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Folk Producer Bill Leader - Discography

29 Jan 13 - 02:29 PM (#3473130)
Subject: Bill Leader Discography
From: GUEST,Litto

Did I tell you I'm writing a book about the legendary folk producer, Bill Leader? Anyway, I've gone public with the Bill Leader Discography on my blog, which would have been an impossible achievement without the aid of Bill himself.

Here's the link -

http://www.dyversemusic.com/2013/01/bill-leader-discography.html

If anyone in the Mudcat community can spot errors, or omissions, or can nail the chronology down more precisely (the stated year and catalogue numbers have been chief guides to my ordering), your contributions are very welcome. Also, I've made the decision to include reissues, to make the list as comprehensive as possible.

Post replies here or leave comments on the blog, or please get in touch directly, especially if you have Leader-related anecdotes/insights, at wildchild.butler@googlemail.com

Thanks,

Mike

29 Jan 13 - 03:47 PM (#3473167)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: GUEST,Spleen Cringe

2011 - The Woodbine & Ivy Band (Folk Police) Recorded by Pete Philipson with invaluable support and assistance from Bill Leader.

Fantastic job on the discography. Wow!

29 Jan 13 - 04:37 PM (#3473194)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: Reinhard

Well done!

If you need more pictures and details of records on the Leader/Trailer and Topic labels feel free to borrow them from my site.

I wonder about two albums on the Hill & Dale label, Plexus's "Life Up the Creek" and Tony & Jenny Reavill's "Revelation". They both seem to have the issue number HD 004. I have only the Plexus album to check so I guess that the Reavill album's number is incorrect, but I haven't found any other information on this album to check...

30 Jan 13 - 05:58 AM (#3473426)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: GUEST

Reinhard, Great to hear from you. Your site has been an inspiration and an invaluable resource for me. Indeed, I've plucked images off it already, but will do so openly and with pridenow that I've got your permission.

Yes, Plexus and Tony and Jenny Reavill's Revelation were inadvertently given the same catalogue number, and who could know that the mistake would come back to haunt Bill several decades later.

Thanks Spleen Cringe, I shall rectify that omission now. Thanks for the encouraging words.

Mike

31 Jan 13 - 04:11 AM (#3473797)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: GUEST,Litto

Quite a productive day yesterday. Went to Oldham - very drab on a wet Wednesday afternoon - and, acting on a tip, joined some old-timers having a good old shin-dig in the back-room of a pub. A couple of Oldham Tinkers were present. These were the vestiges of an incredibly rich working-class culture, now reduced to a handful of boozy revenants. Just before, I visited the local Oxfam and picked up a 1958 10" on Topic, Still I Love Him by Isla Cameron and Ewan MacColl, recorded by Bill Leader. Great condition. First sighting of Once I Had A True Love, as popularised by Pentangle.

And I didn't have it on Bill's Discography! The omission is now rectified. The Discography, btw, is quite a hit on the blog.

http://www.dyversemusic.com/2013/01/bill-leader-discography.html

348 views and it's only been up 24 hours. My previous best was a Spanish Electro pop duo singing about Alan Turing - 248 views and posted in November. Hey, It's looking good for the book!

Mike

04 Feb 13 - 12:18 PM (#3475692)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: GUEST,Litto

When I came to look for images to illustrate the Discography - http://www.dyversemusic.com/2013/01/bill-leader-discography.html - I trawled through Google Images, of course. The source of two thirds came from one extraordinarily helpful website: -

https://www.informatik.uni-hamburg.de/~zierke/folk/

It has to do with Hamburg University and is called Mainly Norfolk, and it is the brainchild of Reinhard Zierke. So thank you, Reinhard, for allowing me free use of your images and grateful thanks for the generousness of your folk scholarship in general.

Quite a few of the other images came from the second best independent folk specialist website, www.theballadeers.com with the emphasis on Scottish and Irish folk.

But still there are some records so rare that their images elude even the resources of Google Images. The following records from the Discography still have no visuals. But hold thy hands Mudcatters, I remember seeing some of them at Bill's house, so I'll take my camera along next time I go.

