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21 Jun 12 - 11:58 AM (#3366256) Subject: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor NPR article. |
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21 Jun 12 - 01:28 PM (#3366298) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Bobert The operative word in the thread name is "story"... B~ |
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21 Jun 12 - 01:40 PM (#3366303) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Wesley S Now can we get Trayvon Martins side of the story? Oh - yeah..... |
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21 Jun 12 - 01:40 PM (#3366304) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu Why is this stuff allowed to be released before trial? |
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21 Jun 12 - 01:48 PM (#3366307) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: GUEST,999 I was just about to ask since when are prosecutors or defense teams allowed to use trial by media? They looking to have the verdict overturned on a tech? Talk about fucked up law. |
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21 Jun 12 - 03:47 PM (#3366357) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Greg F. No, Bruce, talk about fucked up PEOPLE in general. |
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21 Jun 12 - 04:52 PM (#3366371) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor Zimmerman and his lawyers are not building credibility here, especially after the lies at the bond hearing. |
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21 Jun 12 - 05:36 PM (#3366392) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Richard Bridge What lies at the bond hearing? |
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21 Jun 12 - 07:04 PM (#3366412) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don Firth Well, among other things: When the story first broke, the news services published a copy of Zimmerman's mug shot. Other than looking surly, with the eyes of a dead fish, he looked intact. Within a few days, and after Zimmerman claimed that he shot Martin in self -defense after being attacked by Martin (punched, and his head banged on the sidewalked), someone on his defense team published a badly photoshopped job on the same mug shot, making Zimmerman's fish-eyes look kind and friendly (I think they borrowed them from an old still of Mr. Rogers) and had lurid looking blood smeared on his face and forehead. You mean the police wouldn't have at least given him a little first-aid before taking the mug shot? Also, some elements of Zimmerman's story contradict each other. In my opinion, Zimmerman is a self-appointed vigilante, he had a gun, and he wanted to use it. And a black teen-ager, on his way back from a neighborhood store where he bought a bag of candy, just happened to wander into his sights. "Aha! Ideal! Who'll ever question it!?" Don Firth |
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21 Jun 12 - 08:18 PM (#3366433) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu ""Aha! Ideal! Who'll ever question it!?"" A jury? BTW, that's what I think might happen. It might go to court. He might be tried. The jurors might not have an opinion before they weigh the evidence. I think that's the way it's suppose to work, no? Innocent or guilty, I think that's the way it's suppose to work. Correct me if I am wrong. |
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21 Jun 12 - 09:13 PM (#3366448) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: bobad That's exactly how it's SUPPOSED to work - see OJ Simpson trial. |
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21 Jun 12 - 09:26 PM (#3366453) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Bobert Make no bones about it... Zimmerman has the full force of the NRA and ALEC behind him so anything that is put out there for public consumption is intended to bring a favorable verdict for Zimmerman... B~ |
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21 Jun 12 - 09:36 PM (#3366459) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu I ain't judgin or takin sides until the trial is over and I have read the full transcript. Your mileage may vary. |
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21 Jun 12 - 09:56 PM (#3366465) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Bobert I'm just hoping that we don't get another O.J. trial, gn-ze... B~ |
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21 Jun 12 - 10:45 PM (#3366480) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor "What lies at the bond hearing?" Zimmerman's wife said they had no money for bail. They had $100,000 in donations in a bank account. When the judge found out he put Zimmerman back in jail and raised the amount of the bond. |
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21 Jun 12 - 10:47 PM (#3366482) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: GUEST,hg He's guilty of murder. The trial is about the "stand your ground law." A law that has kicked up the murder rate in Florida and thus increased crime statistics. It does not keep citizens safer, contrary to the rhetoric of the gun lobby (Marion Hammer) down the street from me. love, harpgirl |
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21 Jun 12 - 10:56 PM (#3366485) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Richard Bridge Thank you Jack. Has Zimmerman's wife been charged with perjury? If not, why not? |
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21 Jun 12 - 11:14 PM (#3366495) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor No she wasn't . The Zimmerman's claimed not to have understood the Judges questions. Maybe that is why? |
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22 Jun 12 - 01:17 AM (#3366514) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don Firth Gnu, I said "In my opinion" and I underlined it for emphasis. In the exceedingly unlikely event that I would be called to be on the jury for this case, I would recuse myself. There may be things of which I am not aware in this case. But it looks pretty clear to me. As I have mentioned on other threads about this, I know how SOME gun enthusiasts, especially some of those who insist on going armed at all times, tend to think and what their proclivities are. Don Firth |
