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13 Feb 12 - 08:44 AM (#3307374) Subject: BS: Snap-On tool From: Will Fly Now that would be useful. |
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13 Feb 12 - 08:54 AM (#3307384) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: John MacKenzie They're guaranteed for life you know. Replaced FOC if it breaks. |
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13 Feb 12 - 09:02 AM (#3307389) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: catspaw49 For many years the finest tools made and most pro mechanics filled boxes with them. Shiney, hard, and they lasted forever.......Sadly now just a shadow of what they used to be. Spaw |
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13 Feb 12 - 09:16 AM (#3307422) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: gnu The guy that has the Snap-On franchise here is hurtin. |
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13 Feb 12 - 09:59 AM (#3307495) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: John MacKenzie I nearly bought the local Snap-On franchise. Glad I didn't now |
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13 Feb 12 - 09:59 AM (#3307501) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: GUEST,Klumper Many older gents, and those who regularly work on their own, may find it more effective to finish off a job with a traditional Hand Tool ? |
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13 Feb 12 - 10:20 AM (#3307534) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: GUEST,olddude Spaw is exactly right. They were the best tools made. My old man would not use anything but them. They were expensive in their day but you would never break one of them. Sadly no more ... My brother still uses my dad's tools and they are still working like the day he used them 40+ years ago |
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13 Feb 12 - 11:55 AM (#3307713) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Richard Bridge Stahlwille used to be pretty damned good too, and, once upon a time, Britool and Stanley. I've had my Metabo socket set since I was about 16 |
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13 Feb 12 - 12:23 PM (#3307763) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Will Fly Didn't Span-On have a lifetime guarantee? And do they still? |
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13 Feb 12 - 12:39 PM (#3307789) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: gnu Mastercrap (Mastercraft), from Chinese Tire (Crappy Tire, Canadian Tire) used to be good. Still carry a lifetime "warranty" but the stuff I have seen since they have been supplied from China looks "iffy" to me. When I can't read the stamps... Last year I got a 230 piece socket set for Xmas. First time I decided to explore it while doing some minor maintenance, 5/8 was NOT 5/8. I gave it to a buddy's son with a "frustration warning". However, at less that $100 it's a good happy-weekender set. At least, it looks impressive. |
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13 Feb 12 - 12:49 PM (#3307802) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: John MacKenzie Kamasa were great when they first came out, then they disappeared. When they reappeared,I don't think they were as good, but still not bad for th bucks they cost. |
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13 Feb 12 - 01:04 PM (#3307811) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Bobert I've always used "Snap-Offs", i.e. Crapsman because of the lifetime warranty and much lower prices... I do have a few Snap-Ons, including a very nice torque wrench and metric combination wrenches (10,11,13,14,15,17&19mm)... Also have a few nice MATCO wrenches... B~ |
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13 Feb 12 - 01:17 PM (#3307825) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Richard Bridge Many years ago I acted for one of the Kamasa companies and yes, there were some problems. That company no longer exists hence I no longer owe it a duty of confidentiality. The best screwdrivers I ever had were Stanley ones. Most cross-point screwdrivers get fucked by people who do not know the difference between a philips and a posidriv. |
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13 Feb 12 - 01:24 PM (#3307831) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: gnu Philips outta be against the law. The law should say "only Robertson" unless you can prove there is a need otherwise for the application or you can prove you have a better design. I HATE Philips! No, it's way beyond hate. Nearly as much as standard. It actually upsets me to even think about Philips. |
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13 Feb 12 - 01:47 PM (#3307843) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Will Fly people who do not know the difference between a philips and a posidriv I confess - that includes me. So - what is the difference? |
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13 Feb 12 - 02:30 PM (#3307872) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: John MacKenzie 4 points against 8 |
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13 Feb 12 - 02:35 PM (#3307873) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: gnu Four extra smaller slots at 45 degrees to the main slots. Works better than a Philips at holding the screw to the driver but it still ain't no Roberston. I only have two arms so I only used Robertson if at all possible and that ain't often enough fer me. |
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13 Feb 12 - 03:08 PM (#3307885) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: saulgoldie Um, I think the OP was talking about a different "tool." So...this thread is a-driftin. Saul |
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13 Feb 12 - 03:36 PM (#3307900) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: gnu Well, Saul, fact is most of the posters are us older guys who are more interested in working tools than playing tools. Hmmm... that didn't sound quite right either. |
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13 Feb 12 - 04:40 PM (#3307937) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Rapparee Why are only men posting here? Is it something to do with snappy tools? |
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13 Feb 12 - 04:44 PM (#3307940) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: John MacKenzie I have trouble finding mine. It has happened since I acquired a roof over my tool shed. |
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13 Feb 12 - 04:55 PM (#3307946) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: gnu hehehee... here we go. |