1956

TRC98 Jack Elliott, Talking Miner Blues c/w Pretty Boy Floyd [Topic, 10" 78]

TRC99 Margaret Barry, The Blarney Stone c/w If You Ever Go Over to Ireland [Topic, 10" 78]

TRC101 The City Ramblers, Round and Round the Picket Line c/w Nine Hundred Miles [Topic, 10" 78]

1957

TRC103 Jack Elliott, Old Blue c/w Rambling Blues [Topic, 10" 78]

TRC104 Jack Elliott, Streets of Laredo c/w Boll Weevil [Topic, 10" 78]

TRC105 Wendy Corum with Elsie Bracher, Villikins and His Dinah c/w Wendy Corum with John Hasted, The Coachman [Topic, 10" 78]

1958

TRC106 Alex Eaton with John Hasted, The Collier's Rant c/w The Row Between the Cages [Topic, 10" 78]

TRC107 Peggy Seeger, Freight Train c/w Cumberland Gap [Topic, 10" 78]

1962

TRA 108 Cy Grant, Folk Songs & Cool Songs [Transatlantic]

1964

TRA 120 Leon Rosselson, Vote For Us [Transatlantic]

LK 4633 Various: Irish Folk Night [Decca]

1966

TRA EP 109 Isla Cameron, Lost Love [Transatlantic EP]

1967

TRA 159 The Glenside Ceili Band, All-Ireland Champions, Fleadh Ceoil, 1966 [Transatlantic]

XTRA 1058 Frank Shaw & Dick Williams, Gospels in Scouse [Xtra]

1968

SING 1001 Terry Gould, Several Kinds of Loving [Sing]

1974

EC001 Various: North By North East [Evening Chronicle]

1977

LEA 2069 The Beresford Band, Yorkshire Dales Dance Night [Leader]

1978

LTRA 505 Various: First o' t' sort [Transatlantic]

HD 002 Gordon Tyrrall, Farewell to Foggy Hills [Hill & Dale]

1979

SHY 7008 Peter Bond, See Me Up, See Me Down [Highway]

1980

HD 004 Tony & Jenny Reavill, Revelation [Hill & Dale]

GEB 8751 Gill Burns, A Loan At Last [Nosuch]

1981

ESL 1 Ecclesfield School Concert Band, Overture For Band [Ecclesfeldian]

1982

ESL 2 Various: High Spirits - Music at Ecclesfield School [Ecclesfeldian]

1985

HD 851 Holme Valley Tradition, Bright Rosy Morning [Hill & Dale]

1987

BRAD 001 Various: We Singers Make Bold [RSLJ]

2000

VAMP1 Rosie Hardman, The Lost Leader [private pressing, CD]

Mike

04 Feb 13 - 01:47 PM (#3475730)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: Reinhard

Three of these are now on my website:

LEA 2069 The Beresford Band, Yorkshire Dales Dance Night [Leader]

LTRA 505 Yorkshire Dialect Society, First o t'sort [Transatlantic]

VAMP1 Rosie Hardman, The Lost Leader [private pressing, CD]

04 Feb 13 - 03:09 PM (#3475769)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: GUEST,Litto

Thanks, Reinhard, you are the best

03 Mar 13 - 12:11 PM (#3485852)
Subject: Bill Leader Discography Update
From: GUEST,Litto

Just to say that the Bill Leader Discography - http://www.dyversemusic.com/2013/01/bill-leader-discography.html - is expanded and now (almost) fully illustrated. Alas, recent evidence would suggest that Anne Briggs' Hazards of Love EP has no place ("recording supervised by Paul Carter" it says on the sleeve), but then there are records where Bill played a significant role in the session and didn't receive a credit (a few by the Ian Campbell Group, The Tinkers' Carrickfergus, where respectively Nat Joseph and Roy Guest enjoy producer credit), and others which are definite misattributions (like the trio of sea-song EPs from '63: Blow the Man Down/100 Years Ago/The Coast of Peru). Curiosities are coming to light, like Bob Pegg's lone 45 The Werewolf of Old Chapeltown from '78, and, more bizarrely, a 45 from 1981 by a choir of Leeds Midwives singing a festive song about Jesus. The most midwives Bill had ever seen in one place, says Bill, with no babies.

If Mudcatters know of any omissions, or can identify errors, it's still a work in progress. Mike

03 Mar 13 - 12:29 PM (#3485858)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: Noreen

Bill Leader Discography

03 Mar 13 - 12:30 PM (#3485860)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: Leadfingers

Clicky

03 Mar 13 - 12:32 PM (#3485862)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: Leadfingers

You work faster than I do Noreen !!

03 Mar 13 - 06:19 PM (#3486011)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: GUEST,freebornman

Thank you, Mike!

An extremely useful page!

I've got a question though. About the Leader-Trailer label. Does your list include a full catalog of Leader-Trailer? If, for example, the record was released on that label, but was not produced by Bill Leader - do you include such records there? Or there are no such records at all and my question is meaningless?

