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12 Jan 14 - 09:11 PM (#3591514) Subject: BS: A year without God From: Jack the Sailor It is an NPR article. This was not posted to provoke arguments or insults. Civil comments are welcome. Semantic complaints can be made in the comments section of the interview so that the author of the article can deal with them. |
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12 Jan 14 - 09:30 PM (#3591520) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Bill D Oh... I see what it's about. And I agree with many others- some in his congregation. You don't 'really' pretend to be an atheist from such a perspective. I am reminded of Descartes decision to formally 'doubt' the existence of God. Even Descartes knew it was only a logical doubt... but the Catholic church was not amused, and Descartes spent some time backing down. I'm not sure what kind of 'sign' this preacher expected in his year... struck by lightning? A visit from some angels? Now.. I personally knew a Unitarian minister who started as a Southern Baptist. He explained that he "..woke up one morning realizing that he could no longer get up and spout the standard line." He still was concerned about 'issues', so he became a Unitarian. His change came from inside... not some cloak of a test. |
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12 Jan 14 - 10:03 PM (#3591527) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Jack the Sailor It seems odd that he would announce the change, or say that it is only for a year, or that NPR would consider it newsworthy. |
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12 Jan 14 - 10:05 PM (#3591528) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Mrrzy Bully for the pastor - brave. |
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12 Jan 14 - 11:24 PM (#3591539) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Janie I read about it on CNN. I ain't touchin' this one. |
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13 Jan 14 - 12:37 AM (#3591548) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST This is not from NPR This was not posted to provoke arguments or insults. Civil comments are welcome. Semantic complaints can be made in the comments section of the interview so that the author of the article can deal with them. |
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13 Jan 14 - 02:00 AM (#3591553) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Musket A year without God? A month without his reps knocking on my door would be a start. |
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13 Jan 14 - 03:37 AM (#3591562) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Nigel Parsons A little muddle-headed of the pastor. If you are a Christian (or member of any other major religion) you can choose to spend a year ignoring God, but this will not be a "year without God". Reminds me of the prayer: "O Lord, Thou knowest how busy I must be this day; if I forget Thee, do not Thou forget me;" |
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13 Jan 14 - 04:43 AM (#3591571) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Grishka Professional religious leaders, like many other leaders, often feel obliged to pretend to have a quick answer to all questions. This expectation is wrong; complying to it fosters doubt rather than faith. Refusing to answer for one year - or "as long as it takes" - is a wise decision. You may find new answers, more modest but going deeper into the true nature of humankind and religion. In other words: the problem is not God, but theology and dogma. |
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13 Jan 14 - 05:06 AM (#3591576) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: McGrath of Harlow A year without church is hardly the same as a year without God. After all it's quite possible to to church every day and have no kind of belief in God. |
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13 Jan 14 - 07:37 AM (#3591601) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Richard Bridge First, questioning god (or his existence) does not an atheist make. Second, if the person in question was an atheist for a year did that make him less moral? Thought not. |
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13 Jan 14 - 07:51 AM (#3591604) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Backwoodsman "First, questioning god (or his existence) does not an atheist make. Second, if the person in question was an atheist for a year did that make him less moral? Thought not." Completely agree, but where in the article does the minister concerned claim either of those things? |
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13 Jan 14 - 08:11 AM (#3591608) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST "Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes you a mechanic." |
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13 Jan 14 - 08:48 AM (#3591616) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST Christianity: The belief that some cosmic Jewish zombie can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him that you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree. |
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13 Jan 14 - 09:07 AM (#3591621) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Backwoodsman Did the earth move? |
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13 Jan 14 - 09:50 AM (#3591632) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Jeri Regarding the quote above about churches and garages: if you follow Jesus Christ, you're a Christian. If you follow your mechanic, you're gonna wind up with a restraining order. |
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13 Jan 14 - 10:17 AM (#3591641) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Jack the Sailor Good one Jeri. |
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13 Jan 14 - 10:36 AM (#3591644) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST Ditto. LOL |
