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20 Mar 14 - 01:27 PM (#3611209) Subject: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Wesley S TOPEKA, Kan (WIBW) Fred Phelps Sr., the former head of the Westboro Baptist Church, died late Wednesday night, according to a family member. Phelps' son, Timothy told 13 News that his father died just before midnight. Timothy Phelps works at the Shawnee Co. Jail. Ironically, another son who is a member of the church, attorney Jonathan Phelps told us Thursday morning, "Pastor Phelps is doing just fine." That, of course, could have been a spiritual reference. Margie Phelps, Phleps daughter, told WIBW-AM that there will be no funeral for him. Over the weekend, we learned that Phelps was reportedly "on the edge of death." In a statement on his Facebook page, Nathan Phelps, who has been estranged from his father for 30 years, said the senior Phelps was dying in hospice care in Topeka, Kan., and that he had been ex-communicated from his own church in August of 2013. |
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20 Mar 14 - 01:34 PM (#3611214) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: frogprince The world will be a better place for his having left it. |
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20 Mar 14 - 01:37 PM (#3611219) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Wesley S I know it's unavoidable that many folks here will express hate and disgust for this man - but whatever pain this man went through that manifested itself to be expressed in the twisted world view he held is over. Let's hope his church just drifts away now that he isn't here to lead it. Let's not sink to his level. |
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20 Mar 14 - 01:43 PM (#3611221) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Greg F. One down, thousands of similar idiots to go. Let's hope his church just drifts away now that he isn't here to lead it. That's a joke, right? These assholes don't need Phelps to keep being assholes. |
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20 Mar 14 - 03:19 PM (#3611248) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: gnu He will be reincarnated as a homosexual. Or burn in hell. God spoke on Facebook today and said he was sending him to hell instead of allowing him back but maybe God is just having a bad day. Whatever... I couldn't give a flying about the asshole bully. Yeah, that is hatred and disgust for this piece of trash. Again... whatever. |
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20 Mar 14 - 03:22 PM (#3611249) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: GUEST,michaelr Good riddance to bad rubbish. |
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20 Mar 14 - 03:55 PM (#3611259) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Richard Bridge Like, MichaelR |
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20 Mar 14 - 04:32 PM (#3611269) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Larry The Radio Guy Lots of sinking at least toward his level. I agree with Wesley S. |
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20 Mar 14 - 04:52 PM (#3611272) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Jeri I think one has to know someone to hate them. I didn't hate Phelps. Just everything he stood for. If I were religious and was searching for evidence that Satan hides behind the guise of a righteous man, I'd point to Phelps. I'd also comment that people who are driven by hatred give themselves to it. Lots of folks like that around here, although, thankfully, they receive a lot less attention than Phelps did. If it's possible to choose what we fill our lives with, I'd want it to be love, and hope, and generosity, and kindness. The world would be a better place if those were the weapons we fought with. |
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20 Mar 14 - 05:04 PM (#3611276) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: bobad You are a wise woman Jeri. |
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20 Mar 14 - 07:05 PM (#3611305) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Greg F. Lots of sinking at least toward his level. I agree with Wesley S. So you think the death of this individual asshole will have any effect on his fellow assholes? How and why? |
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20 Mar 14 - 07:11 PM (#3611307) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: SINSULL Matthew Shepherd's mother says she thanks God every day for Rev. Phelps. Without his hateful, spiteful, vicious attacks her son would have been just another victim. Phelps turned him into a martyr and a cause. Phelps was his own worst enemy. I believe that he like millions and millions before him has played his part and is gone. I thank him for calling attention to the plight of gays and lesbians. My hope is that his funeral goes unnoticed. Let his family put his body to rest without the interfering rabble disrupting their grieving and calling attention to his version of the truth. |
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20 Mar 14 - 07:36 PM (#3611311) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Stilly River Sage Those who coax moderation from respondents are wise, but still, "good riddance to bad rubbish" pretty well sums it up. The family is wise to not have a funeral, they know how that would turn out. And I agree with Wesley, my first thought was that I hope the "church" drifts apart now that the old man has died. SRS |
