as an excuse to cancel the VP debate.

Obama should do like Clinton when daddy bush didn't show for a debate. He turned the whole thing into a huge Clinton rally!


25 Sep 08 - 01:19 PM (#2449998)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

Yes McCain did propose delaying both the Friday debate AND the Palin Biden debate.


25 Sep 08 - 01:26 PM (#2450006)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Bobert

Yeah, Donuel, but only for 5 weeks...


25 Sep 08 - 01:27 PM (#2450009)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: katlaughing

Yep. From CNN:

    McCain surrogate Sen. Lindsey Graham tells CNN the McCain campaign is proposing to the Presidential Debate Commission and the Obama camp that if there's no bailout deal by Friday, the first presidential debate should take the place of the VP debate, currently scheduled for next Thursday, October 2 in St. Louis.

    In this scenario, the vice presidential debate between Joe Biden and Sarah Palin would be rescheduled for a date yet to be determined, and take place in Oxford, Mississippi, currently slated to be the site of the first presidential faceoff this Friday.


Wonder if she'll want another delay on this, too:

By SHARON THEIMER – 2 hours ago

WASHINGTON (AP) — Sarah Palin requested and received an extension of the deadline for revealing her personal finances, until the day after her only debate with Democrat Joe Biden.

The Republican vice presidential candidate received a four-day extension Thursday from the Federal Election Commission.

The federal financial disclosure report was initially due next Monday. Now, Palin has until Oct. 3, the day after her debate in St. Louis with Biden, the Democratic vice presidential nominee.


25 Sep 08 - 02:02 PM (#2450053)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Alice

oooops

While McCain was wending his way back to Washington, the committee has wrapped up the first agreement of principles and are sending it to the president now. Guess McCain has no excuse to skip the debate after all!!!!


25 Sep 08 - 02:05 PM (#2450054)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Alice

Republican presidential nominee John McCain has not introduced any banking or housing bills in the 110th Congress, while Democratic rival Barack Obama has proposed five.

Guess that shows who really has been working on the economy while campaigning at the same time.


25 Sep 08 - 02:10 PM (#2450059)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Alice

"This notion that somehow John McCain is going to ride to the rescue is a notion in his own mind, not in reality," Dick Durbin said. "Bringing a presidential political campaign to the halls of the Capitol is not going to make this any easier."


25 Sep 08 - 02:13 PM (#2450062)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: artbrooks

And Bush, McCain and Obama are supposed to meet at 4 DC time, possibly to discuss the proposal - or possibly to grandstand some more.


25 Sep 08 - 02:43 PM (#2450092)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: CamiSu

I must say I fail to see how anything McCain says has any weight since, not too long ago at 9a.m. he said that the "economic foundation is strong", and at 11a.m. THE SAME DAY he is hollering "CRISIS!!!" He obviously had to have someone tap him on the shoulder and point out the 800 lb. gorilla in the room.

I think he is afraid to have either himself or Ms. Palin debate their counterparts.

CamiSu


25 Sep 08 - 02:55 PM (#2450103)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

That Palin promotes the appearence of covering up regarding personal finances and refusal to appear at the Legislative troopergate hearing is a bona fide issue. It goes to character and the ability to respond to rules.


25 Sep 08 - 02:58 PM (#2450108)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Alice

Palin does not have time to deal with troopergate - she has to cram for that uh, no, wait, maybe debate?


25 Sep 08 - 09:16 PM (#2450457)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: GUEST,Sawzaw

Obama refuses to return to Washington for the most important issue of the century. His election is more important than his job in the Senate. Then after hearing the reaction, he flip flops like a typical populist.

McCain is steady on as a leader instead of a populist campaigner. His job is more important than the election.

Obama blinks and now they are tied in the polls.

McCain has stunning comeback in Thursday's Gallup Poll

By Yael T. Abouhalkah, Kansas City Star Editorial Page columnist

After John McCain's bold decision to suspend his campaign, he has stunningly erased a three-point lead and now is tied with Barack Obama at 46-46 in Thursday's Gallup Poll.


And just when did Mac say he was not going to be at the debate?

His asked Obama to postpone it. How does that conflate into "won't go"


25 Sep 08 - 09:23 PM (#2450461)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Alice

McCain has not even gone back to the Senate to vote SINCE APRIL.
What an idiotic idea that they needed McCain there today to suddenly be 'involved'. He's grandstanding, total politics, totally NOT leadership.