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13 Jan 14 - 01:21 PM (#3591714) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Stim GUEST: The nice thing about Christianity is that they don't cut your heart out and sacrifice you to the Rain God every time there's a dry spell. I think most of of us forget what an advantage that is. |
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13 Jan 14 - 01:34 PM (#3591722) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Jack the Sailor Good one Stim! May I add.... And our figurehead does not die. Leading to embarrassing statements like... "I know we told you that Kim was the greatest thing since sliced bread. Now it is this Kim." |
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13 Jan 14 - 03:04 PM (#3591756) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Musket Yeah but Kim had a better scorecard on the golf course. He existed too..... Obviously, Stim seems to gloss over the inquisition, crusades, child abuse.... The largest enquiry into institutionalised child abuse in The UK has just started in Northern Ireland. The children there had more than a year without God. Sadly the nuns and priests had them daily.... |
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13 Jan 14 - 03:20 PM (#3591764) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Jeri I once started singing "I saw the light" and realized I was a Zoroastrian. It is my opinion that if you can CHOOSE what to believe in, you're a fake. It's like brainwashing yourself. You can turn your back on your beliefs and go against them, or hate what you believe in, but you still believe in it. |
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13 Jan 14 - 04:09 PM (#3591771) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Stim I don't gloss over anything, Musket. I am at least as aware of history and current events as you, and as outraged by all sorts of hypocrisy and inhumanity, as you might be, as well. Given that, I think that you, and I, and everyone else are a lot better off living in a places that, on a good day at least, make some effort to follow the Laws of Moses and the Golden Rule, than in places that embraced the "old ways" which embraced ritual human sacrifice as a response to all problems great and small. And props to all the Buddhists, Hindus, Muslims and all who try to moral, ethical, and compassionate lives according to whichever teachings they embrace. |
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13 Jan 14 - 04:14 PM (#3591772) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Bert For a minute there, I thought that was a promise. |
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13 Jan 14 - 04:39 PM (#3591776) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Musket Fair do's Stim. |
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13 Jan 14 - 04:40 PM (#3591777) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,antisemantic I'm Wordless |
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13 Jan 14 - 05:47 PM (#3591792) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Jack the Sailor I think knot. |
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13 Jan 14 - 11:36 PM (#3591854) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Jack the Sailor Saw this on facebook |
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14 Jan 14 - 04:13 AM (#3591885) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Marianne S. "make some effort to follow the Laws of Moses" I'm just off to kill some witches, though I promise not to eat any shellfish. |
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14 Jan 14 - 06:26 AM (#3591910) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Musket Straight over their heads Marianne. Our congregation, with the noble exception of pete are decaffeinated Christians. The need to look smug and superior overrides the need to believe in any of it. it would be helpful if Jerk posted after my posts citing the rule number the previous post was breaking. You see I'm scoring them on a bingo card and sweating on a line. Can't wait for full house! Probably have to shag a pit monster or something to get that far though. |
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15 Jan 14 - 12:12 AM (#3592182) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST Yep. We didn't get that at all, Marianne. And Musket is so much more clever than everyone else, it makes us want to puke. He is a regular Malcomb Muggeridge. |
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15 Jan 14 - 07:50 AM (#3592267) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Marianne S. I didn't feel the need to explain because I assumed you would know I was referring to the less appealing aspects of the Laws of Moses. I assumed you *would* get it. |
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15 Jan 14 - 10:10 AM (#3592320) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Lighter Either the man will wind up by announcing that he's become an atheist for real, or he'll announce that despite his year-long rejection of God, only God prevented him from doing godless evil. Other possibilities? |
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15 Jan 14 - 11:07 AM (#3592337) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST He will drift off in to the sunset never to be heard from again? He will have a life-changing experience and find he's actually attracted to other men, come out of the closet and be spurned by his old religious friends? He will roll his car in a drunken stupor and die? God will tap his shoulder and tell him to stfu? |
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15 Jan 14 - 12:08 PM (#3592351) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Jack the Sailor He will move to Canada and post smartassed remarks on this forum without no identification other than a time stamp? |