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20 Mar 14 - 08:07 PM (#3611320) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Allan C. All together now... What the world needs now is love, sweet love. That's the only thing that there's just too little of. |
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20 Mar 14 - 08:25 PM (#3611325) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: GUEST,Troubadour There's a little more of it, without him! Job done!.......or at least a step nearer done! |
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20 Mar 14 - 09:04 PM (#3611334) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: GUEST I feel bad that I'm glad he's dead and not around to do any further direct harm. I felt that way about Bin Laden, too. Can't recall another time I was glad someone was dead... but I'm sure there have been some. |
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20 Mar 14 - 10:50 PM (#3611360) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Rapparee Given an afterlife, I hope that he receives his eternal reward. |
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21 Mar 14 - 12:15 AM (#3611368) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Janie Wesley, Jeri, et. al. I echo you. Also echo someone who I don't recall because I was driving tonight as listened to "All Things Considered" , urging that folks, by example, afford his funeral, family and friends merely that which they themselves wanted when their own loved ones, (mostly service men killed) were memorialized and interred. His teachings were of vengance. Let us not perpetuate that lesson. According to NPR All Things Considered, Phelps, before he was disbarred, took on a number of civil rights cases in the 60's after the 1964 act was passed. Was one of the few Kansas lawyers willing and passionate enough to tackle racism, and apparently did it with the same passion, zeal, and sense of moral certitude with which he attacked the notion of gay rights. I had no idea until I heard this tonight on NPR. Did not know he was an attorney. Still don't know why he was disbarred. But was one of the very few lawyers in that part of the nation the ACLU could count on being willing to take on cases that fought racial discrimination. Pretty startling to learn. Like Jeri, I can't hate someone I don't know. Until by hapstance I heard that NPR snippet this evening I would have comfortably asserted that I can't hate him, only all he stood for. Now I can't even say that. Life and people are complicated. eh? |
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21 Mar 14 - 04:04 AM (#3611390) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Larry The Radio Guy Absolutely, Janie. Even with the worst person, if we look hard enough, we'll find something about them we agree with-----and I've always found that this can be a doorway to dialogue and creating 'doubt'. In response to Greg F: "So you think the death of this individual asshole will have any effect on his fellow assholes". Answer: I don't know. I guess one can always hope. |
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21 Mar 14 - 09:29 AM (#3611492) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: McGrath of Harlow Sometimes people like to hate. As this thread confirms. There's always a Bob Dylan quote: As some warn victory, some downfall Private reasons great or small Can be seen in the eyes of those that call To make all that should be killed to crawl While others say don't hate nothing at all Except hatred |
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21 Mar 14 - 09:32 AM (#3611494) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Greg F. Answer: I don't know. I guess one can always hope. Yiddish Proverb: "He who lives on hope dies of starvation." |
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21 Mar 14 - 09:37 AM (#3611497) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Greg F. I don't hate Phelps and his fellow "Christian"[sic] assholes, Kevin. I'm just glad he's gone and wish they were. |
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21 Mar 14 - 09:57 AM (#3611502) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: GUEST,gillymor And I hope that you die And your death'll come soon I will follow your casket In the pale afternoon And I'll watch while you're lowered Down to your deathbed And I'll stand o'er your grave 'Til I'm sure that you're dead -Bob Dylan I don't aspire to dance on his grave but it's comforting to be reminded that these homophobic mossbacks eventually pass on. |
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21 Mar 14 - 10:57 AM (#3611526) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Greg F. A much more appropriate Dylan quote, thanks. |
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21 Mar 14 - 11:12 AM (#3611536) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Stilly River Sage I heard that story also, Janie. The disbarment came after he started the virulent anti-gay activity. It was a puzzling story, making me think that if NPR played it on April 1 people would assume it was a joke. Here is the NPR link. SRS |
