Songs that take obesity seriously

27 Mar 10 - 09:00 PM (#2873620)
Subject: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Jack Campin

I live in Midlothian (just south of Edinburgh), a region which has seen a horrifying obesity epidemic in the last decade or so. It's now comparable with the worst-affected areas of the US. Just about every bus trip I see somebody (usually a working class woman around 30) who can't get anywhere close to fitting in one seat, looks desperately miserable about it and is often taking it out on her children (who are usually heading the same way).

The causes are stark staring obvious - see books like "Fat Land" for the details. It's nothing to do with genetics (genetically we're matchstick-thin coalminers who've worked in two-foot seams for centuries). There are businesses making billions out of reducing people to that subhuman condition, and dragging the media and institutions of the state along with them to create a world where nobody can see an alternative to bloating themselves into a lifetime of misery and an early death and where for many people there simply *isn't* an alternative any more.

Somebody *must* have politicized this in a song by now, surely?

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27 Mar 10 - 09:11 PM (#2873626)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: dick greenhaus

Well, there's the Too-Fat Polka, for one
And the prison song Heavy-Hipted Woman
and Leadbelly sang of "a big fat woman with the meat shakin' on her bones"

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28 Mar 10 - 09:12 AM (#2873854)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Dave MacKenzie

Back in the 60's, Edinburgh University Folk Song Society used to be treated on a regular basis to "I won't miss you, babe, I couldn't, you're too fat".

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28 Mar 10 - 10:25 AM (#2873869)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: GUEST,CS

Yeah, since we imported US media bred ideals of artificially thin bodies being the universal 'norm', alongside the increase of fast food and people forgetting how to peel & boil spuds, there has been an extreme splitting in our collective perceptions, expectations and behaviours around food and the (mainly female) body. I haven't read the books, but I've seen enough (or rather little enough) front page pictures of 'posh spice' (so-called) & co' to see there is some relentless hard-core brainwashing going on. And altho' I never read such rags, I wouldn't be surprised to see adverts for the latest brilliant new diet therein.

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28 Mar 10 - 01:11 PM (#2873979)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Anne Lister

I'm not sure there have been songs that take anorexia seriously either - or starvation, or beer bellies. I'm not sure I would want to write one, myself.

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28 Mar 10 - 02:41 PM (#2874031)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Acorn4

There used to be a singer called Tessie O Shea who did a song "Nobody Loves a Fat Girl, but Oh how a Fat Girl Can Love!"

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28 Mar 10 - 04:47 PM (#2874125)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: melodeonboy

"You're Much Too Fat And That's That" (Louis Jordan)

"Big Fats" (Canned Heat)

(Although I'm not sure either of them are taking the subject seriously!) :)

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28 Mar 10 - 06:03 PM (#2874190)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: CET

So the answer, so far, seems to be "No, there are no songs that take obesity seriously." Pity, because it's a deadly serious problem, as Jack rightly points out.

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28 Mar 10 - 06:15 PM (#2874204)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Joe_F

Too Fat Polka

Or, on the other side, "Fat Girls" (in the DigiTrad).

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28 Mar 10 - 06:20 PM (#2874210)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Gervase

I'd guess that obesity probably wasn't much of a problem for the average working person in earlier generations, hence the lack of songs taking it seriously. And modern snigger snogwriters would probably fight shy of a hard-hitting song on the subject for fear of alienating half their audience.

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28 Mar 10 - 06:31 PM (#2874219)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Jack Campin

You can't expect to find a very old song about it, because the present-day epidemic is a modern phenomenon with modern causes.

US Center for Disease Control animation

Enable Javascript and click "play" on the map.

It's the sort of issue Alistair Hulett might have taken on.

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28 Mar 10 - 09:00 PM (#2874292)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: katlaughing

..US media bred ideals of artificially thin bodies...

Oh? Twiggy was imported to the UK from the US?!?. News to me.

I suspect Gervase has it right...plus obese people are one of the last segments of society about which it is still acceptable to make fun.

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28 Mar 10 - 09:10 PM (#2874294)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Gibb Sahib

You might find something in the Punk/Hardcore genre.

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29 Mar 10 - 07:20 AM (#2874547)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Valmai Goodyear

Mick Ryan has written an excellent song, The Land of Cockayne, about being surrounded by more food than we can eat; he contrasts our ancestors' dream that it would be heaven with the reality of today. He doesn't mention obesity but he does mention the horrors of excessive choice. The song is on his CD with Paul Downes 'Grand Conversation'.

Valmai (Lewes)

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29 Mar 10 - 07:31 AM (#2874557)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Amergin

John Prine's song Donald and Lydia....

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29 Mar 10 - 08:17 AM (#2874583)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Acorn4

It's a difficult one. It depends on whether obese people are seen as victims or whether they are seen as responsible for their own weight gain. A combination of both perhaps? For this reason it's a tricky one when it comes to songwriting.

To a certain extent, though not in all cases, it seems to be a social class issue.