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22 Jun 12 - 08:34 AM (#3366595) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Wesley S "I know how SOME gun enthusiasts, especially some of those who insist on going armed at all times, tend to think and what their proclivities are." And in my opinion those folks are looking for a fight and hope they find it. In my entire life I've NEVER been in a situation where having a gun on me would have helped me or kept me safe. Those situations are more rare than hens teeth. Common sense and a good pair of feet will usually take care of any situation. |
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22 Jun 12 - 09:37 AM (#3366624) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Arkie As for the Stand your Ground law, does it not also apply to T. Martin. While he may have been unknown to Zimmerman, he was visiting relatives in their own neighborhood. He had as much right to be where he was as did Zimmerman. Except, he did not have a gun. |
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22 Jun 12 - 12:38 PM (#3366710) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor I have to say. I find the story published by the Zimmermans to be unlikely. |
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22 Jun 12 - 03:52 PM (#3366787) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Arkie I agree. For one thing it would be interesting to know how much time lapsed between the phone call and the shooting. |
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23 Jun 12 - 02:05 AM (#3366954) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Neil D Actually, Shellie Zimmerman has been charged with perjury. Here is a Huffington Post article. |
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23 Jun 12 - 10:13 AM (#3367040) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor Looks like they charged her last week. The transferred of $9999 and 9990 look very bad because the banks have to report $10,000 transactions. I guess the Zimmermans were not counting on being monitored. |
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23 Jun 12 - 12:27 PM (#3367084) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: GUEST,999 Neither of the Zimmermans look like the sharpest knives in the drawer. I think stupidity weighs heavily in this killing and the aftermath. Note I said killing and not murder. That will be established by the prosecution, or not. |
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23 Jun 12 - 01:51 PM (#3367109) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Greg F. All things considered, Bruce, I think stupidity weighs heavily in most killings. We need a statute to codify "criminal stupidy" as at least a misdemeanor, if not a felony. |
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23 Jun 12 - 01:55 PM (#3367113) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor No kidding Greg. How about this one? Murder for Chinese food. |
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23 Jun 12 - 02:01 PM (#3367118) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu Don... point well made. |
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23 Jun 12 - 10:43 PM (#3367264) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T The way that the authorities back pedalled about bringing any case, and the fact that the defence are working overtime to try the case by Media, would suggest that, whatever the jury decides will be negated on appeal. The defence will simply claim that after all the publicity there is no possibility of a fair trial, notwithstanding that they themselves are the authors of most of that publicity. I'm afraid this case is going, as you might expect, to be just as dead and buried as the black kid with nothing more on his mind than a sweet tooth. Don T. |
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23 Jun 12 - 10:54 PM (#3367266) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Bobert The bottom line here here remains the same: When Zimmerman called the police he was told to not leave his car and that the cops were on the way... He ignored their orders... This is why Zimmerman should inevitably be convicted and get some serious time... 10-15 years The wife??? Yeah, she perjured herself... Give her community service... Will this happen??? No... The NRA-O.J. factor will trump justice and the truth... B~ |
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24 Jun 12 - 03:16 AM (#3367294) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: GUEST,Guesr ftom Sanity Wait for the trial!....That way the EVIDENCE will be weighed, instead of your hatred and wishes, and prejudged nonsense. GfS |
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24 Jun 12 - 12:13 PM (#3367424) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T GfS, If you don't like other people expressing their opinions, why bother reading them, let alone responding. And you have a very objectionable habit of giving the rest of us orders. I suggest you mind your manners, and leave us to mind our business. Don T. |
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24 Jun 12 - 12:56 PM (#3367438) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Ebbie I echo that. |
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24 Jun 12 - 12:57 PM (#3367439) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: ollaimh the guest from satanism can't even register on mudcat. zimmer was told not to follow and not to leave his car. he should be convicted of something fro following and leaving the car. martin was on the cell phone with his girl friend and that recording doesn'y show the conversation claimed by zimmerman. on another thread the gun toters were discussed. yeah they are lookignf ro trouble. i travelled all over the usa with no weapon and never had a problam. i was carefull but in a middle class neighbourhood zimmerman did not need a carry with hand gun. he might make a case for in his house or even car but to carry it with him is looking for trouble. |