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21 Mar 14 - 12:24 PM (#3611562) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Amos It is startling to learn this about him, isn't it. His thinkerator was bent, but he gave it all he had; now that he's off the stage, let him go in peace. |
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21 Mar 14 - 01:13 PM (#3611580) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Bat Goddess Jeri said it perfectly. Linn |
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21 Mar 14 - 02:10 PM (#3611600) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Greg F. now that he's off the stage, let him go in peace. In God's name, why? |
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21 Mar 14 - 02:34 PM (#3611608) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Stilly River Sage Because if you act like he did you're not much better than him. |
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21 Mar 14 - 02:50 PM (#3611617) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Wesley S Exactly. Besides he's beyond hatred now. Like the song says - "It doesn't mean shit to a tree". How does the saying go - Hatred is like swollowing poison and expecting someone else to get sick. |
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21 Mar 14 - 03:02 PM (#3611621) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Greg F. Yup- let's legitimize his atrocities by being kind to his memory. He sure as hell didn't let anyone else "go in peace". And I am in no way, shape or form "acting like he did". Get real, eh? See above 9:37 AM: I don't hate Phelps and his fellow "Christian"[sic] assholes, Kevin. I'm just glad he's gone and wish they were. |
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21 Mar 14 - 03:40 PM (#3611632) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: GUEST,Eliza Perhaps in a perverse way, he managed to show people just how nasty and evil gay-hating can be, and probably made folk wake up to the fact, and perhaps feel impelled to defend gays from such wicked attack. And all that rubbish at funerals, disrupting the mourners, and forcing the enactment of a Law to prevent this. Evil personified. Isn't it weird that such men are called 'Reverend'? Like the 'Reverend' Ian Paisley. I can't imagine anything less reverend. I know one shouldn't judge a man by his physical appearance, but his face on the photos is truly sinister. Well, he has to face his Maker now. |
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21 Mar 14 - 03:59 PM (#3611644) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Richard Bridge Liking quite a lot of what Greg F has to say. Paisley may have been a bitter orange but those he opposed were terrorists and mass murderers. |
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21 Mar 14 - 04:08 PM (#3611650) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Wesley S Who's being kind to his memory? His actions and viewpoints were atrocious. But sharing his viewpoints and turning them around and pointing them in a different direction doesn't do anyone any good. |
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21 Mar 14 - 04:44 PM (#3611657) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Larry The Radio Guy So Greg F, I'm wondering if you've even considered the possibility that your posts that espouse hatred and intolerance (despite that 9:37 A.M. post denying it) are actually the other side of the same coin? I'm not asking you to 'agree'........but whether you've even considered that possibility and 'explored 'it.....rather than totally discounting it. If Fred Phelps had the capacity to recognize what was truly behind his own hatred, I'm wondering if that could have been a first step toward change. And now.......maybe some of his followers? The more we villify a person, the more invested they are in defending themselves and making their point even 'louder'. |
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21 Mar 14 - 04:50 PM (#3611658) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: bobad Vilifying is Greg's stock-in-trade. |
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21 Mar 14 - 04:56 PM (#3611660) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Jeri I'm glad he's gone and wish more of his minions were, but... The way he and his 'church' treated LGBT people caused a backlash of protectiveness and kindness from average folks that really was a change. Motorcycle gangs protected grieving families, and all sorts of people stepped forward when they never had before. Great evil requires great good to balance out, and often call it forth from where it never existed before. Life works as a series of pendulum swings. It goes one way, then another, until it slowly works to achieve equilibrium. I figure if it ever does that, it's all over. I don't think there's much chance that'll happen, though. We mostly want evil to be gone, but we need it a little. |
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21 Mar 14 - 05:43 PM (#3611668) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Greg F. your posts that espouse hatred and intolerance Hello, Larry? What the fook are you talking about? If Fred Phelps had the capacity to recognize what was truly behind his own hatred Which he didn't. I'm wondering if that could have been a first step toward change. Which it wasn't. And now.......maybe some of his followers? Slim chance - but get back to me on that once you have documentation that his asshole "Christian"[sic] followers have had second thoughts and/or converted to tolerance and rationality. The more we villify a person Proven villians deserve villification. Or do you want to give this turd a pass? |