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29 Mar 10 - 08:44 AM (#2874600)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Morris-ey

"The causes are stark staring obvious..." yes some people eat too much and don't exercise. Nobody force feeds anybody. Perhaps if your fat "working class woman around 30" walked rather than squeeze on a bus she would not be so fat? I wonder if she sees it as a problem? Perhaps she is happy and would resent your condescending attitude?

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29 Mar 10 - 09:56 AM (#2874645)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: melodeonboy

"Skin and bone" by the Kinks is about dieting to lose weight; but there again, I don't think it was done with particularly serious intent!

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29 Mar 10 - 12:20 PM (#2874745)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Jack the Sailor

I don't think its an appropriate subject for a song.
Protest songs are usually railing "against the man" or at least against society's attitudes. Motivating an individual is a much more difficult task.

As an obese person who has often been preached to, I don't see the purpose of putting such usually self serving, smug sentiments in a song.

What are you going to say to the person?

Fatty's song

I saw you on the bus the other day,
About 30, shoulder length brown hair
You might have been attractive if you hadn't been so fat.
I just can't tolerate that

And what a foul mood you were in,
taking out your misery on your children
No doubt headed the same way
Seeing you on that bus inspired me,
to look for a song to save you.
Now, for your enlightenment,
Here is what I have to say.

(chorus)
Shame on you, you lard bucket
Put down that fried chicken
Shame on you you fat slob
Shame on you for hating your children
Don't put cream and sugar in your tea
Show some willpower
Show some selfrespect
and you can be like me.

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29 Mar 10 - 12:24 PM (#2874749)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Jack the Sailor

this show is taking the problem seriously.

But I don't see how it can be condensed to a song.

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29 Mar 10 - 12:27 PM (#2874752)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Anne Lister

My problem with this whole subject is that we don't tend to write songs about people's size and shape normally, so why would we write about obesity? Nor do people tend to write songs about other medical conditions. Yes, we write about drinking and smoking too much, I suppose, and use of drugs, but not food.

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29 Mar 10 - 12:42 PM (#2874768)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: GUEST,erbert

on a similar vein..

does anyone want to stand forward
and write a protest song about social discrimination
against men with tiny todgers ?

anyone..????

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29 Mar 10 - 12:53 PM (#2874777)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Jack Campin

That's why I mentioned Alistair Hulett - "He Fades Away" is the sort of thing I had in mind (a man dying from asbestos-induced cancer). For most working-class people, an obesity-inducing lifestyle is no more a matter of free choice than taking a hazardous job is when you live in a company town.

It's about fighting back against a collusion of authorities, from food biz managers to media executives to the planners of urban transport systems, who want to kill you for money, while telling you your physical shape is your own free choice so they can shrug off responsibility.

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29 Mar 10 - 01:24 PM (#2874800)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Stu

"reducing people to that subhuman condition"

Subhuman? Untermensch?

Bloody hell - now you're subhuman if you're a tubby. What next? Ginger people? People with blue eyes? People with big noses? People who dress differently to you?

Fat people are not subhuman, but it's all to easy to give your own prejudices away with a careless remark like that. None of us are perfect - not even you skinny 'humans'.

SFJ the lardy.

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29 Mar 10 - 02:12 PM (#2874844)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Jack Campin

I take you'd regard it as offensive to slaves to describe their condition as 'subhuman" too?

It is.

Anybody can be reduced to a subhuman condition by an oppressor, and the first step to doing something about it is to recognize what's been done to you. Like, when did you vote for a society where all you can afford to eat is lethal greasy filth?

I can just see some of the people who try to depoliticize this issue as advocating "slave acceptance" 150 years ago.

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29 Mar 10 - 03:19 PM (#2874916)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Jack the Sailor

Jack,

You are getting om my nerves a little. There is no oppressor. No one is standing over people with a whip making them eat.

It is not anything at all like slavery.

It is just as cheap to eat 2,000 calories a day of good food as to eat enough junk food to maintain morbid obesity.

If you ban all processed junk foods in the world. It won't solve the problem people still can still deep fry chips and dough at home.

Are you going to sing your protest songs to cows and pigs for making cream and lard?

The problem is very complex. I don't think it can be distilled into a song.

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29 Mar 10 - 03:19 PM (#2874917)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: PoppaGator

The sedentary lifestyle is hard to avoid ~ part of "taking any job you can get" nowadays usually includes (1) finding work well beyond walking distance of your abode, thereby necessitating the use of vehicular transportation, either personal or public, and (2) sitting still all or most of the workday, whether in front of a computer monitor, customer-service counter, microassembly workstation, etc.

Then there's the fast-food factor. Corporations invest in extensive research to identify the sweet-and-salty flavors that humans find hardest to resist, and then package those flavors in products laden with "empty calories" and unhealthy fats, products that are so cheap to produce that they can be sold to us at low prices.

Therefore, it takes a conscious effort to schedule aftificial exercise periods as part of our days, where in the past our forwbearers got all the exercise they needed in their daily work routines ~ and then ANOTHER conscious effort to investigate the properties of the foodstuffs we buy, often having to invest extra time and/or money to eat healthy and avoid a obesity-inducing diet.