25 Sep 08 - 09:32 PM (#2450469)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Riginslinger

They needed McCain to save the economy. Obama went there to serve as backup.


25 Sep 08 - 09:58 PM (#2450487)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Ron Davies

"save the economy"--

More 100% drivel, from our most reliable source.

Sorry, even the Republican party's mouthpiece, the WSJ editorial page, thinks your observation is pure tripe.

The WSJ editorial page, no fan of Obama, even pointed out that Obama was totally right on this one--a president should indeed be able to handle more than one thing at a time.



By the way, Mr. Fundamentalist, please tell us if you think Palin's witch-hunting Kenyan friend is a good influence on her.


25 Sep 08 - 10:58 PM (#2450518)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Riginslinger

"By the way, Mr. Fundamentalist, please tell us if you think Palin's witch-hunting Kenyan friend is a good influence on her."


                      Basically, I think witch doctors are witch doctors. I think the son of a Kenyan would prove to be a bad influence on America.


25 Sep 08 - 11:03 PM (#2450521)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Amos

Actual poll reports, per RCP:

RCP Average        09/18 - 09/24        --        47.8        44.5        Obama +3.3
CBS News/NY Times        09/21 - 09/24        LV        48        43        Obama +5
Gallup Tracking        09/22 - 09/24        2731 RV        46        46        Tie
Rasmussen Tracking        09/22 - 09/24        3000 LV        49        46        Obama +3
Hotline/FD Tracking        09/22 - 09/24        912 RV        47        43        Obama +4
Battleground Tracking        09/18 - 09/24        1000 LV        47        48        McCain +1
FOX News        09/22 - 09/23        900 RV        45        39        Obama +6
NBC News/Wall St. Jrnl        09/19 - 09/22        1085 RV        48        46        Obama +2
ABC News/Wash Post        09/19 - 09/22        780 LV        52        43        Obama +9
LA Times/Bloomberg        09/19 - 09/22        838 LV        49        45        Obama +4
Ipsos-McClatchy        09/18 - 09/22        923 RV        44        43        Obama +1
CNN/Opinion Research        09/19 - 09/21        697 LV        51        47        Obama +4


25 Sep 08 - 11:35 PM (#2450544)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: The Fooles Troupe

Amos, have you heard the new Repubs campaign song?

Based on that great old hymn...

When The Polls Are Arsed Up Yonder, I'll be there...


26 Sep 08 - 12:03 AM (#2450552)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: The Fooles Troupe

The debate has just been advertised on ABC National TV here in Oz as still on at 11am tomorrow morning our time... well, the audience and the cameras will be there, by the look of it...

:-)


26 Sep 08 - 12:38 AM (#2450561)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Amos

The Photo John McCain Wanted

John McCain's sudden intervention in Washington's deliberations over the Wall Street bailout could not have been more out of sync with what was actually happening.

He lamented that "partisan divisions in Washington have prevented us from addressing our national challenges." But for days, bipartisanship has been the rule on both sides of this argument. Republicans and Democrats alike were highly critical of President Bush's proposal to inject $700 billion into the financial system. Yet leaders of both parties were trying hard to negotiate an agreement with Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson. That's why they were close to an agreement in principle even before the two presidential nominees arrived for yesterday's White House meeting that McCain thought was so important.

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Minority Leader John Boehner normally fight about everything. But on Wednesday they issued a joint statement noting that "working in a bipartisan manner, we have made progress." That was true at least until yesterday's meeting, when Boehner, facing conservative defections, roiled the talks by offering an entirely new proposal.



And if McCain had been following the negotiations closely, he would have known that at times this week, Senate Democrats worried that Rep. Barney Frank (D-Mass.), chairman of the House Financial Services Committee, was too eager for a deal.

Frank did not need McCain to make him bipartisan, and he grumbled befor yesterday's White House gathering that it was a mere "photo op." After the meeting, Senate Banking Committee Chairman Chris Dodd (D-Conn.) called it "political theater" that may have stalled an agreement.

Bush himself was uncharacteristically forthcoming with concessions. In his address to the nation, he said he wanted to "ensure that taxpayers are protected." That meant he had acceded to Democratic demands that the government get shares in the firms it rescues. He endorsed oversight mechanisms his administration's proposal had lacked. He accepted an idea his negotiators had resisted fiercely: limiting what the financial titans who got us into this mess could pocket from this rescue.