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13 Feb 12 - 05:12 PM (#3307957) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: TheSnail Don't Stand Between a Man and His Tool |
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13 Feb 12 - 05:58 PM (#3307985) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: TheSnail Couldn't help noticing that one of the Google Ads on this page was "Snapon Handheld Forum". |
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13 Feb 12 - 06:10 PM (#3307991) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: gnu LOVE the Spooky Men! Thanks. |
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13 Feb 12 - 06:17 PM (#3307996) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Richard Bridge Good listing here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_screw_drives I'd be surprised if Robertson offered the same torque limits as posidriv. |
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13 Feb 12 - 09:09 PM (#3308077) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: gnu But, I can use a Robertson with one hand while I do something with the other hand... like hold onto something to maintain my balance. Screw torque. You only need enough torque to set the screw. If it's getting a screw out that is a problem, preventative maintenance is the problem. And, I am not a makeanickel engineer but I'd be surpised if there was much practical diffrence regarding torque. |
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13 Feb 12 - 09:35 PM (#3308081) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Joe Offer When I was a government investigator, I had a boss named Helen Limneos (married name), now deceased, who came from the Minneapolis area. She often told us that her father founded Snap-On Tools. I see that the headquarters of Snap-On is now Kenosha, Wisconsin that's ten miles south of my home town, Racine. Wish I knew more about the company. Their tools are legendary, a good example of what the Midwestern Work Ethic can do. Helen was a wonderful boss, by the way.... -Joe- |
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13 Feb 12 - 09:56 PM (#3308090) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Bobert As for Phillips head??? Twice as good as a single slot swcrew... Notg as good as 6 ot 8 points but better than the "good old days" of single slots... B~ |
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14 Feb 12 - 12:02 AM (#3308126) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: EBarnacle I prefer almost anything to slotted. Almost all of the nonslotted were invented to be used with power tools. Once you discover driving [or removing] screws and bolts with a power driver you won't go back. |
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14 Feb 12 - 02:24 AM (#3308150) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Richard Bridge IMHO the "slots" on a philips are more likely to fail than any others. If you have a good go at a stuck philips with an impact screwdriver the slots usually become a round tapered hole. If you have a similarly good go at a slotted head the first thing to fail is usually that you neck the bolt or screw - so demonstrating that you have got more torque onto it. Still a bugger to get out after that though!. |
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14 Feb 12 - 02:35 AM (#3308155) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: John MacKenzie Aye, you cannae beat a guid screw. |
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14 Feb 12 - 03:22 AM (#3308165) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: JohnInKansas According to a few friends still in the mechanical maintenance trades, Snap-On is still around and still offers the lifetime warranty on most of their tools. The biggest problems with them are the significantly higher cost, and the need to know how to get in contact with the Snap-On guy who services them in your area. Most of the dealers don't have a fixed location, and rely (almost entirely) on "route service" agents. The agents still come around the vehicle shops fairly regularly - especially where there's "heavy duty" maintenance as in a truck fleet shop; but an order for a specific tool may not be delivered until "next time the route guy is in town," and the schedule may be "casual." Of course in the "light automotive" maintenance trades, you can almost get by without even a screwdriver, because nearly everything is a "special tool" you can only get from the factory. The accessibility of the Snap-On agents isn't too much of a problem if you're working in a fairly big shop, but can be a real b**ch in smaller, or independent, businesses. And of course it varies with what town you're in as well. John |
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14 Feb 12 - 05:11 AM (#3308185) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Musket You used to be able to whack a wheel bearing off by offering a large socket and showing it a lump hammer when using Snap On. The last time I tried it, a fairly new one broke. I popped down to B&Q in a rush, got a cheap and cheerful "Torq" socket at less than a third of the price, and it is still being used for that purpose by my mate on an almost daily basis six months on. (He runs a garage, I was repairing my sons's car in his workshop using, bless him, his tools. I suppose buying a set of pullers would be too radical.) The poor Snap On bloke doesn't even get a mug of tea out of him now. I used to buy Snap On for our workshops when I was in business, but the tales I hear now are of falling quality. My one off recent experience is not the be all and end all, but it makes you think. |
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14 Feb 12 - 10:04 AM (#3308333) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: EBarnacle when a screw slot or Phillips hole or body or hex fails, it is usually because of operator error. The hole has to be sized right, as does the fir of the driver to the insert point. If any one of these is sized wrong, you are likely to cause a problem. It is not the fault of the tool. I virtually eliminated failure of Frearson and Phillips heads when I began making sure everything was properly matched. When planking boats, you begin to appreciate all of these factors. |
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14 Feb 12 - 10:16 AM (#3308344) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: ranger1 Us female types aren't commenting because we're too busy giggling. |