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25 Jun 12 - 12:18 AM (#3367619) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: number 6 I have to say I agree somewhat with GFS's post ... this whole thing is a tragedy ... I could say let the courts of justice determine the outcome ... but this whole thing is a mess fueled by racial emotions that have already pre-determined what the outcome will be ...if it was a black guy vs a black guy, or a white guy vs a white guy it would just be (sadly) another statistical killing. Just more evidence of a dysfunctional society. biLL ... just stating my opinion |
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25 Jun 12 - 01:18 AM (#3367625) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor No. INHO Black or white there is still the "stand your ground BS." |
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25 Jun 12 - 02:01 AM (#3367628) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Thanks biLL...It's re-assuring to know, that there is still someone above lynch mob mentality still on Mudcat! Peace! GfS |
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25 Jun 12 - 07:58 AM (#3367706) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: GUEST,999 It doesn't matter what people on Mudcat thinks. It does matter what the jury concludes. |
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25 Jun 12 - 02:46 PM (#3367836) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: GUEST,gillymor Zimmerman should probably be praying for a conviction because his life probably ain't worth a plug nickel on the outside unless he can raise enough money from the redneck-vigilante community to buy a small island in the South Pacific. |
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25 Jun 12 - 03:12 PM (#3367851) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor No one will bother with him one the trial is over. Though, no matter the result, it has put a damper on his dreams of being a cop. |
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26 Jun 12 - 12:30 PM (#3368227) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: GUEST,gillymor I disagree,Jack. I have some African American friends and co-workers here in Florida and the consensus opinion seems to be that Zimmerman will recieve justice one way or another. I don't wish him any harm because I feel Karma will take care of him. I only hope he doesn't attain hero status (or martyrdom) amongst the gun-toting crowd. |
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26 Jun 12 - 12:46 PM (#3368239) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Greg F. hope he doesn't attain hero status ... amongst the gun-toting crowd. Too late. He's already an NRA poster boy. |
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26 Jun 12 - 01:03 PM (#3368249) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor The NRA will find another poster boy, with less baggage ASAP. Maybe the African Americans you know are different from the ones I do. But the Zimmerman would be way, way down the retaliation list if they had one here. They are more concerned with the way the local authorities handed the case and the way the new gun laws encouraged that. |
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26 Jun 12 - 02:09 PM (#3368278) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Greg F. No argument- and that's good old Florida for ya- somehow folks tend to forget that it is, and always WAS, a Deep South State. For a period at the turn of the 19th/20th century, believe it led the nation in lynchings. "Stand Your Ground" = Open Season On Minorities, no question. |
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26 Jun 12 - 04:07 PM (#3368329) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Richard Bridge Gillymoor: PMSL! |
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26 Jun 12 - 04:19 PM (#3368335) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: CET Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Bobert - PM Date: 23 Jun 12 - 10:54 PM The bottom line here here remains the same: When Zimmerman called the police he was told to not leave his car and that the cops were on the way... He ignored their orders... This is why Zimmerman should inevitably be convicted and get some serious time... 10-15 years The wife??? Yeah, she perjured herself... Give her community service... Will this happen??? No... The NRA-O.J. factor will trump justice and the truth... B~ Bobert: I have as much use for your opinion as anyone on Mudcat, which is saying a lot. I consider you to be one of the Mudcat grown ups. I also have as little use for GfS as most people here, but ... Your reasoning has some logic holes. Zimmerman left the car - bad mistake but not illegal. It is no evidence at all that he went hunting for black guys. It says nothing about whether he feared for his life. He was carrying a gun - he was allowed to do so. You don't believe his story? Fair enough, you don't have to, but you are not a prosecutor, and even less a judge. It will be up to the prosecutor to prove that he was lying by the evidence and not by appealing to hatred of guns and liberal guilt for the many crimes committed by whites against blacks. He's lied about his financial resources. The state has legal recourse for that, but it says nothing about the night that Martin died. Don: you don't like orders? Try one from me. Wait for the damn trial. |