If you doubt that McCain's moves were about rescuing his candidacy rather than our economy, consider how his proposal to suspend the presidential campaign came about.

McCain had just finished a phone call with Obama on Wednesday in which they discussed a joint statement of principles and McCain broached the idea of suspending the campaign. Obama said he'd think about it, but McCain didn't give him time. To Obama's surprise, McCain appeared on television shortly after the conversation to announce his unilateral pause in campaigning and a call for postponing Friday's debate. This is bipartisanship?

As for getting the nominees to yesterday's White House meeting, Bush's lieutenants had been in discussions with McCain's people during the day Wednesday. Obama didn't get his invitation from the president until around 7:30 p.m., just an hour and a half before Bush's speech. This was an active intervention by Bush on behalf of McCain to box Obama into the photo op. Again, was this bipartisan?

The simple truth is that Washington is petrified about this crisis and will pass something. There are dark fears floating through the city that foreign investors, particularly the Chinese, might begin to pull their billions out of our system.

Scarier than the bad mortgages are those unregulated credit default swaps that financier George Soros has been warning about. There are $45 trillion of those esoteric instruments sloshing around the global financial system. They were invented as a hedge against debt defaults, but even the financial smart guys don't fully understand their impact or how to price their real value.

Fear is a terrible motivator for careful legislating, but it's a heck of a way to bring about a lot of bipartisanship. McCain jumped into this game in the fourth quarter. Many of the players on the field, caked in mud and exhausted but determined as they approach the goal line, wonder why this new would-be quarterback has suddenly appeared in their midst.

McCain could yet play a constructive role by rounding up votes from restive Republicans. Oddly, the biggest obstacle to a bill may not be Democrats but Republicans who refuse to go along with their own president. And -- yes, there is an election coming -- Democrats will be wary of going forward unless a substantial number of Republicans join them.

But McCain's boisterous intervention -- and particularly his grandstanding on the debate -- was less a presidential act than the tactical ploy of a man worried that his chances of becoming president might be slipping away.


Washington Post


26 Sep 08 - 12:54 AM (#2450564)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Goose Gander

Perhaps McCain does not want to be reminded in front of a national audience that only days ago he said the 'fundmentals' of the US economy are strong.


26 Sep 08 - 01:37 AM (#2450570)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Teribus

Well wonders will never cease:

akenaton's post of 25 Sep 08 - 03:02 AM.

I agree with every word.

McCain's actions and perspective reflect his "America First" or "Country First" stance. Wake up folks you have a problem, a problem that requires rapid response. Both prospective candidates for President of the United States of America are US Senators. The rescue or bail out package proposed by the current administration has been criticised by committee, who realise that something has to be done, therefore it would appear that some form of compromise must be reached. McCain and Obama have to be part of the process considering where either one may be in about 100 days time.

To debate the issue as a sidebar to the main discussions/negotiations would be an idiotic and pointless and possibly destructive distraction - McCain can see that, why can't Obama? "A president should be able to do more than one thing at a time" said Barack Obama - I would like to point out to the Junior Senator for the State of Illinios that a President also has to recognise what is and what is not important and get his priorities right.


26 Sep 08 - 01:52 AM (#2450572)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: akenaton

I'M AWAY TO SEE A SHRINK!!....Its too scary


26 Sep 08 - 01:58 AM (#2450575)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Peace

Over half the country put that sonuvabitch in power--TWICE.

I have little sympathy for those who voted Bush in. I do have a great deal of sympathy for those who didn't.


26 Sep 08 - 03:59 AM (#2450609)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Big Al Whittle

Teribus.... crisis, what crisis? I thought, according to you all these right wing policies have been a howling success - and we need more of them over here.


26 Sep 08 - 07:47 AM (#2450711)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Riginslinger

"'McCain's actions and perspective reflect his "America First" or "Country First" stance.'"

          This morning, his numbers are soaring in the polls!


26 Sep 08 - 08:00 AM (#2450721)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Bobert

Apparently, t-Bird, has no idea od what really has been transpiring this week...

The deal was well on the way until crybaby McCain unloadeed yet another volley of insane subterfuge on the American people and highly politiciezed that bi-partisan work that has been going on all week on the legislation...