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14 Feb 12 - 12:30 PM (#3308391) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: beardedbruce ranger1, Really, to be giggling at men's tools on Valentine's day! How cruel!! |
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14 Feb 12 - 12:33 PM (#3308396) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: frogprince Are snap-on tools popular with thespians? |
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14 Feb 12 - 12:40 PM (#3308402) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: EBarnacle What has sexual preference got to do with it? |
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14 Feb 12 - 12:51 PM (#3308411) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: GUEST,Callingbird Actually women should choose these tools for you guys...that way they can choose any length and thickness they want. Interchangable ones would be most popular too! Happy Valentines Day. |
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14 Feb 12 - 01:03 PM (#3308420) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: beardedbruce I have yet to find a need for larger than my 24" handled 1" drive socket set. |
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14 Feb 12 - 01:14 PM (#3308425) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Wesley S You only get a one inch drive out your socket? That explains a lot. |
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14 Feb 12 - 01:22 PM (#3308428) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: beardedbruce Th sockets go to 3"- the drive is 1x1" |
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14 Feb 12 - 01:55 PM (#3308461) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: gnu Frearson are better than Philips for holding screws for one-handed insertion but still not as good as Robertson unless you have magnetized drivers. Frearson are scarce round these here parts... in my experience. |
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14 Feb 12 - 02:43 PM (#3308495) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: EBarnacle As I misspelled above, if the fit is right, the driver should work properly. Any type other than straight slotted will hold the tip in the center for maximum drive from the tool. |
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14 Feb 12 - 03:20 PM (#3308520) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: JohnInKansas One of the reasons that people have trouble with stripping the sockets on fasteners is that in the fairly distant past most of the utility fasteners were barely "stove bolt" quality, and weren't expected to to be tightened more than snug. Fasteners might have been tightened to 30,000 psi stress levels, but often were much lower. You just used bigger screws or more of them if you needed more strength. Fairly generally, but especially in autos now, nearly all of the screws and bolts are at least SAE J429 Grade 4 or higher, and are expected to be "tightened to yield" for good retention. This puts the fastener tensile load up in the 90,000 psi range, and of course requires "more torque" to get there. Structural fasteners are nearly always expected to be pulled down to something like 120,000 psi, and for "critical structures" the intended installed fastener stress may go close to 200,000 psi. There are a lot more Fastener Choices easily available now than only a few years ago, and higher strengths are more frequently used. (The link shows a small sample of choices, there are lots more.) You now run into lots more fasteners that are installed at higher torque than "back in the day" because they need to be tighter, and you need to install or reinstall replacements to the original higher torques. This obviously makes some of the older recess styles less suitable than they were in the uses for which they were designed. There's nothing really wrong with the Phillips drive, if it's used for appropriate purposes. It does have a couple of weaknesses as commonly used. A main difficulty is that you must keep the driving tool lined up with the fastener. If you tilt the screwdriver it will cam out of the recess and is likely to ruin the screw. In addition, few people even know that the "screwdrivers" come in more than one size, and you must use the right size tool if you don't want to ruin a lot of screws. Unless you've had significant experience, or (gasp, choke) RTFM!!! it can be difficult to know which size screwdriver to use for a particular screw. An additional difficulty comes from the demand for a "bigger screwdriver" when using power tools to screw them in. A power screwdriver bigger than necessary will have too much "inertia" to stop when the necessary installation torque is reached, and will strip a lot of screws. The "automatic clutches" on popular sizes of "screwdrivers" don't really solve the problem. Nearly all the more exotic drive configurations have been developed to facilitate automated power tool installation on assembly lines. You may have "preferences" for which others you like to see best, but if you're not on an assembly line "you're probably using them wrong." In this context, "wrong" can be perfectly satisfactory but the uncommon drive types are only there to make someone else's job easier, not yours. If the fastener is designed specifically for a high torque automated installation, you probably won't get it installed as intended (unless you RTFM again, and pay attention). John |
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14 Feb 12 - 03:37 PM (#3308530) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: John MacKenzie g you keep talking about single handed applications for your tool. What are you doing with the other hand? |
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14 Feb 12 - 03:46 PM (#3308536) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Midchuck you keep talking about single handed applications for your tool. What are you doing with the other hand? In the old days, you turned the pages. Now, you work the mouse. P. |
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14 Feb 12 - 04:01 PM (#3308541) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: gnu Hahahaa! |
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14 Feb 12 - 04:08 PM (#3308542) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: JennieG Himself used to be a sales rep, selling various brands of tools.....made for some raised eyebrows in social situations, let me tell you. He can talk tools with the best of them and knows the right tool for the right situation - now that's a very handy skill, yes? And important too, because the wrong tool can complete mess up the job in hand. Me, I just sit here and chuckle. Cheers JennieG |