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15 Jan 14 - 12:23 PM (#3592358) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Musket Judging by recent posts, I wouldn't hold my breath... "Straight over their heads" refers to our more vocal Christian congregation. The less appealing is glossed over unless they are throwing their creed in your face and calling you a militant atheist or such insults when you question them. A year without God is one thing. A thread without the bearded one would be nice. Guest. It's spelt Malcolm. As in "holier than thou and tried to get the medieval blasphemy law reenacted. He also tried to get Life of Brian banned. Nice of you to compare me to a God Botherer of the first degree. Presumably he now has an insight into whether heaven exists or not.... |
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15 Jan 14 - 03:47 PM (#3592412) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST ". . . without no identification other than a time stamp?" Probably. Unlike the guy who moved from Canada to post drivel from the US. It's in how you look at things. |
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15 Jan 14 - 06:39 PM (#3592445) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Jack the Sailor One man's drivel.... |
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15 Jan 14 - 07:57 PM (#3592462) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST Yep. |
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16 Jan 14 - 05:20 AM (#3592552) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Musket Eyup Jack. The guest wasn't me, but I'd like to take this opportunity to say "I wish I'd said that." Ones man's drivel needs wiping with a napkin by a carer...... Nurse! |
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16 Jan 14 - 08:01 AM (#3592586) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Stim Haven't heard Malcolm Muggeridge mentioned in a long time. You might not realize that he was something of a fixture on American television, with his contrary but entertaining, literate, and amusing comments. He actually helped to make "Life of Brian" a rather large grossing movie here, because without his comments, the religiously indignant wouldn't have come out to protest its showing, which boosted the attendance incredibly. It is often forgotten that he started out as a communist sympathizer and atheist (or at least an agnostic) and also forgotten that he was one of the first to expose the enormity of Stalin's brutality to a Western intellectual community who'd pretty much fallen for "Russia's Noble Experiment" till then. Anyway, there are worse people to be compared to... |
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16 Jan 14 - 08:36 AM (#3592594) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Musket I'm sure there are Stim. Just thought his holier than thou later life was more relevant to this debate than his exposure of world communism in the face of intellectual fools. I don't mind being compared to an intellectual. So long as nobody mistakes me for one. |
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16 Jan 14 - 11:55 AM (#3592670) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Jack the Sailor " I don't mind being compared to an intellectual. So long as nobody mistakes me for one. " Of course, Mr. Musket, I am less than heartbroken or surprised to think that you may think of anything I post as drivel. May I ask a personal question? Is your tendency to express the same thoughts over and over again part of your strategy to prevent people from mistaking you for an intellectual? Thanks for the information about Malcolm Muggeridge Stim. I find it interesting. |
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16 Jan 14 - 12:21 PM (#3592684) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Musket You perceptive old bugger you! Rumbled me. Those who laugh at you obviously have you wrong Sherlock. Mind you , I can't come up with a reason for your drivel. Sorry about that me old duck. |
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16 Jan 14 - 12:44 PM (#3592692) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Jack the Sailor I don't mind being compared to a heroin addicted yet supernaturally perceptive fictional character as long as nobody mistakes me for one. You could be kinder than to describe my postings as drivel. You could be wiser in that you are inviting comparison to your own.... What would be the kindest way to put it? "attempts at comprehensible humor?" "idiosyncratic insights"? Efforts? Yeah lets just say "efforts." You could be kinder than to describe my postings as drivel. You may be wiser not to do so in that you are inviting comparison to your own efforts. I don't see anyone laughing at me except you and I expect you to come to your senses before too long. |
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17 Jan 14 - 01:29 AM (#3592865) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Musket Nothing wrong in leaving the stage to the sound of your own footsteps. Ever thought the applause you are hearing is in your own head? |
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17 Jan 14 - 03:43 AM (#3592876) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Ever thought that that standing ovation that you were so excited about was nothing more than a visit from Captain Morning Wood!! GfS |
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17 Jan 14 - 05:57 AM (#3592888) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Nigel Parsons From: GUEST,Musket - PM Date: 15 Jan 14 - 12:23 PM Judging by recent posts, I wouldn't hold my breath... "Straight over their heads" refers to our more vocal Christian congregation. The less appealing is glossed over unless they are throwing their creed in your face and calling you a militant atheist or such insults when you question them. A year without God is one thing. A thread without the bearded one would be nice. Of course, there is a tendency to ascribe some of the weirder laws of the Old Testament to Christians. A little reading of the New Testament would show how inaccurate this is. Whilst Christ (whom I assume you're referring to as "the bearded one") commented on the laws of Moses, he also replaced them. Rather than the old view of "an eye for an eye" he preached that we should "turn the other cheek". Rather than parrot the laws of Moses (be it 10 commandments, or all the rest) he summarised "Love the Lord you God with all your heart etc.) and "Love your neighbour as yourself". Dietary requirements don't seem to get a look-in! As for "a thread without the bearded one", I would be surprised if Christ did not get a mention in a thread about a Christian minister and his view of the world. |