Representatives from both sides of the isles have been critical of the White House meeting yesterday and have said it was a setback... And it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that the only reason for the meeting was becauswe crybaby McCain had threatened to not show for the debates if the deal wasn't done...

That, T, is the real story here... I don't know where you are getting your mythology but it sounds like Fox...

B~


26 Sep 08 - 08:02 AM (#2450722)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: GUEST,Sawzaw

If it was necessary for McCain to return to Washington, why did Obama have to follow him?

If Mac was being foolish, so was Obama.

If Obama was not being foolish then neither was Mac.

Follow the leader.


26 Sep 08 - 08:12 AM (#2450729)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Bobert

Wrong again, Sawz...

Obama didn't "follow" McCain... Obama was invited by Bush and when one is invited to the White House when they are running for president one accepts the invitation...

BTW, I find some of the comments about folks who were in the meeting to be quite revealing... Folks say the Obama was fully engaged and talked alot about deatils and McCain hardly opened his mouth...

Hmmmmmmmm???

Cat got yer tongue, John???

I thought it was supposed to by McCain on the white horse riding into Washington to ***Save America*** but when he got there he didn't seem to even be able to keep up with the discussion...

Some savior...

B~


26 Sep 08 - 08:17 AM (#2450735)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Ron Davies

A measure of how helpful McCain has been to the talks:


WSJ 26 Sept 2008:

"At a Senate Republican meeting, some Republicans, including Utah's Robert Bennett, who had been a vocal supporter of the earlier tentative agreement, appeared unhappy. ' They weren't too happy with McCain', said one aide to Senator McCain, adding that there was some 'grousing' that the candidate wasn't fully embracing the emerging compromise".

"Asked late Thursday if having the presidential candidates at the table distracted from the process, Sen. Bennett said: 'I'm not going to comment on that' ."

Preceding is all direct quotes from the WSJ.

Following is my own comment:

There is now civil war within the Republican party.


26 Sep 08 - 08:32 AM (#2450747)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Big Al Whittle

I really can't imagine why Americans are considering re-electing the same idiots that got them into this mess.

Don't the right wing take any responsibility for all their foolish actions?

It seems to me America has this anti-intellectual thing going.

You see it on thosse crime channels - again and again juries reject evidence from expert witnesses because they want to convict some poor sod. I heard one of them say, they talk to us like we're idiots...

And you can't help feeling maybe the experts have got a point.

I really don't think someone with bits missing up top like Rewagan, Bush, or this Palin woman would ever get elected in England. Thatcher was bonkers, but there was no doubting her intellectual and debating prowess. her adroitness in tight corners sometimes left you reeling.

American politics is too well rehearsed and orchestrated. their stupidity is too well hidden. But when I listen - don't you get the feeling that sometimes these tailors dummies don't really understand the words they are saying. Its all been written for them.


26 Sep 08 - 08:44 AM (#2450757)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Riginslinger

Unfortunately, wld, that's the way it is with the candidates in both major parties. There are exceptions--I would say Barnie Frank is an exception--but not many.
                  The people who could really do something positive for the country, like Ron Paul, Dennis Kucinich, and Ralph Nader, can't get past the first rung of the ladder.
                  There are very powerful special interests who want to keep things this way.


26 Sep 08 - 09:01 AM (#2450768)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

They asked the Republican chairman of the banking commitee how many times McCain has called him about the crisis or the hearings or the progress that the committee has made toward a deal...


He answered...



not once.


26 Sep 08 - 10:36 AM (#2450846)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Teribus

How many times did Obama call him Donuel?

Does either McCain or Obama sit on that Committee?

As Chairman of a Committee that is currently siting in order to solve a problem, that as yet does not have a solution. If anyone who is not part of that committee or not part of the current administration calls to ask me for information they would quite rightly get absolutely nothing from me. The flow of information on the committee's deliberations would be inter-committee agreed course of action - then to agreement on the proposed course of action with the current administration - then to agreed joint public statement outling the course of action to be adopted.

I am sure Donuel, that John McCain has been around Washington long enough to realise all that.


26 Sep 08 - 11:49 AM (#2450907)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Riginslinger

And why would you call him in the first place, if he knew what was going on we wouldn't be in this mess.


26 Sep 08 - 12:16 PM (#2450933)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

Obama has been in contact with Henry Paulson on a daily basis.
http://usera.imagecave.com/donuel/bail.jpg


26 Sep 08 - 12:26 PM (#2450939)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: dick greenhaus

I find it interesting that, by Tuesday at least (24 hours after he had supported the deal) McCain couldn;t find time to read the 3-page proposal. Maybe his lips were too tired.