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26 Jun 12 - 07:55 PM (#3368435) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T ""Though, no matter the result, it has put a damper on his dreams of being a cop."" It strikes me that he would be exactly the sort of cop the Florida legislature would want. ""Don: you don't like orders? Try one from me. Wait for the damn trial."" Question for you. When a jury of Southern redneck gun lovers acquit him, will you really be able to convince yourself that it was an honest and fair verdict, in spite of the facts: 1. The kid was seventeen. 2. He was armed with nothing more lethal than tea and candy. 3. Zimmerman was carrying a hand gun. Now, I don't know what Americans consider life threatening, but I can't see me with a gun, being scared of a schoolboy throwing tea and skittles at me. Nor can I see any circumstances when merely poking the weapon into his ribs wouldn't make an unarmed youth back down without the need to fire. And if I were scared of him, I would not confront him, but stay in my vehicle and simply observe. 4. Zimmerman was told to let the police deal with it. 5. Zimmerman made the comment that "They always get away with it". Who always get away with it? Black people! Get away with what? Anything he imagines they might do, with the emphasis on "imagines"! Any logical holes in that? "Don: you don't like orders? Try one from me. Wait for the damn trial."" So, who died and left you thinking you might be the boss? I will express my opinion when and where I choose. Don T. |
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26 Jun 12 - 07:59 PM (#3368439) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T One question: Who speaks for a dead black kid in Florida? The authorities wouldn't even have arrested Zimmerman without the outcry their inaction caused. Don T. |
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26 Jun 12 - 08:13 PM (#3368445) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Bobert The lying about resources under oath and the code talk between Zimmerman and his wife have hurt his defense... If, like some have suggested, ALEC and the NRA give up on him, he goes down... If, however, they double down, then a good chance of an O.J. outcome... High priced attorneys win a lot of cases... B~ |
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27 Jun 12 - 01:29 AM (#3368510) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor No Police Chief or Sheriff in their right mind is going to hire the most famous vigilante in the country as a rookie cop. Zimmerman has this going for him. Since Sheriffs are elected, there are bound to some who are less than perfectly professional. |
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27 Jun 12 - 12:29 PM (#3368684) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T ""No Police Chief or Sheriff in their right mind is going to hire the most famous vigilante in the country as a rookie cop."" I would have thought that no legislative body in their right mind would enact the "Stand Your Ground Law". I was wrong! Are you sure you aren't also wrong? Remember this is Florida, a Southern State which still seems to have a problem with black people continuing to breathe. Hand on heart, can you say that it is possible to stop Zimmerman's NRA funded legal team loading the jury in his favour? Don T. |
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27 Jun 12 - 12:36 PM (#3368691) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor Don. I have lived in three Southern States. 99% of black and white people get along just fine. "Stand your ground" isn't about killing black people. Its about selling guns to meet a wish fulfillment fantasy. Sadly, a lot of Americans, not just in the south, want to be Doc Holiday or Wyatt Earp. And of course you can't do that without the latest Glock or other expensive handgun. |
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27 Jun 12 - 01:11 PM (#3368717) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T ""Don. I have lived in three Southern States. 99% of black and white people get along just fine. "Stand your ground" isn't about killing black people."" Hurricane Katrina!! Who was left behind to drown or starve? Who was shot coming out of flooded stores with food for their families? Whose plight was simply ignored for a considerable time? Who was rescued and bussed out of the area of devastation? Florida has no endemic racial problem? They must be ever watchful not to be squashed as a pig comes in to land. Don T. |
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27 Jun 12 - 01:15 PM (#3368721) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T And before you come back at me, I do know that New Orleans isnt in Florida, but it's indicative of the attitudes of many southerners. DT. |
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27 Jun 12 - 01:18 PM (#3368722) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor Don, You are starting to piss me off. But I can see it is only ignorance. I recall reading and account by white British students who were stopped at a bridge to a neighboring Parrish by the local Sheriff's deputies. If it was racism why did that happen. I also lots of white men who have close friendships with black men. Especially when they played sports together in high school. Come live here for a while. It is not the caricature that you get in the media. |
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27 Jun 12 - 02:59 PM (#3368768) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: GUEST,gillymor I lived and worked in the construction industry in Florida and Texas for 30 years and believe me racism is alive and unwell in this part of the country. People are not as overt with their prejudices as they once were but that's due to fear of reprisals from their employers who,in turn, are afraid of legal action. As management I dealt with it on many occasions. |
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27 Jun 12 - 03:11 PM (#3368776) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor I'm not saying that there is no racism. I'm saying that it is not as pervasive as painted. Do you think that the Florida Legislature is passing laws intended to legalize the killing of black people? Or is that a stretch? |