04 Mar 13 - 05:13 AM (#3486139)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: GUEST,litto

Freebornman,

Thanks for your interest. Yes, the Discography covers the entire Trailer/Leader catalogue, and yes there are records included which were not produced by Bill i.e. LER 2095 Down Among the Barley Straw, by Cyril Tawney, and LER 2096, Green Grow the Laurel, by Tommy Dempsey & John Swift. A fair bit of the Leader output comprises of archive recordings issued in lavish packages, for instance the Joseph Taylor, John Maguire and Cecilia Costello LPs, which Bill wasn't around for (the Joseph Taylor recordings come from 1908!). In these instances a symbol in the key covers it, viz: ∑ - executive capacity.

04 Mar 13 - 02:37 PM (#3486326)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: GUEST

Thanks, Mike!

Really, very nice. Most of their catalog was not reissued, and I see many records I didn't know about.

04 Mar 13 - 02:39 PM (#3486329)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: GUEST,freebornman

That's my comment above (freebornman)

05 Mar 13 - 08:35 AM (#3486566)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: GUEST,Litto

Freeborn,

Yes, the rights to Trailer/Leader were acquired by Dave Bulmer of Celtic Music, who notoriously refuses to re-release the back-catalogue. Contrariwise, everything on Topic is available on download, I believe. Mike

05 Mar 13 - 11:50 AM (#3486631)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: Reinhard

Topic has started to make their recordings downloadable but for the last two years this effort has stalled at 84 albums (for which they now have an advertising campaign with downloadable liner notes) but they promise to do more in the near future.

However, a lot of their early albums are UK issues of Folk-Legacy and Folkways albums for which they probably don't have rights anymore. But these albums seem to be digitally available from Folk-Legacy and Smithsonian Folkways anyway so there's no real reason for Topic to do it too.

14 Mar 13 - 06:00 AM (#3490151)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: GUEST,Litto

Still on a quixotic attempt to make the Bill Leader Discography as complete as possible, and find matching images for all the entries. A personal visit to Leon Rosselson yielded one previously unsuspected item, The Galliards' 1960 Topic 45 Black and White, and I took a snap of the cover of the 1964 Transatlantic LP, Vote For Us, which if elusiveness of image is any measure (nothing on Google Images for instance), might be the rarest record ever made. Alas, in the resulting snap the shadow of the photographer is clearly visible in the reflective surface of the laminate sleeve. Can anyone with a copy of Vote For Us (if any such exists) do a better job?

All to be found at: - http://www.dyversemusic.com/2013/01/bill-leader-discography.html

Thanks, Mike

07 May 13 - 06:15 PM (#3512750)
Subject: RE: Bill Leader Discography
From: GUEST,Martin Farrell

When is the book due?

07 Jan 14 - 10:03 AM (#3589743)
Subject: RE: Folk Producer Bill Leader - Discography
From: GUEST,Litto

Martin,

It's a slow haul (in answer to your question, when is the book due?), as you might judge from the time it's taken for me to answer. Sorry about that. I forgot the thread, and have only just now thought to revisit old mudcat haunts.

Slow progress then. At the moment I'm busy transcribing interviews Bill has given me, and those of other parties involved (wives 1 and 2, Gloria and Helen; Karl Dallas, Gloria's second hubbie; Dave Swarbrick; Reg Hall; Lea Nicholson etc etc). I'm uncovering some great nuggets, although the scale of the project is more daunting than when I started.

The idea is that the book will be self-published. That is, my brother Ant, who has deeper pockets than me, will back it, albeit as a business venture. And indeed, I think it will be a worthwhile contribution to folk music literature. I doubt I'll ever find such a rich subject-matter again, and the things I'm uncovering are far, far from the official version, which is what happens when you start talking to people as opposed to reading books.

My contact number, if you have any info to share, remains 0161 226 5461. The Mudcat community will be the first to know when the book is available.

Thanks for the support and interest, your would-be-Leader-writer, Mike

18 Mar 25 - 08:11 PM (#4219391)
Subject: RE: Folk Producer Bill Leader - Discography
From: FreddyHeadey

2025,,, The Bill Leader Discography seems to be here :

www.idealmusique.com/2013/01/bill-leader-discography.html

19 Mar 25 - 07:47 AM (#4219416)
Subject: RE: Folk Producer Bill Leader - Discography
From: GUEST,Peter Laban

Call it a monorail brainfart by someone but

LEA 2003 Seamus Heaney, Seaumus Heaney [Leader] O ?

is by Seamus Ennis. Someone had their Seamusses mixed up.

Sometime during the eighties I was given the lp on this very day, as a birthday present.