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14 Feb 12 - 04:45 PM (#3308564) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: gnu Hmmm... nevermind. |
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14 Feb 12 - 08:34 PM (#3308662) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Fergie By trade I'm a toolmaker; grab hold of that for Valentine's day. |
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15 Feb 12 - 12:09 PM (#3308955) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Bee-dubya-ell What a great idea! If guys could snap their tools on or off at will, they could go bar-hopping with attractive young women while giving their wives absolutely no reason to be concerned about adulterous behavior. All they'd have to do is snap their tools off, hand them to their wives and say, "Here, Hon. Put this in my sock drawer. I won't need it until I get home." |
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15 Feb 12 - 12:36 PM (#3308970) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: EBarnacle That certainly brings this thread back to its original title. |
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15 Feb 12 - 12:42 PM (#3308977) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Stilly River Sage ☝ As close as I can come to a "like" button. SRS |
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15 Feb 12 - 01:24 PM (#3309010) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Richard Bridge And, we could whip down to "Can-do Tool hire", get what we needed, and go home with an innocent smile... |
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15 Feb 12 - 06:16 PM (#3309129) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: John MacKenzie What if they ask you to leave a deposit? |
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15 Feb 12 - 06:50 PM (#3309141) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: gnu SRS... some like that kinda button pushing. >;-) John... oh my. Hehehee. |
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15 Feb 12 - 10:53 PM (#3309258) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Gurney I've been waiting, but no-one came up with it, so.... Did you hear about the mechanic who was engaged to a lady contortionist? She broke it off! He DID put it into the hands of his solicitor/lawyer, but the solicitor said it would never stand up in court. More seriously, you can break any screw-head off (up to 10G) with a power driver, even 12volt, but it should only be by trying to take them out. If you have to use that sort of torque putting them in, you should have drilled a pilot hole first. Particularly for stainless-steel screws. You'll also shatter bit tips, which are often over-tempered. Philips bits have thin blades, but the screws are easiest to 'bog'/fill over. Pozidrive are fractionally better, but the bits seem to wear faster. Robertson/square stay on the bit. JohnMc, with the other hand I'm holding something I'm screwing onto something else. These screwheads are the most difficult to bog up, a bigger recess. |
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16 Feb 12 - 04:42 AM (#3309325) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: John MacKenzie I'm just going out for a bit. I may be some time. |
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16 Feb 12 - 04:53 AM (#3309326) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: Will Fly Well, I have to say I've learned a huge amount of new stuff about tools from this thread. Now, as Bobert might say, what can the wimminz tell us? |
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16 Feb 12 - 07:28 AM (#3309392) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: John MacKenzie They'll probably just sigh, but remember this. To us menz, sighs don't matter. |
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16 Feb 12 - 07:32 AM (#3309393) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: GUEST,Patsy My dad had an impressive set of tools back in the old days. The only thing I learnt about these tools coming out was to get out of there as fast as possible. DIY was not one of his strong points bless him. |
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16 Feb 12 - 02:59 PM (#3309659) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: JohnInKansas I've known a number of women who've been just as competent with tools as any man. There's nothing wrong with learning about any subject when you have even just an interest, much less when you have a need to know something. Of course the women are expected to "do it pretty," which is a problem the guys don't have (much); but that's sort of a constant thing. The women already know that the only requirement when they try to teach their men to cook is that the proper goal is only to teach enough so he thinks he can do it, and then stand back and let him brag about how good he is. At the risk of giving away secrets, I'll venture that the same rule applies to men and their tools. In reality, lots of men have, and brag amout, lots of tools they have that they haven't really learned to use. (Really secret clue: If he tells his buddy how much he paid for it, he probably doesn't really know what it's for. If he really knew, he'd be talking about what he's done with it.) A good "helpmate" of either sex is the one who hands you the right tool before you have to ask for it (and the really good one picks a better one for the job than the one you thought you wanted). BTDT John |
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16 Feb 12 - 03:44 PM (#3309687) Subject: RE: BS: Snap-On tool From: gnu Hehehee... I was up on a set of staging and the ex was on another set. She wanted to help (yeah... ooooh fuuuuck, here we go). After a bunch of "incidents", she was getting owly, even tho I was quite patient and trying to teach her. Seems SOME women (men too?) think it's condescending to have have someone teach them something they don't already know. I could sense she didn't wanna be helpin anymore. I said, "Nail it in place 1/4" below the top of the facia." and tapped on the fascia. She took out her tape measure and asked me what a quarter of an inch was. She wanted me to "come and show her". That's when I lost it. I said, "If I climb down this staging and climb up your staging, it won't be to show you how to read a tape measure. It will be to throw you the fuck off the staging." As she was going in the house, I asked if she could please bring me a cold beer. That sealed the deal... the rest of the job went smoothly. I even had a cooler of beer under the back deck. Dont'cha just love buildin shit and havin a few ales... alone? |