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21 Mar 14 - 07:08 PM (#3611684) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: GUEST,Troubadour "But was one of the very few lawyers in that part of the nation the ACLU could count on being willing to take on cases that fought racial discrimination." As long as the blacks he represented weren't gay! Sorry Janie, it's not enough. Hell has a new occupant who deserves extra specially severe treatment. No tears here for his passing and no respect for his good side, if he even had one, which is doubtful. That is not hatred, or vengeance! Just a dispassionate assessment of the man and his abhorrent nature. |
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21 Mar 14 - 10:31 PM (#3611721) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: Larry The Radio Guy Thanks for the answer, Greg. I guess you never have considered it. |
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21 Mar 14 - 11:46 PM (#3611729) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps From: GUEST,Stim Phelps & Co. were like the geeks in the carnival freak show, who could be counted on to do something disgusting whenever a TV camera was pointed at them, and they boosted news ratings whenever they showed up. Had the media chosen to ignore them, they would have been an amusing footnote, much like those characters with the "Repent, for the Kingdom of Heaven is at Hand" sandwich boards that used to loiter on the fringes of public gatherings.The media chose pushed them into the national spotlight however, and it kept them there. Cynical types might say that the "Liberal Media" used them to characterized those who oppose gay rights as frothing at the mouth sociopaths, but I don't believe the media has a hidden agenda. I think it was all done for the ratings. |
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22 Mar 14 - 02:21 AM (#3611734) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Larry The Radio Guy I think Stim's right on! |
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22 Mar 14 - 04:20 AM (#3611750) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Musket True. Without professional media interest, bigots would only have outlets such as social media with which to spew their bile. One more dead, but quite a few to go. |
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22 Mar 14 - 08:41 AM (#3611816) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Wesley S Stim nailed it. |
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22 Mar 14 - 10:50 AM (#3611833) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Greg F. Thanks for the answer, Greg. I guess you never have considered it. Not so Larry - I gave it the due consideration it deserved & rejected it as nonsense. |
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22 Mar 14 - 11:23 AM (#3611842) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: GUEST Fred's dead, a situation to which I give a silent nod and my humble approval. |
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22 Mar 14 - 11:25 AM (#3611843) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: JohnInKansas If all you've seen of Phelps, his family, and "his" church has been the news of their picketings, as will likely be the case for most here(?), a "short book length" article giving a fairly complete biography is available and should be of interest. An introduction to the book, quoted here, as it typically appears at a number of sites, explains the rather curious way in which it was "unpublished, sealed by the court, but public information anyway." Addicted to Hate: The Fred Phelps Story [quote] Cover (Notes from the Anti-Phelps Underground) IMPORTANT NOTES FROM THE ANTI-PHELPS UNDERGROUND On June 29, 1994 Jon Michael Bell, a former reporter hired to investigate Fred Phelps and Westboro Baptist Church by Stauffer Communications, Inc.,filed a lawsuit in Shawnee County District Court in Topeka, Kansas against Stauffer Communications alleging the Topeka Capital-Journal owed him compensation for overtime and to clarify ownership of his notes and work product. The work product in question, "Addicted to Hate" chronicling the life and times of Fred Phelps, was attached to the lawsuit as Exhibit A making it, therefore, a public document. Learning of the suit, members of Topeka's anti-Phelps underground delivered a certified copy of the lawsuit to a copy shop near the courthouse. Within 48 hours, Stauffer Communications had written all area media outlets and issued veiled warnings about using the information contained in "Addicted to Hate". A rival Topeka newspaper, the Metro News, announced it was considering publishing the lawsuit in it entirety. The Kansas City Star abided by Stauffer Communication's wishes, but several other media outlets aired or printed portions of the manuscript. Within 48 hours of the filing, Stauffer Communications persuaded a judge to seal the suit so the Clerk of the District Court could no longer make copies for the public. No matter - no such order was issued to the copy shop or to the hundreds of citizens that already had copies. On July 8 the Capital-Journal, which