26 Sep 08 - 01:06 PM (#2450972)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: PoppaGator

It's noon the day of the scheduled debate, and as far as I know at this point, something is going to transpire at, and be broadcast from, Oxford, Mississippi. We just don't yet know exactly what.

I believe we can be fairly sure of only one thing: that Mr Obama will be in attendance, and will be ready to deal with whatever circumstances occur, because (unlike others who shall remain nameless) the man is able to think on his feet.


26 Sep 08 - 01:26 PM (#2450988)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: GUEST,az_skye

I believe that McCain has ADD-HD (yes, in Hi Def even lol) and the beginnings of Alzheimers disease. It would explain a lot of his recent actions. Have lived with 3 family members who have this, and just gets worse with age, stress, lack of sleep and caffinated drinks.

It's time for Mommy McCain to put him back in his room.


26 Sep 08 - 01:54 PM (#2451014)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Barry Finn

MaCain announced he will be at the debate. He couldn't find an excuse to avoid it. He tried for himself, he tried for the sake of Palin postpoment, now he's just the ass in the outhouse & she's looking real flush. He wasn't useful to the "crsis", he's split his parties direction, caused a ruckus in the middle of the planning stages & seeing as he did nothing & made matters worst he'll have to drag his tail to Mississippi & face the folks down there who have contempt for him for the threat of leaving there University out to dry.
Again it looks as if MaCain flies off in a rush & bust flurry stirring up a hornets nest
On the other hand Obama has stayed on track, kept himself informed, did not cause a stir in order to place his campain in the forefront & is the one who thinks before he acts. It's great t know there's someone, finally, who's not shooting from the hip.
MaCain proved to be a political ass.
We'll see how he faits in the debate. My thoughts about tonight, the focus aside from forging(pun)policy followed by the precent economy "crsis" there'll be questions about his posturing about saving the nation for the sake of the nation first. I'd say there'll be some looking at Shara too & not in a postive veiw.

Barry

Barry


26 Sep 08 - 01:54 PM (#2451015)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Amos

Well, he decided he had generated enough confusion for the day and agreed to come to the debate after all, in his brightly colored plane.


A


26 Sep 08 - 02:52 PM (#2451066)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Ebbie

I'll go on record here as I have been saying in my Alaskan hometown: I believe that Palin will be dropped before the election. As a nominee she is a disaster and is not likely to get better.

Just today more has come out about the gifts she has accepted since becoming governor.

My prediction is that in one of two scenarios, she will be out.

One: She tearfully acknowledges that she just has too much on her plate and realizes that her family at this point has to come first. McCain will express his regret but say he has no choice but to accept her decision's validity. He will therefore nominate either Tom Ridge or Joe Lieberman to be his running mate, "either of whom will be ready to fulfill the role from Day One".

Or

Two: McCain will announce that Sarah Palin agrees with him that she does not meet the needs he will have in the rough years he will have as President of the United States, and that therefore he is instating Joe Lieberman or Tom Ridge as his running mate. (As he had wished to do from the start but that Karl Rove wouldn't allow it.)


26 Sep 08 - 02:58 PM (#2451073)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: GUEST,Sawzaw

"Wrong again, Sawz...

Obama didn't "follow" McCain... Obama was invited by Bush and when one is invited to the White House when they are running for president one accepts the invitation.."

La Times Sep 24, 2008:

Obama, McCain invited to White House


26 Sep 08 - 03:12 PM (#2451080)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Big Mick

The day after McCain chose Palin, I posted THIS, and predicted that she will flame out. The word out there right now is that in the practice debates and news conferences she is a disaster and the McCain team doesn't know what to do. Her performance with Couric and Gibson demonstrates perfectly that she is not qualified, and that McCain chose political expediency (which is blowing up in his face) over his vaunted honor and love of country.

Mick


26 Sep 08 - 03:58 PM (#2451100)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

Mick, Good guess. I think she will stay to the bitter end/start

As far as this thread goes, McCain made me a liar. He is going to debate.

Probably the greatest debate of all time with McCain swooning from exhaustion and anger. If he is as run down as he looks, tonight he may collapse before a National Audience. His famous last words will be 'Country First' while witness' testify he actually said 'send sarah hhh...". Whether that was send her home or send her on could not be determined.