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27 Jun 12 - 04:34 PM (#3368816) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Richard Bridge Yes, Jack, I think exactly that. Like the voting laws designed to disenfranchise the black population. |
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27 Jun 12 - 04:36 PM (#3368817) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Richard Bridge Oh, and, silly me to forget, the "pass" laws designed (like those of South Africa in the old days and Nazi Germany) to make it easier to discriminate against the oppressed racial minorities - but in the case (irony of ironies) of US ""pass" laws, Hispanics. |
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27 Jun 12 - 05:52 PM (#3368848) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: robomatic Similar to gnu's comment above, I've thought since the beginning of this contretemps that in spite of the posturing and demonstrating on both sides of this issue, there should be enough evidence to decide this case in law. The street criers and radio reactionaries have very little interest in what was going on in either Martin's or Zimmermann's mind and in all events even the law doesn't so much care what people say they thought as what they did and when. |
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27 Jun 12 - 06:41 PM (#3368860) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T ""The street criers and radio reactionaries have very little interest in what was going on in either Martin's or Zimmermann's mind and in all events even the law doesn't so much care what people say they thought as what they did and when."" Mebbe so! But the problem with that Robo, is that one of the protagonists is going to find it rather difficult to tell anybody what was in his mind or what he did. One man gets to tell the tale he wants believed, and if you think he's going to say anything other than "I was in the right", then you really are living in fantasy land. And speaking of fantasy, which of you guys is going to tell me, in all seriousness, that you believe there would have been no immediate arrest and charge, if it had been the white (comparatively speaking) guy who was killed and the black claiming self defence? Until you can swear to that in a court of law, "Stand Your Ground Law" is only for whites. Don T. |
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27 Jun 12 - 08:37 PM (#3368887) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Bobert Yeah, "stand your ground" does seem to be crafted for Redneck Nation, as is everything else that comes from ALEC... Black folk need not apply... B~ |
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28 Jun 12 - 01:54 AM (#3368954) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: GUEST,999 "Yeah, "stand your ground" does seem to be crafted for Redneck Nation, as is everything else that comes from ALEC.." A few years back I posted a link to the names of hundreds of people who were working for ALEC. I was informed on the thread that my posting was much like the way Joe McCarthy did things. So, I suppose next even mentioning the name will cause trouble, huh? Fuck. |
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28 Jun 12 - 07:59 PM (#3369305) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: robomatic Don: I understand your point and that is why I said I think there is enough evidence for a properly informed jury to make a legal judgement. I didn't say it would be fair. I believe it to be legally decidable. Meanwhile, in Texas there has been a legal rendering for the case in which someone tried to exert 'stand your ground' as a justification for shooting a noisy neighbor. |
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19 Sep 12 - 01:51 PM (#3407389) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: bobad Forensic tests find no Trayvon Martin DNA on George Zimmerman's gun By David Edwards Wednesday, September 19, 2012 12:41 EDT Results of forensic tests released on Wednesday could be crippling to the defense of a Florida neighborhood watch captain who is charged with murdering 17-year-old Trayvon Martin. Documents released by the State Attorney's Office for the Fourth Judicial Circuit ruled out the possibility that Martin's DNA was on the grip of George Zimmerman's gun, according to the Orlando Sentinel. The Florida Department of Law Enforcement could find no evidence that Martin had handled the weapon. Zimmerman had told police that he was forced to shoot Martin because the teen was on top of him, slamming his head into the concrete and had tried to take the concealed pistol from the holster on his waist. Other tests were inconclusive as to whether or not Martin's DNA was on the holster, WKMG reported. Zimmerman's DNA, however, was found on both the gun and the holster. Witness diagrams and several hundred photos were also released on Wednesday, but they reportedly revealed little new information. Zimmerman was charged with second-degree murder earlier this year. He has pleaded not guilty and is claiming that he acted in self-defense. |
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19 Sep 12 - 06:00 PM (#3407456) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu So, that don't mean shit. Crippling? Bullshit. Hey, I got no dog in this fight... I am just sayin what I said. |
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19 Sep 12 - 06:28 PM (#3407461) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: pdq "...Florida Department of Law Enforcement could find no evidence that Martin had handled the weapon..." That means thay did not find anything. Doesn't mean it isn't their in traces to small to find, or they did not look very hard. This non-proof and means precisely that: nothing. "...Zimmerman's DNA, however, was found on both the gun and the holster..." Oh my God! You don't suppose that is because those items belonged to him? Hell, he fired the gun! Just a reminder: Trayvon Martin was kicked out of high school the week before this incident because an inspection of his locker found drugs and burglery tools. Zimmermann thought it suspicious that Martin was going up to people's houses and seeming to check door locks and windows. Like a burgler. |