had deep-sixed the Phelps project and fired the publisher who authorized it when it was completed last fall, suddenly began its watered-down, copyrighted series on Phelps that they had earlier claimed they wouldn't print. Bell also withdrew his suit the same day. By this time, however, TV networks, wire services, and eastern newspapers had obtained copies of the manuscript, and Stauffer's unprecedented attempt to suppress media discussion of the document attracted the interest of several major East Coast newspapers on First Amendment grounds. ... [End quote] The "book" is about 100 pages as I saved it in a single Word .doc, and doesn't take long to read. As posted at this site, it's about 10 separate "Chapter" downloads if you want to save it and put it all together into a single file, but a menu of links lets you jump from chapter to chapter if you just want to read it. (It has been posted at a number of sites, and you might find it elsewhere in more convenient form. Most sites should show up in a search for "Addicted to Hate.") John |
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22 Mar 14 - 03:21 PM (#3611904) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Joe Offer The death of Fred Phelps is a good occasion for saying gentle, nonaggressive things about tolerance, which is what we all seek, if we are people of good will. I've seen many good photos and quotations on Facebook over the last day. Amos posted a photo of a smiling, gentle Dalai Lama with this quote: and whether one believes in rebirth or not, there isn't anyone who doesn't appreciate kindness and compassion. Amen. Fred Phelps was a talented, dynamic man who appeared to be full of hate. But his hatred led many people to go in the opposite direction - toward kindness, tolerance, and compassion. His Westboro Baptist Church had 40 members - it was certainly not a megachurch. Their hatred inspired compassion and tolerance in the hearts of countless thousands. May his troubled soul finally rest in peace. -Joe Offer- |
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22 Mar 14 - 04:14 PM (#3611915) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Greg F. there isn't anyone who doesn't appreciate kindness and compassion. Fred Phelps and his followers excepted, of course. His Westboro Baptist Church had 40 members... You're not maintaining that there are only 40 "God Hates Fags" hateful bigots running around loose, are you? What about the "countless thousands" of similar fundagelicl idiots that support Phelps' outlook? |
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22 Mar 14 - 08:04 PM (#3611956) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Stilly River Sage A classy response. |
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22 Mar 14 - 08:21 PM (#3611960) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Greg F. So the Westboro asshloles are still at it without Phelps, eh Stilly? |
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22 Mar 14 - 10:20 PM (#3611992) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Stilly River Sage Look below the first photo - that is of the Westboro group at work in the past. The lower photos are of non-church folks giving an example of how Westboro should have behaved. SRS |
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23 Mar 14 - 09:32 AM (#3612087) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Greg F. Good for the non-church folks. So the Westboro asshloles are still at it without Phelps, eh Stilly? |
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23 Mar 14 - 09:37 AM (#3612090) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: GUEST,Musket Fascinating that some are saying that without disgraceful bigotry, decent behaviour and outlooks wouldn't get appreciated. Not needing a bloke in a dog collar to tell me how to be moral, I find it odd that Phelps has been heralded as accidentally promoting decency by the reaction to his religious beliefs. So.... How many people wouldn't know how to act civilly without demonstrations of the opposite? |
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23 Mar 14 - 10:22 AM (#3612101) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Janie Fascinating that some are saying that without disgraceful bigotry, decent behaviour and outlooks wouldn't get appreciated. Musket, I don't interpret any post to this thread as saying that. |
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23 Mar 14 - 11:41 AM (#3612114) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Musket I do. For instance, from above.. Matthew Shepherd's mother says she thanks God every day for Rev. Phelps. Without his hateful, spiteful, vicious attacks her son would have been just another victim. Phelps turned him into a martyr and a cause. Phelps was his own worst enemy. I believe that he like millions and millions before him has played his part and is gone. I thank him for calling attention to the plight of gays and lesbians. My hope is that his funeral goes unnoticed. Let his family put his body to rest without the interfering rabble disrupting their grieving and calling attention to his version of the truth. |