26 Sep 08 - 04:00 PM (#2451103)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Amos

McCain's flailing panic


        

                

(updated below)



"There are few things more boring than following the twists and turns of the Campaign Scandal du jour, but this is pretty unstable behavior:

Fox News on Wednesday:

John McCain will suspend his presidential campaign Thursday and has asked to postpone his debate Friday with Barack Obama so the two senators can return to Washington to help negotiate a Wall Street bailout, an approach that Obama promptly rejected.



McCain will participate in Friday night's debate if a bill is passed by Friday morning, his adviser Mark Salter said.



Associated Press yesterday:
His campaign has said he wouldn't participate unless there was consensus between Congress and the administration, and a spokesman said the afternoon developments had not changed his plans. . . .



"There's no deal until there's a deal. We're optimistic but we want to get this thing done," McCain spokesman Brian Rogers said.



The New York Times today:
Talks Implode During a Day of Chaos; Fate of Bailout Plan Remains Unresolved



Separately, Representative Barney Frank, Democrat of Massachusetts, and the chairman of the House Financial Services Committee, said on Friday that an agreement depended on House Republicans' ending their opposition and "dropping this revolt" against the plan proposed by the Bush administration, The Associated Press reported. He described the rival plan being proposed by Republicans as "an ambush."



Meanwhile, Senator Richard C. Shelby of Alabama, the senior Republican on the banking committee and a critic of the current plan, said the plan had to change before it would win support of Republicans.



In an interview on CNBC, quoted by Reuters, Mr. Shelby said, "This is not going to work."



The Politico, an hour ago:
McCain will go to debate



Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) ended three days of suspense on Friday morning and announced that he will leave bailout negotiations in Washington and fly to Oxford, Miss., for tonight's opening presidential debate.



McCain had previously said that he would suspend his campaign -- and so would not attend the debate -- until an agreement was reached on the administration's $700 billion mortgage proposal. No such agreement has been reached, but Republicans said the standoff was hurting McCain's campaign and that he would look terrible if he didn't attend the nationally televised, eagerly anticipated debate, while Sen. Barack Obama (D-Ill.) was ready to go on stage.

In less than 48 hours, McCain went from "I'm far too patriotic to debate unless there is a deal that is done -- there's no deal until there's a deal" to "I'm going to debate even though there's no deal." Is there any way to describe that other than, as Spencer Ackerman put it, a "humiliating failure"? The New York Times's Patrick Healy today inanely ponders whether "In a Time of Crisis, Is Obama Too Cool?" (Didn't Rudy Giuliani become the Greatest Man Ever in History because of his post-9/11 coolness?) But surely excessive stoicism is vastly preferable to the sort of unstable, flailing panic that McCain has exhibited this week, where he issues a definitive, emphatic pledge which, less than 2 days later, is completely abandoned with little real explanation.

UPDATE: On Wednesday, Joan Walsh said McCain's debate announcement was a "crazy stunt" and "he will regret it." I doubt she knew how right she was. In addition to the above, National Review's Rich Lowry adds yet another reason why this is so:
A Hostile Audience



One side effect of McCain's debate gambit is, I'm told, that everyone at Ole Miss now hates him. It will make for a very hostile audience tonight among those students and faculty attending. He might have to apologize for creating the uncertainty or make some explanation up front, which is never ideal.

It's understandable that McCain is trying to run an unconventional campaign -- it's the only way he has any chance to win, and it's why I thought and still think his Palin choice was shrewd, even if it ultimately doesn't work out -- but this "I'm-not-debating-yes-I-am" maneuver was just a total debacle on every level, and -- like Palin -- McCain is becoming an almost pitiable figure.

"

        


26 Sep 08 - 04:29 PM (#2451117)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Big Mick

Donuel, .... it wasn't a guess. This is my bailiwick. The first time I heard her speak I knew she would have trouble. Having run campaigns at the highest level, I knew what savvy interviewers would do, and they did it. They can smell out someone who is over their head in a flash.

Mick


26 Sep 08 - 04:36 PM (#2451124)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Charley Noble

McCain has at least won the battle of "expectations." No one now expects him to do better than Obama. So if he just paws the ground and snarls a little he'll generate exciting headlines.