It's amazing that I'm not fatter than I am...

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29 Mar 10 - 03:49 PM (#2874950)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Mavis Enderby

Supersize Me - Toothpick

It's an issue that was certainly taken seriously in the film...

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30 Mar 10 - 04:39 AM (#2875375)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Stu

"I can just see some of the people who try to depoliticize this issue as advocating "slave acceptance" 150 years ago."

What sort of insult is that? Are you seriously saying by disagreeing with your somewhat demeaning and condescending attitude towards overweight people that makes me an advocate for slavery.

Heck Jack, it might be an idea to get some perspective on this - Jack the Sailor and PoppaGator have it right.

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30 Mar 10 - 07:29 AM (#2875480)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Bloke from Poole

Nobody chooses to be a fat b*stard or a lardarse.

But not everybody wants to spend hours in the kitchen preparing "healthy" food, especially after a day's work.

I had a job with two hours drive each way, sat down all day, too tired to cook when I got back, too tired to do much except veg out in front of the box at night. I ballooned.

But the mortgage still had to be paid.

As people have said, it's complex and I don't see how you'd put it in a song - or interest people in the song if you did.

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30 Mar 10 - 07:41 AM (#2875485)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: GUEST,Gail

OK, one of folk music's claims to fame is that it champions causes, but that doesn't normally include being mean-spirited.

Any time you sing a song that's anti-something, there's likely to be someone listening who feels angry or embarrassed, but at least their personal discomfort's private. The point is, we can't usually identify a person's 'sins' by looking at them, we just hope the song is making someone think again.

But someone's appearance is there for all to see. Singing about it is bullying and I wouldn't want to be part of an audience that's asked to applaud it.

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30 Mar 10 - 09:11 AM (#2875534)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Acorn4

I don't entirely agree that people have no choice about putting on weight - are we therefore saying that half the population are victims? Having said that, modern lifestyles, as quoted in previous posts, do make it hard. The propaganda of having stick insect models dosn't seem to be working.

Until I was fifty, I could eat and drink as much as I liked and not put on an ounce, but all that changed over the next decade, and I've found it very hard to adjust from being able to eat and drink at will, and now carry a bit of the obligatory "folk singer's belly".

A colleague of mine that I invigilate exams with is an undertaker, and has had two dislocated shoulders in the past year.

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30 Mar 10 - 10:01 AM (#2875567)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: melodeonboy

"But not everybody wants to spend hours in the kitchen preparing "healthy" food, especially after a day's work."

Does it have to take hours to prepare something that's reasonably healthy? I don't think so! I work full time during the day and quite often have a gig in the evening, and even when I've got very little time I still manage to prepare good stuff.

(Now if I could only stop drinking beer, I might be a bit less overweight! :))

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30 Mar 10 - 10:09 AM (#2875578)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Bobert

"Fat bottom girls, you make the world go 'round" (Queen)

Now being a bluesman, I cann appreciate that...

B;~)

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30 Mar 10 - 11:09 AM (#2875623)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Bill D

From the Digital Tradition....

Lard

(We DO know that overeating and the wrong kinds of foods are indeed a serious problem for many....and we also know that there are folks for whom NO diet seems to help. I do not presume to be able to tell exactly what combination of factors is involved in any particular individual. I have known a couple of people who did NOT overeat and were still VERY large.....but, alas, I have known a few who were just in a state of denial about their eating habits. All *I* can do is hope those who 'can' control excess weight will find the strength to do so.)

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30 Mar 10 - 01:00 PM (#2875738)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: oldhippie

Harry Chapin's "A Better Place To Be" handles this (and other subjects) seriously. And I agree that "Donald & Lydia" is a good choice.

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31 Mar 10 - 05:52 PM (#2876861)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Bill D

Perhaps some songs need additional verses after this revelation

"Scientists have finally confirmed what the rest of us have suspected for years: Bacon, cheesecake, and other delicious yet fattening foods may be addictive."

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01 Apr 10 - 12:01 AM (#2877095)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Gurney

Chas and Dave's song 'Beer Belly' doesn't take the subject too lightly.
Seamus Kennedy does one called 'The Diet song' by Shel Silverstein.

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01 Apr 10 - 02:24 PM (#2877538)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: Bert

GUEST,erbert

try this

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01 Apr 10 - 04:46 PM (#2877638)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: GUEST,lynnt

What about Grit Laskin's song about dieting "let my stomach be Soft & Round" -- I think Hot Soup recorded it.

Let my stomach be soft & round
Round, round, soft & round
It seems so phony
To work at being bony
And hard as the cold, cold ground.

Lynn

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01 Apr 10 - 08:05 PM (#2877761)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: GUEST,Crowsister

"Notice how Jack always gets off - posting BS above the line"

And notice how Gargoyle is an inveterate jerk-off.
Well at least it makes life nice and simple simple, hey?

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01 Apr 10 - 11:48 PM (#2877841)
Subject: RE: Songs that take obesity seriously
From: GUEST,MG

How about I'm the man the very fat man that waters the workers' beer.

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