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23 Mar 14 - 01:38 PM (#3612141) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Janie Really? Merely in the fwiw department, it seems to me that Sins posted a statement made by Ms. Shepherd. I'm not aware that Ms. Shepherd herself has posted here, though I suppose I have no way of knowing. Nor have I read any posts here- but maybe I missed something or have forgotten- that assert decent behaviors and outlooks are appreciated only in the face of bigotry. It seems to me that the posts of Sins and some others call attention to the reality that the behaviors of Phelps and the Westboro gang had some positive consequences not intended by the Westboro congregation. Only my interpretation, mind you. |
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23 Mar 14 - 02:19 PM (#3612152) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Greg F. the behaviors of Phelps and the Westboro gang had some positive consequences not intended by the Westboro congregation. So we should therefore appreciate, condone or excuse these assholes because of unintended consequences of their atrocious actions? I think not. |
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23 Mar 14 - 02:41 PM (#3612159) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: GUEST Will the new church be called Phelps' Whelps? |
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23 Mar 14 - 02:53 PM (#3612162) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Janie *sigh* I know better than to wade into these threads. Only myself to blame. Take care, Greg. All the best, Janie |
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23 Mar 14 - 10:41 PM (#3612222) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Joe Offer Musket, in his usual pontifical fashion, states: Fascinating that some are saying that without disgraceful bigotry, decent behaviour and outlooks wouldn't get appreciated. Well, no - what we're saying is that the efforts of Phelps and his ilk have backfired. -Joe- |
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23 Mar 14 - 10:49 PM (#3612225) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: GUEST Phelps' Whelps Belch? |
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23 Mar 14 - 11:38 PM (#3612232) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Janie Mercy Now |
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24 Mar 14 - 09:26 AM (#3612339) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Greg F. what we're saying is that the efforts of Phelps and his ilk have backfired. Not so's you'd notice, Joe. There's thousands of his "ilk" out there. Some have been elected to Congress. Some are State governors. Some are just foot-soldiers in God's bigot army. |
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24 Mar 14 - 10:38 AM (#3612358) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: GUEST,Musket We all sing to the crowd Joe. Musical masturbation isn't my scene and waving placards at empty cars wasn't his. |
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24 Mar 14 - 10:54 AM (#3612362) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Greg F. Pol Pot could use a little mercy now The fruits of his labors The thousands buried in the ground His work was comprehensive All those folks that were cut down Poor old Pol Pot, the man could use some mercy now |
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24 Mar 14 - 04:18 PM (#3612465) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Greg F. The New Messiah |
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24 Mar 14 - 06:34 PM (#3612489) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: robomatic You've got to be taught to hate and fear, You've got to be taught from year to year, It's got to be drummed in your dear little ear, You've got to be carefully taught. You've got to be taught to be afraid Of people whose eyes are oddly made, And people whose skin is a diff'rent shade, You've got to be carefully taught. You've got to be taught before it's too late, Before you are six or seven or eight, To hate all the people your relatives hate, You've got to be carefully taught! (Thank you Mr Rodgers and Mr Hammerstein) |
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24 Mar 14 - 08:47 PM (#3612514) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: GUEST,Troubadour "Their hatred inspired compassion and tolerance in the hearts of countless thousands. May his troubled soul finally rest in peace." Not much chance of that Joe, there will be Gays and Blacks in both Heaven and Hell. Poetic justice! |
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24 Mar 14 - 09:19 PM (#3612521) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Donuel I bet he was involved with a priest as a child and could never admit it. His compensation behavior became purely pathological. |
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25 Mar 14 - 02:01 PM (#3612722) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: GUEST Anyone taking odds on whether April 20 will change Phelps' situation? |
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25 Mar 14 - 02:29 PM (#3612734) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Donuel The right words or song from a caring person may have saved the world from all the vitriol this man spewed all over kind souls in this country. Or maybe posing as a bible boss kept him from becoming a serial killer. |