19 Mar 25 - 07:58 AM (#4219417)
Subject: RE: Folk Producer Bill Leader - Discography
From: GUEST,Peter Laban

'Minor brainfart'..predictive text/spellchecker in action above.

19 Mar 25 - 06:47 PM (#4219465)
Subject: RE: Folk Producer Bill Leader - Discography
From: FreddyHeadey

Four volumes of Mike Butler's Sounding the Century: Bill Leader & Co. so far.


"A major history of British music, especially folk music, based around the life of iconic sound engineer Bill Leader. Based on extensive and exclusive interviews conducted over ten years with Bill and other major players. Each volume in this series is illustrated with rare, often unpublished images and original artwork by Peter Seal."

"Sounding the Century proposes a new way of writing about music and mixes the methodology of oral historian and music critic. Characters that have crossed Bill’s path are given pen portraits – from E.P. Thompson to Bob Dylan – and the writing is strong on the thrill of discovery. Mike Butler has even been compared to H.G. Wells…"

"Through the series, a parade of the great and good come and go. These include Paul Simon, Brendan Behan, Pink Floyd and Christy Moore, all recorded by Bill at one time or another. Secrets, surprises and heresies are rife and something jaw dropping happens at least every four pages."

1 – Glimpses of Far Off Things: 1855-1956
",,,the processes of history at work on ordinary people (i.e. Bill’s immediate ancestors)"
Released: 28th July, 2021
Format: Paperback
ISBN: 9781800460768
https://troubador.co.uk/bookshop/history-politics-society/sounding-the-century-bill-leader-co

2 – Horizons For Some 1956-1962
" ,,,the second volume finds Bill settling in at Topic Records and collaborating with Ewan MacColl and Bert Lloyd, the architects of the folk revival.
It is set in the period of the Cold War, ‘Ban the Bomb’ and lingering austerity. Yet the small pond of UK folk is about to be stirred by breezes blowing from the USA. The folk revival was more advanced over there, and the influx of US visitors, the craving for diversity generated by the Stateside Hi-Fi craze, the irresistible rise of Lonnie Donegan and skiffle, all cleared the path for the UK folk revival proper."
Released: 28th April, 2022
Format: Paperback
ISBN: 9781803130910
https://troubador.co.uk/bookshop/history-politics-society/sounding-the-century-bill-leader-co-6774

3 - The Poor Man’s Only Music 1957-1965
"Bill Leader’s big idea, to go where the music is playing and catch it on the wing, is comparable to the moment when technology freed film directors to shoot on location. It gets great results if you don’t mind roughing it.
The third instalment of Mike Butler’s voluminous study of the legendary sound engineer, his life and times and our lives and times, is mainly concerned with field trips and traditional music making, but opens with the building of a recording facility on the top floor of the Workers’ Music Association in 1957."
Released: 28th August, 2023
Format: Paperback
ISBN: 9781803137353
https://troubador.co.uk/bookshop/history-politics-society/sounding-the-century-bill-leader-co-8194

4 - Time Immoral: 1959-69'
"Time Immoral 1959–1969, picks up the story on the cusp of the 60s, and the UK folk scene is rapidly losing its innocence. Something has happened to folk music since the days when it was an innocent endeavour to make the world a better place.
Hucksters and hustlers have emerged to stir the sedate pond. Some are song hunters from the USA, ready to carve up traditional music with native song hunters and music publishers. The folk record industry has come into line with the business standard – crookedness. Tiny sales, tiny fees, long hours and dodgy accounting methods have absolved the singers and musicians of every obligation except survival."
crowdfunder 2024 Ended Jan 8, 2025
https://crowdfundr.com/32QXT0

Forthcoming titles:

5. A MESSY GARDEN, IF IT IS A GARDEN: 1965-1969

6. BRIGHT FERMENTS: 1969-1973

7. FROM DOC ROWE TO DOCK PUDDING: 1969-1978

8. YE WHO SECURE TROPHIES NOT YOUR OWN: 1979-2024

check:
https://troubador.co.uk/bookshop/search?search=sounding+the+century

www.soundingthecentury.com/

Photos & article by Mike Butler | 30 September 2023
Why my biography of folk producer Bill Leader is really a social history of the Twentieth Century
https://themeteor.org/2023/09/30/why-my-biography-of-folk-producer-bill-leader-is-really-a-social-history-of-the-twentieth-century/

19 Mar 25 - 07:57 PM (#4219471)
Subject: RE: Folk Producer Bill Leader - Discography
From: GUEST,Keith Price

Happy Birthday Peter.
Still 3 minutes left.