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17 Jan 14 - 08:24 AM (#3592912) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Musket Nigel.stop being serious. Goofus is reading and we don't want to confuse him. Goofus. Woody wouldn't give a standing ovation, he gives a crowd roaring Mexican wave of appreciation.... Go on then Nigel. Is a year without the Old Testament a year without God, if it is a year with Jesus? To a curious onlooker as myself, who isn't and never has been a member of a religious cult, society or organisation, why would you differentiate between God and Jesus anyway? I am sure I recall something about holy trinity? God the father, the son and the Holy Ghost. If in accuracy is thrown in, why not believe in ghosts too? The god concept is utterly beyond realistic concept anyway, so what difference does a bloke in a bed sheet make? I would fully commend a year without God. Being able to climb a mountain and look out without ascribing the beauty to something so limiting. Peering through a telescope and letting your mind ponder what you are really looking at, without the limiting silly answers found in translations of ancient stories. I feel a song coming on.. THE HILLS ARE ALIVE, WITH THE SOUN..... I wonder what key it is in? |
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19 Jan 14 - 02:40 AM (#3593448) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: DMcG Being able to climb a mountain and look out without ascribing the beauty to something so limiting. Peering through a telescope and letting your mind ponder what you are really looking at, without the limiting silly answers found in translations of ancient stories. I agree. Though it is also worthwhile to ponder what you are really looking at without the limiting answers of modern stories. Einstein, for example, pondered without being bound by the prevailing scientific understanding of the time. It is important to appreciate just how little we really know, whatever informs your understanding. And while science has a great handle on quantum mechanics and a moderate handle on neuroscience, its ability to deal with 'beauty' is limited, I would suggest. |
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19 Jan 14 - 03:07 AM (#3593453) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST,Musket To be fair, I am not pondering whether Higgs boson theory is clouding the view either. If they pop into existence, good for them but for me the view from up there cannot be put into words. I reckon Einstein was getting at the same thing, only far more eloquently. A The superstitious world view is a bit like dismissing the infinity of the cadences in most of what Bach wrote as being mere examples of musical structure. That he teased us with cadences in the glory of a god rather being an example of how limiting his god was is rather ironic. |
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19 Jan 14 - 07:04 AM (#3593503) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: GUEST To see a World in a Grain of Sand And a Heaven in a Wild Flower, Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand And Eternity in an hour. A Robin Redbreast in a Cage Puts all Heaven in a Rage. A dove house fill'd with doves and pigeons Shudders Hell thro' all its regions. A Dog starv'd at his Master's Gate Predicts the ruin of the State. A Horse misus'd upon the Road Calls to Heaven for Human blood. Each outcry of the hunted Hare A fiber from the Brain does tear. He who shall train the Horse to War Shall never pass the Polar Bar. The Beggar's Dog and Widow's Cat, Feed them and thou wilt grow fat. The Gnat that sings his Summer song Poison gets from Slander's tongue. The poison of the Snake and Newt Is the sweat of Envy's Foot. A truth that's told with bad intent Beats all the Lies you can invent. It is right it should be so; Man was made for Joy and Woe; And when this we rightly know Thro' the World we safely go. Every Night and every Morn Some to Misery are Born. Every Morn and every Night Some are Born to sweet delight. Some are Born to sweet delight, Some are Born to Endless Night. (With thanks to Mr Blake.) |
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19 Jan 14 - 12:29 PM (#3593558) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Jack the Sailor "Being able to climb a mountain and look out without ascribing the beauty to something so limiting. Peering through a telescope and letting your mind ponder what you are really looking at, without the limiting silly answers found in translations of ancient stories." "I agree. Though it is also worthwhile to ponder what you are really looking at without the limiting answers of modern stories" A theory among modern neuroscientists is that our, personality, what makes us think of ourselves as individuals is our stories, those we tell others, those we tell ourselves. I am a having hard time imagining people looking at a scenic vista and letting their minds wander but not having that wandering encroach upon the stories within that mind. It literally seems inhuman to me. |
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19 Jan 14 - 12:43 PM (#3593561) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: DMcG Its not only neuroscientists who think that: philosophers have for centuries, psychiatrists for a somewhat shorter time. I'm all for letting stories of all kind encroach on your mind. I have a harder time with the idea of people deliberately blocking certain types of story because they don't agree with the origin. |
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19 Jan 14 - 01:31 PM (#3593584) Subject: RE: BS: A year without God From: Jack the Sailor DMcG I agree completely. |