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19 Sep 12 - 06:59 PM (#3407467) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Yes of course Peedee, standard equipment for the trendy burglar, TEA and SWEETIES? Duh! Don T. |
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19 Sep 12 - 07:36 PM (#3407476) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Henry Krinkle Trayvon looked like a thug to me. Typical hoodlum. Burglar, dope dealer and purse snatching auto thief. (:-( ))= |
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19 Sep 12 - 07:41 PM (#3407479) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu Here we go again. All and sundry with a rope and no evidence. But, by the fuck, there's gonna be a hanging taday, eh? Odd... on threads where the perp pleaded guilty, I am shit upon for sayin he's guilty and deserves what he gets. On threads where a dyin witness said "That IS the guy that shot me." I am shit upon for sayin the perp is guilty and deserves what he gets. On threads where the perp has not yet been proven guilty I am shit upon fer sayin we should wait to see ALL the evidence. Fer fuck sake? Are you people for real? Do you just post inane shit to wind people up? If so, yer doin a good job because I would like to meet you in person and call you some names. The man is innocent until proven guilty. Thank goodness. And, if he IS guilty, all you do-gooders won't pull on him. Almost laughable if it wasn't so sad. |
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19 Sep 12 - 08:32 PM (#3407499) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: dick greenhaus I guess in Florida, it's Ok to shoot anyone that looks like a thug. |
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19 Sep 12 - 09:04 PM (#3407513) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu Dick? WTF? Yer gonna hang an innocent man too? Odd to me that anyone will judge a man before trial. And, as I said, odd that some won't hang him when is he is guilty, when it is proven and when he had recourse which he rejected. Shocking actually. To me. |
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19 Sep 12 - 09:15 PM (#3407518) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Bobert I'm more concerned about the angry white guy with terminal road rage in his big pickup truck trying to bully everyone in front of him than a black kid with a hoodie... B~ |
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19 Sep 12 - 10:37 PM (#3407545) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu The angry white guy? With terminal road rage? In I am soooo in the wrong place. |
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20 Sep 12 - 06:38 AM (#3407638) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Henry Krinkle You're such a bigot Bobette. You and your stereotypes. Well I'm more concerned about the guy in the suit carrying a briefcase with the greed for money and power. (:-( D)= |
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20 Sep 12 - 10:50 AM (#3407736) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T ""The man is innocent until proven guilty. Thank goodness."" OK Mr Wildebeeste, where's the equivalent outrage against those who are slagging off a dead boy who can't defend himself, calling him a drug dealer, drug user, thug and burglar. You are very selective in your choice of those who are "innocent until proven guilty" and those who aren't. Zimmerman is laughing if he gets a jury with that kind of bias, because he'll walk, and Trayvon will be "Just another black kid who deserved to get dead because he was probably up to no good anyway". Making buying sweets and tea after dark a capital offence. Don T. |
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20 Sep 12 - 10:56 AM (#3407739) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor You're such a bigot Krinkle. You and your stereotypes. Trayvon looked like a thug to me. Typical hoodlum. Burglar, dope dealer and purse snatching auto thief. |
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20 Sep 12 - 11:17 AM (#3407747) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor Gees GNU, no body is convicting him. They are just commenting on the news as it is released. As as been said. It is not helpful to Zimmerman that there was no evidence that the kid touched the gun. But that does not prove anything. The whole point, from my point of view is that these "stand your ground laws" is that vigilantes and other mischief makers can go out and goad people into attacking them and then shoot in "self defense." That seems very wrong to me. I don't want it here. So if that is what Zimmerman did, I want to see him punished. On the other hand. Zimmerman's defense team has that law to work with plus a bunch of NRA and gun nut money. Zimmerman will probably get off very lightly. |
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20 Sep 12 - 04:00 PM (#3407856) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu Don... WTF? Quote these posts you say that I have read and ignored that have been interpreted by you as me being selective and having "that kind of bias". I think you need to stop insinuating that I have made ANY "choices" or am "biased". That may be construed as libel unless you can prove otherwise. Take yer ropes and shove em. This will be decided in a court of law and not by mob rule... THANK GOODNESS yet again. BOTH (since Don has implied that I have tried Martin in my mind based on accusations I have never read... which I have NEVER done) are innocent until proven guilty and the fact of the matter is, neither man desrves to be tried by YOU. Nor do *I*. I am seriously pissed off by your accusations and insinuations. JtS... "Gees GNU, no body is convicting him." We disagree. And, again, I take great umbrage at being told I have convicted Martin. Just pure bullshit... I really can't explain how pissed off I am at that. |