Charley Noble


26 Sep 08 - 04:46 PM (#2451137)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Bobert

Ahhhhhh, Sawz... Since when was John McCain elected president... He can't possibly invite anyone to the White House without being president so...

...guess again, Part 2...

Ohters,

Well, what was John Boy gonna do... Give Obama a feee stage at Ol' Miss with a national TV audience??? This little chess move on McCain's part backfired... That's the problem when you run a campaign based on complete suberfuge and no substance...

BTW, Amos,

Did you see the pic in the this morning's Post... There was Obama looking l;ike he was very much into the discussion and McCain down at the end of the table lookin' like a kid in class waiting for the bell to ring... Purdy funny...

B~


26 Sep 08 - 05:01 PM (#2451153)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Riginslinger

"I... predicted that she [Palin] will flame out.


                      She hasn't, of course. She's running stonger than ever.


26 Sep 08 - 05:02 PM (#2451155)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Big Mick

hold on to your dreams.


26 Sep 08 - 05:12 PM (#2451166)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: artbrooks

Lessee - tonight's debate is back on. That means next Thursday's VP debate won't be preempted. Oh dear - watch that or try to find Fortunato's pre-Getaway song circle? The latter should be fun, and the former funny. Decisions, decisions, decisions....


26 Sep 08 - 05:20 PM (#2451181)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

Mick, the word guess is flip.

I too take great stock in my predictions. The last one that totally tanked was this summer when I forsaw a Bush family tragedy. Bupkis

So its a show down. WIll she stay or will she go
you say go
I say stay


26 Sep 08 - 05:24 PM (#2451191)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Big Mick

No, I didn't say she would go, buddy. My use of the term "go down in flames" was merely rhetoric for her becoming a millstone around the neck of McCain, and contributing mightily to his defeat. Their campaign is showing all the signs of cracks in the foundation. The only thing that could save McPalin, IMO, is for a miserable showing in the debates by O'bama (my irish showing there.... ***chuckle***) and Biden, coupled with some October surprise of an amazing magnitude. Don't count the latter out, btw, given that the Cheney operatives can see the same signs. Winning is all for them, no matter who is hurt.

Scary times, eh?

All the best,

Mick


26 Sep 08 - 05:42 PM (#2451203)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

Ass President she certainly could save us all from the ravages of a long and cruel depression by goin nooculer and reducing us all to 30 brillion tons of well done steak.


26 Sep 08 - 06:28 PM (#2451233)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Alice

Well, why even have the debate.... this morning, the McCain campaign already has announced that McCain won!!?!

Why let the truth interfere with their "reality"?

ad states that McCain wins... before the debate


26 Sep 08 - 06:49 PM (#2451245)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Riginslinger

Well, it's a forgone conclusion, isn't it?


26 Sep 08 - 07:31 PM (#2451271)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: GUEST,Sawzaw

Amos taking the side of Achmadinejad and Mugabe is the one with arms flailing.


26 Sep 08 - 08:22 PM (#2451298)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Amos

Sawz:

Your alteration of fact is verging on the defamatory, and if you are not careful I shall start going to the trouble of revealing your asininities for what they are.


A


26 Sep 08 - 08:37 PM (#2451307)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Donuel

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/thefix/2008/09/mccain_wins_debate.html?nav=rss_blog

politoon


27 Sep 08 - 01:07 AM (#2451380)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: DougR

Arghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! There was not debate tonight? I watched it, and thought there was! And I could have probably watched a scintillating episode of My favorite folk music Whistler instead. What a disappointment.
DougR


27 Sep 08 - 03:30 AM (#2451401)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Backwoodsman

The opinion of BBC 'Breakfast' (UK TV programme) commentators this morning seems to be that McCain won.


27 Sep 08 - 02:04 PM (#2451695)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: Riginslinger

The problem being, in order for McCain to really win, he had to win big. Like Obama's pants would have had to have fallen down or something.
                  The next debate will be on domestic affairs. McCain has never been domesticated.


27 Sep 08 - 04:36 PM (#2451757)
Subject: RE: BS: McCain quits, Won't go to debate
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity

From: DougR
Date: 27 Sep 08 - 01:07 AM

Arghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! There was not debate tonight? I watched it, and thought there was! And I could have probably watched a scintillating episode of My favorite folk music Whistler instead. What a disappointment.
DougR

Not much was said of any importance...at least what the SHOULD talk about. This was crappy nonsense. political street theater!