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25 Mar 14 - 04:00 PM (#3612755) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Larry The Radio Guy Greg F, the article you posted on the New Messiah is very interesting. It illustrates how 'fanatacism'-whatever side it falls, is a trait in itself. Steve Drains is a great example. He would go from one extreme to the other. This is why I think that the many posters on this thread who are working on developing the antithesis of the hatred that Phelps espoused----and are also trying to feel some 'mercy' or compassion for Phelps and his lot, even while reinforcing the abhorrence of their views-------are much less likely to become hate mongers than people like yourself, who make fun of them and think in such black and white terms. |
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25 Mar 14 - 06:01 PM (#3612784) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Greg F. So Larry, tell me. Do you believe that there is evil in the world? The right words or song from a caring person may have saved the world from all the vitriol this man spewed... Idiotic. I don't know whether to laugh or cry. Ya figure the same for Stalin, Himmler, Pol Pot, Ivan the Terrible & on & on, do ya? |
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25 Mar 14 - 06:09 PM (#3612787) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Wesley S "Ya figure the same for Stalin, Himmler, Pol Pot, Ivan the Terrible & on & on, do ya?" Ivan the Terrible - sure.One chorus of Kumbaya would have been enough. The others - not so much. They would have needed an anti-bullying seminar at least. |
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25 Mar 14 - 06:13 PM (#3612789) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Larry The Radio Guy Yes, I do believe there is evil in the world. I believe it's a continuum.......even those of us who do mostly 'good' have a dark side, and (which I know from working for many years as a therapist in prison working with rapists, murderers, and people who have committed a number of horrific crimes) amongst those who do a lot of evil things there are glimmers of compassion, love, and a desire to do 'good' things. I can't explain it! So I feel very humble.........and (while doing everything possible to ensure that these people who do such evil things are never in a position to inflict them on others) and want to focus on developing that other side. I do believe that much of this evil comes from a wound. And that all of us, if given a choice, would rather feel 'connected' rather than separate. But people who perpetrate these evil acts often aren't able to even consider the possibility that there is another choice that can work for them. I also believe in the importance of having very strong consequences for people who perpetrate such acts-----whether they be corporate polluters, capitalist exploiters, those who spew hate, or those who commit horrendous crimes. But believing in strong consequences doesn't mean I have to deny all their humanity. |
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25 Mar 14 - 06:13 PM (#3612790) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Greg F. Oh, and Larry? If it makes you feel better to call me a "hate monger" & equate me with Phelps and deny reality & engage in wishful thinking, by all means knock your self out. Frank and Jesse James were a product of their environment They were sent out into the woods by their parents To forage for berries, truffles, rutabagas and roots of all sorts Put yourself in their place: you'da been mean too Kingston Trio - |
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25 Mar 14 - 06:42 PM (#3612799) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Greg F. Larry, we cross-posted. ...doesn't mean I have to deny all their humanity. Fair enough. Give me say, a half-dozen examples of Phelps' "humanity" & I'll sing a chorus of Kumbaya with ya for him. |
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25 Mar 14 - 07:28 PM (#3612806) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Larry The Radio Guy I don't know Phelps. And I hate Kumbaya (oh shit, there's my hate mongering dark side---maybe Phelps and I will do some jamming together in hell)......could we find another song? |
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25 Mar 14 - 08:17 PM (#3612817) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: GUEST,Guest in Topeka My hope is that God takes him into heaven and annoints Matthew Shepherd as his mentor... |
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26 Mar 14 - 09:33 AM (#3612900) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Greg F. ....could we find another song? No problem! How about the Stones' "Sympathy For The Devil"? ;>) |
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26 Mar 14 - 12:16 PM (#3612940) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Musket Or Tom Robinson's Sing if You're Glad to be Gay? I usually find that those who actively condemn people who are wired differently have a repressed dilemma in their heads. |
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26 Mar 14 - 01:58 PM (#3612976) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Larry The Radio Guy Both good songs! |
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26 Mar 14 - 01:59 PM (#3612977) Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Rev Fred Phelps (1929-2014) From: Larry The Radio Guy If we keep doing such great work, we may have to transfer this thread to 'above the line'. |