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20 Sep 12 - 04:07 PM (#3407860) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor "I take great umbrage at being told I have convicted Martin." Wow! Am I far off! I thought you were sticking up for him. |
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20 Sep 12 - 06:55 PM (#3407948) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu I am sticking up for BOTH of them as the case may be. No man deserves the shit thrown in this thread and other threads without a fair trial. Even then, it will still be shit if posters do not read the trial transcript OR, sometrimes, even if THEY DO READ IT! I had a hard time on a recent thread taking abuse from posters who READ and could not acknowledge the fact that a dying man said, "THAT is the guy that shot me." Come fuckin on eh? A dying man IDs the guy that shot him and posters still say this guy is innocent? And so it is. Bullshit from stem to stern. Who needs to carefully weigh the evidence or accept due process? Get the rope. Hang yourselves. |
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21 Sep 12 - 06:56 AM (#3408159) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Henry Krinkle - PM Date: 19 Sep 12 - 07:36 PM Trayvon looked like a thug to me. Typical hoodlum. Burglar, dope dealer and purse snatching auto thief. (:-( ))= Outraged response from Gnu?……………NONE! Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: pdq - PM Date: 19 Sep 12 - 06:28 PM "...Florida Department of Law Enforcement could find no evidence that Martin had handled the weapon..." That means thay did not find anything. Doesn't mean it isn't their in traces to small to find, or they did not look very hard. This non-proof and means precisely that: nothing. "...Zimmerman's DNA, however, was found on both the gun and the holster..." Oh my God! You don't suppose that is because those items belonged to him? Hell, he fired the gun! Just a reminder: Trayvon Martin was kicked out of high school the week before this incident because an inspection of his locker found drugs and burglery tools. Zimmermann thought it suspicious that Martin was going up to people's houses and seeming to check door locks and windows. Like a burgler. Outraged response from Gnu?……………AGAIN, NONE! The next post from Gnu is entirely devoted to calling us a lynch mob and declaring that Zimmerman is innocent until proven guilty. WHO speaks for the dead black victim? Don T. |
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21 Sep 12 - 05:31 PM (#3408423) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu Don... I can't read a lot of your post because of the messed up characters that appear on my screen but I think I get the idea. I thought I already answered your last question... a COURT OF LAW speaks for "the dead black victim" (those are YOUR words and, BTW, your inference to racial bias on my part is EXTREMELY offensive). Not a LYNCH MOB. I am not calling your "us" a lynch mob, rather, just you and the people who want to decide what happened without due process. And... people who infer that I am racially biased through hateful innuendo are unacceptable to me. That kinda shit don't wash with me, buddy, so knock that fuckin shit off. As far as me not responding (to YOUR liking, I might add) to posts which I may not have seen or give no credence to or WHATEVER, how in fuck can you judge me by what I haven't said? DO NOT infer that I am racist and DO NOT put words in my mouth again. |
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21 Sep 12 - 06:36 PM (#3408453) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Henry Krinkle You're an animal,gnu. But which one? Animals |
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21 Sep 12 - 06:46 PM (#3408456) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu None of the above, Hank. |
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22 Sep 12 - 05:41 PM (#3408821) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor Gnu, where I live now, lynching is a serious topic. I think most people I know would say the mob needs custody of a man to lynch him. Since the Florida authorities have custody of Zimmerman, he seems safe from that to me. I will state again, in case I am not clear, that my only concern in this case is with the "stand your ground laws" empowering irresponsible vigilantes. Either one of two outcomes would please me. Zimmerman being found NOT to be an irresponsible vigilante hiding behind that law and found innocent. Or him being found to be one and being convicted of manslaughter. What would not please me is for him to be found to be an irresponsible vigilante and to get away with that because of that law in Florida. IT IS NOT WRONG TO SPECULATE ABOUT A CASE WE ARE NOT INVOLVED IN. We are not a lynch mob and your anger is misplaced. |
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22 Sep 12 - 06:18 PM (#3408827) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T ""I thought I already answered your last question... a COURT OF LAW speaks for "the dead black victim"" WRONG! Nobody can tell Trayvon Martin's side of this story, because nobody else was there, except the man who shot him dead. FACTS! 1. There is nobody to rebut Zimmerman's assertions and only his side can be told in court. 2. The Florida authorities did not want to prosecute Zimmerman, and only did so because members of the public like some of us, care enough to protest. They (the authorities) were perfectly happy to avoid seeing any form of justice for the victim, and make no mistake, Trayvon Martin WAS and IS a victim. 3. The stand your ground law permits the killing of an unarmed person, even when the killer straps on a gun and goes looking for trouble, and when he finds it makes no attempt to back away, but actively seeks confrontation. Now you can tell me till you're blue in the face that Martin will get a fair shake, but I don't think you even believe that yourself. Unless public outcry continues right through the trial, it'll be written off as another black kid gone bad. So you'll excuse me if I continue to talk about it. Nobody forces you to read my posts and you've already said you will choose what side to get upset about. Fine by me, IF you stop telling me what to sy or not say. Don T. |
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22 Sep 12 - 06:45 PM (#3408836) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu "We are not a lynch mob and your anger is misplaced." "... and make no mistake, Trayvon Martin WAS and IS a victim." Really? *I* will wait for the trial. It's not *my* call. |
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22 Sep 12 - 08:57 PM (#3408874) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Bobert Bottom line here??? The cops told Zimmerman to leave Martin alone and that they were on the way... Zimmerman didn't... Martin is dead... I don't give a rat's ass if Martin beat the holy crap out of Zimmerman... Had Zimmerman stayed in his car like the cops told him we wouldn't be talking about this... B~ |
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22 Sep 12 - 10:59 PM (#3408893) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu Bobert... I assume that is another vote in favour of the lynch mob? I am astounded by the fact that any of you sit in judgement before trial. I shall not debate any of the posts. I will wait for the FULL transcript of the trial. AND, I will read it. AND I will take it as fact, recorded in a court of law and not listen to bullshit or hype. I don't know either party and I don't give a shit about either of them. I give a shit about justice and due process. Youse wanna hang someone before the trial? Fuck you. That ain't justice. Fact is, a lot of youse won't even hang the guilty after the trial and that's sick shit to me. That ain't justice.... yeah... we DO disagree. Before and after trial. The after "debate" I can understand... the before part really fucks me up... I just can't believe youse guys. I am at a loss... just don't make no sense to me. "HANG HIM NOW! WITHOUT TRIAL! But, don't hang him!" ??? WTF is that shit? |
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23 Sep 12 - 08:17 AM (#3408989) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Jack the Sailor Gnu, no one is talking about hanging or lynching but you. We are not in Florida. We couldn't if we wanted to. Which we don't. We are all happy to talk about the case as it unfolds. What is wrong with you? Are you pulling our legs? |
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23 Sep 12 - 09:53 AM (#3409005) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Bobert Nah, no lynch mob but not a pat on the back for a guy who first stalked and then shot to death a 17 year old kid... Many people out there think that Zimmerman is some kind of hero... Really... I'm not making this up... There is an attitude in the South that as long as it's white people killing black people everything is okay... That's the part I know all to well... If you lived in the South you'd know this unwritten code to be alive and well in the hearts of way too many white southerners... Zimmerman is no hero to me... I hope that he gets the same treatment as any black person who killed a white would get... B~ |
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23 Sep 12 - 05:18 PM (#3409156) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: GUEST,999 "Innocent or guilty, I think that's the way it's suppose to work." Verdicts are guilty or not guilty. |
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23 Sep 12 - 05:45 PM (#3409165) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu Well, JtS, I have been told that I can't think straight because I won't support a judgement before there is a trial. And, statements made certainly appear to me as if some people have judged both men before trial... = lynch mob. 9... I think you may consider "found" guilty or not guilty. Minor point, perhaps, but it does have meaning. |
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23 Sep 12 - 06:15 PM (#3409178) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T "" I give a shit about justice and due process."" That's exactly your problem Gnu. You are deluded if you think that due process and justice go hand in hand. The courts dish out LAW, not JUSTICE! And Law is whatever a clever lawyer can make a jury believe, and also whatever technicality he can adduce to circumvent justice. I believe in the jury system as being the best we've got, but please don't try to tell me they dish out justice, or that they can read the mind of a dead kid. Don't try to tell me either that they don't have their prejudices. Ask the Scottsboro Boys! Don T. |
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23 Sep 12 - 06:20 PM (#3409182) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: Don(Wyziwyg)T ""And, statements made certainly appear to me as if some people have judged both men before trial..."" You don't object to Martin being cast as a thug, a drug user and a burglar, but you DO object to any opinions against the man who killed him in the street. You are entitled to make up your mind but we are not. Needs no further comment. Don T. |
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23 Sep 12 - 06:52 PM (#3409195) Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published. From: gnu I ain't TELLIN YOU fuck all, Don. You are tellin me. And you have no right to do so. YOU and the rest of us have to live by the rules. If YOU don't like the rules, tough shit. *I* am not deluded. *I* do not have a problem. *You* have a serious problem when you shit on me for something YOU conjure up in YOUR mind. What fuckin right do YOU have to put words in MY mouth or attack my character or inteligence? I do not have a problem. Never did. Your accusations and insinuations are not only feable and upsetting, they are undeserved, at the very least. JtS... no lynch mob? I'll see if I can pick da bones outta dat fish an see if I can swallow n but I tinks I'll choke. (Goes for ME too... someone already has their mitts on my throat for NO reason.) |